Vatican gives HIGHEST level of approval for Medjugorje?
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- Medjugorje approved? The Vatican has issued a judgement of “Nihil Obstat” about the alleged visions of Medjugorje, whilst highlighting “problematic” aspects of the phenomena and also not making a decision on if the events necessarily have a “direct supernatural origin.” We discuss what this means for Medjugorje fans and pilgrims and why Joe does NOT accept Medjugorje messages or visionaries.
#medjugorje #Vatican #Catholic #catholicnews #catholicchurch
ACT - thestationofth...
Vatican rules Holy Spirit acting ‘for the good’ in Medjugorje but won’t say if events are ‘authentic’ - www.lifesitene...
Nota “La Regina della Pace” circa l’esperienza spirituale legata a Medjugorje del Dicastero per la Dottrina della Fede, 19.09.2024 - press.vatican....
This "announcement" is a shiny object for those who are upset over Francis' most recent heretical comment on all faiths leading to God.
Francis likes Medjugorje because one of the "visionaries" has quoted Mary as saying, "All religions are pleasing to God." That's the first clue that the messages from Medjugorje are not from heaven.
Honestly who are you to make such a bold statement saying that that medjugorje is not from heaven? That is your opinion. Period @@mtaylor3771
@mtaylor3771 We know that the devil will allow the truth but will always sprinkle in a lie. Adam & Eve 101
This is incorrect
Read about the subject before you throw out nonsense unrelated to the subject
The fact that this Vatican has approved it so to speak, makes me question it all the more
Why don’t you read about it yourself
Better yet why not visit yourself; have you been I have.
💯 agree.
I am a traditional Roman Catholic SSPV who supports the validity of Medjugorie. Knowing the current false Vatican church of the antichrist gives approbation concerns me greatly. However, the approval or disapproval rendered by a false church is off the table and carried no weight. The proof of Medjugorie will be of when the 10 secrets are released. If they are true and align with all Catholic beliefs and valid prophesy, then it will be it's own proof of validity.
Thankfully we do not have to rely on apparitions to be a good Catholic.
N ovwe don’t but if Jesus sends His Blessed Mother He does it for a good reason and it’s a tremendous blessing for us
Our Lady of Guadalupe,Fatima, Lourdes 🙏 . YOU CANT GO WRONG WITH THEM!!
You are absolutely correct! Catholics are not required to believe in private revelation. But who am I to say that we should ignore Medjugorje if God is sending His mother to visit us?
Never believe in this place of apparitions
About 10 years ago, i prayed to Our Lady and said "If its really you appearing in MEDJUGORIE, invite me and my family, and i will come to you?"... EXACTLY One year later i found myself visiting OUR LADY OF GUADALUPE in MEXICO CITY! 🙏... I Never had the desire to go to Medjugorie again! THANKS BE TO GOD! 🙏
So because the Blessed Mother did not contact you directly it’s not real? Who are you your own visionary?
If this is really Mama Mary she will instruct the seers to preach for her 5th dogma and the approval of it at the Vatican.
@@SmithsnMoz wow what an option. If you don't want to go don't go. Who is forcing you. There are millions of other people who go there . Medjugorje will not close down if you don't go .
I never believed in the Medjugorje apparitions. I recall the late great Father Malachi Martin at a talk he was giving at a church in the US. He was asked about Medjugorje, and he came out unequivocally saying it was a hoax. So that confirmed it for me. I believe he said that it was designed to take away attention from Fatima. And before people can say but what about all those conversions from people who went there, and the shrine dedicated to Our Lady, etc., etc., I will that it’s great that people have renewed fervour for the faith after visiting, but that’s in spite of it, not because of it. I’ve seen pictures of the place, and it is beautiful. But in my opinion, it’s not an authentic Marian apparition site.
Nonsense after visiting Medjugorje in 1989 it led me to Fatima visiting both shrines has been a blessing.
@@LJC-sr7jl Nope. Malachi Martin didn't say this. Please send me the exact video and time where he says this. I've listenend tô his full talks and he simply said THAT HE DIDN'T KNOW if the apparitions were true or false.
Medjugorje is a distraction from Fatima and Akita which are very dire.
Fatima, Lourdes, Akita, Lasalette, Quito, are the real authentic apparitions, medjugorje and garabandal are demonic.
Rediculous
@@TheresaCronin-kc6wz*ridiculous
I do not accept Medjugorje pertaining to the visions themselves. The pilgrimage phenomenon is another matter. I was quite positive that it would receive the Nihil Obstat as soon as I learned of the new classification system, since I think that Medjugorje was one if the reasons it was put into place. Francis’ recent statements affirming his indifferentism were echoed by the “messages” from the visionaries which claimed that the “Gospa” says that all religions are pleasing to God. This is part of the effort to create a new one world religion which would mean that Catholics would be required to give up most of their beliefs.
What you said is not true disgraceful if you’re a Catholic
Please Google "Medjugorje all faiths are equal" before repeating this misinformation. Mary said (Oct. 1981) "MEMBERS of all faiths are equal before God...." then concluding that all faiths are not equal. God loves us all.
The message promotes religious indifference. Since the current Pontificate also promotes the same, that's a reason to reject it. I won't be fooled by this declaration.
You don’t have to adhere to anything Catholic you’re not Catholic you are a fraud
Double talk. Truth does not seem to matter. This is exactly what I would expect a corrupt authority to say if they knew an apparition was false but wanted to promote it anyway.
Thanks Joe. You asked so here’s why I don’t believe any of the Medugorje story: a) all accepted previous apparitions have been different ie, the visionaries didn’t benefit monetarily, Medugorie apparitions on demand year after year etc. b) was widely reported at the beginning of the so called apparitions that a fake priest close to the main visionary, abused teenagers in the house of the main visionary where they were staying. c) during the war, they were wanting to change the apparitions to an alternative site. d) some of the same reasons you stated. It’s a business everyone has benefited from. e) I don’t believe ANY assessment or document that comes from the current Doctrine of the Faith department at the Vatican
a) The visionaries don't "benefit monetarily" from the apparitions.
b) Don't confuse the sins of a local priest with the authenticity of the visionaries.
c) The visionaries have obeyed the local bishop with regard to not having apparitions on church property. Mary accommodated that requirement.
d) The visionaries live in modest homes (except Ivan, who married into a rich American family). He lives in a large home - to accommodate pilgrims - but the money is not his.
e) Regrettable that you've abandoned your Catholic Faith. Reconsider that.
Never accepted it and will not- the Seers have become quite wealthy and 43 yrs later is supposed to be valid after yrs of unapproval-
The Seers are even divorced and the messages do claim all religions are valid!😯😯
@@sherrih8354 so just which visionaries are divorced?
@@kellyschroer2114 None. More misinformation. The devil works furiously.....
I believe it is a fraud...so ill never go.....just too many things
It's hard to accept anything from this heretical hierarchy, especially coming from 'ciucio' fernandez and his boss, Francis, the destroyer. Can you look into the Maria Valtorta writings and the Luisa Picoretta divine Will. I'd like to know your thoughts on those 2 controversial things.
One of my doubts is that none of the visionaries became religious. Look at all the authentic ones, many of the visionaries were religious or became religious.
So, they did this instead of rebuke Bergoglio's pertinacious heresy? I didn't think I could be less confident in Medjugorje's authenticity, but here we are.
Yes maybe you can be the first member of his church
@@TheresaCronin-kc6wz What?
Not one of the visionaries has become a priest or religious. One did enter a convent but then came out again. This is not impressive or convincing.
@@BenjaminHall-yt6kk I heard that all the visionaries are now very wealthy!
@@CatholicMailmanI seriously doubt you can call Viska “wealthy”. Stop spreading here-say. You are just spreading gossip.
@@CatholicMailman You heard wrong.
A heretical message to a visionary that all religions are equal is mentioned here.
My thoughts:
(1) Which visionary? What date? What about a quote? How about giving a source for that quote?
(2) If anybody makes such a serious accusation then he has to provide the info mentioned in point number 1 and be subjected to a background check, especially, in the Yugoslav and Soviet Public and Secret Service Archives. Anything less is a dereliction of duty and a serious violation of due process.
(3) If Bella Dodd and the Communist Party of America sent hundreds of men into the seminary what do you think the Communists did in Eastern Europe?
(4) Do you honestly think the Communists gave up on infiltrating the Church just because the Communist System collapsed in 1989-1990?
Google "Medjugorje all religions are equal". You will find that quote is not correct. See for yourself. The quote is that "MEMBERS of all religions are equal before God..." (Oct. 1981) The devil works furiously to discredit Medjugorje. But what would you expect?
I totally agree with you. Mary never stays for 40 years on visions, she comes says what she needs to say and leaves. No way for 40 years.
Also the seers have profited from it. Previous seers from other apparitions DID NOT become rich from their experience.
@@bauertom00 Our Lady of Laus, France fully approved apparitions lasted much longer than Medjugorje.
@@samwise8309 thank you
@@samwise8309 which ones are you talking about? And did she come there on the daily basis?
@@bauertom00 in Laus in France to a married woman. Look it up. They're apparitions of Our Lady approved by the Church.
I agree with everything you are saying 100%…and I have been there twice.
Don’t follow him if you’re Catholic
I am with you Joe. How ironic when "her" messages include a call to prayer, but not the rosary, which contradicts our Lady's previous appearances. Not to mention the indifferentism, "you don't have to be catholic".... JP2 may have privately supported it, but he also supported Marcial Maciel, and the Legionnaires of Christ because of the fruit (many vocations), and now we know he was wrong because the hidden things were finally revealed.
Mary of Medjugorje CONSTANTLY asks us to pray the rosary. Very early, she requested 3 rosaries per day. Pick any Medjugorje Prayer Group and the center of their activity is the rosary. How can such misinformation exist?
As for JP2 - don't assume that since he was wrong about one thing (Marcial Maciel), he was wrong about everything.
Isn't this the same apparition who said something about all religions being equal to Jesus? Just connecting the dots here....
Yes one of the original messages stated that the holiest person in the village was a Muslim woman.
It's very troubling to say the least. Best to stick to CATHOLIC CHURCH Approved Apparitions... BEFORE FRANCIS...😊
No. Please do your homework. Google "Medjugorje all faiths are equal." (Oct 1981)
@@KenPaulsenArchitect I have. Go read "The Medjugorje Deception"
@@KenPaulsenArchitect You go do your homework and read the "Medjugorje Deception".
In The exorcism of Anneliese Michele the devil boasted that he will gain much booty for his kingdom from VII. With the approval of Majorgarbage he will gain more booty. Rome has fallen.
The gates of hell shall not prevail against the Catholic Church. You get your information from movies.Very dumb
But if it's true.... how will you apologize to Our Blessed Virgin Mary for saying "Majorgarbage" about her efforts?
Reading some of the messages and words of the seers , there is much apostasy and heresy on display. Similar to the utterances from the pontiff in recent and not so recent days.
So what messages show apostasy and heresy? Please state which ones and dates they were given.
The fact that Pope Francis and his Vatican will say that whatever phenomenon is being considered doesn't offend (what the Pope and Vatican think about) the Faith... but NOT that it is or isn't of supernatural origin makes me think of the condemned modernist propositions that talk about how nothing's a miracle bc everything's a miracle to be discovered by the individual so to speak.
It also makes me think that they're setting up an ex post facto law here. As in...
Just like we're not going to say that Medj is supernatural, we are going back in time and saying that we don't claim a supernatural origin for La Salvete ,(happy Feast today), Fatima, Lourdes, etc. That's rather convenient considering Our Lady's words at LaSalette about Rone!
I accept medugourje i am 32 years of age and I have been going there since I was 8 years old. I lived in medugourje for 3 years and if you would like me on your podcast one day to talk to you about the 3 years that I lived there I will gladly accept.
October 1, 1981 "Members of all faiths are equal before God. (Really? Even the faiths that REJECT WHO GOD IS?) God rules over each faith just like a sovereign over his kingdom. In the world, all religions are not the same because all people have not complied with the commandments of God. They reject and disparage them."
A "faith" that rejects God is not considered a faith. Heck even satan believes in God, but I wouldn't call Him a religious person.
@@KenPaulsenArchitect Do you deny Islam is a faith?
It fits their Heresy that all religions lead to God... FALSE
The timing is perfect, eh?
@@mtaylor3771 God works in mysterious ways😉
@@knightoftheimmaculata8876 I guess you can use that belief to validate many heretical messages from heaven. I suggest you read Galatians 1:8.
@@knightoftheimmaculata8876 I’ll save you the trouble; Galatians 1:8 “But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!”
@@knightoftheimmaculata8876 galatians 8:1 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!
There will come a critical moment of great confusion and doubt / decision ,then at that great crossroad a message from Medj will come which totally contradict the Faith of our Father's. Those totally blinded will go with Medj direction and there will be no reaching these people. That's my worry with Medj.
As I said yesterday (before this Vatican press conference); If the pope condemns it, I will abandon promoting Medjugorje. My Catholic Faith is #1. But also, I strongly believe in the authenticity of Medjugorje.
Correction, the current local ordinary as well as the Vatican has given the Nihil obstat.
Bravo Joe McClane on your conversion and your insight. You are spot on!
He’s a convert? That explains it!
@@TheresaCronin-kc6wz So was St. Augustine. Your point being? smh
Lack of humility from some of the "Medjugorie defenders" says a lot too..😮
As for me I know what I have experienced personally, I have yet to experience anywhere else in the world a piece of heaven on earth and its effects. 🙏🏻❤️🔥📿🕊️ Amen
All I need to know is whether the events are supernatural in origin.
"Nothing offends", in our times, is more than a little suspect when you consider who's making that determination. Cardinal Fernandez can be profoundly offensive when he wants to be.
I remember when these events began in the 80s.
I remember that most, if not all, the ppl I knew who went there - sometimes already practicing Catholics and sometimes not - all came back and seemed to be charismatics... a way of being Catholic I reluctantly tried to "get into" back then but now I reject.
An old Muslim lady cannot, as a matter of theological fact, be the holiest person in a village. She can maybe be the most naturally virtuous, but I wouldn't be able to have that conversation with charismatics back then. I don't know about now.
I remember how everybody was waiting for the chain of their rosaries to turn gold. I believe in miracles but...
RE: the seer at the speaking engagement
That works in exactly ONE case, it seems to me.
IF Our Lady is truly appearing and IF She tells this seer that She intends to appear at his speaking engagements for the benefit of those gathered or for whatever other reason She might decide then... Ok.
But for him to give his own guarantee, and also collect money, that's no good. Red flag right away.
Arrogance!
I’ve never believed in Medjugorjie . The reason being that NEVER HAS OUR BLESSED MOTHER HAD A ALMOST CONTINUOUS DIALOGUE ABOUT A PROPHECY FOR DECADES PERIOD.
Thank you! I've always felt guilty for feeling a nagging doubt about this one. I agree with everything you said.
no. the claim that the holiest person in the town was a Muslim. This really coordinates well with the program.
I was in Medjugorie in 1989 and have been apart ever since.
Aside from the beauty and simple lives the people were so hospitable,kind and when it came to the sun...I saw the Holy Eucharist in front of the sun stamped IHS. When I came home I asked a Priest friend what that meant???Jesus Humanity Salvation.
As for the Holy Muslim..why not ..she Pasha gave out of love her last but of food to Miranas family for her brother who was still very young. Pasha than died. I think she was Holy...very
@@joanneminue8853 the problem with it is that as Catholics we believe outside of The Church there is no salvation. This has been taught by popes since Christ. Christ taught it. St. Paul taught. The saints taught it. The exceptions for martyrdom or baptisms of desire were always understood until Rahner and Balthazar to be negligible exceptions. This was expanded after Vatican II. If we are being directed to emulate Muslims maybe that's a better path. This is how Christianity loses its identity.
the fact is Medjugorje reinforces the new doctrine that it doesn't matter what religion you are. We all worship the same God. I am unsurprised that it has been approved. I expect you might see unapprovals for apparitions like Akita, La Salette, Fatima...
Anyone can search "Medugorje condemned" and find the declaration of Msgr. Zanic of Mostar in 1986 condemning Medugorje "apparitions" and again with Msgr. Ratko Peric, Bishop of Mostar in 1991
The Zadar Declaration (Google that) which was issued by the local bishop's commission was NOT a condemnation. There were three possible rulings:
1. Constat de supernaturalitate (Determined to be supernatural - approved)
2. Non constat de supernaturalitate (Not determined to be supernatural - neutral)
3. Constat de non supernaturalitate (Determined to be not supernatural - condemned)
Ruling #2 was issued (not determined). Many people confuse this with #3.
Be aware that the devil is behind this confusion. Do research carefully.
@@KenPaulsenArchitect What the Church Says "There is but one universal Church of the faithful outside of which no one at all can be saved." --Pope Innocent III
What Medjugorje Says "God presides over all religions as a king controls his subjects, through his priests and ministers." --Svetozar Krljevic O.F.M. , The Apparitions of Our Lady of Medjugorje, Franciscan Herald Press, 1984.
It cannot be both. To accept all "religions" is to deny Jesus Christ, who alone is the truth, the way and the life, the ONLY way to the Father is through him.
@@johnpaulsandoval6178 Please read the Catechism of the Catholic Church paragraphs 839-856. Yes, I too believe that it is only through the Holy Catholic Church (our communions, indulgences, prayers etc.) we assist in the salvific sacrifice of Jesus who is the Way, the Truth and the Life. Pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet which includes; "For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world." This is not meaningless.
The devil transforming into an angel of light...
I've thought for many years that Medjugorje was totally fraudulent. I remember that several bishops local to the "visions" rejected them as false and, if memory serves me, even dangerous. That's good enough for me.
Of course they did. I wonder why they don’t approve Garabandal?!… synod on synods!
Best we lovingly pray the rosary daily contemplate on each mystery. We don't have to visit medgiore to entrust ourself to our blessed Mother. However for those who have experienced a change for themselves after their visit there please pray for us and all the world.
I was told about Medugorje by family who had been there. I prayed about visiting during a very trying time in my life. My family members were going and at the last possible moment I called and was told only one space was open. I went. I was broken at the time but so very many signs were given that Our Lady was there. So many opportunities of prayer and worship and the feeling that this is what heaven must be like. Forgive me for my opinion and experience regarding the atmosphere of this place. I saw the crowds of people standing in lines for confession, in church for Mass and Adoration. I saw supernatural phenomena, not just me but with others who verified what I saw. So I am standing in a place that believes the Holy Ghost will blow where He blows. God be praised
Don't apologise for being correct 😊
the FOUNDATION OF THE FAITH.
Pope Francis said that the only means to know the Virgin Mary is the Gospel, excluding the narrative of any seer that does not match with Her personality as the Gospel exposes clearly, the humbleness and fidelity to the Lord.
So, we can raise these questions about the alleged apparitions:
- Would the Virgin Mary ask us to pray Ave Maria? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary introduce Herself saying: "I am the Mother of God"? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary ask for a Chapel be built in Her honour? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary pray the Rosary reciting Ave Maria? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary command a little girl to drink dirty water from a puddle and crawl on the ground eating grass like an animal? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary print Her image on a medal or mantel in order to be venerated? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary impose inhumane penance to 7 and 8 year old children and show them terrifying scenes of the Hell? I affirm: NO!
- Would the Virgin Mary confide secrets that the Pope could not know to a 10 year old girl? I affirm, NO!
We can go on and on analysing all the "apparitions" and conclude that no one stands up.
We can also with a rational thought say that the nature of the Virgin Mary remains human and cannot know each one of Her hundreds of millions "sons" scattered all around the world and stay by the side of each one to protect them at the same time, 24 hours by day. To do this God would have to give Her His powers of being omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent, making Her a goddess like Him.
I see that the Catholic Church made a huge theological mistake relating to the Virgin Mary and sold to the faithful
Now it is very hard and painful to correct it and the Vatican is trying to do it. And more is to come. I urge you all to watch the RUclips video Sister Lucia from Fatima interview 1957. Lucia reported a message saying that God abandoned His plan for our salvation through Christ's sacrifice replacing for the Rosary and the devotion to the Immaculate Hearth of Mary. Watch and judge for yourselves if she was a truthflul "messenger of God ".
Go back to the contradictory Protestantism that clearly has managed to cloud your reasoning. Consider that it's based on purely selfish human criteria, that its battle cry of "sola scriptura" was, is, and always will be perfect nonsense, in other words sweep the cobwebs out of your mind, and then come on back for a friendly conversation and, God willing, to the Church founded by Jesus Christ, not some German or Swiss or English bloke who had his own problems.
I think Medjugorie is FALSE but time will tell.. 🙏..FOLLOW THE MONEY!
Joe, maybe you should go and see for yourself?
Have you considered that the emotional impact of the "experience", might be hysteria? Why trust your feelings? My husband grew up in a charismatic evangelical church, and was convinced that the Holy Spirit was with their church, because of these manifestations he felt were authentic, so did thousands of others. Ultimately, emotions did not stand against truth.
Amen to that.
The "highest" approval, which no longer makes a determination as to whether the phenomon is of supernatural, rather than preternatural (demonic) origin.
Lastly, I dont think it's a coincidence that this announcement was made after the Pope's recent, contoversial remarks, given the allegation that the apparition articulated spme type of religious indifferentism.
No thank you.
The financial thing about Ivan.. that’s crazy! Not cool!
Absolutely not cool at all ... If true? 😮
Ivan married into a rich American family. The money isn't from him.
Fantastic, Thank you!
Mejugorje began as a dispute between the bishop of the place and Franciscans he was trying to remove from St James Church. Then Mary began "appearing" and hasn't stopped since. She never does that! The bishop and his successors have continually called the "apparitions" not supernatural. Rosaries changing to gold. Hokum!
Correction: The bishop's original commission issued the "Zadar Declaration" stating "Non-constat de supernaturalitate" (Not Determined to be supernatural). This is NOT saying that the events are Not supernatural... (that would be Constat de non-supernaturalitate). This ruling is the neutral "Not determined" if it is supernatural or not. Please do not spread misinformation.
Fr. Wolfe FSSP video was my red pill. The video of the Frenchman poking at the girls eyes during a “vision”. The response she gave when questioned. Total quackery!
Couldn't agree with you more! God bless you!
Love Medjugore, Change my life,j❤
Me too!
@@samwise8309 me three! ❤🙏❤
Medjugorje is not from Heaven
Great presentation. Xavier Ayral makes some good arguments in favor of the apparitions. I respect him and yet I have the same questions you brought up. Love your take.
Medjugorje is the truth. I've been going to Medjugorje for years. During those years I have witnessed many supernatural events, some of which was captured on camera and video. The camera doesn't lie. I had one personal encounter with the supernatural, an event that no-one else in the world has ever received. You can try your best to disprove Medjugorje, but I have my own personal experiences and demonstrable evidence captured on film. I hope one day you come to appreciate and accept Medjugorje to be a genuine Marian apparition shrine. God bless 🙏
@@Paul-hq5so do you have the evidence on line? I'd love to see it. I've read Mirjana's book and it's so convincing, but I do have a gut feeling that it's a long game from the evil one. But that's just me. The fruit just seems so overwhelmingly good.
@@Magnificat7248 I was advised by a priest in medjugorje to keep it private as it was a personal message for me to strengthen my faith. However, I have shown some of my photos and it has converted them. I worked for one visionary, and personally know all the other visionaries. I have had meetings with the pope's envoy to Medjugorje. Please don't focus on signs and wonders, instead focus on Christ. Trust me, Medjugorje is the truth. I don't lie, neither does my camera
@@Paul-hq5soby chance did you take a picture and have our lady come out on the picture? When I was in the 4th grade (early 90s) a friend of my Grandpa's gave him a copy of picture she took when she was in Medjugorie. She was taking a picture of some trees. And when the photo was developed, our lady was on the picture holding rosary beads. My grandpa made copies of the picture and gave them to all of us at Xmas that year. Whenever I've show someone the picture in recent years they say it's fake. Just curious if your picture is similar.
@@Magnificat7248 Yes, one of my photos clearly shows the Virgin Mary floating beside the left side of the cross on Cross Mountain. You can clearly see the Virgin Mary's body and head with rosary beads. Don't cast your pearls before swine. If you do show non-believers evidence of God, it will invariably cause a negative reaction because you're tapping into their comfort zone. In the denser depths of their soul they know there's an element of truth of God's existence, but they try to suppress it so to have an easier life without rules that God has given to merit the reward of heaven.
The National Shrine of Our Lady of Champion In Wisconsin is the first and only approved Marion Apparition site in the United States. So many healings, so many graces given, it is heaven on earth! I Hope you can visit these peaceful and sacred grounds.🙏
Hard pass on this nihilistic 😅 approval
But it wasn't Nihil Obstat as claimed. It was "Nulla Osta" - which means Authorized, Permission.
GARABANDAL much more believable!! 🙏
Both are true
@@TheresaCronin-kc6wz.. GARABANDAL is probably TRUE... 🙏.. So many problems with Medjugorie... IMO
I agree with you I always have been making that distinction that was also my experience the peace that you find there and yet the ongoing messages and stuff
About Ivan: I became aware of Medj in the late 1980's and was skeptical at first , then believed, and later , after four visits, and up close and personal contact with them a few times, in Medj and in the USA, stopped believing that the visions were from Heaven. I agree with your idea that good can come to people in bad places, and that most people who believe that the visions are from heaven will not give up the idea even though the congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith during Pope St. JP II's pontificate , while Ratzinger was prefect, declared and documented on 2 occasions that the visions were "nothing supernatural". Some of these people would ordinarily believe and obey the Papal authority but kept saying things like " JP II is in favor of the apparitions but Cardinal Ratzinger is not and he does not love Our Lady".....amazing! Ivan was quite young and barely had any whiskers the first time I attended a group talk by him at Medj. He said that Our Lady told the visionaries that she wanted all of them to become priests and religious but she wanted them to choose and not to be like St. Bernadette of Lourdes who was forced to become a nun. Ivan subsequently entered the seminary twice and could not keep up with the academics because, according to him, the long hours of prayer that Mary required of him did not give him enough time to study. The desire of Mary regarding the vocations was printed in a book by Fr. Rene Laurenten (sp?) who was an early spiritual director of the visionaries. To my knowledge, the other 5 visionaries made no attempts to enter religious orders or the seminary. St. Alphonsus Liguori said that a vocation is the will of God . Apparently the woman who appeared was not good at discerning God's will and the "forced vocation" of Saint Benadette is not true. Years later I read that Ivan was the keynote speaker for Vocations Week , somewhere, maybe in the USA, I can't recall where but I was stunned to hear this.
Yes, I agree that God’s grace can come anywhere you pray and seek the Lord. I honestly feel that God has used the unauthentic Medjugorje apparitions to backfire and open hearts to His graces which he is always giving when we desire it. 🙏🏻♥️🌹
Thanks. I’ve been confused but felt almost unCatholic in my doubts. I know much good has come from this alleged site even great priests attributing their vocation to what they experienced there but over all, it just made me uneasy and I don’t get that feeling from other apparition sites that are fully Church approved.
Francis likes Medjugorje because one of the "visionaries" has quoted Mary as saying, "All religions are pleasing to God." That's the first clue that the messages from Medjugorje are not from heaven.
Which message? What date? To whom? How about an actual quote of the heretical message.
Joe quoted one source in the video. Clearly, you did not watch.
@@josipkesina5696 Vicka Ivanković is cited as having received a message on October 1, 1981, in which it was reportedly stated that “all religions are pleasing to God.” According to accounts from the visionaries, the Blessed Virgin Mary (referred to as "Gospa" in Croatian) emphasized that individuals should live their faith sincerely and that it is essential to respect all faiths.
@@josipkesina5696 October 1, 1981 "Members of all faiths are equal before God." Really? Even IDOLATORS? Even those who DENY WHO GOD IS? Even those who worship SATAN or BAAL, or six-armed, blue skinned demons?
Exactly : Francis has just renounced (once more among many) to his own supernatural mission as a pope by declaring all religions more or less equivalent. The Gospa (lady) of Medjugorje also stated the same message, as to all established religions owing their power from God. These two avowals of renunciation to the tranquil possession of truth in favour of religious multiculturalism go together well. I won't go as far as to say there are not good persons and saints in other religions but they are saintly because they obey in fact to the commands as precised by the Church (chastity, humility, remorse...) despite, not because their own religions.
Jacinta was affected deeply by her vision of Our Lady at Fatima. She became a great saint at a very young age
Regardless of anyone's personal viewpoint regarding the veracity of Medjugorje there is only one standard to apply, the one offered by Our Lord Himself: 'You will know each tree by it's fruit,' and the fruit has been abundant beyond belief. There you have it. Blessings to all.
Amen
Like you Joe, I have heard personal testimonies from many of my friends who've gone there and believe that what they experienced is true. One friend did have his rosary chain turn to gold. Just saying what he shared with me.
Your analysis of the Spirit vs the visionaries is on the mark.
I took my children there when they were about 12 or 13 on a retreat with a local prayer group. They had been to Las Vegas earlier that year to visit their aunt and uncle. Their reaction was that it was like Las Vegas without the naked ladies on the billboards. I always pondered their comment because sometimes out of the mouths of babes. I have always considered its validity an open question. This is an interesting discussion.
I agree with you Joe 100%. I know people who are almost obsessed with Medgugore.
All religions are similar ? Sounds familiar
I went there about 25 yrs ago. Our priest and 10 parishioners experienced
No particular change.
The "vision of our Lady" in Medjugorie stating that "all religions are equal before God" are EXTREMELY TROUBLING... Very problematic.
Except that Our Lady did not say; "all religions are equal before God".
Oct 1981 - she said "MEMBERS of all religions are equal before God....". God loves us all. You can be sure the devil wants to spread this lie. Don't be duped.
By their fruits you will know them..... Go and see for yourself before you judge. I'm talking to my self as much as anything I've not been yet but it sounds very good.
Who am I to judge people’s conversions and spiritual experiences? But Medjugorje, I don’t buy it. It’s really confusing issuing a Nihil Obstat for the messages but saying that it’s not approved? What does it even mean?
She gave a message saying "I hope Croatia win the soccer match tonight"
They're in cahoots
Agreed.
I know people who believe in Medjugorje. Christ said know them by their fruits. The people I speak of all have this in common, They reject the teachings of the Holy Roman Catholic Church.
All the more reason not to accept it..
More reason to not believe Medjugorje
Exactly
Search further.... there is much misinformation in this video and elsewhere. The devil works furiously to discredit Medjugorje - duping innocent people like yourself.
If these visions are of diabolical origin,Catholics should not go there. The church has always protected the laity from diabolical apparitions and would cause considerable harm to catholics. God can give grace in this but that does not mean the environment is safe.
Hard to believe cause he himself thought it was unreal for the Blessed Mother to give messages everyday, I myself doubt that, but I know that miracles have been happening there...
Nice one Joe, always speak the truth that is staring you in the face whoever it upsets,
Loads of talk of Fruits and Jesus said You will know them by their Fruits.
“Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruits, but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. “A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit; neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit
Medjugorje has only good fruits thanks to the Blessed Mother
@@TheresaCronin-kc6wz They more or less stated that the visions are false and the fruits that they go on about are the wealth generated and the people taken in by it. Anything built on a fraud remains a fraud and if the Catholic church needs to depend on fraud to bring in converts then this brings the whole catholic Church into question.
Agree with you Jo 👍🏻seems like a cult to me
It's a gut feeling that I have that doesn't allow me to believe it.
Great news.
It's private...but then... that means that Our Lady is contradicting herself....does that sound like a sound mother??? 🤔🤔🤔
Way to divide the Church even further. Good grief.
I wonder if Ivan gave Our Lady a kickback for her timely appearance
Heaping more confusion on top of confusion.
Besides, the phrase "spiritual experience" is at the core of modernism and the first thing Pope St. Pius X condemned in Pastor domenici gregis. Subjective over objective standard.
First, no apparitions have been approved while ongoing.
Didn’t the Priest in Arizona commit suicide?
I seem to remember that
to appear so often, while The Mother of God changed the world, appearing a few times with concise short messages each and every other times ... besides, most visionaries of real apparitions, led reclusive spiritually coherent lives, ... God does not do miracles on a time table, he is revelatory and His miracles are never contradictory or vain, .... when Christ contradicts himself in tone, in message, in morality, when he differs from Christ in the Bible , I stay away...
Up in Heaven, the three Marys - Mary Magdalene, Mary of Bethany and Mary, the Mother of our Lord are planning their holidays.
Mary of Bethany says, "I fancy going to Ibiza."
Mary Magdalene says, "No, let's go to Paris for a bit of culture."
Mary, the Mother of our Lord, says, "No, I want to go to Medjugorje. I've never been there."
Galatians 8:1 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!
Look up Xavier Aryal hes a good solid trad catholic he would refute all you say. Maybe look him up.
Make Marian Pilgrimages Great Again.
I don't agree with you! If the spiritual goings on are bad, doesn't matter about the good things. Too much damage is going on>Dangerous!
That is the uside down glow
Go to Medjugorje first, then judge ! It is easy to judge from the comfort of your chair. Dare to go, especially you non believers and see how you feel and what kind of a person can tell you what you feel in your heart !