He Was SAVED... But It All Went Horribly Wrong: The New Raid's Alternate Story
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Haurchefant was SAVED... then everything went very wrong, very fast. The Dragonsong's Reprise Ultimate has amazing story content for players & for viewers who don't have the time or skill to play it themselves.
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If you want some more heartache, during the Nidhogg and Hraesvelgr phase, Haurchefant and Ysayle can be seen fighting other dragons outside of the arena. So Ysayle lives too but gets a front row seat of watching Hraesvelgr be controlled, being put down by us, then getting his eyes absorbed by Thordan.
She also dies again, becaue if you don't spare Thordan she gives you the buff to kill an eye.
@@OliveEaters but not sparing Thordan results in a wipe because you can’t reach the final boss right? So that would mean she would still live technically
@@Harrowing999 She presumably dies either during or before phase 6 of the fight in the alternate timeline because her ghost appears to give you the buff. Haurchefant's doesn't appear because he hasn't died. You wipe because one of the eyes is invulnerable without the buff from Haurchefant's ghost.
@@Harrowing999 she would still be dead nothing would technically change
@@Harrowing999 The only way you can save Estinien is with Ysale and Haurchefant's help. In the Ultimate you get a buff from the spirits of both that lets you damage the eyes. Since they're alive in the branching timeline, and if Thordan is dead, the eye phase starts normally but you're unable to damage them, and in the end wipe.
After Endwalker, knowing that Limit Breaks are powered by strong emotion, and having to use it to save Haurchefant, got me fucked up.
Yep
> Cutscene Skippers
*Shows Quinn getting absolutely fucked by very visible mechanics people learn of an expansion earlier*
He's never going to live that down.
Good.
its sad that had Quinn actually gave the game a fair shake he would probably be playing today.
@@DireFoxIIC I wouldn’t call it fair. Skipping everything to get to the current content instead of going at it slow and learning like most others.
@@BadaBadger Read the comment you replied to again.
@@BadaBadger read dude... also he didn't get to current content he skipped to the last story trial in stormblood and got his ass beat because he knew nothing.
I remember watching Rin Karigani's stream at one point and they were discussing how to resolve mechanics, not by talking about the fight, but by arguing about the events of the story in Heavensward. That's why everyone was so invested into the race this time. It wasn't just about the mechanics, it was the story that everyone in the community experienced together.
And sparing Thordan makes sense story-wise too. Haurchefant not dying not only means that we don't have the personal motivation urging us to go stop Thordan in Azys Lla, but also that we don't have a need to avenge him by killing Thordan.
@@HanabiraKage
That's tough, because we still need to stop him becoming un Uber primal and wrecking all the work we've been doing to help Ishgard. So story wise we still should have chased him right away. Especially knowing (by Thordans own admission) that the ascians were involved.
We didn't chase him only because he killed our friend.
Them implying that was kind of strange. We already had two major reasons to rush out there and stop him. Haurchenfant was just a very painful third reason. That kicked us in the gut while we were already desperate and in a rush.
@@noxelohim On the contrary, him being a primal is not a good reason enough. Ysale is a primal, and she actively uses it, for our own benefits so she gets a pass somehow? Thordan may be "in league" with the Ascians, but unlike Gaius, he knows full well the treachery of the Ascians, and even tells the WOL about it that he plans to deal with them and ask for your cooperation. The reason a primal is even a threat is because they drain the land's aether and temper people. Thordan as a primal doesn't need to do either, he already has the power of the eyes, alongside an ascian soul to draw limitless aether, and he doesn't need to temper people because he already has thousand years of prayers from the Ishgardian Faith. He's practically one of the most eco-friendly primal.
The only real other reason is the dragon issues, but that's because you have been listening mostly to Hrae's version of events. The original Ishgardian wronged the dragons yes, but guess who was the one that escalated the slaughter for thousand of years? The dragons. And Hrae, nor any other dragons did anything about it. They just flee and afk in their little haven while watching newborn dragons get sent to die in a war they have no clue is about thanks to Nidhogg.
And this problem is not unique to Ishgard, almost pretty much all three city-states of Eoazea is built upon some, as Gaius said, cob-web of lies, beast tribes have their landes robbed or threatened, The Twelve was summoned as a primal to deal with the Bahamut problem when it felt needed. It is a hypocrisy when you think about it .
Now we may still go to Asyz La, but our goal is not to murder or kill Thordan, to the WOL's gallant heart and mind, he's misguided, confused. Just like Ysale. The issue we have against him is not on a personal level. Thordan didn't really do anything wrong personally to us because at the end of the day, he's doing what his forbearers have been doing. And his cause is way more just than say, a bunch of pirates who rob lands of beast tribes and brag about how awesome they are about it. Or some pototo who threatens the land by betraying the Scion and forces us to go on Heavensward's journey in the first place.
@@peerawat9x "The Twelve was summoned as a primal to deal with the Bahamut problem
when it felt needed. It is a hypocrisy when you think about it "
Especially when you consider that the summoning was being carried out by the greatest advocate against summoning and primals in the modern age lol.
@@noxelohim tbh we didnt know he was a primal until the singularity reactor, so no real reason to chase
The FFXIV MSQ is something I think the developers could make a completely single-player experience if they wanted.
This Ultimate is something only MMOs can do. Story players get to experience a different timeline together in a stream chat with everyone else. High-end players get to grapple with mechanics. Everyone is having a good time. What a unique, beautiful experience.
They are making the msq a completely single player experience if you want it to be
I'm not convinced of that. I think the FFXIV MSQ, even in the future when they make it possible to uses trusts for every fight, only works as an MMO.
TL;DR version is that the communal nature of the experience, sharing those impactful moments with others, watching them experience them for the first time, is a MASSIVE part of what makes it work. Even if we play it alone, we enjoy it as a community.
Longer Version:
This is a story that has been ongoing for 8 YEARS, in 3-4 month increments. I think that only works because the rest of the more traditional MMO side of the game is there to flesh out the little bits of characterization and setting in addition to MSQ, and the community is there to actively discuss and share in their enjoyment and play the content together and generally engage with the world and it's fiction together, in a way that makes the long timescale feasible for the story.
If we didn't have the MMO community to share this story with, and the extra flavor that the non MSQ content lends to the MSQ, it wouldn't be as fun, or as interesting, or likely, have ever been made, since you could never make an 8 year live service game with major story updates for a singleplayer one time purchase title.
apart from all but 1 trial all dungeons in the game have a solo mode, with npcs for other players. So the game is practically soloable at this point
@@mukulvdhiman not quite yet
2.x msq dungeons and Heavensward and Stormblood msq dungeons aren't yet built to use the duty support system.
In 6.2 supposedly we will get duty support for Snowcloak, Keeper of the Lake, Sohm Al and The Eyrie. 6.3 most likely the rest of the 3.0 msq dungeons. 6.4 Heavensward patch msq dungeons (6.1 only had sidequest dungeons so there's 4 of them)
6.5 will probably get 4.0 dungeons (level 63 is optional so no duty support)
Maybe the Stormblood patch dungeons will be done in 6.55 or maybe in 7.0
The only issue is the trials, whether they will make duty support for all the 8 man msq trials
@@FF-tp7qs ahhh i didnt know they didnt add those
There is a small bit of back lore from HW that this raid explains as well, which is a wonderful cherry on top. In the Aery, lv 55 story dungeon, right before the final boss in the ruins in the background you can see a fragment of some clearly Allagan device. Some people assumed that it was a remnant of Allagans' failed attempt to enslave Nidhogg. For years we didn't know for sure why it was still there, but now it becomes clear, Nidhogg kept it to enslave Hraesvelgr and force him into joining his final attack on Ishgard as a last resort.
or ya know... a fallen piece of azys lla
@@rinnnnnnnnnnrin Why would it be Azys Lla? Surely you mean Dalamud?
@@rinnnnnnnnnnrin It couldn't be from Azys lla, because Azys lla is above the Sea of Clouds in Abalathia region of Eorzea, Aery is in the Churning Mists in Dravania area, miles to the north-west.
@@AlexAnder-bc8kg *malms to the northwest
I seriously doubt Nidhogg entirely knew the true purpose of the Neurolink. It just all seems too convenient cuz why wouldn't he have utilized it after his shade snatched Estinien? He should've felt compelled to enslave Hraesvelger if he had a Neurolink he knew how to use prior to his final invasion on Ishgard. My theory is that Thordan had more time to investigate Allagan technology on Azys Lla to plan out his attack on the Churning Mists which the Eyes retained knowledge of, one of them being about the Neurolinks which Thordan wasn't aware was located in The Aery. After Thordan was defeated and was forced to abandon the Ascalon sword to retreat, Nidhogg's shade took over Estinien as preordained and utilized what he learned in Azys Lla to control Hraesvelgr.
Couldn't we just have had a Timeline where Haurchefant lived, but Thordan in his hurry got swallowed by Bismarck, leaving only a facepalming Lahabrea behind?
the ward could already transform before arriving in azys lla, they just didn't have a reason to. Without us to do the dirty work for him, he'd just transform alongside his knights in the sea of clouds and dunk bismarck with ease
it really is like it's Doctor WoL and the multiverse of Dragons...
I mean, I’d have loved that. XD
No, because then that’d be a tumblr meme fic
Something unmentioned is that not sparing Thordan means you can’t save Estinient from the Eyes and have to kill him.
Which opens up a bigger can of worms when you realize that prevents Shinryu from being summoned, Omega being awakened, and all of Stormblood effectively.
And papalmo not giving his life to seal him away
You can't stop the eyes because Ysayle and Haurchefant are alive so they can't give you an amp lol Thordan becoming the new vessel just has the added and unintentional effect of saving Estinien which is hilarious
No stormblood means no meeting Zenos, means no shadowbringers, means Emet still out there, the rejoigning probably happens, and guess what.
Black rose gets used and you die.
I think thats something they might come back to in a later ultimate or something.
@@Karami42 it would be cool if the ultimates turned into these alternate route scenarios.
No Shinryu means no one to save you from the Endsinger if that timeline even gets that far.
I wonder if future Ultimates will be "What If" scenarios like this? Like, what if Tsuyu survived? What if we sided with Zenos when he invited us to join him? What if the WoL had to save the First but WASN'T Azem?
I hope so! They've already been what if scenarios story-wise, but this is the first time they took that bit of fluff and actually leaned into it and made it part of the fight. It's such a unique and cool thing, I hope it becomes the norm.
OH FK
I want that Zenos theory one, I'd love to do that! I imagine we're goin down into the darkside Anakin style, and the last boss could be Raubahn powered by Rhalgr himself. That'd be epic.
I really would love a Zodiark Ultimate where he's fully rejoined, maybe even with Elidibus or Emet-Selch as his core depending on the alt scenario.
Tsuyu deserved better. Maybe now she can get it, even if it's only a "what if?" in an ultimate.
What if Louisoix didn't kill Bahamut?
Dragonsong Ultimate is a piece of art. They absolutely nailed it. The use of RP mechanics, music and in general the mechanics. Arguably the best boss that has ever been released in this genre.
I've heard other people say that high-end content can be aspirational and inspirational for people. A small percentage of the playerbase clears Ultimates, yes, but the excitement of Ultimates gets the community energized, makes for memorable "you had to be there" moments, and gives people sitting on the fence about trying the harder stuff the chance to consider something new. Dragonsong's Reprise nailed all of those extra-hard this time by leaning hard into lore that just about every dedicated FFXIV player would know, and that's brilliant.
It's gotten a number of people in my FC motivated to join in on Savage raid practice. :D
Just wanted to comment a slight correction; There was a small hotfix to the fight. There was a bug involving tower placement during the Nidstinien phase causing the location of the tower to freak out if the player was "moving fast" during it's placement. It caused a few towers to be placed literally off the map in a few of Arthars pulls.
We also saw some floating Towers while our progress. But overall just a Placement Hotfix and not a difficulty Scaling.
But it never went as far as: "Oh crap they're cheesing a mechanic, let's just patch that method out" during progression that essentially sabotaged a World First team's pace lmao
As someone who's been playing since 2014, never had any interest at all to do ultimates, don't much care about the glowing weapons or titles this fight was the one that got me, I want so bad to experience this story myself, I got a group of friend together and we'll start progging the previous Ults to get a taste for them soon.
All the kudos and props to the dev team, they made high end content so good that even casuals want to hop in and give it a shot, we are now currently progging P4S Part 2, currently figuring out Act 2, and I've never had as much fun as I've had these past few weeks doing the current tier. Congrats and thank you to all the teams that have cleared and to the dev team for the massive success they have achieved.
Good luck in raid! Always happy to see more players giving raids and ultimates a shot :)
Hell yea man. Have fun with P4S Part two. Its a fun one.
This is one of the best videos that I have seen in a while.
Hard agree on everything you said. I am just a viewer, but the last couple of days have been INTENSE.
Thank you for this. I am happy that I am not the only one who thinks that this Raid is amazing
this race is fucking beautiful the story, community and the raiders all came together cohesively making this event to be remembered forever in the history of FF14
It really, really was. One thing Matt didn't mention but I've seen a few streamers talk about, was how much the community in Twitch chat played into the fight as well. It was challenging enough that in some cases chatters were able to pick out mechanics that the raiders were struggling with, and provide suggestions and thoughts. It really was an event that could engage every level of player, and that's astounding.
@@kendric99 so true I was following Arthars specifically seeing him clearing it brought tears to my eye the dude once said this might be his final earnest chance to give it his best because he can start to feel his age (40+ years old and 2 kids)
This is very similar to the og Demon's Souls and Dark Souls days where the players were discovering mechanical secrets and piecing together a story as a community.
To have someone do that, unifying a very diverse community that way in a multiplayer RPG is a fantastic achievement.
This race was a blast to follow and this fight is incredible to prog! I am really excited for the next one 😁
One of the best things about the ultimate in my opinion is that the community gets to be part of the puzzle solvers while they watch the raiders. Like when after thordan the raid got sent back to the beginning everyone was speculating and trying to think about what to do. Some people noticed the extra lb bar and then it came down to what to do with it. No other mmo has this kind of live audience involvement
The greatest fight ever made, so far.
Heavensward's setting, story and music is my favorite. This whole situation is a big nut button moment for me.
Any ending where Haurchefant lives is a good ending.
Thordan still meets his end in the long run, even after all he did in this alternate timeline, only to fall once again. Even though he wasn't yelling anything when he was finally downed in his final form, I like to imagine he yelled something similar to his canon-counterpart at the end of the normal fight, only much louder and vitriolic before finally being destroyed.
The fact that the content for the most hardcore players is good content and something the more casual players that only care about the story can enjoy this ultimate. It was a blast to watch, the way they messed with the story to get an alternate reality is so cool... In fact the idea of putting a alternate reality into the fight is insane and normally I wouldn't think that would work but hey, the 14 team totally nailed it and something absurd became something incredible epic
I don't want to start the discussion what is harder WoW Mythic or Ultimate, but i'm a big fan of the idea that the hardest content in the game is not just Bosses that we already know in very hard but also a "What if.. ?" Story, Dragonsong was not the first one.. we already fight Alexander in his Perfect Form that we never see in the raid story (TEA) or what happend when the Ultima Weapon unleashed its full power (UWU), much stronger than in the mainstory where we just saw a blink of that.
Sorry for my english.
even UCOB is a "what-if" scenario in a sense. iirc the way it's explained by the minstrel, it's supposed to be a hypothetical situation where the WoL wasn't able to get to Bahamut in time, and so you're effectively fighting him, Twintania and Nael all at their most powerful at the same time.
This ultimate is the best hardcore raid content ever put into an MMO and you can’t tell me otherwise.
Glad to see you headlining another video!
The energy in this ultimate was crazy. Most likely since this was the first truly great story in FFXIV people were keen to know what an alternate version would be. The fact that so many great players who had cleared the previous ultimates had trouble with it is a great mark as well.
Shoutout to Arthars, Stal, Xeno and MrHappy for their prog streams.
Every single one of FFXIV’s teams consistently outdoing themselves is kind of fucking wild. Every patch, the music, raid, story, hell now even PvP outdo their performances from the previous patch.
RIBIDE RIBIDE RIBIDE
DAN DAN
ONE OF MY STUDENTS DIDNT COME
This goes deeper as a veterans as well. For those that got the title "The Final Witness" bared a special mark among others back in the day. This was when FFXIV hid an important lore behind the most difficult content at the time; The Final Coil. It said there were less than 2% of population witnesses the hidden cutscenes. I was among those few who knew the truth of what happened. Since then, Yoshi P has decided not to have an important lore locked behind a raid. Veterans were divided on that decision. Personally, I was against it and felt like Yoshi P has tuck this controversial decision under until this new ultimate. I believe Yoshi P has somehow created a successor to the coils but at the same time keeping the lore available for everyone. He managed to successfully married lore and raid together without creating a schism between the hardcore and casuals.
Not only this, but since it's a "what if" story, that means that the events of Dragonsong Reprise are not canon - they're just one possible way the events could have unfolded had Haurchefaunt lived - told through a song from the Wandering Minstrel's imagination. And that's what really distinguishes the Coils from today's Ultimates and Savages. The Coils actually are canon (in fact, the MSQ treats you as completing the Coils even if you haven't), which means that they're important to complete, even if by using unrestricted party options. But the stories in the Ultimate are speculative "what ifs".
@@powerofk its literally yoshi P's self-insert character writing a fan fiction and then singing about it to you xD
@@powerofk Yeah I feel like alternate "what if" scenarios being locked behind endgame content is fine, just nothing pertaining to the main game's story like the final coils did.
The fact that the FF14 team is willing and able to write a fully thought out and emotionally engaging alternate story purely for a hardcore raid surrounding content that's "already been done" is just further proof as to how much they care about their story and their players. Adding something to content that normally the more casual players wouldn't even bother to try/watch just to make it more interesting for EVERYONE is that "above and beyond" kind of mentality that keeps me there for the long haul.
Cannot wait to start this with my static soon been helping others has been a blast! Thank you for the video. I try to get anyone and everyone to try ultimates. They’re so fun and rewarding and anyone can do it.
That 'anyone can do it' is what I love about FF raids and trials. Yes, they can be hard. But the way the fights are set up make it so that even if you screw up, it's not a wipe. The whole fight is a learning experience right up until you win.
It can genuinly be hard. But its so cool tho.
I cleared my first alexander raid this week and yes, we been wiped at least a dozen tomes troughout. But the Raid was so worth it. It was so good!
Once again I believe that you did an excellent job at a solo content video Sir Mat. Very nicely done. I truly enjoy the finer details that you guys add to these kind of videos. They are so fun for me to listen to. Thank you for an entertaining video. Please keep doing your best in what you enjoy doing.
In addition to Hraesvelgr enraging if his attacks kill any players, Nidhogg also enrages if you fail to keep passing around his DoT/healing down debuff, because you broke his cycle of vengeance.
Save him Smadge
Save him STRUMMER
While the alternate timeline idea is very cool indeed, I'm not quite sure why Haurchefant not dying makes us want to go to Azys Lla less so Thordan can finalize his plan.
Like we see the old fart going going for some Allagan tech to try to conquer the world no matter if Haurchefant is alive or not. I kinda understand wanting revenge as a motivational factor here, but still it should be secondary to a need of stoping a maniac from getting even more power.
Haurchefant being alive would make more sense in fact we don't have ghost buddies to help with Eyes after Final Steps of Faith so then we lose Estinien for good.
I mean.... thordan becomes a primal... thats the whole reason we would have to fight him regardless as the warrior of light. A.k.a EIKON slayer.
If I learned anything from The Flash is that going back in time to save someones life will result in a fracturing of the space time continuum which will lead to a horrorscape level alternate timeline which will just be hell on earth. No one wants a Flashpoint.
I cried so much watching! And when they cleared I ended up cry even more. I also cried because I can never do this content. So all I can do is watch.
Thank you for the details, as watcher, we cannot really read what things says.
I hope you can try it someday!
@@seekittycat It is a dream but unable
@@yabiyabi I will say, I never thought I'd do on content savages even as late as E12. I got my P1S clear week one. I'm primarily an RPer. You can do it, it'll just take practice, time, and patience with yourself. Never say never.
@@lexysteinberger7725 savage is not so difficult ^^ I started O9s I qued thinking it is 'extreme'.......as new player...haha. I studied and cleared (with much effort and 3 months ) all and so I do savage, I do not think is comparable....I cannot do this because I cannot join fixed group. Because people look at logs and I like my privacy so I hide it. (I got harassed to no disgusting end) now I am ridiculed for hiding so .... it's sad reality. I am happy yoshi-p understands. :( alaso thank you for encouragement. I am sure I could do it....... I just cannot do without fix group ^^
We reached the Final Phase once Yesterday and Overall this Fight is absolute Amazing. It by far surpasses Ucob/Tea in difficulty and gives so much "What if?" Storymoments within the Fight. Its so hard to look at all of the Details while you have to be carefull for every Step you take.
Cant even immagine how they gonna Top this Fight ever. Even with the differend Timeloop and the Saving of our Boy it made so much impact.
Really hoping we can clear this week.
And yet, AND YET, you know with the track records these mad, brilliant bastards have, they're gonna top it.
@@lexysteinberger7725 tbh but only in Terms of Difficulty. Because overall i still prefer UCoB over UwU and TEA when it comes to Fight Design. Yes Perfect (Megazord) Alexander is cool looking but thats all.
But DSR has good Story, Relevant Lore, a Really cool idea with the whole Timeline Stuff AND is freaking Hard. I dont think they gonna Top this Ultimate for a very Long Time also because the whole Dragonsong War is for most people still the Peak of FF14 Storytelling. Maybe in 2-3 Expansions when we get a Hydalyn/Zodiac Themed Ultimate. With Perfect Endsinger ^^
I wish you and your group alot of good luck :D
At this point, I'm just scared what they will do with a potential Yotsuyu Ultimate...
@@Aaron.Arcanum the piano interlude during that phase is just haunting.
4 lords, rhythm game ultimate lol
It's a what-if scenario that takes extreme liberties why would Haurchefant living delay us getting the key when Thordan didn't even get it when we took the time to mourn Haurchefant death? How did he get the Warring Triads power so fast when we had to get around the barrier just to get in Azys Lla?
it ain't that deep lol.. I see what u mean but idk I think you just gotta have fun with it
Minstrel figured it'd make a better story.
thordan only says 'go. azys lla awaits.' to his airship's pilot after haurchefant was struck by the spear, if he watched his lackey's attack 'completely fail' (cos tank LB) he'd probably say something more like 'what the fuck how' and so we'd never learn he's going to azys lla, and he/his knights would just gtfo since they have an airship and we dont. that'd give them time to amass some strength again, to use their primal forms to kill bismarck to get the key unopposed
at least thats how i see it
These things wouldn't really bother me if other people weren't saying them as reasons for post-Haurchefant saving phases so authoritatively, because their logic doesn't make sense to me.
@@Boyzby Unfortunately, people are just so into butterfly effect stories (which was an awesome movie, bot to watch it in theaters), and because most what if scenarios before that movie involved happily ever afters, they're just so ready to accept bad endings without going back through the story and critically analyze every plot point in multiple viewpoints to see what actually would be changed and what wouldn't.
Love your guys FF14 videos
Many Neverland members have admitted to come back and replay the HW story to prepare for bullshit cryptic mindscrew that they might throw at them like TEA‘s Enigma Codex. They also liked it, surprise surprise. So, once more, ultimate is genius content SE makes, because now you get most of the skippers to go back and enjoy a story you well crafted.
It's really not cryptic at all. Arthars who is part of the clips featured and part of Team Krile who is World #5 clear skipped the majority of HW story, but was able to figure out pieces of the mechanics just by reading some of the dialogue and just figuring out how the mechanics get weaved together. What is pretty awesome is that Arthars' interest in HW story was rekindled and he is now planning to do New Game + to experience it. Even just watching the Ysayle and Haucherfaunt clips had him tear up and he still didn't have all the context. This Ultimate is just fantastic.
I am not saying the tank lb happening right now is cryptic. Even primal awakening in uwu is not that cryptic a puzzle for me. I am saying they CAN make cryptic mechanics for ultimates so the world first raiders, to do anything in order to win, will have to check out the related story. Therefore hitting 2 birdies with a stone
As a big fan of the HW Expac, this Ultimate Raid was such a big fan service for me... I was so immersed with HW's storyline, it was a rollercoaster of emotion when I went through it and this revisioned storyline via Reprisal was amazing! YoshiP;s team outdid themselves once again!
Hey! Saw my server/data center on those charts... all the way on the end, at right. Woo!
Literally the best MMO on this planet and anyone who tries to debate against that fact just makes themselves look like an absolute moron
There is a reason why its on the number 1 spot right now. And already been since endwalker
I really loved Alex ultimate for the mechanical complexity that effectively mirrored the mechanical high points of Alexander and a lot more only to deal with a brutal burn phase into the LB3 and final phase transition. Very cool stuff and the fate calibration mechanics are super creative. But I never thought they would do something this fucking crazy
fate calibration was literally just "we dont show you the mechanic until you datamine whats up with this add"
@@ich3730 Except there was nothing to be datamined. They categorized it as a vuln up to fool the people doing it in the first place so people literally had to figure it out
Slight correction: the arena that Phase 5 Thordan is in is not Anix Trine, its a scaled up version of Dakrscale's FATE boss arena in the Churning Mists. You can tell based on the floor pattern and the fact Darkscale and Vedrfolnir are among the dragons that Thordan tempers.
I’m so happy to see more players try higher end content- I was able to finally convince some non-raiding friends to try ucob. Yes, you read that right, I threw them into the deep end. I was super excited to see they all thoroughly enjoyed it though; and they were picking up mechanics, understanding, and able to execute to reach nael within an hour. Now they’re thirsty for more raiding content. Unfortunately I’m currently progging DRU with another group atm, but I hope I ignited a spark in these now new-to-raiding friends to give raiding a shot
If they can do Twintania they can definitely do P1S and P2S with almost no difficulty. Maybe not P3S right away but given time for sure.
@@thisismyyoutubecommentacco6302 yeah! I was super excited for them, and hopefully they'll be down to do more in the future :)
There actually was a hotfix, one of the mechanics in nidhogg(p2 estenien) was bugged and it would freak out if you moved too much right before it went off. It only existed for a day though and was an actual bugfix instead of an fixing accidental overtune or anything like that
Also the error was occurring only server-side, so it was just fixed live
Dude! Dragon-king Thordan was just fucking bonkers to watch! He looks so fucking awesome! Its INSANE how cool he looks!!
I see what you did there at 1:38, nice move. lmao
I can’t wait for the Raid Dev Team to continue this whole story in the next Ultimate and give us an Alt Timeline
watching the first time loop with arthur was amazing, chat went wild…. and because he was the first streamer to get there on live, he got to try all the option
7:22 THERE I AM GARY, THERE I AM!
I feel like this video should've come out last weeek, as streamers has cleared it now xP - Watching it live and with the teasers from a certain team was insane, I don't think I've ever felt so much hype around an encounter in any mmo
the content on this channel does seem to lag behind generally ://
@@FrankysABoysName I imagine they're working on several videos at once, as well as doing their regular several-hour-long podcast and developing a game, on top of actually playing the MMOs!
I think the best part about the other timeline is that the Heaven's Ward had to fight a giant flying whale to get the waymarker for Azys Lla.
XD i wonder if they actualy could? They don't posses the echo... are they therefor not vulnerable to being thralled?????
@@cherrydragon3120 They're already tempered by Thordan. Once someone is tempered, they cannot be re-tempered by another Primal.
I gotta say, if you're on the NA dcs and want to try ultimates, pug them. I've cleared uCOB, TEA and UWU in pugs and it's a great way to meet awesome players and people love helping others. Example Aether has Ethel who loves doing UWU and he helps clears so many people Aether also has The Avengers a group of people who help people do that last push through golden and they will carry damage mitigation and healing you just need to show up and do your job.
Primal has amazing people like level checker and so much more helping people and I haven't been on Crystal in awhile but they have an ultimate server too.
Ultimates are insanely fun and I personally love helping people clear, I do TEA pugs a lot and it's my favorite fight.
Prob the first Ultimate I've watched on Twitch, was on break from FF on the past ones. What an incredible event to witness, having mechanics and story is fantastic.
I don't do raids much these days so I don't think I'll ever get to do it myself, but watching with twitch chat going "SAVE HIM Smadge", jumping between streamers on wipes was so fun, prob moreso than if progging it (unless you're said raider dealing with mechs over and again, can't imagine the pain).
Good luck to the raiders progging tho
I freaking LOVED following this story as the raid was progressed. I'm not one to ever care for world first races or ultimate progging, but this one was genuinely fascinating as an FFXIV lore fan. I played WoW for 9 years, and now FFXIV for 3, and never in all that time spent playing WoW was the story ever as engaging as FFXIV's story is. WoW can really learn a ton from this.
The fact we see that even if we saved our dear friend the situation gets so much worse. I believe when it comes to the minstral we see an alternate timeline of the fights. Though knowing that he died and us acting saved us from a much worse fate will hurt us....and cause to go his grave like every week
The good thing about Ultimates is that them being evergreen means you can take your time. I'd argue anyone can do an ultimate, if you are just have a group to do it for a while. I know people that progged TEA for 8 months casually to get their clear.
Imagine it like fighting 7 savage bosses in a row. Eventually the first few fights, or in the case of an ultimate the phases, become very internalized and you know what to do for each phase and you "prog" the most current phase to learn it properly.
Also what didn't get mentioned is that the only goal of Ultimates is prestige. You get a Title and a Weapon. And that it isn't a real "gearcheck". as in that you could possibly outscale it. If you farmed savage and got your BIS in Pandemonium, have food and pots bam, you're ready to go.
"The beloved Knight. Turned. Martyr. In my youth, i witnessed Haurchefant's sacrifice, and his rise into Martyrdom.
Years later, i stumbled upon a chance to journey back in history, unaware that the entire affair had been carefuly orchestrated by Elidibus. In my "wisdom," i seize that opportunity to tear my dear friend away from the jaws of death, and thereby, deprives my past self of the catalyst he needed to ignite a personal crusade against the Heavensward.
This one. Reckless act. Unravels the scale of history. The Martyr never becomes a Martyr, Thordan's scheme goes unhinged, I, the untimely savior becomes the author of the second holy war, and the Ascians profits from it all. I prevent a tragedy, only to create one far worse."
Love how my home Data Center Crystal is last and even my server Malboro is last lol
I once said that F14 is a great game with a very profound and moving story and banger music, but it's not the most backseat gamer friendly game.
I take that back. I've found myself looking up walk-throughs of the ultimate (but all I can find are hours long stream progs) the instant I discovered the Dragonsong Reprise Ultimate is a what-if scenario.
And about battle design... I'm still trying to figure out who the hell designed some of my favorite fights in EW.
Its kind of mindblowing they can retell an alternate timeline for entire expansion in 19 minutes fight
So how did Hraesvelgr get mind controlled?
Perhaps a recap of each of the ultimates (from a story/lore perspective) would be an interesting series to do.
In the Binding Coil of Bahamut raid series, you'll find Twintania, a dragon collared with the same sort of Allagan device Hraesvalgar is forced to wear. Allagans in the past fought against a nation led by Dragons, which led them to developing technology to capture and harness Primals and Dragons.
@@MythrilShotgun Well I know that, but how did that happen to Hraesvalgar or is that a "it just happened offscreen for the sake of the Ultimate" type of thing?
@@AoiKaze2000 Offscreen, though there's enough in the game to connect the dots, like the Allagan relic in the Aery and how they've been used in the past to surmise.
@@MythrilShotgun There was a relic in the Aery? It's been ages since I've done Heavensward (did it upon release), so my memory of that part is rather hazy.
You're wrong with regard to saying that the Ultimate is a bigger event than Endwalker in terms of Twitch numbers, because.....NO-ONE was gonna risk spoiling themselves when it comes to Endwalker's story.
I cut off all access to RUclips after almost getting spoiled on something in the 5th area...while I was IN the 5th area! Everyone was playing, few were watching.
Some of these madmen were up to over 1,000 pulls before completing.
Imagine being Blizzard and say stuff like that:
"We do not release Raid-Encounters for mythic content that the Def-Team was incapable of clearing out". I remember a Boss calle Kil'Jaden, which was FUCKING OVERTUNED and they needed to patch fix him 3 or 4 times, so that it was beatable...
The internal raid team probably doesn't need to clear the entire fight in one go to consider it cleared. You can demonstrate that a raid is clearable while using dev tools like extra checkpoints to make it more feasible
10:32 DSR didn't prove that, TEA did, FFXIV viewership on twitch was HUGE when TEA was new.
Even before that, UWU had a very large viewership too. People want to watch Ultimates, see what the next struggle is, see the hype moments in real time.
Obviously spoilers for Heavensward for those that haven't gotten to the points yet:
So, the funny thing is, when you critically examine every bit of the story starting with the events leading up to his death, you'll see that his death wasn't necessary at all to stop Thordan VII's plans in Azys Lla.
While in The Vault, you see his knights becoming psuedo-primals, so in the meeting with Aymeric afterwards, Alphinaud realizes that, with all of the fervent prayers towards the original King Thordan and whatever they're going to find in Azys Lla, Thordan VII's plan is to become a Thordan Primal the same way Ysayle becomes Shiva, so the urgency will ALWAYS be there, we would still be chasing them to Azys Lla and immediately to the Sea of Clouds since the knights at Camp Cloudtop reported to Lucia that the Soleil, the pope mobile, heading towards the Sea of Clouds.
In the death scene itself, we see Thordan VII say, "Come, Azys Lla awaits." I have seen people say make the argument that his death CAUSES Thordan VII to say those words, not realizing that most likely it wasn't the death itself but the fact that the 2 people closest to him are distracted (one of which did die, admittedly). The only way he wouldn't say, "Come, Azys Lla awaits," would be if both the WoL and Haurchefant just shrugged off the psuedo-primal spear attack that was clearly aimed at the WoL, meaning if the death really was what caused Thordan VII to mention Azys Lla, why would a low ranking knight's death be good enough for him to think, "Oh, the WoL was saved, but at least this one knight that is far below my Heavens' Ward ranks died, clearly I have nothing to fear from them now"? However, the ultimate does make it look like we'd still be distracted a bit, making sure Haurchefant was fine after dealing with the psuedo-primal spear, so in most cases Thordan VII's actions shouldn't change.
For now, though, let's assume Thordan VII doesn't mention Azys Lla for whatever reason, we'd still chase him to the Sea of Clouds since, like I've shown, Alphinaud would still have realized that his plans involves making a King Thordan primal, so he's a threat the Scions would immediately take up. There, we come to the aid of a Vanu being attacked by Garlean soldiers, where we find out they're also hunting the pope mobile. After saving the Vanu (which most likely would still be possible as, at worst, the WoL and Alphinaud wouldn't be delayed by more than a few minutes, and as the Garleans are after information, they would try to subdue the Vanu, not kill), they lead us to the village, where we ask after the pope mobile. After a trade where we tell them the difference between the Garleans and the Ishgardians, the chief mentions that their scouts saw them and overheard talks about finding the key to Azys Lla, which we then find out that Bismarck ate the island housing said key. Before this we hear at least one Garlean airship trying to kill the primal, to which it escpes and eats a nearby small island/isle to regain some aether to regenerate from the battle.
After this realization, Alphinaud remakes that, since "the knights of the Heavens' Ward wield primal powers", we should hurry up and slay Bismarck first to obtain the key. After which the story plays out exactly as before. To note, Thordan VII and the Heavens' Ward are waiting the entire time normally, so there is no reason to believe they would try to kill Bismarck themselves as the timing of our arrival would almost be the exact same in the AU where we saved Haurchefant. After we kill Bismarck and retrieve the key to Azys Lla, and where the 4th crystal reignites, Igeyorhm shows up with Thordan VII and binds the WoL in some shadow chains, which allows Thordan VII to pick up the key to Azys Lla, which they themself state it is the key after Thordan VII asks if the WoL has what they seek. After failing to retrieve the key, we go to inform the Vanu tribe of Bismarck's demise, only to come back to Imperial troops taking over the village, seeking knowledge of how to get to Azys Lla. This is where then Emperor Varis zos Galvus arrives and mentions how the WoL is also seeking Azys Lla, where he also points out "the secrets of the Allagans' power to bind eikons to their will could scarcely fail to interest the Scions of the Seventh Dawn...". So, at this point, even had Haurchefant survived, the urgency to pursue and possibly even kill Thordan VII is present since his knights displayed psuedo-primal powers in The Vault, and even lacking Thordan VII himself mentioning Azys Lla, there were 3 other instances of us hearing its mention (which the friendly Vanu somewhat told us a bit about).
At this point the story would, once again, resume as normal: we try and fail to enter Azys Lla, we go back to Ishgard to talk about what to do next, hear about how Raubahn's Flames found evidence of a Scion's aether, so lacking any other leads we act on this one, retrieve Y'shtola, and the events of 3.0 from there onward would proceed exactly the same.
That does make a whole lot sense to be fair. Except now the WoL would fight Thordan VII in a sense of "its my duty to take down primals." Instead of the "YOU KILLED MY FRIEND YOU ASSHOLE."
It could be that him mentioning Azys Lla was part of his plan to lure you into trying to get the key for him. But when the spear gets shrugged off, he panics a bit and thinks to leave immediately. Knowing your power, Thordan might have tried to even up the odds a bit by tempering dragons, which you find out in some manner, your saving thing kicks in and you rush to him and beat him. He leaves his sword behind which Estinien tries to claim, becoming Nidhogg. And since Thordan's actions have decimated his troops, he uses the Neurolink on Hreasvelgr to aid his invasion of Ishgard.
@@ArisaPD I don't think it would play out that way. Remember, even IF he doesn't mention the location Azys Lla at all, since Alphinaud would establish the primal threat aspect immediately, so they wouldn't have the time to find a way to keep Bismarck in place long enough to beat it. It's only after Alphinaud's offhand comment about spearfishing from the Vanu tribe (which I did forget to mention since I didn't think it was important, but it was what sparked Cid to think of using the Ishgardians' dragonkillers as spears to spearfish Bismarck to a floating island) that the solution of how to keep Bismarck nearby is presented. So while the knights may have the power to kill Bismarck, I am doubtful they'd have the means to keep Bismarck stationary to deal the killing blow before it'd escape, eat an island, and regenerate from the damage like it did with the Garleans.
Also, even IF Thordan VII and the Heavens' Ward came up with the same plan Cid did, they'd need to find an Ishgardian engineering team near the Ironworks' level of competency to see it through, and the Ironworks wouldn't help them since Cid, being basically the CEO of the company or whatever the equivalent there is, would deny any help to Thordan VII and the Heavens' Ward.
@@WhiteRKnight1 I think you misunderstood something, my theory is that Thordan never goes to Azys Lla or Bismarck at all, and instead detours to temper some dragons as insurance first. He already has the one eye needed to kickstart being a primal. We wind up hearing about this and run off to the rescue, setting things up for the Thordan 2 phase of the Ultimate.
@@ArisaPD Oh, my bad. While I do think the evidence presented in the story suggests that he could go primal at any time, especially since they probably had Haldrath's corpse on the Soleil when they departed from The Vault, I think we'd just kill him before finding Y'shtola.
Remember, we NEED either 1) the key that's in Bismarck or 2) the aetheric ram we eventually get normally in the story. We have to omit 2) at this point for obvious reasons. Now, according to your theory, instead of heading to the Sea of Clouds, he'd go to the Coerthas Western Highlands and possibly to the Dravanian Forelands to temper dragons. Now, while the WoL would do their best to avoid killing the tempered, at this point they'd view it as a necessary evil since we don't even think about a cure being possible until 5.4.
So in your theory, we'd still chase him the knights would have seen the pope mobile's flight at least until they get near the Dravnanian Forelands (Aymeric asking us to chase him still since, at this point, he's completely committed to peace with dragonkind, and bringing Thordan VII and the Heavens' Ward to justice would be the first step in this).
Now, assuming he'd need to land to temper the dragons (the Soleil doesn't seem big enough to handle Thordan VII and the knights as primals in a fight), the WoL and company should be able to find them, kill the tempered dragons, sadly, then fight an underpowered King Thordan and the Knights of the Round primals as King Thordan wouldn't have absorbed Lahabrea into his sword at this point.
This whole thing was so cool that i watched this video twice just to catch everything lol
This video is really good but there is one notable thing I learned from Preach’s video is that: you can’t put the heavensward theme song in a video. You should consider to edit it out just for safety.
I got CE's on WoW, and started playing FF14. And as a RL I can tell you that FF14 raid size is a massive advantage.
Try to find 20 people that can stand each other, with specific roles, amount of time they can invest, with the same scheduled and with enough skill to beat it. Not even to mention that 20 people will make more mistakes than 8 people. I believe that many Mythic Guilds break in WoW just because of this reason.
Watching this Ultimate was a blast! May try it eventually...
by the release of this video a few groups got the clear already, fflogs is illegal, but they made a full coverage to the race, you can go and check it
As interesting as this all is, and im not sure if i misunderstood somewhere, but you realize there's tons of FF players that enjoy both MSQ and hardcore content? 😅 It's not mutually exclusive. It's why at least the first savage tier is pushed back 2 weeks. There would be no emotional story moments during the fight for them. Someone who skipped the MSQ wouldn't know anything about Haurchefant, they'd have no idea who that is or why he matters lol. So the raiders who do react, who get excited over those lore bits, are people that did invest into the msq at some point.
Yeeeey a Matt vid \o/
My only lament is I will never be good enough to see this content for myself outside of someone else recording it.
This FFXIV this ultimate event gaming with decisions & storylines, is what was wanted in gaming as far back as '2005. Editorial Dungeon Master's comments begging for RPG gaming to have substance, depth in storylines, care about NPCs, I read in Dragon Magazine 2000s, - & here - '2002 - finally past wishes granted in game play of FFXIV The Dragon's Reprise Ultimate. I feel successes won by the gamers now, in the future. Thank you FFXIV game designers, developers!
10:14 YEAAAAH CRYSTAL REPRESENT AT THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE LIST. I find it so fucking funny how Crystal Data center is ALL at the bottom percentile of Ultimate clears. It's a meme that's complete reality that its the RP data center. Each one of the bottom 8 are from Crystal. And of course, Balmung being RP central, is near the top of that bottom 8 most likely JUST because ultimate glamour weapon is so good.
This type of thing is why i think FFXIV is a class above other MMOs. Even something like this which would normally just be for the hardcore raiders still has thought put into it as far as story is concerned. It isn't just a final challenge for them to do until the next patch's final challenge. Also like at the end how he points out "evergreen content." Because of they way the level sync systems are designed, older content remains there for people who never did it and still want to experience it in some way for themselves. It's certainly not a perfect game, but it has become my favorite MMO over the last year.
I still wish they used Heroes Never Die for Thordan 1 instead of Heroes
Thanks for this video. I don't have the time or the patience really to watch prog so I've been looking for info on the alternate time line.
Why does the video quality/resolution feels lower than usual, even at 1080p?
A shame that as time goes on an increasingly tiny percentage of players AMONG THOSE WHO WOULD AND COULD AND WANT TO, will EVER get to do this stuff. Raiding is a thing that is no longer feasible for gaming, and while it can be great fun, it's dying, categorically. in FFXIV as much as anywhere. Finding a chill group that suits you now? Practically impossible in all literal sense. if you're not already in a clique, you never will be allowed to enjoy the content.
The fact it's fun for some people to simply be content to watch redeems NOTHING. if you can't experience it for yourself due to the simple fact not enough mature adults still have the time to raid, it's worthless.
It would be super interesting if the final boss couldn't be killed, and you have to sacrifice Haucherfant in the previous fight to clear the raid.
Thordan's dialogue that asked you to spare him would also interrupt his enrage cast. Very sus.
Great video Matt!
Congrats to Arthars and Team Krile on world 5th and first twitch clear!
your voice sound so much better here than your discussions with Bellular.
A Matt video! Excellent! Thanks for this!
I'm expecting the next ultimate to be Yotsuyu's redemption alternate timeline
Whoever thought of using what if scenarios for ultimates is a genius
This raid is so fucking good man...definitely the hardest content the game has ever had though lol.
When the boss, in addition to doing normal damage, also deals emotional damage...
Where can I find the phase 4 reactions? I've been looking around YT and Twitch's VODs and I can't really find anything (especially for first reactions to saving H in phase 4)
The reason why viewers like to watch Ultimates is because it is an alternative tale of a story that everyone who played FFXIV experienced. The big difference, at least for me, in FFXIV, everyone can experience a story fist-hand - you don’t need to be a good player or mystic raider. Everyone will see the cutscenes with their character in them. You don’t need to look up a clear video from a raider to see the downfall of a “bad guy”. So we all invested in the story already and so now even players that will never attempt an Ultimate have emotional connection to this alternative tale. I guess what I’m trying to say is that I think this only works because we all all experienced Haurchefant death and we all saw Count Edmont de Fortemps collapsing to his knees and urging us to leave him to his grieve and make chaise.
I wonder. Thordan already questioned what the hell we were in the normal timeline because we were so god damned strong... what would his thought be now in the alternate timeline?? He is so much more powerfull yet we still beat him regardless. He must really be confused and really frustrated on that front i assume... he is insanely powerfull yet we beat him down anyway.
If this is the Ultimate fight for Patch 6.1, what do they have planned for when 6.3 arrives? I'm actually interested now.
Technically it isn’t an alternative, this DRS timeline following Graha. The addition of this will be carried into the next ultimate with the warring triad a bit.
Instead of telling ppl what happened and why EW turn out what it is, they can just make the game mechanics telling it
Well no, it just minstrel "what if" scenario just like other Ultimate/savage
so its more like Exaggerated Story of your battle from a fanboy