Audiophile Rants about Powered Speakers! I Hate Them - Starring the ELAC Debut ConneX DCB41
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
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Hi, Kef q100 or Sony Sscs5?.
I *LOVE* my Active ("powered") speakers. I've had 3 "high end" stereo systems of "component separates" that I'd carefully built up, first starting in 1982; each one was more elaborate and more costly as I bought and sold my homes and refined my listening taste and evolving space arrangements, the last one was started in 2001. When my Infinity speakers started to show signs of age as in cracking of the surround of the woofers, I decided it was time to retire them. Having spent MANY thousands of dollars over the years to find the best systems I could accommodate, I again started looking at what was being offered and available. My current listening room is smallish (12 x 15) so I thought I'd look at some of the new Active speakers being offered. I was BLOWN AWAY by the amazing sound of many of the new Active systems. I now have the Kanto TUK and a CV sub. AMAZING and amazingly affordable! Including turntable, dacs, headphones, cables, and related audio paraphernalia, for less than $6k I have what I consider the best sounding system I've ever had! I am astonished at how incredibly good the technology has developed in affordable high end audio!
I have high expectations for my home listening, mostly classical, acoustic jazz and lots of world music, thousands of vinyl records, cd's and digital files. I enjoy lots of live music and my S/O is a professional studio session artist. She is a contributing artist on over 50 CDs and plays all over the world. I enjoy your entertaining reviews, thank you. Life is good!
Hey bud! Sony SSCS5 at Amazon $98.00!
Why don't you review JDS labs Element, El stack, Atom? I really want to know if you recommend them. I know a lot already do, but I would like to hear your opinion. Please and thank you. Btw I'm subscribed. If not what would you recommend.
You should evaluate the Adam Monitors T7V or T8V. They are apparently insane.
What might be a negative for the typical audiophile is a positive for more casual listeners who just want something that sounds nice and is easy to use. I absolutely recommend powered speakers to my friends who just want good sound without worrying about system matching.
Studio monitors are ideal for audiophiles. Powered speakers get a bad rap because people think it always means lifestyle products.
People act like it’s all this extra gear they need and a huge pain to manage.. all you need is an amp. you can get a decent amp like AIYIMA A07 for $65. Plug it in and boom. How is that any more impractical?
System matching is largely overblown. I’d much rather encourage people toward passives that will last years, possibly decades depending on the person, than a system where you have two built-in amps that have to be matched to each other and will be subject to much greater heat + vibration than an amp in its own enclosure. Not only do the amplifiers in powered speakers or monitors fail much more quickly than those in a standalone receiver or amp, but you always end up having to throw everything out once one amplifier fails and you can no longer easily find a complement for the surviving twin. Some people end up swapping out the amps on their old monitors but that kind of surgery is usually beyond the scope of a casual listener
@@cartilagehead I have seen exactly zero active speakers ever broken. I have seen a ton of blown passive speakers, though. I think the likelihood of electronics breaking is significantly lower than just blowing speakers. Maybe your experience is different, but I think having an amplifier that cannot blow a speaker is very valuable, not to mention the lower crossover distortion and ability to contour the frequency response so that it is more even.
@@stevenswall you have seen a ton of blown speakers because probably....there are much more? I've seen many subs with blown amps...
After decades of recording in studios and listening to playbacks and thinking “man, imagine having that kind of sound at home” I finally asked an engineer “what are these speakers!’. He told me they were PSI audio powered monitors. Monitors? huh? I realized at that moment that what I really love are speakers that sound like live sound, the kind I make and hear in the studio. Being faced with a big move to Japan I had to rethink my future audio options. I was moving to a small apartment and didn’t see myself filling the space with audio gear. Instead I remembered my experience with powered monitors. I ended up purchasing Buchardt A500’s for the living room and Hedd 07 Mk II for my desk. The Buchardt give me versatility, DSP and room correction for difficult rooms and my HEDD give me nearfield incisiveness. Both are enormously engaging to listen to and not one musician who walks in my door isn’t astounded by either one or both systems. Although I will concede I don’t always feel like picking up my phone to control my system, I do use my phone a lot for practice and work (zeroing in on songs to learn, sharing material from the bass at a rehearsal, slowing down musical passages and looping things etc etc). Do I think I would love a McIntosh system with some La Scalas? You can bet on it. But that’s going to require a very different listening space. I’m not sure why you think all powered speakers look alike, there are bold and creative designs all over the place: BUCHARDT, KEF, HEDD, PSI, VIVID, Q ACOUSTICS, KI, GENELEC. You seem to be heading into the Steve Gutenberg camp, all-things ELAC (not a fan) and separates rocking classic dad-rock. Totally cool. But I realized that my consumption of audio has changed radically over the years. I tried vinyl with my Arcam and Dynaudio towers. But the truth was, it left me wanting. I stream from multiple platforms, constantly sample new and old music crossing all genres, constantly am called upon to learn new material. Powered speakers sound incredible and fit my lifestyle. I’m more of a Darko/Jay/Crinacle. These guys are leaning forward. I love vintage but I’m more looking forward than back by nature. Perhaps companies are just jumping on the bandwagon and racing to offer a powered speaker that won’t aesthetically rock the boat for traditionalists. I’m not really interested in those manufacturers and prefer those that are truly moving the needle forward.
If powered speakers lead people down the path to separates and passive speakers instead of soundbars, then that's a good thing.
I couldn't find a soundbar I liked at a price I liked. But my family needs simplicity. Costco ran a special on Klipsch The Fives and subwoofer. Family and I are happy.
Powered speakers are, IMHO, a much better option than soundbars. For critical music listening, they are not the best, but for TV or even computer uses, they are cool.
@@stonefree1911 Isn't critical listening what they do in studios, almost exclusively with active/powered speakers?
@@stevenswall Yes, but they're usually bigger and with more power (and far more expensive) than what we're talking about here. Studio monitors are a tool designed to allow the engineer to get the levels and panning of the tracks just right, not to enjoy the music, per se. Now, I'm not saying you can't enjoy music on studio monitors, because I've done it for years, but that's not their primary purpose and you can't always guarantee they'll fill a room with enjoyable sound or be at their best in anything but a near field environment. These little powered speakers are basically an all-in-one system for someone who wants to hook them up to a TV, PC, or streamer.
@@stevenswall Do you think those are the powered speakers that we are discussing in this video?
Powered speakers are great. Kanto YU6 or TUK for example. They are good solution for people who want a good sounding system but do not want to dedicate their lives to trying different audio equipment. They are a great 'no fuss' good quality music system. If you want to be trying a new amp, new dac, new bookshelf speakers, new towers, new cables every few months and constantly be fiddling with components, that's fine. Not everyone wants to do that. If 'audiophile' means playing with equipment all day and always being dissatisfied, then these are not for audiophiles.
This video as especially bad I thought, because he gives no specific reason why powered speakers are bad. They all look alike? That's silly. They look alike no more than all passive speakers look alike. 'I don't like them, but I can't explain why' is what it sounded like. If you make a living reviewing various components, then you prefer a system with 10 different components that you can keep reviewing, I guess.
This. As soon as the major argument was that they look similar… I was out. Most passives look the same as well, st least while you’re in the “budget” range. I generally like Randy’s videos, but this one was a dud. I own a pair of Kanto TUK’s which look amazing in my opinion and sound great.
His complaint of them all being similar is because that removes the fun of trying different speakers. Who cares if it’s an elac or a u turn if they have the same drivers and same timbre? You lose the joy of each brand having a sound. Imagine if kef sold a q150 level powered speaker and it didn’t have the uniq driver? Get it?
@@tylerhackman6832 nope, because they don’t. My powered speakers have an AMT tweeter and a 5.25” aluminum driver. They have a built in class D amp.
My brothers powered speakers are Bi-amped (class d, class a/b) with a Uni-Q Driver Array.
Both have DSP to get the most out of the hardware as possible. Something that I used to get by buying yet another component (a mini dsp 2x4)
But other than most powered speakers being in the bookshelf range size wise, they can vary significantly. So again, I don’t believe the argument is valid.
@@s2photo he didn’t say every single one is the same 😂 cool story though
@@tylerhackman6832 no, but you did. “Who cares if it’s an elac or a u-turn if they have the same drivers and same timbre?” I’m just letting you know that powered speakers are just as diverse as passives these days and getting better every year. Yes you lose out on the ability to mix and match some components, but for some that’s more of a pro than a con.
In pro audio land we like powered speakers (they are now the norm) because we want audio purity and transparency from our speakers. So having the exact amps required for the drivers as part of the speaker design process ensures we get this.
Audiophiles don't like it because they fetishise and want to buy their own amps, preamp etc.
Mackie SRM user myself. Couldn't agree more.
Adam Audio user here, also agreed!
Paradigm Active 20v2, absolutely love them!
I don't really make music anymore but I do still use my little KRK Rokit 5s in the bedroom and I still love them deeply. For such a tiny and cheap speaker they really sound awesome.
The truth, it burns.
Why are you conveniently ignoring all of the high-end powered speakers in the world? (Genelec/Hedd/Barefoot/Kii/ etc.)
Also, why are you acting like there aren't a ton of passive speakers that are carbon copies of eachother coming from factories in Asia?
Grouping all powered speakers together as if they're all cheap is as silly as grouping all passive speakers together as if they're all cheap.
Powered speakers are definitely more cost effective than passives when the cheapest decent integrated amp is at least $400
While I understand how you're arriving at your conclusions, the U-Turn product is made/assembled in the US right alongside their turntables --so they are not coming out the same factory as the Elac (or other powered speakers), and is why they are more expensive compared to say the Elac, which is straight out of China (not judging). While the driver compliment and design/style may be similar, one only has to pick up or interact with the U-Turn to realize it is in a whole other class with respect to build and finish (not to mention uses a Class A/B amp, which is rare). Also, while I agree with you about Elac's accessories and whatnot, U-Turn's speaker cables and accessories are anything but cheap, another way they (U-Turn) differentiate themselves from the masses in this market.
Welcome Andrew! Love it when discourse like this organically occurs.
I don't see what the problem is. Do the sound good for the price? Is this a better value than buying speakers, a DAC and a amp? Those are the questions that matter.
Also how are these powered speakers any less or more differentiated than all the tons passive speakers of a similar size on the market?
When getting my daughter into HiFi she didn't want anything complicated. There is no way she wants to deal with complex hardware - it just needs to work, be enjoyable to listen to, and be managed by her phone. She can just bluetooth Spotify from her phone to the speakers and doesn't need anything else. Active speakers make things super easy for someone like her.
Since then I have added a Fluance turntable (with internal phono amp) straight into active speakers with a Wiim streamer and subwoofer also connected to the speakers. Still simple and sounds better than average.
This is exactly the kind of setup I'm looking at putting together, I appreciate simplicity.
Something apparently missing from the comment section (and the video) is that powered isn't the same as active. Unlike the powered sets in the video, actual active speakers have active crossover, i.e. each driver has dedicated amp circuitry after the crossover. This allows for much finer matching of the amp and each individual driver, and subsequently better transparency. This may or may not be what you like in you hifi, but there's a reason active speakers are everywhere in pro audio.
I wasn't a fan either. At a recent audio show I was forced to change my mind. I listened to some Lyravox Karlos (which are expensive but not crazy expensive) in a small untreated room and the sincerity of the midrange brought me to tears, literally. with good records it sounded a lot like reality and with bad ones it managed to get some magic out of it. Mind you, I've been an audiofhile for 30+ years. I've heard glassier highs, punchier bass drums, crisper snares, deeper soundstages possibly, but I never experienced such a deep connection with the music and the artist. The idea that you can hook a streamer and enjoy music, stop worrying about the interconnect or the spikes under your amp has been life changing. A powered speaker can sound unbelievably good
13K USD a pair.... do you realize what can be bought for that money....
@@jungtarcph well unfortunately I do. I did not buy those speakers myself because I may be able to afford them with financing but can't personally justify spending so much. Actually I may find them second hand around 7k and I'm still thinking about them daily after two months. Anyway at this hi fi show there were cables that costed more than that and in general high end is getting more and more expensive.
13K not crazy expensive in Cheapaudioman's channel? Does anybody have a map to show this fella and his brags a way out? :)
@@ChuckNorris-bf5cj you got a point.. to me 12k is very expensive, 250k is call the cops crazy batsh1t expensive ;)
Kinda like my 80 year old mother when I take her shopping. She can never find my car cause she thinks all grey cars are the same 😂
It's all about the music for me and powered speakers makes that easier. I'm enjoying my Kanto TUK and Bluesound Node combo.
I use powered speakers (Edifier R2000db's) as my computer speakers. They are superb for that - everything I need is already built in. I play music while working or listening to ads for the latest Sith Audio product and they are awesome. They also look great. I don't think they would fill a room, but as near field monitors they are just excellent.
Exactly, I got the Presonus 4.5. Getting an amp and large speakers for your computer setup seems weird and too large.
Edifiers are spectacular powered speakers I got the 980s and they sound phenomenal rite out of the box and I listen to alot of variety of music
I have the Edifier R2000db's as well for my computer speakers and they are great, been using them like 5 years now and no reason to upgrade. Theyre good enough to fill a bedroom or small room. For my living room I use Elac UB5's they are more detailed, way better imaging, more bass but they also need an amp and are more expensive. the edifiers i got for 200.
You made a video about how you hate powered speakers. In this video you list three great options, and highlight perfectly the people for whom these speakers are an absolutely ideal solution. Then you go on to list a few minor niggles or observations about how they were made with someone other than you in mind. You don't hate powered speakers at all (!), you've just come to them at a point when you've already got equipment that's well past them.
Those little things are great!
I am so sick of this guys schtick. He is the worst kind of audiophile there is and people don't seem to realize because he uses the "cheap" bs to act like he's not. Like:
His main act is to just rant and bash on things because that gets him the most attention. That's why this video exists because Wiim wants ads out today and he needed an idea for a video fast so he does what he does best and find something to hold his nose at.
He gives glowing reviews to products that literally sponsor him, sometimes even sponsoring his their own review.
His number one consideration of an audio product is how much it costs. He literally makes lists judging products based on price.
He goes to audio shows just to bash on everything there talk about how much better his equipment is.
Despite claiming that audiophiles only care about how much something costs to show off their worth all his content is filled to the brim by sponsors and requests for money, seriously just click that "show more" button in the description.
He claims to be able to hear the difference in things like "power cords" and at the same time exposes just how little he actually understands in that somehow unironic video by using 2 separate amps.
And it goes on.
I love my Edifier R2000DB, they sound great, have a ton of features, and only cost me $289 when I bought them. That being said, I only use them for my desktop, and they are amazing at doing that
i use the edifier s350db for my desk top and love them
@@uglykidmoe150 I think Edifier is very underappreciated
I just got the Edifier 980s and for 100 dollar speakers I was actually blown away by how good they sound for something so small
I got my first component system when I was a teenager, and while I loved it, it was a pain dragging it everywhere as I moved like 15 times in 10 years from age 18-28. A lot of times I didnt even have the room to set the whole thing up (just used headphones). So on form factor alone I can get the appeal of something like this for young people.
I have no problem with powered speakers as a 2nd or third system where it is impractical to place traditional audio equipment. Like the bedroom or a desktop. I have had a set of Vanatoo T-zeros for a while and with the addition of the WiiM (thank you Randy) that system gets more use than ever.
100% agree. As a soundbar replacement or as computer speakers I totally get it. But for my main hi-fi where I have 6 different sources connected it seems like it would be rather archaic to manage all that without a dedicated receiver or some kind of audio switcher. Not to mention adjusting the volume on most powered speakers either requires reaching around behind them or using the little fiddly remotes that they often come with.
I have a pair of T-zeros at my desktop. They are fantastic! I feel like they are different than most powered speakers tho, with each speaker having its own amp, and a sub out that takes the lows away. Im not a fan of powered speaker systems that just have one powered and one passive.
Is a small desktop amp really that impractical?
@@NickyNicest not at all. Before my t-zeros, i had a SMSL Sa300 amp powering a pair of mission ms-5s at my desktop. While i love my t-zeros and i do think they sound better, i dont think it’s considerably better.
@@nshandy I have the T-Zero's thanks Z-reviews. But I am pretty certain they don't have seperate amps in each speaker.
Studio monitors have been doing this for years. Check out Adam A4V, Hedd 07, Neumann KH80. I run Adams in one room, excellent. Balanced input, DSP, it's the future, it's already here.
Exactly. I bought a focusrite 2i2, and some JBL 306's for my laptop, and im never going back!
Powered or Active? There's a difference.
@@funkyfurballs1078 there are few non powered these days, guess you know about the ones mentioned. NS10's not good for hifi😉
Hedd 07 🤘...I don't miss my old passive setup at all
Powered/active speakers come in lots of shapes, sizes and prices. With small speakers add a subwoofer and you will have big, clear, dynamic sound.
I love power speakers but I have been rocking Focal studio monitors for a decade now I love the small form factor of them. Studio monitors are something you should maybe take a look at.
I feel like many people overlook pro audio gear, I used Adam's powered speakers for listening and producing. My brother uses cheap Yamaha hs8's purely for listening and I think they're great, they fill a large room with good sound. Just because it's marketed to a different crowd doesn't mean it can't be used for casual listening.
@@canepaper967 i do get it you tube can sound horrible SM just seem to do a better job in reveling flaws good or bad
Audiophiles hate pro gear
Not because it sounds somehow different but because it's good value more often than not
I used to believe active/powered speakers were inferior tp passive/externally amplified speakers. THEN I found Vanatoo powered speakers. I have both the desktop Transparent Zeros and the bookshelf Transparent One Encores. For my rather small office both of these, I'm lovin'! Really liked your review of the Transparent One Encores.
Kali LP-6 and JBL 305 powered speakers totally convinced me that powered speakers provide the absolute best value. Ain't no problem here. Don't get it.
Yeah I mix and master with Kali LP-8s. They are fantastic sounding, crystal clear.
@@lescobrandon8045 Sure. . I don't get the "I prefer to spend money on an external amplifier which compromises frequency response but gives me audiophile cred" line of thinking at all.
I'd be curious for recommendations on passive speaker/amp combos that beat/compete with the Kali LP6v2 or similar on raw performance for similar prices? I'm not saying it can't be done, but I'm wondering what combos people have actually heard that might compete. I considered trying to figure that out when my prior monitors died, but it likely would have involved a lot of trial and error and futzing around with system synergy. Powered monitors often come with built-in settings for bass alignment, different room placement, built-in DSP to flatten response of the drivers, etc. All of that is more money up the chain if you go passive. But if you're into figuring that out for yourself, by all means live it up! Other people like me are lazy and want something more plug and play. ;)
@@Philberts No consumer electronics speaker sounds as good as a studio monitors. I promise you that. I have had owned some 80s Pioneer amps that were nice, but consumer electronics are a big ol rip off.
@@JeffMudrick The only application monitors don't sound good in are huge open spaces. Most all of them are near field anyhow.
The big thing with some high end powered speakers is that there's some kind of active crossover magic going on.
I still LOVE my pair of The Fives from Klipsch
I’m not crazy about powered speaks either, but i will defend their position. There are a LOT of high quality (maybe not CHEAP) , beautiful, unique, audiophile grade powered speakers out there. I would guess (just my guess, opinion), not unlike tube amps, you don’t really know a lot about them until you dive in a little and maybe find one you think is really cool, good sounding, etc, as apposed to hearing a few “cheapies” and then generalizing all powered speakers are the same. I also think they are more popular in places around the world where less living space is common. I love your channel Randy, love you really, would never want to make waves, just felt like this one was slightly…narrow minded (oh i hate saying that, so negative, just can’t think of other words, too early) thank you
Hes just trying to cause controversy... he literally used "hate" on the thumb lol.
I have a pair of Tannoy Reveal 802 that I bought for 169 euros each. A few months ago they were at Steelwater for $109 each (now back to their original $199 each).
I believe that they are the best VFM speakers ever made. For 340euros I have a pair of 8" studio monitors and an amplifier together. And they sound amazing even at really high volume. I really can't see how passive speakers + amp can beat that, especially for a speaker with an 8" woofer that can play at reference levels at 2.5m (8ft) with ease.
I love them and I don't think I will ever go back to passive speakers.
Passive speakers are not better than studio monitors with price being the same.
Neumann KH420 which is under 10k a pair is objectively superior in every metric to something like Magico S5 that is what, 30k? 50k?
The majority of studio monitors are powered...what do they know that audiophiles don't?
Go figure.. Almost all if not 90% of the monitors used to mix and master music .. are powered.
The irony.
You cannot build a non powered speaker to sound as good as powered speakers when designed correctly. Its physics
I am more than a casual listener, but I have severely-limited square footage in the form of a tiny apartment. I literally do not have room for separate amplification. This is why my powered speakers (Kanto TUK + SVS SB-2000) work well for me. I can have higher-end audio in a small, cramped space. You may be assuming that everyone lives in an expansive 5000 sq. ft. dwelling.
What the market needs is a small class AB 2 channel integrated amp. Desktop sized. Properly priced.
Wonder if Schiit is considering something like that..
And classy digital UV meter display.
I have to say thanks. Your relentless marketing of wiim has resulted in one of my favorite purchases of all time. I love that little box. I didn't even know it existed or that I needed it in my life
Love my audiophile separates system but also dig my minimalist set-up; with powered speakers & a Schiit stack for a gaming & mini home theater in a small room. Future-Fi solutions are as appreciated as much as spinning vinyl and glad we have so many listening options these days.
Used Pair of T7V, a $350 DAC, and a JBL LSR310s. This will leave you completely speechless. It's insane the amount of clean, precise, and a wide range of sound you get for $1k. Way better than any hodge-podge of cheap audio components.
I really like powered speakers. They are very nice for secondary systems where setting up a multi-box center is not desired: preamp, DAC, streamer. Or if you like, none of those and go for the KEF LSX or LS50W2. It can allow for a great sounding system in rooms where conventional systems don't work (my dining room, for example, or an office.) Better yet, the companies that make them really seem to take the time to engineer the speakers to work as systems and sound good. And they don't have to be expensive. Look at the Q Acoustics M20. $500. And it sounds great.
Iunno, not that i personally would get them for my main listining room but the powered kefs are pretty spectacular for a turn key solution.
Powered speakers are like passive speakers. Some are awesome, some are okay and some are cheap sounding. You often get what you pay for. There are more cheap sounding passive speakers than active speakers.
Powered speakers are bad for profits. DSP crossovers, DSP response correction, and built in equalization eliminate the nonsense of amp/pre-amp synergy, crossover mods, dumb speaker wire voodoo, various other separate components, etc.
I have 1280 t edifier speakers. You can buy edifier 1780 bts speakers for 175 canadian dollars. They point slightly upward and are powered, so you so you don't need speaker stands or an amp. They are more powerful than the 1280 t's. They are bluetooth. And they have a remote. For a desktop/computer setup in an apartment they would be ideal. I use my 1280 t speakers on my desktop computer setup and you really don't need a subwoofer. I would say the 1780 bts speakers would be a great deal.
I actually like soundbars and powered speakers. Combine it with a little DAC, CD player, and subwoofer and you have a very compact system for under the TV.
Love my TANNOY GOLD5 Active monitors. Use with an SMSL M500 Pre DAC balanced as my desktop setup 🙂
I have 3 pairs of powered: focal solo6 be, Yamaha hs8, and event 20/20 bas v3. They are all pretty sweet options and wouldn’t sell them for passive bookies.
Hs8's are incredible for the money
Hs8s and t8vs are both fantastic at their prices.
They say the Audioengine HD6 is a fantastic powered speaker, due to cabinet design, old school looks, woofer and tweeter, AND a monoblock amp used inside of the powered speaker!
If you don't want to fuss with a number of components, then get powered speakers. If you want to be an audiophile (whatever the heck that is), then don't use them. Frankly, if you have the hearing of German Shepherd then go for components. Do you.
Just got the SVS prime wireless pro speakers. I am amazed and enjoying them so much. People talk about exciting speakers - these have a transparent balanced sound, but when they kick man they kick. Now back to a quiet evening of Royal Trux and a fine brandy, or whatever was in that glass.
Here's a few things that irk me:
-Proprietary cables between the powered and the passive side. Abramtek is guilty of this, along with a lot others like Swan and Edifier.
-Lack of sensible inputs or outputs. Optical should be standard, also subwoofer outs with some bass management.
-Lack of replacement parts. If the amplified unit goes belly up you're usually left with a pair of paperweights. This has happened to me twice after the warranty period was expired. Every set of passive speakers I've purchased is still going strong.
So for the prices they are asking, powered speakers are an expensive gamble. That's my rant.
You just described the Vanatoo T0
I just got delivery of the Triangle bro2 BT active speakers, they look larger than those on show and so far a nice neutral sound.
Keep up the great content my man 👍
This video came off kind of audio elitist. That's the vibe I'm getting from it.
Exactly.
Most subwoofers today are actually powered by their own amplifier 😊
My reluctance would be that, except for the very expensive powered speakers, they probably contain pretty trash amplifiers.
Also, I would refer to them as powered or non-powered speakers, not active/passive, because active systems use electronic crossovers, which I doubt many of these do.
It would seem that the audiophile market that would be interested in powered speakers are the ones who don't want to deal with picking out or can't afford a separate amp/DAC
I'm older than this guy, and this attitude takes me back to reading hifi mags in the early 80's like to see your review of the Edifier s3000pro
I’ve been into Hifi for 26+ years and lately they redefined the components to active speakers. I’ve heard several high end active bookshelf’s that KILL a lot of my buddies upper 5 figure component system (Cabasse and devialet especially).
I just bought my pair of Klipsch R 51PM.
I may have had the budget to get cheap passive speakers and a semi vintage integrated, but I preferred to cut corners. I don't have much space so these speakers will do the trick until I get a better system, but I prefer to spend that extra money on more records.
Powered monitors are the best option for impoverished sound enthusiasts.
Of course, the quality might not be the optimal, but for the price, I think they're building more interesting speakers.
I see them as the future for people who want to have several options where to listen to music and movies without the hassle of a home theatre/ audiophile set up
I have a pair of Peachtree M24 speakers that are kind of like this. Phono stage, USB dac, RCA in, sub out etc. They’re so good though! You can totally pimp them out with an external dac and external phono stage and make them sound really good. They come in a gorgeous bamboo finish too-I got a Geshelli J2 dac with a similar wood finish and it’s a really cool looking system in a small room.
This video aged like fine milk. I get where you’re coming from but us old guys need to get with the times. I was running a $200 pair of passive bookshelves powered by one of the nicer class D budget amps and a solid DAC/headphone combo. That’s a $400-500 desktop system and while modest by ‘audiophile’ standards it’s still a killer system by any other metric.
Then I caught the Swan OS-10s on prime day and picked them up for my wife. They’re plastic and a bit busy looking with their fabric sides and copper woofer. I scoffed at the light up touch controls, remote and built in Bluetooth. These were clearly ‘computer’ speakers and while I had heard good things about them my expectations were firmly in check when I went to test them out on my desktop. And then I heard them. Seriously what the fuck? Detailed and smooth treble. Shockingly good bass response from a speaker so small. Imaging is other worldly. Desktops are crappy places for speakers and yet the soundstage these present is downright holographic without ever sounding forward or fatiguing. I mean- I get it- it’s an active speaker (no crossover the drivers are powered independently) with probably Skynet levels of DSP manipulative fuckery going on. But I don’t care. They were $130 on sale and they sound better than every speaker in my house ON A DESK. I’m having so much fun just listening to music at my computer and… oh yeah my wife isn’t getting these. Maybe I’ll buy another pair for her with the money I get for selling my rig.
The only powered speakers I own are the Proton 301s. They are bi-amped, well built, and sound great. They also have tone controls.🖖🏼
i have only one question: did you composing, mixing, and produce music or just a audience????
I’ve had powered fluance speakers hooked up in my bedroom tv for years and have loved it. Very clean, minimal, great sounding system. The only improvement would be an HDMI in.
For people who refuse to deal with the number of external components and cables and aren't extreme audiophiles, which sounds like it would fit a wide population, powered speakers are the only option.
They look alike? VW beetle and Honda civic are the same car I guess. Four wheels, a steering wheel, coincidence? Yes, that’s what cars are
Bought Klipsch The Fives on BF for hooking up to the TV. HDMI e-Arc, DSP with bi-amping, phono in and tone control but sadly only via their app... Takes no room, and since I havent heard a good sounding soundbar in my life and dont need the bass with an old appartement with neighbours, I bloody love these things. In the future, they can be downgraded and work flawelessly in the garage or in the office.
Dont think it can be beaten for $550 bucks and real wooden faner. Love'em!
I came from logitech shitboxes then upgraded to audioengine a2 back in 2008. That put me into this hobby to this day. This hobby helped me propel my career wherever it is because i had to be able to afford expensive stuff. So in some ways i owe everything i own to a powered speaker 🤣
I started from "powered" 3" desktop PC speakers. They even had a baffle step style boost built in to make it sound fuller.
Of course when I got another pair years later, they didn't sound anywhere near as good as I used to think they were
This entire industry is in a race to copy.... Great testimony Randy. Cheers and have a great weekend.
Thanks, brother! You are too generous
so far, my favorite powered speakers have been Swan. I would definitely recommend checking out their speakers.
Powered “active” speakers have been around since the mid ‘60s in studio & later some limited PA applications, but probably became most familiar to the residential hi-if customer with mainstream products like the Advent PAL and several innovations by Boothroyd Stuart Meridian in the early ‘80s - including some of the first DSP products.
While the advantages of modern DSP and efficient class D amps in terms of compact footprint / internal real estate packaging requirements can’t be ignored by aesthetic & production designers, as anyone who’s experienced failure of custom OEM plate amps in mainstream makers’ sub-woofers can attest, the main issue with them is when (not if) any portion of the internal signal processing or amplification stages fail, repairs can be “problematic”, to say the least. A local hi-if shop has one corner of their service basement reserved for dead subs where the plate amp has died and neither repair parts or even full replacement amps are available, and can only be resurrected by trying to find a third party amp of comparable performance that can be shoehorned into the enclosure, or resorting to a kludged DIY outboard solution, which of course defeats the product’s whole design purpose.
Add to that the comprehensive feature sets incorporated into the likes of models described herein - or the ever increasingly popular soundbar/sub combos that can deliver amazing performance in compact packages - and the potential for a fancy bricked paperweight increases.
Yeah those "wireless" subs that don't have a wired redundant connection are then separated from the soundbar and are next to useless. Imo they should all have an RCA input just in case
Had a Powered 2.1 system for years I didn't know any better. Then I purchased separates and now I know better.
I think that powered speakers without passive crossovers, but with advanced DSP are future. Each speaker could have their own built in amp with DSP. I think that only wire needed to connect will be AC plug. Sound have to be sended wireless without compression and delays like old BT connections.
First of all I love your channel.
1. the smaller a speaker is the more similar they have to get because there is not enough space to play around with design and when you want them cheap there´s not enough margin to play around with
2. If we want an active speaker in similar price ranges like passiv speaker although there are additional ports, dials, minimum 2 amps, a dac, bluetooth, wifi, adc, dsp and phono preamp - of course not not all of these are in the same box - then there has to be a drop somewhere else and this is design. They have to share parts from brand to brand.
3. And of course has the powered speaker the potential to be the better speaker over passiv, because nowadays a manufacturer can be better in tuning his product if he has every component under control - if the manufacturer understands to use this potential depends on the product.
But all this is not the problem audiophiles have with all in one products - dosen´t matter if it is an active speaker or "a record player with build in Bluetooth, amp, streamer, wifi" ... ready to connect to passiv speaker 🙂 - with these hardware you took away a part of audiophiles hobby/playground. This is to try things out, to mix components, cabels .. other stuff and also thats the reason for buying new hardware to make the own system better. The all in one stuff is to boring for them.
The only thing many or some - not all - audiophiles don´t want to play around is the one component which affects the sound the most and should be optimized before buying new cables or boxes, is the listening room. I think the reason is that a well treated listening room mostly doesen´t look better than an untreated one - a new component does. 🙂
And all this is ok, everybody should have his own focus on his hobby.
In my living room there is a 6.0 passive Canton speaker system connected on an Denon AVR with Canton Ergo 695 as mains, in a 2. room there are 2 Yamaha DBX10 and a JBL SRX 818p - both active and at my Computer there are 2 Neumann KH80 calibrated with the Neumann Mic and software. And when I want to listen carefully to music I go to the Neumanns because perfect angle, perfect distance, less room influence, but I LOVE my Cantons in cherry wood an the sound they have. So it depends what I want to listen to for from time to time. 🙂
Hi Randy, some companies like Meridian and B&O have been making great active speakers since the 80s, that's something you could look into if you want something different and good.
I know the new prices are often insanely high for these, but at least on the second hand market B&O Beolab speakers can be quite affordable.
I have the SVS Prime Wireless Pro paired with a SB1000 on my PC and Xbox rig. Great for my uses, and I dig being able to rock them when guests are over or relax for some critical listening. But I also have a 7.1.4 setup in the other room, so... Best of both worlds.
the market for these small, powered speaker is huge ... many many times bigger than audiophile market ... reason is everyone have a pc or mac
ATC produce some really fine active speakers...
how about the Vanatoo?!? they pretty darn good for me on my desks at home and at work.
If you have all powered speakers with each speaker having its own DSP. Then you can really creat a perfect listening area. Especially if those DSPs have access to a microphone and they can do real time adjustment…. But that goes against “cheap audio” lol
Is this problem known? TV connected to Elac via HDMIarc and once a day or once in a few days no sound, while Elac are on.
When I turn on the TV, the speakers also turn on but no sound comes out. LED lights are on, but there is no sound at all. Only restart helps. I showed it below in the videos. I use PCM output and used Auto - problem remains.
Dynaudio XEO 10 sounds fabulous! But the price is eye watering like the KEF LSX.
You were gushing all over the new SVS powered speakers, and now? Is the honeymoon over?
They're "take it or leave it" products.
High end active speakers are the future.
Great channel & video. As a true audiophile I would never consider any power bookshelf speaker except for two-- The Dynaudio Xeo20...and well...the Elac Navis ARB-51. Funny you should mention Elac in this video, because I just picked up the Navis @ a Crutchfield S&D offer and that's certainly no typical powered speaker. As I'm sure you know it has minimal inputs and maximum amplification (160w/100w/60w@ AB no less) for its three-way coaxial design with 2 equal speakers requiring direct power & RCA/XLR cabling. No messy digital garbage to get in the way like Bluetooth or even digital inputs... or even an onboard volume control...just a pure signal path.
The best part is that the entire speaker is in the analog domain. I prefer to run from my Marantz preamp or directly from my Cayin balanced tube dap. Both methods sound great...but I've yet to try directly from my balanced output of my Oppo 205, which should sound incredible.
I myself do not like powered speakers. The only powered speakers you need to own is a subwoofer. I am designing a passive speaker setup. I have acquired some crossovers and drivers from the one and only Mr Andrew Jones, I appreciate Andrew. I been working on this for over a year now. So far, so good.
I love K&F filters, especially the 1/4 and 1/2 strengths ✌
I'm actually going to snag the 'Shortstache' CPL + 1/4 Mist 2 in 1 filter from Polar Pro. Could be a game changer for what I do.
your cup of coffee is the star of your videos - 'cup of coffee'
I am quite happy with my JBL Linear 3 series 2-way powered speakers with 8" woofers and with the accompanying 10" subwoofer. They are rear-ported, and are a long way from the nearest wall. The mid-high horns image quite well. For the money have (or don't have)' they do quite well with my iMac and my Topping 30 Pro DAC. I do run a headphone amp off the DAC, but it certainly won't put out the volume through the speakers. I use the JBLs as near-field monitors, and have no complaints. I run HD 600s out of my headphone amp, and DT880 Pros put of my GT-100 box when I practice. The Topping DAC is better than the DAC in the practice board, but the board is not what I use for critical listening. I use very good wires to connect them. When I listen to stereo in my room, my old Sony 200-watt receiver with 2 old 12" 3-way Pioneers do fine. I'm in a condo, and I'd blow the neighbors away if I turned them way up. The room is not large, and they sound very good when towed-in. My "soundbar" is my Samsung 40" TV as a center channel when I listen to my CDs, DVDs, and Blu-Rays. Until and unless I get a lot more money, these do fine. I can only open up my bass and guitar amps when I gig.
I think these smaller powered speakers are targeted towards desktop/computer applications. Their compact, lots of convenience, and one thing is for sure, they WILL stomp all over those dinky PC/monitor speakers most people use in a desktop situation. That being said, I think you lose out on that market once your above that $200 price point. Just my opinion.
C’mon. They look alike? That’s your beef? Choose any two black, 2-way passives and they look alike. 1 woofer, 1 tweeter (tweeter on top). Geez, why not compare the sound to similar price passives + amp at least.
Hey Randy! I generally agree with you in that I find most powered speakers very unimpressive! However I have to add a caveat that certain (very expensive ones) Genelec in particular are the exception! Have you ever heard them? If not you should give them a listen. If you have then what did you think of them?
I'm poor. For $100 my little Edifiers absolutely blow any soundbar sub $200 out of this Galaxy.
A friend asked me for suggestions for his new in-home office. I suggested an Aiyima T9, Sony SSCS5 and a WiiM Mini, for under $400, all in. He went to a stereo store and bought KEF LSX II powered speakers for $1,400 plus tax. At least they have streaming capacity and look different. The appeal is there’s nothing to think about. You can’t make mistakes if you don’t make choices.
You,and your fellow music lovers need to understand that active speakers(the better ones)have a active crossover for the two or three drivers to work within their frequency bandwidth.
This creates less distortion,less phase issues,and a more direct coupling from the amplifier to the drivers.
The cable runs are a great deal shorter,so all in all the sound of a well designed active crossover powered speaker better then most.
The design on a budget that stands out is acoustic energy ae1
The problem with powered speakers is that they're usually way better (better on axis FR, much better directivity, better output handling) than similarly priced passive speakers and you don't need to pay out your ass to get legit endgame performance.
Let's do a quick comparison. Neumann KH420 is by all metrics (except MAYBE looks but high end trash makes me cringe) superior to the Magico S5. But the Magico is nearly 5 times the price and doesn't have built in amplification.
i have a pair of active speakers they are the best sounding speakers i've heard B&O Balance, they are great
Today would you buy powered speakers like the Elac or unpowered with a WiiM Amp?
Powered speakers allow for tuning with Digital Signal Processing which make them sound awesome despite the design limitations. My Edifiers sound incredible.
I had Emotiva Airmotive 4Ss for years, balanced or RCA and they are plugged in individually, no tethered cord! GREAT sounding speakers. Do I do like my passive Klipsch RP600MIIs a lot better. I would like to try a set of Genelecs which are expensive as all get out! Oh! The Genelecs look NOTHING like anyone's powered speakers Their total cost is well over $1000 maybe over 2k at this point. I have been told Adams are some of the best deals in audio. Emotiva stopped making theirs. Those looking NOTHING like anything you mentioned...
I still have my Emotiva Airmotiv 6s on my desk and use XLRs from my RME adi-2 dac. 420 watts of class AB amplification and they sound fantastic with their AMT tweeter ! There is cheap powered speakers and then you find out about high quality powered monitors like Genelec, Adam, etc. which is a whole different matter. Rock on !
@@mikelanier5617 All I had money for at the time was the 4s, I still have them. I really wanted balanced Genelecs but soooo pricey... I bought a class A amplifier and speakers for LESS than most Genelecs!!
Agreed they are pricey for their size especially. Thinking about buying a pair of the Adams monitors now that I know I like the AMT tweeter sound as I was always a dome tweeter guy before on my main speakers, whether it was DIY builds or companies like Paradigm, AAD, PSB, Polk and others I've owned. Love the extension and detail 👌 Just ordered 2 Emotiva B2+ for mains, C2 center, 4 B1+ for Atmos heights and 2 for surrounds in my 5th wheel RV with a XPA5 and BassX A4 for amps. Camping is going to be great..lol !
Ever heard the Fluance A61 (I think) or the Edifiers in the $300+ range? Always hear of Elac, venture out a bit.
I paid $100 for a pair of edifier 1280db, they do all I need for my work from home setup. They sound good enough for tidal hifi flac playback in exclusive mode and teams calls, and the bluetooth is good enough for friends visiting my appartment and connecting their spotify accounts. Also 4.5" is the perfect size for a computer desktop setup.
I don't want/need the mess of additional DAC/AMP stacks (that's like $300 for schiit magni/modi + passive speakers), and I wouldn't pay 499-699 for a pair of active bookshelfs to do exactly the same with barely perceibable improvements.