How to quickly heat up freezing cold Tesla battery
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- I left the car in -13°C to -17°C (7-1°F) overnight. And in the morning I tried to supercharge. It was super slow. It turns out that driving the car heated up the battery faster.
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A lot of people mention the max battery power option. Keep in mind that this setting will only allow higher max temperature (about 40°C vs 17°C on normal setting). It will still rely on the same 6 kW battery heater. Please read this before commenting.
Cool stuff Bjørn!! I was wondering though, is this procedure going to harm the battery and/or the motors? I suppose it's not a good idea to do it very often.. Still the car is under warranty, but you may want to keep it for many years.
Tesla programmed the car to be pretty foolproof. If the battery is too cold, there will be power output limits too. Look at this video:
ruclips.net/video/nNqShkjg6nU/видео.htmlm1s
There, the car has been sitting still for a week in freezing temperatures. The power limit was at around 40 kW. I guess in my test with the Model X, the battery must have been around zero degrees celcius. That means it will take more than 8-9 hours to chill down 600 kg of batteries. Probably some 24 hours is needed.
Hi Bjorn, not sure if this is available for P90DL, but FYI, if you turn on Ludicrous+, you'll see the temperature of the battery pack which will help you gauge how much yoyo-ing you need to do while warming up the car.
Makes sense, thanks for the immediate reply! Keep up these cool videos as well as the road-trip ones!! Your content is the best :D
Only available for P100DL.
“Officer, I’m not drunk, I’m heating up my battery”
Underrated comment.
*Message from the future - Crazy 2020*
Absolutely loved the "drive it like you stole it" part :D
It was so stiff you needed 2 hands. Good job.
That's what she said. Lolz
@@ALeAnn365 lolz
Classic 👍🏼
Merry Christmas!
Listen from 3:42 with your eyes closed. Huehuehue
had a good laugh (:
I was thinking exactly the same thing!
I can literally not stop laughing right now. HAHAHA
* c o m a t e s *
Good one 😂😂😂
Well done video. I love how you can see your face, speed and view while you drive.
Great Video.....I was just on a trip and saw my battery pack get down to 6 degrees. I went from a stay in a hotel directly to a supercharger. When I plugged in I got zeros all across the charging info, We sat there for 20 mins and still zeros all across. It took us 45 mins to get up to 30Kw. I didn’t even think about taking it out and driving it like you did to build up heat in the battery pack. This will be a big time saver this winter. Thanks.
I just saw this older video and it helped me today. Jan 17th 2024 😊
My model x was not charging for 20 mins I waited. After I saw this video I went for a yoyo drive and came back it went to 90km/hrs ❤
KmanAuto made a video about battery heating.
He showed, while monitoring the coolant-temprature, that the battery do not start charging before the battery temperature is above freezing.
The target temperature battery heating is 8°C.
BTW, it's not just the resistance from the battery that heats the battery while driving, if you look at the schematics in the "diagnostic mode", you can see that the heat from the inverter and motor can be dumped into the battery.
This is why it's always better to drive instead of standing still, even with a fossil. Hot engine + cold gearbox = big trouble.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_shock
Bjørn with the sacrifices for Tesla science, knowing what would happen when plugging in in the morning.
That Sunrise at 11:56 is awesome!
Interesting info, it's surprising Tesla lets the battery go below zero. Lithium batteries don't really like that.
Not really true. Batteries will last longer if you keep them at low temp. What gets lower is the efficiency charging/discharging them. So, the best situation is keeping the car cold while parked, and around 25 deg. celsius while driving.
Yes and no. Yes, batteries last longer and degrade less when keeping them at optimal temp. But there is a threshold they shouldn't go below for charging. For example: if you charge a lithium battery when it's frozen it could easily be permanently damaged. That is what I'm talking about. Hence why I'm surprised Tesla lets their pack go below zero.
Some more background info: the thing is, the lower the temp of the battery, the lower the operating voltage becomes, this is the same reason why a cold battery puts out less power/energy. So, if you freeze a cell the voltage drops accordingly. If you would charge a cell to its maximum capacity and then freeze it it will be dead since the energy stored will exceed the capacity of the cell. That also leads me to believe that this is handled at the pack level and thus the BMS.
Freezing them and not charging them seems to be no problem though.
That's what i said and, you're not correct. In fact, that's what the video clearly shows. Hardly getting 1kw of charge after waiting minutes means the batteries are NOT allowed to charge when frozen. Once they start heating up, it slowly raises up. That's what the battery heater is meant of, and clearly it's not enough to heat up the whole battery pack quickly. solution: drive the car and heat the battery... Am i missing anything here?
Well, my initial comment was with the assumption the cells shouldn't be frozen at all. That was incorrect.
Freezing them isn't a problem as I mentioned in my second comment. Charging them when frozen is (which I already knew).
It's still surprising they don't maintain the battery close to zero degrees though, to facilitate charging at all times. Then again the 6 kW battery heater only needs 16 hours to drain the battery completely.
The length of time to complete battery drain is why they don't do it. At least when they're not plugged in.
Like Bjorn said, this should be the last resort option. But do do it if you need to, charging lithium ion cells below freezing is a bad idea which is why the supercharging is so slow when the battery pack is cold.
I would however be cautious if the temperature has been (and is) extremely low, well below -20C, as at that point aggressively discharging lithium ion's is a bit questionable from the endurance standpoint as well as the capacity.
Obviously you'd want to have the battery heater keeping the pack warm.
The car is foolprof and won't let you damage the battery. In this case, the battery must have been around 0°C. Look here where the battery was really cold after sitting still for a week:
ruclips.net/video/nNqShkjg6nU/видео.htmlm1s
What an AMAZING scenery/view at 12:15... OMG!!!
8:29 It's also an amazing demonstration of acceleration. That thing sure moves.
It's convenient we can see your face reflected in your dash display cam (12:00)
Teslavangelist 12:22 is more visible
Love the transparent dash display while driving! Great video 👍
463/5000
I had exactly the same situation once.
My vehicle was outside for one week at - 8 degrees.
There was still 50% in the battery and the recuperation was switched off.
When I arrived at the charging station, it took 10 minutes before charging.
Actually normal, if the vehicle switches off the recuperation then it cannot charge either.
After 10 minutes he started to land slowly and became faster and faster ..
Nice job, keep up the good work!
Tesla should put free treadmills next to their superchargers.
And the treadmills should have generators to put energy back to the grid :D
Reminds me of a Black Mirror episode
phpART Yep same
That is actually quite a smart way to heat up the batteries
They could put some at every gym where they have work out machines that are always occupied. Then power them buy modifying or replacing the workout machines. The cost could be split between the users of the machines and the users of the chargers.
When I switch to ludicrous mode, the battery temperature will raise up to 50 degree C. That means when you sleep in the car, set alarm one hour before you wanted to wake up and the another alarm for the actual wake you. Turn on ludicrous mode then the battery will heat up at much higher speed than regular mode. Note sure if this will work in Norway :-)
It will probably work.
The dry crunchy/squeaky sound of the snow under your feet is the best indictor of how cold it is. That doesn't usually happen until it gets pretty far below freezing.
Bjorn! Thanks for this tip! Missing Frank Moses. He is out for small dent repair. Day 8 of 21(estimated). Had to go outside and scrape windows this morning. Plus cars were cold! Don’t even have a Tesla rental as it isn’t warranty repair. :(
Fossil car lol
Riding With Jahv - Not a joke. A Chevy volt will just run the gas engine long enough to warm up the battery pack, which has fluid heating and cooling.
@@pascalmerschaudio He is already killing them by buying Teslas lmao. Theyre enviroment killers aswell.
Videoforum you're wrong. In Norway most of electricity is produced from renewable sources. Even though Teslas produce more co2 to manufacture, they're better for the environment.
Paweł Buczyński Also, Tesla factories are turning to solar power pretty quickly. So that will reduce the production emissions even further.
@@4nlimited3dition_4n3d Still, a fossil car is way more environmentally friendly than a tesla. (Atleast the first 150k km)
I like watching Bj0rn videos. He is so funny with his expressive words.
"what is best? driving is more fun, I guess..." love your sense of humor, Bjorn.
Most iconic “oh shit” ive ever heard. Look forward to it now lmao
Oh I believe you on the cold part! I deal with that every winter here in Western Maryland. -30°F with -50°F or more wind chills that one year. My diff fluid was like peanut butter!
Is there not a way to see the battery temperature? Car settings or special app?
Steve Rioux that’s what I was thinking you would think. The price you pay for one of these it should have it.
@@Branman345 I'm sure they'll add it in a software update if people really want it
Yes, is in the app
I would love to visit you one time just to feel the power of that Model X, I would really love that.
And of course also to meet you, you seem like a really cool guy!
you really hearing how the snow cracking how cold it is....
Beautiful view with the sun setting and the snow :) Around 12:17
I like this channel video it's talking about the electric vehicles and also the future I love it
Excellent video Bjorn
There is no bad weather, only bad clothes.
Your profile picture looks like the Honda S2000 Engine Start button.
and bad cars
Hi! Thank you for your videos! Having a Tesla in Russia is a problem ) we still have no chargers, and distance here is veery big, i often travel 1000+ km so it could be a problem) I watch your videos and dream of that day when I could buy Tesla) I mean, a day when i could use it as an everyday car) by the way, even in central regions we sometimes have -40 c temp in winter) i saw videos that Tesla survives it normally)
Upvote for sleeping in the car during Scandinavian winter temperatures. My old 90-s Ford Fiesta did not keep the warmth in when i needed it hehe
I will never be able to buy Tesla but I enjoy watching your videos
I bought the Kia soul 2016. I wish I could afford a Tesla to.
You could have just hit acelerator and brake pedal at the same time while standing still. Around 10-15 kW heat would be dissipated in the motor and heat the battery via shared coolant loop. And your wild guess of 10% heat loss gives 40Kw at 400kW output (at the gauge). But those 40kW happen only 1/3 of the trip time. So standing still with accelerator and brakes pressed at the same time should give you comparable results. And not stressing the drivetrain mechanically.
i don't think the tesla allows you to hit brake and accelerator at the same time
just no.
Before charging, after parked in the cold, as you said drive it a bit in hills if available and use the cabin heater jist 2 to 5 min is plenty!
Was in Minneapolis MN once ~10 years ago. It was -15F -26C. That was cold -55F wind chill. Schools closed.
I would definitely think charging the battery is the best way to warm it up. Start driving around, and the moving air will chill everything down. And even if the battery is already charged, the supercharger can run the battery heater.
11:49 awesome scenery
If you dont have a road with a high speedlimit, just do freakn donuts on the parkinglot, thats constant heat
Youre the best! It would be cool if Tesla show the battery temperature. So we can see the ongoing better .:)
Norway 🇳🇴 is very pretty man! Keep up the great work!!
This is awesome. Don't think I've been in any climate below 0 °C. Someday I will!
Very interesting.
Tesla should put in more heaters for the battery in places like Denmark and Norway etc.
"My nose hair is freezing....aww shit" lmao
Great Video Bjorn.... don't see temperatures nearly that low here in Florida but future road trips will be easier with your transfer of knowledge.
BTW, can you advise which cell phone holder you've got suctioned to your carbon fiber dash please? Need to get one that works for mine. Keep up the entertaining work.....always enjoyable.
I am in Southern China. Winter is not cold, just t-shirt and a jacket is enough. I also dont own a Tesla as i am a Foreigner. Its 2.39PM and i enjoyed watching your video !!! Absoluely no idea why.. ha. Time for Bed.
The most amazing thing is that you slept in the back of the car at 0 degrees F and it didn't even lose 50% of its range
Would be funny if you see lots of Teslas JoJo-driving next to the superchargers from now one :D "TeslaBjørn told me to do it"
As I explained in the video, the yoyo-driving is last resort. If planned correctly, this shouldn't be necessary.
Keep up good work,i plan to do a roadtrip from Moscow around the Russian Golden Ring on my P85D !
Supercoldcharger :))))
Have you tried to switch to ludicrous/launch mode from a very cold battery? The car will tell you it will take 10 or 15 minutes or so to warm up. If it works cold, this is better as you don't have to drive it at all; you can stay parked.
Jim Whitehead he mentions in the video that the battery heater is 6kw
The motor when push to its limit pushes at 400kw and if you account a loss of 10% that means the battery is heating at a rate of 40kw
Therefore, heat loss from the the motor is much greater than heat from the battery heater.
Is a loss of 10% in the battery a realistic assumtion?
I'm not sure. But look at the stats at the very end of the video. There was a whopping 27 % heat loss that was not counted in the trip meter.
I'd like to know something about charging speed. Can you make a test, where you test for example a Nissan Leaf or a KIA Soul, where you can charge chademo and typ1 at the same time, does it charges faster, if you plug in both of them at the same time?
Small problem with sound quality. FYI
Wonder if battery would heat up fast if you went to ludicrous setting and select heat battery. It most likely will say that you will need an hour to get full heat.
G ary then select Max battery power
12:30 looks like there’s a nuclear explosion!
Nah it's just a nuclear fusion reactor 150 million kilometers away
I just wonder if it might be another explanation about the heating effect.
When using energy from the battery, the heating will be from inside the battery cells, instead of heating with the element, that will heat the cells from outside.
The element will give a lag, and it means the battery heating need to be used for a while before the heat reaches the inside of the cells.
Some math:
Using 5,8kWh totally in 10 minutes, means 34,8kW of effect.
To compete to the 6kW battery heater, in power, that means its necessary to have
1/(34,8/6)= 17.24% loss in battery.
That fosil is probabaly long gone.:D Man, you spend way too much time doing these experiments, but they sure are fun to watch. Btw, can you keep your car plugged in supercharger over night while you sleep in it, or you have to pay idle fees then? And if so, how much? Thanks.
Yes, you pay idle fees as soon as you're done charging. €0,40/minute. Also, it's not done to block a stall for that long. Camper mode works fine to keep the heat in the car and will not consume that much energy. Easily topped off again in the morning if you "camp" near a supercharger.
That's incorrect. In this case, I would not pay any idle fees. The idle fees start when the capacity of the supercharger has reached 50 %. That means that on a 8 stall supercharger, the idle fees occur when 4 or more cars are charging. During that night, almost no cars went there.
But on the other hand, it's bad manner to park there after charging has completed. That's why I moved the car in the evening after charging.
Bjørn Nyland right. Forgot about that
It's interesting how the max regen of a Tesla is only maybe 70KW or so... but with my 2013 Volt with only a 16-17.1KWh pack, it can do 60KW regen for a limited time. Wish Tesla's could do 100KW regen for things like towing down a mountain. Battery could certainly handle it since supercharging is that fast.
Tesla should implement this at the supercharger, so that you don’t have to drive. Just do the Jo-Joing with the grid or some powerpacks located at the SC or even another car charing there. The owner does not have to notice, just show an exponentially increasing charging speed, by gradually reducing the discharge time in favor of more changing time. However, I don’t know if this is good for the battery pack or if it doesn’t really matter.
I can tell that around 5% of the Energy gets drained inside the Battery (mostly lower depends on inner Resistance of the Battery). Thats roughly 20Kw bei full throttle. Better than the 6kw from the heater which first heats the outside of the cells.
I would probably only do this in tight situations. It's unnecessary wear on your batteries. Extreme cold can increase strain on the batteries which is the whole reason it warms up in order to charge. Discharging them under heavy load does the job of heating them up, but at the cost of creating strain the slow charge/warm up period is designed to avoid.
sound of snow, when you step on it are a good indicator of low temperature
You can hear how cold it is, by the sound the snow makes when you walk around, atleast you know by that sound that it is very cold.
Ha, the frozen SC cable that acts like a pine tree branch. Tesla has a patent for cable cooling system, should include heating too. The gas station pumps have the same problem though. I wonder how that charging cable acts in -30C. That's where the winter starts, warmer than that is still OK, not too difficult to manage, you can still work out side, but below -30C plastic parts will break, fluids turn to solid, rubber tires have parking dents, shock absorber fluids turn molasses and your car will stay tilted after a long curve. I cannot even imagine how bad it gets below -40, but I have experienced -37C and that cracked my shoe soles and I got flat tires just by moving a car a bit.
Are those power outlets at 0:44 ? Could you have just plugged in there overnight and kept the battery heater running all night?
many nother countrys have 220V outlets (these are the normal ones there, no 110V at all) for your car to be plugged in over night, yes even for Gas cars :)
I could have. But the test here was to simulate an EV sitting still with no heater on throughout the night.
Bjørn Nyland Oh, off course!
Freakschwimmer wow. I need to get myself and my electric motorcycle there! (Maybe in summer....)
Great video. that's great info.
Just brilliant and good fun as always. Did you do the roadtrip video in Thai? If yes, whats the link?
Check out my Thai channel.
Such a beautiful place
So why wouldn't you have left range mode off so that the car would have kept the battery warm as you slept? Or does range mode off not keep the battery warm enough to supercharge? You didn't explain the significance of range mode. You where at the supercharger and could have topped off in the morning to replace the energy spend heating the cabin and the battery.
I wanted to simulate a parked car for the night. If you want to know more about range mode:
ruclips.net/video/lSRv-REnUIg/видео.html
So whats the electricity usage in that case? kW of energy used to heat battieries. That's negative mpg
miles per fossil?
In the P-Models: Just simply enable "Max Battery Power" and let it rund for 20 minutes together with pre-heat. Done.
Useful, thanks Bjorn. Does it increase battery degradation or risk any other damage to quickly draw power from a battery when cold. Guess the electric motor is not an issue putting under load from cold.
I don't think so.
Try the goldside inwards to reflect the heat into the car instead of out. :)
Will be interesting to see how much quicker model 3 will be to heat up. It run power through the motor without it moving to generate heat (quite a bit more than 6kW)
No worries, after global warming you wont need to worry about the cold tesla and even ice and snow!
4:50 The range actually went down while charging
could this be taking so long because you did have quite a bit of charge already in the battery??? Thanks Bjorn !!
"Drive like we stole the car" ^_^ Typical Bjørn lol
It’s 21 C in Arizona, USA right now. I can not imagine what negative C would feel like!
Welcome to Tomsk, Russia in Nov/Dec/Jan :) couple of weeks ago there was below -30 (down to -40 for the night) C for the whole week. In 2010, it was below -30 for three weeks without a brake. And I didn't say anything yet about Yakutsk, Norilsk or Magadan, they have temperatures down to -50, and -30 people living there consider as "it's getting warm" :)
Min Volvo v70 mod98 i minus 23 bruker 12-15 min på tine rutene.
Det er viktig å lese håndboka hvordan du defroster ruta.
12-15 minutes is slow. My Tesla needs just a few minutes.
In cold conditions - always plug in straight after you stop - simples :)
If I slept there overnight in my golf 4, I would have become an icestatue the next day. Hopefully, a fancy one at least
Takk får videioen teslaen vår kommer snart til familien.🙂
NIce :)
So in cold countries there should be something similar to a Dyno test setup, so electric cars can heat up their batteries when standing next to the supercharger.
When the battery is so cold the internal resistance is pretty high, so you have so high losses that it heats up very quickly when youre accerlerating with 400kw.
Problem here is that this is really bad for the battery, so when you are in a hurry, I would accerlerate not so hardly and do it a bit longer
It is close to impossible to heat engine up when running car on idle. You can heat up engine in 2 minutes by actually driving it (putting some load on engine), so it can burn more fuel.
Very exciting video!
Lithium-Ion batteries cannot be charged below 0 degrees C. It will physically damage the battery. Which is why the car uses power to warm the battery before it will accept a charge.
Would it then have been better in this case to sleep in the car with range mode off so it keeps the battery warm overnight? Is that how it works? (Obviously not for this video otherwise you'd have nothing to show us :)
Do this again in 2019 with model 3
BMWCrown he just did !
@@Lovejazz01 I saw but it was not the same yet. Maybe once it gets even colder he will do it
Interesting to know this stuff, interesting videos too. The Tesla is really been tested to the temperature limits. I’m in the UK, and sometimes the temperature drops to -3/4 mostly, but last year it went down to -8/9/10. I have a shielded drive way beside the house which helps. So would a Tesla still perform ok in these Temperatures. The other question is, how long do Tesla batteries last. You got to treat them nicely.
Thanks for the videos👍
is there any reason why BEVs don't have what ICE have had for years in your colder climates which whilst an engine heater would be no use a battery heating element under the battery would be great?
Teslas do (the 6 kw heater he talks about), but Bjorn deliberately turned it off for this demonstration of what to do if circumstances are such that this situation is unavoidable.
his description doesn't mention any of that or in the lower description either did I miss something?
Fancy a Bev Mate? The description necessarily isn't a transcript of the entire video. He talks about it several times in the video.
Mark Haury so if I'm looking for information regarding this information that isn't described in the description....no that doesn't work either. Maybe he forgot to put it in the description because he likes to be mysterious!
Fancy a Bev Mate? Or... you could watch the video before commenting...
If you're looking for text information, this is not the place. It's a video platform, not Wikipedia.
Like fossil fuel cars you have to think about when you are going to fill-up/charge. I would just charge my car after driving not a problem.
-17C Sheeett! I think back in 2009 it became -14C here in England. In the early hours. I was awake so put my head out just to feel what it was like. Painful to breathe!
m1aws In February here in russia we have -30 and nope,we still alive
Nrhfbfb pretty much similar in Finland
Minäenkeksinimeä even my p85d here works nice :)))))
lol -14 is nothing
Bro -14? You crying about -14? Its minus 18 right now n we all chilling laid back
Great video. My 2013 p85 handled the cold well but the 2017 100D seems less ready to warm the battery, even with the new software battery warmer, which is not predictable. Any chance you’ll do a video with the latest software or did it not make it to you yet? Model S’s
Here is temp -45 in Winnipeg canada
you can hear how cold it is by listening to the snow cramming under your steps