Coming from a church that has to repeat the sacrament prayer or the baptism prayer when not said perfectly, yet everything regarding the temple ordinances are always changing 🧐
that was just kind dumb, if we allow people to make mistakes in saying the prayer over the sacrament, then what, Christ gave the exact wordage to the people in the Americas when he came and stayed with them. So it's something that should be set correctly and it usually is. The changes to temple rites, have to do with the times we live in as symbols change, wording might change. Are you a prophet so you know what should be done. Being a member for 51 years, I don't recall many changes in many changes. You'll spend the rest of your days, finding things to try to ridicule. Because you can't take the BOM and find mistakes in it, it's too sophisticated with tying everything together, so instead you just make comments like above.
There were a lot of rules about rites in temples. You can find them in the Old Testament. Sadducees and Pharisees ADDED things that were not commanded by God. I know and testify the requirements to enter holy temples in this dispensation have been given by God. May you succeed in your quest to know Jesus Christ and receive eternal life.
In addition to the adjustments to the interview questions, a study of the changes within the temple can be quite insightful. As a side note, there is no known record of the temple endowment as originally taught by Joseph.
It is interesting to consider that the Temple which is so central to Mormonism actually has no scriptural or prophetic basis at all. I am not saying it is not of God however it certainly would make sense that if it was of God then we would have written revelation to support it.
In the book The Exoneration of Emma, Joseph, and Hyrum it talks about the endowment being pilfered from the Masons. It mentions that William Clayton and Heber C Kimball had a hand in this.
You left out the #1 requirement, positively proving you've paid your exact 10% by making your W2 forms available to your bishop during the annual "tithing settlement". Which is in perfect alignment with the corporate environment of the LDS church
No that is not correct. You do not have to provide a W2 at all or ever. If you have been told this, then it is a one off. I know this from 40 years, 2 countries and several wards of getting my recommend renewed. The question from the Bishop is if you are a full tithe payer. You say yes or no. That's it.
@@boysrus61 total bull_____ I was married to a recommend carrying Mormon woman for 20 years. And in every one of those years she had to provide PROOF of her income apart from mine and reconcile that against what she had paid. And NO, THEY DO NOT JUST TAKE YOUR WORD FOR IT. Are you for real???
I had always thought the impure, unholy, or unnatural sex acts question was something they tried to enforce in 1982 but due to backlash it was dropped in less than 9 months.
I think you are correct and I put that down wrong. The language was added to the handbook in 1978, then the oral clarification was in 1982 which caused the backlash.
General Handbook of Instructions Supplement 3 (1978) - Added it to the handbook January 5, 1982 - First Presidency statement to all leaders clarified what it meant.
In Doctrine Covenants 97:15-16 theLord teaches that He will not come to a Temple if the unclean or unfaithful are allowed. Only the pure in heart. Furthermore DC 88:138-141 & DC 4:1-2 tells us which members are allowed into Temple and the School of the Prophets.
One part of the bible that I love is how history shows it true and I try and read up on all knew discoveries. I was elated to study the dead sea scrolls found in Qumran which showed beyond any doubt that the old testament had not been corrupted as 1 Nephi chapter 13 said: "the loss of many plain and precious parts of the bible" had occurred. This is why Nephi said there was the need for "the restoration of the gospel, the coming forth of latter-day scripture". 1 Nephi 13: 26 says "after .. the twelve apostles of the Lamb, ... the formation of that great and abominable church, ... for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the lamb many parts which are plain and most precious". The notes at the bottom say Nephi made this prophesy between 600 and 592 B.C. Then 1 Nephi 13:30 says: "because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel ... Satan hath great power over them". Then, 1 Nephi 14:3 says because of this "the devil... lead away the souls of men down to hell". But the dead sea scrolls proved this prophecy is false as the scrolls found in cave 1 show that the old testament we have is not corrupted like Nephi said. And the other caves have proven this also with more books of the old testament. Jesus said he was the "word" of God and was one with the Father (not a previous humanoid) as a false prophet would say. God bless you.
IF a temple recommend is necessary, why not simply ask members the sanctifying question, "Do you follow the Ten Commandments and abide by the Beatitudes?" That's gospel compliant.
They could certainly simplify it. "Are you trying to be like Jesus in all things" or something similar. Or just "Do you feel worthy to approach God for further light and truth?"
This would require the church to actually TEACH the 10 commandments and Beatitudes. I've never had a specific lesson on it in Sunday School. Ever. It just isn't part of the Temple, Profit, Pay and Obey curriculum
@@hrv4908 the temple is the body which houses the spirit, as Jesus clearly explained and the church leaders of His day also didn’t understand. The temple building is not “the temple”. In case you didn’t notice, there were quotations around that sentence because it came right out of the scriptures - it didn’t originate from me, lol.
@@yeboscrebo4451Yes, the human body is considered the temple where man's spirit dwells. Stone temples are places where God's work is done and He comes to visit. God lives in the heavens. It's really pretty simple, but you Anties try to convolute the truth in an effort to discredit the building of temples. I guess you hate ancient temples as well. Matt 21: 12-17, John 2: 16
Recent changes include the emergence of an e-recommend. It's already on the system. This year or last. I think there has also been a question about conduct towards family added in the last twenty years.
I am not sure how the electronic recommend is any different than the barcode they have been scanning for a while now. Will the digital recommend be tied to a social credit score?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism It just pops up on your phone. Presumably a QR code will be the besis for it. Our bosses seem to love these thngs... they've been around for years but almost no one used them until 2020. In answer to your last question... not far off.
You listed the oral sex first presidency question and removal as being in 1978, but I'm pretty sure it was 1982 (when Kimball was ill). Quinn argued that he thought that the first Nauvoo temple recommend may have been a tithing receipt.
Yes you are correct. I had it wrong in the video. It seems the phrase was added to the handbook in 1978 and then clarified in the FP statement in 1982 which caused the backlash. Thanks for noticing that.
King Solomon the Wise got it right. In his dedicatory prayer for the very first temple he said, "But will God indeed dwell on the earth? behold, the heaven and heaven of heavens cannot contain thee; how much less this house that I have builded?" 2 Kings 8:27 Jehovah ordered the design of the Tabernacle and His presence dwelt there. Jesus Christ commanded the construction of the Kirtland Temple and His presence landed there. Other than those instances, how is any temple holier than any other place? It's all the same -- everything everywhere on earth belongs to Jesus ("...this earth will be Christ's." D&C 130:9).
Good observation. I would also like to see where and how God commanded all the other temples. If God didn't ask for them then how can they be his and why would he accept the works in them? That would be like the jews anciently just building a structure, calling it holy, and performing the rites in them. Does anyone think God would be okay with that?
You know I'm a little overweight myself but the word of wisdom is supposed to be invited by to go into the temple you said in the past there was much leeway giving in that there still is if there wasn't we would see no overweight people in there we would only see people with perfect body because there are Health standards in the word of wisdom and if we were buying those we would not be overweight at all as I said I am a little bit overweight myself and I have a temple recommend I know that I was not living that standard
You can drink surgary drinks 24/7 or energy drinks daily BUT heaven forbid you should drink coffee or tea. You can be obese for purely poor health choices (not medical) and get a recommend, but to be an athlete who drinks coffee- Nope. This is not a slam against obese but a nod to the cognitive dissonance it takes to not see the stupidity in it. God should have told Joseph to tell the people to boil their water. Now that would have been revelatory.
One part of the bible that I love is how history shows it true and I try and read up on all knew discoveries. I was elated to study the dead sea scrolls found in Qumran which showed beyond any doubt that the old testament had not been corrupted as 1 Nephi chapter 13 said: "the loss of many plain and precious parts of the bible" had occurred. This is why Nephi said there was the need for "the restoration of the gospel, the coming forth of latter-day scripture". 1 Nephi 13: 26 says "after .. the twelve apostles of the Lamb, ... the formation of that great and abominable church, ... for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the lamb many parts which are plain and most precious". The notes at the bottom say Nephi made this prophesy between 600 and 592 B.C. Then 1 Nephi 13:30 says: "because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel ... Satan hath great power over them". Then, 1 Nephi 14:3 says because of this "the devil... lead away the souls of men down to hell". But the dead sea scrolls proved this prophecy is false as the scrolls found in cave 1 show that the old testament we have is not corrupted like Nephi said. And the other caves have proven this also with more books of the old testament. Jesus said he was the "word" of God and was one with the Father (not a previous humanoid) as a false prophet would say. God bless you.
I knew what it's meant to have garments.. but in my clarification and understanding there is something missing. My garments is defferent from your garment, my garment is hedden hehehe Sorry I cannot add. The more I telling you the more you've got learn and learn by, from my idea ('s) 🤩🥳🤓🧐
They don't have correct Theology like Catholics. Catholics are against all birth control in all its forms. The only accepted form of birth control is "natural family planning". Timing cycles ect, something Joseph Smith with do with his many wives.
I found this episode interesting and educating until... The narrator (like Aaron telling the people to build a golden calf while they wait for Moses) decided to take it upon himself to tell the people of God should or should not do. 🤦♂️
Do you have a more specific example? I freely admit I could have done that, however without something more specific then it is very difficult to understand what you mean.
@@robertthompson3447 Thanks. I honestly am not sure what is offensive in what I said. I mentioned that the questions should be removed and we should be able to commune with God if we feel worthy or the questions should be more invasive so no one can slip through the cracks. Is this not true? Is this not a logical extension of what is happening now? There is no legitimate purpose for those questions other than control by our religious leaders. This is similar to Aaron allowing the people to worship an idol? I certainly am not offended however you are saying I cannot say those things, however you can tell me not to say them? Honestly, I am confused.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism I see that appealing to your Christian side is a waste of time. When you are converted, please message me back to further this discussion.
@@robertthompson3447 I have seen this so many times. Someone makes a comment, I ask for information about the comment or for a scriptural reason they believe that. They then respond very similar to how you just did. I am not worthy of their response or I wouldn't understand their response or I wouldn't even listen if they tried. To be honest with you, all of those are plain excuses because you or the people who gave me those other excuses can't or don't want to spend the time to analyze the word of God closer. They are too caught up in the wicked traditions of their fathers to even begin to care whether they are wicked traditions or not. I would love to engage with you on an intellectual level. However currently I am the only one providing a coherent logical argument.
@@hanichay1163 ever notice how, in the temple ceremony, the men were pronounced clean or that they may become clean through their faithfulness but the women were not? That’s because women are ritualistically unclean. What’s natural and healthy in a fallen world isn’t the goal of religious transcendence.
@@yeboscrebo4451 WOW. The calling of women "unclean" for the way god made them is beyond sexist and simply maddening! It'd be like calling men unclean due to erections.
@@dynamicbree For the way god made them? Eve’s body was changed (in regards specifically to reproduction) as a result of her disobedience. Choices bring consequences.
Coming from a church that has to repeat the sacrament prayer or the baptism prayer when not said perfectly, yet everything regarding the temple ordinances are always changing 🧐
That is a good point. I never considered it that way before.
that was just kind dumb, if we allow people to make mistakes in saying the prayer over the sacrament, then what, Christ gave the exact wordage to the people in the Americas when he came and stayed with them. So it's something that should be set correctly and it usually is. The changes to temple rites, have to do with the times we live in as symbols change, wording might change. Are you a prophet so you know what should be done. Being a member for 51 years, I don't recall many changes in many changes. You'll spend the rest of your days, finding things to try to ridicule. Because you can't take the BOM and find mistakes in it, it's too sophisticated with tying everything together, so instead you just make comments like above.
All the rules remind me of the Sadducees and Pharacees.
That is true. The immediate parallels are elitism, single truth, changing by whims of leaders.
There were a lot of rules about rites in temples. You can find them in the Old Testament.
Sadducees and Pharisees ADDED things that were not commanded by God. I know and testify the requirements to enter holy temples in this dispensation have been given by God. May you succeed in your quest to know Jesus Christ and receive eternal life.
In addition to the adjustments to the interview questions, a study of the changes within the temple can be quite insightful. As a side note, there is no known record of the temple endowment as originally taught by Joseph.
This channel did a video about the changes a few weeks ago. 😉
It is interesting to consider that the Temple which is so central to Mormonism actually has no scriptural or prophetic basis at all.
I am not saying it is not of God however it certainly would make sense that if it was of God then we would have written revelation to support it.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism Well, it is mainly based on Freemasonry and a variant of the Genesis narrative.
Exactly. 🚩🚩🚩
In the book The Exoneration of Emma, Joseph, and Hyrum it talks about the endowment being pilfered from the Masons. It mentions that William Clayton and Heber C Kimball had a hand in this.
You left out the #1 requirement, positively proving you've paid your exact 10% by making your W2 forms available to your bishop during the annual "tithing settlement". Which is in perfect alignment with the corporate environment of the LDS church
No that is not correct. You do not have to provide a W2 at all or ever. If you have been told this, then it is a one off. I know this from 40 years, 2 countries and several wards of getting my recommend renewed. The question from the Bishop is if you are a full tithe payer. You say yes or no. That's it.
@@boysrus61 total bull_____ I was married to a recommend carrying Mormon woman for 20 years. And in every one of those years she had to provide PROOF of her income apart from mine and reconcile that against what she had paid. And NO, THEY DO NOT JUST TAKE YOUR WORD FOR IT. Are you for real???
@@boysrus61Exactly. I've held a temple recommend for 4 decades and have never been asked for proof. Anties lie.
I had always thought the impure, unholy, or unnatural sex acts question was something they tried to enforce in 1982 but due to backlash it was dropped in less than 9 months.
I think you are correct and I put that down wrong. The language was added to the handbook in 1978, then the oral clarification was in 1982 which caused the backlash.
General Handbook of Instructions Supplement 3 (1978) - Added it to the handbook
January 5, 1982 - First Presidency statement to all leaders clarified what it meant.
In order to believe that this church is “The True Church” you have to believe that God cannot make up His mind.
You hit the nail on the head. Exactly right.
Another change was from annual renewal to every other year.
Totally true. I missed that one.
Updated the blog with that information. Thanks.
In Doctrine Covenants 97:15-16 theLord teaches that He will not come to a Temple if the unclean or unfaithful are allowed. Only the pure in heart. Furthermore DC 88:138-141 & DC 4:1-2 tells us which members are allowed into Temple and the School of the Prophets.
Arguably, the temple recommend questions are symbolic.
I can see this. However in this case then they shouldn't matter.
One part of the bible that I love is how history shows it true and I try and read up on all knew discoveries. I was elated to study the dead sea scrolls found in Qumran which showed beyond any doubt that the old testament had not been corrupted as 1 Nephi chapter 13 said: "the loss of many plain and precious parts of the bible" had occurred.
This is why Nephi said there was the need for "the restoration of the gospel, the coming forth of latter-day scripture". 1 Nephi 13: 26 says "after .. the twelve apostles of the Lamb, ... the formation of that great and abominable church, ... for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the lamb many parts which are plain and most precious". The notes at the bottom say Nephi made this prophesy between 600 and 592 B.C. Then 1 Nephi 13:30 says: "because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel ... Satan hath great power over them". Then, 1 Nephi 14:3 says because of this "the devil... lead away the souls of men down to hell".
But the dead sea scrolls proved this prophecy is false as the scrolls found in cave 1 show that the old testament we have is not corrupted like Nephi said. And the other caves have proven this also with more books of the old testament. Jesus said he was the "word" of God and was one with the Father (not a previous humanoid) as a false prophet would say. God bless you.
This is interesting information..
IF a temple recommend is necessary, why not simply ask members the sanctifying question, "Do you follow the Ten Commandments and abide by the Beatitudes?"
That's gospel compliant.
They could certainly simplify it. "Are you trying to be like Jesus in all things" or something similar.
Or just "Do you feel worthy to approach God for further light and truth?"
@@uncorrelatedmormonism That is one of the questions. Do you feel worthy to attend the temple.
This would require the church to actually TEACH the 10 commandments and Beatitudes. I've never had a specific lesson on it in Sunday School. Ever. It just isn't part of the Temple, Profit, Pay and Obey curriculum
“The most high dwelleth not in temples built with hands”. The body which houses the spirit is the true temple. Everyone has their own temple.
Typical anti excuse. God dwells where the righteous gather. Who are you to say where He can't go?
@@hrv4908 the temple is the body which houses the spirit, as Jesus clearly explained and the church leaders of His day also didn’t understand. The temple building is not “the temple”. In case you didn’t notice, there were quotations around that sentence because it came right out of the scriptures - it didn’t originate from me, lol.
@@yeboscrebo4451Yes, the human body is considered the temple where man's spirit dwells. Stone temples are places where God's work is done and He comes to visit. God lives in the heavens. It's really pretty simple, but you Anties try to convolute the truth in an effort to discredit the building of temples. I guess you hate ancient temples as well. Matt 21: 12-17, John 2: 16
Recent changes include the emergence of an e-recommend. It's already on the system. This year or last.
I think there has also been a question about conduct towards family added in the last twenty years.
I am not sure how the electronic recommend is any different than the barcode they have been scanning for a while now.
Will the digital recommend be tied to a social credit score?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism It just pops up on your phone. Presumably a QR code will be the besis for it. Our bosses seem to love these thngs... they've been around for years but almost no one used them until 2020. In answer to your last question... not far off.
We have Temples in all world's without numbers, & Heaven's, of THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS.
You listed the oral sex first presidency question and removal as being in 1978, but I'm pretty sure it was 1982 (when Kimball was ill). Quinn argued that he thought that the first Nauvoo temple recommend may have been a tithing receipt.
Yes you are correct. I had it wrong in the video. It seems the phrase was added to the handbook in 1978 and then clarified in the FP statement in 1982 which caused the backlash.
Thanks for noticing that.
King Solomon the Wise got it right. In his dedicatory prayer for the very first temple he said, "But will God indeed dwell on the earth? behold, the heaven and heaven of heavens cannot contain thee; how much less this house that I have builded?" 2 Kings 8:27
Jehovah ordered the design of the Tabernacle and His presence dwelt there. Jesus Christ commanded the construction of the Kirtland Temple and His presence landed there.
Other than those instances, how is any temple holier than any other place? It's all the same -- everything everywhere on earth belongs to Jesus ("...this earth will be Christ's." D&C 130:9).
Good observation. I would also like to see where and how God commanded all the other temples.
If God didn't ask for them then how can they be his and why would he accept the works in them?
That would be like the jews anciently just building a structure, calling it holy, and performing the rites in them.
Does anyone think God would be okay with that?
You know I'm a little overweight myself but the word of wisdom is supposed to be invited by to go into the temple you said in the past there was much leeway giving in that there still is if there wasn't we would see no overweight people in there we would only see people with perfect body because there are Health standards in the word of wisdom and if we were buying those we would not be overweight at all as I said I am a little bit overweight myself and I have a temple recommend I know that I was not living that standard
So people with health problems, for 1000 reasons, shouldn't be allowed in the temple?
They are not worthy of God? 6 pack abs only?
You can drink surgary drinks 24/7 or energy drinks daily BUT heaven forbid you should drink coffee or tea. You can be obese for purely poor health choices (not medical) and get a recommend, but to be an athlete who drinks coffee- Nope. This is not a slam against obese but a nod to the cognitive dissonance it takes to not see the stupidity in it. God should have told Joseph to tell the people to boil their water. Now that would have been revelatory.
One part of the bible that I love is how history shows it true and I try and read up on all knew discoveries. I was elated to study the dead sea scrolls found in Qumran which showed beyond any doubt that the old testament had not been corrupted as 1 Nephi chapter 13 said: "the loss of many plain and precious parts of the bible" had occurred.
This is why Nephi said there was the need for "the restoration of the gospel, the coming forth of latter-day scripture". 1 Nephi 13: 26 says "after .. the twelve apostles of the Lamb, ... the formation of that great and abominable church, ... for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the lamb many parts which are plain and most precious". The notes at the bottom say Nephi made this prophesy between 600 and 592 B.C. Then 1 Nephi 13:30 says: "because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel ... Satan hath great power over them". Then, 1 Nephi 14:3 says because of this "the devil... lead away the souls of men down to hell".
But the dead sea scrolls proved this prophecy is false as the scrolls found in cave 1 show that the old testament we have is not corrupted like Nephi said. And the other caves have proven this also with more books of the old testament. Jesus said he was the "word" of God and was one with the Father (not a previous humanoid) as a false prophet would say. God bless you.
The ARK of the COVENANTS is in all Temples in the Heaven's & world's without numbers, for eternities.
I knew what it's meant to have garments.. but in my clarification and understanding there is something missing. My garments is defferent from your garment, my garment is hedden hehehe Sorry I cannot add. The more I telling you the more you've got learn and learn by, from my idea ('s) 🤩🥳🤓🧐
What kind of birth control not allowed? Abstinence?
They indicated nothing should be used to prevent conception. I don't think they strictly held people to that standard though.
They don't have correct Theology like Catholics. Catholics are against all birth control in all its forms. The only accepted form of birth control is "natural family planning". Timing cycles ect, something Joseph Smith with do with his many wives.
It is called legalism!!
Yes. There is a lot of that today with the need for political correctness.
I found this episode interesting and educating until...
The narrator (like Aaron telling the people to build a golden calf while they wait for Moses) decided to take it upon himself to tell the people of God should or should not do. 🤦♂️
Do you have a more specific example? I freely admit I could have done that, however without something more specific then it is very difficult to understand what you mean.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism
Time 27:00 - 27:09 in the video.
@@robertthompson3447 Thanks. I honestly am not sure what is offensive in what I said.
I mentioned that the questions should be removed and we should be able to commune with God if we feel worthy or the questions should be more invasive so no one can slip through the cracks. Is this not true? Is this not a logical extension of what is happening now? There is no legitimate purpose for those questions other than control by our religious leaders.
This is similar to Aaron allowing the people to worship an idol? I certainly am not offended however you are saying I cannot say those things, however you can tell me not to say them? Honestly, I am confused.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism I see that appealing to your Christian side is a waste of time. When you are converted, please message me back to further this discussion.
@@robertthompson3447 I have seen this so many times. Someone makes a comment, I ask for information about the comment or for a scriptural reason they believe that.
They then respond very similar to how you just did. I am not worthy of their response or I wouldn't understand their response or I wouldn't even listen if they tried.
To be honest with you, all of those are plain excuses because you or the people who gave me those other excuses can't or don't want to spend the time to analyze the word of God closer. They are too caught up in the wicked traditions of their fathers to even begin to care whether they are wicked traditions or not.
I would love to engage with you on an intellectual level. However currently I am the only one providing a coherent logical argument.
Oh. My. Goodness. Menstruating women impure and unclean??? Yikes.
That is a historical, ritualistic tradition shared by religions and cultures across the world. Even the Native American Indians shared the belief.
@@yeboscrebo4451 I know but this was modern times relatively. Educated people know it’s natural and healthy.
@@hanichay1163 ever notice how, in the temple ceremony, the men were pronounced clean or that they may become clean through their faithfulness but the women were not? That’s because women are ritualistically unclean. What’s natural and healthy in a fallen world isn’t the goal of religious transcendence.
@@yeboscrebo4451 WOW. The calling of women "unclean" for the way god made them is beyond sexist and simply maddening! It'd be like calling men unclean due to erections.
@@dynamicbree For the way god made them? Eve’s body was changed (in regards specifically to reproduction) as a result of her disobedience. Choices bring consequences.