Back in I think 2004, as a teenager I was burned and required medical attention from what was later found to be two bootleg grounds at an old theater in Dearborn MI while setting up for a rock gig. On stage me and my uncle were setting up the amplifiers, sound mixers, what have you, plugged into two different receptacles on the stage. As I plugged the cable from the mixer to the amp, there was a large flash, and the cable glowed bright orange for a second or so, caught fire and melted in two. About $1500 worth of our sound gear was destroyed. An independent investigation for insurance and liability purposes found every receptacle on the stage was bootleg grounded, some were correct polarity, others were reverse polarity and all the fuses in the panel serving the auditorium had been replaced with copper tubing, to make a bad situation worse. When I connected the sound gear plugged into different receptacles of correct and reverse polarity, this created a direct 120 volt short, with no fuse protection to cut off the power. The theater was about 80 years old at the time.
@@jeffbaca1173 yeah, terrifying was a bit of an understatement. For litigation purposes we settled with building owner's liability insurance , but if I remember correctly my uncle hired a licensed electrician out of pocket to investigate and document the unsafe conditions, and it was up to the owner's if they wanted to fork out the money to rectify the situations. There's no telling who Jerry rigged what over the years in a 1920s building, and it's possible the people responsible were long deceased. The fuse panels were of the old style with exposed bus bars, cartridge fuses and knife switch disconnects, and every fuse in that panel was ½ inch copper pipe, same situation with the main fuses outside at the meter.
I’ve been a master journeyman electrician for over 45 years and the second biggest issue here is somebody knows who did this work and they should be held accountable. They knew exactly what they were doing when they added those jumpers. Safety when I leave a job is absolutely paramount.
Given the history of historic theater venues, and their propensity for fire, and this is outright negligence. The Notre Dame Cathedral fire is suspected to have been caused by electrical fault.
I have one quibble with the statement "they knew exactly what they were doing." I met an older electrician who honestly thought this was an acceptable method.
@@TheQuark6789 No not at all 😀 and it does have a certain logic in that the _identified_ conductor (in the language of the CEC - it usually isn't a true neutral) and the bonding conductor are both connected to ground. On reflection I remembered that he only thought jumpering was an improvement to replacing the regular receptacle with a GFCI, not an acceptable fix by itself. Bridging bond and identified conductors is a no-no regardlss, but at least he had the basic corrective action right for situations where you can't get a bond to the receptacle.
Definitely is. Especially dangerous when bootleg grounds are used along with backstab connection devices, because this method although permitted with #14 solid copper wire ONLY, is not very reliable, almost every torched receptacle I've come across was backstabed and someone had been running a significant amount of current just before it failed, usually a space heater, and if the neutral upstream of a bootleg ground fails, the chassis of a 3 prong lamp or appliance becomes electrified and the device stops working. You then become the path to ground and could have deadly results depending on the conditions. Whereas if the neutral had failed on an open ground receptacle without a bootleg ground, the 3 pronged appliance would still stop working, but the chassis wouldn't become energized unless there was an internal failure.
@@dimitriberozny3729 yep, this is what we as "real" electricians vs "DIY" electricians (some of whom I wouldn't trust with a pair of wire strippers in their hand, let alone install wiring and devices😅) refer to as "Reverse Polarity Bootleg Ground "
@@Sparky-ww5re Not sure about where you are but here in Australia it's basically illegal to do any mains wiring or even running wires etc as the Electrician has to sign off on everything afterwards and supply a Certificate of compliance. Good luck with insurance if you have issues and you did the wiring yourself.
@@Sparky-ww5re DIYers are more likely to try and do it right by reading up on things. This is crap done by a fly by night electrician. Knows enough to jimmy the test device.
I don't agree it is a flipper. That is a code breaking reno. Flip is buy and sell. Calling this practice a flip is a bit misleading, even though I also accept this usage.
@@AshiStarshade Disagree. Flipping is to get money, firstly. It's close in sound and spelling to the word flippant, which also is a negative. There is the term flipping people off, as well. Flipping grossly inflates the housing market. Flipping already comes with a built in handicaps. Reno is done for more generalized improvement/change, including functionality. A poorly functioning home is hard to live with and defeats the purpose of redoing it.
Some electrical company did that in my house several years ago to a ton of new additions. New work boxes modified. Not the ones that have the recessed screw hole.
@@thomasperozze6810 Yeah man, I hear ya. I have seen “professionals” do all sorts of non-compliant things, across the trades. In reality some of these were very low-risk, but code is there for a reason. And if/when you go to sell, you don’t want to have to worry about this stuff being discovered, and then it’s back to the negotiating table.
@@joewoodchuck3824 Someone fished the box into the wall instead of pulling the sheetrock and using the two nail attachment points. The only way i'd come close to trusting the wiring if it had a real ground would be if the receptacle was wrapped with electrical tape.
Thanks for posting this important home inspection tip. Clearly you take pride in providing high quality service to your customers. From my experience far too many home inspectors do the bare minimum, choosing expediency over quality.
In a 1951 house , I added a dedicated ground when I bought a PC . I researched the gauge wire . I did use stranded wire because it was easier to run from the basement to the first floor where it needed to go . Great tip in your video .
Someone could make up a plug in tester to find those bootleg grounds without too much trouble. As wired, that outlet would have a almost zero resistance / dead short on it and no AC voltage between neutral and ground, but a properly wired and grounded outlet would have a higher resistance with some amount of AC voltage between the neutral and ground (maybe 1 volt or less, but it will have something to measure) due to the length of wire going back to the main breaker panel where the loop would be measured to. I never even thought of configuring a bootleg ground like that, and I was taught how to do household electrical wiring as a teenager by my father, who was a building maintenance engineer.
@Internutt2023 : They do make plug in circuit analyzers with digital readouts that will tell you if you have a bootleg ground. They are on the pricey side. A couple hundred bucks up to 1k. That aside. You already know this but, for those who don't. A cheap multi meter will tell you everything you need to know without taking receptacles apart. You should only check resistance between neutral and ground with the breaker off. A little plug in radio will help you find the breaker if nothing is labeled in the panel or a circuit breaker finder. Also a good idea to pick up a cheap little no contact voltage tester and double check the receptacle for voltage or you can just use the multi meter in AC mode checking for voltage. With the power off and with the multi meter in resistance mode, If it reads zero ohms or a 0.1 ohms reading between neutral and ground. It would be a dead giveaway of a bootleg ground. Good grounds read around 1 ohms (anything above 5 ohms would indicate a lose connection that needs addressed). A cheap multi meter is about 20 bucks and a no contact voltage tester is about 10 and a circuit breaker finder is about 20 though most people have a little plug in radio laying around. 20 to 50 bucks is a small investment for some peace of mind. Than again you can always splurge on the quick easy circuit analyzer but, if that's the case, just call an electrician who could also fix things while there. All that being said, anyone who installs a bootleg ground should be pummeled or worse. They are playing with others lives. Neutrals and grounds are bonded at the main service panel, not the receptacle. It's dangerous and potentially deadly.
The definition of a neutral or grounded conductor is that it has zero voltage potential between it and the ground itself. A gfci works by detecting the smallest micro voltage traveling the ground wire instead of neutral, At most you have the resistance of a longer home run, but since the ground is bonded to other home runs. That resistance would depend on the number of home runs, the number of pipes included and bonded to the grounded system, additional ground rods at sub panels, bonding to metal studs, bonded to metal ductwork. So sorry to burst your bubble. You at least are thinking, but need more education on grounding and bonding
@@jimonthecoast3234 l think he might have a point checking the resistance between ground and neutral, in theory there should be no resistance, but in practice the circuit all the way to the panel and back should show up greater than a two inch loop behind the outlet. A possibly better test might be to measure the capacitance of the wiring between the neutral and ground, but I'm not sure meters sensitive enough to read that low would tolerate the coupled noise in those lines well. Also, l thought GFCIs only look at the currents flowing in the live and neutral to make sure they are perfectly equal and opposite so that there is no leakage, but I'm only familiar with the remote ones, a central GFCI at the panel could be completely different for all l know
@@microwave221 in reality the path of least resistance. . if you double the conductors, resistance drops, ohms law and all. So the ground path, being bonded and grounded to all the other steel. Will have a much lower resistance than just two ungrounded conductors going back to the panel. I think the differences would be two small to pick up the bootleg. If it was, the tech exists to build it into a plug in tester. Anyways
They do. It's called a muti-meter. They are exponentially better than any little test device. They just don't have a convince factor or safety factor that the tester has. It's easier to just plug the tester in than jam two probes in the outlet while "telling" you if the polarity is right or not. And safer if you so happen to plug hot and ground due to incorrect wiring or probing the outlet incorrectly.
What you learn in a inspectors course will not make you competent to inspect electrical work. There is a course that teaches the National Electrical Code, a 1000 page book. It takes about 2 years of night school. An inspectors certification should require years working in the trades not a couple weeks in a class room. Sorry to he harsh but in my opinion it's way to easy to become an home inspector that people pay money to be experts.
Great advice and inspection. The flipper is going to be pissed, but that's too bad. Any buyer on a flipped house should have the house inspected before purchasing to avoid costly repairs.
@Ojja78 That's true and I agree with you, but this video was about a flipped house and shoddy repairs to that house to try and flip it and make as much of a profit as possible.
@@Ojja78 I did my inspection myself. But... I bought it at 27k with cash, so I knew what I was getting into, and I'm a gas tech w lots of general HVAC and framing/finishing experience. Even on a brand new home, the only thing I'd get an inspector for is if they had gear more valuable than what I cared to invest in.
I once got shocked by touching the rear of a computer at the network card while trying to diagnose a flaky network connection. Asked for multimeter, measured 240V from rear to heating pipes, and told them to get an electrician first. I now wonder if this was a reverse bootleg ground, or a missing ground + a case to hot fault. I also wonder why the ground on the ethernet wire did not cause a massive short to the next hub. Maybe it actually did and the ground wire in the cable melted (might have been 10base2 at the time)? I definitely can see how this would get flaky... but after that shock I could not continue, and did not know enough yet to diagnose wiring anyway.
If you plan on doing home inspections full time, I would recommend investing in some specialized tools. I use the Ideal 61-164 SureTest circuit analyzer. It will tell me if there’s a bootleg ground. It’s not cheap at around $420.00, but it will also tell you how strong/week a gfci is. You can get false positives if the outlet is close to the panel and it takes longer (7 seconds) per socket than the Klein RT250 used in this video.
Good catch, I own/operate an inspection company in Florida and I do the same thing, I start finding some shady stuff or apparent attempts to conceal, I can get a little invasive too. Sometimes it's for naught, but occasionally I'll find stuff like this too. Usually if you see in the panel that the ground wires are largely missing (older home) and all the receptacles are 3 prong and grounded, I'll pull a few covers off and check to see how they got the ground there. Well done sir. We aren't here to make friends with scumbags. I find most flippers here in Florida would conceal just about anything. I really am starting to dislike inspecting flips because after 25 years I get tired of ruining peoples day constantly. But, it's the job.
I heard horror stories and seen some horrific things done to building in Florida. My grandma used to live in New Port Richey, Tampa area, and it is like the wild west out there for contractors.
This is why I use a $400 tester on my Inspections. Saves me from having to take apart every outlet and will call out a false ground. This is definitely a safety hazard. Great find!! 💪😎
The dry wall screws holding the blue plastic box worry me more. I nearly got electrocuted because the wiring of the plug was touching screws. No electrical tape around the plug in to keep it from touching
@@mxslick50Doubtful. Too much inductive impedance to hold voltage to cause a load that would yield any harm. Additionally the moisture would have to track from the hot to the screw then you would have to touch the screw somehow behind the box without the screw tracking to ground causing a dead short which would trip the breaker via fault current. That’s a common practice with plastic boxes and approved within the NEC. I hope you’re not feeding that bullshit to anyone you know. I’m an EE but if you’re an electrician, you should know that without question.
@@thomasloveless4800 And as an EE you know nothing about real world conditions and the REALITY of how current travels. First off, in moist tile the the impedance would be RESISTIVE, NOT inductive. (Is tile a magnetic coil? I hope you know it is not.) Second, in a situation without a proper grounding conductor in place, moisture will easily cause tracking from the hot screw, over the plastic of the device, to the metal yoke (which would in most cases be in direct contact with the tile. ) The only BS is your post trying to come off intelligent and throwing your degree around. I have been an electrician for over 45 years, in all settings, and have personally witnessed and measured several instances of shock occurring due to the very situation I posted about. So take your misinformation and use it somewhere else, because you are dead wrong here.
@@mxslick50 You need to go to a lab brother. No way you’re tracking voltage from a drywall screw to a person unless you have a major plumbing leak that somehow doesn’t trip that breaker through overload or fault current. My Dad was an electrician and got his card in 74’. He used screws for plastic boxes all the time. The impedance of the inductor is reactive, hence my comment which re-reading your comment, that’s what you’re saying. I’m not even sure we’re disagreeing.
While I would be reasonably certain that box isn't intended to be mounted that way, Southwire has some that are intended for replacement/retrofit applications that do screw in the studs from inside the box. They were very helpful when I was needing to replace old metal switchboxes with bigger single gang boxes big enough for larger electronic controls
You're right and the flipper can do it themselves. Less work and safe. My parent's house has old wiring and a low cost gfci at the first outlet in a branch is enough. Didn't the flipper replace the receptacles anyway?
A quick and easy way to determine if the bootleg ground has been installed is to use a multimeter. Probe the ground plug, then touch the screw that affixes the cover plate. There should be continuity. Then probe the neutral and touch the cover plate screw. There should be no continuity. if it's present, the ground is boot legged.
@@chrisanthony579 That does require taking the panel cover off and it won't tell you if an outlet is hooked up correctly if you saw ground wires. But it's certainly a good way to see if grounds are run at all.
Not exactly. Even on a PROPERLY grounded circuit you will still have continuity between the ground hole and the neutral slot because the neutral and ground are bonded in the main panel ONLY. There is, however a tester that checks the impedance between neutral and ground at an outlet and flashes an "F" over the ground on the display when this impedance is lower than a certain threshold eg. jumper between neutral and ground screws, it's the Ideal 61-164 l SureTest Circuit Analyzer and it costs about $430. Aside from buying this expensive tester or pulling every coverplate, you can usually spot a bootleg ground outlet by practicing situation awareness around the entire house. A mix of 2 prong and "correctly wired " 3 prong outlets, and/or the presence of old cloth sheathed wiring visible in unfinished basements/crawlspaces or attics is a strong indicator of bootleg grounds.
You can find these easier with the Ideal circuit analyzer as it can detect bootleg grounds without having to pull outlets. The analyzer checks circuit impedance on each conductor and can easily identify issues beyond just bootleg grounds; the meter can also check fault currents and voltage drop along with GFCIs.
Depends on the age of the home. This is probably an older two-wire house with no ground. I don't know what other reason there would be for using the neutral, but I have seen it a lot in kitchens and bathroom to get GFCI breakers to work.
Purchased a 100 year old farmhouse on acreage South of Seattle 5 years ago. Found Romex throughout except for a few hard to reach areas still had knob and tube. Tester said grounded but I was skeptical so I pulled a couple receptacles and found the jumper wire. I'm no electrician, inspector or contractor so I googled it later and discover it was called 'bootleg'. When I saw the thumbnail and read the title, I knew exactly what this was about. I immediately checked with the planning department online for any permits issued for new work recently done. There weren't any. Anyone purchasing a home that could be classified as a 'flip should check for permits issued for recent work. Has a room been opened up by removing walls? Have new electrical fixtures throughout been installed by a DIYer or professional? New deck, balcony or covered porch?
In my country only electricians are allowed to do electrical work on your house, as you require a certificate from them to even get insurance let alone sell the property. That’s one thing I don’t mess around with is something that can kill me in my sleep by fire, or electrocute someone, we use 240v here.
Getting an electrician won't necessarily save you from people trying to save time and money like this. That also makes construction a lot more expensive
To make the gfci work correct you can run a ground wire from the next closest circuit and just connect it to that outlet. And since it is only a ground wire you can sneak it around easier.
There are testers that can detect these situations. What it does is measure the resistance on the ground to neutral and if it is too low it will give an indication.
If your panel is bonded it all goes to the same place, most people can’t afford to rewire their entire house that was built before 12/2 w/ ground romex existed. Poor Man’s ground is not dangerous at all
This can be found with a hair dryer. With the hair dryer running, measuring between neutral and ground on the other outlet. If it reads 0, you have a bootleg ground.
I have been doing renovations for 30+ years, 2 prong receptacles are available (Menards and others) and should be used with an ungrounded system. To be honest, very few appliances actually have a grounded plug anyway. The bootleg ground is not only to fool the inspector, but because 2 prong receptacles may not be readily available. And yes, it is very dangerous.
That's interesting. I am not an electrician, merely dabble with small electronics in my spare time. I would like to know a few things if you would? 1. The ground is normally bonded to the neutral at the breaker or distribution box, right? 2. That "bootleg ground" is also tied to the neutral? 3. What's the difference between tying in there or at the box? Thanks for helping me understand why this is so bad!
When your roughing in a house, it can be very tempting to do this when installing the box between a pack of studs when enough space for the box to fit, or in a corner such that it is very difficult or impossible to swing a hammer and use the mounting nails that were provided by the manufacturer. The problem is making an in the field alteration voids the UL listing on the box, and is against code. The proper way to handle a situation like this would be an adjustable box with a bracket that mounts to the front of the studs with wood screws.
Got to love the drywall screws in the side of the box. Odds are all the work done on this flip were done without a permit. ALWAYS hire a home inspector, regardless if it is brand new or 100 years old.
In a former house, I had an electrician wire in a "bootleg" ground. Funny thing is that the ground was available! I caught it when I did my own inspection.
An ultra low resistance between neutral and ground at the receptacle would be a giveaway. Depending on distance from main panel, you should see at least a few ohms there. Outlet test equipment should be made to indicate that a potential 'bootleg' exists.
This would only work if your distribution panel is bonded. I know my main panel is not bonded and that was by code here in Ontario Canada. It was also passed by the Electrical Safety Authority
The problem here is if the white wire gets broken anywhere back to the main panel, then a 3 prong device plugged into the outlet and turned on (it won't come on) will have 120 volts on the outside grounded parts of it. Makes it an electrocution risk.
I would like to know what the other end of that romex ground was doing. That has a ground wire in it, and I bet they cut it off. Even in my last home that was built in 1937, the cloth covered wiring (We'll call it Romex for practical purposes) had a thin ground that was run to each metal box in the house, and attached to a screw in the box. Not a "Ground Screw" , although that did ground the box, and subsequently the device screws did ground the devices if the frame and ground were contiguous. Updated devices made sure of that.
I first saw those screws on the side of the box that the outlet could contact (vs getting the right rype ofvrework box or making a bigger hole to screw it to the stud properly--but wow, another reason to not check for permits & hire detailed inspectors like yourself!
You missed the part where they screwed the box into the stud. The IEC clearly states that you cannot modify an electrical box in any way and putting a non-bonded/non-grounded screw through the wall of the box, on the the hot side of the circuit is a good way to get someone hurt or killed.
Wow! As an electrician, with tons of different experience, I thought I had seen it all! I have never seen an outlet wired like that with a jumper from neutral to ground... that's ridiculous!
What happens when you connect ground to the third rail but in between that connection, you place a tyrant? Will it smoke or will the tyrant pop and act like a fuse? Asking for a friend.
Unless you do a complete remodel you are not required by the NEC to update to a 3 wire with ground. If the "flipper" just bought the place painted and put in new outlets and switches this home inspector legally can't tell the seller to update it. I am a home inspector as well as a licensed electrician I run into home inspectors all over the place that have no idea what they are telling people to do. Be very careful what home inspectors you hire most of them were never in the HVAC, Plumbing, Construction, or electrical field working!
Important Note! What IS and NOT allowed varies from state to state AND county to county within one state! Hopefully the home inspection sharing this experience... is because 3 ground wiring is REQUIRED upon remodeling the given home/house! Wow! 🍀🙀🌟 😇
Never mind the fact that all of the outlets have been upgraded to three prong...especially the one with no ground which gives it the appearance of a grounded outlet. Having doubts as to your claim of being a home inspector lol...
Sometimes the buyer insists on updated wiring. So even if you can’t be forced to update, you may find it harder to sell or maybe you’ll have to sell at lower price.
If the inspection is being done during the due diligence phase of a home sale, the buyer can back out for any reason. The seller doesn’t HAVE to fix anything. The buyer can do a contract addendum for the repairs and the seller can chose to accept, reject, or counter the contract. In my market, some people have been requiring a non-refundable deposit on top of the refundable one. You would likely lose that unless you specify that all electrical must be up to code, etc in the original contract.
i don't understand the problem, myself. the ground and neutral are the same thing in the box. It honestly seems like a waste of copper to have two wires running to it. The only reason that could make any sense is to force a sort of quasi-polarity wherein you don't accidentally connect the casing to hot, but it's not hard to figure out which one that is.
If the state this house is in has adopted any recent cycle of the NEC the kitchen counter receptacles should be GFCI protected already. Also, the screws through the side of the box are a code violation.
Wow... I have never seen that before, and I have worked in a lot of renovated older homes. Its three wires in the wire they used, why would you not home run it back to the box?
This isn't simply a safety hazard - it's a FIRE HAZARD!! I've done renovations for more than thirty years but I never thought of doing this myself nor would I encourage anyone else to do it either.
I'm a general handyman. Get called out to a lot of flips and owner-remodeled homes. Electrical problems is the number one reason, after leaking plumbing. Never heard about bootleg grounds, never would do one. Better to be honest than to be liable.
Now lots more people know. I learned this hack years ago from a licensed electrician. I would never ever do something so stupid. I have fixed a bunch of these on Section 8 houses because they fail for open ground. The property managers just can’t understand that the building built in the 50s does not have a ground wire so yes you have an “open ground”.
1:35 "That would protect a person but not any equipment". Explain how it would protect a person, or why you think we have a separate ground wire from a neutral when they are bonded at the circuit breaker box typically? I'm trying to figure out how minimal your understanding of electricity is.
@@sylviaisgod6947 You are correct that there are videos you could watch. Obviously if you didn't understand my comment which was in simple English, you wouldn't understand any concepts regarding electricity without more education.
It does make a difference. They are only bonded at the service. Neutral is a current carrying conductor. It completes the circuit with the hot. Ground, under normal operation, carries no current.
@@i2rtw it doesn't matter where they are bonded it's still going to the same place. For years this has been the case and the fact that code requires they be separated is a facade and it always has been.
@@i2rtw Exactly right. The danger is that neutral becomes disconnected upstream. The downstream neutral will then become energized through the various loads connected to it which will in turn energize the metal chassis of the various appliances in the downstream section. This is a VERY dangerous practice.
" This Flipper " , with a picture of a wall socket hanging out, I thought it as a joke/prank wall socket that would retract back into the wall when Dad, Mum whoever had shouted at someone - I was wrong. I'm from Northern Ireland.
Was that Romex going to the outlet? It looked like 14 gauge romex (because of the white color of the sheathing) to me. if it was modern Romex it would have a ground wire. There was a kind of two wire NM cable used 50 years ago or so but it didn't look like that. If it was 14 gauge would that be a violation for kitchen receptacles?
It would only be a violation if they were 20AMP receptacles. If there was a separate branch supplying one or more 15AMP kitchen receptacles then I believe it would be legal. Disclaimer: I am not a licensed electrician.
I'ts amazing that the homes that have knob and tube wiring and fuses that were wired 100 years ago are still standing. Of course that's before we had (inspectors????)
My father, and electrical engineer of over 40 years standing, told me about “bootleg grounds.” In an otherwise properly wired house they are not necessarily unsafe. They’re just a quick and easy way of adding a three-pronged grounded outlet to a properly wired two-wire leg.
Please explain the risk. The neutral and ground are bonded at the panel regardless. So long as the hot and neutral are not swapped incorrectly at the plug, I see no risk.
The risk is that one connects the wire to the hot wire and not to the neutral creating a reverse bootleg ground. This might also happen if the wires are later reversed which could happen with knob and tube. Also there is a risk if the neutral breaks. It also causes stray currents that can cause various kind of interference on data cables.
That's to code only if there are only 240-volt systems in the appliance. Most new dryers and ovens/ranges have both, therefore, a 4-wire setup is used.
@@jamesplotkin4674 I've seen an appliance that allowed the white wire and the green wire to be connected in order to enable attachment of a 3 prong cord to accommodate a 3 prong receptacle. I thought the reasoning was that there would be very little current on the grounding wire and it would be for a limited time.
YES! That looks like a major renovation and likely no building permits obtained. That building inspector (the real one) could make them open up walls and ceilings.
I got bolted by 460 hot wire connected to a ground during construction. Knocked out all the lights on that circuit. Went in my fingers (through gloves) and out my elbow. Burning red circle on back of my elbow. I was pissed off but not pissed on. Key advice:Don’t be scared of electricity. Be respectful and SMART. This ‘flipper’ was none of them. Not scared, respectful or smart.
I would think that a bootleg ground will only work if the branch circuit comes from a meter main combo where the neutral and ground is connected to the same bar
Back in I think 2004, as a teenager I was burned and required medical attention from what was later found to be two bootleg grounds at an old theater in Dearborn MI while setting up for a rock gig. On stage me and my uncle were setting up the amplifiers, sound mixers, what have you, plugged into two different receptacles on the stage. As I plugged the cable from the mixer to the amp, there was a large flash, and the cable glowed bright orange for a second or so, caught fire and melted in two. About $1500 worth of our sound gear was destroyed. An independent investigation for insurance and liability purposes found every receptacle on the stage was bootleg grounded, some were correct polarity, others were reverse polarity and all the fuses in the panel serving the auditorium had been replaced with copper tubing, to make a bad situation worse. When I connected the sound gear plugged into different receptacles of correct and reverse polarity, this created a direct 120 volt short, with no fuse protection to cut off the power. The theater was about 80 years old at the time.
That is wild. Glad you're around to tell the story.
AC has no polarity. Lines are either hot, neutral, or ground.
@@jordanrelkey He means hot and neutral reverse.
That must have been terrifying, of course there’s no way to track down the company who won the bid, glad you’re alright.
@@jeffbaca1173 yeah, terrifying was a bit of an understatement. For litigation purposes we settled with building owner's liability insurance , but if I remember correctly my uncle hired a licensed electrician out of pocket to investigate and document the unsafe conditions, and it was up to the owner's if they wanted to fork out the money to rectify the situations. There's no telling who Jerry rigged what over the years in a 1920s building, and it's possible the people responsible were long deceased. The fuse panels were of the old style with exposed bus bars, cartridge fuses and knife switch disconnects, and every fuse in that panel was ½ inch copper pipe, same situation with the main fuses outside at the meter.
You danced around that *so much* without calling the spade a spade: it's *fraud.*
I’ve been a master journeyman electrician for over 45 years and the second biggest issue here is somebody knows who did this work and they should be held accountable. They knew exactly what they were doing when they added those jumpers. Safety when I leave a job is absolutely paramount.
Amen brother, this kinda thing scares the hell out of me. Lord know what else they did around that home
Given the history of historic theater venues, and their propensity for fire, and this is outright negligence.
The Notre Dame Cathedral fire is suspected to have been caused by electrical fault.
I have one quibble with the statement "they knew exactly what they were doing." I met an older electrician who honestly thought this was an acceptable method.
@@civildiscourse2000 Does that electrician think the third wire is just there to waste money?!
@@TheQuark6789 No not at all 😀 and it does have a certain logic in that the _identified_ conductor (in the language of the CEC - it usually isn't a true neutral) and the bonding conductor are both connected to ground.
On reflection I remembered that he only thought jumpering was an improvement to replacing the regular receptacle with a GFCI, not an acceptable fix by itself. Bridging bond and identified conductors is a no-no regardlss, but at least he had the basic corrective action right for situations where you can't get a bond to the receptacle.
A bootleg ground is way more dangerous than no ground at all.
Definitely is. Especially dangerous when bootleg grounds are used along with backstab connection devices, because this method although permitted with #14 solid copper wire ONLY, is not very reliable, almost every torched receptacle I've come across was backstabed and someone had been running a significant amount of current just before it failed, usually a space heater, and if the neutral upstream of a bootleg ground fails, the chassis of a 3 prong lamp or appliance becomes electrified and the device stops working. You then become the path to ground and could have deadly results depending on the conditions. Whereas if the neutral had failed on an open ground receptacle without a bootleg ground, the 3 pronged appliance would still stop working, but the chassis wouldn't become energized unless there was an internal failure.
Also if you have a reversed hot/neutral upstream or downstream you have a shock/electrocution hazard by doing this!!!
@@dimitriberozny3729 yep, this is what we as "real" electricians vs "DIY" electricians (some of whom I wouldn't trust with a pair of wire strippers in their hand, let alone install wiring and devices😅) refer to as "Reverse Polarity Bootleg Ground "
@@Sparky-ww5re Not sure about where you are but here in Australia it's basically illegal to do any mains wiring or even running wires etc as the Electrician has to sign off on everything afterwards and supply a Certificate of compliance.
Good luck with insurance if you have issues and you did the wiring yourself.
@@Sparky-ww5re DIYers are more likely to try and do it right by reading up on things. This is crap done by a fly by night electrician. Knows enough to jimmy the test device.
glad you caught it for the sake of future buyers. Great inspector.
A flipper is exactly the best term. It's all about speed and flash. Different from a reno.
Zero need to make up new terms...
I don't agree it is a flipper. That is a code breaking reno. Flip is buy and sell. Calling this practice a flip is a bit misleading, even though I also accept this usage.
@@AshiStarshade
Disagree. Flipping is to get money, firstly. It's close in sound and spelling to the word flippant, which also is a negative. There is the term flipping people off, as well.
Flipping grossly inflates the housing market. Flipping already comes with a built in handicaps.
Reno is done for more generalized improvement/change, including functionality. A poorly functioning home is hard to live with and defeats the purpose of redoing it.
Isn't that what he said in the video?
Motherflippers!
I also see they added that box by driving a wood screw from the inside, which is modification of a device and is against code.
Some electrical company did that in my house several years ago to a ton of new additions. New work boxes modified. Not the ones that have the recessed screw hole.
@@thomasperozze6810 Yeah man, I hear ya. I have seen “professionals” do all sorts of non-compliant things, across the trades. In reality some of these were very low-risk, but code is there for a reason. And if/when you go to sell, you don’t want to have to worry about this stuff being discovered, and then it’s back to the negotiating table.
What's wrong with a wood screw to make it more stable?
There’s nothing wrong with that screw its an old work box that the ears didn’t catch so a screw is actually better than the whole box falling out
@@joewoodchuck3824
Someone fished the box into the wall instead of pulling the sheetrock and using the two nail attachment points.
The only way i'd come close to trusting the wiring if it had a real ground would be if the receptacle was wrapped with electrical tape.
What a joke of a receptacle install! Glad that we have reputable electricians to point out stupid mistakes! Good job pointing that out sir!👍
I use an Ideal circuit analyzer that detects bootleg grounds.
Can I ask which model you have? I was on the Ideal website looking at the receptacle testers but the info isn’t great.
Link or model number please!
@@mattwaters6987 Ideal 61-164 is what I have. The newer 61-165 includes AFCI testing.
How much did it cost?
@@mattdude I found mine for an excellent deal on CPO's website, think about $130.
Thanks for posting this important home inspection tip. Clearly you take pride in providing high quality service to your customers. From my experience far too many home inspectors do the bare minimum, choosing expediency over quality.
I’ve never met a home inspector that looks inside walls or receptacles.
Nice catch. I wish more home inspectors were as thorough as you.
In a 1951 house , I added a dedicated ground when I bought a PC . I researched the gauge wire . I did use stranded wire because it was easier to run from the basement to the first floor where it needed to go . Great tip in your video .
Someone could make up a plug in tester to find those bootleg grounds without too much trouble. As wired, that outlet would have a almost zero resistance / dead short on it and no AC voltage between neutral and ground, but a properly wired and grounded outlet would have a higher resistance with some amount of AC voltage between the neutral and ground (maybe 1 volt or less, but it will have something to measure) due to the length of wire going back to the main breaker panel where the loop would be measured to. I never even thought of configuring a bootleg ground like that, and I was taught how to do household electrical wiring as a teenager by my father, who was a building maintenance engineer.
@Internutt2023 : They do make plug in circuit analyzers with digital readouts that will tell you if you have a bootleg ground. They are on the pricey side. A couple hundred bucks up to 1k. That aside. You already know this but, for those who don't. A cheap multi meter will tell you everything you need to know without taking receptacles apart. You should only check resistance between neutral and ground with the breaker off. A little plug in radio will help you find the breaker if nothing is labeled in the panel or a circuit breaker finder. Also a good idea to pick up a cheap little no contact voltage tester and double check the receptacle for voltage or you can just use the multi meter in AC mode checking for voltage. With the power off and with the multi meter in resistance mode, If it reads zero ohms or a 0.1 ohms reading between neutral and ground. It would be a dead giveaway of a bootleg ground. Good grounds read around 1 ohms (anything above 5 ohms would indicate a lose connection that needs addressed). A cheap multi meter is about 20 bucks and a no contact voltage tester is about 10 and a circuit breaker finder is about 20 though most people have a little plug in radio laying around. 20 to 50 bucks is a small investment for some peace of mind. Than again you can always splurge on the quick easy circuit analyzer but, if that's the case, just call an electrician who could also fix things while there. All that being said, anyone who installs a bootleg ground should be pummeled or worse. They are playing with others lives. Neutrals and grounds are bonded at the main service panel, not the receptacle. It's dangerous and potentially deadly.
The definition of a neutral or grounded conductor is that it has zero voltage potential between it and the ground itself. A gfci works by detecting the smallest micro voltage traveling the ground wire instead of neutral,
At most you have the resistance of a longer home run, but since the ground is bonded to other home runs. That resistance would depend on the number of home runs, the number of pipes included and bonded to the grounded system, additional ground rods at sub panels, bonding to metal studs, bonded to metal ductwork.
So sorry to burst your bubble. You at least are thinking, but need more education on grounding and bonding
@@jimonthecoast3234 l think he might have a point checking the resistance between ground and neutral, in theory there should be no resistance, but in practice the circuit all the way to the panel and back should show up greater than a two inch loop behind the outlet. A possibly better test might be to measure the capacitance of the wiring between the neutral and ground, but I'm not sure meters sensitive enough to read that low would tolerate the coupled noise in those lines well.
Also, l thought GFCIs only look at the currents flowing in the live and neutral to make sure they are perfectly equal and opposite so that there is no leakage, but I'm only familiar with the remote ones, a central GFCI at the panel could be completely different for all l know
@@microwave221 in reality the path of least resistance. . if you double the conductors, resistance drops, ohms law and all. So the ground path, being bonded and grounded to all the other steel. Will have a much lower resistance than just two ungrounded conductors going back to the panel.
I think the differences would be two small to pick up the bootleg. If it was, the tech exists to build it into a plug in tester. Anyways
They do. It's called a muti-meter. They are exponentially better than any little test device. They just don't have a convince factor or safety factor that the tester has. It's easier to just plug the tester in than jam two probes in the outlet while "telling" you if the polarity is right or not. And safer if you so happen to plug hot and ground due to incorrect wiring or probing the outlet incorrectly.
Shady?! It ought to be 100% illegal. Finding one should damn the entire flip.
And incur substantial fines.
It is. The flipper broke the law and didn't clearly didn't obtain a building permit.
Currently going through the electrical portion of my inspectors certification course. Super helpful finding to share!
What you learn in a inspectors course will not make you competent to inspect electrical work. There is a course that teaches the National Electrical Code, a 1000 page book. It takes about 2 years of night school. An inspectors certification should require years working in the trades not a couple weeks in a class room. Sorry to he harsh but in my opinion it's way to easy to become an home inspector that people pay money to be experts.
Lmfao.
Great advice and inspection. The flipper is going to be pissed, but that's too bad. Any buyer on a flipped house should have the house inspected before purchasing to avoid costly repairs.
You should have inspections done on ANY house you're buying. Jeez. Are you only inspecting flips? That's idiotic.
@@Ojja78 Flips should be under more scrutiny than houses that have been lived in and people are just relocating.
@Ojja78 That's true and I agree with you, but this video was about a flipped house and shoddy repairs to that house to try and flip it and make as much of a profit as possible.
@@Ojja78
I did my inspection myself.
But... I bought it at 27k with cash, so I knew what I was getting into, and I'm a gas tech w lots of general HVAC and framing/finishing experience.
Even on a brand new home, the only thing I'd get an inspector for is if they had gear more valuable than what I cared to invest in.
@@Jeff-xy7fv and?
I once got shocked by touching the rear of a computer at the network card while trying to diagnose a flaky network connection. Asked for multimeter, measured 240V from rear to heating pipes, and told them to get an electrician first.
I now wonder if this was a reverse bootleg ground, or a missing ground + a case to hot fault.
I also wonder why the ground on the ethernet wire did not cause a massive short to the next hub.
Maybe it actually did and the ground wire in the cable melted (might have been 10base2 at the time)? I definitely can see how this would get flaky... but after that shock I could not continue, and did not know enough yet to diagnose wiring anyway.
If you plan on doing home inspections full time, I would recommend investing in some specialized tools. I use the Ideal 61-164 SureTest circuit analyzer. It will tell me if there’s a bootleg ground. It’s not cheap at around $420.00, but it will also tell you how strong/week a gfci is.
You can get false positives if the outlet is close to the panel and it takes longer (7 seconds) per socket than the Klein RT250 used in this video.
Good catch thats freaking wild
Good catch, I own/operate an inspection company in Florida and I do the same thing, I start finding some shady stuff or apparent attempts to conceal, I can get a little invasive too. Sometimes it's for naught, but occasionally I'll find stuff like this too. Usually if you see in the panel that the ground wires are largely missing (older home) and all the receptacles are 3 prong and grounded, I'll pull a few covers off and check to see how they got the ground there. Well done sir. We aren't here to make friends with scumbags. I find most flippers here in Florida would conceal just about anything. I really am starting to dislike inspecting flips because after 25 years I get tired of ruining peoples day constantly. But, it's the job.
You aren't' just protecting people from buying a lemon, you are quite possibly saving someone's life. Building codes exist for a reason.
I heard horror stories and seen some horrific things done to building in Florida. My grandma used to live in New Port Richey, Tampa area, and it is like the wild west out there for contractors.
This is why I use a $400 tester on my Inspections. Saves me from having to take apart every outlet and will call out a false ground. This is definitely a safety hazard. Great find!! 💪😎
The dry wall screws holding the blue plastic box worry me more. I nearly got electrocuted because the wiring of the plug was touching screws. No electrical tape around the plug in to keep it from touching
@Ed-ds3hjWrong, tile holds moisture and WILL conduct quite nicely.
@@mxslick50Doubtful. Too much inductive impedance to hold voltage to cause a load that would yield any harm. Additionally the moisture would have to track from the hot to the screw then you would have to touch the screw somehow behind the box without the screw tracking to ground causing a dead short which would trip the breaker via fault current. That’s a common practice with plastic boxes and approved within the NEC. I hope you’re not feeding that bullshit to anyone you know. I’m an EE but if you’re an electrician, you should know that without question.
@@thomasloveless4800 And as an EE you know nothing about real world conditions and the REALITY of how current travels. First off, in moist tile the the impedance would be RESISTIVE, NOT inductive. (Is tile a magnetic coil? I hope you know it is not.) Second, in a situation without a proper grounding conductor in place, moisture will easily cause tracking from the hot screw, over the plastic of the device, to the metal yoke (which would in most cases be in direct contact with the tile. ) The only BS is your post trying to come off intelligent and throwing your degree around. I have been an electrician for over 45 years, in all settings, and have personally witnessed and measured several instances of shock occurring due to the very situation I posted about. So take your misinformation and use it somewhere else, because you are dead wrong here.
@@mxslick50 You need to go to a lab brother. No way you’re tracking voltage from a drywall screw to a person unless you have a major plumbing leak that somehow doesn’t trip that breaker through overload or fault current. My Dad was an electrician and got his card in 74’. He used screws for plastic boxes all the time. The impedance of the inductor is reactive, hence my comment which re-reading your comment, that’s what you’re saying. I’m not even sure we’re disagreeing.
@@mxslick50 You have no idea what you're talking about. Water is a very poor conductor of electricity.
Plus box has screws through the side
While I would be reasonably certain that box isn't intended to be mounted that way, Southwire has some that are intended for replacement/retrofit applications that do screw in the studs from inside the box. They were very helpful when I was needing to replace old metal switchboxes with bigger single gang boxes big enough for larger electronic controls
@@kc8ufv right those are intended to mount that way. and have recessed holes for screws that box in no way meets code or is acceptable
Shady is when no one gets hurt. This is criminal endangerment. It's manslaughter if someone is killed because of that.
A electrician can add a GFCI outlet to the line instead of rewiring all the outlets. Like the inspector said.
Plain receptacle: $2. GFCI receptacle: $25. I know which one a flipper will choose.
@petemaynard A 15 Amp is not that expensive if bought in bulk. $5-$7, way less than the profit on a flip.
@@petemaynard Yeah, but those countertop outlets need to be GFCI anyway.
You're right and the flipper can do it themselves. Less work and safe. My parent's house has old wiring and a low cost gfci at the first outlet in a branch is enough. Didn't the flipper replace the receptacles anyway?
you just taught a lot of us how to get around the annoying part of the job, so everyone gives thanks for the free lesson
I hope you don't flip houses; you can't even form a proper sentence.
A quick and easy way to determine if the bootleg ground has been installed is to use a multimeter. Probe the ground plug, then touch the screw that affixes the cover plate. There should be continuity. Then probe the neutral and touch the cover plate screw. There should be no continuity. if it's present, the ground is boot legged.
Simply looking at the fuse box would be the first indication the building isn't a grounded
@@chrisanthony579 That does require taking the panel cover off and it won't tell you if an outlet is hooked up correctly if you saw ground wires. But it's certainly a good way to see if grounds are run at all.
Incorrect, it will be a loop as the neutral bar is grounded in the main panel. A neutral is a grounded current carrying conductor.
Not exactly. Even on a PROPERLY grounded circuit you will still have continuity between the ground hole and the neutral slot because the neutral and ground are bonded in the main panel ONLY. There is, however a tester that checks the impedance between neutral and ground at an outlet and flashes an "F" over the ground on the display when this impedance is lower than a certain threshold eg. jumper between neutral and ground screws, it's the Ideal 61-164 l SureTest Circuit Analyzer and it costs about $430.
Aside from buying this expensive tester or pulling every coverplate, you can usually spot a bootleg ground outlet by practicing situation awareness around the entire house. A mix of 2 prong and "correctly wired " 3 prong outlets, and/or the presence of old cloth sheathed wiring visible in unfinished basements/crawlspaces or attics is a strong indicator of bootleg grounds.
You can find these easier with the Ideal circuit analyzer as it can detect bootleg grounds without having to pull outlets. The analyzer checks circuit impedance on each conductor and can easily identify issues beyond just bootleg grounds; the meter can also check fault currents and voltage drop along with GFCIs.
Here in ms if the house is old and no ground was originally wired in you can just use two prong outlets or do the gfci route
Thanks! I was wondering how I was gonna fix the ground problem in the house I’m selling. You just saved me lots of money.
Nice video and amazing job by the Coast Guard. Amazing as there is no ice to be seen here in Cleveland. Home port of the Neah Bay.
Depends on the age of the home. This is probably an older two-wire house with no ground. I don't know what other reason there would be for using the neutral, but I have seen it a lot in kitchens and bathroom to get GFCI breakers to work.
@romanfields7900 GFCI's do NOT need a ground to work properly.
Purchased a 100 year old farmhouse on acreage South of Seattle 5 years ago. Found Romex throughout except for a few hard to reach areas still had knob and tube. Tester said grounded but I was skeptical so I pulled a couple receptacles and found the jumper wire. I'm no electrician, inspector or contractor so I googled it later and discover it was called 'bootleg'. When I saw the thumbnail and read the title, I knew exactly what this was about. I immediately checked with the planning department online for any permits issued for new work recently done. There weren't any. Anyone purchasing a home that could be classified as a 'flip should check for permits issued for recent work. Has a room been opened up by removing walls? Have new electrical fixtures throughout been installed by a DIYer or professional? New deck, balcony or covered porch?
In my country only electricians are allowed to do electrical work on your house, as you require a certificate from them to even get insurance let alone sell the property. That’s one thing I don’t mess around with is something that can kill me in my sleep by fire, or electrocute someone, we use 240v here.
Getting an electrician won't necessarily save you from people trying to save time and money like this. That also makes construction a lot more expensive
To make the gfci work correct you can run a ground wire from the next closest circuit and just connect it to that outlet. And since it is only a ground wire you can sneak it around easier.
There are testers that can detect these situations. What it does is measure the resistance on the ground to neutral and if it is too low it will give an indication.
If your panel is bonded it all goes to the same place, most people can’t afford to rewire their entire house that was built before 12/2 w/ ground romex existed. Poor Man’s ground is not dangerous at all
Good stuff. Greetings from a Detroit home inspector.
This can be found with a hair dryer.
With the hair dryer running, measuring between neutral and ground on the other outlet.
If it reads 0, you have a bootleg ground.
I have been doing renovations for 30+ years, 2 prong receptacles are available (Menards and others) and should be used with an ungrounded system. To be honest, very few appliances actually have a grounded plug anyway. The bootleg ground is not only to fool the inspector, but because 2 prong receptacles may not be readily available. And yes, it is very dangerous.
Another reason is 2-prong outlets are more expensive than grounded outlets, I guess that's because they don't make as many?
That's interesting. I am not an electrician, merely dabble with small electronics in my spare time. I would like to know a few things if you would?
1. The ground is normally bonded to the neutral at the breaker or distribution box, right?
2. That "bootleg ground" is also tied to the neutral?
3. What's the difference between tying in there or at the box?
Thanks for helping me understand why this is so bad!
Can't use the mounting screws to the stud inside the box.
When your roughing in a house, it can be very tempting to do this when installing the box between a pack of studs when enough space for the box to fit, or in a corner such that it is very difficult or impossible to swing a hammer and use the mounting nails that were provided by the manufacturer. The problem is making an in the field alteration voids the UL listing on the box, and is against code. The proper way to handle a situation like this would be an adjustable box with a bracket that mounts to the front of the studs with wood screws.
This reminds me of the place.I used to work.They made a special ground rod and nailed it to the bottom of the telephone pole to fool inspector.
People are scumbags.
Especially when Money matters. (Stolen money that is).
You can bet they had no intention to remove this wiring when the house sold
Got to love the drywall screws in the side of the box. Odds are all the work done on this flip were done without a permit. ALWAYS hire a home inspector, regardless if it is brand new or 100 years old.
Worked at a complex did stuff like this all the time. That’s what I started taking out every outlet and changing them all.
Very entertaining and fun to watch. Thanks for posting this.
There are testers that show the voltage, including between zero and ground, and then a violation of the socket without opening will be visible
In a former house, I had an electrician wire in a "bootleg" ground. Funny thing is that the ground was available! I caught it when I did my own inspection.
I can't believe there are so many rules that prevent inspectors from exposing dangers
An ultra low resistance between neutral and ground at the receptacle would be a giveaway. Depending on distance from main panel, you should see at least a few ohms there. Outlet test equipment should be made to indicate that a potential 'bootleg' exists.
I love the screws in a remodel box
This would only work if your distribution panel is bonded.
I know my main panel is not bonded and that was by code here in Ontario Canada.
It was also passed by the Electrical Safety Authority
The problem here is if the white wire gets broken anywhere back to the main panel, then a 3 prong device plugged into the outlet and turned on (it won't come on) will have 120 volts on the outside grounded parts of it. Makes it an electrocution risk.
Yep happens all the time.
That's a countertop receptacle outlet and required to be 20amp GFCI protected circuit. Also the screw into the side of the box is a no go
I would like to know what the other end of that romex ground was doing. That has a ground wire in it, and I bet they cut it off. Even in my last home that was built in 1937, the cloth covered wiring (We'll call it Romex for practical purposes) had a thin ground that was run to each metal box in the house, and attached to a screw in the box. Not a "Ground Screw" , although that did ground the box, and subsequently the device screws did ground the devices if the frame and ground were contiguous. Updated devices made sure of that.
Given that this is a kitchen, that circuit is required to be GFCI protected, either by breaker or receptacle(s).
Why is a home inspector removing devices?
I first saw those screws on the side of the box that the outlet could contact (vs getting the right rype ofvrework box or making a bigger hole to screw it to the stud properly--but wow, another reason to not check for permits & hire detailed inspectors like yourself!
When you get popped by one of these, you realize how important it is to have a thorough inspection
From the pins, I assume this is in the USA?
You missed the part where they screwed the box into the stud. The IEC clearly states that you cannot modify an electrical box in any way and putting a non-bonded/non-grounded screw through the wall of the box, on the the hot side of the circuit is a good way to get someone hurt or killed.
Wow! As an electrician, with tons of different experience, I thought I had seen it all! I have never seen an outlet wired like that with a jumper from neutral to ground... that's ridiculous!
I thought the totle meant "The Flipper", a device used to hijack wifi signals and many other things like cameras and video feeds.
What happens when you connect ground to the third rail but in between that connection, you place a tyrant? Will it smoke or will the tyrant pop and act like a fuse? Asking for a friend.
can you even get romex with just hot & neutral and NO GROUND?!?!? or were they using 220/240 twin conductor left over from something else?
That's what I was thinking
Unless you do a complete remodel you are not required by the NEC to update to a 3 wire with ground. If the "flipper" just bought the place painted and put in new outlets and switches this home inspector legally can't tell the seller to update it. I am a home inspector as well as a licensed electrician I run into home inspectors all over the place that have no idea what they are telling people to do. Be very careful what home inspectors you hire most of them were never in the HVAC, Plumbing, Construction, or electrical field working!
Important Note! What IS and NOT allowed varies from state to state AND county to county within one state! Hopefully the home inspection sharing this experience... is because 3 ground wiring is REQUIRED upon remodeling the given home/house! Wow! 🍀🙀🌟 😇
Never mind the fact that all of the outlets have been upgraded to three prong...especially the one with no ground which gives it the appearance of a grounded outlet. Having doubts as to your claim of being a home inspector lol...
Sometimes the buyer insists on updated wiring. So even if you can’t be forced to update, you may find it harder to sell or maybe you’ll have to sell at lower price.
So electricians do not have to meet current standards when a remodel is underway? At least in the areas where work is being done?
If the inspection is being done during the due diligence phase of a home sale, the buyer can back out for any reason. The seller doesn’t HAVE to fix anything. The buyer can do a contract addendum for the repairs and the seller can chose to accept, reject, or counter the contract.
In my market, some people have been requiring a non-refundable deposit on top of the refundable one. You would likely lose that unless you specify that all electrical must be up to code, etc in the original contract.
i don't understand the problem, myself. the ground and neutral are the same thing in the box. It honestly seems like a waste of copper to have two wires running to it. The only reason that could make any sense is to force a sort of quasi-polarity wherein you don't accidentally connect the casing to hot, but it's not hard to figure out which one that is.
If the state this house is in has adopted any recent cycle of the NEC the kitchen counter receptacles should be GFCI protected already. Also, the screws through the side of the box are a code violation.
Luckily, where i live they never wired the ground at all! Feels funny touching things like computers or audio cables!
Not just the ground wire is bad, the exposed screw on the inside of the box securing it is also a code violation where I live.
Given what else I've found wrong with my house since I bought it, I'll now be opening all outlets up to check for that.
Wow... I have never seen that before, and I have worked in a lot of renovated older homes.
Its three wires in the wire they used, why would you not home run it back to the box?
This isn't simply a safety hazard - it's a FIRE HAZARD!! I've done renovations for more than thirty years but I never thought of doing this myself nor would I encourage anyone else to do it either.
Well that's because you're not a POS.
I'm a general handyman. Get called out to a lot of flips and owner-remodeled homes. Electrical problems is the number one reason, after leaking plumbing. Never heard about bootleg grounds, never would do one. Better to be honest than to be liable.
Now lots more people know. I learned this hack years ago from a licensed electrician. I would never ever do something so stupid. I have fixed a bunch of these on Section 8 houses because they fail for open ground. The property managers just can’t understand that the building built in the 50s does not have a ground wire so yes you have an “open ground”.
And there it is, run a jumper from neutral to ground , at the outlet. Get a gfi if there is no ground wire.
1:35 "That would protect a person but not any equipment". Explain how it would protect a person, or why you think we have a separate ground wire from a neutral when they are bonded at the circuit breaker box typically? I'm trying to figure out how minimal your understanding of electricity is.
There are lots of RUclips videos that explain this.
@@sylviaisgod6947 You are correct that there are videos you could watch. Obviously if you didn't understand my comment which was in simple English, you wouldn't understand any concepts regarding electricity without more education.
@@tcolondovich2996 I understand perfectly. Do the letters "f.o." mean anything to you?
I understand it may not be in code but ground and neutral are bonded together so it really doesn't make any difference
It does make a difference. They are only bonded at the service. Neutral is a current carrying conductor. It completes the circuit with the hot.
Ground, under normal operation, carries no current.
@@i2rtw And why is that relevant? Can you explain it with your own words without quoting some rules? (I could).
@@i2rtw it doesn't matter where they are bonded it's still going to the same place. For years this has been the case and the fact that code requires they be separated is a facade and it always has been.
@@phakeAccount until something that requires an equipment ground has an energized chassis and someone get shocked.
@@i2rtw Exactly right. The danger is that neutral becomes disconnected upstream. The downstream neutral will then become energized through the various loads connected to it which will in turn energize the metal chassis of the various appliances in the downstream section. This is a VERY dangerous practice.
That's shady and dangerous AF. It is cheaper and easier to install GFCI breakers and label each outlet.
Labels can become illegible or fall off,no?
I'm sure that happens but I've never seen it and by code you have to lable it.
There should be prison sentence for this.
" This Flipper " , with a picture of a wall socket hanging out, I thought it as a joke/prank wall socket that would retract back into the wall when Dad, Mum whoever had shouted at someone - I was wrong. I'm from Northern Ireland.
Was that Romex going to the outlet? It looked like 14 gauge romex (because of the white color of the sheathing) to me. if it was modern Romex it would have a ground wire. There was a kind of two wire NM cable used 50 years ago or so but it didn't look like that. If it was 14 gauge would that be a violation for kitchen receptacles?
It would only be a violation if they were 20AMP receptacles. If there was a separate branch supplying one or more 15AMP kitchen receptacles then I believe it would be legal. Disclaimer: I am not a licensed electrician.
I'ts amazing that the homes that have knob and tube wiring and fuses that were wired 100 years ago are still standing. Of course that's before we had (inspectors????)
My father, and electrical engineer of over 40 years standing, told me about “bootleg grounds.” In an otherwise properly wired house they are not necessarily unsafe. They’re just a quick and easy way of adding a three-pronged grounded outlet to a properly wired two-wire leg.
There is no need to connect a line (hopefully the neutral) to the ground. The only reason is to fool the testers you can plug in.
What made you suspect it was wired wrong? Just that it was an older house?
How did you discover that if it shows on tester that it wired properly?
Please explain the risk. The neutral and ground are bonded at the panel regardless. So long as the hot and neutral are not swapped incorrectly at the plug, I see no risk.
A neutral is a naturally current carrying conductor...a ground is not.
Then you don’t understand how the electrical systems in homes work. Rick is correct.
@@rickss69 That explains nothing.
The risk is that one connects the wire to the hot wire and not to the neutral creating a reverse bootleg ground. This might also happen if the wires are later reversed which could happen with knob and tube. Also there is a risk if the neutral breaks.
It also causes stray currents that can cause various kind of interference on data cables.
But remember that it used to be legal to use the bare or green grounding wire as the return (neutral) wire on 3 wire dryers and ovens.
That's to code only if there are only 240-volt systems in the appliance. Most new dryers and ovens/ranges have both, therefore, a 4-wire setup is used.
@@jamesplotkin4674 I've seen an appliance that allowed the white wire and the green wire to be connected in order to enable attachment of a 3 prong cord to accommodate a 3 prong receptacle. I thought the reasoning was that there would be very little current on the grounding wire and it would be for a limited time.
How old is that house? My home was built in 1964, and it has ground wires throughout.
A condition of my home purchase was to ground all outlets. They did this and signed off on it. I made the rewire my whole house.
Bootleg grounds kill. Period. This inspector is fierce and is respected by me. Shady and dangerous….
I’d like to find out who did the electrical, and signed off on it.
Looks like one. A building I rented 30 years ago, every plug was bootlegged.
It’s also funny they used drywall screw to attach that old work box when a regular nail on would have been much cheaper.
Should contact the local building inspector and have the building's "Certificate of Occupancy" revoked until electrical is addressed.
YES! That looks like a major renovation and likely no building permits obtained. That building inspector (the real one) could make them open up walls and ceilings.
I got bolted by 460 hot wire connected to a ground during construction. Knocked out all the lights on that circuit. Went in my fingers (through gloves) and out my elbow. Burning red circle on back of my elbow. I was pissed off but not pissed on. Key advice:Don’t be scared of electricity. Be respectful and SMART. This ‘flipper’ was none of them. Not scared, respectful or smart.
If you find stuff like this, you can still bring a lawsuit against the flipper.
“In this house are an insane NUMBER of electrical issues.” Sheesh.
I would think that a bootleg ground will only work if the branch circuit comes from a meter main combo where the neutral and ground is connected to the same bar
Never at the receptacle, only at the mains service entry shall the neutral and ground be bonded.