When I was younger and I bought Half-Life 2 for PC way back when, I was incredibly upset trying to install it on my computer, only to apparently require internet access to download Steam. Nowhere on the box did it say it required internet access (and believe me, I looked everywhere), but as Steam was a requirement, I couldn't play my game. That was my first bad experience with Steam. Later on I read about it and it seemed like a cheap-ass DRM that holds games back and prevents me from playing how I always loved playing games. Buying and installing them on my computer. But, eventually, I downloaded Steam. I can't remember why, I think it was because I saw a Steam sale or something and wanted a game. I still kinda think Steam's offline mode is a little annoying, but the benefits of Steam far outweighs the cons. Just make sure Steam is on and running and you can go to offline mode and you're good. Even if you're no longer online, just make sure it hasn't been closed. I have over 110 games in my Steam library, I think, now. It's only getting bigger every day. HumbleBundle, Indiegala, BundleStars, G2A and Steam Sales all allow me to get whatever game I want for the best price. I'm done with consoles and their "sales."
Gabe's such a great guy. Knows his customers very well. I would never even consider pirating a Valve game. The Source engine is still going strong, the advancements since HL2 and Vampires Bloodlines are crazy.
The SEGA Saturn analagy with the PS3. I've been saying that for years. The Saturn COULD do decent 3D, and had powerful hardware at its disposal, but getting results from it was HARD and costly in terms of time. A little like the PS3, eh?
after watching this two part series, I can now see why Valve has become one of the top PC developers of all time. WIth the thought process of someone like Gabe Newell, how could any company go wrong? This guy has his thinking straight.
I bought 3 games for $15 this summer sale. I also had enough afterwards to buy about 5 sets of trading cards on the market and put myself up to level 11.
@@Spaceman69420 Yeah, well, no. Steam has a well-deserved monopoly and I don't have the feeling that Valve has any bad intentions with their customers. Every rival gaming platform is just utter dogshit. Also if a patch removes content from a game then it's the decision of the developer or publisher. Steam doesn't have anything to do with such stuff.
he didnt really "trash-talk" the PS3 he just explained how difficult and impractical it is in terms of business strategy and to develop games for it overall but now look at sonys new press conference. PS3 is getting the best version of Portal 2! who saw that coming right?
Gabe's not saying the PS3 is bad, he is saying its hard to code for (with 7 sub-processors and one main processor in the cell architecture), but now Valve has a PS3 Team to specifically code for the PS3 (and as it seems, cross-platform) i think we can see some very good things coming out of Valve and the PS3 in the near future.
He not trash talking the PS3. What he says is true. If anything it can be a compliment to the Ps3. Becuase Sony wants to make sure It's hard for Game Devs to port to other consoles.
Amazing interview. As a programmer, very insightful for me. What makes World of Warcraft so great is THE CHARACTER. Developing your character, getting achievements, getting gear all in a beautiful shared world with thousands of other people all in real time. And there is the team collaborative concept and guilds. If halflife can become that, it would conquer the world.
This is an issue with consoles in general. The newest generation (XB1,PS4,WIIU) each has its own share of problems on the hardware and software side. The PS4 and XB1 specifically have had massive launch problems these past few months, maybe even years if you count Battlefield 4 and before then.
But now there are far less excuses because both PS4 and XB1 are both x86 consoles so the differentiation is only in the graphics API. One only needs only to look at AC Unity to see how lazy and near sighted these companies have gotten, in an age where the core game code can be nearly identical. To rub salt in the wound Sony uses OpenGL on top of its x86 architecture which is clearly limited in comparison to DX12 but it's an open api that thousands of people can dissect and improve for the simple joy of challenge and DX12's core is a guarded IP.
@@nottafanboy6954Don't playstations mostly use their own proprietary gnm (low-level) and gnmx (high-level) api? Albeit, with them having some but not complete basis on OpenGL.
The downside is that if you want to upgrade the graphics on some of your older titles that they have to be released on completely new hardware. However, for a developer, a console isn't that much to buy when you have a 10 million dollar budget. You'll lose more money trying to get your game to work on all this different hardware than just buying one console. However, the point is that it is easier to develop games on consoles (if it's an AAA game and not just indie platformer).
well for the average consumer consoles are fine and are not a trend, 7 generations and counting. If I wanted to be a PC gamer I wouldn't settle for anything short of the most high end system money can buy.
3. I used to hook up my PC when it first was based with TV out(NVIDIA Riva 128). It is not convenient to navigate windows through TV. And it is also not convenient to move it from my desk to TV and vice-versa. I even don't want to mention how it is not convenient to play near TV using kb+mouse while laying on the floor.
@icanfly303 I don't think they'll only port it as they now can code/script correctly, or whatever it was. They now know more about PS3 than they did before.
1. The TV is not being used only for gaming. You are still able to use it by design - to wat-ch TV programs. And you are not considering the fact that TV is becoming digital nowadays. Look at the store. You will find there almost only HDTV LCD or plasma products. There is less ERT-based ones available.
Because it's fucking complex. Complex means frustrating to make ANYTHING work well on ,but at the same time it means that if you do it right you get extra ordinary results.
No, just PS2 used MIPS processor while CELL has PowerPC main core. Just different opcodes and formats, but also there's different micro OSes not compatible to each other.
BTW I used to build cheap PCs for under 600 USD. Now I consider these ones as an office-only machines. To play PC games you need to own a high-end one. It is prooved by years of upgrades since 1997.
If you want to run a new release on a 360 like Crysis, then the downside is the graphics just aren't going to be as good. The textures will have to be reduced, the geometry will have to be reduced, and the overall activity on the screen will be limited, but there are also many tricks on 360s that you can't do with PCs simply because you are granted much more control over the resources. You can kind of bypass the "OS" of the console and use which ever resources you want.
Not necessarily. With PCs you have a lot of different hardware, so it can get tricky at times. One of the neat things about consoles is that it's the same console to console. A developer can develop something on his own console and he knows it will work on every other console across the world, so that greatly narrows time spent on optimization and general infrastructure.
> is a bumpier road and needs to be allowed to catch up. it seems to me that if the design of the experience is not understood, the advancements technology allows cant be properly taken advantage of
actually here - Sales figures for Steam have not been released by Valve. However, Stardock, the previous owner of competing platform Impulse, estimated that, as of 2009, Steam had a 70% share of the digital distribution market for video games.[67] In early 2011, Forbes reported that Steam sales constituted 50 to 70% of the $4 billion market for downloaded PC games and that Steam offered game producers gross margins of 70% of purchase price, compared with 30% at retail.
1. if your not counting the TV, in the price you pay for consoles than you may as well not count the monitor you pay for PC. 2. you can use Windows 7 RC and build your own pc engine for 500$ and still get much more power than a ps3 or 360. 3. you can hook your PC up to a TV using a 5$ wire. 4. games on PC are 10$ cheaper. plus steam savings (LFD 20$, orange box 10$ ETC)
The PS2 was hard to program as well in its time, but everything turned out ok. I will not bash Sony for trying to do something diferent in each generation instead of the same but just bigger. Thats what makes Sony Sony. Sure its risky but they have a pretty big 1st party/2nd party support to make it success and in the end the results are always great for gamers.
This is one of the guys behind "the next-gen". He's talking about how others are taking the next gen in a non-optimal direction for self-oriented goals. He's not complaining about his job being harder, though that would be a perfectly legitimate complaint just like travel agents complaining about the internet making their jobs harder. What he's complaining about is for the market and for the gamers. He's talking about the negative impacts of certain major technology on everyone, including you.
Oh and MAG cant be done on 360 because of its processor, 1) its a very demanding game that the 360s processor cant handle very well 2) the processor needs to be kept at a certain temperature but 360s would overheat. Also either way Epic even stated that they love developing for the ps3 when they made ut3 for it. Like I said before its not hard at all, just something new.
His comments about WoW are really nice. He's aware that the fan community is really important which is something i really love about Valve despite owning only a handful of their games. Gabes not just bashing the Ps3 he doesn't like developing for any console. For the 360 he doesn't like having limited hard drive and Ps3 has complicated programing code it seems. I already know Nintendo must also have a unique code as well. He's honest about his opinion and should be respected.
@tazer95 It's microsofts fault. They order the prices and they also limit how much content can be brought in by one DLC. Like Gabe said, TF2 on 360 is like a train wreck. On PS3, they can put free DLC's to PSN store.
What Gabe said in this video about competing with World Of Warcraft really gives me an understanding of why Team Fortress 2 now has features like crafting abilities.
Valve's problem is their very old school and they have problems getting programmers who can program for PS3, they have had this issue right up until a couple of years ago when they finally hired some programmers who can multi-thread program. Looking at Valves games today and steam today then going back and re-analyzing What Mr Newell said then, was very ahead of it's time. Which is why Valve is very popular now and why Left4Dead and TF2 games are so popular.
I didn't mention I don't like their games at all. I like several ones but I dislike their support. And from a consumer point of view I don't want to limit myself to Valve. Why should I do this? After about of 12 years of being a PC gamer I bought the system which is really designed for games. Almost every product for it never drops fps. No headache. It makes me wonder how simple-to-use and suitable home electronics can be. It is a pleasure to use it. It supposed to be simple.
Medicore reviews aside, no, his point still stands and is still right. For many years, Sony has had the opinion that they will release their own revolutionary new formats (not my words), no matter how impractical, and then try to strongarm the market (specifically companies making compatible products) into becoming their pocket. Sometimes it works. Some recent examples: Memory Stick. UMD. Blu-ray.
As a programmer in training Gabe Newell is my Idol. He's what I'm shootin for. Fuck the money! Technology is about helping people, and making life easier. Honest to god he is the only GameDev Ceo I have ever heard who makes real sense. Valve actually supports and encourages their community to do things and be creative, whereas most other companies don't even allow mod support. And yeah HL2EP3 aint out yet but at least they haven't been teasing it for years only for it to not come out.(DIABLO3).
My point is those developers are many examples of industry leaders quitting PS3 NOT due to contractual obligations but quite simply because the PS3 was TERRIBLE to code for. In fact most multiplatform games are developed on X360 and the publishers (like EA) merely give the X360 code to a third party studio to do a straight-port to PS3. That's the case with Orange Box on PS3, Valve wanted nothing to do with the PS3 port That's also why multiplatform games usually look worse of PS3 than X360.
@Elbottoo you can actually hook a computer up to an HD tv mind you. they did that in school and it's pretty easy to learn how to do. and not really smashed and owned, I'm just enjoying a debate with someone who likes to use owned a lot apparently. and i don't get those errors and I'm patient to wait for the install to go through.
@JackBandicootsBunker He first went to Microsoft but they basically said "No way Jose, we want to charge people for stuff like DLC!" So he went to the PS3 because that's the only other console that can support a low - medium end version of Portal 2. He still hates the cell architecture system, but Sony is the second choice. This isn't a time paradox, this is him extending his business to other platforms, and if nobody wanted games on the consoles he would have ditched it.
The only thing different is the coding process for the systems, there is no piece of hardware or software in the PS3 that pushes it ahead of the 360. Saw a Killzone 2 article stating that it can't be done on 360, BUT the people claiming it was not only the people who worked at Sony but the people who developed the game. The only reason given where that it had Blu-ray and Six-axis wtf, and said that it was important for THEIR needs, Killzone 2 is more then possible on another system.
i remember john carmack talking about how when rage came out they had to make deals with microsoft and sony about how they could better utilize the data on the dvd and the hardrive to optimize performance, but for that to happen you had a 30 gig download. i think the problem isn't with the technology of the consoles, but the conditions in which you can use the data set by the company. i mean, aren't pcs today running multi threaded games? thats why consoles will never surpass the pcs flexibility
@Cili1000XL You can't blame Valve. The 360 literally can't fit all the updates they have for their games like TF2, not only that but the DLC you pay for on L4D/L4D2 is 100% free for PC gamers. This is all Microsoft forcing Valve to put a price on their DLC for consoles.
It's interesting hearing him talk about world of Warcraft before tf2 . It was his grand plan to make something like it with recurring sales. It seems his dream came true with the Mann co store.
Old good days ago we were buying PCs because its main purpose was to work. But in addition you got a possibility to play games as well. But nowadays you have to buy PC which is suitable for games and get a possibility to work. This is an inversion of its primary intent. If you need a PC - buy cheapest and do your work on it. If you want to play games why don't you just buy a gaming system? Console is also a computer but specialized. Why not? It solves the problem it was intended to. Does it well
Other developers to have jumped ship from Sony: -Ubisoft (Splinter Cell Conviction) -Southpeak Interactive (Velvet Assassin) -Timegate Studios (FEAR files/ Section 8) -Webzen Games Inc (Huxley) -Bioware (Mass Effect 2, even though published by EA) -Koas Studios (Frontlines: Fuel of War) -Team Ninja (DoA / Ninja Gaiden 2) -Namco Bandai -Cyanide (Blood Bowl) -SNK Playmore (Samurai Shodown 4) -Behemoth BTW Insomniac are owned by SONY they have to make a "game every year" yet with mediocre graphics
It's not another language to many of us. So the fact that you're not in the target audience is his problem? You're the gamer, not the developer. You're the test subject, not the scientist. Don't get mad just because you don't understand the scientists.
I mean he isn't just trash talking it... He is talking about specific issues. Issues that he had confirmed outsourcing orange box porting to the ps3(because they couldn't do it in house) and got a sub par port and no post release support. Now there are more people who know how to program for the ps3 and it have probably become easier too with updated developer tools from sony. Gabe wasn't wrong and he hasn't changed, the world has.
2. Windows 7 RC will not be available since irs trades launch and I will have to buy it(Usually I don't midn to buy windows since I used to try Red Hat, FreeBSD, Slackware which are honestly a crap in comparison to 1st one). Oh, at least the cost for home distro of win is about 150 USD for Vista and about 200 USD for Win7.
Its amazing to hear him talk about how complicated the PS3 coding is, yet its far easier to develop a game on a ps3 and transfer the code to the 360. Devil May Cry 4 only took a week to port to the 360 after being developed on the PS3...kinda makes me doubt his education :P Granted, this WAS 2006 lol
@Cili1000XL EA was publishing games for Valve and again forced them to port the game over to PS3. There are a lot of politics behind games but you'd never know if you don't look. Developers usually don't talk about a system being complicated or anything negative because they don't want to be seen bad-mouthing it or the publishers don't want to cut out that demographic in order to make more money. Valve and more specifically Gabe are very honest, with their customers and with their opinions.
@Cili1000XL Also unless you've developed specifically for the PS3 porting it over is more difficult. Lots of people including developers have already discussed this.
I understood your point. Indeed it doesn't bother me. You are right. I only wanted you to understand our point of view. It is your choice whether to play PC, console ot whatever you prefer. The rest about games is kind of particular platform services and/or support offered.
Do you realize how much Sony's flipped their image since the PS3 launch? They launched an insanely expensive console with foreign architecture to the majority of coders and had the lowest market share for a very long time this generation. It was only until Sony slashed prices and started working with developers (Sony actually came to Valve offering to help them develop on the PS3) that they started actually making progress this generation.
He is truly a game nerd at heart, but an incredibly insightful and with deep knowledge in the history of gaming industry. My God, he made analogy with Sega Saturn and PS3! It never occurred to me of such obvious resemblance. All the technical talks aside, he's similar to Steve Jobs - they are, I think, cut from the same cloth.
@BornRuffian1 i never said i thought the ps3 made more money than steam, i was saying that he would have made more money if he had written code for the ps3. might want to actually read the comment next time.
Don't confuse great internet deals with real life prices. Im talking going to the computer store and purchasing parts, not those great deals you find after days of searching on the internet.
There would be no TF2 without valve, but TF was originally a Quake Mod that was later made into a HL mod [TFC] and eventually ending up what it is today, thanks to Valve. I wouldn't say they made TF, they just gave Walker and others a platform to make it better, and what it is today. Yeah, hats, w/e, it's still an amazing MP game that gets amazing content updates regularly :D
that's going to be the biggest setback for ps3 owners. programing specifically for ps3 requires 7 times the work it seems but if youve seen kill zone 2, that was specifically developed to take full advantage of the ps3s 7 independent processing elements it looks like its worth the effort. i just hope developers will take the time to program specifically for ps3 because im curious to see what the ps3 is capable of.
It's funny how the exact opposite happened to the PS3. Most developers developed their games for the Xbox 360 and then ported it over to PS3. This is why most non-exclusive games run better on the Xbox 360 than they do on the PS3.
Even most of the exclusives ran badly. Uncharted: Drake's Fortune (2007) has framerate drops and tearing throughout the game, Metal Gear Solid 4 and Infamous 1 have double buffering and inconsistent framerate, God of War 3 and Ascension target 60 but they mostly run at 45 or 30. And Resistance games (mostly 2 and 3) have graphics worse that CoD on the same system while running at 30 or bellow while a comparable CoD would hit 60fps with ease. I love the PS3 but I have to admit, it is an absolute disaster of a console.
@@nunosa528 1 if you had played youd know gow 3 and ascension target 30 fps,but run with better framerate than that,and theres literally no xbox 360 title that graphically compares to these two,and to this day gow3,ascension humiliate modern games graphics. 2 i never got those framerate drops you're reporting,on exclusives.
Too right. I've only played Prototype demo but it is just one of those really solid and incredibly fun sandbox games and deserves a high 80%. But that kinda supports my opinion, the last three Tomb Raider games have gotten high-70% to low-80% scores and they really deserve higher just for what solid platformers they are. And I've since seen reviews of Uncharted 2... oh my God... It looks AMAZING! I am SO glad I never sold my PS3. Now I just need a 1080p HDMI monitor. (no sarcasm).
My co-worker, the friend of mine, bought newest Wolfenstein and he is unable to play it neither in hi-res nor in low-res with his mid-end 1.4 DualCore. But he plays CS a lot. So what are you talking about? What are you going to proove me? I already have an experience of frequent upgrades for PC in order to play games(Virge, Riva128, Trio3D, GeForce2MX400, how long will it happen?). May be you just need to buy this mid-end PC and start play games on it? Maybe after that you will change your mind.
Actually I agree with this. Piracy is getting worse. At my college whenever we want a game, say Bioshock or Gears, we just find a copy in the Schools Transfer drive, and download the game. Its too easy, And I never even consider buying a computer game now, not for a second. As soon as someone uploads Spore, 1000 students are getting it free...so yea, I Know it hurts the dev, but honestly, why pay 40 bucks when you can get it for free without even wasting the gas to go buy it?
Automatic updates are not possible on consoles since Microsoft and Sony charge money for them. On PC, the updates on valve games are free, so it goes against Microsoft and Sony policies.
More to it even than that -- the Cell architecture is unlike any other that they would be writing on for many years. It's not worth it for a game that has been in the market for a very long time.
I mean, yes it cost money for the console developers to redesign a new console and pump them out, but that's how they make money and I'm talking strictly about software. The only console in particular that costs more to develop than on a PC that I can think of is a PS3. That architecture is just a train wreck.
I know for a fact that the guys interviewing him didn't know jack shit and were pretending to be interested. As are most people, probably. But that shit fucking fascinates me. Kudos to someone that knows their shit. I'd DEFINITELY take him if he were giving lectures or was a professor.
Put it this way. PS2 Slimline was a real improvement, it was shrunk by a much larger %, the only reason t couldn't be done again today is Sony's apparent loss in technical competence. PS2 slimline was so small, less than 2lbs and smaller than a DVD boxset. PS3 slim is almost as big as the original Xbox and still weighs as much as the Xbox 360. Yeah, people are NOT buying PS3 Slim for any practical reason but simply because it's new and pretty lookin'. A trend that can't last.
I hardly could count at least one person who really needs this power as you have described. No one of my friends perform his work at home for purpose other then games, internet surfing, reading books. Those who really work at home use cheap hardware for web programming. mid-class laptop for under 700$ is good enough for home video editing. I still don't know anyone who makes 3d modeling at home. You are right about plug-and-play. It really amazed me. I'm still wondering this simplicity.
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Thy majesty GabeN was worried that people wouldn't like steam. Only a God can be this humble.
People absolutely hated Steam for the first few years, especially when HL2 launched.
Nick Shomos True, I hated the guts of Steam. Now it is the source of all my games.
When I was younger and I bought Half-Life 2 for PC way back when, I was incredibly upset trying to install it on my computer, only to apparently require internet access to download Steam.
Nowhere on the box did it say it required internet access (and believe me, I looked everywhere), but as Steam was a requirement, I couldn't play my game.
That was my first bad experience with Steam.
Later on I read about it and it seemed like a cheap-ass DRM that holds games back and prevents me from playing how I always loved playing games. Buying and installing them on my computer.
But, eventually, I downloaded Steam. I can't remember why, I think it was because I saw a Steam sale or something and wanted a game.
I still kinda think Steam's offline mode is a little annoying, but the benefits of Steam far outweighs the cons. Just make sure Steam is on and running and you can go to offline mode and you're good. Even if you're no longer online, just make sure it hasn't been closed.
I have over 110 games in my Steam library, I think, now. It's only getting bigger every day.
HumbleBundle, Indiegala, BundleStars, G2A and Steam Sales all allow me to get whatever game I want for the best price. I'm done with consoles and their "sales."
LunarD3A7H Amen brother
The only thing I do not like is that there are more programs you have to install now for some games like Uplay.
For the people that didnt know: Longhorn was the codename for windows vista.
STEAM IS THE FUTURE
100 milion active users agree lord gaben.
10 million actualy..(thats active users).
Y U NO LAUGH??
10 million ONLINE AT THE SAME TIME. If I launch Steam once a week only to play Skyrim that doesn't mean i'm not an active user.
Game James What about those phishing bots?
+TheNeXusCore9032 Bots are people too!
@Bold One consoles are cheaper and more socially acceptable/ more accessible than pc’s
The uploader needs to find the meaning of "trash talking" and rename the video when they realize they have no idea what "trash talking" is.
Gabe's such a great guy. Knows his customers very well. I would never even consider pirating a Valve game.
The Source engine is still going strong, the advancements since HL2 and Vampires Bloodlines are crazy.
Hey bruh, are you alive?
@@abhi.dx2345 yes.
The SEGA Saturn analagy with the PS3. I've been saying that for years. The Saturn COULD do decent 3D, and had powerful hardware at its disposal, but getting results from it was HARD and costly in terms of time.
A little like the PS3, eh?
after watching this two part series, I can now see why Valve has become one of the top PC developers of all time. WIth the thought process of someone like Gabe Newell, how could any company go wrong? This guy has his thinking straight.
At first I hated Steam,but its just so damn useful for updating and stuff. Also,weekend madness and summersale. :-)
I bought 3 games for $15 this summer sale. I also had enough afterwards to buy about 5 sets of trading cards on the market and put myself up to level 11.
Steam cloud, as well. A handy feature if ever I saw one.
Now in 2024 Steam has got too big. The sales are crap and patches can remove content from games :(
@@Spaceman69420 Yeah, well, no. Steam has a well-deserved monopoly and I don't have the feeling that Valve has any bad intentions with their customers. Every rival gaming platform is just utter dogshit.
Also if a patch removes content from a game then it's the decision of the developer or publisher. Steam doesn't have anything to do with such stuff.
@@BenniRoRplus steam allowa you to downpatch
this is before he developed his fear of the number 3
LOLLLL
For context, Windows Longhorn is the codename for Vista. They were talking about Windows Vista at 1:00.
he didnt really "trash-talk" the PS3 he just explained how difficult and impractical it is in terms of business strategy and to develop games for it overall
but now look at sonys new press conference. PS3 is getting the best version of Portal 2! who saw that coming right?
Notice how there isn't a Gabe Newell talks trash Playstation 3 part 3
Gabe's not saying the PS3 is bad, he is saying its hard to code for (with 7 sub-processors and one main processor in the cell architecture), but now Valve has a PS3 Team to specifically code for the PS3 (and as it seems, cross-platform) i think we can see some very good things coming out of Valve and the PS3 in the near future.
When Gabe Newell is talking everybody should listen.
My entire opinion of this man has changed. An incredibly versed man, quite deserving to where he currently is.
Fun Fact: Gabe later retracted his statement after he realize how bad it was to update 360 games compared to PS3
1. Processor - Pentium D 820
2. Motherboard - Intel BLKD102GGC2L LGA775
3. Memory (RAM) - A-Data 2 GB
4. Hard Disk - 250 GB
5. DVDRW drive
6. Graphics card - Sapphire X1650XT
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for 500$
No Part 3? This is bad...
+TheForgery And you've got 3 likes, too. Lololol
On the bright side, there won't be an XBOX Three. Hehehehehe Avion A'ris
+TheForgery Gabe never does 3.
Valentin Rafael
For sure.
3:06 here were gaben talks about cell/ps3
He not trash talking the PS3. What he says is true. If anything it can be a compliment to the Ps3. Becuase Sony wants to make sure It's hard for Game Devs to port to other consoles.
First comment
He needs to go back to college if he can't program in Cell Processor it's essentially modified Power PC 4 CPU😂
Dude can't count to 3. How does He get to say Playststion 3.
hurhurhurhurhurhur hilarious
He can say three, but not count from one to it.
Amazing interview. As a programmer, very insightful for me. What makes World of Warcraft so great is THE CHARACTER. Developing your character, getting achievements, getting gear all in a beautiful shared world with thousands of other people all in real time. And there is the team collaborative concept and guilds. If halflife can become that, it would conquer the world.
Getting gear and having a paper doll character, maybe that's why they added a lot of cosmetics and unlockable weapons to TF2 over time
This is an issue with consoles in general. The newest generation (XB1,PS4,WIIU) each has its own share of problems on the hardware and software side. The PS4 and XB1 specifically have had massive launch problems these past few months, maybe even years if you count Battlefield 4 and before then.
But now there are far less excuses because both PS4 and XB1 are both x86 consoles so the differentiation is only in the graphics API. One only needs only to look at AC Unity to see how lazy and near sighted these companies have gotten, in an age where the core game code can be nearly identical. To rub salt in the wound Sony uses OpenGL on top of its x86 architecture which is clearly limited in comparison to DX12 but it's an open api that thousands of people can dissect and improve for the simple joy of challenge and DX12's core is a guarded IP.
@@nottafanboy6954Don't playstations mostly use their own proprietary gnm (low-level) and gnmx (high-level) api?
Albeit, with them having some but not complete basis on OpenGL.
POV: you're looking for comments of 2024
crazy how I look at windows 11 the same way as GabeN and longhorn (Vista) 18 years ago. There is not a single feature that does anything for me.
The downside is that if you want to upgrade the graphics on some of your older titles that they have to be released on completely new hardware. However, for a developer, a console isn't that much to buy when you have a 10 million dollar budget. You'll lose more money trying to get your game to work on all this different hardware than just buying one console. However, the point is that it is easier to develop games on consoles (if it's an AAA game and not just indie platformer).
0:43 jesus christ what a throwback!
Man, Gabe is a very intelligent guy.
well for the average consumer consoles are fine and are not a trend, 7 generations and counting. If I wanted to be a PC gamer I wouldn't settle for anything short of the most high end system money can buy.
3. I used to hook up my PC when it first was based with TV out(NVIDIA Riva 128). It is not convenient to navigate windows through TV. And it is also not convenient to move it from my desk to TV and vice-versa. I even don't want to mention how it is not convenient to play near TV using kb+mouse while laying on the floor.
This sounds like an advertisement for the steam deck lol
research and youll see that the games I listed cant be done on the 360. Thats all it takes people, tons of fanboys downing my comments wow.
He has *spoken*
Hes not talking trash, hes giving his honest opinion, hes a respectable man.
you lose an ass load of money making games compatable with the damn thing and you also lose money when only 4 people buy it for ps3.
@icanfly303 I don't think they'll only port it as they now can code/script correctly, or whatever it was. They now know more about PS3 than they did before.
1. The TV is not being used only for gaming. You are still able to use it by design - to wat-ch TV programs. And you are not considering the fact that TV is becoming digital nowadays. Look at the store. You will find there almost only HDTV LCD or plasma products. There is less ERT-based ones available.
Because it's fucking complex. Complex means frustrating to make ANYTHING work well on ,but at the same time it means that if you do it right you get extra ordinary results.
No, just PS2 used MIPS processor while CELL has PowerPC main core. Just different opcodes and formats, but also there's different micro OSes not compatible to each other.
BTW I used to build cheap PCs for under 600 USD. Now I consider these ones as an office-only machines. To play PC games you need to own a high-end one. It is prooved by years of upgrades since 1997.
If you want to run a new release on a 360 like Crysis, then the downside is the graphics just aren't going to be as good. The textures will have to be reduced, the geometry will have to be reduced, and the overall activity on the screen will be limited, but there are also many tricks on 360s that you can't do with PCs simply because you are granted much more control over the resources. You can kind of bypass the "OS" of the console and use which ever resources you want.
Not necessarily. With PCs you have a lot of different hardware, so it can get tricky at times. One of the neat things about consoles is that it's the same console to console. A developer can develop something on his own console and he knows it will work on every other console across the world, so that greatly narrows time spent on optimization and general infrastructure.
> is a bumpier road and needs to be allowed to catch up. it seems to me that if the design of the experience is not understood, the advancements technology allows cant be properly taken advantage of
3:06 Gabe said 3.
*HALF-LIFE 3 CONFIRMED!!!!!!!!!11!!1111!!!!!!!!!!*
+Nick Gregory LOL, yeah, but....no...
+Nick Gregory in part one of this series he actually says Half life 3...so yeah
You wrote this comment four years early
actually here - Sales figures for Steam have not been released by Valve. However, Stardock, the previous owner of competing platform Impulse, estimated that, as of 2009, Steam had a 70% share of the digital distribution market for video games.[67] In early 2011, Forbes reported that Steam sales constituted 50 to 70% of the $4 billion market for downloaded PC games and that Steam offered game producers gross margins of 70% of purchase price, compared with 30% at retail.
1. if your not counting the TV, in the price you pay for consoles than you may as well not count the monitor you pay for PC.
2. you can use Windows 7 RC and build your own pc engine for 500$ and still get much more power than a ps3 or 360.
3. you can hook your PC up to a TV using a 5$ wire.
4. games on PC are 10$ cheaper. plus steam savings (LFD 20$, orange box 10$ ETC)
The PS2 was hard to program as well in its time, but everything turned out ok. I will not bash Sony for trying to do something diferent in each generation instead of the same but just bigger. Thats what makes Sony Sony. Sure its risky but they have a pretty big 1st party/2nd party support to make it success and in the end the results are always great for gamers.
you can use a lamptop as a monitor. and connect it to your TV using a gamepad, and an s-video.
@jpandaaron He said that four years ago. How many people had quad cores four years ago? Source has been multithreaded for a couple years now.
This is one of the guys behind "the next-gen". He's talking about how others are taking the next gen in a non-optimal direction for self-oriented goals.
He's not complaining about his job being harder, though that would be a perfectly legitimate complaint just like travel agents complaining about the internet making their jobs harder. What he's complaining about is for the market and for the gamers. He's talking about the negative impacts of certain major technology on everyone, including you.
Oh and MAG cant be done on 360 because of its processor, 1) its a very demanding game that the 360s processor cant handle very well 2) the processor needs to be kept at a certain temperature but 360s would overheat. Also either way Epic even stated that they love developing for the ps3 when they made ut3 for it. Like I said before its not hard at all, just something new.
His comments about WoW are really nice. He's aware that the fan community is really important which is something i really love about Valve despite owning only a handful of their games.
Gabes not just bashing the Ps3 he doesn't like developing for any console.
For the 360 he doesn't like having limited hard drive and Ps3 has complicated programing code it seems. I already know Nintendo must also have a unique code as well. He's honest about his opinion and should be respected.
@tazer95 It's microsofts fault. They order the prices and they also limit how much content can be brought in by one DLC. Like Gabe said, TF2 on 360 is like a train wreck. On PS3, they can put free DLC's to PSN store.
What Gabe said in this video about competing with World Of Warcraft really gives me an understanding of why Team Fortress 2 now has features like crafting abilities.
Valve's problem is their very old school and they have problems getting programmers who can program for PS3, they have had this issue right up until a couple of years ago when they finally hired some programmers who can multi-thread program.
Looking at Valves games today and steam today then going back and re-analyzing What Mr Newell said then, was very ahead of it's time. Which is why Valve is very popular now and why Left4Dead and TF2 games are so popular.
I didn't mention I don't like their games at all. I like several ones but I dislike their support. And from a consumer point of view I don't want to limit myself to Valve. Why should I do this? After about of 12 years of being a PC gamer I bought the system which is really designed for games. Almost every product for it never drops fps. No headache. It makes me wonder how simple-to-use and suitable home electronics can be. It is a pleasure to use it. It supposed to be simple.
Medicore reviews aside, no, his point still stands and is still right. For many years, Sony has had the opinion that they will release their own revolutionary new formats (not my words), no matter how impractical, and then try to strongarm the market (specifically companies making compatible products) into becoming their pocket. Sometimes it works. Some recent examples: Memory Stick. UMD. Blu-ray.
I do agree that there are some advantages,the mouse and keyboard simply allows a gamer to do more. Plus,we're talking pinpoint accuracy via a mouse.
As a programmer in training Gabe Newell is my Idol. He's what I'm shootin for. Fuck the money! Technology is about helping people, and making life easier. Honest to god he is the only GameDev Ceo I have ever heard who makes real sense. Valve actually supports and encourages their community to do things and be creative, whereas most other companies don't even allow mod support. And yeah HL2EP3 aint out yet but at least they haven't been teasing it for years only for it to not come out.(DIABLO3).
My point is those developers are many examples of industry leaders quitting PS3 NOT due to contractual obligations but quite simply because the PS3 was TERRIBLE to code for.
In fact most multiplatform games are developed on X360 and the publishers (like EA) merely give the X360 code to a third party studio to do a straight-port to PS3.
That's the case with Orange Box on PS3, Valve wanted nothing to do with the PS3 port
That's also why multiplatform games usually look worse of PS3 than X360.
The title of this video shouldn't be "Gabe Newell Trash Talks PS3," it should be "Gabe Newell speaks like a true Genius"
@Elbottoo you can actually hook a computer up to an HD tv mind you. they did that in school and it's pretty easy to learn how to do. and not really smashed and owned, I'm just enjoying a debate with someone who likes to use owned a lot apparently. and i don't get those errors and I'm patient to wait for the install to go through.
@JackBandicootsBunker
He first went to Microsoft but they basically said "No way Jose, we want to charge people for stuff like DLC!" So he went to the PS3 because that's the only other console that can support a low - medium end version of Portal 2. He still hates the cell architecture system, but Sony is the second choice. This isn't a time paradox, this is him extending his business to other platforms, and if nobody wanted games on the consoles he would have ditched it.
The only thing different is the coding process for the systems, there is no piece of hardware or software in the PS3 that pushes it ahead of the 360.
Saw a Killzone 2 article stating that it can't be done on 360, BUT the people claiming it was not only the people who worked at Sony but the people who developed the game. The only reason given where that it had Blu-ray and Six-axis wtf, and said that it was important for THEIR needs, Killzone 2 is more then possible on another system.
i remember john carmack talking about how when rage came out they had to make deals with microsoft and sony about how they could better utilize the data on the dvd and the hardrive to optimize performance, but for that to happen you had a 30 gig download. i think the problem isn't with the technology of the consoles, but the conditions in which you can use the data set by the company. i mean, aren't pcs today running multi threaded games? thats why consoles will never surpass the pcs flexibility
@Cili1000XL You can't blame Valve. The 360 literally can't fit all the updates they have for their games like TF2, not only that but the DLC you pay for on L4D/L4D2 is 100% free for PC gamers. This is all Microsoft forcing Valve to put a price on their DLC for consoles.
Totally agree. PCs also multicored. So isn't it hard to code for PC? It also requires multithreading skills.
It's interesting hearing him talk about world of Warcraft before tf2 . It was his grand plan to make something like it with recurring sales. It seems his dream came true with the Mann co store.
Old good days ago we were buying PCs because its main purpose was to work. But in addition you got a possibility to play games as well. But nowadays you have to buy PC which is suitable for games and get a possibility to work. This is an inversion of its primary intent. If you need a PC - buy cheapest and do your work on it. If you want to play games why don't you just buy a gaming system? Console is also a computer but specialized. Why not? It solves the problem it was intended to. Does it well
also, what prototype demo? there never was a demo released for the game.
I love how he talk about windows vista too (windows longhorn)
Other developers to have jumped ship from Sony:
-Ubisoft (Splinter Cell Conviction)
-Southpeak Interactive (Velvet Assassin)
-Timegate Studios (FEAR files/ Section 8)
-Webzen Games Inc (Huxley)
-Bioware (Mass Effect 2, even though published by EA)
-Koas Studios (Frontlines: Fuel of War)
-Team Ninja (DoA / Ninja Gaiden 2)
-Namco Bandai
-Cyanide (Blood Bowl)
-SNK Playmore (Samurai Shodown 4)
-Behemoth
BTW Insomniac are owned by SONY they have to make a "game every year" yet with mediocre graphics
It's not another language to many of us. So the fact that you're not in the target audience is his problem? You're the gamer, not the developer. You're the test subject, not the scientist. Don't get mad just because you don't understand the scientists.
I mean he isn't just trash talking it... He is talking about specific issues. Issues that he had confirmed outsourcing orange box porting to the ps3(because they couldn't do it in house) and got a sub par port and no post release support.
Now there are more people who know how to program for the ps3 and it have probably become easier too with updated developer tools from sony. Gabe wasn't wrong and he hasn't changed, the world has.
2. Windows 7 RC will not be available since irs trades launch and I will have to buy it(Usually I don't midn to buy windows since I used to try Red Hat, FreeBSD, Slackware which are honestly a crap in comparison to 1st one). Oh, at least the cost for home distro of win is about 150 USD for Vista and about 200 USD for Win7.
Its amazing to hear him talk about how complicated the PS3 coding is, yet its far easier to develop a game on a ps3 and transfer the code to the 360. Devil May Cry 4 only took a week to port to the 360 after being developed on the PS3...kinda makes me doubt his education :P Granted, this WAS 2006 lol
@Cili1000XL EA was publishing games for Valve and again forced them to port the game over to PS3. There are a lot of politics behind games but you'd never know if you don't look. Developers usually don't talk about a system being complicated or anything negative because they don't want to be seen bad-mouthing it or the publishers don't want to cut out that demographic in order to make more money.
Valve and more specifically Gabe are very honest, with their customers and with their opinions.
@Cili1000XL Also unless you've developed specifically for the PS3 porting it over is more difficult. Lots of people including developers have already discussed this.
I understood your point. Indeed it doesn't bother me. You are right. I only wanted you to understand our point of view. It is your choice whether to play PC, console ot whatever you prefer. The rest about games is kind of particular platform services and/or support offered.
At first he says PS3 sucks, then leaves 360 and goes to PS3 praising it's awesomness...never change Gabe.
Do you realize how much Sony's flipped their image since the PS3 launch? They launched an insanely expensive console with foreign architecture to the majority of coders and had the lowest market share for a very long time this generation. It was only until Sony slashed prices and started working with developers (Sony actually came to Valve offering to help them develop on the PS3) that they started actually making progress this generation.
Gabe talks the most sense and benefits us gamers the most compared to those revenue hungry corporations.
He is truly a game nerd at heart, but an incredibly insightful and with deep knowledge in the history of gaming industry. My God, he made analogy with Sega Saturn and PS3! It never occurred to me of such obvious resemblance. All the technical talks aside, he's similar to Steve Jobs - they are, I think, cut from the same cloth.
@BornRuffian1 i never said i thought the ps3 made more money than steam, i was saying that he would have made more money if he had written code for the ps3. might want to actually read the comment next time.
Don't confuse great internet deals with real life prices.
Im talking going to the computer store and purchasing parts, not those great deals you find after days of searching on the internet.
There would be no TF2 without valve, but TF was originally a Quake Mod that was later made into a HL mod [TFC] and eventually ending up what it is today, thanks to Valve. I wouldn't say they made TF, they just gave Walker and others a platform to make it better, and what it is today. Yeah, hats, w/e, it's still an amazing MP game that gets amazing content updates regularly :D
that's going to be the biggest setback for ps3 owners. programing specifically for ps3 requires 7 times the work it seems but if youve seen kill zone 2, that was specifically developed to take full advantage of the ps3s 7 independent processing elements it looks like its worth the effort. i just hope developers will take the time to program specifically for ps3 because im curious to see what the ps3 is capable of.
It's funny how the exact opposite happened to the PS3. Most developers developed their games for the Xbox 360 and then ported it over to PS3. This is why most non-exclusive games run better on the Xbox 360 than they do on the PS3.
Even most of the exclusives ran badly. Uncharted: Drake's Fortune (2007) has framerate drops and tearing throughout the game, Metal Gear Solid 4 and Infamous 1 have double buffering and inconsistent framerate, God of War 3 and Ascension target 60 but they mostly run at 45 or 30. And Resistance games (mostly 2 and 3) have graphics worse that CoD on the same system while running at 30 or bellow while a comparable CoD would hit 60fps with ease.
I love the PS3 but I have to admit, it is an absolute disaster of a console.
@@nunosa528you never played on a playstation 3
@@nunosa528
1 if you had played youd know gow 3 and ascension target 30 fps,but run with better framerate than that,and theres literally no xbox 360 title that graphically compares to these two,and to this day gow3,ascension humiliate modern games graphics.
2 i never got those framerate drops you're reporting,on exclusives.
Too right. I've only played Prototype demo but it is just one of those really solid and incredibly fun sandbox games and deserves a high 80%.
But that kinda supports my opinion, the last three Tomb Raider games have gotten high-70% to low-80% scores and they really deserve higher just for what solid platformers they are.
And I've since seen reviews of Uncharted 2...
oh
my
God...
It looks AMAZING! I am SO glad I never sold my PS3. Now I just need a 1080p HDMI monitor. (no sarcasm).
My co-worker, the friend of mine, bought newest Wolfenstein and he is unable to play it neither in hi-res nor in low-res with his mid-end 1.4 DualCore. But he plays CS a lot. So what are you talking about? What are you going to proove me? I already have an experience of frequent upgrades for PC in order to play games(Virge, Riva128, Trio3D, GeForce2MX400, how long will it happen?). May be you just need to buy this mid-end PC and start play games on it? Maybe after that you will change your mind.
Actually I agree with this. Piracy is getting worse. At my college whenever we want a game, say Bioshock or Gears, we just find a copy in the Schools Transfer drive, and download the game. Its too easy, And I never even consider buying a computer game now, not for a second. As soon as someone uploads Spore, 1000 students are getting it free...so yea, I Know it hurts the dev, but honestly, why pay 40 bucks when you can get it for free without even wasting the gas to go buy it?
Automatic updates are not possible on consoles since Microsoft and Sony charge money for them. On PC, the updates on valve games are free, so it goes against Microsoft and Sony policies.
Stop lying
it's funny how he talks about automatic updates on display drivers in 2006 and yet here in 2012 we still don't have them....
He is a big fat liar
More to it even than that -- the Cell architecture is unlike any other that they would be writing on for many years. It's not worth it for a game that has been in the market for a very long time.
I mean, yes it cost money for the console developers to redesign a new console and pump them out, but that's how they make money and I'm talking strictly about software. The only console in particular that costs more to develop than on a PC that I can think of is a PS3. That architecture is just a train wreck.
I know for a fact that the guys interviewing him didn't know jack shit and were pretending to be interested. As are most people, probably. But that shit fucking fascinates me. Kudos to someone that knows their shit. I'd DEFINITELY take him if he were giving lectures or was a professor.
at launch the ps3 was aweful, I heard that they didn't support devepers enough. I'm glad they have sorted that now.
Put it this way. PS2 Slimline was a real improvement, it was shrunk by a much larger %, the only reason t couldn't be done again today is Sony's apparent loss in technical competence.
PS2 slimline was so small, less than 2lbs and smaller than a DVD boxset.
PS3 slim is almost as big as the original Xbox and still weighs as much as the Xbox 360.
Yeah, people are NOT buying PS3 Slim for any practical reason but simply because it's new and pretty lookin'. A trend that can't last.
LOL you call me a douche because you disagree with my opinion? WAY to show your maturity, buddy, really strengthening your argument.
@JoshuaWolfWilcox Gabe's not really even a coder. He was talking about conversion from PC coding to PS3 coding, not PS3 to 360.
I hardly could count at least one person who really needs this power as you have described. No one of my friends perform his work at home for purpose other then games, internet surfing, reading books. Those who really work at home use cheap hardware for web programming. mid-class laptop for under 700$ is good enough for home video editing. I still don't know anyone who makes 3d modeling at home. You are right about plug-and-play. It really amazed me. I'm still wondering this simplicity.