Fixing Ungrounded Outlets - An Alternative Option to Rewiring Your Home
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- Опубликовано: 9 май 2019
- Older homes usually have two-prong outlets instead of today's standard three-prong outlets that include a ground wire. Instead of rewiring your home to correct this issue, there is another cheaper way by installing GFCI Outlets on the first outlet in a run.
NOTE: I am not an electrician, nor do I claim to be. Make sure you follow all appropriate safety precautions and electrical codes. Do not attempt this yourself if you are not comfortable working with electricity.
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Check out these other related videos...
Upgrading Two Prong to Three Prong Outlets: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
How to Wire a GFCI Outlet - What's Line vs Load? ruclips.net/video/Uop79H_iqoQ/видео.html
Electrical Outlet Wiring - Home Wiring 101 ruclips.net/video/Dukmv88HXI0/видео.html
All Top Homeowner Electrical Videos: ruclips.net/p/PL4VC0S4HJFr5aDUJSASj9Sji43-YODAC6
You have to install them on every one as there is no ground wire. If you use a grounded device it has to have a gfci on that receptacle
You are wrong guy > The NEC does not allow a three-prong outlet to be installed on a non-grounded circuit unless the circuit is GFCI protected. An electrician can install a GFCI breaker in the panel or a GFCI receptacle at the outlet.Dec 23, 2021 The sticker goes on the outlet with the gfci only. You can not protect other outlets with a gfci receptacle when there is no ground.
You have to install a gfci in every one you with to use grounded devices in. That sticker on the other one is incorrect and you cant just install a grounded plug there. You video is not correct on the NEC as an electrician i have done these jobs and you are wrong and what you are telling people is wrong. Go buy a gfci woodhead ( tester ) they look like your tester and check the other outlets they will NOT trip the gfci which means you are NOT to code.
Love how your wife laughed when she caught your mistake and you tried to play it off! Hahaha so good.
Haha yes she is my sanity check...there may be a few videos with her in the background laughing.
😂 dude forgot he turned the power 📴
The receptacle looked like a little face and the wires (line and load) coming out of the box looks like a person, with they're arms and legs out, jumping in the air.
Better to forget it's off than on!
Sometimes on older houses and by sometimes I mean often if you have metal junction boxes they are indeed grounded they ran a completely different wire to the back of those boxes so if you actually test it it may be grounded and if they are all you need to do is pigtail from the switch to the junction box but if you have a metal box check it you may very well be grounded
To be code compliant, be sure to put the "no ground" sticker provided with the GFCI on the faceplate if you are replacing 2-prong un-grounded outlets. GFCI does not protect by grounding, but by tripping.
Thank you for the clarification of that.
The GFCI outlet should be grounded so it properly works when there's a short on the line.
@@lj2991 - A GFCI does not need a ground to work properly.
Yes, its not code if the sticker isn't on it. Plus the downstream ones should have that and the "GFI protected"; both stickers come with the plug. Lastly it should be noted that modern electronics (computers, TVs, etc) won't have the same protection as a fully grounded plug, that is surge protector circuitry probably won't work.
ground only is to protect equipment. it doesn't protect people
This is such a great video! You explained everything in detail and very thorough. Thank you!
Great siumple explanation.
I did not realize that the GFCI. protects the rest of the run.
Thank you.
Glad this was helpful! I put together a couple other videos that talk about this too if you are interested:
How to Wire a GFCI Outlet - What's Line vs Load? ruclips.net/video/Uop79H_iqoQ/видео.html
Follow-up to this video: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Thank you sooooo much for this video! Oh, if only I had access to this information 20 years ago when we bought our house. LOL! But it is very useful info now. I'm going to go around the house and install a GFCI outlet in each room as you outlined. Blessings to you!
Much easier to swap circuit breakers for dual protection AFCI/GFCI circuit breakers -but in either case, have an electrician do it.
Glad it was helpful! I made a follow-up video to this one if you are interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
To whom it may concern. This is not intended to ground the circuit which is required of many devices for protection and functionality. Putting a gfci on the line side of a circuit allows you, by code, replace 2 prong outlets with modern 3 prong HNG outlets which allows you to plug in devices without those 3 to 2 prong adapters. The greater benefit is in case of you becoming the ground it will cut the power to that circuit and hopefully you won't die.
Unfortunately routing existing circuits is usually never that straight forward especially in older buildings. And also code requires nowadays for the outlets should be wrapped with tape across the terminals and mounted inside a box extension when they are mounted in a metal box... especially in wooden paneling. And always use the screws not the lazy mans quick connect and if you have 3 pairs of wires, pig tail 'em.
Where in the NEC does it say thay? Hmmmm?
I do all of that,for safety and good practices, also ,the job is done in a more professional presentation.,
Great video, can hardly wait to implement your plan. I was very apprehensive about having to rip the lathe and plaster apart in an investment home I just acquired. Your presentation was exemplary. Thanks so much!
Glad it was helpful! I know you posted this a while back but I actually put together a follow-up video that you might be interested in where I answer a lot of the comments from this one: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
In the gfci breaker bos are stickers saying "No Equipment Ground." Code requires use of them on both receptacles!
Great point. I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
You should use your voltage detector on a known live outlet first, then test the outlet you will be working on. Alternatively, plug a lamp into that outlet before flipping the breaker off. Otherwise, if the tester is broken you will be in for a nasty surprise. Generally a small bedroom has all outlets on the same circuit, do not assume this is true. One of my bedrooms has outlets on two separate circuits, I wasn't previously aware of it but discovered that when teaching my son to check each outlet before working on it.
I've watch videos all day and so far this is the best one! It makes sense as to why half of my kitchen no longer has outlets that work and probably because the new outlet with that protection was put on the 2nd to last out that in the string
The wiring starts with a switch at my kitchen counter to a plug on my kitchen counter for 2 things to be plugged in like a microwave and a phone and then the Plug for the garbage disposal no longer works which is where I put the plug your talking about
Mind you before that didn't work I replaced and outlet in the middle of the 3 I mentioned with just a regular plug and it doesn't work help
Thanks for watching! I have a couple other videos that talk about GFCI outlets if you are interested:
How to Wire a GFCI Outlet - What's Line vs Load? ruclips.net/video/Uop79H_iqoQ/видео.html
Also, I just published a follow-up to this one answering the biggest questions: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Excellent descriptive video. Thanks for that!
Sure thing!
This is a good option in older homes. GFCI outlets are significantly more expensive than regular 3 prong outlets, so use one GFCI "upstream" of the other outlets in each circuit. One thing to be aware of is many older homes like my 1949 home are not wired with all the outlets in one room on the same circuit. In fact, no room in my house is wired that way. For example, there may be one of the outlets in the living room, another above it in a bedroom etc. So, I made a booklet of circuit diagrams by going circuit by circuit turning off the power and seeing which outlets and lights had no power. I also traced the exposed wires in the basement to get an idea of which outlet was first in the circuit. The kitchen and also the washer/dryer area were the only grounded circuits. The rest of the 2 prong outlets in the house I upgraded to 3 prong, protecting them with a GFCI at the start of the run, and attaching proper labels them. A lot cheaper than rewiring your house, but providing ground related safety without a ground wire.
Or you can replace the actual breakers to GFCI breakers. It will protect everything on the circuit that breaker feeds
@@terrythomas790 If your place has breakers.
@@ronaldcarson4360 If it doesn't have breakers, have an electrician install a subpanel for the necessary GFCI or AFCI breakers.
1949 home with different circuits in same room. It’s better to have that you room is served by 2 circuits with double the amp capacity of 1. Running a vacuum on one circuit and you won’t trip another outlet like the Window AC.
@@terrythomas790 Very often not possible.
Another option is to replace the breaker with a combination arc-fault and ground-fault breaker. AFCI+GFCI. A little more costly, but easier to implement.
Another note, since I AM and electrician... The stab-in connections on the backs of switches and duplex outlets are for 14 guage wire only and are NOT recommended to be used. These WILL cause problems down the road! Always use the side screw terminals.
Thank you for your input from a clueless individual myself I am learning something new all of the time from comments or videos. Thanks again William it is greatly appreciated.
Stay Blessed
The new cheap outlets have screws pressure tabs that bite into the back wires. I tried pulling them out and couldn’t if the screws are tighten which put pressure on the tabs.
Amen to not using the stab-in connections. They get loose over time, and arc. On an older plug where I lived, plugging into one outlet resulted in a "pop" in a playing radio. A stab-in connector was so loose, it was arcing.
Hey. I'm watching my father install a afci for me and he's plugging in the wires into the back, even though I read him this comment. What kind of problems can I expect in the future? He says the screws on the side don't loosen up enough for him to wire it normally
@@jabberman3000 What gauge of wire is he hooking up? He should have no problem at all if it is 14 or 12 gauge wire! The electrician here says the stab-in connections are crap SO WHO IN THE HELL CAME UP WITH THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE?!! I never use them either. Reminds me of the aluminum wire fiasco where people are NOW TAKING THAT CRAP OUT!!
As the third owner of an older double wide mobile home with signs of DIY electrical work. I sounded out all outlets on each breaker before putting in the GFI outlet your way but did the trip test on all the circuit outlets as I have multiple rooms on common circuits and multiple outlet circuits in some rooms. This may have been allowed by 1981 Colorado MH code and DOT code. Just a heads up that mulitple codes create confusion. LOL at least my outlets and lighting circuits are independent and I now have detailed breaker labels on the main panel.
The most upstream outlet in a room is not necessarily the first outlet on a circuit. It is likely the beaker serving this room provides power to other rooms and hallways. Thank you for including these other links. Viewers would be well served to view them.
Licensed Journeyman Wireman here. The GFCI should be on the first receptable from the panel. The "room" has nothing to do with it.
He does mention “on the run, in the room” a few times. It’s a bit of an odd phrase given that most homes (especially ones that don’t have ground!) Wouldn’t have a run for every room but it halfway checks out.
Wiring style now is to wire from outlet to outlet. Wiring style then was to wire to a central light and wire down to each receptacle from there. Precludes a gfci protect a whole circuit, you have to put one at every receptacle. You then have to consider a panel Full of gfci breakers. Then you realize that we have few(none) problems in homes with ungrounded homes, we are trying to address a problem that really doesn't exist. Who are we trying to please? Insurance companies.
Wouldn't GFI breakers be even better?
@@anonamouse5917 GFI breakers would be fine. Cost is usually a factor. I just priced a GFI breaker at HD for $40 a breaker. A pack of 4 GFI outlets run around $55. Either way is perfectly fine.
@@justice4scalia846 Who are we trying to please? The homeowner and the people in the home. This is done to solve a problem; which is trying to plug a 3 prong plug in a house with 2 prong receptacles. And as a benefit, the receptacles (but not any light switches upstream) are a little bit safer.
One thing you should know is to never use those quick connect holes on the back of the plugs! Those holes only have a small thin piece of metal on each side that grabs your wire and has hardly any contact being made which in turn causes excess heat. Over time these will get worse for having a good connect from being too hot, especially if there’s a heavy load drain on the plug in and it will fail and burn thru. I have replaced many of these plugs over the years that have been plug in these holes that failed and the plug and wires are burnt and the box inside often shows burnt marks as well. It’s a huge fire hazard using these electrical holes. You should alway and I do mean ALWAYS wrap your wires around the screws having enough of the wire insulation cut off so plenty of the bare wires is making as much contact with the screws as possible to have the absolutely best contact they can get! Talk to any license electrician and they’ll tell you the same thing I am here! I’m not a electrician, but I’ve been a contractor for over 18 years and have worked along side many electricians over the years and have had more then one electrician warn me to never use those quick connections holes on the plugs! Big NO NO!
Good information thank you!
I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions. You can watch it here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
quit spreading misinformation . I am an electrician and have seen just as many outlets burned out with wires on the terminals only. if this was true it wouldn't have passed UL testing. when you actually get a certification then you can talk.
@@johndoen3751 the situation described by "op" is if a constant (maybe 14amp) load is present then it will over heat, but everything can fail with fatigue. It's like part 15 of the fcc regulations.
Yes pigtail everything
Thank you for this. So helpful.
I love that giggle at the beginning since you cut the power already… lol this video was super helpful though. Thank you!
Trying to keep things real! Glad the video helped
When you have exposed wires (7:10) you should wire nut / cap them and then turn on the power. This will prevent any accidental arcing or shorting should someone or a pet "tamper" with the wires once you turn on the power. Next, use your tester to test the wire sheathing to find the hot wire(s). I heard little kids voices in the background so this is just another safety measure for anyone in the house that might accidently touch the wires when you turn the breaker back on.
Great point! I talked about this in my latest video. It's here if you're interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
99% of the time it will be the outlet closest to the power panel and if you have open space like a basement below you may be able to fish a ground wire down and the surge suppressors have something to drain to. Check with your local electrical inspector. Retired IBEW 292.
Good video. Concise and to the point.
Pretty informative, I didn't know this . Thank you
Thanks for the comment! I put together a follow-up video as well that you might be interested in: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
the hot wire you tested does not necessarily mean its the first outlet in the chain. There may still be an outlet "upstream" from the one you installed the GFCI on. It may even be in a different room. That one, as well as any others before the GFCI protected outlet, will be unprotected.
👍
Totally agree!
The accurate way to figure out which is the first receptacle is to map the entire circuit, make sure none of the receptacles have anything plugged into them, make sure all light switches are off, disconnect all the wires on all the receptacles and switches ...and then do a continuity check back to the panel.
...Which of course, nobody is going to actually do. :-)
...Which is why it's better to figure out which circuit breaker it's on and replace it with a dual purpose GFCI/AFCI circuit breaker. This is the new standard for the 2014 NEC is AFCI protection instead of just GFCI protection. Since you have to change the circuit breaker anyway, there's no point in fussing with receptacles (unless it's broken or something).
The exception for me would be a kitchen or bathroom upgrade where a standard (grounded or not) receptacle needs to be GFCI protected. I mean, if you get out of the shower in a towel or your in the middle of cooking dinner, am I going to make you go out to the garage or down to the basement to flip a breaker? That is cruel. In that case, AFCI breaker and GFCI receptacle at that location.
This is based on NEC 406.4 (D) -specifically (D) (2) and (D) (4)
You should naturally test the installation. After you are done, press test and verify that all sockets you changed are dead. Then reset it an test that they all work.
But if one does not change that outlet then it is not relevant.
Yes, I wasn't very clear on that point in this video. I made a follow-up that talks about this: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
I never leave wires open, even for a few minutes. I would cover the wires with either a wire nut or a fold of electrical tape. Since it’s temporary, I just cut the tape to about 2 inches, lay it over the end of the wire, and fold it back on itself. Makes it easy to remove.
Ha. I change them out live 🤷🏻♂️.
I’m not saying I don’t change them out live, I just don’t walk away with them live. I’d hate to get interrupted and someone else not realize it was live. Very slim chance, but better safe than sorry. 😢
Finally a video that I can understand...thanks!
Glad it helped!
I wish I'd found your channel several years ago. Good information!
Thank you! I'm glad it's been helpful.
LMAO "because... we killed the power to the outlet...!"
Lazy guy......
"I'll edit that"
Lmaoo such a mood 😂
Do not backstab your outlets and switches. Use the screw terminals.
Will Dwyer Always better to use screw terminals ,but it is legal to back stab ..
Legal yes, but so often the wires are over sized for the holes, forced in, and damage the outlet/switch
Found several occasions where the two minute shortcut of using the quickie push in has eventually caused a loss of power in one or more of the outlets further down in the circuit.
Nothing beats the positive crimped connection of the screw terminals.
In life, it's best to avoid backstabbers. "They smile in your face, all the time they wanna take your place, backstabbers"
@@jenvahle and they are very difficult to remove when changing an outlet or switch.
This was very helpful. I might have a sort of unique situation and did not know if I was good or not. I have a large window unit AC connection that is 30 amp. The outlet is one that was installed just to handle that AC unit, so nothing else runs from that outlet (nothing upstream in series). I checked the outlet with a tester and found out it was not grounded. The AC unit itself has one of those breakers that has the green light on the plug which effectively acts like a GFCI breaker. My home is an older home and there have been a couple of after construction wiring to handle modern appliances. Another example is the dryer outlet was wired after the home was constructed. Testing the outlets, I found that all the regular 15-amp outlets were grounded. So, my understanding is that this AC unit is not dangerous.
Thanks for the funny, yet helpful video.
You bet!
I needed that laugh at 1:41 I liked the video because of it. lol
Same lol
Dude Netscape takes me back😎
ok~i had learned more,thank you.
Sure thing! I actually put together a follow-up video that clarifies some of the questions others have posted too: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Wow very helpful thanks 🙏
Thank you this was very very helpful
Thanks for sharing. Just a suggestion, wrap electrical tape over the screws to prevent accidental shorting to the metal box.
Yeah. That's in the NEC now.
@@bgarrison67 what code article requires this?
@@AdirondackCampingAdventures it's called a courtesy wrap...union electrician here...IBEW Local 11......dont ask any questions just do as your told!
@@AdirondackCampingAdventures It's not a code requirement, but it's very good practice. I require it of all our journeymen. I also don't let them energize without covers in place, no matter how much they dislike it.
I've had it up to here with the mucho-machos who think 120VAC can't kill you.
@Brian Uehlein believe what you want, but that tape may be the difference between an amateur getting electrocuted or not when he takes out the receptacle to work on it. It is imprudent to advise against this practice since this comment section is flooded with amateurs.
To test for line in, you just disconnect one black and see if the outlet is powered. Be sure to turn off breakers when wiring. If not powered, it’s certain that the other black is the line in.
Thank you for your informational video, keep sharing Sir.
Thanks, I appreciate that! I made a follow-up video that talks about a lot of the comments I've received on this video and answers a lot of questions. You can watch it here if you're interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
thanks for the info man, it really helped
Glad it helped! Because this video has gotten so many comments I made a follow-up video if you're interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Thanks i liked the video . can you show the part of you actually putting in the wires and buttoning up the outlet.
I know this is an old comment but I wanted to let you know I've come out with some follow-up videos recently. This one talks about wiring a GFCI receptacle but doesn't show the process of putting it back in the box. How to Wire a GFCI Outlet - What's Line vs Load? ruclips.net/video/Uop79H_iqoQ/видео.html I have another video planned for the complete install.
This idea ONLY works in houses/locations where the wiring at each outlet provides a "line" and "load" set of conductors. The GFCI device is inserted at the first outlet (nearest the source) in the circuit and protects all the remaining outlets sourced from the "load" pair of wires. MANY older houses were wired using a system called "knob and tube" wiring (that used porcelain knobs and tubes to insulate the wires from the wood framing). With that system, all the splicing that extends the live circuit conductors to additional outlets is done "INSIDE THE WALLS" so each outlet only has two conductors. This means the circuit cannot be interrupted/protected by a GFCI device.
I agree, for knob and tube there really is only one option and that's rewiring the house. Thanks for your comment!
@@TopHomeowner
Unfortunately !! Or, running a ground conductor to each outlet given access to a "crawl" space below the outlets, of course.
Sure it can, you just need to use only GFCI outlets. The load side is optional.
@@TopHomeowner Yeah, I'll get right to that as soon as I win the lottery, lol.
VERY GOOD VIDEO THANKS
Great job with the video. How can you tell which one is the first outlet on the run? I have a three floor home so does it start from the top floor down or the bottom floor up?
Unfortunately my house doesn’t have any ground wires with the outlets and some of the light fixtures. I’m trying to fix these issues without breaking the bank if you know what I mean… Thank you!
I’m no electrician but I think receptacles look more like surprised faces
I'm pretty sure that outlet was saying, "Oooohh noooo, Mr Bill !!!"
D=
As an electrician, I can confirm, the receptacles do look like surprised faces.
😮
Good one, what's the technical term for that. Oh well, your reply takes the cake for being the most TERMINALLY funny.
A good idea would’ve been to check for a ground inside the metal box with a voltage tester. Very often the metal box is grounded, either by the metal wire jacket or the ground wires themselves but they are attached to the metal box on the outside where they can’t be seen. If you can determine that the box is grounded, then you can install self-grounding outlets. Or do what you saw with the green ground wire in that one outlet you pulled out. A GFCI needs to be grounded to work properly.
Actually GFCI doesn't need a ground to work: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
A GFCI measures the current going out of the hot and back into the neutral if there's 5ma difference it trips. The ground on a GFCI work the same as any other outlet and doesn't effect the trip function what so ever. Additionally it's against code to use a raceway or a steel/aluminum armor as a ground. They can experience galvanic corrosion and essentially become resistors never tripping the breaker. I found a pump in a funeral home using the bx sheathing as a neutral for years due to a failed solder joint up the line, never tripped the breaker. They'd been turning the pump on with a wooden stick since the 90s.
Also, just checking for a grounded box may not be enough. A tester may light with a poor ground, but not be enough t trip te breaker if a hot wire hits the boss, if fact a high resistance ground could overheat and cause a fire.
If I go with this option, in the possibility of a power surge/blackout will this protect my other electronics in that room downstream essentially like a surge protector?
I had someone powerwash my home, since then my two outdoor outlet and garage outlets not working. I reset the circuit breaker still not avail. I do not see any GFCI outlet in garage or outdoor. Do you have any if the issue is in circuit breaker or the outlet outside is causing no power to all the connected outlets.
Looked to me like one light on in thereafter so still had open ground yeah or nay?
Of course it had open ground. The whole point was what to do when you have no ground wire.
@@okaro6595 If there is an open ground then a G.F.C.I. won't work properly. They were not made to substitute for a ground.
@@dlighted8861 Not again. Why do people make that bogus claim hundreds of times. The functioning of the GFCI has been explained dozens of times in the comments.A GFCI monitors the current between live and neutral. If there is an imbalance more than 5 mA it cuts both those wires. Such an imbalance means that current escapes to the ground, possibly through some person. The ground wire is in no way involved in the operation though grounding can help in creating the fault. If the equipment s grounded the GFCI or even the circuit breaker cuts the power immediately at the fault. If it is ungrounded it might happen only when someone touches it so it could sting but the GCFI prevents dangerous shock. The fact that unless installation is very old sockets in wet rooms are grounded anyway.
Nobody ck aims that it is a substitute to ground. All new installations need to be grounded. This is just for fixing old installations.
I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions. You can watch it here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Best option is to run a ground wire.
Another option is if the breaker panel already uses the metal fresh water pipe as ground, find a pipe close to the outlet that has continuity to there.
That used to be legal until plumbers started doing plumbing repairs using PVC, ABS or PEX pipes, breaking continuity to electrical grounding. If you temporarily ground the box to a pipe, you must make sure the continuity is not broken by PEX plumbing splices. If there is such a splice, plumbing code requires a 6 gauge or thicker jumper between the metal pipes to keep the bonding continuous. It is, of course, better to use type L grade copper pipe to repair a water pipe leak on a copper water line.
No, do not improvise. This method is up to the code, running wires to pipes is not.
Can you go ahead and install a gfci in the plug down the line just si you can have 3 prongs anyway?
Thanks.. very helpful ..
As of the 2017 NEC, when replacing receptacles you need to comply with tamper resistant receptacles and AFCI requirements. Also the GFCI method will not protect electronic equipment that requires a ground. This method is usually done by house flippers as a cheap fix.
Electronic equipment does not require a ground. It is only there to protect you from being electrocuted if hot becomes shorted to the metal chassis of the device. Under normal conditions, the device is forbidden to allow more than a few mA of current to flow through the ground wire. That is why dryer outlets used to not have a neutral but then had to add one because the manufacturers were too cheap to use a 220v AC/DC power supply for the electronics and instead were returning 120v through the ground wire. This was not allowed.
Phillip Susi,
Grounding wire carries no current. If it was being used as a neutral then it would have a current on it. But three prong dryer plugs have 2 hots (220V) and a ground. No neutral was needed. The reason for neutrals now is because of the other electronics on the device requiring a neutral.
@@phillipsusi1791 TVSS needs an EGC for proper operation. You want the surge protector to take the hit before electronic equipment.
THE NEC STATES EACH OUTLET MUST HAVE A GFCI RECECTACLE AND A LABEL. WHAT HE IS DOING IS DEAD WRONG.
@@TheForgottenMan270 The ground wire does carry the leak current. Typical leak current of various devices (PCs, fridges etc.) are in the order of half a milliampere.
The old dryer socket used combined neutral and ground. This is far from ideal so it was changed.
Other than kitchens, I prefer ground fault breakers. Far too often these receptacles end up behind a heavy piece of furniture, like a book case, which makes them difficult to reset. Sometimes people don't know they are there and call an electrician. Put it in the panel.
can you put them in the panel and not in the wall ??? i have a few receptacle that show open ground and want to put gfi breakers in the panel ...will that work???? thank you
Hey I am trying to install an outlet with the only 2 wires black and white but it did not worked could not find the ground wire. What can be done?
good info. thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
As a home inspector this will not pass a home inspection. I have found many outlets where people have done this exact same thing. Sure it will protect you the homeowner, as the GFCI will flip with or without a ground, but it will in no way protect the equipment that needs a ground. If fact if you plug something in that requires a ground (i.e. computer, tv, etc.) you can actually void the warranty if it so states that in the manual of your electronic device. Also as a side not I have seen people use these GFCIs (with no ground) and then plug a surge suppressor into the GFCI. This also does absolutely nothing and will not protect the electronic equipment since there is, in effect, no ground. So do this at your own peril and expect to either change these 3 holes (no ground) back to a 2 hole outlet so that there is not a false perception that these have a ground. Or be prepared to rewire your house correctly when you intend to sell. Just my two cents.
Woke up this morning and wanted to say that I am in no way trying to bash this guy on his video. There are lots of things you can do around the house to save money on repairs and be just fine. I just feel that electricity is not something you want to cut corners on. It could not only cause fires but worse kill you or someone else. I haven't watched his other videos but I am sure there are some great things he has that can help a diy'er. Just please be careful when it comes to electrical. Your life is worth more than the money you might save.
@@solarpower2020 You are more than absolutely correct , For as dangerous as electricity is , You cannot afford to cut corners , The best solution is to install the proper wiring with the ground wire, If I was wiring a house , The outlets would be on 20 amp AFCI breakers and AFCI/ GFCI breakers where GFCI protection is required , Do it right , Definitely not worth the risk of you and/or your loved ones getting electrocuted from a shock or getting burned to death from a fire ,
All new circuits must be on arc fault interrupting breakers and where GFCI protection is required , Those circuits must be arc fault protected as well , In wiring a house , I would have the light fixtures separate from the outlets , Also when it comes to outlets and switches , I always use the professional or commercial grade because they're much safer than those cheap outlets and switches that cost a little more than a dollar , Which are way more than worth it , I just did a wiring job for my sister's ladyfriend and her husband , they wanted two outlets installed at the counter top they just had installed in the basement , Which was renovated into a rec room , I put the outlets on a separate 20 amp breaker that has both AFCI and GFCI protection because outlets in the basement require GFCI protection and with new wiring , Must also have AFCI Protection , Afterwards they were really pleased because it was done right with top quality materials and they can use it with confidence , I am very strict about electrical safety and if it's not gonna be done right , I won't do it , I've turned down jobs where they want to cut corners and they had to look for someone else because I won't go there
@@solarpower2020 Also if I was a home inspector , I wouldn't pass that inspection either , Installing grounded outlets where there's no ground wire is a violation of The National Electrical Code
@@ironmartysharpe8293 Cite the code, because you are wrong.
Home inspectors don't have the correct answer. If you want the correct answer go to your local town and ask to talk to an ELECTRICAL inspector!
Most all boxes with a 2 prong receptacle are not big enough to install a gfci, now you have another code violation. Box count---device, size and number of wires determine the size of the box required. But just stuff and pound it in anyway, n be sure to smash those wires nice n thight.
Good point. In that situation, it's better to swap the breaker for a dual protection GFCI/AFCI breaker. :-)
"now you have another code violation" No you don't. The volume allowances for a traditional duplex receptacle and a duplex GFCI receptacle are exactly the same. You need to review box fill calculations.
@@MrBluelock depends on location. We are not allowed to use anything smaller than a 4” box. But we also run conduit. No 1/2 ass romex here
THANK YOU
Good vid. Easy enough for laymen to follow. Any more than this, you should really hire an electrician
Thanks! This video got a lot of comments so I just put together a follow-up video if you are interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
A revolutionary idea I know, but a good fix for “we already cut power to this outlet...” would be to take a few moments to pause recording, turn back on the power, show the test, then cut power again...
Hell, you could even go back and edit in a clip of testing the power on a different circuit just to illustrate what the procedure and result looks like.
Nice video... thanks for the info.
So after installing the GFCI, all the down stream outlets will still show open ground right?
Yes, that's correct.
Jing Chen They never seem to come right out and say it: A GFCI receptacle doesn’t provide a ground but it does allow you to plug in a 3-prong plug (provided you haven’t exceeded the limit for wattage on the circuit.)
And you must label the
outlet ‘No Equipment Ground.’
Which is still not grounded... which is still incorrect
I cover this point as well as some others in a follow-up video: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
How do you know what is the first outlet in the room? What happens if I put the GFCI outlet in a position where it's not the first in the room? Is the outlet still protected? Thanks!
Found ur video interesting n helpful to change outlets without ground. Will check if ok to change some outlets to GFCI utilizing ur info. . Thanks for video.
I made a follow-up video that answers some more questions too if you are interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Thanks for watching!
Uhhh, your test still came up with no ground at the end there.... what did we accomplish here?
Adding a GFCI outlet does not give you an equipment grounding conductor. You still have a 2 wire ungrounded circuit. It is against code to install a 3 prong receptacle in a 2 wire circuit unless the receptacle is GFCI. The GFCI gives you some level of protection due to either equipment being damaged, or wiring damage itself.
@@jeremiegrund what about of you use metal box and screw the ground wire to metal box... its count as grounded???... or in other words use GFI first and start wire from there 3 prong outlet is that correct alternatives???
@@jaandel1 If I understand your question correctly, the answer is no. As Jeremie Grund said, adding a GFCI outlet does not give you a ground. So there is no point in connecting a ground wire between the box and _any_ receptacle unless there is a ground wire connecting the device box back to the electrical panel. The GFCI just detects current leaving the circuit and going through something other than the load, like a human.
Lighting Guy The point is not to connect a ground, but to provide ground fault protection against current running to ground through your body.
@@jaandel1 Adding a ground wire and attaching it to a metal box DOES NOT make a true ground. A true ground ALWAYS terminates at the breaker panel.
It is not approved to have changed the original 2 prong ungrounded to a 3 prong . However adding a gfci receptacle is an approved device if adding a label displaying ungrounded outlet.
MrTHEBRITINWA down leg from the gfci is ‘legal’ by NEC to change 2 prong to 3 prong as long as you add the appropriate labels! GFCI PROTECTED & NO EQUIPMENT GROUND
@@coypatton3160 It is also legal if you have the GFCI on the electric panel. Then you do not need to use any GFCI outlets. Same rye in marking apply.
I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
so where did you attach the grounding wire to the GFCI? i saw no ground wire connected
Use wirenuts and pigtails then use screws on the side for connection
White wire on silver
Hot wire on copper colored
Yes, thats also a good option. Thanks!
Just to be clear, it seems the GFCI and the 'downstream' outlets will all still test as "open ground".
The GFCI test button must be used to confirm the outlets are safe.
You are correct; GFCIs add SAFETY, not an equipment ground. So this might protect someone from getting shocked, but it won't stop feedback/static on audio equipment.
I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
If its bx wire with metal box then pigtail a bond jumper to the box then your outlet will be BONDED with the grounding system of its true all the way back to panel. Armor on the wire can make a good bond but not truly grounded. Put a gfci with the not grounded sticker to identify it
@john accettola not grounded, but bonded
@john accettola Have never seen any inspector "fail" an electrical installation (at time of sale) that was in compliance with the code in effect at the time of installation. Yes, if it's a "change of use" to a different hazard class, then non-grounded receptacles (and wiring method) may become an issue.
Is there a certain type of GFCI that you have to use ,on a no ground circuit ?
Those holes in the back of the outlets should be illegal. I have replaced several outlets in my house and several of the wires have just fallen out of the back of the outlet.
@1:44, wife is giggling and thinking, "you BIG Duffuss!"
OK my question is, if you’re using a GFCI outlet you still need a ground that is correctly installed back to breaker box. By adding a ground fault outlet you still need a proper ground to make it work and be safe. So can you explain how you fix the ground when it showed it wasn’t working?
Justin, I have two suggestions. One option is to (if they are available for your Breaker Box) replace the standard breaker with a AFCI/GFCI combo breaker. This will connect to the ground in the Load Center and protect ALL outlets on the circuit. The second option, if your Breaker Box is in a fairly hidden area, is to add a GFCI outlet immediately next to the Breaker Box, connecting that circuit from the breaker to the GFCI with new ROMEX, then connect the original branch circuit wiring to the load side of that GFCI.
justin eben no you don’t !!! To properly install one it only takes two wires so I could be ran without a ground
Its NEC compliant to replace with a GFI as long as you label it with "no equipment ground"
@@JeffPenaify but it won't protect you if the whole branch circuit does not have a ground.
@@donski1519 I didnt say smart I said N.E.C. compliant 😂
Yea, I live in a old apartment. Some of the tenants left and those apartments need renovations. The people that was doing told the landlord they need to upgrade all the power to the building. Haha. Used to be if we ask we will get our rent increased. Now every one gets their power upgraded and we now have GROUND. Yahoo. I am very happy. Also, more amps. I started to upgrade my surge protector and power strip for higher wattage. Now I can use portable AC, vacuum cleaner, and high wattage microwave.
You do not get more amps from a ground.
@@michaelhinchey You do if the electrical service was properly upgraded...
After doing this, is it safe to use the outlet for a grounding mat?
I would never recommend back stab outlets use the screws not the push in. And never with stranded wire.
I'm currently replacing outlets which have melted due to failed backstabs.
People aren't exaggerating when they say it's a fire hazard, so yes, spend the extra time wrapping the wires around the screws or spend the extra money on outlets that use the screw clamp method.
I'm somewhat convinced that the powers to be that promote and approve codes are doing it for the money. Years ago, aluminum wire, being cheaper, was sold as the wire of future - until it was found to be a fire hazard. I think the backstab outlets are heading the same way. My house is built cheap (vs inexpensive). There's a lot of foam, sawdust and glue. The garge isn't insulated. I'll be lucky if it outlasts the mortgage.
had a backstab fail and fry the circuitboard in our furnace... $600 repair because some bloke chimped on a $0.30 outlet.
@@Belboz99 Motor loads do not like undervoltages from weak connections: they will pull more current to make their power and things go downhill fast, wherever your loose/dirty connection is. There are voltage monitoring devices you can install to cutout your motor load [by interrupting controls] and also tunable overcurrent monitors - motor savers or protection relays, depending on manufacturer. Things like well pumps and hvac can get saved if you ever have a brownout in your area - but it will not save a motor from itself in the event it goes bad. I like to have an auxilary contact that I can use for a remote indication in case it ever trips [a light or small buzzer] when equipment is awkward to get at [such as an attic unit or remote pump house/station]. Work with your electrician on exactly what you need/can be sourced locally, but here is just one example: www.galco.com/buy/Macromatic/VAKP120A
Generally, I find setting a protection device at 110% of full load amps for the motor being monitored works well - one unit per motor gives me the best peace of mind. For undervoltage protection settings, 15% under normal line voltage should work ok - this needs a little testing perhaps, to make sure that when large loads kick on the starting current does not trip other units [a delay or 'pickup' setting is available on some units]. Large loads are a comparative term [relating to size of your power transformer], but droop is another subject.
Cinnabar Sonar that’s because it was poorly installed. Backstabbing has nothing to do with it. If you follow the directions right and do it correct. You’re fine. Ive seen backstabbed outlets from the 70s still working today.
I didn't know I just needed one OMG I almost bought a ton of them 😂
@Milan Kraguljac no.. that's only true for grounded wiring. He needs to do all of them because of the lack of ground. Yes I'm licensed
@@CybekCusal so this video is bull, he installed a gfci in the first outlet in the circuit like you would to any grounded circuit but clearly his circuit was not grounded. This does seem like a quick and dirty fix to me, but is tearing out dry wall to run a ground wire the only legitimate fix? I have a couple rooms like this.
@@Edaloy27 you can have two prong receptacles (no ground) or just install gfci in each receptacle box. Both options are code compliant. What's not compliant is a 3 prong receptacle without a ground wire connected.
@@CybekCusal Thanks, that makes sense to me.
Would have been quicker to just replace all the outlets with GFI outlets.
Thank you very much.
You are welcome! I made a follow-up video to this one as well that answers a lot of the questions in the comments if you are interested: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
I pulled out an old electric outlet, to replace it with a GFCI.
I accidentally touched some part of the old outlet while removing it on the metal box, and saw a small spark. (I thought the fuse was out, but maybe I had the wrong fuse out).
Now, I am reading 14 volts from hot to neutral, and from hot to the metal box(ground). I've pulled every fuse in the panel, and still see 14 volts!
Note, the outlet was working fine before my accident (although the hot/neutral were reversed).
What did I do break when that old receptacle sparked? Did I burn/short a wire, or junction? How do I find the problem. I cannot use continuity tests since I have 14 volts present. Help!
I love how the tester shows open ground at the end of the vid, and he is happy about that
So? What did you expect it to show?
@@okaro6595 You clearly don´t understand what´s the function of grounding...
@@bror8228 really? Please explain.
I made a follow-up video that talks about this and answers some other questions. You can watch it here: ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
How did you ground the gfci without a ground wire?
GFCI outlets will prevent shock and electrocution. Always check your local electrical codes to see if this is acceptable in your area.
The outlet still has no safety ground. This GFCI is an acceptable workaround
for older wiring with no ground conductor. Need two stickers on the second
outlet. "GFCI PROTECTED" and "NO GROUND" Thank you.
@bad Good It does offer protection without an equipment ground by monitoring difference in current between hot and neutral, which means current is leaking to another source.....so yes a GFCI can operate without the EGC.
Hi please help i need to ask. I need to know if i can put in a same room 2 of this type of outlet . The home its old and has in that room 2 outlets 2 prongs and i will put there a new washer machine and a small fridge.. did you recomend using this for washer and fridge? I need to ask if i connect without using the ground and the system has a fault if the outlet will tripp? For bee honest i didnt decide what outlet use. The outlet box its metal i beleved but i dont know of it grpunded. Can i use a screw for attacth a cable to a new regular 3 prong outlet to the box or if better the GFCI outlet?
GFCI will provide more protection (safety) but not a true ground. I still recommend installing a true grounded outlet whenever possible but that's not always an option. I think the washer would be OK, but typically you don't want to plug a fridge into a GFCI because there is a higher chance for the power to be shut off, which could spoil your groceries. I hope this helps
Very good demo. Glad I watched I was worried about buying a home with this issue
You just need to install a AFCI/GFCI breaker in the panel. It will protect the whole circuit without having to determine the "first" outlet.
How do you add GFCI breakers to pre-1960's boxes that only have fuses?
He didn't actually show the wires being hooked up properly to the installed GFCI! Unbelievable.
or the ground process, did I miss it?
@@loudaddy2001 You just missed the whole point.
@8:57 he shows it
@@Fabyfakid
He speaks it. He does not show himself actually doing anything.
Did you connect the GFCI to ground wire that was coming from service panel? Or only to hot and neutral?
The whole point of the video is to do when there is no ground wire so ground wire is not connected. If you have a ground wire you must use it.
It is acceptable by NEC as long as you place the appropriate labels. On the GFCI that means a NO EQUIPMENT GROUND label. Any regular receptacles down-leg also need a GFCI PROTECTED label in addition to the NO EQUIPMENT GROUND label.
Why isn't the receptical grounded? Is the box wired with BX wire? If so add a ground screw to the metal box with a piece of bare wire.
@@markhammond4539 Like he said in the video, the wire was originally run with only 2 conductor wire, no ground. The metal box also is not grounded he said.
This video helped a lot. Now what do you suggest when wiring a new ceiling fan to black 2 wires in an older home?
Glad it helped! If you only have 2 black wires (and no white) then you'll need to figure out which one is hot with the voltage tester I showed in the video. Just be sure to put wire caps on the wires when testing (i missed that part in this video) so you don't risk getting shocked.
The missing ground wire provides the safety path for the current when a fault occurs, such as a piece of equipment shorting to its case.
Backstabbing is usually OK for 14 gauge runs with solid wire. Unless an experienced user wraps it around the screws, wrapping is more likely to fail than backstabbing, which is at least idiot proof.
@billyrayband: yes, but the point of the video is that you don't NEED a grounding wire if you properly install a GFCI receptacle when you replace your ungrounded receptacles with "grounding-type" (three-slot). The GFCI works fine without it and provides ground-fault protection that a mere "grounding wire" won't. For instance, a grounding wire won't save your life when there is a fault in your neutral that opens the neutral and puts it into contact with the appliance enclosure. You could get zapped unless you also have a GFCI.
Dumbest thing I’ve heard. Haven’t heard anyone say wrapping is more likely to fail then a backstab
GFCI receptacles are different. They do not have the backstabbing option. The hole sin the back are secured by the screws.
PLEASE put wire nuts on the bare wires! You can still read if the wires are hot and avoid getting electrocuted!
Rookies!!! Sorry not sorry guys...
oh puulease!
Very informative. I've been trying to figure out how to ground all outlets in my house. I know the breaker box outside is grounded to a copper rod sticking out of the ground. So I'm not sure why all the outlets are not grounded. Maybe it's only the 4 outlets in the converted garage that aren't grounded. There is 1 gfi in the kitchen and 1 gfi in the main bathroom. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks again for the informative video.
Did you verify that the outlets in the house are grounded? And if so, how?
@@surferdude642 The 4 previously mentioned are not grounded and were added in the 60s/70/s. I have not checked the main house outlets that are wired original to the house in the 40s. Whoever converted the garage got no permits because the half bath that was put in the garage conversion, does not show up when you look at info on the house. Listed as a 1bath. I have a gang box that I plugged into the 4 outlets that has a light in red showing when something is not grounded. Its red on all 4 outlets in garage addition.
@@daniellloyd52 you should check the main house outlets to make sure but since it was built in the 1940's probably not grounded. As for the garage the red light means a malfunction. You can press the test and reset buttons and if that works you're good, if not, the gfci is bad or there's a wiring problem.
A GFCI works by comparing the current between the hot wire and the neutral (the proper return path). They should be the same. On a normal GFCI circuit, If a metal part of the item that is plugged into it comes into contact with the hot, this sends some of the return current to ground through the ground wire instead of the neutral wire, and causes it to trip. If however, you wire in a GFCI without a ground wire, then in the above faulty scenario, it will NOT trip until you touch that metal part. It should trip then, but not until you touch it--this is less than ideal. So you definitely should label the outlets as "no ground". Your solution is better than not doing anything, but you don't want to give the impression that you are "protected" like a normally wired GFCI.
@6:24 note the inserted wires...Highly recommend using screws not pushing them in. Please research fires related to inserted wires vs. actual screw mounted wiring.
I'd hate to see a fire that is absolutely preventable..maybe others know but didn't one of the brands have a recall?
Oh stop crying i see backstabbed outlets lasting longer then you were born kid. Screws are good too but what if you have more wires? You cant put 2 wires on one screw thats code violation
Gamer007 backstabs do not cause fires. Its the outlet. Outlets can catch on fire even with on the screws so if you’re really scared of a fire. Remove outlet and cap everything in wall because all outlets are gonna have risks. Even on screws or backstabs. If backstabbing was seriously dangerous. It would not be allowed on newer outlets. Learn before you talk :)
I will agree that back stabbing receptacles isn’t a good ideal. I’ve been an electrician for over 20 years and every house I have had to replace a burnt/over heated receptacle in has been back stabbed. (Side note, if you have holes in the back that the screw will lock the the conductors in then I don’t have a problem using those holes)
It isn’t a good ideal to back stab switches either. I think the tension spring breaks down, but it does.
@@GlitchedPepsi Good one. "Remove outlet and cap everything in wall". You can do that, but you also need to properly label all capped wires "for future use", or actually snip them back as far as you can, or remove them entirely, to meet national fire code regarding "abandoned electrical wiring".
GFCI receptacles use back-wiring, and don't have an option to push in the wire like their cheaper residential grade cousins ruclips.net/video/3AXcRsAOLPk/видео.html
Was it just me forget that one black hot wire on that first receptacle look like it was chewed up or had gotten hot at one time or another? If that is the case I just about bet you it's because those Outlets are stabbed in the back of the receptacle and not around the screw like they're supposed to be! That's just my opinion
Baked or melted insulation? Yep, seen it many times. Especially on the first outlet on the circuit, which has to carry all the current for the downstream outlets on the circuit. Replacing one of these is the most common fix in a modular or trailer home where they routinely use those devices.
how can i fix my regular open hot outlet one of my outlet dosent work but the others do in my room
I might have missed something, but did you explain how you got the ground wire on there properly as opposed the pigtail that it had originally?
You only missed the entire point of the video.
A GFCI does offer protection similar, though not equal, to that from a piece of equipment with a valid ground connection. But I think any 3 prong outlet should have a valid ground connection, GFCI or not. Some devices need a ground connection not only for safety, but for surge relief, noise reduction or to protect against ESD that can destroy semiconductors. If I find an outlet with no ground connection and can't trace it do an open at some accessible point in the circuit, I just ground that outlet by connecting it to a cold water pipe or, if need be a grounding steak..
my wall outlet is ungrounded and i have a backup power device (UPS) plugged into it and my PC is plugged into the "battery backup" side of it and without warning it tends to turn off irregularly and regardless of load
@John Connolly that sounds illogical
For anyone who doesn't understand, a grounding STAKE. A metal rod driven (usually pounded in with a large hammer) into the ground (earth). Ground wire connected to the stake/rod with a clamp. Water pipes can also be used in a similar way. If you don't know how to do this properly, read up on it and test when you're done. Stay safe!
@@jeffnorbert1871 A ground rod has nothing to do with equipment grounding or posses the ability to trip a breaker.
I'd much rather grab the hot on a gfi protected outlet than one on a grounded duplex.
What you think is not really relevant. It is what NEC says that counts. The text "No equipment ground" will warn the user for that.
In Europe grounding male on the socket just to allow using grounded plugs on ungrouned outlets (but not the reverse unless the equipment is double insulated). Grounding is to protect people, not for equipment.
Is this comparable to a regular ground? I have this exact issue and it's causing some static but i use a surge protector to protect the electronics from that static. However I know it's not truly surge protected without a ground
No you still have no ground.
Very nice video 👍📸❤️