Definitely! My sister did that...her p.o.s. of a boyfriend hit her cat with a showerhead, so she packed her things, took the cat and left. This story reminded me of it.
For some people it's not easy. One of my friends live with a guy like that. Me and her family, the local police, had warned her. He abused her many time: verbally and physically, slashed her tires because he was upsed etc. We have offer her all kind of support we can, and the authority, offered her therapy, and even with that level of abuse, ( he even film her without her consent and send the video to her family) and more than a year after all that, she still engaged to him because he manipulate her by love bombing. He's a dangerous psychopath, with a long record of abuse the police told her. We can't do anything more. Just wish she lighten up before it's too late.
@@xminusone1 You're right ..it's not always as easy as seeing the red flags and getting away or even being warned by many people of the dangers.These relationships are always very complex, I hope your friend eventually gets out of that relationship. As the old saying goes "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".
@@ClickClack_Bam those people wanted to change though. They needed the support, absolutely, but they were always willing to change. They just needed the opportunity.
Yes! He probably attacked the clinician or tried to strangle them! I really can't imagine anything except overt violence that would cause a clinician to write a letter(s).
Thank you for covering this case, Dr. Grande. This is an interesting if tragic case especially considering the waver of clinician-client privilege. Gail's sister Alayne has established a safe house for victims of domestic violence in the name of her sister called Gail's House and hopefully this will help women who are in situations like that of Gail.
Or they happen to be a dog person. It doesn't mean there is something "wrong with them" if they don't like cats/snakes etc. But actually harming those animals is a different story and definitely a red flag.
It takes a long time to get into anything in therapy in my experience. I can’t imagine what he must’ve been like for them to be able to tell he was dangerous from a single session. Also don’t know if it’s more naive or arrogant to think you can change someone like that. Countless people have already paid the price for that type of mentality.
@F. Aduke Femi-Babalola yikes! I wanted to become a psychologist so bad but once I found out the years of schooling with no doubt a crap ton of work I bowed out. I admire you for following through. Congrats! And best wishes to you.
The combination of the love bombing and the "you're a perfect princess and you've changed my life", which is appealing to insecure people. Add in the factor of being comfortable around mentally ill people and interacting with them without stigmatizing them, and it's a recipe for disaster.
I read once “people don’t change, they only become more of what they already are”. Women, especially think their partner will change despite all the red flags. Self deception can be deadly! Appreciate you Doc, thanks.
This is such a sad case. There were so many red flags but Gail was probably trauma bonded to him, codependent and and perhaps repeating childhood patterns. Dr Grande, can you please comment on DV in general and how family and friends can intervene when the victim won't leave? And aren't psychologists mandated to report serious crimes, such as choking one's wife? Choking is a good predictor of murder in a DV relationship. Had the crime been reported, perhaps this could have been prevented.
I’d love to hear more about the types of observations a clinician might make in order to so quickly determine that a client is dangerous. It’s difficult for me to imagine how little self awareness a person must have to be so transparent
The total lack of self awareness and utter disregard for the cultural norms -actually verbalizing hate and rage and possibly even murderous intent! Hint and 1/2!
In my experience doing psych evaluation in emergency departments, they were usually intoxicated or psychotic. In the course of assessing a checklist of features that I needed to address I would just let them ramble, and that stream of consciousness was when they divulged things that people were usually guarded about. I did include whether they were intoxicated or high, but that didn't stop me from making notification. The notion that people shouldn't be held accountable for threats they make when they're using drugs or alcohol fails to take into account the problem that they can easily get drunk or high again and be back in the same state as when they divulged these threats to a stranger.
Your warnings and overall advice with this case was so brilliant, Dr. Grande!! Very sadly, my sister is one of those who believe "I can fix him." The fact that 2 mental health therapist found him so alarming that they actually tried to prevent harm at a great risk to themselves- said so much about how their trained instincts knew he was a terrible danger! Your content is so incredible, and important!!
Abusing the vulnerable like animals, children, elders, customer service employees, etc. should always be red flags for anyone. You can't change people; they have to do that for themselves. Also, psychopathy is rarely conducive with any healthy relationship. Lastly, the Dunning-Kruger Effect can kill you; never overestimate your abilities & intelligence. Especially when literally everyone is telling you to bail.
Not perceptive. This was not a case of Dunning Kruger. Dunning Kruger is about being so lacking in skill in a certain area that the person is unaware how unskilled they are and they overestimate their competence (too dumb to recognise how dumb they are). Gail did not lack intelligence and she did not lack skills in the area of psychology or reading people, therefore she was not overestimating her competence. Rather, her preceptions were clouded by her feelings and possibly some attachment issues or childhood trauma that lead her to repeat the pattern and try to change it this time around (eg. Subconscious process: 'this is familiar to me so I'll stay in this situation. Mum couldn't fix dad but I can change my husband and that will help me heal'). It is evident she was emotionally vulnerable given her history of depression and a suicide attempt.
@@MsSilverTulip She clearly didn't have the skill and it was obvious she'd overestimated her abilities as both a human and alleged clinician. She was told many times she was wrong, but went ahead because she thought she knew better. That's Dunning-Kruger. She clearly lacked those skills, as well as the self-appraisal necessary to see that she did not have them. She couldn't outsmart this person's disorders, and because of it, she hung around a clearly dangerous individual. Those who did have the skills & abilities made it clear she was very wrong. Sorry Huey Lewis, the "power of love" doesn't trump common sense, especially went it's literally beating you on the head.
Primitive is the perfect word to describe love bombing. I would also add that it is shallow, lazy, unintelligent, and insidious. I have been love bombed before and my goodness, what an awful experience. I feel so bad for this woman, she seemed intelligent and sensitive, yet she wasn’t able to escape this treacherous man. Really sad. Alright, now back to watching your podcast, I am almost done.😉 Thank you for the another brilliant analysis Dr. Grande.❤️
I don't think this have to do with intelligence in general but with emotional intelligence, the capacity to put theirs feeling aside and not denying the reds flags. Also, to be strong enough to leave. I know someone who is very intelligent and yet, she still engaged in an abusive relationship, even if she know to well that he's a narcissist and an abuser. Tire slashed because he was upset, pushing her, pulled her by her hair and the police removed him 3 times from her apartment because he threatened her. And she's a doctor. ( not psychologist ) she's indeed a very intelligent person, but easy to manipulate. She tried to leave him many but each time she ended up with him after two weeks. Me and her family had tried all we can do but now it's on her. I wish she'll lighten up before it's to late.
Dr. Grande can you answer this question, "Does a spouse EVER actually change for the better"? I've witnessed bad marriages time & again (2 bad ones I was in) with the wife thinking the husband would change. That never happened
"My love will cure him" and "I have a PhD in psychology, I should know whether or not he's violent and dangerous, no matter what all these other psychologists tell me". PhD or not, her death proves her incompetence.
Sounds like as long as he was in total control, which he would be flying a plane or being the head surgeon in the operating room, he was stable. But, put in the mix of other people and he has no control over others at all. I wonder what his childhood was like.
Excellent video as always! Off topic but we dig the brushed indigo blue shirt & yesterday’s safety yellow. (Yes, we’re in the camp who tunes in to see the daily shirt too!) 🧐🤣
The bubble above Dr. Grande's head: After all of my physical struggles, along with my intense study to make a difference in this world -- My followers are focused on my shirts and my cacti...
And what does one have to do to convince aPhd student in psychology to run for her life. One more instance of so many smart women’s willingness to sacrifice for “love”.
@@loisherzog8803 Not love, remember she’s sleeping around so she obviously didn’t want to be married. She seems be the epitome of „play stupid games, win stupid prizes“. She was soooo smart, she knew more than two experts. Nah, there are real victims of domestic abuse and she wasn’t one of them. One of the few victims I’ve heard of that I have less than zero sympathy for. She didn’t even give an eff about her cat. Complete narcissist.
@@elisabethrankin7702 according to Dr. grande‘s report, there was credible evidence that she had been abused in the relationship. She had physical injuries and several of her friends made these allegations as well. I can only wonder about your mental health if you think she deserved to die.
@@logicalblackman8228 She did not say the victim deserved death. Only she had no sympathy. There is a difference. I admit, it’s difficult to feel sympathy for someone REPEATEDLY warned yet scoffing at the danger. I do feel bad for her family and friends. it must’ve been agony for them to watch her ignore the warning signs over and over again.
@@blaidencortel She said “ Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.“ That is saying someone deserved whatever happened to them. But if you still disagree, please feel free to explain the difference between having “zero sympathy“ for someone and thinking that they deserved whatever happened to them.
Dr. Stone was a hero, in my opinion. Although Gail didn't heed his warning, he tried. I work closely with physicians every day and have been there when decisions like this must be made. One of the many reasons physicians are, in a lot of cases, underestimated.
Strangeling my cat?......Relationship?..... WTH! This person could be VEEERY happy to be able to even breath after touching my pets the wrong way. On a lighter note, DOC Grande is always able to give horrifying cases the right amount of irony and humor. Love this somewhat harsh humor, it is this kind of ironic fun i grew up with. My friends and my brother too often talked about how to tone it down because we sometimes happened to come across situations that were not suited for this kind of fun. After my teenage years i learned when this is/and in what form it is appropriet or not, lol!, But the Doc has a real talent for the right level of irony and for using it at the right moment. Keep them coming DOC!!
I would love to hear your analysis of the horrific case that was Joel Steinberg. I try to stay updated on most every case you present and I enjoy hearing your input. Thank you Dr. Grande.
Question: If someone reacts so strongly to someone else getting a compliment are they 1. Jealous 2. Weird 3. Defensive. 4. Sarcastic or 5. Just in a bad mood?
He's clearly a narcissist. My sister once lived with a boyfriend who was of that controlling self-absorbed type who also had tempers. He once hit her cat with a showerhead in a rage, and that was when she finally left him. You bet, if our family had seen any sign of him being physically violent towards my sister, we all would have got together to beat him into tiny little pieces.
Well, I wonder what kind of costume he would choose? I'm just speculating here; but I don't think he'd dress as a clown, as there are so many psycho, murderous clowns in movies.
I just gotta say, I don’t know what the data says but working with surgeons in the OR.. most of them do not seem to regulate their emotions. They are often yelling at the staff and seem angry
Their reputation precedes them. Surgeons are well known for their tremendous ego and flashpoint tempers. It is not unusual for them to throw instruments during a procedure and/or curse at and berate others working w/ them if they make mistakes, insisting they scrub out and leave the OR immed. Robert prob fit right into that milieu.
If you struck my cat only once, never mind strangling it, I would be on the phone to the police, the cat & I would leave, nothing would get me into any room alone with you ever again. Absolutely common sense, never mind her 'almost' Psychology Degree'. TgT
1:35 - "...for example, Robert would fly into a rage from time to time..." Well...I mean c'mon doc...he's a pilot. He has to get enough flight hours to maintain his pilot's license. Flying into rages helps him meet those ends...
Can't believe I missed this when it first released. Glad I caught it in my recommendations. Self-deception is a hell of a drug. The only positive in this story is that Gail's murder didn't remain unpunished after all those years. Someone was still fighting to see justice done for her. Another tragic but educational case. Thanks for covering it.
Thank you for this insightful upload. Always appreciate your time and effort. I was hoping you may look into the case of Joel Steinberg and Hedda Nussbaum. I remember reading about this case after watching an episode of Law and Order. Heartbreaking what they did to little Lisa. How could someone be so evil?
Wow. What a tragic, albeit incredibly intriguing case. Imagine being in a relationship so toxic that you feel the only potential remedy involves demanding your partner seek therapy, only to receive a letter from the therapist suggesting that your safety & well-being are contingent upon you ending the relationship you were hoping to fix. Yikes. I suppose the moral of the story is: if a therapist ever advises that you are in danger, it would be in your best interest to heed such advice (as opposed to relying on the fact that you "almost obtained a PhD in psychology"). Another superb presentation, Doc. Your concise breakdowns are always greatly appreciated. I think I'm speaking for everybody when I say we'll be looking forward to the next one!
Good Morning Dr Grande. Great analysis. It seems to me, she ignored all the warning signs of his behavior. You're right a Doctor is legally unable to treat his relatives. Thank you Dr Grande .Great topic .
Dear Dr Grande, could you please analyze the personality traits in Tara Westover's life? She wrote the book 'Educated' about growing up in a survivalist Mormon family in Idaho....there's a lot of interesting stuff though INCLUDING her choice to wrote the book - which her family didn't approve of.
Can you look at the mental health and personality factors of Henry viii please? Did he ever love Anne Boleyn? Could his head injury explain some of his behavior? How could he execute people who he claimed to love? Love your videos!
Man, when Dr. Stone, the creator of the Scale of Evil, is warning you your husband is dangerous, that puts several exclamation points on his statement!
1:42 oh fuck no, I've put up with shit but by God... once you touch the cat you get the bat. Even if that wasn't enough to end things, I'd still never let them near my cat again ever or loved ones. They would be the ol russian doll roulette partner.
You should do the case of Dr Turcotte, who was a cardiologist surgon in Canada, he killed his two young kids to punish his ex wife( theirs mother) because he was jealous that she dates other mens AFTER their separation. And why they deem him unfit to prison and send him to a psychiatric hospital who he was relased after 3 years and now he lives completely free under an other name. Edit: English is not my language.
These are tough. It's all very tragic and shouldn't have happened. I've known several women who, despite seeing evidence to the contrary, still hang on to hope that love can *fix* a broken partner. I've watched them return time and time again, as "nurturers," and "caregivers," never letting go. And not once has their story had a happy ending. While I *DO* believe people can evolve, grow and get rid of bad habits, a person's *character* doesn't change. Love will never make a bad man good.
I very much enjoyed your commentary regarding this case. I remember watching a show about this couple and remember distinctly the letter Dr. Stone wrote. I got goosebumps reading it. He basically called the doctor a homicidal maniac. I was working in Berkeley during the time of the Tarasoff case; Cal lost, and it was a good thing. It never ceases to amaze me how intelligent women are so naive about human behavior and give their partners the benefit of the doubt. Thanks for a very good case analysis.
I think the red flag was the poor cat 😾. When your significant other tries to drown the cat and you go ahead and marry the psychopath anyway. He strangles her into unconsciousness? The psychiatrist goes on record saying her life is in danger. There must have been a serious trauma bond. Thank you for another great analysis Dr. Grande 🌵🌵🌵🌵
Great analysis, particularly the traits common with every day surgeon. Perhaps this cases would interesting for you to look at. Anthony McGrath, an, orthopaedic surgeon staged a break-in at his home sent to prison 8 years 2019. The case against McGrath was featured on Channel 4's 24 Hours in Police Custody, in April 2019
Oh I remember Dr Stone did a great TV series about levels of evil and this was one of the episodes! I really enjpyed his presentation, much like Dr Grande's....minus the options to be campy 😉
Hi dr grande Las Vegas Craig here I’ve been subscribed to your RUclips channel for over a year and I have shared many of your videos however for the last month the RUclips algorithms I have not alerted me to your videos even with the bell selected on all Anyway this video you made is outstanding for content and your expertise. I really learn from your analysis You have the best Channel for mental health issues on RUclips bravo 👏🏻 Thank you so so much For sharing your expertise in your experiences I look forward to watching more of your videos 😊😇✌️👍☝️ ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️ 5 star 💫
Dr. Grande thanks for doing this case analysis which helped to point out that a person having advanced education in any helping profession is no guarantee that they are going to be a decent person or that they will be more resistant to being taken advantage of by a malignant narcissist with a terrible set of values. A reminder on how important it is for people to have a circle of close friends to give a person feedback on whom they are dating and how important it is for people to take their time when getting to know someone well enough to marry. Best to wait until marriage so that insobriety doesn't take over how we are perceiving any dating situation too.
I think it would be fascinating if you covered the Tarasoff case. A lot of people, I would even wager *most people* don’t know why the duty to warn exists. It would be s good educational piece. Tatiana Tarasoff deserved better from the people around her, and the least we can do is continue to share her story and warn those who are in danger.
This is such a sad but frustrating story. Why did she stay? My sister’s first husband had a severe mental illness. He would wake her up at night ranting about the people saying bad things about him while holding a baseball bat. He would ask if she could hear the voices. They went to couples counseling and the therapist ended up telling my sister that he was a danger to either her or himself or both of them. My sister left him and filed for divorce. The week their divorce was to be final, he started acting out was was put into a psych ward - but they left him with his bathrobe belt and he used it to hang himself.
Sheer incompetence on the part of staff who admitted him! The pt should not have been given any belongings until all shoelaces, belts, keys, nail files, glass, sharp objects, pencils and pens, jewelry, etc. had been locked away. They could easily be sued for their negligence.
@@kathyclark8274 - I think his parents did sue. They weren’t very nice to my sister and blamed her for their son’s death. Later, my sister found out that his family hid from her that there had been other family members with serious mental health disorders as well as at k on east one previous suicide.
Well I guess, don't fall for the plane rides 'cause in the wrong hands, you might fall out of one (not trying to be funny). Thanks for your efforts to protect women from men like this, Dr. G. You're a good guy (and looking handsome too)! Have a great night, and I'll see ya tomorrow! 😉😘
This is one of several cases which Dr. Grande has commented upon that make me question the whole OCEAN model. I assume there are multiple subcategories to each category in the model but still I'm skeptical. Calmness and quickness to anger are easily observable in life but should they really be grouped into one category "Neuroticism"?
Exactly. Was he high in neuroticism or low? It doesn't make sense if his personality varied so dramatically between settings, to the extent that it renders a personality trait meaningless.
My mom used to work as a housekeeper for a heart surgeon and she’d say that if a patient of his died in or right after surgery, he’d break up emotionally and not leave his office for days.
Almost being a psychologist, is probably not as good as actually being one... And that's still not a guarantee! If psychologists were perfect mind readers they'd be gods. Thank you Dr.Grande for this deep dive into the equally messed up lives and minds of fairly intelligent and privileged people.
I don’t think it has anything to do with that actually. For anyone able to think objectively, regardless of their professional qualifications, it should’ve been obvious that she was in a great deal of danger.
If a person consistently shows you who they are, believe them. Random acts of violence inflicted by a stranger, is no less painful or deadly than from someone you know. Be safe out there 🙏 in crazyland 🥴
If somebody tried to drown my cat, I wouldn't need a therapist's letter to warn me. That's just about the biggest of all possible red flags. (1) Report the bastard to the cops tonight. (2) First thing tomorrow, go to the courthouse for a restraining order. (3) Take further (lawful) steps as seems right.
@@zenawarrior7442 I had one guy ask me if an unhappy ex had known my password and broke into my account to change the name haha **shrug** it always leads to interesting conversation =)
I thoroughly watching your take on this episode and look forward to your upcoming episodes as well. Is there any chance of reviewing Motive currently on Netflix? Thanks. PS, your understated humour is much appreciated.
I had a client once and after the first session I felt that this client would either suicide or file a complaint against me. I just had that feeling after spending the hour with him. It's very interesting when a clinician can get such a strong impression so quickly, such as the two therapists in Robert's case. In regards to my own case, the client did email me a suicide note at one point, but never made an attempt.
VERY important analysis of Dr. Stone's letter. Every person, but especially every educated person like Gail, should have understood exactly what it meant.
Anyone else remember the episode of Law and Order: Criminal Intent that was based on this case? I didn't know it was based on a real case til just now. Thanks Doc
The cat incident alone would've had me running for the hills, never looking back!!!!
Definitely! My sister did that...her p.o.s. of a boyfriend hit her cat with a showerhead, so she packed her things, took the cat and left. This story reminded me of it.
I was thinking the exact same thing!!
For some people it's not easy. One of my friends live with a guy like that. Me and her family, the local police, had warned her. He abused her many time: verbally and physically, slashed her tires because he was upsed etc. We have offer her all kind of support we can, and the authority, offered her therapy, and even with that level of abuse, ( he even film her without her consent and send the video to her family) and more than a year after all that, she still engaged to him because he manipulate her by love bombing. He's a dangerous psychopath, with a long record of abuse the police told her. We can't do anything more. Just wish she lighten up before it's too late.
@@xminusone1 You're right ..it's not always as easy as seeing the red flags and getting away or even being warned by many people of the dangers.These relationships are always very complex, I hope your friend eventually gets out of that relationship. As the old saying goes "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".
Yep!
One person can't change anyone, even with love, you can't cure someone with love. A person changes only if they choose to and wants to.
Very very true.
@@ClickClack_Bam those people wanted to change though. They needed the support, absolutely, but they were always willing to change. They just needed the opportunity.
Even then, doubtful
Can they change if they choose to and want to even
After he tried strangling her, he apologized. Robert: "I'm so sorry, I thought you were a cat."
🐈🐱🕵
This was really,,SLEEPING WITH THE ENEMY,, I can't believe she stayed with that guy!
Hilarious! I can appreciate gallows humour despite the fact I'm an ailurophile. If someone mistreated one of my furbabies it would not be so funny.
🤣🤣🤣
Two clinicians saying he was dangerous after their first session… that’s a 🚩
Seriously
Yes, red flags that come with their own marching bands and fireworks!
@@onewheelatatime2905 absolutely!
That’s not a red flag; that’s a wrap! I’m gone after the first letter.
Yes! He probably attacked the clinician or tried to strangle them! I really can't imagine anything except overt violence that would cause a clinician to write a letter(s).
Thank you for covering this case, Dr. Grande. This is an interesting if tragic case especially considering the waver of clinician-client privilege. Gail's sister Alayne has established a safe house for victims of domestic violence in the name of her sister called Gail's House and hopefully this will help women who are in situations like that of Gail.
Aw I love her sister for doing that. It is so sad.
💜Gail’s House💜 Alayne is providing a much needed place for safety. Awesomeness ☮️&💟 Peace&Respect, Shelley Anne
A safe house is only helpful if a woman recognizes she is in danger, and WANTS to be safe. This woman clearly did not.
075
@@natekeyes2297 I unfortunately have to agree. She was given so many warnings but you can't help her if she doesn't want to help herself.
The second that the words “rules” or “obey” were introduced into the relationship, I’d be out. Hell no.
My yardstick: If a person doesn't like my cat...I know there's something wrong with them.
And that’s why you remain single😛
@@logicalblackman8228 found the incel
If a person doesn't like my snake...I know there's something wrong with them.
Or they happen to be a dog person. It doesn't mean there is something "wrong with them" if they don't like cats/snakes etc. But actually harming those animals is a different story and definitely a red flag.
@CRAM MARC what if they have an allergy allergy?
It takes a long time to get into anything in therapy in my experience. I can’t imagine what he must’ve been like for them to be able to tell he was dangerous from a single session. Also don’t know if it’s more naive or arrogant to think you can change someone like that. Countless people have already paid the price for that type of mentality.
@F. Aduke Femi-Babalola yikes! I wanted to become a psychologist so bad but once I found out the years of schooling with no doubt a crap ton of work I bowed out. I admire you for following through. Congrats! And best wishes to you.
I’ve become quite frustrated with my therapy and I’ve been at it for awhile. Please expand on “…takes a long time to get into anything in therapy…”
The combination of the love bombing and the "you're a perfect princess and you've changed my life", which is appealing to insecure people.
Add in the factor of being comfortable around mentally ill people and interacting with them without stigmatizing them, and it's a recipe for disaster.
I read once “people don’t change, they only become more of what they already are”. Women, especially think their partner will change despite all the red flags. Self deception can be deadly! Appreciate you Doc, thanks.
I’ve read that men marry believing that she will never change while women marry believing that she can change him.
.....or, like the leopard, they move their spots to a more hidden place
One of my favourite quotes, I think of it from time to time.
I choked up on my coffee with "moving on up." Keep it coming, Doc.
Me too very clever ! Funny
We finally got a piece of the pie!
This is such a sad case. There were so many red flags but Gail was probably trauma bonded to him, codependent and and perhaps repeating childhood patterns. Dr Grande, can you please comment on DV in general and how family and friends can intervene when the victim won't leave? And aren't psychologists mandated to report serious crimes, such as choking one's wife? Choking is a good predictor of murder in a DV relationship. Had the crime been reported, perhaps this could have been prevented.
You know you are dispensing free therapy with your videos, right? Excellent-thank you, Dr. Grande!
Yes! We all learn a lot (while being entertained)!
I take it as dating advice lol.
When Dr. Grande says a guy is "creepy", women everywhere should be worried! 😂😂
Some people say that even Ted Bundy was afraid and creeped out being alone in the same room with that guy
@@roberth.5938 Damn!!!😲😳
Truth
I’d love to hear more about the types of observations a clinician might make in order to so quickly determine that a client is dangerous. It’s difficult for me to imagine how little self awareness a person must have to be so transparent
The total lack of self awareness and utter disregard for the cultural norms -actually verbalizing hate and rage and possibly even murderous intent! Hint and 1/2!
In my experience doing psych evaluation in emergency departments, they were usually intoxicated or psychotic.
In the course of assessing a checklist of features that I needed to address I would just let them ramble, and that stream of consciousness was when they divulged things that people were usually guarded about.
I did include whether they were intoxicated or high, but that didn't stop me from making notification. The notion that people shouldn't be held accountable for threats they make when they're using drugs or alcohol fails to take into account the problem that they can easily get drunk or high again and be back in the same state as when they divulged these threats to a stranger.
A proposal spree.Gorgeous.
Hardest working analyst on youtube. Thanks Dr. Grande!
And prolific!
Your warnings and overall advice with this case was so brilliant, Dr. Grande!!
Very sadly, my sister is one of those who believe "I can fix him."
The fact that 2 mental health therapist found him so alarming that they actually tried to prevent harm at a great risk to themselves- said so much about how their trained instincts knew he was a terrible danger!
Your content is so incredible, and important!!
Abusing the vulnerable like animals, children, elders, customer service employees, etc. should always be red flags for anyone.
You can't change people; they have to do that for themselves. Also, psychopathy is rarely conducive with any healthy relationship. Lastly, the Dunning-Kruger Effect can kill you; never overestimate your abilities & intelligence. Especially when literally everyone is telling you to bail.
So perceptive!
Not perceptive. This was not a case of Dunning Kruger. Dunning Kruger is about being so lacking in skill in a certain area that the person is unaware how unskilled they are and they overestimate their competence (too dumb to recognise how dumb they are). Gail did not lack intelligence and she did not lack skills in the area of psychology or reading people, therefore she was not overestimating her competence. Rather, her preceptions were clouded by her feelings and possibly some attachment issues or childhood trauma that lead her to repeat the pattern and try to change it this time around (eg. Subconscious process: 'this is familiar to me so I'll stay in this situation. Mum couldn't fix dad but I can change my husband and that will help me heal'). It is evident she was emotionally vulnerable given her history of depression and a suicide attempt.
@@MsSilverTulip She clearly didn't have the skill and it was obvious she'd overestimated her abilities as both a human and alleged clinician. She was told many times she was wrong, but went ahead because she thought she knew better. That's Dunning-Kruger. She clearly lacked those skills, as well as the self-appraisal necessary to see that she did not have them. She couldn't outsmart this person's disorders, and because of it, she hung around a clearly dangerous individual. Those who did have the skills & abilities made it clear she was very wrong.
Sorry Huey Lewis, the "power of love" doesn't trump common sense, especially went it's literally beating you on the head.
Primitive is the perfect word to describe love bombing. I would also add that it is shallow, lazy, unintelligent, and insidious. I have been love bombed before and my goodness, what an awful experience.
I feel so bad for this woman, she seemed intelligent and sensitive, yet she wasn’t able to escape this treacherous man. Really sad.
Alright, now back to watching your podcast, I am almost done.😉
Thank you for the another brilliant analysis Dr. Grande.❤️
I don't think this have to do with intelligence in general but with emotional intelligence, the capacity to put theirs feeling aside and not denying the reds flags. Also, to be strong enough to leave. I know someone who is very intelligent and yet, she still engaged in an abusive relationship, even if she know to well that he's a narcissist and an abuser. Tire slashed because he was upset, pushing her, pulled her by her hair and the police removed him 3 times from her apartment because he threatened her. And she's a doctor. ( not psychologist ) she's indeed a very intelligent person, but easy to manipulate. She tried to leave him many but each time she ended up with him after two weeks. Me and her family had tried all we can do but now it's on her. I wish she'll lighten up before it's to late.
@@xminusone1 You are right, emotional intelligence is the right word. Good point.
@Mjira Achieng How awesome was that?😉
But he was Superman…
@@cht2162 Agreed.🎯
Dr. Grande can you answer this question, "Does a spouse EVER actually change for the better"? I've witnessed bad marriages time & again (2 bad ones I was in) with the wife thinking the husband would change. That never happened
"My love will cure him" and "I have a PhD in psychology, I should know whether or not he's violent and dangerous, no matter what all these other psychologists tell me".
PhD or not, her death proves her incompetence.
Big price to pay for misunderstanding!
It either proved her incompetence or her arrogance, naivete notwithstanding.
Wow, the victim shaming
Sounds like as long as he was in total control, which he would be flying a plane or being the head surgeon in the operating room, he was stable. But, put in the mix of other people and he has no control over others at all.
I wonder what his childhood was like.
Yes, I wonder that as well.
Excellent video as always! Off topic but we dig the brushed indigo blue shirt & yesterday’s safety yellow. (Yes, we’re in the camp who tunes in to see the daily shirt too!) 🧐🤣
The bubble above Dr. Grande's head: After all of my physical struggles, along with my intense study to make a difference in this world -- My followers are focused on my shirts and my cacti...
Oh! He doesn't mind! He knows that these things are effective hooks and HE IS RIGHT!
Yup... content/jokes/shirts/decor... I'm here for it all! 😏
I wonder, what does one have to do, in order to get two clinicians to label you as dangerous (one clinician after one session)??
And what does one have to do to convince aPhd student in psychology to run for her life. One more instance of so many smart women’s willingness to sacrifice for “love”.
@@loisherzog8803 Not love, remember she’s sleeping around so she obviously didn’t want to be married. She seems be the epitome of „play stupid games, win stupid prizes“. She was soooo smart, she knew more than two experts. Nah, there are real victims of domestic abuse and she wasn’t one of them. One of the few victims I’ve heard of that I have less than zero sympathy for. She didn’t even give an eff about her cat. Complete narcissist.
@@elisabethrankin7702 according to Dr. grande‘s report, there was credible evidence that she had been abused in the relationship. She had physical injuries and several of her friends made these allegations as well.
I can only wonder about your mental health if you think she deserved to die.
@@logicalblackman8228 She did not say the victim deserved death. Only she had no sympathy. There is a difference. I admit, it’s difficult to feel sympathy for someone REPEATEDLY warned yet scoffing at the danger. I do feel bad for her family and friends. it must’ve been agony for them to watch her ignore the warning signs over and over again.
@@blaidencortel She said “ Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.“ That is saying someone deserved whatever happened to them.
But if you still disagree, please feel free to explain the difference between having “zero sympathy“ for someone and thinking that they deserved whatever happened to them.
“ ... and once in a while love.”
Dr. Grand’s sarcasm is beyond words 😁.
Thanks doctor. Your life lessons are life changing 💙.
Marvellous, interesting story and a great level of detail as always.
Dr. Stone was a hero, in my opinion. Although Gail didn't heed his warning, he tried. I work closely with physicians every day and have been there when decisions like this must be made. One of the many reasons physicians are, in a lot of cases, underestimated.
As a nurse; Dr. Grande, I suspect the nurses in the OR experienced his anger. I have worked with many. Have a great weekend.! Thanks for the video!
Have a great weekend, Dr. Grande!
🎃🎣🚴🏈🤹🎳🏸
Strangeling my cat?......Relationship?..... WTH! This person could be VEEERY happy to be able to even breath after touching my pets the wrong way.
On a lighter note, DOC Grande is always able to give horrifying cases the right amount of irony and humor.
Love this somewhat harsh humor, it is this kind of ironic fun i grew up with.
My friends and my brother too often talked about how to tone it down because we sometimes happened to come across situations that were not suited for this kind of fun.
After my teenage years i learned when this is/and in what form it is appropriet or not, lol!, But the Doc has a real talent for the right level of irony and for using it at the right moment.
Keep them coming DOC!!
1:57 Woof, that wedding photo. His face is a glare of psychotic triumph; hers one of terrified resignation.
I would love to hear your analysis of the horrific case that was Joel Steinberg. I try to stay updated on most every case you present and I enjoy hearing your input. Thank you Dr. Grande.
Yes, please!!
Yes! Great work Dr Grande!
Dr Grande thanks for keeping me company during my lunchtime and doing such amazing work. you’re phenomenal
🍎🍕🌭🌮🍜🍝🍱😋
No he isn't "phenomenal".Stop idolizing,it makes us puke.
Regards,
The Men
Question: If someone reacts so strongly to someone else getting a compliment are they 1. Jealous 2. Weird 3. Defensive. 4. Sarcastic or 5. Just in a bad mood?
@@bthomson maybe a bot or something? seems unreal to me haha
Both my grandmother and my aunt on my dad's side were Ellas!
How can you stay with someone who tried to drown your cat??? He's clearly a psychopath!
He's clearly a narcissist. My sister once lived with a boyfriend who was of that controlling self-absorbed type who also had tempers. He once hit her cat with a showerhead in a rage, and that was when she finally left him. You bet, if our family had seen any sign of him being physically violent towards my sister, we all would have got together to beat him into tiny little pieces.
@@murphychurch8251 if only Gale was as level-headed as your sister( Dr. Grande wouldn't have to make this video
How can you stay with anyone who would choke you into unconsciousness!!! She should have out with her cat
And also a failure! How hard can it be to be to drown a cat?
@@logicalblackman8228 Have you ever tried to bath a cat? 😈
Is there any chance we might get Dr. Grande in a Halloween costume?? I can't be the only one who would enjoy this. 🎃😁
Maybe he'll do a Psychiatrick or Treat.
🎃The Dr. doesn't have the chutzpah!🤔
Reverse psychology? 🤙😜😋
@@eadweard.
Funny EB! 😁🤡
Well, I wonder what kind of costume he would choose? I'm just speculating here; but I don't think he'd dress as a clown, as there are so many psycho, murderous clowns in movies.
👻👽👾🤖
"After he strangled her, he apologized" . What a guy.
I just gotta say, I don’t know what the data says but working with surgeons in the OR.. most of them do not seem to regulate their emotions. They are often yelling at the staff and seem angry
I guess it's a profession with a high rate of narcissists?
@@murphychurch8251 in my non professional opinion, I’d say probably yes lol
But we are very thankful someone is willing to do it!👩⚕👩🔬👳
@@bthomson haha of course!! No one is perfect and they are amazing without a doubt
Their reputation precedes them. Surgeons are well known for their tremendous ego and flashpoint tempers. It is not unusual for them to throw instruments during a procedure and/or curse at and berate others working w/ them if they make mistakes, insisting they scrub out and leave the OR immed. Robert prob fit right into that milieu.
I really appreciate your calm rational approach to distressing cases.
If you struck my cat only once, never mind strangling it, I would be on the phone to the police, the cat & I would leave, nothing would get me into any room alone with you ever again. Absolutely common sense, never mind her 'almost' Psychology Degree'. TgT
Thanks doc for this. Learned about this case my first semester in social work school!
Many important lessons but also warnings!
1:35 - "...for example, Robert would fly into a rage from time to time..."
Well...I mean c'mon doc...he's a pilot. He has to get enough flight hours to maintain his pilot's license. Flying into rages helps him meet those ends...
Haha!!
Can't believe I missed this when it first released. Glad I caught it in my recommendations. Self-deception is a hell of a drug. The only positive in this story is that Gail's murder didn't remain unpunished after all those years. Someone was still fighting to see justice done for her.
Another tragic but educational case. Thanks for covering it.
Thank you for this insightful upload. Always appreciate your time and effort. I was hoping you may look into the case of Joel Steinberg and Hedda Nussbaum. I remember reading about this case after watching an episode of Law and Order. Heartbreaking what they did to little Lisa. How could someone be so evil?
Wow. What a tragic, albeit incredibly intriguing case. Imagine being in a relationship so toxic that you feel the only potential remedy involves demanding your partner seek therapy, only to receive a letter from the therapist suggesting that your safety & well-being are contingent upon you ending the relationship you were hoping to fix. Yikes. I suppose the moral of the story is: if a therapist ever advises that you are in danger, it would be in your best interest to heed such advice (as opposed to relying on the fact that you "almost obtained a PhD in psychology").
Another superb presentation, Doc. Your concise breakdowns are always greatly appreciated. I think I'm speaking for everybody when I say we'll be looking forward to the next one!
Good Morning Dr Grande. Great analysis. It seems to me, she ignored all the warning signs of his behavior. You're right a Doctor is legally unable to treat his relatives. Thank you Dr Grande .Great topic .
Dear Dr Grande, could you please analyze the personality traits in Tara Westover's life? She wrote the book 'Educated' about growing up in a survivalist Mormon family in Idaho....there's a lot of interesting stuff though INCLUDING her choice to wrote the book - which her family didn't approve of.
Can you look at the mental health and personality factors of Henry viii please? Did he ever love Anne Boleyn? Could his head injury explain some of his behavior? How could he execute people who he claimed to love? Love your videos!
Always interesting.
I'm so glad you understand people and why they do what they do.
Peace 💕🇺🇲
Really! Think of how many life stories he has studied and researched! Mind boggling!
@@bthomson
Man, it's his job and hobby💕🇺🇲
Man, when Dr. Stone, the creator of the Scale of Evil, is warning you your husband is dangerous, that puts several exclamation points on his statement!
Good afternoon, Dr. Grande. Hope you're having a lovely day! Thank You!
1:42 oh fuck no, I've put up with shit but by God... once you touch the cat you get the bat. Even if that wasn't enough to end things, I'd still never let them near my cat again ever or loved ones. They would be the ol russian doll roulette partner.
The relationship would be over if they even attemp to hurt my cat 😡
Serious marker.
You should do the case of Dr Turcotte, who was a cardiologist surgon in Canada, he killed his two young kids to punish his ex wife( theirs mother) because he was jealous that she dates other mens AFTER their separation. And why they deem him unfit to prison and send him to a psychiatric hospital who he was relased after 3 years and now he lives completely free under an other name.
Edit: English is not my language.
Life in prison for Guy Turcotte with no possibility of parole before 17 years, that was the verdict back in 2015.
Your English is fine, I wouldn't have known.
This case hits close to home as someone who was in an abusive relationship. We are always the last to know, everyone else notices first
These are tough. It's all very tragic and shouldn't have happened. I've known several women who, despite seeing evidence to the contrary, still hang on to hope that love can *fix* a broken partner. I've watched them return time and time again, as "nurturers," and "caregivers," never letting go. And not once has their story had a happy ending. While I *DO* believe people can evolve, grow and get rid of bad habits, a person's *character* doesn't change. Love will never make a bad man good.
This explains many things to continue understanding. I'm very grateful for your insight. Happy 2022!
Movin on up to east side we finally got a piece of the pie
Right
So crazy that I listened to the 20/20 podcast about this case this morning!
I very much enjoyed your commentary regarding this case. I remember watching a show about this couple and remember distinctly the letter Dr. Stone wrote. I got goosebumps reading it. He basically called the doctor a homicidal maniac. I was working in Berkeley during the time of the Tarasoff case; Cal lost, and it was a good thing. It never ceases to amaze me how intelligent women are so naive about human behavior and give their partners the benefit of the doubt. Thanks for a very good case analysis.
Astute observations and commentary succinctly stated, as always with deadpan humor.
I think the red flag was the poor cat 😾. When your significant other tries to drown the cat and you go ahead and marry the psychopath anyway.
He strangles her into unconsciousness? The psychiatrist goes on record saying her life is in danger.
There must have been a serious trauma bond.
Thank you for another great analysis Dr. Grande 🌵🌵🌵🌵
GET OUT!
“Trauma bond.” I never heard of that term but I can see the truth in it. Thanks!
Great analysis, particularly the traits common with every day surgeon. Perhaps this cases would interesting for you to look at. Anthony McGrath, an, orthopaedic surgeon staged a break-in at his home sent to prison 8 years 2019. The case against McGrath was featured on Channel 4's 24 Hours in Police Custody, in April 2019
Drowned the cat over jealousy? Sounds like a fun guy. Im sure he’s sorely missed. Prick. Great video doc
thank you, very valuable remarks
Oh I remember Dr Stone did a great TV series about levels of evil and this was one of the episodes! I really enjpyed his presentation, much like Dr Grande's....minus the options to be campy 😉
What can we learn from this case? Never marry somone who tried to murder your cat...
Pretty clear to me!
For someone to change they have to want to change. They want to make effort and work on the themselves.
Great video Dr Grande!!
Hi Dr. Grande. Happy Halloween!
Well thought out and presented analysis Dr. Grande!
Hi dr grande
Las Vegas Craig here
I’ve been subscribed to your RUclips channel for over a year and I have shared many of your videos however for the last month the RUclips algorithms I have not alerted me to your videos even with the bell selected on all
Anyway this video you made is outstanding for content and your expertise. I really learn from your analysis
You have the best Channel for mental health issues on RUclips bravo 👏🏻
Thank you so so much
For sharing your expertise in your experiences
I look forward to watching more of your videos 😊😇✌️👍☝️
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️ 5 star 💫
Dr. Grande thanks for doing this case analysis which helped to point out that a person having advanced education in any helping profession is no guarantee that they are going to be a decent person or that they will be more resistant to being taken advantage of by a malignant narcissist with a terrible set of values. A reminder on how important it is for people to have a circle of close friends to give a person feedback on whom they are dating and how important it is for people to take their time when getting to know someone well enough to marry. Best to wait until marriage so that insobriety doesn't take over how we are perceiving any dating situation too.
Dr Grande please can you make a video on Undercontrolled/Overcontrolled borderlines? And maybe on DBT vs RODBT for borderlines? Thank you x
Appreciate the casual shirt. Thank you so much for the video 🌼🌳🌲🌵🌿
Great detail and explanation
And, as always, great humour
I think it would be fascinating if you covered the Tarasoff case. A lot of people, I would even wager *most people* don’t know why the duty to warn exists. It would be s good educational piece. Tatiana Tarasoff deserved better from the people around her, and the least we can do is continue to share her story and warn those who are in danger.
This is such a sad but frustrating story. Why did she stay? My sister’s first husband had a severe mental illness. He would wake her up at night ranting about the people saying bad things about him while holding a baseball bat. He would ask if she could hear the voices.
They went to couples counseling and the therapist ended up telling my sister that he was a danger to either her or himself or both of them. My sister left him and filed for divorce. The week their divorce was to be final, he started acting out was was put into a psych ward - but they left him with his bathrobe belt and he used it to hang himself.
Sheer incompetence on the part of staff who admitted him! The pt should not have been given any belongings until all shoelaces, belts, keys, nail files, glass, sharp objects, pencils and pens, jewelry, etc. had been locked away. They could easily be sued for their negligence.
@@kathyclark8274 - I think his parents did sue. They weren’t very nice to my sister and blamed her for their son’s death. Later, my sister found out that his family hid from her that there had been other family members with serious mental health disorders as well as at k on east one previous suicide.
Him trying to harm ANY animal would be a deal breaker for me!..I can't comprehend how she accepted that😢
Amazing video! Thank you.
What a pretty,. blooming cactus 🌵 on the background table.Much appreciation for your brilliant work Dr Grande as always
Compliment his cacti and he purrs!
Good stuff Doc !
Well I guess, don't fall for the plane rides 'cause in the wrong hands, you might fall out of one (not trying to be funny). Thanks for your efforts to protect women from men like this, Dr. G. You're a good guy (and looking handsome too)! Have a great night, and I'll see ya tomorrow! 😉😘
This is one of several cases which Dr. Grande has commented upon that make me question the whole OCEAN model. I assume there are multiple subcategories to each category in the model but still I'm skeptical. Calmness and quickness to anger are easily observable in life but should they really be grouped into one category "Neuroticism"?
Exactly. Was he high in neuroticism or low? It doesn't make sense if his personality varied so dramatically between settings, to the extent that it renders a personality trait meaningless.
If you didn't say "moving on up" after mentioning the Jeffersons, I would have been very disappointed.
My mom used to work as a housekeeper for a heart surgeon and she’d say that if a patient of his died in or right after surgery, he’d break up emotionally and not leave his office for days.
Sounds like he was heartbroken, which is a bit ironic really.
@@eadweard., it really is
@@LluviadeOrugas I think that shows that he was so very sincere and hoping to do well by every patient. I like him already.
@@Nan-Elle, yes, I have very fond memories of him!
Being strangled the first time would be a major red flag maybe? Love you in RAF blue Dr G! 🇬🇧
Almost being a psychologist, is probably not as good as actually being one... And that's still not a guarantee! If psychologists were perfect mind readers they'd be gods. Thank you Dr.Grande for this deep dive into the equally messed up lives and minds of fairly intelligent and privileged people.
I don’t think it has anything to do with that actually. For anyone able to think objectively, regardless of their professional qualifications, it should’ve been obvious that she was in a great deal of danger.
In your profile picture, it looks like you're wearing "scary shiny glasses". Classic anime glasses glare.
Anyone can become a psychologist
Intrigued and interested in this analysis. Wondering what you might have cooked up for us at 900K!
Soon very soon!⏰🕰⌚🎉🎇🏆
Harm to animals, red flag for psychopathy. Someone who ‘nearly has a Phd in psychology’ should know that.
I shudder to think of what he said to his therapists that made them believe he was extremely dangerous.
He either discussed having homicidal thoughts and intentions to act on them, or he was very aggressive and threatening towards the therapist, or both.
If a person consistently shows you who they are, believe them. Random acts of violence inflicted by a stranger, is no less painful or deadly than from someone you know.
Be safe out there 🙏 in crazyland 🥴
Yes! But you have to have a good sense of self-worth first and many don't!
@@bthomson Truth. It's somewhat comforting to know there are sensible people like you still around. Thank you.
Hi dr. Grande. Would you consider making a video about Ali Abulaban please? Thank you. 🙏
Thank you, doctor. 🧡
If anyone ever tried to harm one of my cats (or other pets) that would be the end of any contact with this person
Hit the road jack and don't you come back no more, no more, no more! 🎤🎶
If somebody tried to drown my cat, I wouldn't need a therapist's letter to warn me. That's just about the biggest of all possible red flags.
(1) Report the bastard to the cops tonight.
(2) First thing tomorrow, go to the courthouse for a restraining order.
(3) Take further (lawful) steps as seems right.
Interesting esp about the letter. So many women stay with abusers with misguided compassion or low self esteem. Very sad. Thanks Dr G😊💛💜
haha I forgot about Zena, warrior princess haha =)
@@ScumfuckMcDoucheface 😊She was fierce but funny. U sure have an interesting handle there....! Any reason? 😆
@@zenawarrior7442 haha just to give others a chuckle, and keep myself humble haha =) that's all
@@ScumfuckMcDoucheface OK. It's definitely eye 👁catching haha
@@zenawarrior7442 I had one guy ask me if an unhappy ex had known my password and broke into my account to change the name haha **shrug** it always leads to interesting conversation =)
I better pee before the vid starts.,.Doctor Funnyman T. Grande is getting to be too much nowadays :)
Just right!
I thoroughly watching your take on this episode and look forward to your upcoming episodes as well. Is there any chance of reviewing Motive currently on Netflix? Thanks.
PS, your understated humour is much appreciated.
I had a client once and after the first session I felt that this client would either suicide or file a complaint against me. I just had that feeling after spending the hour with him. It's very interesting when a clinician can get such a strong impression so quickly, such as the two therapists in Robert's case. In regards to my own case, the client did email me a suicide note at one point, but never made an attempt.
Intuition could be a factor.🙂
VERY important analysis of Dr. Stone's letter. Every person, but especially every educated person like Gail, should have understood exactly what it meant.
Moving on up. Dr. Grande, only those of a certain age will catch that funny!
Anyone else remember the episode of Law and Order: Criminal Intent that was based on this case? I didn't know it was based on a real case til just now. Thanks Doc
One of my favorite detective pairings on the show was Belzer and Ice T.
I like Ice T he's cool.
His wife coco is his perfect partner.
Erik - Did you see the wonderful ad with Ice T about lemonade! Priceless!
THAT'S why the plane thing felt familiar!