'Not by accident that you have to join a wait list'...........Or maybe they are underfunded and they don't hold stock. I have heard of some ridiculous waiting times. The swytch kit uses a cadence sensor. The Brompton Electric a torque sensor, which is a better system as it gives more assistance the harder you push on the pedals which is what you need. The Brompton Electric has integrated lights. I am viewing this from the UK where the motor power/assist cut off speed is the same for all road legal bikes.
BROMPTON ELECTRIC. "THE WORLDS MOST UNRELIABLE BIKE".. Both of my Electric Brompton"s continuously keep braking down. The poor quality bearings & electronics keep failing. Brompton knows about this. But just keeps replacing them with same the parts. Buy yourself several Chines copies for the same price. Or better still a Honda CBR 125cc motorcycle for the same price. Feel less disappointed & save yourself a fortune.
I have a E Brompton but I live with the limitations which is a robust system. The forks are designed and dimensioned differently to cope with the motor. I like the idea of Grin system and with more horses under your feet.
I do like your videos = very detailed. Unfortunately the Swytch people did not do their homework = you can not fold the Brompton down with the battery facing frontward. Many Brompton owners who purchased this system complained to swytch so they had to be refunded or they sent out an additional piece of kit so it faced on the inside, obviously the people making it never even tried it before going to market.
For the Swytch I am curious since the battery cradle/controller is mounted on the front of the handlebars if that interferes with the fold. That is the side which folds towards the frame.
Interesting. I am wanting a Brampton Electric, but have been hesitant because of the 15 mph limit....too slow. I like the idea of using the grin kit with a regular light weight Brompton. Are there any problems specific to the 6 speed that might make either the 4 speed or the 3 speed a better option? The complexity of an internally geared hub with the externally geared derailleur seems a lot. I'm not expert though. I live in an area of steep hills, but that's why I want the electric. The non-electric would be for mostly flat terrain and small hills. 😁
Justin from Grin seems well ahead of the rest of the pack (including Brompton)! so many detailed resources on their site, including simulators! I like their open and scientific approach. Do you know if they ship to Europe?
@@SmallWheelWonder They have discontinued the geared one and seem to only offer the direct drive motor now. I am not sure if the direct drive motor is the right choice for converting bromptons. It's significantly heavier and has considerably less torque. It enables regen breaking but I don't know if it justifies the extra weight and reduced torque
There's no way anybody is selling a direct drive for the front wheel. It would rip apart the headset. Direct drives are great for scooters in the rear wheel because of their insane torque, but they don't belong in front wheel driven bikes. The regenerative break is a dreamboat you don't want to miss. Just ask any Tesla owner. I use it exclusively, but it has to be set correctly. The grip brakes I use maybe twice a year to do an emergency break.
Any bike can go as fast as it likes downhill, whether the electric motor is governed or not. 15mph assistance limit means you can probably do 20+ mph on the flat if you pedal meaningfully, and 40 mph downhill on the right hill. And the Swytch has sucky cadence sensing not torque sensing.
@@SmallWheelWonderNope. I regularly ride my small geared hub motor at 30mph downhill. It freewheels when it reaches its terminal velocity where it is able to assist. Beyond that, my 100 watts and gravity make me go as fast as I like.
Excellent Information and tips, and I would very much concur with your advice on an electric conversion vs. a factory electric Brompton. However, when it comes to front drive conversions, and having done several front wheel conversions and broken and stripped a couple of front forks using front Hub motors, and I was lucky they failed when starting from a stop and not when traveling at speed, and as such, I would advise utmost caution when installing front hub motors on bicycles. Do you know if the front forks on the Brompton's factory ebikes any more robust than the non-e-bike versions? I see Brompton use 250w front hub motors, that appear to be direct drive rather than geared. As a 250w to 350w geared hub motor can produce at much or more torque than say a 500w to 1000w hub motor, If I were going to install a front-drive geared hub motor, or direct drive hub motor much larger than 250W, I'd install the Grin's V7-torque arms and not the older versions or the cheap ones as they are not designed to work with Re-gen breaking and won't contain the front wheel if the fork drop-outs fail. I've have several DIY ebikes and one with a 1,500w font drive motor So I can attach a Yakima one-wheel trailer, and end up with 2-wheel Drive for off-road, and have ridden it over 2,000 miles, but installed my own design CNC dual attachment torque arms on a very heavy-duty downhill front fork, but I would not recommend front drive motors for the average rider as it introduces several risks. I installed a 48V 350w direct-drive front hub motor on a Folding Dahon bike I over-volted to about 600W, but found it a handful and I was slipping the front wheel and putting a lot of stress on the frame, and later converted it a 500W rear drive hub boosted to about 750w and much prefer the balance and handling of the rear motor, and I was thinking if the Brompton has a wide-enough drop-out to accommodate a rear hub motor, for those who don't often need to go back to non-electric, or want to really hot-rod their Brompton, perhaps rear drive might be a better option?
Why would you need to motorise a 16lb Brompton..It should be a breeze to barrel up to 15mph and stay there on a T line. Its basically like riding a miniature road bike....
Ich will in Kürze ein Brompton kaufen ... möglichst ein Electric... Aber der Motor : 1. zu laut, 2. zu unschön, 3. zu schwach, 4. kein Tuning möglich, 5. die Akkutasche .. Man kann nur in eine Richtung schalten ( = wenn man im 3. ist und in den 2. will, muss man drücken = 0, nochmals drücken = 1, nochmals drücken 2 Gang ... ) und dann das sich rüber beugen über den Lenker um an die Schalter zu kommen ... : unbequem und umständlich .... und beim Pflasterstein-Fahren hüpft der Akku aus der Halterung .. und er nimmt mir an der Lenkstange den Platz weg .... Also irgendwie unprofessionell .... Da baue ich mir vielleicht lieber den "PENDIX"-Motor ein ... Und den kann man dann auch problemlos wieder aus-/umbauen ... und so weiter ........... Dachte immer dass Brompton der Rolls-Royce der Falträder sei ... leider aber nicht bezüglich des Elektrik-Modells ....
'Not by accident that you have to join a wait list'...........Or maybe they are underfunded and they don't hold stock. I have heard of some ridiculous waiting times.
The swytch kit uses a cadence sensor. The Brompton Electric a torque sensor, which is a better system as it gives more assistance the harder you push on the pedals which is what you need.
The Brompton Electric has integrated lights.
I am viewing this from the UK where the motor power/assist cut off speed is the same for all road legal bikes.
Thanks for the information.
BROMPTON ELECTRIC. "THE WORLDS MOST UNRELIABLE BIKE".. Both of my Electric Brompton"s continuously keep braking down. The poor quality bearings & electronics keep failing. Brompton knows about this. But just keeps replacing them with same the parts. Buy yourself several Chines copies for the same price. Or better still a Honda CBR 125cc motorcycle for the same price. Feel less disappointed & save yourself a fortune.
Wow! Would love to hear details.
I have a E Brompton but I live with the limitations which is a robust system. The forks are designed and dimensioned differently to cope with the motor. I like the idea of Grin system and with more horses under your feet.
I do like your videos = very detailed. Unfortunately the Swytch people did not do their homework = you can not fold the Brompton down with the battery facing frontward. Many Brompton owners who purchased this system complained to swytch so they had to be refunded or they sent out an additional piece of kit so it faced on the inside, obviously the people making it never even tried it before going to market.
Time to get a Grin kit 😉
@@SmallWheelWonder how much are they.
Check: ebikes.ca
For the Swytch I am curious since the battery cradle/controller is mounted on the front of the handlebars if that interferes with the fold. That is the side which folds towards the frame.
You may have to do a bit of adjusting to accommodate the fold.
Most Brompton with a Swytch will have it installed on the 'inside' of the bar as it can't fold as shown on the images.
Have you seen the Zehus all-in-one motor/battery hub, which is the system in the Hummingbird e-bike?
May not be reliable but a better design than the Brompton's.
Interesting. I am wanting a Brampton Electric, but have been hesitant because of the 15 mph limit....too slow. I like the idea of using the grin kit with a regular light weight Brompton. Are there any problems specific to the 6 speed that might make either the 4 speed or the 3 speed a better option? The complexity of an internally geared hub with the externally geared derailleur seems a lot. I'm not expert though. I live in an area of steep hills, but that's why I want the electric. The non-electric would be for mostly flat terrain and small hills. 😁
3 speed + Grin.
A-line is 3 speed not one.
Confusing indeed.
Justin from Grin seems well ahead of the rest of the pack (including Brompton)! so many detailed resources on their site, including simulators! I like their open and scientific approach. Do you know if they ship to Europe?
I'm sure they ship anywhere if you pay for it. Money talks ;-)
@@SmallWheelWonderyou got the direct drive or geared motor
Geared.
@@SmallWheelWonder They have discontinued the geared one and seem to only offer the direct drive motor now. I am not sure if the direct drive motor is the right choice for converting bromptons. It's significantly heavier and has considerably less torque. It enables regen breaking but I don't know if it justifies the extra weight and reduced torque
There's no way anybody is selling a direct drive for the front wheel. It would rip apart the headset. Direct drives are great for scooters in the rear wheel because of their insane torque, but they don't belong in front wheel driven bikes.
The regenerative break is a dreamboat you don't want to miss. Just ask any Tesla owner. I use it exclusively, but it has to be set correctly. The grip brakes I use maybe twice a year to do an emergency break.
Any bike can go as fast as it likes downhill, whether the electric motor is governed or not. 15mph assistance limit means you can probably do 20+ mph on the flat if you pedal meaningfully, and 40 mph downhill on the right hill. And the Swytch has sucky cadence sensing not torque sensing.
100% incorrect. I have tested both situations multiple times.
@@SmallWheelWonderNope. I regularly ride my small geared hub motor at 30mph downhill. It freewheels when it reaches its terminal velocity where it is able to assist. Beyond that, my 100 watts and gravity make me go as fast as I like.
I hit 45 mph on my etrike on a big hill, and my direct drive hub motor only assists up to 25 mph. don't know what you are on about.
Look up gear inches.
OMG dude! Give it up. I love all my Brompton’s. You must be jealous or something
This is not a Brompton fan channel. I have no brand loyalty and serve none. The brands serve me 😉
Excellent Information and tips, and I would very much concur with your advice on an electric conversion vs. a factory electric Brompton. However, when it comes to front drive conversions, and having done several front wheel conversions and broken and stripped a couple of front forks using front Hub motors, and I was lucky they failed when starting from a stop and not when traveling at speed, and as such, I would advise utmost caution when installing front hub motors on bicycles.
Do you know if the front forks on the Brompton's factory ebikes any more robust than the non-e-bike versions? I see Brompton use 250w front hub motors, that appear to be direct drive rather than geared. As a 250w to 350w geared hub motor can produce at much or more torque than say a 500w to 1000w hub motor, If I were going to install a front-drive geared hub motor, or direct drive hub motor much larger than 250W, I'd install the Grin's V7-torque arms and not the older versions or the cheap ones as they are not designed to work with Re-gen breaking and won't contain the front wheel if the fork drop-outs fail.
I've have several DIY ebikes and one with a 1,500w font drive motor So I can attach a Yakima one-wheel trailer, and end up with 2-wheel Drive for off-road, and have ridden it over 2,000 miles, but installed my own design CNC dual attachment torque arms on a very heavy-duty downhill front fork, but I would not recommend front drive motors for the average rider as it introduces several risks.
I installed a 48V 350w direct-drive front hub motor on a Folding Dahon bike I over-volted to about 600W, but found it a handful and I was slipping the front wheel and putting a lot of stress on the frame, and later converted it a 500W rear drive hub boosted to about 750w and much prefer the balance and handling of the rear motor, and I was thinking if the Brompton has a wide-enough drop-out to accommodate a rear hub motor, for those who don't often need to go back to non-electric, or want to really hot-rod their Brompton, perhaps rear drive might be a better option?
Rear drive or torque arms + wattage knob.
How can you motorize a T line Brompton? If you have a T line Brompton, can you use these kits?
I would worry about motor spin-out on the T-line's carbon forks, but other than that they should fit just fne.
@@b.griffin317 I was concerned that the carbon fork might be to fragile for these motor kits. What is motor spin-out?
You should not put a motor into a carbon fork. You can motorize the TI Bromptons but only from the rear, which is an advanced topic.
Why would you need to motorise a 16lb Brompton..It should be a breeze to barrel up to 15mph and stay there on a T line. Its basically like riding a miniature road bike....
Ich will in Kürze ein Brompton kaufen ... möglichst ein Electric... Aber der Motor : 1. zu laut, 2. zu unschön, 3. zu schwach, 4. kein Tuning möglich, 5. die Akkutasche .. Man kann nur in eine Richtung schalten ( = wenn man im 3. ist und in den 2. will, muss man drücken = 0, nochmals drücken = 1, nochmals drücken 2 Gang ... ) und dann das sich rüber beugen über den Lenker um an die Schalter zu kommen ... : unbequem und umständlich .... und beim Pflasterstein-Fahren hüpft der Akku aus der Halterung .. und er nimmt mir an der Lenkstange den Platz weg .... Also irgendwie unprofessionell .... Da baue ich mir vielleicht lieber den "PENDIX"-Motor ein ... Und den kann man dann auch problemlos wieder aus-/umbauen ... und so weiter ........... Dachte immer dass Brompton der Rolls-Royce der Falträder sei ... leider aber nicht bezüglich des Elektrik-Modells ....
Kaufen Sie einen R&M Tinker oder holen Sie sich ein elektrisches Brompton-Kit von Grin (ebikes.ca).