Honestly, Joppa has discussed housing before on a stream, and I could seem them implementing guild halls/housing eventually. What you descirbed for the selling stalls, was basically what the Bazaar started out as in Everquest. You set you char in a spot in the bazaar, put in sell mode, and had to stay logged in to actually sell something. I'd be down for something like this, maybe set it in an instanced location. I wouldnt mind mob markers as a QoL thing, but i could see why ppl wouldnt, but most enc would kill for it.
I thought it would be a nice little synergy specifically for Enchanters, the mob marking, then I thought "Why not expand it to the other synergy skills like Expose and Open Gap" but obviously it couldn't be a utility knife of applying those itself. If VR ever sees this video, hopefully they consider the marker debuffs! I really need to tune into more Joppa streams. I try to catch him when I can but the timing usually isn't in my favor. Do you happen to remember the date of the stream he talked about housing? I'd love to go back and give it a watch. Thanks!
Everquest when it first came out did not have an auction house. We use the tunnel in East Commonlands leading to North Ro. Eventually we got an AH where your character stood in an area and was able to sale things as a merchant. Only issue was it was near an Open PvP arena and on the full loot PvP server we would push people into the area, kill them and then loot the stuff. After a few months, they fixed it so we could not push players in merchant mode.
This seems like a wild experience. I actually looked into the Bazaar that EQ implemented but couldn't find a lot of good footage to use nor any ideas I could draw a direct reference to but an area like this without the need to afk sell things would be kind of cool. Or a limit on what can be sold while afk- perhaps just abundant gathering mats like maple and ash logs, and not something that has already been processed.
@@ErrantLorefinder I think Star Wars Galaxies had the best AH/Merchant setup. You would search for what you wanted, and then have to go to the persons store and there was an NPC merchant that would sale you stuff. You could also setup custom orders for pickup for a specific person.
The idea of keeping auctions social is appealing to me. Deals can be made and lost in real time that way. Most people make bank alts and such. Why not lean into that a bit more and have a “vendor class” of sorts that has access to the bank’s and inventory’s of the accounts toon’s. I mean it could have those ideas you suggested to name a few and be tied to a playerhousing function. Probably dreamland imo but who knows 😂
A vendor class would be sick. I don't even know what that would look like but I would LOVE the ability to make my main class a merchant and have my little stall. Set up a business where an adventuring guild can use me as a medium to sell their goods and I keep a little share of the profit but then they don't have to stand around to sell their stuff- I'll do it for them! Damn, that is a good idea. I might actually have to make a video about that, thanks!
I like that you covered the hot topics. Some "solution" towards auctioning is definitely something I want to see the game move towards, but I myself am also undecided as to how that might look. I definitely don't want just a WoW like AH...but right now the spamming can get over the top, and servers with multiple shards make things a bit awkward as well. One thing to remember: The game is aiming to have no zones, which could mean the auction channel becomes worldwide. Having said that, the most appealing solution to be would actually be the first you suggested. The ability to highlight text in chat would make things simpler without the annoying and abusive things that come from an actual AH. Great video friend!
I actually didn't realize that the game was intended to be one big zone. That is going to make global chats go absolutely crazy though I suppose they have some help for that in the fact that you can just make separate chat channels for things. I think the Auction House talk is something that is going to continue on for some time- probably all the way up to release, and I am sure there will be some people that don't like what ever version that VR happens to go with. Either way, thanks for watching!
The idea of using a player stall is great. I can imagine people lined up on the road making their own market there. The stall could be crafted by a carpenter too. This worked on a game called Aion. You could set up a personal shop where you stand and sell anything.
Comments like this really remind me of how little experience I have had in other game systems. I love the idea of market stalls that folks can set up and maybe even customize- it adds a lot of life into the game. Hope Aion 2 delivers such innovative ideas.
I think a lot of you are asking for things to be worse to feel superior to people who don't want their game to have the feel of an excel spreadsheet. Just because you're nostalgic for EQ doesn't mean we should forego common sense game design.
I'm not sure what this means exactly but my personal intention is to keep the game social. =] I love the idea of things having to be done manually because it drives character interaction, not out of some sense of superiority, though I have a feeling this comment wasn't aimed at me. Either way, I wanted to respond.
I am glad you enjoyed the video! It has been so long since I have played Mabinogi but it had a lot of social/life systems that made it incredibly social. Stuff like that doesn't get as much attention now-days, sadly. Here is hoping for the player profile system!
If they don’t implement a better system than spamming chat to trade, it means trading will eventually move to a website or discord server designed for this. Anyone thinking otherwise is very naive.
I think an external website will be used regardless of what solution is come up with. Every game has one. You can search "World of Warcraft market" on Google and you'll probably get an insanely comprehensive detailing of what item is going for what on what server. These sorts of things are just inevitable. That being said, we can still want and dream for a system that keeps the market sociable. =]
I had a similar thought to this, perhaps a base % tax on any items sold through the stall plus an hourly fee to rent the space of the stall. Maybe you could even pay a little more to make your stall look fancy? Having a money sink always helps.
I absolutely hate having to sit around and try to sell stuff. With that said I hate even more trying to read a wall of text that gets replaced by another wall of text. People defending how EverQuest was need to stop. Back then there was not a true standard for mmorpgs. It’s just how they did it back then. We are in much different times with a much different player base. I played EQ back in the day and I also play XIV now. I remember how painful it was and I know how nice it can be now. Games definitely need a quality of life that will keep players around and not frustrated. I’d love to see an auction house and a better system to find groups. I’ve spent hours trying and failing to get a party going. It’s rough. However, I still defend no maps. It makes me use my pea size brain. Great vid. Cheers.
Thank you for the remarks, and though I hadn't been around for the EQ1 glory days, I can respect the sentiment of not wanting to sit around and spam your sell macros and then have to read through walls upon walls of text to find what you are looking for. I'm not sure there is a perfect solution for that which I seek but I love the idea of keeping the market place a social experience. Perhaps I am being too wishful in my thinking, but Pantheon wants to be a social game where players engage with each other. Maybe we can make that happen? =]
And then there will be someone that thinks " i absolutely hate the auction house, i want players to sell their stuff face to face and barter for prices , but i can not play without a map, even explorers back then had maps, at least give me a cartographer skill, that will fill the map as i explore, the more skill i have the better the details on the map" The PC game Eschalon did that perfectly, my point is everyone thinks differently. The amount of players that will not play the game because there's no map will be gigantic....its also funny to see people speak about Everquest and back then there were no maps, but those same people use ZEAL on emulated server to use the map.....yeah.
I'm not sure if this is part of the game or the server but I have been told that Neverwinter Nights allows you to keep the basic outline of a map you explored but it would become covered by a "fog of war" so the details would become obscured after so long an amount of time. Rangers were the exception, and Rangers were often hired to guide people from place to place because their map was persistent. Something like that would be kind of sick imo.
I personally like the idea of a global auction channel, and no actual AH. Guildhalls would be huge for me, though. I'd really like to see ways to engage with the game more as a crafter without needing to also focus on leveling/combat (to just be a more purely "social" player), but the level gating on crafting really makes the difficult. I know that it isn't a simple problem to solve, though, since if getting access to significant crafting didn't require investment and energy from leveling, then each player could just make a set of characters for every type of crafting and swap between them (something I definitely don't want to happen).
Guild Halls would be massively. As I have gotten older, I've grown more in favor of them than I have things like personal player housing. I do think there is something to be said about a slightly separated structure of crafting and gathering levels from character levels but I have no immediate thoughts on what that would look like. Maybe I'll give that some thought and see what comes out. If I come up with something neat, I'll put it in a follow up video. =] Cheers!
Guild Trader system from ESO is best trading imo. You might run across a great deal in the open world and outside of that you can still offer trades in the game's zone chat.
@@ThatGuy-cb3yv @ErrantLorefinder Thank you for your reply. I just went into the goblin cave with a party of Palx3, Nec, Clr, and Shm, and we were able to get to the depths without collapsing😀
It’s not that horrible, the mobs still give good exp at levels 14. These dungeons aren’t meant to be conquered like wow in one trip. Hell there’s a level 20 guy in there, it’s about exploration much more then the loot.
My issue with the game, is the mini game u have to play to use ur skills. Have played few classes shaman, wizard, dire lord so far n out of the 3, shaman plays the best cuz it's jus mana where as wiz,DL I have to have focus or essence respectively. Will give monk n necro a go to bout 8 as well. As these are the 5 class potentials for me but shaman is winning right now cuz of the mini games
I don't feel like I have had this same experience, though most of my gameplay has been Cleric, Paladin and Rogue, and these have a pretty standard rotation of things that deviate a little as the character gets higher level but I haven't found a class that I thought felt bad to play.
You can make a separate tab and have only the auction chat there! Why people still advertise in /ooc, I have no idea. Honestly I would LOVE to see an LFG channel as well.
And that is totally alright! If you don't like something a game is doing, you have full rights to not participate. There isn't even a guarantee there will be a map in the future, so if you think your money is best spent elsewhere, I hope you find something worthwhile out there.
![Combat Guide: Consumables - Master Level (Nightfall) [Mortal Online 2]](/img/1.gif)
Honestly, Joppa has discussed housing before on a stream, and I could seem them implementing guild halls/housing eventually.
What you descirbed for the selling stalls, was basically what the Bazaar started out as in Everquest. You set you char in a spot in the bazaar, put in sell mode, and had to stay logged in to actually sell something. I'd be down for something like this, maybe set it in an instanced location.
I wouldnt mind mob markers as a QoL thing, but i could see why ppl wouldnt, but most enc would kill for it.
I thought it would be a nice little synergy specifically for Enchanters, the mob marking, then I thought "Why not expand it to the other synergy skills like Expose and Open Gap" but obviously it couldn't be a utility knife of applying those itself. If VR ever sees this video, hopefully they consider the marker debuffs!
I really need to tune into more Joppa streams. I try to catch him when I can but the timing usually isn't in my favor. Do you happen to remember the date of the stream he talked about housing? I'd love to go back and give it a watch. Thanks!
@@ErrantLorefinder Sadly I do not, but pretty sure was recent, but it was brief too.
Looks like I'll have to go digging but thanks for the heads up anyway! Maybe I'll ask him about it if I can catch him on a stream.
Everquest when it first came out did not have an auction house. We use the tunnel in East Commonlands leading to North Ro. Eventually we got an AH where your character stood in an area and was able to sale things as a merchant. Only issue was it was near an Open PvP arena and on the full loot PvP server we would push people into the area, kill them and then loot the stuff. After a few months, they fixed it so we could not push players in merchant mode.
This seems like a wild experience. I actually looked into the Bazaar that EQ implemented but couldn't find a lot of good footage to use nor any ideas I could draw a direct reference to but an area like this without the need to afk sell things would be kind of cool. Or a limit on what can be sold while afk- perhaps just abundant gathering mats like maple and ash logs, and not something that has already been processed.
@@ErrantLorefinder I think Star Wars Galaxies had the best AH/Merchant setup. You would search for what you wanted, and then have to go to the persons store and there was an NPC merchant that would sale you stuff. You could also setup custom orders for pickup for a specific person.
@ That sounds kind of awesome. Maybe I should do a video on Starwars Galaxies and see how it is doing.
The idea of keeping auctions social is appealing to me. Deals can be made and lost in real time that way. Most people make bank alts and such. Why not lean into that a bit more and have a “vendor class” of sorts that has access to the bank’s and inventory’s of the accounts toon’s. I mean it could have those ideas you suggested to name a few and be tied to a playerhousing function. Probably dreamland imo but who knows 😂
A vendor class would be sick. I don't even know what that would look like but I would LOVE the ability to make my main class a merchant and have my little stall. Set up a business where an adventuring guild can use me as a medium to sell their goods and I keep a little share of the profit but then they don't have to stand around to sell their stuff- I'll do it for them!
Damn, that is a good idea. I might actually have to make a video about that, thanks!
I like that you covered the hot topics. Some "solution" towards auctioning is definitely something I want to see the game move towards, but I myself am also undecided as to how that might look. I definitely don't want just a WoW like AH...but right now the spamming can get over the top, and servers with multiple shards make things a bit awkward as well.
One thing to remember: The game is aiming to have no zones, which could mean the auction channel becomes worldwide. Having said that, the most appealing solution to be would actually be the first you suggested. The ability to highlight text in chat would make things simpler without the annoying and abusive things that come from an actual AH.
Great video friend!
I actually didn't realize that the game was intended to be one big zone. That is going to make global chats go absolutely crazy though I suppose they have some help for that in the fact that you can just make separate chat channels for things. I think the Auction House talk is something that is going to continue on for some time- probably all the way up to release, and I am sure there will be some people that don't like what ever version that VR happens to go with.
Either way, thanks for watching!
The idea of using a player stall is great. I can imagine people lined up on the road making their own market there. The stall could be crafted by a carpenter too.
This worked on a game called Aion. You could set up a personal shop where you stand and sell anything.
Comments like this really remind me of how little experience I have had in other game systems. I love the idea of market stalls that folks can set up and maybe even customize- it adds a lot of life into the game. Hope Aion 2 delivers such innovative ideas.
I think a lot of you are asking for things to be worse to feel superior to people who don't want their game to have the feel of an excel spreadsheet.
Just because you're nostalgic for EQ doesn't mean we should forego common sense game design.
I'm not sure what this means exactly but my personal intention is to keep the game social. =] I love the idea of things having to be done manually because it drives character interaction, not out of some sense of superiority, though I have a feeling this comment wasn't aimed at me. Either way, I wanted to respond.
My maps were printed out on EQ
Truly the meta.
I really think player owned "stores" like in mabinogi would be the best option
oh dude I love the idea of character profiles, honestly a must have for any social mmo
10/10 video
I am glad you enjoyed the video! It has been so long since I have played Mabinogi but it had a lot of social/life systems that made it incredibly social. Stuff like that doesn't get as much attention now-days, sadly. Here is hoping for the player profile system!
If they don’t implement a better system than spamming chat to trade, it means trading will eventually move to a website or discord server designed for this.
Anyone thinking otherwise is very naive.
I think an external website will be used regardless of what solution is come up with. Every game has one. You can search "World of Warcraft market" on Google and you'll probably get an insanely comprehensive detailing of what item is going for what on what server. These sorts of things are just inevitable.
That being said, we can still want and dream for a system that keeps the market sociable. =]
Charge an auction house fee and a vendor booth fee to people selling their things.
I had a similar thought to this, perhaps a base % tax on any items sold through the stall plus an hourly fee to rent the space of the stall. Maybe you could even pay a little more to make your stall look fancy? Having a money sink always helps.
I absolutely hate having to sit around and try to sell stuff. With that said I hate even more trying to read a wall of text that gets replaced by another wall of text.
People defending how EverQuest was need to stop. Back then there was not a true standard for mmorpgs. It’s just how they did it back then. We are in much different times with a much different player base. I played EQ back in the day and I also play XIV now. I remember how painful it was and I know how nice it can be now. Games definitely need a quality of life that will keep players around and not frustrated. I’d love to see an auction house and a better system to find groups. I’ve spent hours trying and failing to get a party going. It’s rough. However, I still defend no maps. It makes me use my pea size brain. Great vid. Cheers.
Thank you for the remarks, and though I hadn't been around for the EQ1 glory days, I can respect the sentiment of not wanting to sit around and spam your sell macros and then have to read through walls upon walls of text to find what you are looking for. I'm not sure there is a perfect solution for that which I seek but I love the idea of keeping the market place a social experience. Perhaps I am being too wishful in my thinking, but Pantheon wants to be a social game where players engage with each other. Maybe we can make that happen? =]
And then there will be someone that thinks " i absolutely hate the auction house, i want players to sell their stuff face to face and barter for prices , but i can not play without a map, even explorers back then had maps, at least give me a cartographer skill, that will fill the map as i explore, the more skill i have the better the details on the map"
The PC game Eschalon did that perfectly, my point is everyone thinks differently.
The amount of players that will not play the game because there's no map will be gigantic....its also funny to see people speak about Everquest and back then there were no maps, but those same people use ZEAL on emulated server to use the map.....yeah.
I'm not sure if this is part of the game or the server but I have been told that Neverwinter Nights allows you to keep the basic outline of a map you explored but it would become covered by a "fog of war" so the details would become obscured after so long an amount of time. Rangers were the exception, and Rangers were often hired to guide people from place to place because their map was persistent. Something like that would be kind of sick imo.
I personally like the idea of a global auction channel, and no actual AH. Guildhalls would be huge for me, though.
I'd really like to see ways to engage with the game more as a crafter without needing to also focus on leveling/combat (to just be a more purely "social" player), but the level gating on crafting really makes the difficult. I know that it isn't a simple problem to solve, though, since if getting access to significant crafting didn't require investment and energy from leveling, then each player could just make a set of characters for every type of crafting and swap between them (something I definitely don't want to happen).
Guild Halls would be massively. As I have gotten older, I've grown more in favor of them than I have things like personal player housing.
I do think there is something to be said about a slightly separated structure of crafting and gathering levels from character levels but I have no immediate thoughts on what that would look like. Maybe I'll give that some thought and see what comes out. If I come up with something neat, I'll put it in a follow up video. =] Cheers!
Guild Trader system from ESO is best trading imo. You might run across a great deal in the open world and outside of that you can still offer trades in the game's zone chat.
I'll add this to the growing list of systems I need to check out in other games, thanks!
As a player who enjoys playing alts a lot, the only thing I wish for is for shared bank slots
I am sure there are more than a few people that would appreciate that- or at the very least a means by which to send things between characters.
Goblin caves are too difficult for the temporary party. At least Lv12 is needed for summon corpse.
Gob caves is where you cut your teeth. I like that it's hard and hope it stays challenging.
I have greatly enjoyed my time in the Goblin caves, myself!
@@ThatGuy-cb3yv @ErrantLorefinder Thank you for your reply. I just went into the goblin cave with a party of Palx3, Nec, Clr, and Shm, and we were able to get to the depths without collapsing😀
It’s not that horrible, the mobs still give good exp at levels 14. These dungeons aren’t meant to be conquered like wow in one trip. Hell there’s a level 20 guy in there, it’s about exploration much more then the loot.
My issue with the game, is the mini game u have to play to use ur skills. Have played few classes shaman, wizard, dire lord so far n out of the 3, shaman plays the best cuz it's jus mana where as wiz,DL I have to have focus or essence respectively. Will give monk n necro a go to bout 8 as well. As these are the 5 class potentials for me but shaman is winning right now cuz of the mini games
I don't feel like I have had this same experience, though most of my gameplay has been Cleric, Paladin and Rogue, and these have a pretty standard rotation of things that deviate a little as the character gets higher level but I haven't found a class that I thought felt bad to play.
@ErrantLorefinder yeah I like the old school mana for skills etc. Getting chi n essence is annoying. Doesn't feel great imo
Wait. There's an auction channel? Why the heck is OOC flooded with sales?
You can make a separate tab and have only the auction chat there! Why people still advertise in /ooc, I have no idea. Honestly I would LOVE to see an LFG channel as well.
Play Guild wars 2, if you want player music with instruments.
I've only ever put like 2 hours into GW2 but I had a lot of fun- I didn't know it had a player music system. I should check that out...
You're describing the bazaar
Yes! The bazaar was part of my inspiration for that idea though I haven't actually played EQ1 so I didn't know how to draw a direct parallel.
I refunded the game once I saw no map
And that is totally alright! If you don't like something a game is doing, you have full rights to not participate. There isn't even a guarantee there will be a map in the future, so if you think your money is best spent elsewhere, I hope you find something worthwhile out there.