The "Fat" Girl: Bridgerton To Early 2000's Chick Flicks
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- I just watched season three of Bridgerton and it sent me down a rabbit hole of the history of fatshaming, ongoing fat jokes and double standards in the media and even early 2000's rom coms like Bridget Jones' Diary, the Devil Wears Prada and Love Actually. It even pops up in famous musical movies... remember "Fat Amy", anyone? This is a sensitive topic so let's be kind to each other in the comments.
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There is a lot to delve into on this topic. It was so pervasive that we couldn't recognize what it was, and so many people grew up with completely warped perceptions of themselves and what women should look like. Fatphobia was not in our lexicon. It is sad to see we are still there in so many ways.
Penelope was played by a woman who is a size 10 and we think we did something revolutionary. Even though she is the only person whose stomach we cover with robes and scarves. This is brave to us. Because it is, unfortunately. It is brave for her to knowingly face the onslaught of criticism and utterly terrible questions.
I hope we get better, and better a lot more quickly than we've done so far.
Love the hair for this one, Serena. It's very eye-catching.
I find this dialogue about Penelope in Bridgerton to be very much the same as the dialogue around Bridget Jone's Diary in the early 2000s. We all seem to be just accepting her body type is so much larger than the norm, and we will look back in 20 years and say, wait, why were we all acting like this woman didn't have a perfectly normal healthy body?
Because she is overweight? She is absolutely gorgeous, but she weighs more that she should.
@@emmamartin4045 Sigh. I am a person of normal BMI, with a degree in a medical field, from a family of all doctors. 'Should'? You mean like, medically? Because medically.....no. Not if we are defining 'health' by 'likely to live longer'. Plenty of modern studies (look in JAMA, Sci American, etc) say that a BMI that puts someone in the 'overweight' but not 'obese' category live as long as people in the 'normal weight' range, and there are very many studies showing 'overweight' BMI lives on average longer than 'underweight' BMI. Most Hollywood actresses flirt with the 'underweight' BMI, and often get there through excessive dieting, smoking, alcohol usage and other substances. Plenty of women in Hollywood are objectively not healthy, but because they are thin, we do not talk about what they 'should' do with their bodies. The actress here does not appear to have the level of weight on her that I can guarantee she is shortening her lifespan (compared to obese individuals, who I can much more confidently say probably have blood pressure issues, diabetes, joint issues, etc). I honestly think the viewing public have gotten so used to see unhealthy thin people in media, we look at a different body type and think it cannot be healthy. I have no idea what this actresse's health is, but if she says her doctors say she's healthy at her weight, I would believe her. So, no, she may weigh more than you enjoy looking at. But you can't say she weighs more than she 'should'.
@@emmamartin4045who tf are you to tell anyone how much they should or shouldn’t weigh, especially when they’ve clarified their own doctor who knows them far more intimately than you ever will and possesses knowledge and expertise you do not, has said she is fine
@@FishareFriendsNotFood972Thank you! It’s wild how distorted the views on especially women’s bodies are. Bridget Jones is not at an unhealthy weight (at the very least how she’s portrayed in the movies), and there’s ample evidence that slight overweight is healthy for women - our bodies are supposed to be able to bear children, after all (you don’t have to want any, it’s just what our physicality is set up to do). She’s also not heroin chic thin, which is a good thing, actually. As a very very skinny woman, I’m just tired. As in physically speaking (I will catch ANY flu, doesn’t matter where it is, try me but please don’t), but also mentally. We’ve lost track of health a long time ago, women simply “shouldn’t” occupy any space, be it physical or by character. Nobody cares about women’s health except if it comes to even slightly larger bodies. It’s ridiculous.
Thank you for this video, especially near the end so much truth that women need to finally internalize. Male "approval" is useless and means nothing, the goalpost always shifts and men themselves don't even know what they want, so there is no point in appealing to them. It's funny and just plain sad that every other species has the male trying to appeal to women (peacock anyone lol?) but with us it's women doing crazy surgery and obsessing their whole lives for... what? A man who has nothing to offer, who doesn't put in HALF the work you do. Seriously ladies, DONT SETTLE. YOU DESERVE MORE. MEN SHOULD APPEAL TO YOU NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.
Bridget Jones wasn’t even as big as the average woman- she was a size 12. The average U.K. woman is a size 16. So us being gaslit into thinking Bridget is as fat as the movie makes her out to be is laughable when she’s two whole dress sizes smaller than the average woman. Thats why so many people who were teens in the early 2000s have body image issues (along with tv shows like Supersize v Superskinny, 10 years younger, fat families, what not to wear).
A whole generation of young girls were told that these small characters were fat and our bodies were flawed and anything remotely resembling fat tissue needed to be hidden away, and tv hosts were running about calling people “massive fatties” and tv shows were shooting semi naked bodies in a desaturated body horror sort of way and shovelling food into a tube.
And now it’s 2024 and I’m in my late thirties and somehow watching all this diet culture stuff come back around and any progress we did make being rolled back when someone like Nicola Coughlan is called big and not given as many nude scenes as her smaller costars.
Just because women in the US were bigger than Bridget Jones, it doesn’t mean that she’s wasn’t fat. It could just literally mean that the most of the population in the US is overweight. Which is proven to be the case, actually.
@@emmamartin4045 Emma, dear, what you are saying here has little to do with medicine or actual health issues, and all to do with social conformity. The actress here is not the size the medical community would have concerns, compared to like, a skinny smoker patient. I could confidently say to a smoker their habit they use to stay skinny is taking years off their life. I cannot say to the actress that plays Pen that her size is taking years off her life. And yet skinny smoker actresses are on the covers of 'Women's Health' magazine and are praised, and Pen gets five million think pieces about whether she's even allowed to show her body onscreen. Women are exhausted by this hypocritical stuff pretending to be conversations about 'health' when it's really conversations about controlling women and literally making them feel bad for taking up space.
@@FishareFriendsNotFood972 Why are we comparing skinny smoker actresses with an overweight non-smoker actress? Yes, being a smoker is worse than being a bit overweight. But there are also plenty of skinny women who don’t smoke and aren’t eating restrictive diets. And they are healthier than Nicola. But she’s truly a beautiful woman. Beautiful hourglass body and adorable face.
@@emmamartin4045 I am comparing her to skinny smoker actresses because that's what our culture does, that's what you are doing. Obsession over staying the level of skinny that is the beauty 'norm' for women is not medically healthy. Eating disorders, depression, over exercising, plastic surgery, nutrient deficiencies from endless strange diets, autoimmune disorders......doctors are TIRED of the truly unhealthy things women do to themselves to fit beauty norms, and yet THIS actress is the one who gets called 'unhealthy' by the media. My mother would tell me all about the strange health issues women would present with. Teeth falling out from bulimia. Knee replacements at 30 because a woman thought that if she did not run every day she would get 'fat'. Anxiety disorders leading to such bad headaches a woman who cry and vomit. Their quality of life and health was poor because of all the things they did to look 'good'. And here you are, adding to that issue. You look at someone like Nicola and declare her less healthy than thinner women. I am saying, medically, THAT IS NOT THE CASE. And then you immediately follow it up with the real issues for you; what she looks like. You are assessing her aesthetic value when I am not, thinking as long as your assessment is complimentary, it won't look misogynistic. It is. You are policing what women should look like and pretending you can because it's about health. That women who look more like what you think they should look like are 'healthier'. Girlie. Stop. You are part of the problem. I want women to be actually healthier, and the best way to get there is to stop obsessing over how they all need to be thinner.
@@emmamartin4045 My mother, a practicing physician, would tell me all about the strange health issues women would present with. Teeth falling out from bulimia. Knee replacements at 30 because a woman thought that if she did not run every day she would get 'fat'. Anxiety disorders leading to such bad headaches a woman who cry and vomit. Their quality of life and health was poor because of all the things they did to look 'good'. And here you are, adding to that issue. You look at someone like Nicola and declare her less healthy than thinner women. I am saying, medically, that. Is. Not. The. Case.
I can’t say I’ve watched this show but the woman who plays Penelope is so beautiful
thank you random dude for your insightful comment, it means a lot that you in particular think she's attractive! That was totally the most important point here :)
My problem with Penelope and Colin is the same issue many of us Polin fans had.
The new show runner picked her favorite characters and focused on them. She underestimated how popular Penelope and Colin was to people and did not center them in their own season. This is why the chemistry seemed lacking between the two. They dis give them enough material to work with and some of their writing sucked.
She also focused in the drama if their relationship versus having more happy and romantic moments between the two.
Others did have a problem with how their steamy moments were literally cut short. They start and two seconds later, it moves to bendetict or someone else.
And do agree how they had to keep Penelope covered when they didn’t really need to do that with the other couples.
People do feel that they did not want Nichola to be nude and she shouldn’t have to fight for that if that’s what she wants to do.
They should have not made Penelope and Colin sidelined in their own season. That’s ridiculous.
Only one of their steamy moments was interrupted (the modiste scene). Carriage scene was uninterrupted, mirror scene too, even their final scene. But their dances were interrupted, which I found annoying. They would be sharing a romantic dance (like the wedding dance) then in the middle of their dancing, it would pan to Fran and John, or Violet and Marcus or Violet and Fran, which annoyed me greatly because they didn't allow me to sit in a moment that is romantic. Dance is their love language, everyone knows that. Yet the only uninterrupted dance they got was the church scene dance.
I also don't mind Colin being angry for as long as he was. It makes sense, Lady Whistledown did some damaging things. My problem was where in the timeline they put the tension. He should've found out by the end of ep 5, ep 6 should've been him being mad, and by the end of ep 7 he should've forgiven her. Ep 8 should've been the us against the world dynamic I expect from them. So he stays mad for the same length of time (2 episodes), but at a different point in time. But Bridgerton has a tendency to put the tension at the end of the season so I came in expecting this to happen.
That being said, I still love them as a couple, they generally tend to be on the more communicative side (ep 7 modiste scene is honestly one of my favourite "fight" scenes in the whole of Bridgerton series because of how much communication was established and gaining a bit of their inner psyche, especially establishing Colin's insecurity and envy). They kinda dashed all that established communication away in ep 8 by not having Colin reach out to Penelope, essentially taking away some of Colin's agency in the resolution of the conflict. But still, a step up from the previous couples who barely had communication until the last minute of the last episode.
As for the steamy scenes and noodity, I feel as though people took Nicola's statement of feeling comfortable with noodity for ONE scene and ran with it. To me, her simply stating for "one particular scene" was enough for me to know that she wasn't really gonna be nood in the other scenes. I don't even know if it was her decision or the decision of execs to have her be covered in the other scenes but I'm not gonna disregard her agency and immediately blame higher ups because what if she did request to not be nood? What if she really was uncomfortable with being nood in other scenes? What if one scene was enough for her, y'know? There's a particular moment in the mirror scene where you see the blue covering slip off her body slightly, exposing her n*ps, and you can see Luke moving over at a slight angle to cover her. To me that signalled that maybe she was only comfortable with exposing herself for a few seconds. Or maybe she wasn't. But again, not gonna fully discount her agency when she's been vocal about having some control in these particular scenes. Don't want her to feel particularly pressured into doing these kinds scenes if she's not really comfortable doing them.
@@notevenfunny_ i agree with a lot of this, but the moments in part 2 made me want to rewrite them.
They were wishy washy with Penelope’s motivations as LW and I felt the fight scene that was written at the modiste missed the point of the previous 2 seasons.
It felt like the writers did not review their scripts or the previous seasons while writing it.
I do absolutely agree with you on the placing on Colin finding out LW and figuring out his anger and jealousy.
Ep. 6 was titled about them and they were barely in it. I felt a lot could have been resolved in that episode if they took out much of the fluff and redundant scenes.
A lot of Cressida’s scenes were redundant because we saw it in part 1.
I couldn’t tell if it was Nichola that felt uncomfortable or the show people felt uncomfortable with her. Looking at the contrast, they were completely fine with the sex workers, tilly, Paul, and Bendetict for being naked multiple of times, but when Nichola had a chance to be nude, they kept her covered except one scene.
While people complained about the lack of kathany sex scenes, even kate showed more skin than Nichola did. For me, it is the double standard of it all that pissed me off.
And do agree with you in how many emotionally happy or charged moments that were interrupted between them. It was their season and it felt disrespectful that they did that to the main couple and the fans of them.
@@gabrielleduplessis7388 Huh, I didn't read the modiste scene as making Pen's motivations wishy-washy, in fact they solidified her motivations for me: She wrote about Eloise and Marina to protect Eloise and Colin but she acknowledges that she shouldn't have played God and should've allowed them to face the consequences of their own actions. The power to change someone's fate (like she did with Colin and Eloise), even if she wields it for their protection she is still wielding power over them. She was tempted to wield power because she had no power in her life (no confidence). In doing so (wielding power), she changes the fate of many lives but they have no say or no agency in the change. If she gave them the information (like if she had told Eloise that she was LW, or told Colin that Marina was pregnant, they could've been allowed to make the decisions themselves). But she chose to wield her power to control their fates and now she's acknowledging how wrong that is. At least that's what I got from Penelope. But then again, I think differently about the LW thing than most of the fandom, I think she was in the wrong for what she did to Marina and Eloise, and Colin but I know I'm in the minority.
@@notevenfunny_ oh sorry. Poor explanation. I just meant the second half of the season in general. I felt the while second half needed tweaking and rewriting. I felt in one episode, it was “I am giving them a voice”. Another moment, it was “you don’t know what feeling alone feels like because you are not a woman” and than it was “to escape her life”
Blah blah blah.
She felt alone because she was outcasted. Her family wasn’t the family to associate with especially after Jack’s and Portia’s schemes. She was a wallflower. Men did not view her as attractive. Her feeling alone wasn’t specifically related to her being a woman and that line felt like pandering.
I feel a better way was “no. You can’t relate because you are a Bridgerton”. The bridgertons are closer knit. They constantly come back from scandals. They can obtain multiple suitors.
She recently wanted to be a voice for a people, but she sort of did that at the beginning of the season and previous ones too. So it felt weird that the show made that another motivation almost out of nowhere.
Rewatching the other seasons would have fixed that and helped with its continuity.
But sticking with the modiste scene, I would have had Penelope remind Colin that she did try to tell him, but he refused to listen to her. Explain she was trying to protect him and Eloise at certain points. I feel their fight was a bit too short and needed nuance and development.
And one line in part 2 explained why Eloise gets why Penelope did not tell her. She can’t keep a secret. In part 1, Colin told her in confidence about helping Penelope find a husband and what does Eloise do? She tells.
But with Eloise in season 2, a) she did not let Penelope speak half of the time or did not heed her warnings the first time and b) the queen was going to harm Eloise more than LW could. But Penelope wrote just enough to not ruin Eloise completely.
In season 1, with Colin, someone commented on that she did not have time to tell Colin again before he left to see and elope with Marina. So in that front, I can see how she felt like it was a last resort. She did try to tell him once, but that failed especially when they were interrupted by Marina.
I do feel LW did write good things, but the show only focused on the few bad things. And she also reported the truth.
But do agree she can be hasty with her pen and needs to take a breather before she writes and publishes sometimes.
And I think the show failed to execute these conversations between Colin and Penelope well. I think they shouldn’t have Colin internalize in silence for two whole episodes. Even in their book, they had conversations and wholesome moments between them even while processing the LW situation and they had a few arguments, but each one led them to figuring out the heart of their issues. It allowed them to hear each other out. And the show failed to show those, in my opinion.
And a lot of their development felt like tell v. Show which is why I feel it wasn’t executed in the best way.
Sorry this was so long.
@@gabrielleduplessis7388 I definitely feel the same about the I am a woman line, did feel a bit pandering to me. Like you said, you are a Bridgerton fits her motivation to write Whistledown better. I disagree with having him internalized for 2 whole episodes, I liked that he was an internal processor, it makes him stand out as a male lead, as he is not withholding his feelings but rather deciphering what exactly he is feeling. But they should've used journal entries as a way to let us into his thought process. One thing that annoyed me was the missed opportunity of using Colin's journaling as a way to let us in his thoughts for the whole season. It also could've been a nice mirror to Penelope, she uses her writing to vocalise and externalise her thoughts in the form of Whistledown while Colin uses it to internally process what he is thinking. They only gave us one entry and that's it, which is such a shame. I honestly don't blame people for thinking that his journals are about his sexcapades since the only entry read aloud was one about how he wasn't feeling the sexcapades. As for the conversations, I kinda disagree on them not being executed well, they were executed well, they just needed to be longer. The conversation at the study in ep 8 felt like they were going somewhere and then they cut if off, it should've been longer. But my point moreso when I bring up communication between Polin is that they have at least shown communication between Polin, whereas with other couples, they frustratingly didn't show a conversation, they showed them having revelations about each other. I wanted them to show a conversation of them slowly coming to understand the other person's point of view as they talked more, which we saw the beginnings of with Polin (they just cut them off too quick, but at least its there).
girllll i remember being like 10 and watching bridget jones and thinking to myself like 'she's huge omg' and now when i look back it really pains me how we're taught that so young, she looks normal, healthy, i look like that now and it hurts how disgusting that culture was in the '00s
Similar but different experience, when I watched the movie for the first time I found her beautiful but after hearing her talk about how "fat" and "ugly" she was it made me feel terrible because I was nearly the same weight/height as her as a teen and if she, a conventionally attractive actress, was made to be this undatable woman how could I find love too?
Most of the criticism for season 3 is about the new showrunner's choice to turn Bridgerton into her own fan fiction. Also poor writing, editing and pacing this season. Too little Polin scenes in THEIR season.
Yeah she focused too much on side plots that did not need as much time as they got. They cut out certain Polin scenes. They needed more that 8 episodes t88
@@oliviapedersen8309 I don't mind the side plots if they made season 3 have 12 episodes. Jess Brownell gives the vibe that she doesn't care about Penelope.
@@reccyre I totally agree I think the side would’ve been totally fine if they still gave Penelope and Colin the proper amount of screen time but they didn’t that’s why they needed more episodes. Penelope really seems like they weren’t even the main couple. It felt like Francesca and her love interest were. It honestly felt like it was too focused on her a lot more than I think was necessary. But I would’ve felt that way if it wasn’t so rushed.
I ended up watching this series through a youtube reaction channel as i didnt really like it, but still wanted to know what happened 😂
@@zellalaing5439That will be me from now on. Shondaland isn't all they think they are. Julie Pottinger/Julia Quinn got her pay off and is happy to allow them to make it into what it has become.
In practice, plenty of bigger or more shapely women attract men (I'm not saying obese, but sort of Penelope's size). It's only the media and mainstream movies/TV shows that have tried to convince us that only thin women attract men! So well done to Bridgerton, a series I have literally never watched but that I respect for certain choices it has made! Just think that an actress like Kate Winslet has been considered fat in the past!
That's what I've been saying!!
I know the Bridget Jones films are technically from the 2000s but the character herself always struck me as very firmly a 90s woman because of when the stories were published (and heck the first film was released in early 2001 so is even part of the 'long 90s' that lasted until September 11, 2001.)
Obviously there is a lot of overlap and I might be oversensitive as someone who hit their teens in the second half of the 90s but I do think a lot of the pop culture carried through. I'd really like to see your take on some of the pop culture and trends of that decade.
I agree. Furthermore, the movie is based on a book, which came out in 1996. So, Bridget actually is a 90's Woman.
Just before I get my cup if tea, checking in to say I’m excited to see this!!
Heyyy guys 🥰
Hey! I loved your video, I would love to see your opinion on Penelope as a character and her evolution in the show and about the character of Lady Danbury.
It just struck me as offbeat that of all the main ladies of the cast to doff it on screen on the show, it's Nicola.
I agree with the word fat. Fat isn’t negative word. Like if thin isn’t bad thne why is far a bad word. Calling someone fat when they are isn’t a bad thing bc there’s nothing wrong being big
...my issue with this season was not anything with weight. Or anything else related to body images. I mean, whenever I saw Nicola on screen, I wanted to hug her and cuddle with her.
My problem was the storyline in itself.
Yes, I read the book and asked myself "How are they going to make this a season?" Because not really that much happened. Penelope and Colin just spent an awful lot of time just sitting there, thinking. Lots of stuff that changes inwards, not easy to show without hearing their inner voices.
I fully hoped for added scenes, changed scenes which would show us what was going on.
Instead we got...meh. Not enough sweet stuff they could have added in. Flashbacks to when they were younger, how they met, etc. We got nothing.
It doesn't feel like they took the book and changed some things to make it better - it feels like they took two or three things out of an entire book and did something completely different around those scenes. 🤷🏻♀️
Jess Brownell decided she is bigger than the books 😂
@@reccyreAMEN!!! She has personally made it where I will wait for RUclips clips. I don't trust Shondaland.
Your hair suits you so well, i love it!!!
Who’s your favourite Bridgerton character?
Violet Bridgerton and Kate Bridgerton (nee Sharma) are my favourite characters
After Pen, Lady Danbury is my favorite BRIDGERTON character. I also love the Featherington sisters and Hyacinth Bridgerton. Hyacinth is a Baby Violet!
Penelope ❤ I started the show because of her. It was almost life-changing seeing someone who has a similar personality like mine on screen. I really feel connected to her. All her flaws, mistakes, positive and negative treats, her family issues. It is like watching my Regency Era version.
And I very much love Lady Danbury, Hyacinth, Genevieve, Rae, George and Mr.Finch.
Kate Sharma
Lady Danbury
Anthony bridgerton
It seems to be tied between Penelope and Colin.
But it varies on mood, but my top 5, in no particular order will always be:
Penelope
Edwina
Francesca
Colin
Kate
Daphne got more scenes but Penelope showed more.
They also did better angles for Daphne and Kate. Penelope was done wrong.
I don’t know if you will talk about this in your video, but before I forget: it’s not just an issue for women being gaslit into thinking they are too big when they aren’t. it’s also an issue for men being gaslit into thinking it’s only ok to be with ultra thin women. men then echoing this sentiment irl make it even worse for women.
Kate and Anthony also only had one sexszene
I've never seen Bridget Jones's diary, so I looked it up and... ? In what world is she fat like what? Not to say that even if she were fat it would be a bad thing or would make her ugly, but like what? What kind of delulu world is this?
The Beauty Myth changed my life. I recommend it to everyone.
Sierra Burgess was so bad and a rip off of the 90's movie "The Truth About Cats and Dogs" which is much better done. I recommend it if you haven't seen it
lol it’s not a rip off of that film in particular. It’s a modern retelling of the classic Cyrano De Bergerac, which has been made into many modern films and TV shows and has been copied and parodied since its inception. The film you’re talking about is based off the same work, but it’s not a rip off of that film in particular 😂
I loved Janeane Garofalo in "The Truth About Cays and Dogs". She was adorkable!
Yes Colin and Penelope had like 4 of those kind of scenes but they cut it out
Whenever I watched Bridget Jones Diary I never once thought she was overweight. If she ‘is’ then it suits her body in this film as someone who has issues with my tummy making me have to wear a size up or two sizes up from what I am, when I watched that film as I got older it makes it seem as if well I am not the only one. That was the only thing that I could tell was slightly bigger. Each woman is different and we all need a certain amount of weight on us to be healthy.
My friend was told by a doctor that is she got smaller then a size 12 uk she would be classed as underweight based off of her guessing here height, body type. I can’t exactly remember why but definitely think it was to do with her height.
I didn’t know Renée Zellweger was an established actress who had to put on weight for Bridget Jones until years later. I’m glad I missed out on the debate, because I genuinely thought she was just an unknown actress with her body type, being insecure about her weight (who, as a woman, isn’t), and that it’s kinda sorta played for laughs - I mean, she’s gorgeous. I genuinely thought it was a “Look at this beautiful woman, even she’s got insecurities!”-moment. But there are plenty few scenes of very skinny characters weighing themselves and losing their minds over it, apart from the not-played-for-laughs anorexic characters. It’s one of the two, when realistically speaking, pretty much all of us have been standing on our scales with at least some trepidation. Hollywood’s not doing women’s bodies any favours
Season 2 was the best from Bridgerton, i still havent finish sesson 3, it just feels weridly written, paced and Colin just isnt a great love interest to me.
Wow what a chest ....❤
Creep 🙄
@@fireandsugar2625its a compliment why a creep .... 😂
@kayliahferrero A compliment would be "I like your shirt" or something. You don't comment on people's individual body parts. That's gross and creepy. No woman is going to take it as a compliment if a random man says "wow nice chest". That's being a perv. It's 2024. Do better jfc 🙄
Very insightful I look forward to the video on Bridget Jones,oh and you are on Instagram