Ampogrip Vise Rehab.
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- I picked up this crusty oddball machinists vise, made for holding irregularly shaped objects on a milling machine. It's similar in purpose to the now-famous "Fractal Vise" but works in a completely different way. I don't know that I would call this a "restoration" but it cleaned up well, and it's pretty neat how it works.
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Although the equalizing type jaw vises are wonderfully clever.. Please be extremely careful when being used for larger cutter processes, like fly cutting, shell cutters, multi-point insert tools... When tight, they leave the machinist feeling confident, that the oddly shaped part is held firmly, but, vibration can allow things to settle, or deform the parts gripping surface, and then, the entire part comes loose and then crash... These were often times used for drilling or multi-point drilling heads operations, and not so much for milling operations. Smaller cutters 1/2" diameter and under should be fine, just be careful, wear safety glasses, Not that you don't, just saying... Kinda reminds me of the Kunze vise, or rather as it is know by today's name, the FRACTAL VISE. Very clever equalizing system, but those units were sold as a saving grace to the auto industry to shave time off of set up times. Many men were injured in a short time, before the company was sued, which was a a failed attempt to recover any of the claims that they would offer secure holdings, the owner bolted town. Kinda a sad story.. But even on the Fractal curve bows type vise, if one point loosens up, of all the points making contact on the oddly shaped part, then all the other points are free to loosen up.. scary stuff.. still neat as heck though.. Be careful machine heavy with that equalizing vise son. When it lets go, it happens scary fast.. Good luck, I enjoyed the video non the less, well done.
So in short, my english is not good. Did you say that this walrus in the video and that "Fractal Vise" that some people are making are dangerous to use?
@@CorruptionManX I don't know anything about a walrus, but, your English seems just fine to me, as per, how it is written here. The Fractal Vise systems, are very clever, and serve a function in certain applications. I was simply throwing caution out there, for anybody who desires to use this equalizing jaws system in most machining situations.
If just ONE, of the contact points of the many, on BOTH sides, or both jaws rather, comes loose, by just (0.001" imperial) all other contact points in the system are not loose or will come loose. I method to lesson the potential for this to happen, is to tighten the vise, loosen it, then re-tighten back again, to force the points to rock or rotate to a neutral or relaxed position, so all points are pushing at each of their respective contact points equally. Often times, it is a good idea, to mar the part or clamp the part to a measure that the part has dents into it. That is a roughing setup, is no big deal, but upon finishing processes, denting the parts is not ideal.
I mentioned milling processes, due to the nature of harmonics, or vibrations, that induce the jaws to relax the tensions in the pivoting points. Fly-cutting is extremely dangerous in these types of work holdings, as per the intermittent cutting action of the fly cutting action's nature. if the part come loose in a fly cutting process, things can get scary very quickly. I am not telling you what to do or not do, other then, be wise, use caution, and be safe. You might get 99 different setup/clamped up parts machined just fine, and not even a hint of problems, but, on that 100th, setup/clamped up part, is when things let go or come loose on you, and all heck breaks loose. Just be careful is all.
Please note, do not get me wrong, I have always liked these vises, due to how clever they are and how amazing the manufacturing process is, upon how they each are made. These vise, for the era they were designed and made in, is actually in my opinion, precision artwork, due to how tight fitting and fine toleranced that each swivel (male to female, to concaved to convexed) fitment is to one another. just artwork and is intriguing to me to watch both side just flow around a oddly shaped part.
Always try to view the direction of the moving jaw to the stationary jaw, it is linear or one direction. At the moment one of the swivels contact points get too far away from the linear direction, to being forced to apply pressure from a sideways direction upon the oddly shaped part, that is when the danger elevates, as the contact point is no longer just pressing in the one direction, it is not being asked to move in two directions on a prorated scale of pressure, linearly, and from the side. The more pressure asked to come in from the rocking side ways direction on the outer most contact points, the less pressure is coming from the linear direction. While also, forcing those wrapping-around contact points to not just press into clamping the part, but SLIDE on the part sideways as the jaw is still moving inwards towards to opposing jaws contact points.
Good luck, I hope I answered that better. I am sorry if I caused any misunderstandings, upon how I explained in the previous and or, even in this second attempt to explain. I am sorry is so.
Ha, the steelhead cavier joke was pretty good. Loving your videos, great stuff.
That vise is in pretty good shape, most machine vises get pretty beat up over the years. Do you think the balls with flat spots were flattened due to pressing against the harder jaws? There's a company called Norgren Workholding coming out with similar idea but just vise jaws to add to your existing vice and they want $4k for a set of 6"!
I think they were just not round to begin with, more like steel shot rather than precision ball bearings.
A similar vise has turned up - but differently branded, and a different size I think.
ruclips.net/video/JaHjFL7NZlU/видео.html
What's the jaw width and opening on the Ampogrip?
I messaged him on Instagram with a bit of the history. EW Bliss bought the rights to the design in 1957. Mine actually has jaws that were made by Bliss, so I guess there was a relationship prior to that. There’s very little history out there about them.
Mine is the 5” wide version, I’m not sure on the opening, but probably about that.” Or maybe a bit smaller. They made them in various sizes, I think I saw pictures of an 8” version. I think there was a bench version as well.
Soba magic vise is probably a copy ?
Since you found lots of cast iron "dust" & crud in the vise, perhaps this style of vise is/was mostly used to hold "rough" castings with their draft angles?
I think that’s probably it.
The cast iron debri u talked about makes me think it was used to hold some pretty irregular castings in a prodution line. I might be wrong, but its just one of those tools that u don't see any pratical use on day to day basis, but when the perfect scenario for it appear u wish u bought it years ago on that garage shop.
Grease would allow for more pressure to build.up in the "ballbath" ?
Very nice vice and interestig mechanics. Thanks alotmdor sharing this.
That's pretty neat - did you manage to find anything out about these from old literature or anything? If you just clamp down on square stock or something like that how does it react?
The only thing I’ve found about them is the patent for them, beyond that it’s a couple of forum posts that basically just say that they exist and that they work. I haven’t tried it on square stock, I imagine it would work fine, but I’m not sure about the repeatability.
The only thing I’ve found about them is the patent for them, beyond that it’s a couple of forum posts that basically just say that they exist and that they work. I haven’t tried it on square stock, I imagine it would work fine, but I’m not sure about the repeatability.
Okay, besides the vise and restoration being quite interesting, your "...must be steelhead, I guess..." comment made my day!!! And I so appreciate your deadpan delivery. I have a life rule that if I'm reading something and someone makes an obvious play on words, and then says "no pun intended", I stop reading immediately. If you have to point out your own jokes, they are not good. Yes, I miss some interesting endings sometimes, but one must stand on principles sometimes!! Thank you again!!
Simpler but crafty alternative to the amazing fractal vice
pretty neat odd vise. dont worry i always seem to find odd machinery as well. looking forward to more videos
You should use a thick grease, not oil, for the "ball bearings". The grease acts somewhat like a hydraulic fluid. Oil will leak out too easily.
I like that vise, first for me I have never seen one like it, great video, keep'um coming..
Just sitting around on a rainy afternoon looking for some of your videos I haven’t seen, so imagine my surprise when I see the vice that was made within walking distance from my house,thoroughly enjoying your videos thanks
Nice! Any chance you know anything about them? There’s not much info out there about them.
Unfortunately no ,way before my time, it looks like the building is still there used to be a lot of small industrial buildings in that section
another youtuber has something similar, he states that if you tighten the lids too strong it will not work perfectly
I’ve encountered that with mine.
Никогда не применял и не видел подобных тисков .
I would like to see the balls (shot?) moving around as the jaws conform. Any chance of putting some perspex covers on and low force test?
That would be neat to see, but with how this thing is put together, the chances of spilling them all out again while taking it apart don’t make it worth it.
Another RUclipsr - Make Everything, has a video on a similar design model. At the end he puts an acrylic plate on one end to show the balls moving ruclips.net/video/JaHjFL7NZlU/видео.html
Searched for different special vice video after watching fractal vice restoration
I machined rubber parallels for mine..
at the end of the video we can see its not acurate, part is shaking
I found one of these and restored it. It was previously owned by the Navy. Judging from the wear I believe they found a use for it often. It has certainly come in handy for me a couple of times. I never found out much more info than what you did. Just a couple of ads, including a matchbook cover on eBay... had to buy that, lol.
Did I see pictures of yours on one of the machining forums?
@@JeremyMakesThings Probably, I posted it on Practical Machinist's Antique forum when I found it and probably after I completed the restoration.
Not ball bearings. It looks more like "steel shot". Also good for cleaning crusty wine bottles.
Good call. The patent referenced “steel balls” so I was thinking ball bearings going into it. If I have to “refill” it at some point, it looks like shot would be a lot cheaper.
Very cool old vise. Great score
cool
Of course you can unpainted, you heard about paint stripper
True, but “unde-patina” doesn’t really roll off the tongue.
Have an ampogrip model 50 vise.. can not find nothing about it.. its 125 lbs with 6" wide jaws. Its more vise then i need.. its 16" tall and 26" long when closed
That’s HUGE! Yeah, there’s not much info out there about these