Keep using it but pay attention to routine maintenance and high quality fuel. Watch oil level to see how much it is or isn’t burning. Might experiment with one of the engine restore products out there.
Did you check compression after it ran? Some cases the oil, rings, cylinder walls, all kinda “seat in” after it runs and compression increases. It may not be as worn as it appears.
Your a magician, I think someone definitely was in the valves not knowing what they where doing as will old petrol may of not started, you in the other hand primed it with fuel and got it going after adjusting the valves first pull and with fuel again it ran. I have a serious issue, that is you didn’t clean the mower first😀😀😀 I see I’m not the only one whom noticed. My Compression tester was faulty the needle would stay, so thank you I’ve brought another on eBay just under $20 so I can check compression on machines.😀🇦🇺
I'd most definitely keep using it!! I gotta throw this out there, you are definitely an awesome small engine mechanic. I'm so glad you did a video on this. Question? What cause the valve lash to get that tight? I mean I've seen it get extremely out, but that was crazy tight. Awesome job as usual.
thank you Gary Allen, so one of the commenters mentioned that these are supposed to be zero lash, because it has a hydraulic lifter. The problem is that I think the lifter failed, probably due to lack of maintenance.
I think that it's Fitted with a decompression camshaft so it will be low on compression during startup,if it was worn out then it would be blowing blue smoke & particularly at high RPMs !
you make a good point. But my in experience, the first pull, should be close to 60 psi, the second or third pull, should get 75 psi, and the max should be closer to 90. Even though I didn't use a drill, to do the compression test, I should have gotten a much higher reading.
A simple question is to replace the engine if everything is in good working order i say go for it well worth the money spent ... The prices for a newer walk behind mower is mind blowing that walk behind is very versatile to a landscaper company
If it was my lawn mower and it seems to be in pretty good shape I would tear down the engine. Now if I did not know how to do it I would not think it would be worthwhile to pay someone to do that. They only option if you don't have to work on it yourself would be the replace the motor. I think with how good it sounds that perhaps there could be a compression release and that's why you're not building up compression. The only way I know of testing that theory out is to use a power drill to spend the motor. That's the only way to get it up to speed and get the truth compression if it is a compression release engine making it easier to start. If you have to go into the engine with it running that good I would think maybe just laping the valves could be all it needs. I think that the only other thing could be the rings and that's a cheap enough fix also and you can check this cylinder wall. As always I made sure to give you a big old thumbs up. Look forward to your next video.
definitely use it until it stops running, if you wish to. Then a new engine/rebuild would probably do it good considering the deck is in beautiful condition looking at it through video.
that thing would be incredible for my hillside i have to mow! I'd definitely keep it till the engine dies lol. then get another 12 HP briggs and throw on it. the body of it is in surprisingly good shape for it's age too!
Looks like some jackleg tried to set the valves and failed. I've never seen them tighten up that much BIT I haven't seen everything either and most of my dealings have been with flatheads too. If it were mine I'd do exactly what I did with the old belt drive Ex-mark and change the oil to Delo and run it after I lubed everything up and checked it out good. I like the old cast iron Kohlers but my pal with his saw shop has found a couple of the V-block engines with VERY LOW hours with bad cams. Reminds me when G.M. had that run of soft cams years ago. Good fix, Pal! GBWYou
I agree with you. Use it until it is completely gone. Use heavier oil, some Kawasaki engines even recommend 15/40. Kohler command engines do not have great reputations. You might get past the compression release by using a high speed 1/2 inch drill to spin it fast enough to make the compression release to retract to full compression. Also Kohler's have had some pretty bad situations with ignition coils, especially on the two cyl. models.
so because valve lash was below zero the valves are probably pretty messed up since the valves need to seat to cool off between strokes. but if all else is good it might just be a question of getting new valves for the engine and lapping them. another theory I have is the compression release on that engine might be rather aggressive due to the engine being of rather high displacement, 200 cc engines usually get in the 90 to 120 psi on compression release so for a 420cc engine to release at about half sorta makes sense
Great video, I think they should just keep using it until it dies, my John Deere LT150 riding mower has a Kohler Command 15 hp engine single cylinder. They are great solid engines and mine has hydraulic valve lifters so no clearances to adjust, they adjust themselves with oil pressure.
Kohler Command and Pro series engines use a hydraulic style valve lifter / valve system, it's suppose to be zero clearance and set to a .030-.060 preload on the valves, the new 5400 and 7000 series Kohler's are set at 4 and 6, older ones zero clearance. Not putting the valves at zero will cause tapping and a whole host of other problems. All Kohler engines use a compression release, min compression for starting is between 50 and 60 PSI.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE I would move the lifters back to barely zero clearance. Change the oil a couple times when the engine is hot and run it for a few weeks/mowing cycles. Check compression again with a drill. The rings could've been stuck besides it's other issues. If it's not smoking or making noise, check the cylinder walls with a bore scope to quench your curiosity.
I'm really having a lot of trouble trying to find videos when you do a series of them on the same machine, especially when they are spread out across both channels.
I have found out that videos in a series that are uploaded conservatively, do not perform well. Meaning part1 will be today, and part 2 might be in a week or 2 but I never know if it'll be on the same channel .
Two drive belts, one for each rear wheel. Pistol grip steering, I think on this model (some have that bar) . Squeeze the grip the way you want the mower to turn. Correct me if I’m wrong, but there is no reverse on 32”.
If the engine has a compression release valve, I wouldn't expect to have much more compression than what this one has. I guess your probably looking for at least 75psi, but in the case of the Kohler on my Toro Recycler, I think it only gets about 50-55psi, so I'm guessing the engine isn't worn out that badly. I would love to see if you can get a more accurate compression reading to see how bad it really is. The bigger question is why were the valves so tight. I'd generally expect them to get looser over time as parts wear out, but those looked to be cranked down nearly all the way. Seems unlikely someone has adjusted them before given that the valve cover did not just immediately fall off. That makes me think there is some more serious internal engine damage to the valve train. Or perhaps someone tried replacing a part in the hopes to make the engine run better, but forgot to readjust the valves. It's got me curious what's going on here. Whatever the case, at least it runs for now, and I guess it'll keep running until something else wears out or breaks.
Hey bro what's up? It's sad to see an expensive piece of equipment run down like that. I'm in agreement with you bro, use it until it can't work anymore and then do an engine swap.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE it's probably more like a pain-killer than medicine...it won't reverse the problem, but it may help one manage the symptoms. I'm also sceptical about additives, but Project Farm's test results give me a little more confidence that this particular product is not just snake oil.
Might as well keep using it until it blows or quits. Then if you can get a decent engine at a reasonable amount change engines depending on the condition of the rest of the mower.
the video was shot in vertical format to used for RUclips shorts, but I got so much attention, people wanted to see more of the diagnostic, so I had to use this format to make a video with. Not what I wanted to do, but It gives all the information, about the repair.
if it was mine, and the rest of the mower was in great shape. i would have replaced the rings, if there was a lot of wear on the piston sleeve I would put oversized rings on it, and since I had it open, replaced he seals. some of those even have a replaceable bearing shell for the position. ( thats just me) most people would just replaced the engine. i never send old engines to the junk year anymore, I break them down, into the basic parts and reycle the low temp metals into ingots with my home furnice, the rest of the parts i drop at the scrap yard for some beer cash.
Those motor are bad about the valve seat silding out. It does sound like it's on its last leg. Keep it until u come across a good compatible motor to put on it
I would continue to use until is no longer runs. Replacing the engine might not be cost effective as the engine would cost more than the value of the mower. Simple fix and costs you nothing except some rtv silicone form a gasket on the valve cover. Still, you should not sell as the life expectancy of the engine is limited most likely.
Use it until it dies and swap out the engine. Even though you didn't clean it with the toothbrush, the deck looks like it's in pretty good shape.
thank you A Patterson.
@@stellarproductions8888 You bet, Stellar! 👍
Another great video, thanks. Change the oil. Add Engine Restore and use it until it dies.
thank you Fran Leck.
How quickly the valve adjustment got it running on its own power 👍👍
you're absolutely right.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE yeah buddy 😎👍
I would keep using it. I would also remove that recoil starter and recheck the compression using a drill. It may not be as bad as you think.
thank you Bruce Coleman.
Keep using it but pay attention to routine maintenance and high quality fuel. Watch oil level to see how much it is or isn’t burning. Might experiment with one of the engine restore products out there.
that's a pretty good idea.
These are great motors iv seen serveral come into the shop i worked for with around 1.5k hrs on them and still run
very nice, thank you Conner.
Did you check compression after it ran? Some cases the oil, rings, cylinder walls, all kinda “seat in” after it runs and compression increases. It may not be as worn as it appears.
no I didn't but I might have to do that.
Your a magician, I think someone definitely was in the valves not knowing what they where doing as will old petrol may of not started, you in the other hand primed it with fuel and got it going after adjusting the valves first pull and with fuel again it ran.
I have a serious issue, that is you didn’t clean the mower first😀😀😀
I see I’m not the only one whom noticed.
My Compression tester was faulty the needle would stay, so thank you I’ve brought another on eBay just under $20 so I can check compression on machines.😀🇦🇺
thank you Rick Thelian.
I'd most definitely keep using it!! I gotta throw this out there, you are definitely an awesome small engine mechanic. I'm so glad you did a video on this. Question? What cause the valve lash to get that tight? I mean I've seen it get extremely out, but that was crazy tight. Awesome job as usual.
thank you Gary Allen, so one of the commenters mentioned that these are supposed to be zero lash, because it has a hydraulic lifter. The problem is that I think the lifter failed, probably due to lack of maintenance.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE Makes sense, thank you for helping me understand why that happened.
I agree with A Patterson. Use it until it won't run any more them replace the engine.
thank you Bob Smith.
I think that it's Fitted with a decompression camshaft so it will be low on compression during startup,if it was worn out then it would be blowing blue smoke & particularly at high RPMs !
you make a good point. But my in experience, the first pull, should be close to 60 psi, the second or third pull, should get 75 psi, and the max should be closer to 90. Even though I didn't use a drill, to do the compression test, I should have gotten a much higher reading.
I'd rebuild it, probably still make a profit after parts. Great video!
not a bad idea, thank you Joseph Brokenbourgh.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE Make a good video too.
A simple question is to replace the engine if everything is in good working order i say go for it well worth the money spent ... The prices for a newer walk behind mower is mind blowing that walk behind is very versatile to a landscaper company
If it were mine I would use it till it broke again, the replace it with a Kawasaki.
2:30 cold start
If it was my lawn mower and it seems to be in pretty good shape I would tear down the engine. Now if I did not know how to do it I would not think it would be worthwhile to pay someone to do that. They only option if you don't have to work on it yourself would be the replace the motor.
I think with how good it sounds that perhaps there could be a compression release and that's why you're not building up compression. The only way I know of testing that theory out is to use a power drill to spend the motor. That's the only way to get it up to speed and get the truth compression if it is a compression release engine making it easier to start.
If you have to go into the engine with it running that good I would think maybe just laping the valves could be all it needs. I think that the only other thing could be the rings and that's a cheap enough fix also and you can check this cylinder wall.
As always I made sure to give you a big old thumbs up. Look forward to your next video.
thank you David Frank
Run it till it dies. Good job.
thank you Jim.
Good backup mower. With all that black smoke on start up I was hoping the rings were just washed out
there were a lot of failed attempts to start it, so yes there was quite a bit of fuel in the engine
"Use it 'til it dies!" Oh, what you said. Stay safe!
Thank you Dwayne Madsen!
definitely use it until it stops running, if you wish to. Then a new engine/rebuild would probably do it good considering the deck is in beautiful condition looking at it through video.
yes to be honest, the mower is in really good condition, however, the previous Owners didn't the oil changes, it needed for commercial work.
that thing would be incredible for my hillside i have to mow! I'd definitely keep it till the engine dies lol. then get another 12 HP briggs and throw on it. the body of it is in surprisingly good shape for it's age too!
that's a good idea, thank you Jacob Feather.
Looks like some jackleg tried to set the valves and failed. I've never seen them tighten up that much BIT I haven't seen everything either and most of my dealings have been with flatheads too. If it were mine I'd do exactly what I did with the old belt drive Ex-mark and change the oil to Delo and run it after I lubed everything up and checked it out good. I like the old cast iron Kohlers but my pal with his saw shop has found a couple of the V-block engines with VERY LOW hours with bad cams. Reminds me when G.M. had that run of soft cams years ago. Good fix, Pal! GBWYou
thank you Lewie McNeely, yes there's definitely something going on with the camshaft.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE The ones he's had to replace, the lobes were worn down, just like the G.M.'s. One had 80 hours on a Cub Cadet zero turn.
I agree with you. Use it until it is completely gone. Use heavier oil, some Kawasaki engines even recommend 15/40. Kohler command engines do not have great reputations. You might get past the compression release by using a high speed 1/2 inch drill to spin it fast enough to make the compression release to retract to full compression. Also Kohler's have had some pretty bad situations with ignition coils, especially on the two cyl. models.
thank you Waterman one.
so because valve lash was below zero the valves are probably pretty messed up since the valves need to seat to cool off between strokes. but if all else is good it might just be a question of getting new valves for the engine and lapping them. another theory I have is the compression release on that engine might be rather aggressive due to the engine being of rather high displacement, 200 cc engines usually get in the 90 to 120 psi on compression release so for a 420cc engine to release at about half sorta makes sense
those questions will be answered as soon as this engine tanks but the good news is that it's still going strong.
sell it as is. I was given a toro 30" cut commercial 3 weeks ago. cleaned it up. got it running good and replaced the belt. have it listed for sale.
that's a good idea.
Great video, I think they should just keep using it until it dies, my John Deere LT150 riding mower has a Kohler Command 15 hp engine single cylinder. They are great solid engines and mine has hydraulic valve lifters so no clearances to adjust, they adjust themselves with oil pressure.
thank you WildeFox.
Im wondering if it’s worth it to repair that engine meaning new piston rings etc..
it depends on how much they bought it for and what they value it at.
I would have killed to have a mower like this a few years ago.
I hear that, these are great mowers for big jobs.
Kohler Command and Pro series engines use a hydraulic style valve lifter / valve system, it's suppose to be zero clearance and set to a .030-.060 preload on the valves, the new 5400 and 7000 series Kohler's are set at 4 and 6, older ones zero clearance. Not putting the valves at zero will cause tapping and a whole host of other problems. All Kohler engines use a compression release, min compression for starting is between 50 and 60 PSI.
thanks for the information and if that's the case the lifters have failed
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE I would move the lifters back to barely zero clearance. Change the oil a couple times when the engine is hot and run it for a few weeks/mowing cycles. Check compression again with a drill. The rings could've been stuck besides it's other issues. If it's not smoking or making noise, check the cylinder walls with a bore scope to quench your curiosity.
What should someone pay for a non-running push mower
a smaller 22 or 21", probably about $40
Four things can cause it to stop running. Fuel cap not venting unless it's has a separate vent hose. Coil is going out. Carb. Or bad compression.
The valve lash was much too tight
done.
I'm really having a lot of trouble trying to find videos when you do a series of them on the same machine, especially when they are spread out across both channels.
I have found out that videos in a series that are uploaded conservatively, do not perform well. Meaning part1 will be today, and part 2 might be in a week or 2 but I never know if it'll be on the same channel .
I don't know if it's me but I always have problems with the Kohler command series
you're not alone, to be honest, when I see these engines, I typically walk away from them.
What is the difference between this walk behind mower vs a normal mower...
You mean like a riding mower?
No like this is on video
@@aidanasmr5099 likely deck width. Most “normal” mowers are 21’’. This one is a 32’’ which aren’t always common to see
it's huge.
Two drive belts, one for each rear wheel. Pistol grip steering, I think on this model (some have that bar) . Squeeze the grip the way you want the mower to turn. Correct me if I’m wrong, but there is no reverse on 32”.
If the engine has a compression release valve, I wouldn't expect to have much more compression than what this one has. I guess your probably looking for at least 75psi, but in the case of the Kohler on my Toro Recycler, I think it only gets about 50-55psi, so I'm guessing the engine isn't worn out that badly. I would love to see if you can get a more accurate compression reading to see how bad it really is. The bigger question is why were the valves so tight. I'd generally expect them to get looser over time as parts wear out, but those looked to be cranked down nearly all the way. Seems unlikely someone has adjusted them before given that the valve cover did not just immediately fall off. That makes me think there is some more serious internal engine damage to the valve train. Or perhaps someone tried replacing a part in the hopes to make the engine run better, but forgot to readjust the valves. It's got me curious what's going on here. Whatever the case, at least it runs for now, and I guess it'll keep running until something else wears out or breaks.
thanks for the information NerfCraft. I appreciate it.
Valves can stretch as well as beat the aluminum valve seat into the head therefore the valve clearance gets tighter.
Hey bro what's up? It's sad to see an expensive piece of equipment run down like that. I'm in agreement with you bro, use it until it can't work anymore and then do an engine swap.
thank you Ramadin Sookhoo, I Agree with you.
My thoughts exactly.
What about replacing a few ounces of the oil with Engine Restore? Other than that, keep using it as long as it will run.
I've never had much luck with engine restore, it's like taking medicine when it's too late.
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE tbh I’d still try it
@@INSIDEHOUSEGARAGE it's probably more like a pain-killer than medicine...it won't reverse the problem, but it may help one manage the symptoms. I'm also sceptical about additives, but Project Farm's test results give me a little more confidence that this particular product is not just snake oil.
These engines have a decomp. So 60psi is the max the valve will allow
thank you Alex Stromberg.
Might as well keep using it until it blows or quits. Then if you can get a decent engine at a reasonable amount change engines depending on the condition of the rest of the mower.
that's a good idea.
Put some engine restore in it and keep using it till it doesn’t go.
Very cool videom but what's with the format of the video ?
the video was shot in vertical format to used for RUclips shorts, but I got so much attention, people wanted to see more of the diagnostic, so I had to use this format to make a video with. Not what I wanted to do, but It gives all the information, about the repair.
The engines running a decompression valve. The compression reading is probably off.
turns out the valve lash was much too tight.
i,d rebuild it as it does not look that bad and of course personally these are a good engine for sure maybe new piston rings and she,s apples etc.
thank you Patrick Stapleton.
if it was mine, and the rest of the mower was in great shape. i would have replaced the rings, if there was a lot of wear on the piston sleeve I would put oversized rings on it, and since I had it open, replaced he seals. some of those even have a replaceable bearing shell for the position. ( thats just me) most people would just replaced the engine. i never send old engines to the junk year anymore, I break them down, into the basic parts and reycle the low temp metals into ingots with my home furnice, the rest of the parts i drop at the scrap yard for some beer cash.
as long as the cylinder was also salvageable, I agree with you.
engine deplasemevt please
Those motor are bad about the valve seat silding out. It does sound like it's on its last leg. Keep it until u come across a good compatible motor to put on it
yes it was a commercial mower before this so it's got a lot of time on it.
I would run it till is knackered and then replace the engine at a later stage
thank you Andrew Johnston.
If this engine has a compression release, then 60 psi should be exactly what you are looking for.
I don't remember if I ended doing a real compression test on it, since I was "on site" and not at home.
Rebuild it!! It has a compression release
JJ Juarez.
Use it
thank you TL NELSON.
My vote would be to run until it dies. Then swap the engine. Would not be a big deal, that is wide open and easy to work on.
thank you JurpikAg.
Use it till it stop working and then put a use engine in it 🙏👍🙏👍
thank you RayFpv.
I’d keep using it till it dies. It might last a long time for residential use.
thank you Mike Jones.
yo wsg
thanks
I would continue to use until is no longer runs. Replacing the engine might not be cost effective as the engine would cost more than the value of the mower. Simple fix and costs you nothing except some rtv silicone form a gasket on the valve cover. Still, you should not sell as the life expectancy of the engine is limited most likely.
that makes a lot of sense
Rebuild it if the cost doesn't exceed the cost of a new engine.
thank you R Shin.
60 lbs with a comp release is about normal. Much more and you can’t pull start it.
I was hoping for about 75 psi, thank you Shaffer Small Engine Shop.
Drive it into the ground unless you can get a cheap replacement engine.
thank you sticustom
Change the oil and sell it.
not sure what they're going to do with it.
I'd rebuild the engine.
thank you Christopher Marshall.
I would use it until it dies.
thank you William snow.
Sell it
I wish it was mine to sell