The Pistons Just Made One Thing Clear…
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- Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
- When the Detroit Pistons landed the 5th overall pick in the draft lottery (again) after having the worst record in the NBA (again), many viewed it as a disaster. Already in a weaker draft, they fell 4 spots in the lottery.
However I think they actually made an incredible pick at 5th overall. Taking G-League Ignite wing Ron Holland. Holland was a decisive prospect in this class. At the beginning of the season he was a projected top 3 pick and many thought he could be the number 1 pick. However despite putting up good numbers with Ignite, the Ignite team was so bad they folded the program after the season. And due to some of the flaws on tape, people thought he could fall out of the lottery. However I was still really high on Holland, and thought he was a top 2 prospect in this class. And I think Detroit getting him at pick 5 is incredible value. Is the fit perfect? No, not by any means. However for a team as bad as Detroit, they need talent. And I think the selection of Ron Holland makes one thing very clear about the Pistons moving forward.
0:00 Intro
1:40 Ron Holland Profile
6:45 Short Term Projection
9:38 Long Term Projection
12:06 What This Means For The Pistons
15:01 Recap
15:38 Outro
#terranovabasketballstudy #ronholland #nbadraft #2024nbadraft #detroitpistons #nba
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Did the Pistons make the right pick?
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I don't understand why NBA fans think that if a player doesnt have the skills of a 10 year vet and top 10 player in the league at 18 then he will never be good.
Doesn’t make sense, especially when he made significant strides with his handle and creation this year
Nobody says d that but you
True but too many people also have a rainbows and unicorns view of development
If you actually study which players improve, how much, what and why you will understand what is rational and what is irrational to expect.
Obviously people can disagree -- especially about shooting -- but there is a reason pretty much every reliable draft analyst has these players as tier 3 and tier 4 level prospects and it was considered a weak draft
Specifically with Holland and the four areas of concern:
1) Finishing: This is probably the least important because being able to generate rim pressure and draw fouls has a lot of benefits even if you are never a good finisher (Westbrook being the best example)
2) Ball handling: players who don't exhibit a lot of "wiggle" or creativity in their ball handling at a young age rarely develop it later. But a straight line driver is fine and Holland has a good, though not elite, first step
3) Passing: There are really two different things you are looking for that are growth areas. First is vision which is the ability to see passes others don't. This almost never changes as a player ages. You see it or you don't. The second is the passing Rolodex or how many of the myriad passes available they make and whether they do it on time and target. It's almost like a check list. The fuller the Rolodex, the less development they need.
But it should be noted that floor mapping should improve with age/experience
4) Shooting: There are _many_ schools of thought in this area but the people who are pessimistic about Holland will point to two things. First is his absurdly high bad miss rate of 20% -- combined with his touch on layups this paints a worrying picture that he just has bad touch and doesn't possess the fine motor skills required to be a good shooter. The second is that his shot has a lot of moving parts and generally the more things you need to go right, the less often everything will.
This is why people prefer compact, quick, high releases -- like Reed Sheppard or Risacher -- because they are easily repeatable and there aren't many weak points in the shot where something can go wrong
If a player has a complex shot and it goes in -- Steph, Haliburton, Reggie Miller, Ray Allen -- that's fine but if it's not going in by 19 it's probably not going to work
In general, Holland is fairly raw and similar to Jaylen Brown. That is good news unless you realize how rare a player increasing every facet of his game to that degree actually is.
If a player needs outlier development just to reach his median outcome that should be concerning.
They not real fans they just detroitsrs
This is exaggeration is hilarious 😂 How many NBA Prospects who struggle to shoot coming in...ACTUALLY develop a shot in the time span of a career? Everyone knows he's a talent who could develop into a star going to the Pistons surrounded by ppl to who do nothing to suppress his weaknesses and maximize his flaws doesn't help
The person in the video brought up JK from the Warriors JB from the Celtics...JK in GS had STEPH CURRY AND KLAY THOMPSON Jaylen Brown was allowed time because the Cs were good to develop who does Holland have? Jaden Ivey? and what wiggle room does Holland have in the motor city?
The pessimisism is more so do to the dumpster fire then it is Holland
Ausar is gonna be a BEAST! Hope they make the fit work, and keep Ivey.
Unfortunately ivey will get traded...... but hopefully new coach changes front office mind...... he need at minimum another year or 2 ... then trade him if it don't work
Pistons fan here. Been a rough year or 15, but I got faith in this regime. I wouldn’t say I questioned this pick when it happened, but it definitely surprised me. I’m completely on board now. Big picture wise, Cade, Ausar, and holland with the latter 2 improving their shooting is an absolutely menacing trio on the perimeter on both ends.
Trajan Langdon has made a point of saying that, while Ausar and Ron may not fit right away, he can see them fitting long term. So I don't think they're looking to move off of Ausar. I think Ivey is much more likely, but I won't give my dissertation on that right now.
I do think this could be one of the better landing spots for Holland, considering Trajan Langdon just stripped down close to half the roster in the last day and a half. I think he could benefit not only from working with Fred Vinson, but finally getting to play with a talented, team oriented PG like Cade Cunningham, could be tremendous for his growth. I think the fit between those two specifically could be great in the long run.
Also, Cade and Fontecchio (who only played 16 games), were the only two guys who played 100 minutes or more for us and had a positive BPM. Funny enough, they actually had four players with positive Estimated Plus-Minus: Cade (0.4), Fontecchio (0.3), Ausar (0.1), and Stewart (0.1).
Great video as always, and I'm not just saying that because it was complimentary toward a Pistons player. :)
Thank you!
Did something else happen besides Grimes and TBJ? 2 players ain’t nearly half…
They’re not Extender many qualifying offers to players like Flynn, Wiseman, they cut fournier, umude, and some other stuff .
A Stewart guy he add n wins to anything at all. Also Ivey is here to stay. And with Casey he showed what he can be. Monty killed his production. Yet the office isn't stupid enough to let him go.
@@Heru313Of Cade, Ausar, Ivey, Duren, and Holland, Ivey and Duren are definitely the most likely to be traded. Pistons beat reporters and people close to the organization have alluded to this.
I just came to the realization that the NBA doesn't really have a player pencilled into the rookie of the Year talk.
I mean Cade was a great pick, Duren was a great pick, Ivey was a great pick, Thompson was a great pick. Detroit have been praised on draft night four years in a row basically. But they still cant string a good team together.
This is a development and management issue, not a draft issue
If you look at the +/- our starters for a lot of games did well… then Monty continued to run out all-bench lineups that lost the lead. It was crazy. Should be a better season if we just clean up the rotations
They drafted for talent, not for guys who fit together nicely. Sometimes that's good, but sometimes it's not. The core young guys just don't fit together well at this point.
Coaching was a big issue
All good future players but too many young players to be expected to win now and it showed
The most important thing now is adding vets who can teach this young athletic team how to win close games.
Great video. I had Holland as the pick from the beginning (even did a video on it on my channel) . I had a similar comparison from Holland to Kuminga and the physical tools that bode well for their success, along with intangibles like motor, work ethic, and competitiveness. I also love the comp between Kuminga and Jaylen Brown (shout out to Cal where I live in the Bay). This video has been inspiring!
One of the best channels on RUclips I’ve been following your channel for a few months now and you’re really an inspiration to start my own channel 🙏🏾💯
This is great analysis… underrated af … subbed!
New sub! I love every take EXCEPT for one thing. I think you may have underrated his ceiling slightly. 23-7-5 is very good but he does have insane visible potential that when in the right system with some luck added I could see him being all nba yearly.
Still watching the video as I’m commenting and he was also my no question #2 behind Sarr
Fit is what makes teams good though. Stacking talented players that don’t gel together doesn’t do anything.
Great analysis. New subscriber.
Thank you!
If Fred vinson gets Ausar, jaden and Ron to shoot at least 35-36% from 3, give him monty’s contract. Also, what do you think about Jalen duren’s defensive struggles and the talk of picking up someone like claxton or hartenstein to protect the rim
Hopefully they keep all these guys together, they will be great in due time they are young and the face of the NBA.
Right pick, no doubt. If they have a good chemistry with Cade the Pistons will finish significantly better next season and reach the play off there after 25-26.
I think Holland is a great prospect for the Pistons. My objection is that they should pick Clingan and exchange for Holland as a lower pick, plus anything else they could take.
Overall, Ron will be a great player for our Pistons.
Ron Holland remind me of Russell Westbrook
Reminds me of a quicker twitch Richard Jefferson
More skilled asur Thompson..
Indeed
Pg
hell yes been waiting for this video
🫡
Pistons LOVE Ivey!!! His home family from Detroit. It was the horrible coach. But we saw him and Cade drop 30 pieces in the same game. Holland is nowhere near him or Ausar. We had to draft someone. But nobody is leaving for awhile. We let these young guys suffer on purpose too long sadly. Always getting rid of or not bringing in vets. Look at Houston or OKC. We were right at the same level but they had vets
A lot of the issues of last year stem from Monty Williams and his lack of actual coaching. He was basically punishing Ivy for no reason before the season even started. His entire idea of an offence was give Cade the ball. Its like he heard the Cade and Luka comparisons and thought that's all he needed to do. Nevermind the fact that Cade isn't that kind of player. I hope this new coach has a system on offence that works and makes sense. You can't have 3 guys on the court who can't shoot at the same time.
Lmao 😂 do you even KNOW wtf you are talking about???!
@@davidmcpherson1347 yeah I'm close to the situation. Why are YOU speaking on it?
I agree. I think this pick puts the writing on the wall for Ivey. I'm a big fan of Ivey's game, so I hope he was worked on that 3ball in the off season. Cause I think this paves the way for Ausar to play the 2, Holland to play the 3 in the future. Who at the 4? God knows. We should have taken a big. Duren just doesn't have the bball IQ for defense. And him getting caught out of position has given up so many offensive rebounds. And we just seem gunho about keeping Stewart in the starting 5, and this is detrimental to Simone. This roster is still a big ass mess.
I was hoping they would off load the pick for more depth in a trade. I would look to get rid of Stew and possibly Cade to address the depth Issues. Stew is in my opinion a terrible player who doesn't really have a position and Cade just doesn't seem like he's that guy. I get that fact he has limited help, but I've also watched him make mistake after mistake with turnovers and bad shots. I think Ivy would make a better point guard. The guy can shoot, and make plays. I think with the right coaching he can become a decent defender. where Cade is a good player, but his shot has been up and down, and he is worse on defense because he is too slow. Ivy's main problem is he plays too fast and aggressive. With time he'll learn to slow it down. Cade is never going to speed up and he is very injury prone. So too mean its a no brainer; trade Cade and getting some vets and draft picks.
Bro duren is still a kid lol and really he just out of shape that’s why he has lapses on defense
@@OfficalPrinceToni And he's scared to jump. He's stated he doesn't want to get injured. It's deeper thsn that. No IQ and scared,
@@zmonkey111 when did he ever say that lol?
@OfficalPrinceToni don't have the specific interview, but he stated he don't like trying to jump too high due to injury issues. As he missed more games last season than Cade.
Man thanks for the video but you just sound like a cartoon character 😂
I’ve been watching a lot of Ron Holland and he looks a lot like Demar Derozan offensively when he came out and that was my pro comp for him. I do think he can be an above average defender unlike Demar
Ur fr the goat
Washington wizards video coming soon ?
Maybe
What’s your thoughts on matas?
Great value at pick 11. Should be a good Swiss Army knife wing
@@TerranovaBasketballStudy yessir I think he was a good pick at 11 too
How do you know the Pistons don't like Ivey? New coach and staff, and president of operations.
Pistons need to move ivey for a shooting 2 guard or shooting 4
Jonathan issac herb jones jrue holiday og Caruso imo top 5 defenders
See him as a jimmy butler
He’s better than Brown from the Celtics and he better than Kuminga also his ceiling higher than both and he only 18
???????
He's probably not going to be 230 like them and he's not as explosive as Brown or the leaper Kuminga is which limits his ceiling in comparison but he is better at 18 than they were.
Of course pretty much every 18 year old now is better than comparable 18 year olds 8 years ago because the overall skill level is higher.
If we were as good as Brown -- especially Brown in 2024 -- that would be a 10/10 outcome for him given where his shooting, finishing, ball handling, playmaking, decision making and defense are right now.
No ron holland isnt better than Jaylen Brown lay off the drugs
He won’t start. They need to figure out Jaden’s future fit this year and if it doesn’t work Holland will be his replacement. It’ll be Cade, Ivey, Fonteccio, and Duren for sure. Then either Tim Hardaway Jr or Thompson, but I’m thinking THJr.
Sarr vid next
I really hope Langdon trade Ivey
🤡🤡
Why tho
Relax. They’re both young.
And I think he was the second best prospect in the class, and would’ve been a good pick at first overall
they just made one thing clear: they'll never draft a shooter in the FRP😅
Sad the Bulls couldn't get Ron
Y’all got the next best wing in the class tho lol
@@TerranovaBasketballStudyfair, I'm excited for Matas
Idk i feel like our 2nd pick is going to be better
Matt Greco
Why must we keep put smaller ppl at the 4 spot.they will get torched being to small
They are all just kids. The draft is a joke, no one can predict how these athletes will mature or even become nba quality players.
He had a thumb injury. The rehab was a problem. Some GMs were afraid of how much time it would take to come back. If you guess wrong his career is dust. Check the doctor on Woodward Sports.
Interesting
Incredible pick compared to the talent of this draft.
I see paul george 🤷🏾♂️
Pistons building a roster like they hoppin in a Time Machine to go hoop in the 70’s 😂😂 Ron Holland was a 💩 pick. Not because he’s a bad prospect. The Pistons are the pistons they’re just bad at the whole basketball thing. Ausar and Holland don’t really spade the floor and both young and with so much potential should be given ample time to fast tract their development and chemistry with the teams. Ivey streaky shooter, Duren a paint beast, Cade solid shooter, Fonteccio can stretch the floor, but idk I don’t like the lineups they’re gonna cook over there they’ll be bad again this season
They were ALWAYS going to be bad again this season, because of how bad the last GM fucked everything up.
Holland can't shoot. Of course he fits right in for the Pistons. Pathetic.
Can I give this video 100 likes myself?
Anything’s possible!
The Pistons should trade Jaden Ivey, A. Thompson, Beef Stew, and maybe a draft pick for Laurie Markkenen. Trajan Langdon seems like he wants to develop his own team around Cade Cunningham, starting with Ron Holland and eventually having Jalen Duren, Tobias, Markkenen rounding out their starting rotation. Signing Fontecheo and keeping Marcus Sasser and Tim Hardaway Jr. They are still looking to find a backup center and could possibly sign Gary Trant Jr. Even with that, they still would have enough cap space to fill out the rest of the roster. I think with the Holland pick, he was sending a message that he's going to reconstruct this team to his liking and not stay with the status quo.
He's not just not the best fit, he's a terrible one. ZERO shooting on a piston's team that NEEDS SHOOTING. His talent is his athleticism, not his skill, which is terrible for the pistons.
If you think he’s just some run and dunk player then you clearly haven’t actually watched him play
Someone said to me "his 3 poi t is 24% but he's a better shooter than that."
But like if he was a better shooter than that, he wouldn't be 24% lmao
@@TerranovaBasketballStudy what does this comment prove I’m confused? I watched him play, and I’ve watched him shoot terribly. It doesn’t help your case by that fact that every clip on the background is just him running and dunking
@@TerranovaBasketballStudy You’ve basically just said “you’re wrong” and given no reasoning to back that claim up
I understand the concern about the shooting, but when you’re as bad as the pistons, you have to draft best talent available. You can’t win 14 games and draft for fit. Holland was the highest upside player that they could get, and all the other high upside players they could’ve got at 5 couldn’t reliably shoot either. They hired the best shooting coach in the nba to help Ausar and Holland develop their shot. They also got Tim Hardaway Jr, who will probably play over Jaden Ivey, and they’ll likely sign Tobias Harris in free agency, along with possibly a couple other free agency moves for shooting.
I would rather the pistons to rid of Cade than Ivey . Holland would work better with Ivey bcuz of the speed.
Yes because the NBA stands for National Track And Field Association
@@TerranovaBasketballStudy😂
@@TerranovaBasketballStudy😂😂
wtf?
You're actually correct but most people don't really understand how style of play impacts players
Cade is a PnR guard so these wings are put out in positions where they need to be able to shoot threes and the middle is closed because Cade has a roll man. (Having one athletic non-shooting wing is manageable but not two)
But if you built around Ivey, Holland and Ausar you would do two things:
1) a high pressure defense that relied on athleticism to force turnovers and recover when you missed (that Cade can't do)
2) a 5 out style offense like OKC or Sacramento or GS where the center was away from the rim to allow for slashing
You would still need all three to be better shooters and need a shooting center but the paint being open allows them to get downhill more and play to their strengths
Whereas Cade actually needs a screen to create an advantage, those three just need half a step and they are at the rim