No we're not. Hollywood may produce some god awful crap, but it doesn't come remotely close to the agonizing cringe of fan films. People who have zero training in wushu twirling lightsabers and thinking they can do their own choreography, directed by people who don't know how to direct, delivering lines written by illiterates, with the gravitas of an actor in a high school play.
If you think about it: star trek was always close to be a fantasy in space. Vulcans = Elfs Klingons = Orks Humans = Humans Holograms = Golems Ferengi = Goblins Romulan = Dark Elfs Borg = Zombies Hirogen = Darkelfs Species 8472 = Demons and so on. There is even magic and some kind of gods involevd. Edit: Ferengi are the goblin becouse the romulans are more the dark elfs/dwarfs. sorry for this messup. Edit2: Added Ferengi to the list to hammer it home.
Kinda see the point but also dark elves have often (like all elfs) some kind of hunter culture. Romulans act and look more like goblins for far i remaber.
Star trek was supposed to inspire us to get past our BS and be better than we are, not poke the hornet 's nest and make it worse. Voyager had a divided crew in season 1 due to the Maquis and Federation having different ideologies. But they GOT PAST IT and merged into one solid crew that backed each other up despite their backgrounds. Lord I miss Voyager, TN, TOS, and DS9
@Mike Forti I'm sorry they couldn't get that many people who are a mixture of all the races. Some people just...might not want to mix races, but are tolerant of others who are okay with mixing races. January 23, 2019, 9:52pm
And additional strange SJW plot twist, the ' new ' Klingons, which look very dark skinned and kinda scary, Actually represent White Supremacists !! Huh ? Yes ! But why ? Seriously ? Who are the ' bad guys' supposed to be here ? Can't stand the Michael Burnham character, either.
Also meanwhile: We’re gunna make the Klingons look exactly like what crude depictions of black people were drawn up to look like by racists back in the day. ANND were gonna have them sound annoying
thats what i was hoping for, worf would make a great cpt and it would continue the story, i dont care what happened in the past hell i have only ever seen 2 eps of TOS, i came in on generations and been a fan since, if this is the direction they are going i think ill skip the next few shows
Star Trek The Original Series: ST:TOS Star Trek The Next Generation: ST:TNG Star Trek Deep Space Nine: ST:DS9 Star Trek Voyager: ST:VOY Star Trek Enterprise: ST:ENT Now we come to this series... appropriately abbreviated as STD
Space walks. The age of ascendance, 13, to become a warrior, started and possibly ended with a test of an open space walk. This leaves a dead skin look. Eventually the epidermis is gradually grown out but depending on how long the "walk" was endured would determine what kind of Warrior they would be regarded as. The "albino" Klingon, great diplomats. The far darker warriors were considered to have seen stovacore and therefore no longer feared death. Obviously this practice changed by the time Alexander reached the age of Ascension. Or did I guess wrong in explaining the physical attributes of a made-up people? Remember they don't talk about it with Outsiders.
Idk, Worf was fairly dark-skin. . . It's almost irrelevant with so much prosthetic makeup whatever color the actors are. But the show sucks in its mean-spirited ethos.
Farscape actually handled alien language very well, they introduced microbes that would be injected, so all the different aliens including the main character would still be speaking their own language, then the main character and hence the audience would be hearing English as the microbes would be translating for the main character. And the only times we would hear the original language of the aliens was with cuss words or words that don't have a direct translation, like with phrases.
I remember that in *Farscape* too. All the characters were making strange sounds until Ben got injected in the first episode. Star Trek original series had something called a Universal Translator they mentioned in some episodes.
Plus there were also occasional scenes where they showed the perspective of people, mostly humans, who didnt have translator microbes, where the alien languages were occasionally shown. It was a nice touch to make the microbes only work one way, but not the other.
I once talked to a guy who stared in various fan films. He was a big fan of Star Trek but he told me he didn't like Discovery & it wasn't over politics. All your criticisms here are valid but now that I watch the series. It is not Star Trek. It is beyond dumbed down. It is an action space film that resembles Trek. The canon was pooped on. I could live with Spock having a half-brother from his Father's previous marriage in the 5th movie we don't talk about. But all this time he has had a secret adopted human step-sister? That ruins the whole dynamic with His Father! Spock was always at odds with his Father because he was half human and yet Sarek is shown as having a human adopted daughter whom he has a better relationship with? FUCK THAT!!!!! My only solace is to know Star Trek established in STTNG there is a multiverse and I can pretend all this stupidity doesn't really exist in the Classic Trek universe.
Everything you said was perfect. However, ST V Final frontier IMO was an AWESOME movie (if you ignore a sudden half brother that looks MORE HUMAN than hybrid Spock, and that thing where Scotty is a dopey moron for no apparent reason).
I never even liked Voyager that much, I just didn't find the crew particularly likeable, but at least it was still made by competent writers, producers and directors, and was faithful to the source material. It still felt like Star Trek.
@@TheGreatGodPan I agree Voyager was one of the weaker ones, I still enjoyed it, but I see the issues, I still believe Janeway specifically was quite solid, I really liked her.
I just came across this video and I have to say FINALLY!!!! someone sees what I see. The stories are muddled; the characters are unsympathetic; the tech (magic mushrooms that bind the universe together!) is absurd; and the moral underpinnings that make Star Trek, well, Star Trek are gone. Michael Burham is unlikable and arrogant . Her seemingly mandatory crying scenes don't give her depth; they just highlight her self-absorption. As an aside: Thank G-d they at least somewhat marginalized Ash Tyler. I couldn't stand to see that sniffling, co-dependent , wimp blubber one more time over his (cue violins) undying love and angst for Burnham . Sorry: I HAD to vent.
I agree. The Klingons in fan films look like Klingons, not rejects from the Uruk-Hai freak show. The plot makes sense, not reliant on Deus Ex Machina and retcons. The protagonists are likable, not cringe worthy and one-dimensional.
@The Dracobirthstonian That is a very poorly thought out statement. The notion that multiculturalism is connected to moral relativism shows a fundamental lack of understanding of the role it has played in cultural discourse for half a century. Canada's current constitution is founded on multiculturalism. And what about it is nonsensical? Allowing citizens to practice their religions and keep their identities without the fear of official persecution, and accepting other cultures?
Yeah. Voyager was also great. YAY Janeway! And I love Picard. Shame both are done but they got great endings. (Nemesis Movie and the time-travel Borg Wormhole episode... thing.)
Nate112332 I thought the Borg time traveling was a Star Trek movie... Star Trek First Encounter. Also there is a risk board to see who is the better captain I know it is Kirk Picard And Janeway I forget the other 2.
Janeway was my fav, she had to deal with all the crazy shit in the delta quadrant without starfleet assistance, no starbase to go resupply n repair at, no federation to call when you need back up. They found "new life and new civilizations." Given alot of which kinda wanted to kill them.... but still she and her crew did all that including R&D on things like delta flyer, transwarp n that lot of things. I felt she had a good balance to between diplomatic and hostile / aggression n assertive. Seemed alot less diplomatic than Kirk but more ...assertive for lack of a better word than Picard.
If I recall the late 90's was the start of when hollywood wanted to try and make female characters appear badass, sometimes it worked other times it was just cringeworthy however in Janeways case I think they really pulled it off well. With STD The show itself is ground breaking but I just don't like Michael Burnem , I think she's entitled and full of herself, she's like a bad Tom Paris. I've only watched about 5 episodes of STD so I will go back and give it another chance, I'm hoping in the future they'll develop the characters further.
To be fair, the Borg are a tad bit more reasonable then the average sjw . Lol And I love how my keyboard corrected the b on Borg to caps, but had no problem leaving sjw's as lower case. 😂
We have our politically programmed anti west agenda. Funds have been received infiltration into media net successful begining phycological warfare operation .codename. "you should feel bad about being born" Tactic 101b initiated "call names and label the majority of the population" Now hands in the air and empty your pockets." Resistance is futile logic will not save you. because we are retarded.... I mean we are the borg .
"Why? Because we've left the Federation, and that's the one thing you can't accept. Nobody leaves paradise. Everyone should want to be in the Federation. Hell, you even want the Cardassians to join. You're only sending them replicators because one day they can take their 'rightful place' on the Federation Council. You know, in some ways, you're even worse than the Borg. At least they tell you about their plans for assimilation. You're more insidious. You assimilate people and they don't even know it."
He's completely correct, in this deplorable series that's almost as bad as its completely non-canon predecessor the Federation are going completely against their Prime Directive and setting out to bastardise, twist, dilute and destroy other cultures like missionaries do today with religious bulshit
In the original Star Trek they had multiple races working together, however they were all basically of the same culture. Sure they came from different cultural backgrounds but whether they assimilated or just came from very similar cultures, in the end they were all part of the same culture. Spoke a common language, same morals, values, etc. True racists are rare. One of the big issues these days are people moving to new countries who refuse to assimilate, and that causes all kinds of problems. Some worse than others depending on how dissimilar their culture is. It's the cultural differences that people don't like on both sides, race usually has little to do with it. ...other than it is used as an excuse to further divide people by corrupt elites.
@Mike Forti I wondered about that too. But then all though history there have been very distinct races and languages, even among neighboring countries. Just look at Europe. So I suppose it's possible. From a selfish point of view, I kind of hope we don't all become the same in the future. I like the differences. It's interesting and distinct. :-) But ya, this current BS (like Discovery) is just about identity politics and very little else.
Scott Phillips well one thing i recall from tng with aliens is, the captain told worf once that do whatever as long as it doesnt affect your duties. The only time i saw him bend that rule was letting that one hot af ensign wear a piece of jewelry.
@Mike Forti Two interesting facts about human pairing: 1. Statistically, people tend to prefer to couple with people from their own culture. This is because people from the same culture are more likely to share values. 2. Whenever different cultures co-exist in a single society, there will be intercultural couples, whether it is legal or illegal. This is never more common than in-group coupling, but it always occurs. There are various reasons why people do this and I don't want to elaborate too much. But it always happens.
@Mike Forti I've always thought that as well. The problem is , who exists today that looks like the future mixed humans? Impossible to know what our species will look like and impossible to cast.
I don't care where Star Trek: Discovery fits in the Star Trek timeline. I don't consider it cannon. I see it as apart of a separate universe like the J.J. Abrams ST movies.
I loved (pre-discovery) Star Trek’s treatment of race: don’t talk about it. Treat them as individuals who just happen to have lighter or darker skin and hair textures. Like the old Will Smith movies.
Ever seen Red Dwarf? The lead character is black, and nothing is ever made of it, ever. It's an excellent series, and if you haven't seen it, I strongly recommend it.
i found the "planet of hats" treatment to be pretty racist. everyone of one race were the same. not the most open minded idea. apparently the ferengi were originally a criticism of jews and capitalism. but even they were able to defend themselves and their way of life in the script and are one of my favorite cultures. i love the klingon too. i guess i loved it when the show would defend the villains ("no evil race" mentality). and question the heros like it did with the occasional vulcan villain or vulcan failing. i wish the writers were comfortable enough to attack the federation more.
Jew Jew Abrams “I walk into this room and it’s the most kosher fucking room! We need some diversity, let’s put some Asian actors, I’ve had it with this jewish nepotism!”
What annoys me about the crew interactions is that they keep saying they've worked together for seven years. Look at the TNG,DS9 and Voyager crews after seven years. They had become families. Riker never mutinied against Picard, Kira had learned to trust Sisko.
Here’s one thing I can’t understand with liberal reactions to the Klingons and how their self-isolation is bad: why is it bad for the Klingons to live in self isolation but not bad for the Japanese during the Tokugawa Shogunate? For those who don’t know, Shogun Tokugawa Ieyasu instituted a policy of self-isolation on Japan called Sakoku, forbidding any foreigner to set foot in Japan and for any Japanese to leave. Sakoku was ended when Commodore Matthew Perry entered Tokyo Bay with four warships and demanded that Japan end its self-isolation, or America would take their country by force. We would view the actions of Commodore Perry as the actions of an imperialist warmonger, but for some reason the Federation acting in a similar way is somehow promoting diversity? I’m sorry ST:D producers, but I don’t see the Klingons as white nationalists in this situation. Instead I see the Japanese staring down the barrels of Commodore Perry’s guns.
Your comment makes no sense. Clearly people did think Japan's self-isolation was bad, or Commodore Perry wouldn't have shown up with his warship. So the liberals of today are agreeing with the leaders of yesterday who sent Commodore Perry out to Japan in a warship.
odonnell1218 this channel and all of you are fucking stupid. I think Discovery sucks but I didn't expect to listen to a bunch of political shit and far right bullshit. WTF?? get a life.
It's simple: Complaining about Japan doesn't give them power. Leftists ignore gays being murdered in Iran, women being stoned or mutilated for not wearing a burka in Syria, women being kidnapped and raped by Boko Haram in Nigeria, China's mistreatment of Muslims and their own people, because that doesn't give them power where they live.
Dave: The writers may end up defeating their own points of view; wondering why the "fans" are actually empathizing more with the Klingons - like what happened to characters like Alex P. Keaton, and Archie Bunker. I believe the writers of those characters mis-read how the public would admire them instead of disliking them as the writers initially intended.
Chris Leskiw Audience members often liked Klingon culture, and adding the best quality of the federation, individualism, to the Klingon characters will only make them more appealing.
If they wanted so badly have a "white sepramacist" race why don´t create very pale aliens like the castithans in Defiance? It is not like they were trying to be subtle or hide their progressive agenda. The funniest part is how SJWs can´t see the problem even when fans point exactly what it is.
If you look at the evidence Dave has presented, in the show creators own words, the Klingons actually look like they represent Native American Indian culture. And as Dave said the Federation represents imperialism, or the colonialists who wiped out the Indians. If they wanted to be truly social justice they'd have the Klingons invading Starfleet Federation territory as migrants making demands on the host culture. As you say Chris they really don't appear to have thought through their own worldview. They are following blind ideology and it may be a massive mistake on their part. There is little intelligence to their approach. They are even showing emotional immaturity in how they're communicating with Trek fans. Any good fiction examines different points of view in a sincere manner. It's part of what creates the friction which is needed for good dramatic stories.
The only way to save the show is for the Klingons to WIN ... and kick the Federation-Borg-collectivism in the nuts. Maybe have a reveal of the leaders of the Federation being secretly Borg (after First Contact) ... just like they did in comics for Captain America and his "Nazi story arc". Star Trek does have alternate timelines ...
@@eriveltomartinsbarrosjunio9022 Completely agree. It was and is a totally awful and cheesy theme song. I think though what they were trying to say with it was that it's been a long road Getting from there to here. It's been a long time, but my time is finally near. I will see my dream come alive at last, I will touch the sky, and they're not gonna hold me down no more, no they're not gonna change my mind, no they're not gonna hold me down, cause I've got faith of the heart, I'm going where my heart will take me, I've got faith to believe I can do anything, I've got strength of the soul, and no one's gonna bend or break me, I can reach any star, I've got faith,I've got faith, faith of the heart.
@@JohnnyZenith , the lyrics are actually quite powerful, I don't deny that. They encapsulate the whole idea behind anything ST. The melody is cheesy though.
7 лет назад+57
The Federation won the war against the mighty Klingon, Romulans, and Borgs, but was vanquished by the PC dominion. RIP Star Trek
Not a Trekkie by any means, but seeing this franchise going the way of Doctor Who, Star Wars, Cartoon Network and most of the videogame franchises I loved break my heart. Like watching a wonderful legacy getting thrown in the nearest ditch.
thats how capitalism works. And for the sake of making a few idiots more rich people jump on every new train to be brainless entertainent to make the rich more rich and themselve more poor year by year
You nailed it. STD is so distasteful, having seen every Trek episode and movie prior to this, I had to stop after the 4th episode. The effects are the ONLY bit of this show I enjoyed. I'd keep watching if I wanted to see a series about the Terran Empire.
starmanovich you should watch the whole series, it gets so good. The first 4 episodes are setting up the story. Actually the first 9 do, and then it finds its footing and is brilliant
Nickolas Canning-Battye It shouldn't take 9 episodes to "git gud" (as the gamers say); that's more than halfway through the first season. It should have been well into the meat of the story by episode 5, since that's solidly 1/3 into the season's 15-episode arc.
Dargonhuman The Next Generation took an ENTIRE season to Get Good, so did Buffy, Voyager and 90% of all series. The first series is usually just to get you to know characters and set up a bigger story.
Before the first episode even aired, the cast did a pathetic photo shoot "taking a knee" in solidarity with the NFL "protests". That was all I needed to see. I have never watched Discovery, nor do i intend to. They lost this Trek fan before they even started.
If I was a member of Star Fleet during Discovery I would contact the Borg and beg to be assimilated. This show is bad, is not Trek, is not Cannon and is not good,
Star Trek Discovery and diversity: it is questionable why, after going to the trouble of introducing female characters of color, they chose to kill the Asian one, and make the black one a convict... as well as killing the literally black Klingon to have his position as unifier of the houses usurped by a literally white one. Add to that Sarek, who won't talk to his Vulcan son Spock for joining the human Federation, but is proud of his adopted human daughter for joining her kind; a segregationist. But yeah..... Diversity. -_-
Oh shut up. It's kind of hard not to have things happen to non-white races when almost everyone is. And may I point out that the two white characters also got killed? You're what gives the left a bad name. DSC is not racist (which would include anti-white). The strongest case for it being racist is that comment about someone's background referring to them being black. It does suck though. Okay, I thought I was done, I'm not. Having something happen to non-white people is not fucking racist! Neither is having the two main characters being female anti-male nor is the majority of the cast being non-white anti-white. After all, the majority of people is non-white, and although I did not break it down, it seems like the racial makeup of the DSC cast resembles the racial makeup of earth pretty well. Here is the list of discriminatory things series do: - Having a token black/female/gay person to excuse all claims of discrimination - Over a big sample, having a complete lack of diversity (unless it makes sense in context) - Having every diverse character fit their stereotype (note: some stereotypes are fine, because some people really do act like their stereotypes) Here is a list of things series do which are not (by themselves) discriminatory: - Have discriminatory characters - Having a small group share gender or race (these things happen by chance in the real world too) - Having something happen to non-white people (guess what, stuff happens to people of every race! The thing people rightfully complain about is 'the black character being killed off', but it's the token black guy that's the main problem, not the having something happen to them)
My theory is that the writers are trying to make the Burnham character as bad as humanly possible in order to explain why Spock never talked about her.
The fact that the writers are using 20th century issues for a show thats supposed to be a techno-utopia in the 23rd century just shows they don't give a shit about the actual source material.
Because subconsciously, the Woke don't believe we ever CAN advance as a species. They even say the US in 2021 is just as racist as it was in 1921, but the racism is "covert" nowadays.🙄🤦🏾♀️ They see "progress" as if they were using tweezers to pick a few weevils out of grain so the result will be weevil-free and edible. But they're really using an ax to chop barnacles off a ship that's deep at sea. . . They'll never get all the barnacles off, before the ship sinks from the damage they're doing.
@@zxyatiywariii8 So true. The only important thing for them is to be a victim. Put them in paradise, and they will say God stops them from progressing. Not sure if God would have the same tolerance tough lol
And the thing is, Star Trek has ALWAYS used contemporary social issues as a template for plots, but they were very diverse ones and not galvanized into a singular agenda the whole way through
I see why they killed Axanar. It would have spelled the end of every "suit" in Paramount. Axanar is HIGH QUALITY. Just look at the introduction "Prelude to Axanar". It is impressive, great acting, and far more satisfying in its mere 20 minutes than all of Discovery. You actually came away from that 20 minute episode wanting MORE. I did watch the first season of Discovery out of curiosity. Have absolutely NO DESIRE to see anything else. The Axanar Prelude also reminded me of Babylon5 season finales or mid-season cliff-hangars- I counted the days to the next new episode. Discovery, Picard, Strange New World's, Below Decks? Don't care. IT is all garbage.
"Who are the bad guys in the story?" Exactly my thought! I was rooting for the Klingons, instantly. They had the albino outsider and they overcame minor prejudice and started seeing him based on his character and his attitude towards their cause. The Klingons are portrayed as the more understanding factions right away! On the other side silly emotional non-vulcan Vulcan girl over there instantly wanted to start a war, trying to take over the ship, ignoring ranks, rebelling against authority she swore to abide etc. And the best fact: The Klingons were portrayed as pretty passive at the beginning and only ongoing imperalism of the Starfleet brought them to a point, where they wanted to gather to fight back, defending their territory and culture.
I seem to recall the only memorable and badass scene was when the leader of the Klingons gave the federation Admiral his answer..Then the hologram of the Admiral starts scrambling and he s thrashed around and then gone..The next shot showing the Starship being smashed by a giant slowly decloakibg Klingon craft. I was definitely rooting for them as well..
Klingons passive. You on some kind of drugs mate. They were far from it. Tell me who attacked who when they discovered what they though was an asteroid and then turned out to be a Klingon ship. The Klingon attacked first fact. Nothing passive about them at all.
It would be cool if they would make Federation kinda bad and Klingons alsmost good, but they are not smart enough for any real depth. Stupid SJW propaganda will be everything we will see.
Terrible show. Characters are really bad and the writing is worse. I hated the way the captain always kept saying number 1, trying to get people to connect this with the TNG
I can't find your reply, but I am not kidding, it was mentioned in a book about the original series. I have that book somewhere, I think, it has been years since I read it. I would look for it but I have hundreds of books, most of them are in boxes yet from when I moved.
@jamesk479 I find it funny that people who like this mess of a series are just so violent and angry just because a lot of people don't like this show at all. It's weird, people like you are so often angry and hateful and so many of you are like this, and you project what you are onto everybody.
@jamesk479 Here, I'm going to be kinder and less verbose. If people are saying "dumb sh***", tell them what that "dumb shi***" is. If you don't do this, you're not engaging with them, you're just insulting them. You might be right, but you're giving no opportunity for the other person to understand they are wrong, or to demonstrate you are wrong. I'm pointing out that the true toxic group, are people like you. I don't need to insult you, or demean you, I'll just take issue with what you've said. I find the current incarnations of Star Trek to be horribly written, and that the main reason "minorities" (which are absolutely fine!) are placed into lead roles is that when people inevitably complain about the lazy, incompetent, stupid writing, is that when they do, they can be denounced as racists, sexists, whatever. This happened with GhostBusters 2016. That movie largely failed NOT because women were in the lead roles, but because the writing was terrible. It wasn't funny. It was lazy. They dependeded entirely on the name of "GhostBusters" and GhostBusters 2 wasn't that good. And you had all the effort put in for special effects, sets, and honestly good comedians, but the writer was a complete screw up. A low budget production, with lousy special effects can become a classic with great writers or even just competent ones. The original series of Star Trek isn't remembered for its amazing special effects (although they WERE top of the line at the time) and it's not remembered for the amazing sets (although they did a good job within their constraints not knowing what would be available to a CONSUMER just 40 years later), it stands up, because the writing (at least for season 1 and 2) were quite good. It's considered "campy" today, but it had quite a few thoughtful episodes. People have built recreations of the sets, CGI clones of the sets, fan fiction, blah blah blah, because they loved it. I think I'm correct in saying that's not going to happen with Discovery or Picard because the writers, are horrible. None of the stories are memorable. They have a worse understanding of science than I did when I was 10, seriously. And I'm serious. The writers make ZERO effort in being believable within the realm of known physics or even how people would act of make decisions. If you enjoy it, that's fine, but it's lost the technical community. To be honest, I thought that TNG was losing the ability to be believable. Now, there's NO science consultants (well competent ones anyhow) in the current incarnations. It's pure fantasy and they don't even care about how people would realistically react, it's just filler until the next cgi-boom-boom 'splosion sequence. If that's all people wanted, there's video games for that. I was really hoping that when a show called DISCOVERY would go back to strange new worlds. They proposing a series called Strange New Worlds, but I don't believe them. It's a false promise. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on you. I've looked for the origin of the quote, it may have been created by a "low budget" science fiction show that has entered our vernacular. I don't think anything that "writers" of Discovery of Picard say will.
I take it back as I did more research. "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me" is from Anthony Weldon, 1651. Writers used to be well read.
I don't like Trump myself, but dear God I wish they keep the politics out of Star Trek. It's supposed to be a positive outlook of a future with enlightenment and equality, not a grim exercise in destructive SJW beliefs. Encounter At Farpoint introduced us to the character of Q. All that's needed to be said as to its superiority over STD's pilot I suppose.
But Star Trek has ALWAYS reflected the political situation at the time? Like LGBT issues, racial issues and so on. Also our world is ever more fatalistic and shit so I think it reflects that, also the belief that an Organisation is not always only good or bad (like the Klingon and The Federation) is very today-ish. And then we also need the bad evil villain TM, because yeah it's Star Trek not Game of Thrones seasons 1-5.
Star Trek was always about politics. In times like these with trump tryin to destroy democracy in the US and want to install an authoritarian regime like in Russia and Hungary the worst fears became real. I really do not like st: discovery coz of his storytelling and gender agenda, too but its a dangerous and thin line not to be misunderstood and labelled as misogynist or right-winged idiot.
Deep space nine is still one of the best trek programs and captain sisko is one of best all round characters. As a white man it never crossed my mind that he was black. Probably because the fact that he was, wasn't forced on the viewers. We just got to know him as person, warts and all.
How can they keep the racism card if know one talks about it, racism will never go away, it's always gonna be here, and unfortunately those that don't see colour are bombarded by racial propaganda and begin to to see colour and this continues the undertones of racism through society. IT IS HERE FOREVER, it only stops when people stop talking about it.
Maybe it never crossed your mind that he was black because you weren't caught up in this white backlash taking place now. DS9 pivoted on themes such as racism, oppression and fascism. The Cardassians were a ruthless racist empire who occupied Bajor and oppressed the Bajorans. Gul Dukat made several Cardassian supremacist speeches in the show that could be lifted straight from Nazi Germany or the Confederate South. There was an episode were Sisko went back in time to the 1960s Civil Rights era and had to deal with racism. These have always been Star Trek themes. That was always Roddenberry's intention.
You're right, Joel. They have always been central themes. However, before the secular original sin of whiteness, these ideas were handled in a lot more grown-up way. There was some nuance there. There was usually a cost to taking that higher road ethically. Not this binary "with our beliefs or against them" jingoism going round hollywood. I don't think you can argue that these themes haven't been handled much more artfully in the past, given how social justice themes seem to been reduced to their least sophisticated iterations (Particularly for ST, which has kind of spearheaded those conversations on Television) I'm not sure how it's happened that writing is getting dumber rather than more subtle but it certainly has gone downhill. I'm not some hardliner for any particular political camp, but I have to agree with the consensus that using such a venerated franchise as a blunt force instrument for ideology (Rather than just idealism, and there is a noteworthy difference between the words) is sort of profane.
I definitely agree that it happens, especially with feminism. But frankly I have not seen it in this show and everyone that keeps saying it is happening is yet to provide any proof. Why exactly is this an SJW show? Because they cast a black woman? In interviews Gene Roddenberry specifically stated that he wanted not only a black person for the show, he wanted a black woman and he wanted her to be an officer. When they told him stations in the South would not carry it he basically said : "good, fuck em." What is more SJW than that?
The Federation is actually more like an ideal United States and was always intended to be so. It and Starfleet are more based on classical ideas of liberty, natural rights, republicanism, the scientific method and civic virtue (as Captain Picard always more or less insisted, making him one of televisions greatest characters, if not the greatest) than Marxism/Communism. The only reason Earth and Starfleet are without money is because tech has eradicated scarcity. There are still relatively independent states, property and even classes based on merit. In the old series they would never attempt to force a species to join the Federation or to adopt human or Federation ways. The Federation was all about protecting rights.
Nearly 2 whole years later and this STILL rings true. I worry about the new Trek series in production too. The Trek we all grew up on and loved is gone. :(
@@sirbattlecat and now we have Prodigy, and... It's actually not bad at all. Each episode manages to stand on its own in some form or fashion, it doesn't shove any political agenda down your throat and then shit in your mouth saying "YEAH, POLITICAL AGENDA". It's much more in line with the Star Trek we know and love compared to Picard and Discovery. The characters have flaws, and aren't fully in synch at the start of the show, but by the halfway point of Season 1, they've come together pretty smoothly. Whoever's writing for Prodigy needs to keep it up, it's really good.
I just finished watching season 1 of Discovery, and it was terrible, and you are right this show is full of agenda, I never cared there was a black, or woman captain, and in fact voyager and janeway were my favorite, but Discovery is garbage, and I cant stand it.
It began just as Dave said, then fooled us for few episodes, only to wrap up back where it started with the SJW crap. Too bad, I really enjoyed the twist with Lorca. It was the only highlight, which they clearly couldn’t allow a strong, white male character to derail their “message”. These are truly dark times we live in.
Very true that Janeway was a return to the action roots of the series and Cisco was also good. TNG though OMG that was bad. PS A GREAT actor cannot rescue terrible writing.
@@saberiandream316 dude, would you stop injecting YOUR political agenda into all of this? Every fucking comment chain....most People don't care about race and gender, as proven by the other beloved star trek installments, it's the blatant political agenda (and thus horrible writing), along the other stuff you mentioned. Hell, I'm a left leaning white man myself and I'm fed up with being labelled racist or mysogonistic all the fucking time, just because I want some proper character development instead of being lectured how evil I am. Exactly this shit is why people voted trump. I'm no us citizen and when trump got elected, all of Europe was scratching their heads how someone could vote for this disgusting man. Well, diving into the current political landscape of yours, I now know why. Not that I agree, but I see why. It's really saddening how we FORGOT to write proper badasses like Ripley, sarah connor, blade, shaft and many others across all forms of media. 1980's were more progressive than now lol
You know the like/dislike ratio is artificial, when a much greater majority of the comments are in agreement with the video. (on a channel that doesn't censor, at least that I know of)
@@saberiandream316 "Passionately left" You sound like an emotional whiney beta, yucky. SJW and leftwing politics are cancer. From someone who is fairly center....
I grew up on TNG. And I loved Voyager. Not because she was a female captain. But because no matter what they faced, she kept to her principals. I admired that. There’s no one on Discovery I can get on board with.
When i grew up i was told that the customer is the king and you even apologise for mistkaes you didnt make. In my workplace a collegue got fired for telling a customer that he is an idiot - to be fair that customer was a moron and we all could see why he said it but you cant do that..... You have to please your audience and cater to those who like your product. Now it seems the new policy is to mock your customers, cater to those people who dont want your product, and blame your mistakes at the audience. Wow. if those hollywood guys ever had a real job they would know such behaviour would get them fired immediately
God this show is awful. I am big Star Trek Fan. I sat for even lowest of low. I endured Nemesis and JJ flarefest. But thois was to much. I stopped at episode 5 and will no touch any more of it.
That's about how far I made it too., came to a brickwall and couldn't go past it. Which is pretty telling as I normally can't get enough Star Trek, I've seen every single episode of every series in Star Trek's history, until now. It has to be really bad for me to not be able to watch it.
I watched through the entire thing... and I regret it... I kept watching and watching hoping and hoping that it will get better but it never came... this is the worst star trek ever, its not even star trek, I hate it with almost soul and wish it would burn in a fire
I am a fan of Star Trek since I have seen the Original series when I was five or six years old and continued to watch ever since. Which meant watching it illegally on a western tv channel, since I grew up in the GDR. And ever since, Star Trek was a part of my life, with TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise. Not anymore, because since the movie reboot, Star Trek is pretty much dead and what we see now is a mockery of the real thing, just like a zombie which is an imitation of life.
Having seen all that was available on Netflix - I can truly, and very sadly say it really was terrible. I kept watching each episode as they were released hoping and naively expecting that it would all come together and become the enjoyable sci-fi romp that have been the stock in trade of the earlier series. And as for the premise - a "special" starship traversing the universe using fungus and the worst "teletubbies" like animation for entry and exit of ship into and out of the "dry rot" multi-fungi-universe-bullshit - really really childlike rubbish. Very disappointed - crestfallen - sad state of affairs.
Well, my wife and I were finally going to dive into this new Star Trek adventure. But I'm sick of being slapped in the face everywhere I turn with SJW preaching. Furthermore, since Jason Isaccs has indicated that he hates me on general principle, I think we'll forget about it. So, it's on to Cobra Kai season 2...a much, MUCH better show!
A rare example of two leftists jews somehow redeeming a franchise, its a bloody miracle Kobra Kai.A modern day tv miracle, still I am sure they will sneak in there subversive bs as time goes on trhey cant help themselves, so far the worst thing was in season 2 making that dumb chick a random leszbo for no reason and there little Dr who is a girl now and shes bad ass bs, but as far as intolerable goes thats pretty low and so far,so far Kobra Kai is bloody fantastic.
@Random L3vel Doctor who the new one isnt even a man..so he cant be bad ass.because objective reality is still reality and a man is still a man and a woman is still a woman even if lying weirdos play make believe lol,so no the Dr who at present is literally not a "bad ass" not even a man not to mention everyone says the show has gone over the top retarded with the usual feminist/bullshit nonsense, I guess I could see how that could be funny in the context of a haha fuck you Hawk didn't see that one coming,I do get that and admittedly thats subjective.I myself though am just sick to shit of it because now a days its always always an agenda always!, I do give these two guys credit though they have done overall a great job with this show so far.
Im more upset with that annoying little turd Dimitri beating Hawk, thats beyond un realistic,cant stand that kid,anyhow great show I just really hope they dont do something super dark like have Miguel either paralyzed for life or unable to do karate again or both,I really think thatd ruin a great thing.
My bad you didnt say she was a he just that Dr who was bad ass,but regardless the new Dr who is not bad ass just an unbearable feminist bitch ya know. Wouldnt watch that garbage if someone Hollywood grabbler executive paid me to.
For me, that's Star Trek VI. I rooted for General Kang (or whatever his name was) for being so ruthless and cunning in assassinating his own chancellor and framing Kirk for it. Gotta admire him for it...he got results, and almost got away with it.
Even when playing Star Trek Online, my character was an officer in the Discovery Starfleet, every single character was either gay, lesbian, transgender, or some other edgy minority group. This would be perfectly fine if they hadn't mentioned it every time they had an opportunity to!
Captain Sisko was my favorite captain of all of the shows, and Geordi was my favorite character in TNG for a lot of it's run. I didn't even care that they were black. It literally was not relevant to me. THAT is how you make a show diverse. Write AWESOME characters and make them happen to be people of color, or women, or whatever. This normalizes these situations and changes people's perception with no pushback.
Perfectly well said. The characters just happen to be black or gay or female or male or trans… but don’t make it about that. Like when Adira tells Stamets what pronoun they prefer… what the hell? In the 23rd century they’re still going to complain about misgendering? I’m all for diversity and letting people be who they are but nobody cares what you identify as. It’s your personal thing.
The show perfectly illustrated how paranoid nationalist can be if not careful. The Klingons saw a treat that wasn't there in the first place. No one was seeking to take away their culture. They missed the whole point of multiculturalism, like many people in our own world do today. This is good Star Trek.
You can tell the Klingon actors are spending so much time focusing on remembering and pronouncing their stupid Klingon lines that they completely forget to act. The way senior officers on the Discovery bitched about each other in front of subordinates like teenage valley girls disgusted me. That's not Starfleet.
0:35 The Trill Symbiont idea was actually much more closer to reincarnation rather than changing genders- the Dax Symbiont is essentially a physical form of a spirit, and Curzon, Jadzia, Ezri, etc. are the successive hosts of that spirit, which accepts whichever sex that host may be. Shoehorning it into the trans & non-binary thing(both of which only exist within one host/body) by those SJWs completely misses the point of the symbiont storyline.
@one punch God who said anything about Fairytale? Someone seems a little but hurt. Ironic that your profile pic is a super sayan and your name is a referance to one punch man (both Animes superman sytle characters) and you accuse me of watch garbage anime........
What anime? There's only boku no hero and attack on titan, both annual series, so we have to wait a long ass time just like these TV series, lol At least, these are the only 2 I watch. Don't know if there's any other decent anime out there right now.
excellent analysis. Also, how does this video get 19k down-thumbs? I doubt there are even 19k VIEWERS of the show. I wouldn't put it past the people working on the show to have created a few bots to artificially thumb this down. They're still losing. All good wishes.
@@saberiandream316 You hate Sexually Transmitted Diseases? :P Well... kinda tells all you need to know about the leftists today... LOL XD More to the point... the makers of this show really made a bad descision when even a hardcore ultraleftist cannot stand it XD true scifi-fans are true fans no matter the political stance, good for you mate ;) and thanks for actually rising my view on humanity :)
@TMPanos96 pretty sure smart people who actually like the show don't want to waste their nerves in the comment section with some fan boys that can't take the thought that not everyone thinks the same like you.
They don't want just that; they want everyone else whose not a Klingon. And they'll conquer you if you don't submit. They've never been isolationist. Hell the main conflict with this show came from them violating federation borders.
Chuck Norris and Kid Rock? Seriously? Jason Isaacs never heard of John Wayne, Charlton Heston, Clint Eastwood, Sylvester Stallone, Kurt Russell, Arnold Schwarzenegger, James Woods, Mel Gibson, Bruce Willis and Vince Vaughn? Odd because he's acted with several of them.
Wayne's been dead since the 70's, Heston in 2008, Eastwood's chair speech kind of ended his support, Stallone says he’s not a member of the GOP but votes whoever is best, Russell is "a hardcore libertarian.", Arnold Schwarzenegger did not vote Republican for the first time since 1983. The last 4 tho are GOP supporters, but none as vocal about it as Chuck Norris is. If you were to say I'm going to vote the same as Vince Vaughn, most people would think you mean liberal. James Wood is kind of known as the Obama Troll along with Trump, but Bruce and Mel are just republicans, Mel's not even raised in USA like Chuck Norris or Kid Rock. None of them really embody the 'deep south' core of 'Confederate America' supporters either. So a lot of your examples are good examples of Republicans, but the other half are just your typical Republicans hardliners, none of them really embody the type of people that Trump Rally's and the alt-right and people at Charlotteville know and support. There's nothing wrong with the GOP, but they court the vote of some weird fucking people, let's just say. It's more about WHY he chose those guys, then forgot about John Wayne, who's dead.
@ghenulo Ya wonder why a black women would have so much hate in USA, you'd almost think that she was bitter about something??? As a white guy, I don't see any issues.
Orville, is good , I really liked the 3rd episode about the baby being female , but being made into a male It did not feel pushed or rammed down your neck. It was a good story
It touched on gender issues, but since the baby was a baby and, using progressive usage of the term, couldn't yet have a "gender" (not to mention the Moclans being a primarily single-gender species unlike humans), the parallels to real-world trans issues were inherently limited. It seemed to me to touch on several topics, from simple chauvinistic sexism to the definition of disabilities to parental and governmental coercion. I actually thought it handled things quite well, and more artfully than I'd feared. (I enjoyed the first two episodes and was not wanting to be disappointed with ep 3).
You nailed it mate, I have watched Star Trek all my life, I'm 38. My favourite is DS9 and never thought of Sisco as a "Black Man" he was an awesome Captain!
Nope, your take on this train wreck of a show is spot on!! Watched like 10 minutes of it, yes, the first officer is just DAMNED ANNOYING. Turned it off, haven't gone near it since...and don't plan on it.
It feels like every generic drama out there nowadays, with an emphasis on violence, melodrama, and action. People watch a Star Trek show to see intellectual things like diplomacy, well-written characters, a utopian sci-fi universe, and some occasional interesting plots on the various planets they visit.
You know - this video is almost a year old... and I still pull it out and watch it because it is SOOO dead on correct even after the completion of the first season.
Just binge watched the first 6 episodes; you nailed it in every regard. I could not identify with any of the characters; they were weird, dark and distasteful. And though I’m a white male, I always liked Cisco, Janeway, Worf and others in the past shows. I will nevertheless watch the show but be assured, it is only because I’m. Sci Fi geek and appreciate the special effects and future tech but sadly, it is not to see any of the characters. These humans are mor alien than some of the aliens. Man did they miss the boat with not doing a Titan series with Riker as captain. There was a relatable character (and the CHARACTER would’ve been relatable in any ethnicity or gender). Discovery is pretty much STINO (Star Trek in name only). In closing, this is all just my opinion; I hope there are others out there who find the show more engaging because despite its perceived shortcomings, it’s better than no Trek.
I felt the same way after the first 2 seasons of TNG when Tasha Yar was killed by a talking puddle of black goo, Wesley Crusher fell in love with a girl that turned into a giant turd, and Data's evil twin tried to feed the Enterprise to an alien that resembled a broken chandelier. lol. Most ST shows are not good out-of-the gate. Loved DSC's second season.
Kenneth Baker true tng and tos had bad episodes but they always still had a Star Trek 'family' feel, in a cosy, well established Star Trek universe. STD has none of that. All of the crew are unlikeable. It's very disappointing & sad to an old Trekkie who grew up with tos, loved tng & voyager, not so keen on ds9 or enterprise but even they were infinitely better than STD!
@@Shimmy246 It took TIME to establish that "family feel", and it didn';t happen after 2 seasons. You're comparing a show that had 178 episodes to a show that has had 29. TNG was "almost unwatchable" after it's first 2 seasons (writer Ron Moore's words, not mine). I remember going to a Star Trek convention in 1989, and fans were BOOING TNG. james Doohan raised both of his hands and said, "Hey, let's give the new show a chance". LOL. Fans had the same exact complaints about EACH ST show during their earl years as they have about Discovery.
I'm a Native American, and the writing, acting, production design, costumes and MAKEUP, suuuuuck on this show. It's shite. One of the great strengths of star trek has always been, as you say, a more subtle diversity, as if OHMYGOD the future actually got past these things. This kind of heavy handed, lazy writing TOTALLY dates this show and it will not be rewatched a few years from now. The original and TNG stories are often timeless.
When they cast a black woman in the original series they did it with a different spirit than they do those sorts of things now. It's more about hate and exclusion than love and inclusion.
let's get t-shirts made a great logo showing your favourite character with a tear in his/her eye and the inscription I didn’t leave Star Trek, Star Trek left me.
good reply every time someone disagrees with STD just say good riddance instead of trying to change there opinion. it will make for great viewing figures
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
We're living in an interesting time where fan made films are better than the Hollywood ones.
@@pwnmeisterage Can you elaborate on this? I'm actually curious.
At least the fans actually watched star trek, which this bunch of hacks clearly didn't
No we're not. Hollywood may produce some god awful crap, but it doesn't come remotely close to the agonizing cringe of fan films. People who have zero training in wushu twirling lightsabers and thinking they can do their own choreography, directed by people who don't know how to direct, delivering lines written by illiterates, with the gravitas of an actor in a high school play.
@CrazyHorseInvincible talking about lightsabers on a star trek-related video, lol, amateur hour...
@@TheGreatGodPan We were talking about fan films vs Hollywood films. Reading comprehension is apparently not your forte.
It's amazing how much the people behind Star Trek keep making aliens look more and more like Orcs.
If you think about it: star trek was always close to be a fantasy in space.
Vulcans = Elfs
Klingons = Orks
Humans = Humans
Holograms = Golems
Ferengi = Goblins
Romulan = Dark Elfs
Borg = Zombies
Hirogen = Darkelfs
Species 8472 = Demons
and so on.
There is even magic and some kind of gods involevd.
Edit: Ferengi are the goblin becouse the romulans are more the dark elfs/dwarfs.
sorry for this messup.
Edit2: Added Ferengi to the list to hammer it home.
Kinda see the point but also dark elves have often (like all elfs) some kind of hunter culture. Romulans act and look more like goblins for far i remaber.
Ironic when these people claim to not be racist.
Hahaha. Love your comment :-)
more like reptilians
Star trek was supposed to inspire us to get past our BS and be better than we are, not poke the hornet 's nest and make it worse. Voyager had a divided crew in season 1 due to the Maquis and Federation having different ideologies. But they GOT PAST IT and merged into one solid crew that backed each other up despite their backgrounds. Lord I miss Voyager, TN, TOS, and DS9
just got done binge watching voyager, its def my fav out of all of them, ds9 takes 2nd.
You names the good ones. Nobody seems to miss TNG.
Voyager rules.!!!
@Mike Forti I'm sorry they couldn't get that many people who are a mixture of all the races. Some people just...might not want to mix races, but are tolerant of others who are okay with mixing races. January 23, 2019, 9:52pm
@@Karen1963Yorks speak for yourselves. TNG is the best of them all by a long shot in my view.
"We're totally against racism!"
...meanwhile: "When I'm in a room full of people all I care about is Skin Color."
And additional strange SJW plot twist, the ' new ' Klingons, which look very dark skinned and kinda scary, Actually represent White Supremacists !! Huh ? Yes ! But why ? Seriously ? Who are the ' bad guys' supposed to be here ? Can't stand the Michael Burnham character, either.
@@aaronhumphrey2009 Where did you get that idea from? When it's the white Klingon who is actually the savior.
Jangler333 ehe ehem
Also meanwhile: We’re gunna make the Klingons look exactly like what crude depictions of black people were drawn up to look like by racists back in the day. ANND were gonna have them sound annoying
I know what the discovery is in Star trek discovery. It's the writers discovering that no one likes gender politics except for crazy leftist .
Michael Dorn has been pitching a Captain Worf show for over a decade. Who wouldn't have loved that?
As a sit-com?
SalMasRac Would have been awesome.
Nah, I think we've seen Worf get his ass kicked enough times, thank you.
Burt1038 yeah, a word show was never a good idea
thats what i was hoping for, worf would make a great cpt and it would continue the story, i dont care what happened in the past hell i have only ever seen 2 eps of TOS, i came in on generations and been a fan since, if this is the direction they are going i think ill skip the next few shows
Star Trek The Original Series: ST:TOS
Star Trek The Next Generation: ST:TNG
Star Trek Deep Space Nine: ST:DS9
Star Trek Voyager: ST:VOY
Star Trek Enterprise: ST:ENT
Now we come to this series... appropriately abbreviated as STD
Star Trek Discovery has the same intials as Sexually Transmitted Disease? How did I not notice that? January 23, 2019, 10:01pm
What's funny is that the fanboys of the show are trying so hard to call it DSC instead. Lol
@@VirtuaSavage what does the s.c stand for?
How did the Klingons go from rare to well-done?
Well done, I agree.
Well done, I agree.
Space walks. The age of ascendance, 13, to become a warrior, started and possibly ended with a test of an open space walk. This leaves a dead skin look. Eventually the epidermis is gradually grown out but depending on how long the "walk" was endured would determine what kind of Warrior they would be regarded as. The "albino" Klingon, great diplomats. The far darker warriors were considered to have seen stovacore and therefore no longer feared death. Obviously this practice changed by the time Alexander reached the age of Ascension.
Or did I guess wrong in explaining the physical attributes of a made-up people? Remember they don't talk about it with Outsiders.
I'd vote burned, to a cinder.
Idk, Worf was fairly dark-skin. . . It's almost irrelevant with so much prosthetic makeup whatever color the actors are.
But the show sucks in its mean-spirited ethos.
Farscape actually handled alien language very well, they introduced microbes that would be injected, so all the different aliens including the main character would still be speaking their own language, then the main character and hence the audience would be hearing English as the microbes would be translating for the main character. And the only times we would hear the original language of the aliens was with cuss words or words that don't have a direct translation, like with phrases.
I remember that in *Farscape* too.
All the characters were making strange sounds until Ben got injected in the first episode.
Star Trek original series had something called a Universal Translator they mentioned in some episodes.
Yep .... was amazingly well done.
Like the Babel Fish from The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy
Plus there were also occasional scenes where they showed the perspective of people, mostly humans, who didnt have translator microbes, where the alien languages were occasionally shown. It was a nice touch to make the microbes only work one way, but not the other.
Been a fan for over 40 years, the 90's were a great time to be a star trek fan........RIP STAR TREK!!!!!!
I was thinking the same thing, I've tried my best to like it but it isn't happening.
I came to the Star Trek game late. Just started Deep Space 9. I'm a Pre-Discovery Trekie.
jony fish its a sad day trek wars mravle its all dead
Jennifer Costanza I live past trek I reject this junk its trek in name only
DS9 is my faverite trek series.
I once talked to a guy who stared in various fan films. He was a big fan of Star Trek but he told me he didn't like Discovery & it wasn't over politics. All your criticisms here are valid but now that I watch the series. It is not Star Trek. It is beyond dumbed down. It is an action space film that resembles Trek.
The canon was pooped on. I could live with Spock having a half-brother from his Father's previous marriage in the 5th movie we don't talk about. But all this time he has had a secret adopted human step-sister? That ruins the whole dynamic with His Father! Spock was always at odds with his Father because he was half human and yet Sarek is shown as having a human adopted daughter whom he has a better relationship with? FUCK THAT!!!!!
My only solace is to know Star Trek established in STTNG there is a multiverse and I can pretend all this stupidity doesn't really exist in the Classic Trek universe.
Everything you said was perfect. However, ST V Final frontier IMO was an AWESOME movie (if you ignore a sudden half brother that looks MORE HUMAN than hybrid Spock, and that thing where Scotty is a dopey moron for no apparent reason).
God I miss characters like Captain Janeway. She was a very strong lead.
I never even liked Voyager that much, I just didn't find the crew particularly likeable, but at least it was still made by competent writers, producers and directors, and was faithful to the source material. It still felt like Star Trek.
@@TheGreatGodPan I agree Voyager was one of the weaker ones, I still enjoyed it, but I see the issues, I still believe Janeway specifically was quite solid, I really liked her.
The B**** turn my stomach so much so that I stopped watch Star Trek, unless, it is the original series.
Strong like a skunk.
At the time I liked Janeway, but looking back after Hollywood's turn to the Far Left, the casting on this show was very, very, very woke.
I just came across this video and I have to say FINALLY!!!! someone sees what I see. The stories are muddled; the characters are unsympathetic; the tech (magic mushrooms that bind the universe together!) is absurd; and the moral underpinnings that make Star Trek, well, Star Trek are gone. Michael Burham is unlikable and arrogant . Her seemingly mandatory crying scenes don't give her depth; they just highlight her self-absorption. As an aside: Thank G-d they at least somewhat marginalized Ash Tyler. I couldn't stand to see that sniffling, co-dependent , wimp blubber one more time over his (cue violins) undying love and angst for Burnham . Sorry: I HAD to vent.
That is the one think I didn't like.
the fan based Star Trek films are better than STD
I agree. The Klingons in fan films look like Klingons, not rejects from the Uruk-Hai freak show. The plot makes sense, not reliant on Deus Ex Machina and retcons. The protagonists are likable, not cringe worthy and one-dimensional.
No
'The Orville' is better Star Trek than STD
@@A_Haunted_Pancake Orville kicks ass.
@@A_Haunted_PancakeOrville is woke..pushing the homosexual agenda on its viewers...
Original Star Trek: General Order 1, the "non-interference directive"
Discovery: Forced Multiculturalism
@The Dracobirthstonian That is a very poorly thought out statement. The notion that multiculturalism is connected to moral relativism shows a fundamental lack of understanding of the role it has played in cultural discourse for half a century. Canada's current constitution is founded on multiculturalism. And what about it is nonsensical? Allowing citizens to practice their religions and keep their identities without the fear of official persecution, and accepting other cultures?
The Dracobirthstonian Define gender. I have a feeling you might not know the definition “leftists” (the scientific community) use.
It's not forced, the premise of the show was about unity. That's literally the underlying thread of the narrative. Nothing forced about it.
The Prime Directive only applied to non-space species. It didn’t apply to Klingons, Vulcans, Tellarites, etc because they were considered equals
.
How is it forced multiculturalism.
I miss Picard.
I miss Sisko. Shame DS9 never got movies.
Yeah. Voyager was also great. YAY Janeway! And I love Picard. Shame both are done but they got great endings. (Nemesis Movie and the time-travel Borg Wormhole episode... thing.)
Nate112332 I thought the Borg time traveling was a Star Trek movie... Star Trek First Encounter. Also there is a risk board to see who is the better captain I know it is Kirk Picard And Janeway I forget the other 2.
Janeway was my fav, she had to deal with all the crazy shit in the delta quadrant without starfleet assistance, no starbase to go resupply n repair at, no federation to call when you need back up. They found "new life and new civilizations." Given alot of which kinda wanted to kill them.... but still she and her crew did all that including R&D on things like delta flyer, transwarp n that lot of things. I felt she had a good balance to between diplomatic and hostile / aggression n assertive. Seemed alot less diplomatic than Kirk but more ...assertive for lack of a better word than Picard.
If I recall the late 90's was the start of when hollywood wanted to try and make female characters appear badass, sometimes it worked other times it was just cringeworthy however in Janeways case I think they really pulled it off well. With STD The show itself is ground breaking but I just don't like Michael Burnem , I think she's entitled and full of herself, she's like a bad Tom Paris. I've only watched about 5 episodes of STD so I will go back and give it another chance, I'm hoping in the future they'll develop the characters further.
I gave a like after the federation was compared to the borg
Me too, bro
Group Vucic my comment was a month ago what’s the time stamp??
To be fair, the Borg are a tad bit more reasonable then the average sjw . Lol And I love how my keyboard corrected the b on Borg to caps, but had no problem leaving sjw's as lower case. 😂
Hell, Michael Eddington told Ben Sisko that the Federation was worse than the Borg in some ways.
Hahah! The Federation has become the Borg!
We have our politically programmed anti west agenda. Funds have been received infiltration into media net successful begining phycological warfare operation .codename. "you should feel bad about being born" Tactic 101b initiated "call names and label the majority of the population" Now hands in the air and empty your pockets." Resistance is futile logic will not save you. because we are retarded.... I mean we are the borg .
"Why? Because we've left the Federation, and that's the one thing you can't accept. Nobody leaves paradise. Everyone should want to be in the Federation. Hell, you even want the Cardassians to join. You're only sending them replicators because one day they can take their 'rightful place' on the Federation Council. You know, in some ways, you're even worse than the Borg. At least they tell you about their plans for assimilation. You're more insidious. You assimilate people and they don't even know it."
@@MKDumas1981 go be a politician, he was supposed to be talking about star trek ffs lol..
Peter Bernard: That is Star Trek.
He's completely correct, in this deplorable series that's almost as bad as its completely non-canon predecessor the Federation are going completely against their Prime Directive and setting out to bastardise, twist, dilute and destroy other cultures like missionaries do today with religious bulshit
In the original Star Trek they had multiple races working together, however they were all basically of the same culture. Sure they came from different cultural backgrounds but whether they assimilated or just came from very similar cultures, in the end they were all part of the same culture. Spoke a common language, same morals, values, etc.
True racists are rare. One of the big issues these days are people moving to new countries who refuse to assimilate, and that causes all kinds of problems. Some worse than others depending on how dissimilar their culture is. It's the cultural differences that people don't like on both sides, race usually has little to do with it. ...other than it is used as an excuse to further divide people by corrupt elites.
@Mike Forti I wondered about that too. But then all though history there have been very distinct races and languages, even among neighboring countries. Just look at Europe. So I suppose it's possible.
From a selfish point of view, I kind of hope we don't all become the same in the future. I like the differences. It's interesting and distinct. :-)
But ya, this current BS (like Discovery) is just about identity politics and very little else.
Scott Phillips well one thing i recall from tng with aliens is, the captain told worf once that do whatever as long as it doesnt affect your duties. The only time i saw him bend that rule was letting that one hot af ensign wear a piece of jewelry.
Race has everything to do with it Demographics is Destiny By the way the safest countries to live in The World are either Majority White or Asian FACT
@Mike Forti Two interesting facts about human pairing:
1. Statistically, people tend to prefer to couple with people from their own culture. This is because people from the same culture are more likely to share values.
2. Whenever different cultures co-exist in a single society, there will be intercultural couples, whether it is legal or illegal. This is never more common than in-group coupling, but it always occurs. There are various reasons why people do this and I don't want to elaborate too much. But it always happens.
@Mike Forti I've always thought that as well. The problem is , who exists today that looks like the future mixed humans? Impossible to know what our species will look like and impossible to cast.
I don't care where Star Trek: Discovery fits in the Star Trek timeline. I don't consider it cannon. I see it as apart of a separate universe like the J.J. Abrams ST movies.
It has to be a seperate universe too many
Inconsistencies imho
except that it isn't. It takes place in the prime timeline.
JJ should go down in history like the guy who put Lead in petrol and CFC gasses into spray cans... (Was the same guy lol)
@@cottonpatch2000
It can exist in the same universe as Enterprise. Not the same universe as the Original through Voyager.
@UClQMv8_grkXcjmyEtWoAvKw fuck off, Enterprise is leagues better
5 years later and I can say you hit the nail on the head with your first impression of these characters and the direction the show was going in
LOL when you think about SJW's are like the Borg, think as we do, speak as we do, dress as we do
Do as I say not as I do!
I loved (pre-discovery) Star Trek’s treatment of race: don’t talk about it. Treat them as individuals who just happen to have lighter or darker skin and hair textures. Like the old Will Smith movies.
Damn straight.
Ever seen Red Dwarf? The lead character is black, and nothing is ever made of it, ever. It's an excellent series, and if you haven't seen it, I strongly recommend it.
The left obsesses over race and gender. They are more racist than any other group yet are too blind to see it
i found the "planet of hats" treatment to be pretty racist. everyone of one race were the same. not the most open minded idea.
apparently the ferengi were originally a criticism of jews and capitalism. but even they were able to defend themselves and their way of life in the script and are one of my favorite cultures.
i love the klingon too. i guess i loved it when the show would defend the villains ("no evil race" mentality). and question the heros like it did with the occasional vulcan villain or vulcan failing. i wish the writers were comfortable enough to attack the federation more.
@@billsimms2511 nah, colorblindness is racist.
Jar Jar Abrams is almost as bad as Ruin Johnson.
Don't insult Jar Jar by comparing him to JJ Abrams
Jew Jew Abrams
“I walk into this room and it’s the most kosher fucking room! We need some diversity, let’s put some Asian actors, I’ve had it with this jewish nepotism!”
There is a reason why true star trek fans call it STD!
What annoys me about the crew interactions is that they keep saying they've worked together for seven years. Look at the TNG,DS9 and Voyager crews after seven years. They had become families. Riker never mutinied against Picard, Kira had learned to trust Sisko.
look at worf "if you were another man i would kill you right now" even worf can keep more cool .
Here’s one thing I can’t understand with liberal reactions to the Klingons and how their self-isolation is bad: why is it bad for the Klingons to live in self isolation but not bad for the Japanese during the Tokugawa Shogunate? For those who don’t know, Shogun Tokugawa Ieyasu instituted a policy of self-isolation on Japan called Sakoku, forbidding any foreigner to set foot in Japan and for any Japanese to leave. Sakoku was ended when Commodore Matthew Perry entered Tokyo Bay with four warships and demanded that Japan end its self-isolation, or America would take their country by force. We would view the actions of Commodore Perry as the actions of an imperialist warmonger, but for some reason the Federation acting in a similar way is somehow promoting diversity? I’m sorry ST:D producers, but I don’t see the Klingons as white nationalists in this situation. Instead I see the Japanese staring down the barrels of Commodore Perry’s guns.
In short, because they're not Japanese and don't live in Japan.
Your comment makes no sense. Clearly people did think Japan's self-isolation was bad, or Commodore Perry wouldn't have shown up with his warship. So the liberals of today are agreeing with the leaders of yesterday who sent Commodore Perry out to Japan in a warship.
odonnell1218 white nationalism is white people wanting a homeland where they stay the majority in a Nation they built! What is wrong with that?
odonnell1218 this channel and all of you are fucking stupid. I think Discovery sucks but I didn't expect to listen to a bunch of political shit and far right bullshit. WTF?? get a life.
It's simple: Complaining about Japan doesn't give them power. Leftists ignore gays being murdered in Iran, women being stoned or mutilated for not wearing a burka in Syria, women being kidnapped and raped by Boko Haram in Nigeria, China's mistreatment of Muslims and their own people, because that doesn't give them power where they live.
Dave: The writers may end up defeating their own points of view; wondering why the "fans" are actually empathizing more with the Klingons - like what happened to characters like Alex P. Keaton, and Archie Bunker. I believe the writers of those characters mis-read how the public would admire them instead of disliking them as the writers initially intended.
Chris Leskiw
Audience members often liked Klingon culture, and adding the best quality of the federation, individualism, to the Klingon characters will only make them more appealing.
If they wanted so badly have a "white sepramacist" race why don´t create very pale aliens like the castithans in Defiance? It is not like they were trying to be subtle or hide their progressive agenda. The funniest part is how SJWs can´t see the problem even when fans point exactly what it is.
If you look at the evidence Dave has presented, in the show creators own words, the Klingons actually look like they represent Native American Indian culture.
And as Dave said the Federation represents imperialism, or the colonialists who wiped out the Indians.
If they wanted to be truly social justice they'd have the Klingons invading Starfleet Federation territory as migrants making demands on the host culture.
As you say Chris they really don't appear to have thought through their own worldview. They are following blind ideology and it may be a massive mistake on their part. There is little intelligence to their approach. They are even showing emotional immaturity in how they're communicating with Trek fans.
Any good fiction examines different points of view in a sincere manner. It's part of what creates the friction which is needed for good dramatic stories.
Coffeeshunter hundreds of thousands of "native Americans" here in the Indian Nations will be shocked to discover they don't exist.
The only way to save the show is for the Klingons to WIN ... and kick the Federation-Borg-collectivism in the nuts. Maybe have a reveal of the leaders of the Federation being secretly Borg (after First Contact) ... just like they did in comics for Captain America and his "Nazi story arc". Star Trek does have alternate timelines ...
How did no one catch the fact that Star Trek Discovery abbreviates to STD? I guess they didn't care or were trying to tell us what they had here.
Worst crime of discovery... They had no memorable song!
Everything is horrible about the show entirely.
I like Enterprise, but that opening song is cheesy as hell.
@@eriveltomartinsbarrosjunio9022 Completely agree. It was and is a totally awful and cheesy theme song. I think though what they were trying to say with it was that it's been a long road
Getting from there to here. It's been a long time, but my time is finally near. I will see my dream come alive at last, I will touch the sky, and they're not gonna hold me down no more, no they're not gonna change my mind, no they're not gonna hold me down, cause I've got faith of the heart, I'm going where my heart will take me, I've got faith to believe
I can do anything, I've got strength of the soul, and no one's gonna bend or break me, I can reach any star, I've got faith,I've got faith, faith of the heart.
@@JohnnyZenith , the lyrics are actually quite powerful, I don't deny that. They encapsulate the whole idea behind anything ST. The melody is cheesy though.
The Federation won the war against the mighty Klingon, Romulans, and Borgs, but was vanquished by the PC dominion. RIP Star Trek
Not a Trekkie by any means, but seeing this franchise going the way of Doctor Who, Star Wars, Cartoon Network and most of the videogame franchises I loved break my heart. Like watching a wonderful legacy getting thrown in the nearest ditch.
thats how capitalism works. And for the sake of making a few idiots more rich people jump on every new train to be brainless entertainent to make the rich more rich and themselve more poor year by year
It's called society evolving too fast for some to keep up.
@@relativeparadox9567you mean regressing?
@@relativeparadox9567...correction...society devolving.
@@alantasman8273 you don't understand how this works.
It's ok.
You nailed it. STD is so distasteful, having seen every Trek episode and movie prior to this, I had to stop after the 4th episode. The effects are the ONLY bit of this show I enjoyed. I'd keep watching if I wanted to see a series about the Terran Empire.
Lol
starmanovich you should watch the whole series, it gets so good. The first 4 episodes are setting up the story. Actually the first 9 do, and then it finds its footing and is brilliant
Nickolas Canning-Battye It shouldn't take 9 episodes to "git gud" (as the gamers say); that's more than halfway through the first season. It should have been well into the meat of the story by episode 5, since that's solidly 1/3 into the season's 15-episode arc.
Dargonhuman The Next Generation took an ENTIRE season to Get Good, so did Buffy, Voyager and 90% of all series. The first series is usually just to get you to know characters and set up a bigger story.
Make STD great again!
You're not really spoiling anything when the product arrives already expired.
Before the first episode even aired, the cast did a pathetic photo shoot "taking a knee" in solidarity with the NFL "protests". That was all I needed to see. I have never watched Discovery, nor do i intend to. They lost this Trek fan before they even started.
💯%
they gained one star trek fan here! I have never watched a full episode of the older Star Treks
Woke trek
@@juiceter3981 woke trek is joke trek
If I was a member of Star Fleet during Discovery I would contact the Borg and beg to be assimilated. This show is bad, is not Trek, is not Cannon and is not good,
That’s funny
Star Trek Discovery and diversity: it is questionable why, after going to the trouble of introducing female characters of color, they chose to kill the Asian one, and make the black one a convict... as well as killing the literally black Klingon to have his position as unifier of the houses usurped by a literally white one.
Add to that Sarek, who won't talk to his Vulcan son Spock for joining the human Federation, but is proud of his adopted human daughter for joining her kind; a segregationist.
But yeah..... Diversity. -_-
You win.
Oh shut up. It's kind of hard not to have things happen to non-white races when almost everyone is. And may I point out that the two white characters also got killed? You're what gives the left a bad name. DSC is not racist (which would include anti-white). The strongest case for it being racist is that comment about someone's background referring to them being black. It does suck though.
Okay, I thought I was done, I'm not. Having something happen to non-white people is not fucking racist! Neither is having the two main characters being female anti-male nor is the majority of the cast being non-white anti-white. After all, the majority of people is non-white, and although I did not break it down, it seems like the racial makeup of the DSC cast resembles the racial makeup of earth pretty well.
Here is the list of discriminatory things series do:
- Having a token black/female/gay person to excuse all claims of discrimination
- Over a big sample, having a complete lack of diversity (unless it makes sense in context)
- Having every diverse character fit their stereotype (note: some stereotypes are fine, because some people really do act like their stereotypes)
Here is a list of things series do which are not (by themselves) discriminatory:
- Have discriminatory characters
- Having a small group share gender or race (these things happen by chance in the real world too)
- Having something happen to non-white people (guess what, stuff happens to people of every race! The thing people rightfully complain about is 'the black character being killed off', but it's the token black guy that's the main problem, not the having something happen to them)
she's dead, Jim
I wouldn't even rape her dead body.
Aurex We aren't talking about Discovery, we are talking about Star Trek
My theory is that the writers are trying to make the Burnham character as bad as humanly possible in order to explain why Spock never talked about her.
The fact that the writers are using 20th century issues for a show thats supposed to be a techno-utopia in the 23rd century just shows they don't give a shit about the actual source material.
Sadly same on Picard show... Smoke? Alcohol? Poverty? Bad language? All on the paradise planet?.........................
Because subconsciously, the Woke don't believe we ever CAN advance as a species. They even say the US in 2021 is just as racist as it was in 1921, but the racism is "covert" nowadays.🙄🤦🏾♀️
They see "progress" as if they were using tweezers to pick a few weevils out of grain so the result will be weevil-free and edible. But they're really using an ax to chop barnacles off a ship that's deep at sea. . . They'll never get all the barnacles off, before the ship sinks from the damage they're doing.
@@zxyatiywariii8 So true. The only important thing for them is to be a victim.
Put them in paradise, and they will say God stops them from progressing.
Not sure if God would have the same tolerance tough lol
To be fair, star trek VI was reflective of the cold War
And the thing is, Star Trek has ALWAYS used contemporary social issues as a template for plots, but they were very diverse ones and not galvanized into a singular agenda the whole way through
Shaka...when the walls fell.
One of the best episodes ever.
Love this 😂
Darmok and jilad at tenagra
Temba, his arms wide.
Rick Berman in diapers.
I see why they killed Axanar. It would have spelled the end of every "suit" in Paramount. Axanar is HIGH QUALITY. Just look at the introduction "Prelude to Axanar". It is impressive, great acting, and far more satisfying in its mere 20 minutes than all of Discovery. You actually came away from that 20 minute episode wanting MORE. I did watch the first season of Discovery out of curiosity. Have absolutely NO DESIRE to see anything else. The Axanar Prelude also reminded me of Babylon5 season finales or mid-season cliff-hangars- I counted the days to the next new episode. Discovery, Picard, Strange New World's, Below Decks? Don't care. IT is all garbage.
"Who are the bad guys in the story?" Exactly my thought! I was rooting for the Klingons, instantly. They had the albino outsider and they overcame minor prejudice and started seeing him based on his character and his attitude towards their cause. The Klingons are portrayed as the more understanding factions right away!
On the other side silly emotional non-vulcan Vulcan girl over there instantly wanted to start a war, trying to take over the ship, ignoring ranks, rebelling against authority she swore to abide etc.
And the best fact: The Klingons were portrayed as pretty passive at the beginning and only ongoing imperalism of the Starfleet brought them to a point, where they wanted to gather to fight back, defending their territory and culture.
Can you be more right?
Constant Colours it’s like bizzaro Star Trek.
I seem to recall the only memorable and badass scene was when the leader of the Klingons gave the federation Admiral his answer..Then the hologram of the Admiral starts scrambling and he s thrashed around and then gone..The next shot showing the Starship being smashed by a giant slowly decloakibg Klingon craft. I was definitely rooting for them as well..
Unfortunately where I live, defending your own interests, territory and culture is now 'racist'. It's called 'Brexit'.
Klingons passive. You on some kind of drugs mate. They were far from it. Tell me who attacked who when they discovered what they though was an asteroid and then turned out to be a Klingon ship. The Klingon attacked first fact. Nothing passive about them at all.
"These aren't Klingons, just fuck off." Lol. Thank you! I'm glad someone else expressed what I've been thinking, regarding this show.
Anyone remember that the first enemies of Cathrine Janeway as a Captain were called the Cardassians?
The cardashians
@@Tina.Di.Napoli there pure evil
@@thedoctor1263 lol 😂
Submit to the Federation, resistance is futile.
Remain Klingon!
So bubbly and cloy..
It's Vile!
But you know what's really frightening? If you drink enough of it, you begin to like it.
Wonko Sane: Oh you and your "Root Beer". :)
It would be cool if they would make Federation kinda bad and Klingons alsmost good, but they are not smart enough for any real depth. Stupid SJW propaganda will be everything we will see.
Terrible show. Characters are really bad and the writing is worse. I hated the way the captain always kept saying number 1, trying to get people to connect this with the TNG
Really, the captain did that? I really can't see that working with anyone that isn't Picard.
Angryenderman She certainly did. I noticed it at least once.
Pike called his second-in-command Number One in the first Star Trek pilot.
That was actually her name. She was the best her planet could produce, therefore "Number One".
I can't find your reply, but I am not kidding, it was mentioned in a book about the original series. I have that book somewhere, I think, it has been years since I read it. I would look for it but I have hundreds of books, most of them are in boxes yet from when I moved.
So, the 20k downvotes are the entirety of the ST: Discovery viewing audience? LMAO
@jamesk479 youre trying way too hard sound smart
I liked the show and the video cause I like to hear other people’s opinions on stuff
@jamesk479 I find it funny that people who like this mess of a series are just so violent and angry just because a lot of people don't like this show at all. It's weird, people like you are so often angry and hateful and so many of you are like this, and you project what you are onto everybody.
@jamesk479 Here, I'm going to be kinder and less verbose.
If people are saying "dumb sh***", tell them what that "dumb shi***" is. If you don't do this, you're not engaging with them, you're just insulting them. You might be right, but you're giving no opportunity for the other person to understand they are wrong, or to demonstrate you are wrong.
I'm pointing out that the true toxic group, are people like you. I don't need to insult you, or demean you, I'll just take issue with what you've said.
I find the current incarnations of Star Trek to be horribly written, and that the main reason "minorities" (which are absolutely fine!) are placed into lead roles is that when people inevitably complain about the lazy, incompetent, stupid writing, is that when they do, they can be denounced as racists, sexists, whatever.
This happened with GhostBusters 2016. That movie largely failed NOT because women were in the lead roles, but because the writing was terrible. It wasn't funny. It was lazy. They dependeded entirely on the name of "GhostBusters" and GhostBusters 2 wasn't that good.
And you had all the effort put in for special effects, sets, and honestly good comedians, but the writer was a complete screw up.
A low budget production, with lousy special effects can become a classic with great writers or even just competent ones.
The original series of Star Trek isn't remembered for its amazing special effects (although they WERE top of the line at the time) and it's not remembered for the amazing sets (although they did a good job within their constraints not knowing what would be available to a CONSUMER just 40 years later), it stands up, because the writing (at least for season 1 and 2) were quite good.
It's considered "campy" today, but it had quite a few thoughtful episodes. People have built recreations of the sets, CGI clones of the sets, fan fiction, blah blah blah, because they loved it. I think I'm correct in saying that's not going to happen with Discovery or Picard because the writers, are horrible. None of the stories are memorable. They have a worse understanding of science than I did when I was 10, seriously. And I'm serious.
The writers make ZERO effort in being believable within the realm of known physics or even how people would act of make decisions.
If you enjoy it, that's fine, but it's lost the technical community.
To be honest, I thought that TNG was losing the ability to be believable.
Now, there's NO science consultants (well competent ones anyhow) in the current incarnations. It's pure fantasy and they don't even care about how people would realistically react, it's just filler until the next cgi-boom-boom 'splosion sequence. If that's all people wanted, there's video games for that.
I was really hoping that when a show called DISCOVERY would go back to strange new worlds. They proposing a series called Strange New Worlds, but I don't believe them. It's a false promise.
Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on you. I've looked for the origin of the quote, it may have been created by a "low budget" science fiction show that has entered our vernacular. I don't think anything that "writers" of Discovery of Picard say will.
I take it back as I did more research.
"Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me" is from Anthony Weldon, 1651.
Writers used to be well read.
I don't like Trump myself, but dear God I wish they keep the politics out of Star Trek. It's supposed to be a positive outlook of a future with enlightenment and equality, not a grim exercise in destructive SJW beliefs.
Encounter At Farpoint introduced us to the character of Q. All that's needed to be said as to its superiority over STD's pilot I suppose.
But Star Trek has ALWAYS reflected the political situation at the time? Like LGBT issues, racial issues and so on.
Also our world is ever more fatalistic and shit so I think it reflects that, also the belief that an Organisation is not always only good or bad (like the Klingon and The Federation) is very today-ish.
And then we also need the bad evil villain TM, because yeah it's Star Trek not Game of Thrones seasons 1-5.
Star Trek was always about politics. In times like these with trump tryin to destroy democracy in the US and want to install an authoritarian regime like in Russia and Hungary the worst fears became real. I really do not like st: discovery coz of his storytelling and gender agenda, too but its a dangerous and thin line not to be misunderstood and labelled as misogynist or right-winged idiot.
@@Picking.a.name.is.hard1 How can the star trek universe have LTBG+Q-E issues ? They are set in far progressive future
Deep space nine is still one of the best trek programs and captain sisko is one of best all round characters. As a white man it never crossed my mind that he was black. Probably because the fact that he was, wasn't forced on the viewers. We just got to know him as person, warts and all.
Neither have any of the western hero types. Do you call Hercules a "Magical mediterranean"?
How can they keep the racism card if know one talks about it, racism will never go away, it's always gonna be here, and unfortunately those that don't see colour are bombarded by racial propaganda and begin to to see colour and this continues the undertones of racism through society. IT IS HERE FOREVER, it only stops when people stop talking about it.
Maybe it never crossed your mind that he was black because you weren't caught up in this white backlash taking place now. DS9 pivoted on themes such as racism, oppression and fascism. The Cardassians were a ruthless racist empire who occupied Bajor and oppressed the Bajorans. Gul Dukat made several Cardassian supremacist speeches in the show that could be lifted straight from Nazi Germany or the Confederate South. There was an episode were Sisko went back in time to the 1960s Civil Rights era and had to deal with racism. These have always been Star Trek themes. That was always Roddenberry's intention.
You're right, Joel. They have always been central themes. However, before the secular original sin of whiteness, these ideas were handled in a lot more grown-up way. There was some nuance there. There was usually a cost to taking that higher road ethically. Not this binary "with our beliefs or against them" jingoism going round hollywood. I don't think you can argue that these themes haven't been handled much more artfully in the past, given how social justice themes seem to been reduced to their least sophisticated iterations (Particularly for ST, which has kind of spearheaded those conversations on Television) I'm not sure how it's happened that writing is getting dumber rather than more subtle but it certainly has gone downhill. I'm not some hardliner for any particular political camp, but I have to agree with the consensus that using such a venerated franchise as a blunt force instrument for ideology (Rather than just idealism, and there is a noteworthy difference between the words) is sort of profane.
I definitely agree that it happens, especially with feminism. But frankly I have not seen it in this show and everyone that keeps saying it is happening is yet to provide any proof. Why exactly is this an SJW show? Because they cast a black woman? In interviews Gene Roddenberry specifically stated that he wanted not only a black person for the show, he wanted a black woman and he wanted her to be an officer. When they told him stations in the South would not carry it he basically said : "good, fuck em." What is more SJW than that?
Star Trek: Discovery: The first Trek show to feature a war between the Klingons and the Federation... and you want the Klingons to win.
The Federation is sort of like communism though...
The Federation is actually more like an ideal United States and was always intended to be so. It and Starfleet are more based on classical ideas of liberty, natural rights, republicanism, the scientific method and civic virtue (as Captain Picard always more or less insisted, making him one of televisions greatest characters, if not the greatest) than Marxism/Communism. The only reason Earth and Starfleet are without money is because tech has eradicated scarcity. There are still relatively independent states, property and even classes based on merit. In the old series they would never attempt to force a species to join the Federation or to adopt human or Federation ways. The Federation was all about protecting rights.
+Ishmael Forester i hope you are as familiar with actual history as you are with trek history
Aye, all too familiar, but I did say an ideal United States, not the real deal. The ideal was the hope of humanity for a while. Hence Star Trek.
Nearly 2 whole years later and this STILL rings true. I worry about the new Trek series in production too. The Trek we all grew up on and loved is gone. :(
nuck97 sadly, the Picard show will be terrible.
The new show is slightly better, but "it's better than Discovery" isn't saying much. Picard also seems to forget what star trek is about.
@@sirbattlecat and now we have Prodigy, and... It's actually not bad at all. Each episode manages to stand on its own in some form or fashion, it doesn't shove any political agenda down your throat and then shit in your mouth saying "YEAH, POLITICAL AGENDA". It's much more in line with the Star Trek we know and love compared to Picard and Discovery. The characters have flaws, and aren't fully in synch at the start of the show, but by the halfway point of Season 1, they've come together pretty smoothly.
Whoever's writing for Prodigy needs to keep it up, it's really good.
4 years now. I still haven't watched it.
Orville is better, ds9 is the best. Enter the badlands is better than this. 40k show when?
I like Orville better.
TMW The Tau Empire is the perfect analogy for progressives.
Ronald Macdonald democles crusade 2 now!
Adrian SH Iv actually been enjoying it and I kind of went off Seth
DS9 was absolute politically correct shit.
I just finished watching season 1 of Discovery, and it was terrible, and you are right this show is full of agenda, I never cared there was a black, or woman captain, and in fact voyager and janeway were my favorite, but Discovery is garbage, and I cant stand it.
It began just as Dave said, then fooled us for few episodes, only to wrap up back where it started with the SJW crap. Too bad, I really enjoyed the twist with Lorca. It was the only highlight, which they clearly couldn’t allow a strong, white male character to derail their “message”. These are truly dark times we live in.
You are correct.
Roman Tmetuchl i am so glad i stopped watching it after the fourth episode.
Very true that Janeway was a return to the action roots of the series and Cisco was also good. TNG though OMG that was bad. PS A GREAT actor cannot rescue terrible writing.
@@saberiandream316 dude, would you stop injecting YOUR political agenda into all of this? Every fucking comment chain....most People don't care about race and gender, as proven by the other beloved star trek installments, it's the blatant political agenda (and thus horrible writing), along the other stuff you mentioned. Hell, I'm a left leaning white man myself and I'm fed up with being labelled racist or mysogonistic all the fucking time, just because I want some proper character development instead of being lectured how evil I am. Exactly this shit is why people voted trump. I'm no us citizen and when trump got elected, all of Europe was scratching their heads how someone could vote for this disgusting man. Well, diving into the current political landscape of yours, I now know why. Not that I agree, but I see why. It's really saddening how we FORGOT to write proper badasses like Ripley, sarah connor, blade, shaft and many others across all forms of media. 1980's were more progressive than now lol
You know the like/dislike ratio is artificial, when a much greater majority of the comments are in agreement with the video. (on a channel that doesn't censor, at least that I know of)
And if Google is caught rigging the downvotes, they'll just lie through their teeth as usual "oops it was a glitch."
Yup. First thing I thought. Completely rigged by the Jewtube crew.
It’s hilarious because by mass disliking the video they give it thousands of views so mare people will see it,full counter
The comments seem to agree because (I presume) RUclips puts comments from likeminded people at the top, so everyone seems to agree with one another.
@@saberiandream316 "Passionately left" You sound like an emotional whiney beta, yucky. SJW and leftwing politics are cancer. From someone who is fairly center....
I grew up on TNG. And I loved Voyager. Not because she was a female captain. But because no matter what they faced, she kept to her principals. I admired that. There’s no one on Discovery I can get on board with.
The Klingons have been reduced to space orcs (LOTR orcs): Bland, faceless, characterless, disposable fodder for the heroes to kill.
heh,i was surprised they could levitate a coffin :D
With extremely stereotypical African facial features...
Lurtz was way cooler than any of these Klingon clowns.
When i grew up i was told that the customer is the king and you even apologise for mistkaes you didnt make. In my workplace a collegue got fired for telling a customer that he is an idiot - to be fair that customer was a moron and we all could see why he said it but you cant do that..... You have to please your audience and cater to those who like your product. Now it seems the new policy is to mock your customers, cater to those people who dont want your product, and blame your mistakes at the audience. Wow. if those hollywood guys ever had a real job they would know such behaviour would get them fired immediately
I thought The Orville was way more entertaining
The Orville is also filled with SJW crap, but little bit less then STD.
Max L A lot less. Mainly because they touch on both sides of the issue. It's ehy SJWs hate it. Makes them confront both sides. lol
So much for the Prime Directive.
Star Trek Discovery is the evil Mirror Universe.
If True, you would look at her much more willingly🤔..... But Now that i Think about it why didn't they do that 😭?!
God this show is awful. I am big Star Trek Fan. I sat for even lowest of low. I endured Nemesis and JJ flarefest. But thois was to much. I stopped at episode 5 and will no touch any more of it.
That's about how far I made it too., came to a brickwall and couldn't go past it. Which is pretty telling as I normally can't get enough Star Trek, I've seen every single episode of every series in Star Trek's history, until now. It has to be really bad for me to not be able to watch it.
I just couldn't finish episode 4. Impossible.
2 here, tried the 3rd but started halfway trough.
I watched through the entire thing... and I regret it... I kept watching and watching hoping and hoping that it will get better but it never came... this is the worst star trek ever, its not even star trek, I hate it with almost soul and wish it would burn in a fire
Kitten_Wizard Scary
This is why I stop after DS9
Yeah. I stopped after DS9 as well. Now I just rewatch the old series.
@@jasonbrown4526 I've been trying voyager......It is way better than Discovery, but no DS9.
@@JohnFreedman0 The last episode of Voyager is pretty good.
I stopped after DS9 also. STD has been such trash it made me watch Enterprise. I have STD to thank, season 3 was awesome.
@@85MasterV we should probably stop calling it std
As a watcher of Star Trek since 92 I’m glad I will never watch this series 👍
whise choice.
Dodged a bullet there mate...
Will Myname so fucking what..... go walk the dog....now think.
Im sad its bad, would have liked another good trek.
I am a fan of Star Trek since I have seen the Original series when I was five or six years old and continued to watch ever since. Which meant watching it illegally on a western tv channel, since I grew up in the GDR.
And ever since, Star Trek was a part of my life, with TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise. Not anymore, because since the movie reboot, Star Trek is pretty much dead and what we see now is a mockery of the real thing, just like a zombie which is an imitation of life.
Having seen all that was available on Netflix - I can truly, and very sadly say it really was terrible. I kept watching each episode as they were released hoping and naively expecting that it would all come together and become the enjoyable sci-fi romp that have been the stock in trade of the earlier series.
And as for the premise - a "special" starship traversing the universe using fungus and the worst "teletubbies" like animation for entry and exit of ship into and out of the "dry rot" multi-fungi-universe-bullshit - really really childlike rubbish.
Very disappointed - crestfallen - sad state of affairs.
Well, my wife and I were finally going to dive into this new Star Trek adventure. But I'm sick of being slapped in the face everywhere I turn with SJW preaching. Furthermore, since Jason Isaccs has indicated that he hates me on general principle, I think we'll forget about it.
So, it's on to Cobra Kai season 2...a much, MUCH better show!
A rare example of two leftists jews somehow redeeming a franchise, its a bloody miracle Kobra Kai.A modern day tv miracle, still I am sure they will sneak in there subversive bs as time goes on trhey cant help themselves, so far the worst thing was in season 2 making that dumb chick a random leszbo for no reason and there little Dr who is a girl now and shes bad ass bs, but as far as intolerable goes thats pretty low and so far,so far Kobra Kai is bloody fantastic.
@Random L3vel Doctor who the new one isnt even a man..so he cant be bad ass.because objective reality is still reality and a man is still a man and a woman is still a woman even if lying weirdos play make believe lol,so no the Dr who at present is literally not a "bad ass" not even a man not to mention everyone says the show has gone over the top retarded with the usual feminist/bullshit nonsense, I guess I could see how that could be funny in the context of a haha fuck you Hawk didn't see that one coming,I do get that and admittedly thats subjective.I myself though am just sick to shit of it because now a days its always always an agenda always!, I do give these two guys credit though they have done overall a great job with this show so far.
Im more upset with that annoying little turd Dimitri beating Hawk, thats beyond un realistic,cant stand that kid,anyhow great show I just really hope they dont do something super dark like have Miguel either paralyzed for life or unable to do karate again or both,I really think thatd ruin a great thing.
My bad you didnt say she was a he just that Dr who was bad ass,but regardless the new Dr who is not bad ass just an unbearable feminist bitch ya know. Wouldnt watch that garbage if someone Hollywood grabbler executive paid me to.
Loved Star Trek since I was a kid but never watched Discovery and never will.
What about the albino Klingons that get treated worse than dirt?
cool, a star trek where i get to root for the Klingons...
Neal Van Baelenberghe human by birth, klingon by choice?
He's just living his truth!
Arch Stanton So, he's trans-alien?
For me, that's Star Trek VI. I rooted for General Kang (or whatever his name was) for being so ruthless and cunning in assassinating his own chancellor and framing Kirk for it. Gotta admire him for it...he got results, and almost got away with it.
Even when playing Star Trek Online, my character was an officer in the Discovery Starfleet, every single character was either gay, lesbian, transgender, or some other edgy minority group. This would be perfectly fine if they hadn't mentioned it every time they had an opportunity to!
Captain Sisko was my favorite captain of all of the shows, and Geordi was my favorite character in TNG for a lot of it's run. I didn't even care that they were black. It literally was not relevant to me. THAT is how you make a show diverse. Write AWESOME characters and make them happen to be people of color, or women, or whatever. This normalizes these situations and changes people's perception with no pushback.
Perfectly well said. The characters just happen to be black or gay or female or male or trans… but don’t make it about that. Like when Adira tells Stamets what pronoun they prefer… what the hell? In the 23rd century they’re still going to complain about misgendering? I’m all for diversity and letting people be who they are but nobody cares what you identify as. It’s your personal thing.
The most absolutely hilarious thing is that letting Klingons "remain Klingon" IS THE ENTIRE POINT OF THE PRIME DIRECTIVE.
The dude's way of remaining Klingon was to start a war with the federation by attacking within Federation territory. Prime Directive doesn't apply.
The show perfectly illustrated how paranoid nationalist can be if not careful. The Klingons saw a treat that wasn't there in the first place. No one was seeking to take away their culture. They missed the whole point of multiculturalism, like many people in our own world do today. This is good Star Trek.
You can tell the Klingon actors are spending so much time focusing on remembering and pronouncing their stupid Klingon lines that they completely forget to act.
The way senior officers on the Discovery bitched about each other in front of subordinates like teenage valley girls disgusted me. That's not Starfleet.
I didn't even bother watching STD. I knew exactly what it would be, pure garbage, given the state of Hollyweird these days.
I took one look at how they designed the Klingons and said no thanks. Everything I continue to hear about it let's me know I was right not to bother.
0:35 The Trill Symbiont idea was actually much more closer to reincarnation rather than changing genders- the Dax Symbiont is essentially a physical form of a spirit, and Curzon, Jadzia, Ezri, etc. are the successive hosts of that spirit, which accepts whichever sex that host may be. Shoehorning it into the trans & non-binary thing(both of which only exist within one host/body) by those SJWs completely misses the point of the symbiont storyline.
Thoughts on THE ORVILLE being a better "Star Trek" show lol?
I was really surprised by it, can't wait till season 2
Yes!
It really is and they have a Star Trek executive producer
Is TV even worth watching anymore? Think I'll stick with anime
@one punch God who said anything about Fairytale? Someone seems a little but hurt. Ironic that your profile pic is a super sayan and your name is a referance to one punch man (both Animes superman sytle characters) and you accuse me of watch garbage anime........
What anime? There's only boku no hero and attack on titan, both annual series, so we have to wait a long ass time just like these TV series, lol At least, these are the only 2 I watch. Don't know if there's any other decent anime out there right now.
@@RRRRRRRRR33 one punch man and overlord are pretty great
Isn't Tron: Uprising anime?
uh..no... no it isn't.
excellent analysis. Also, how does this video get 19k down-thumbs? I doubt there are even 19k VIEWERS of the show. I wouldn't put it past the people working on the show to have created a few bots to artificially thumb this down. They're still losing. All good wishes.
Indeed. As the rating on imdb. STD apparently has 7,4 rating, however, reading the reviews on the show, most people give it 1/10
@@saberiandream316 You hate Sexually Transmitted
Diseases? :P
Well... kinda tells all you need to know about the leftists today... LOL XD
More to the point... the makers of this show really made a bad descision when even a hardcore ultraleftist cannot stand it XD true scifi-fans are true fans no matter the political stance, good for you mate ;) and thanks for actually rising my view on humanity :)
@TMPanos96 pretty sure smart people who actually like the show don't want to waste their nerves in the comment section with some fan boys that can't take the thought that not everyone thinks the same like you.
We've already had the whole "You can't be your own culture" with the Marquis, Eddington even tells Sisco that the Federation is like the Borg.
And Quark and Garek with the root beer.
@@Aurora-313 That scene is legendary!
What's wrong with Klingons wanting to stay Klingon?
Spaghett!
....Spooked ya!
Because north korea.
They don't want just that; they want everyone else whose not a Klingon.
And they'll conquer you if you don't submit.
They've never been isolationist.
Hell the main conflict with this show came from them violating federation borders.
Get woke go broke! Poor Star Trek. The show of my childhood!
Chuck Norris and Kid Rock? Seriously? Jason Isaacs never heard of John Wayne, Charlton Heston, Clint Eastwood, Sylvester Stallone, Kurt Russell, Arnold Schwarzenegger, James Woods, Mel Gibson, Bruce Willis and Vince Vaughn? Odd because he's acted with several of them.
It's too bad someone so hot is so hateful.
Wayne's been dead since the 70's, Heston in 2008, Eastwood's chair speech kind of ended his support, Stallone says he’s not a member of the GOP but votes whoever is best, Russell is "a hardcore libertarian.", Arnold Schwarzenegger did not vote Republican for the first time since 1983.
The last 4 tho are GOP supporters, but none as vocal about it as Chuck Norris is. If you were to say I'm going to vote the same as Vince Vaughn, most people would think you mean liberal. James Wood is kind of known as the Obama Troll along with Trump, but Bruce and Mel are just republicans, Mel's not even raised in USA like Chuck Norris or Kid Rock. None of them really embody the 'deep south' core of 'Confederate America' supporters either.
So a lot of your examples are good examples of Republicans, but the other half are just your typical Republicans hardliners, none of them really embody the type of people that Trump Rally's and the alt-right and people at Charlotteville know and support. There's nothing wrong with the GOP, but they court the vote of some weird fucking people, let's just say. It's more about WHY he chose those guys, then forgot about John Wayne, who's dead.
@ghenulo Ya wonder why a black women would have so much hate in USA, you'd almost think that she was bitter about something??? As a white guy, I don't see any issues.
Yes, because Antifa, BLM and giraffe neck professors are normal right?
Clifford Wolfenstein its becuz you raycis
I don't care about race. The race baiters say that is racist.
Nobody would say that and honestly watching Discovery RACE is the least of its problems. I still liked it.
@@Picking.a.name.is.hard1 exactly lol. It's fine, they all get a kick out of victimising themselves.
The Orville looks WAY more fun!
It is. I've watched it. Went into it with a lot skepticism too and came away with "that wasn't half bad". More Star Trek than Star Trek.
It is. I mean, its still Mcfarlane so you gotta accept a certain amount of stupid jokes, but the show is fun.
spoiler; It is.
i cant believe Orville is better than a long running franchise... oh wait that's not that hard to believe anymore
Episode 4 was really good. They even threw in a Hollywood superstar cameo. :)
Orville, is good ,
I really liked the 3rd episode about the baby being female , but being made into a male
It did not feel pushed or rammed down your neck. It was a good story
It touched on gender issues, but since the baby was a baby and, using progressive usage of the term, couldn't yet have a "gender" (not to mention the Moclans being a primarily single-gender species unlike humans), the parallels to real-world trans issues were inherently limited.
It seemed to me to touch on several topics, from simple chauvinistic sexism to the definition of disabilities to parental and governmental coercion.
I actually thought it handled things quite well, and more artfully than I'd feared. (I enjoyed the first two episodes and was not wanting to be disappointed with ep 3).
To be fair, the security of computers in Star Trek was always ridiculously bad.
You nailed it mate, I have watched Star Trek all my life, I'm 38. My favourite is DS9 and never thought of Sisco as a "Black Man" he was an awesome Captain!
How about the episode that focused directly on him being black, living in the past as a science fiction writer?
Nope, your take on this train wreck of a show is spot on!! Watched like 10 minutes of it, yes, the first officer is just DAMNED ANNOYING. Turned it off, haven't gone near it since...and don't plan on it.
"I'm sorry, but...just...these aren't Klingons. Just fuck off." Truer words never spoken and all! Get 'em, Dave!!!!
"chaq DaHjaj QaQ jaj … cha' qIl!"
(Perhaps today is a good day to . . . cancel this show!)
Dilios the Greek "MEV"
Q’pla! Make the Klingon empire great again!
QAPLA ALSO FRIEND
It feels like every generic drama out there nowadays, with an emphasis on violence, melodrama, and action. People watch a Star Trek show to see intellectual things like diplomacy, well-written characters, a utopian sci-fi universe, and some occasional interesting plots on the various planets they visit.
You know - this video is almost a year old... and I still pull it out and watch it because it is SOOO dead on correct even after the completion of the first season.
Just binge watched the first 6 episodes; you nailed it in every regard. I could not identify with any of the characters; they were weird, dark and distasteful. And though I’m a white male, I always liked Cisco, Janeway, Worf and others in the past shows. I will nevertheless watch the show but be assured, it is only because I’m. Sci Fi geek and appreciate the special effects and future tech but sadly, it is not to see any of the characters. These humans are mor alien than some of the aliens. Man did they miss the boat with not doing a Titan series with Riker as captain. There was a relatable character (and the CHARACTER would’ve been relatable in any ethnicity or gender). Discovery is pretty much STINO (Star Trek in name only). In closing, this is all just my opinion; I hope there are others out there who find the show more engaging because despite its perceived shortcomings, it’s better than no Trek.
If you thought the first two episodes of STD were bad, wait till you see the second season. 😂😂
I felt the same way after the first 2 seasons of TNG when Tasha Yar was killed by a talking puddle of black goo, Wesley Crusher fell in love with a girl that turned into a giant turd, and Data's evil twin tried to feed the Enterprise to an alien that resembled a broken chandelier. lol. Most ST shows are not good out-of-the gate. Loved DSC's second season.
Kenneth Baker true tng and tos had bad episodes but they always still had a Star Trek 'family' feel, in a cosy, well established Star Trek universe. STD has none of that. All of the crew are unlikeable. It's very disappointing & sad to an old Trekkie who grew up with tos, loved tng & voyager, not so keen on ds9 or enterprise but even they were infinitely better than STD!
@@Shimmy246 It took TIME to establish that "family feel", and it didn';t happen after 2 seasons. You're comparing a show that had 178 episodes to a show that has had 29. TNG was "almost unwatchable" after it's first 2 seasons (writer Ron Moore's words, not mine). I remember going to a Star Trek convention in 1989, and fans were BOOING TNG. james Doohan raised both of his hands and said, "Hey, let's give the new show a chance". LOL. Fans had the same exact complaints about EACH ST show during their earl years as they have about Discovery.
How fitting this show is called *STD*
Maan,putting the sjw shit to the side,the writing is so baad.
I'm a Native American, and the writing, acting, production design, costumes and MAKEUP, suuuuuck on this show. It's shite. One of the great strengths of star trek has always been, as you say, a more subtle diversity, as if OHMYGOD the future actually got past these things. This kind of heavy handed, lazy writing TOTALLY dates this show and it will not be rewatched a few years from now. The original and TNG stories are often timeless.
NPCs destroy everything they touch.
Non player characters?
You’re brilliant mate. I agree with you 1000%. Discovery is truly the worst series of Star Trek ever made. Total garbage.
No one should like STD.
When they cast a black woman in the original series they did it with a different spirit than they do those sorts of things now. It's more about hate and exclusion than love and inclusion.
The Klingon's are truly appalling. It's time to #MKGA. Make Klingon's great again!
make kangz great again
they are deplorable!
-Make STD great again!- ... impossible!
I didn’t leave Star Trek, Star Trek left me.
let's get t-shirts made a great logo showing your favourite character with a tear in his/her eye and the inscription I didn’t leave Star Trek, Star Trek left me.
Star Trek... left you... what does that even mean?
You became a right-winger which is why you no longer it. Star Trek is left-wing like it's always been.
+Mike Maher Which means that Star Trek was never for you to begin with. Good riddance.
good reply every time someone disagrees with STD just say good riddance instead of trying to change there opinion. it will make for great viewing figures