Understanding the finger and the moon has contextualized so much of from soft in a way I could feel but not articulate. I could feel it being tied to something within Shinto or Buddhism but I didn’t know what. Thank you very much.
When you mentioned "the Moon in a Dewdrop" it immediately made me think of Metyr staring into the Microcosm to search for messages from the Greater Will. I wonder whether she too searched for enlightenment.
"I've seen your kind, time and time again. Every fleeing man must be caught. Every secret must be unearthed. Such is the conceit of the self-proclaimed seeker of truth. But in the end, you lack the stomach. For the agony you'll bring upon yourself..." Sir Vilhelm.
This video was anonymously and randomly recommended to me now since I love all things dark, gothic, and strugglers alike 😌😎🙏 thank you RUclips for doing something right for once.
Hey, I really enjoyed the video! On the topic of seeing the moon and enlightenment, what do you think of the Brain of Mensis being hoisted up into the sky and seeing the moon, but still being a big dummy?
You put these ideas in a very, very nice way. It's also quite interesting to see the lessons from this "finger vs moon" popping up in other situations outside of From. It sounds so obvious with the moon analogy but it can be so insidious that someone sinks so much effort into a process that they let go of the very goal they had to begin with, as it would require eventually leaving the process. Lots of food for thought for sure
It's mind blowing how these themes go all the way back to kings field 1. I used to think of the moonlight sword as a nostalgic in-joke sort of thing they put in every game just because. It's wild to see how consistent it's been as a thematic symbol.
I thoroughly enjoy the more philosophical and spiritual approach to observing From's world building. With the Madness aspect of From's worlds being one of the elements that fascinates me most, I greatly look forward to seeing what you have to say on the topic.
I think people argue so much about the how’s and why’s that very few lore channels seem to actually do any story analysis. I think the philosophical and spiritual themes of fromsoft games are pretty obvious even with relatively little understandings of the stories. All though I tend to think about similar themes through out my day to day life. So it may only seem obvious to me who’s prone to noticing said themes.
The Valley of Defilement is still conceptually the most interesting area in all the Soulsborne games. The specific level geometry with paths and enemy placement could of course have been done much better. But the environmental storytelling and the narrative associated with it are still the most fascinating.
On revisiting this video, I don't think I praised this enough. Your metaphor of pointing at the moon helped recontextualize a game I've been closely examining for years. Thank you sir, for bringing new light to often- overlooked corners.
I like looking at their games as they explore these themes over and over and how they shift the general stories around them more than I enjoy the plot points.
I remembered a lot of the plot in AC Nexus revolves around corporations fighting over a mine they all want in order to extract technnological resources of a previous era, only for said resources to end up bringing the destruction of the world due to the corporations incessant search for more technologies that should have probably been left dormant or buried. Also, regarding ACVI, it could be argued that when Coral is used as a fuel resource, it is deprived of its natural tendency to ascend to the atmosphere and unify until it eventually gains sentience, achieving, for all practical effects, a sort of enlightenment for its own species, and "Liberator of Rubicon" might be about the idea of Rubiconians achieving enlightenment by co-existing with the Coral in the planet. Prof. Nagai feared the uncertainty of Coral continuing it's life cycle because he concluded large quantities of Coral could burn or produce a Singularity, instead of the real product: Achieving sentience and creating entities like Ayre. This was a possibility we know he never considered.
Man I just love watching your videos. I always thought that when you eat the three or 4(?) ambilical cords and kill the moon presence you ascend to become the next moon presence.
This is an inspiration. I am currently writing a dissertation about how games communicate these philosophical ideas, so this is a great example. I do wonder, though, whether the Moon is as positive a symbol as you claim. The moon is often an omen of evil. I think of how in Sekiro it hangs over Genichiro’s shoulder in the introduction, or how it led Ludwig to hell, or how the knight who previously wielded it in Demon’s Souls met a terrible end in the Valley of Defilement. The Moonlight Greatsword seems cursed, not blessed. I don’t think it is as easy to get around this by saying they were looking at the finger, not the moon. Ludwig in particular was in direct communion with the moon.
I'm really appreciating all the latest videos on fromsoft themes, the quality of this channel is always growing and shows a deeper knowledge than the average lore video (also you keep using footage of OG demons instead of the remake, thats based asf, og demons FTW!)
I kind of expected some talk about Gwyndolin at some point. He is after all, the character that comes to mind most readily when thinking about the moon and fromsoft? And he doesn't really fit the enlightenment idea, if anything he obscures the truth and punishes those who seek it
he is the Seath of the Era that bore him. They are both mortal moon coded sorcerers, blessed by the era's (Dragon Era/ FIre Era) to NOT be bound to the characteristic features of it (Seath is mortal, Gwyndolin is beyond a strict boundayr unlike older siblings which are a warrior god (masculine) and fertility goddess (feminine). As the era end, it creates Seath and Gwyndolin to signal the end, and they are free'd from the burden and impositions of it so they can focus on the moon they have a natural affinity to and gain enlightenment and ascend. But both are fixed on the cycle. Seath goes mad trying to gain the immortailty he was blessed to not have. Gwyndolin is the final true believer of his father's order. Sorry about the rambly framing, it's late where I am, hope it makes sense :) Basically, they are moon-coded, but they are too attached to the era's that made them, to escape.
Weeeeell, since you asked so nicely, I GUESS I can praise the moon, just this once. 🌕 FR tho, I think these kinds of analysises... analyses? that explore the philosophical and cultural implications of Fromsoft games honestly do so much to help me grapple with what the fuck these games are going on about. Great job, Mr. Aesthetics!
31:27 Tangentially related, I realized after hearing that, the best explanation why the Left-Right Game broke the Journalist’s mind was because she couldn’t do that.
Another excellent video. You have touched on certain philosophical points delicately yet on the surface level and I like it. Delve any deeper and this video could end up being three hours and risk losing the attention span of the audience. Once again good job on feeding the audience a piece wise meal.
If the moon is a stand-in for enlightenment, then what do you think the dark moon stand-in is for? I bring this up because it has been used in both Dark Souls and Elden Ring, so it is a theme Fromsoft use rather than it being a one off thing.
The Moon has cycles and the Darkmoon is simultaneously an end and a beginning. Those who are tuned to it can do anything and go anywhere (It compeltely resets every stat in DeS (heals everything), it's the mark of Gwyndolin, the blank slate and possibility to do anything is Ranni's ending, etc
@@AesirAesthetics So basically the dark moon is the representation of our IRL new moon. While I agree, is rebirth (end and beginning) really the opposite to enlightenment? I would have thought ignorance is the opposite of enlightenment, unless ignorance is an aspect of rebirth?
@@slightlytwistedagain I dont think the Darkmoon is the opposite of Enlightenment, I think you're right on the nail with ignorance being the opposite. Ignorance, Aversion and Attachment
@@AesirAesthetics Well the thing is if the dark moon doesn't have ignorance, then the other opposite to the moon would be the sun as both are celestial and go in cycles (they effectively dance around one another). The reason I think the dark moon would be ignorance is that rebirth is being born anew, and all newborns (babies) are ignorant to the world they have just arrived in. You also have with old age losing your faculties, and thus losing your memories is becoming ignorant of the world again. I do feel like this is communicated in Ranni's ending. She appears to embrace the unknown, the frontier which can be classed as ignorance.
nothing like starting your day with an Aesir video. Remember some of us drink tea instead,Aesir! XD EDIT:Also your links for Sinclaire and Lokey are formatted wrong and not working.
the finger pointing at the moon and the fool looking at the finger is not a “buddhist philosophy” its a very very old concept that exists in arabic literature and the true origin of it is unknown but people tend to say anything old is buddhist for some reason.
I say it's Buddhist because of the many Buddhist writings I found on it. dogeninstitute.wordpress.com/2021/09/26/ryokan-interpreted-finger-pointing-at-the-moon/ Heres a random one, you can find many more if you use google
![Madness • Themes of From Software [3]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/AFL0XIKr2po/mqdefault.jpg)
![Madness • Themes of From Software [3]](/img/tr.png)
![Kegare • Themes of From Software [1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/H4wI5ffJGbA/mqdefault.jpg)
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
If Mensis could not elevate themselves, they decided luring the moon down to them was good enough; this was their greatest mistake.
Understanding the finger and the moon has contextualized so much of from soft in a way I could feel but not articulate. I could feel it being tied to something within Shinto or Buddhism but I didn’t know what. Thank you very much.
glad you enjoyed :)
Hope fully you'll watch the thrid Themes of Fromsoft video where I go into the Three Fingers and Madness
When you mentioned "the Moon in a Dewdrop" it immediately made me think of Metyr staring into the Microcosm to search for messages from the Greater Will. I wonder whether she too searched for enlightenment.
Metyr is a giant kegare centipede made of fingers underneath a body of water.
Does the body of water act as a bulwark?
@@AesirAesthetics It acts as a bulwark to avoid him feeling the vermin part and giving up for good, going mad (taking a queue from video 3)
The moon 🌙 🌝 amirite?
Like moths to a flame 🌬️🦋🌞
This is right up there with Charred Thermos' Agony of Effort series as eye-opening works of brilliant analysis
:)
Clicked instantly, faster than a bad ganker disconnecting
Alt+F4 true combo
"I've seen your kind, time and time again. Every fleeing man must be caught. Every secret must be unearthed. Such is the conceit of the self-proclaimed seeker of truth. But in the end, you lack the stomach. For the agony you'll bring upon yourself..."
Sir Vilhelm.
An absolute masterclass. It's a stop everything moment when aesir uploads
:)
One of the best Fromsoft videos I've watched in years.
"Artorias can't see the moon because it's daytime." Is SENDING me
Thank you RUclips algorithm. An hour of this is heaven.
Hope you enjoy!
This video was anonymously and randomly recommended to me now since I love all things dark, gothic, and strugglers alike 😌😎🙏 thank you RUclips for doing something right for once.
Hey, I really enjoyed the video! On the topic of seeing the moon and enlightenment, what do you think of the Brain of Mensis being hoisted up into the sky and seeing the moon, but still being a big dummy?
I like that.
I also liek the idea of the Brain as an artificial moon which makes you insane if you stare at it
You put these ideas in a very, very nice way. It's also quite interesting to see the lessons from this "finger vs moon" popping up in other situations outside of From. It sounds so obvious with the moon analogy but it can be so insidious that someone sinks so much effort into a process that they let go of the very goal they had to begin with, as it would require eventually leaving the process. Lots of food for thought for sure
:)
One of the greatest analysis I have ever come across. Praise the Moon
thank you 🌝
It's mind blowing how these themes go all the way back to kings field 1. I used to think of the moonlight sword as a nostalgic in-joke sort of thing they put in every game just because. It's wild to see how consistent it's been as a thematic symbol.
🌝
Really excited to hear you're doing a Shadow Tower video with Casitive, I love the King's Field video you two did!
Us too!
IT'S ENLIGHTENMENT TIME LET'S GO
babe wake up aesir posted
did she wake up?
@@AesirAesthetics im babe unto myself, and i indeed awoke from my hive of slumber
That Moonlight Greatsword image was amazing 😂😂😂. Love what you're doing, brother
Now I wonder what the Japanese term for Insight is.
The English "Insight" is such a wonderful term for Bloodborne. Seeing inside.
I thoroughly enjoy the more philosophical and spiritual approach to observing From's world building.
With the Madness aspect of From's worlds being one of the elements that fascinates me most, I greatly look forward to seeing what you have to say on the topic.
I think people argue so much about the how’s and why’s that very few lore channels seem to actually do any story analysis. I think the philosophical and spiritual themes of fromsoft games are pretty obvious even with relatively little understandings of the stories. All though I tend to think about similar themes through out my day to day life. So it may only seem obvious to me who’s prone to noticing said themes.
The Valley of Defilement is still conceptually the most interesting area in all the Soulsborne games. The specific level geometry with paths and enemy placement could of course have been done much better. But the environmental storytelling and the narrative associated with it are still the most fascinating.
I agree
Great scholarly work, Aesir, this was really informative and interesting to watch and listen to and I can't wait for the next one!
PEAK. Can’t wait for part 3
Aesir, this was a really beautifully written, thought-provoking essay. Good work all around!
Thank you :)
Here's hoping the next 3 "Themes of Fromsoft" videos also deliver 🤞
On revisiting this video, I don't think I praised this enough. Your metaphor of pointing at the moon helped recontextualize a game I've been closely examining for years. Thank you sir, for bringing new light to often- overlooked corners.
Sooo, Count Ymir rejecting the moon for the finger(s) does kinda give the opposite impression of his quest
I like looking at their games as they explore these themes over and over and how they shift the general stories around them more than I enjoy the plot points.
Keep these coming man these are great
I remembered a lot of the plot in AC Nexus revolves around corporations fighting over a mine they all want in order to extract technnological resources of a previous era, only for said resources to end up bringing the destruction of the world due to the corporations incessant search for more technologies that should have probably been left dormant or buried.
Also, regarding ACVI, it could be argued that when Coral is used as a fuel resource, it is deprived of its natural tendency to ascend to the atmosphere and unify until it eventually gains sentience, achieving, for all practical effects, a sort of enlightenment for its own species, and "Liberator of Rubicon" might be about the idea of Rubiconians achieving enlightenment by co-existing with the Coral in the planet.
Prof. Nagai feared the uncertainty of Coral continuing it's life cycle because he concluded large quantities of Coral could burn or produce a Singularity, instead of the real product: Achieving sentience and creating entities like Ayre. This was a possibility we know he never considered.
26:54 high res icon was too hard to find. Much like true enlightenment.
It makes my head shudder uncontrollably
@@AesirAesthetics i wish i could say that ms paint mgs gave me conniptions... but it didnt :)
Man I just love watching your videos.
I always thought that when you eat the three or 4(?) ambilical cords and kill the moon presence you ascend to become the next moon presence.
This is an inspiration. I am currently writing a dissertation about how games communicate these philosophical ideas, so this is a great example.
I do wonder, though, whether the Moon is as positive a symbol as you claim. The moon is often an omen of evil. I think of how in Sekiro it hangs over Genichiro’s shoulder in the introduction, or how it led Ludwig to hell, or how the knight who previously wielded it in Demon’s Souls met a terrible end in the Valley of Defilement. The Moonlight Greatsword seems cursed, not blessed.
I don’t think it is as easy to get around this by saying they were looking at the finger, not the moon. Ludwig in particular was in direct communion with the moon.
Fantastic stuff
thank you:)
always a pleasure to see a new vid here
:)
Omg. I clicked on the notification faster than James stuck his hand around the ubend!
:)
Excellent videos Sir!!! Your a top tier creator imo! You have a great future on the horizon
Thank you
😎👉👉
I'm really appreciating all the latest videos on fromsoft themes, the quality of this channel is always growing and shows a deeper knowledge than the average lore video (also you keep using footage of OG demons instead of the remake, thats based asf, og demons FTW!)
og DeS is only DeS
"Everything is because of the moon", i saved you guys over an hour!
Ah man, I watch this now and I remind myself how much I loved bloodborne back in my early 20s
You just had to upload this the day after my flight! I had to rewatch your old videos lol
lol
I kind of expected some talk about Gwyndolin at some point. He is after all, the character that comes to mind most readily when thinking about the moon and fromsoft? And he doesn't really fit the enlightenment idea, if anything he obscures the truth and punishes those who seek it
he is the Seath of the Era that bore him.
They are both mortal moon coded sorcerers, blessed by the era's (Dragon Era/ FIre Era) to NOT be bound to the characteristic features of it (Seath is mortal, Gwyndolin is beyond a strict boundayr unlike older siblings which are a warrior god (masculine) and fertility goddess (feminine).
As the era end, it creates Seath and Gwyndolin to signal the end, and they are free'd from the burden and impositions of it so they can focus on the moon they have a natural affinity to and gain enlightenment and ascend.
But both are fixed on the cycle.
Seath goes mad trying to gain the immortailty he was blessed to not have.
Gwyndolin is the final true believer of his father's order.
Sorry about the rambly framing, it's late where I am, hope it makes sense :)
Basically, they are moon-coded, but they are too attached to the era's that made them, to escape.
Great work as always
thank you 🌝
Really enjoyed the video, thank you!
thank you :)
Weeeeell, since you asked so nicely, I GUESS I can praise the moon, just this once. 🌕
FR tho, I think these kinds of analysises... analyses? that explore the philosophical and cultural implications of Fromsoft games honestly do so much to help me grapple with what the fuck these games are going on about. Great job, Mr. Aesthetics!
Thank you :)
31:27 Tangentially related, I realized after hearing that, the best explanation why the Left-Right Game broke the Journalist’s mind was because she couldn’t do that.
Another excellent video. You have touched on certain philosophical points delicately yet on the surface level and I like it. Delve any deeper and this video could end up being three hours and risk losing the attention span of the audience. Once again good job on feeding the audience a piece wise meal.
Praise the moon! \[T]/
\🌝/
I was familiar with Kegare, albeit to a lesser degree than the earlier vid. This one was all new though. Good work.
"The guidance rune and the beast rune are the same rune" Ah shit now I gotta replay bloodborne
:)
this just keeps getting better and we have 3 more to go!
hype!
@AesirAesthetics hype indeed 😂
Brother you have some of the best shit out. Keep going it gets me giddy when a new video drops 👊
:D
Praise your videos!
thank you fren :)
Those were the two obvious themes. Really curious about the next three.
Silent Hill 3 in my Fromsoft analysis video? It just doesn't get better than this.
I aim to please :)
So Bloodborne is a gothic horror story, disguised as an eldtritch horror story, disguised as a gothic horror story
yes
Banger
Great stuff !! 🌝
Here we go
If the moon is a stand-in for enlightenment, then what do you think the dark moon stand-in is for? I bring this up because it has been used in both Dark Souls and Elden Ring, so it is a theme Fromsoft use rather than it being a one off thing.
The Moon has cycles and the Darkmoon is simultaneously an end and a beginning.
Those who are tuned to it can do anything and go anywhere (It compeltely resets every stat in DeS (heals everything), it's the mark of Gwyndolin, the blank slate and possibility to do anything is Ranni's ending, etc
@@AesirAesthetics So basically the dark moon is the representation of our IRL new moon. While I agree, is rebirth (end and beginning) really the opposite to enlightenment? I would have thought ignorance is the opposite of enlightenment, unless ignorance is an aspect of rebirth?
@@slightlytwistedagain I dont think the Darkmoon is the opposite of Enlightenment, I think you're right on the nail with ignorance being the opposite.
Ignorance, Aversion and Attachment
@@AesirAesthetics Well the thing is if the dark moon doesn't have ignorance, then the other opposite to the moon would be the sun as both are celestial and go in cycles (they effectively dance around one another). The reason I think the dark moon would be ignorance is that rebirth is being born anew, and all newborns (babies) are ignorant to the world they have just arrived in. You also have with old age losing your faculties, and thus losing your memories is becoming ignorant of the world again. I do feel like this is communicated in Ranni's ending. She appears to embrace the unknown, the frontier which can be classed as ignorance.
"I'll punish you in the name of the Moon!" - someone from Fromsoftware, probably...
Red moon pilled & beast
I need MORE
YOOOO 🎉🎉🎉
ENLIGHTENMENT!
🌝
Great googly moogly. It's Aesir!
it me!
Anybody know the music playing around 20:00?
Demon's Souls - Fool's Idol
praise the moon
🌝
"my guiding moonlight"
nothing like starting your day with an Aesir video. Remember some of us drink tea instead,Aesir! XD
EDIT:Also your links for Sinclaire and Lokey are formatted wrong and not working.
I hat ewhen the links dont work!
Does big hat Logan's hat look like an eclipse when seen from above? Is that a stretch?
maybe
More support for the idea that Bloodborne is conceptually much closer tied to Demon's Souls than any other of the games.
Have you tried Deracine and what are your thoughts about it?
Not yet, but channel friend @casitive has a great video on it
53:00 or so
The Comment section and the first viewers are one. "The notification gang".
Praise the moon
🌝
the finger pointing at the moon and the fool looking at the finger is not a “buddhist philosophy” its a very very old concept that exists in arabic literature and the true origin of it is unknown but people tend to say anything old is buddhist for some reason.
I say it's Buddhist because of the many Buddhist writings I found on it.
dogeninstitute.wordpress.com/2021/09/26/ryokan-interpreted-finger-pointing-at-the-moon/
Heres a random one, you can find many more if you use google
SUR LA LUNE
🌝🥖
I need more insight!
next month: "Madness"
that's not enlightment, that's aufklärung
Grass supremacy gang where you at
we still here
Babe wake up
did she wake up?
@@AesirAesthetics she awakened
Based?
😉
@@AesirAestheticsAlways making the good stuff Æsir. Keep at it mate 🫡
Praise the Moon! \[T]/
Praise the moon
🌝