Again, THANK YOU Geoff for doing this interview with Steve. It desperately needed to be done, and I’m so happy you gave this man a full 1-hour+ video interview. I met Steve for the first time in-person at this same National. I actually bought a PSA 7 MJ 101 (I showed you on the show floor, but you were pretty busy, not sure if you recall). The 101 is a card I always wanted, but I wanted to get one in-person, and have that experience. Buying it from Steve Taft at the National was a really cool experience I’ll cherish forever. As a collector myself since 1986 when I was 8, growing up in Chicago, the Star 101 has always to my Generation & demographic been the TRUE Rookie Card. Steve is an amazing wealth of info on not only Star Basketball but Basketball cards in general. Also, the 101 isnt the only Star Card that deserves recognition, theres several Jordans that do, but theres also many of the original Dream Teamer’s legitimate first Rookies as well, we forget that Drexler, Nique Wilkins, Ewing, Olajuwon, Barkley, and Isiah Thomas’ that predate the 86 fleer set by 4 years! Even John Stockton, who most believe has his rookie in 1988 fleer, is in the 1984-85 Star set! Amazing interview, Thank you for putting this out there for the public to understand the truth!
I think the STAR is the true rookie. I’m definitely adding a few to my collection in my lifetime. I love that these cards were not printed by the million. If Fleer didn’t want to support the hobby in 1985, they lose that RC spot.
@@Robertj1214 Maybe for those who already bought the card years ago. Most people are struggling to even live, let alone afford to buy a piece of cardboard for five or six-figures.
@@vintagecollector5340 how do you explain the stock market at all time highs. Ppl buy, as far as the 84 star 101 goes it’s a vg investment right now. Over 40,000 fleets compared to 3,000 stars. Psa started grading them about a year ago. They’re scarce.
This was the best interview ever, Geoff. I actually purchased a PSA 7 Jordan Star 101 from Steve, at the National. In fact I spent more time at his booth than anywhere else, looking at his amazing display of Star & unique Basketball cards. He was so pleasant & took the time to lecture on the history of everything. He even had licensed Pro-Set Basketball prototypes from 1990 with Jordan. They looked amazing and now I’m definitely going to look for one for my collection..
For all those that say this isnt the rookie because of the "distribution" not being in a pack...ok then what if star continued to have the license until 2003 and then panini came along and printed a jordan card with him in his wizards uniform but you were able to buy that panini card in pack form. Are you going to try and tell me that the panini card would be considered his rookie in my example??? I think not.
If James Beckett, as Steve directly pointed out, did not change his original designation for the 101 from RC to XRC (for some reason) then we would not even be having a debate. The star 101 would be without question be considered the RC and the 86 Fleer a third year card or First Fleer card of MJ. By the way, the story goes that Beckett only changed the designation because if the advertising dollars they were getting from Fleer thus pressure from Fleer.
I bought the 83 set in team bags from the back of a Magazine...with the Drexler, I. Thomas & Dominique Rookies. Wish I would've continued to buy thru 86 but alas, so I never owned the Jordan Rookie. So few know what they are talking about when it comes to the Star cards so I like this guy.
Hats off to Geoff Wilson and Steve Taft for producing this long overdue video about the Star brand. I value the education, awareness, and rumor squashing/myth debunking regarding these important and highly relevant cards about the golden years of NBA history. Geoff Wilson, THANK YOU!!
Great educational video and Steve Taft is a true legend in our hobby! It’s a no brainer that the very rare MJ 1984 Star 101 is MJ’s True Rookie card issued as his First base card in his First fully licensed NBA set released during his True Rookie year, so case closed! Dr. Beckett is another legend in our hobby, but if he didn’t make the big mistake of misrepresenting the great MJ 84 Star 101 card as an incorrect XRC in his 1990’s Beckett price guides then there would be No debate! In the near future these very rare Star basketball True Rookie cards of some of the All-Time great basketball legends will skyrocket in value, because of very low supply and much more demand once collectors/investors continue to get properly educated on how special they are to basketball history!
This man is a treasure for NBA fan particularly if you grew up in this time or after when the dream team ruled the sports world.... A true treasure trove of knowledge, hopefully we hear more, I'd love to show him some of mine... Never had big bucks but I have a few and a team bag
Saved this to a favorites playlist. Definitely one I'll be referring back to at some point years down the line. I was hoping he talked about the Crunch N Much set. That one was always so unique to me and how branding with food companies (Entenmann's included) became a thing with sports cards.
I remember buying the 84-85 team bags from a card dealer at a local flea market back in the day. They were a really fresh design compared to the traditional designs of the day. I've always seen this as the true rookie.
This is definitely the best episode the Star cards are a beautiful design with great photography. To get to listen to someone with a wealth of 1st hand knowledge speak about them is a pleasure.
Steve sure knows his basketball! Totally agree that Magic and Bird don’t get the true appreciation they deserve in the hobby. Seems like there’s more collectors of Penny Hardaway than these 2 legends who saved the NBA 🤔
The first set to print an athlete's rookie card is the true rookie card. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. It's not about how you feel that constitutes a rookie card. Facts don't care about your feelings. If a athlete's first rookie card comes in the Panini Instant set, that's the true rookie card.
Right on. All the caveats of regional distribution, pack-pulled, etc., are irrelevant. The first card is the first card -- and that is the true rookie card.
So if someone prints 10 cards (under license) first and sells them to 10 of his friends, you're saying that's the true rookie card? How can it be if there is no distribution? I think the Star card is his true rookie. But my earlier scenario i don't think would qualify as a rookie
Geoff doesn’t realise he’s getting caught up in the systematic pumping of these cards by a small group (who own the majority of the cards) of heavily invested Star card owners . Goes to show - doesn’t matter if it’s stock / cards / shoes , everything can be manipulated through hype .
Great interview. Loved hearing about the history of these sets. Hope to see more like this before this type of history is lost. Imagine if you could interview the person who dumped all of the 1952 Topps cases in the ocean!! 😂
This is a chicken or the egg debate. Star owners are trying to pump their values, Fleer owners are trying to retain value of their cards. Collect what you like and can afford. Both cards are awesome. Enough with trying to influence for your gain
Hey Geoff this interview is awesome, I have an idea, is there anyway you can get interviews with the creators of sets for example prizm, optic, topps black, origins etc.? It’s hard to believe that those sets dont have an artist behind them and this could bring more attention and appeal to different sets.
Star cards were the true rookie cards! I think beckett needs to reconsider that XRC for all those great rookies. These cards were true, and very limited unlike fleer. Maybe they should consider that 86-87 fleer mj card an XRC instead. Awesome interview with taft, cant wait to see if PSA starts grading sealed star bags. I just might send in a few myself...
I don’t collect basketball cards anymore, but it is always interesting hearing the history of different sets in the hobby. Especially from someone who is so well versed in the subject
Great interview. Luckily his still with us to share the knowledge. We lost a lot of people during the Covid-19 years. Hopefully his with us many more years
the 86 fleer card just looks better than the star cards, the real problem was the scandal of with the STAR company is why it was devalued compared to the FLEER set.
Another point that I would like to make is what if Star went out a business like it did and then no trading card company picked up the NBA license to make cards until 2000 let's say. And then that new company only sold its cards online and not in pack form. Fast forward to 2023 and Fanatics comes along and sells cards in packs. Does that mean that any licensed NBA cards from 1984 to 2022 are not "true rookie" cards?
Makes them more limited in my opinion. If everyone thought he'd do what he did, people would've found a way to get to them. Just like any other collectible.
All these "rules" of what makes a card a rookie card are just laughable.. It takes common sense out of it and replaces it with numerous laughable rules
If you said to me “ I have Michael Jordan’s rookie card. “ and showed me either the Star OR the Fleer… I wouldn’t say you were wrong. One is more rare and the other is more iconic. Both cards are extremely important to the hobby and considered grail cards to a lot of collectors. If you are trying to claim one is the true rookie over the other.. good luck, people have argued this topic for years. Personally I consider the Fleer his true rookie but again I also consider the Star 101 his rookie and same with his Court Kings 5x7 Star. Just be glad you have any of Jordan’s early cards and stop fighting about which one is his true rookie. 😂
That was bs listing it as a XRC. Team bags, over-the-top briefcases......whatever. He distributed to dealers in the hobby. CRAZY, just because they weren't mass produced shouldn't discredit them. Why people [want] to be fooled is bonkers to me. This is his rookie in my opinion. They got railroaded.
very interesting - great segment - but im still puzzled - watched this twice. how about the star baseball cards? star was around longer than 4 years, correct? or did they back date a lot more? the answers were confusing to me. I wish there was more info to research so Geoff could have asked more questions. Wax pack hero did a story a year ago on this and mentioned the feds followed levine to the printers and busted him. Or did i mis hear steve ? - i thought he said levine had nothin to do with the reprints. And a former worker at the print shop took the prints or plates? I thought 2 guys bought most of the stuff? did they goto florida? they were in stars office in florida or NJ? i question this because i met a guy who claimed he worked in the print shop in boca and was told to trash these cards but he kept them instead and i have seen baseball cards from 1983 into the 90s - or the date printed on the cards also basketball cards from star in the 90s - both with and without logos on uniforms some cards are printed cherry hill and some boca raton so they must have printed more than just the super stars cards in 97 ? or was this all original stuff from NJ took to florida? yeah dont think we are hearing the whole story.
If the first card printed of Babe Ruth is considered his Rookie Card, then the Star 5x7 Court Kings is the first NBA card of Jordan. How the Fleer, released years later (NOT DURING HIS ROOKIE SEASON), has soo much hype is beyond me.
I have seen a few people who were selling the "10" card 1986 Jordan Star Company sealed bag set ...When the bag was opened for grading it only had 9 cards in the set with the number 8 card missing...
Why is the 101 considered Jordan's rookie n not roy or Olympic card BER SUBJECTIVE IVE HEARD THE GIY WOULD MANUFACTURE CARDS FEW YEARS AFTER N BACK DATE THEM
It’s Jordan’s true rookie card. I actually think XRC is the perfect label for it… as XRCs were EXTREMELY common in the 80s in baseball. No serious collector would consider 87 Topps Barry Bonds to be his true rookie card, his true rookie is the 86 Topps Traded XRC. One of MANY examples of this from the 80s. The Star cards are no different. Officially licensed, but available in hobby outlets only, thus XRC. But pretty much every collector wants the first card. It’s his true Rookie.
Take another baseball example, Bo Jackson. His true rookie is in 1986 Topps Traded… Pre packages sets only available at hobby stores… Similar to the Star. It’s his true rookie, despite the 1987 Topps being a “cooler” looking, iconic card with the future star label. Some collectors might even prefer the ‘87 Topps aesthetically, and it is considered a RC.. But his true rookie is 86 Topps Traded XRC. Very very similar to MJ’s rookie card situation IMO.
Steve is obviously extremely knowledgeable, probably the most knowledgeable about the Star Co cards. But, I can say with 1000% certainty that I know of at least 400 - 1984 101’s with black and white borders that were not from Shop at Home and were made available in uncut team sheet form in 1996. How do I know this?? Well I was at a location in the fall of ‘96 and saw them myself. I would say that approximately hundreds of each had thick black marker lines going through the cards. I know of only about 12-15 of each that were not ruined this way. Fascinating history.
I love Geoff, but I feel this one may have been self-serving to reinforce his Jordan Star investment and he already knew this guy’s opinion on which card is Jordan’s rookie. I traded away my 1986 Fleer Jordan rookie 1.5 weeks ago and now have no Jordan rookie cards so I have no skin in the game. Would have been better if we had someone else on who thinks the Fleer is his true rookie card for a better well-rounded debate. Just my opinion. ✌🏻
1984 MJ star cards are ripping on eBay right now. Bgs 8s are in the high 40s and the 8.5s are in the 60-80s. Do they keep going up or will they come back down. Idk
I thought watching this video would determine which MJ card is the true rookie. I was just confused when it was all over lol. 2 many questions left unanswered and this just boosted the $ for Fleer MJ rookie.
I am going to explain how the Star 101 is actually very UNDERVALUED right now using a graded comparison against the 1952 Topps Mantle so please read this carefully and follow along. (And by the way what I do for a living is analytical and systematic sales forecasting all day long so I pretty good with numbers and analysis.) Based on my checking from a few months back, there roughly have been around 1,600 to 1,700 of the 1952 Mantles graded in total between PSA and BGS with the vast majority being PSA. The Star 101 now has around 1,300 to 1,400 total graded between the two companies and I would estimate that on the BGS side, resubmissions probably account for at least 10 to 15% of those numbers because people wanted to see if they could bump their grades but I will still keep my total at around 1,300 to 1,400. So right off the bat, there are less graded 101's than 52 Mantles. (And after almost 40 years, there aren't going to be another 1,400 or more being sent in. More original ungraded cards may trickle in but year over year they are not much because I have been tracking it.) Now, if you look at where the Mantles fall on the grading scale, you will notice that the vast majority of them fall at the mid to lower end and that only an extremely small handful fall at the higher end PSA 7 on up, thus that is why the 52's sell for so much money in the hundreds of thousands and millions. Take the same look at the Star 101 and you will see that the majority of the grades are at the higher end of the grading scale which is the opposite of what you see with the 52's. Now why I believe the current Star 101 cards prices are undervalued by a factor of 3 to 4 times current actual prices (if not more) is first, in order to make a fair pricing comparison between the two, you need to give q fair equivalence for both based on the qty at their given grades. So to do this, I am allowing for a four - even five - downgrade price shift on the Mantles, so look at what the selling prices are for PSA 2 to 7. Why because obviously as I stated above there are less higher end 52's compared to 101 so no, it would not be fair to say that a 8 grade Star 101 should be worth the same as an 8 graded Mantle. Now when you allow for that pricing shift, you will clearly see, based on the scarcity and grading scale compared to the 52 Topps that even right now the Star 101's are greatly undervalued. I just checked completed sales on eBay and a PSA 2.5 Mantle sold for $57k. You're trying to tell me that the much more rarer RC of a fellow hyper iconic sports figure - MJ - in a 5, 6, 7, 8, 8.5 etc grade is not worth much much more than what they are selling now. Heck, I see people offering 8 and 8.5's for well under a $100k. What I believe the Star 101's prices should be is 9's at around $400k to 500K, 8.5's 200 to $300k, 8's at $100 to 100k etc etc. Sorry this was long and I hope this makes sense but I wanted to lay out my methodology. Please take the time yourself to look up the pop reports and prices and compare as well. MJ Forever !!!! - text me-815.919.5361-if you have any questions.
In the sports card collecting hobby Mickey Mantle is more iconic than Jordan especially when comparing their RC's. Jordan's cards came out in the 80's when collectors were taking better of cards compared to previous decades.
Yes, Mantle is iconic but mainly just in the united states. MJ is what I call hyper iconic where you can go anywhere on the planet and show someone his photo and they will know its jordan. His #23 jersey is worn around the world no matter if rich or poor. You cannot say any of that about Mantle. As for the card itself, the pop reports don't lie, there are three times the amount of 52 mantles graded compared to the 101.
@@johndivelbiss2762 The vast majority of sports cards collectors are in the USA who collect sports cards of US athletes so Mantle is more iconic among them than Jordan. Jordan is more well known around the world but they do not collect his cards. Context is important. Look at any ranking of sports cards and you'll see Mantle's 1952 Topps above any of Jordan's.
hello Geoff and Steve. I have the set of 18 Star 85 cards of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. They are also autographed and each one of them are in a hard plastic case. I'm thinking of getting them graded. This is my first time doing this. Any advice would be greatly helpful.
I dont own either but thanks for this interview. I knew i was right. Just wish i would've pulled the trigger on one earlier. Jersey Fusions are the next sleepers.
The bottom line is that the STAR CARD COMPANY didn't sell their Cards through out the country they chose different geographic areas and why nobody knows! That's why the Jordan RC wasn't considered the true RC of MJ but I always considered it his true RC even though I could not find them anywhere in the south at least not NC!!!
Great show!! What about the star 1984/85 “coaches set” or coaches bag I didn’t hear him talk about that I wonder if that is a legit set or was it a fake set?
I'm very into "truth" and believe everyone should be living their life truthfully. I think making a big hullabaloo about a "true" rookie sportscard is an insult to the word... Especially, when a decisive verdict on one or the other could cause huge financial wins and losses for various people. America is too "all or nothing." The word "formidable", I think comes from the French, is under utilized in the west. Imo this video simply showcases various formidable claimants of MJ's RC. I'd be happy to own originals of any of them! Pushing too much for one over the other typically only exposes the power hungry!
There is no debate! It would of been virtually impossible for anyone to acquire! a rookie card from these releases as they were regional! Not a national release! This guy is biased! just as is this Geoff guy since he now has bought one! A rookie card is something that is released nationally and available to any and everyone!
PRINTING BACK WAS SUPER CHEAP! It cost pennies to print those cards that is why he would print both “new” and fakes ones of the 84. It was too easy to do both plus he didn’t want to saturate the market so fast at one time and didn’t know if the new ones might sell better without lowering the price.He sounds naive!
Again, THANK YOU Geoff for doing this interview with Steve. It desperately needed to be done, and I’m so happy you gave this man a full 1-hour+ video interview.
I met Steve for the first time in-person at this same National. I actually bought a PSA 7 MJ 101 (I showed you on the show floor, but you were pretty busy, not sure if you recall). The 101 is a card I always wanted, but I wanted to get one in-person, and have that experience. Buying it from Steve Taft at the National was a really cool experience I’ll cherish forever.
As a collector myself since 1986 when I was 8, growing up in Chicago, the Star 101 has always to my Generation & demographic been the TRUE Rookie Card.
Steve is an amazing wealth of info on not only Star Basketball but Basketball cards in general.
Also, the 101 isnt the only Star Card that deserves recognition, theres several Jordans that do, but theres also many of the original Dream Teamer’s legitimate first Rookies as well, we forget that Drexler, Nique Wilkins, Ewing, Olajuwon, Barkley, and Isiah Thomas’ that predate the 86 fleer set by 4 years! Even John Stockton, who most believe has his rookie in 1988 fleer, is in the 1984-85 Star set!
Amazing interview, Thank you for putting this out there for the public to understand the truth!
I think the STAR is the true rookie.
I’m definitely adding a few to my collection in my lifetime.
I love that these cards were not printed by the million. If Fleer didn’t want to support the hobby in 1985, they lose that RC spot.
Very true about Fleer, and it is his true rookie
The star 101 is Jordan's true rookie and it's extremely undervalued.
Undervalued? Not quite. I'd say five-figures is a big price point. Ship has sailed on this card.
@@vintagecollector5340wrong my man. It’s only getting started….
@@Robertj1214 Maybe for those who already bought the card years ago. Most people are struggling to even live, let alone afford to buy a piece of cardboard for five or six-figures.
@@vintagecollector5340 how do you explain the stock market at all time highs. Ppl buy, as far as the 84 star 101 goes it’s a vg investment right now. Over 40,000 fleets compared to 3,000 stars. Psa started grading them about a year ago. They’re scarce.
Spell ck * fleers * lol
This was the best interview ever, Geoff. I actually purchased a PSA 7 Jordan Star 101 from Steve, at the National. In fact I spent more time at his booth than anywhere else, looking at his amazing display of Star & unique Basketball cards.
He was so pleasant & took the time to lecture on the history of everything. He even had licensed Pro-Set Basketball prototypes from 1990 with Jordan. They looked amazing and now I’m definitely going to look for one for my collection..
If Michael Jordan was in the famous 84 Draft then his true rookie is the Star 84 card not the 2 years later 86 fleer card!
For all those that say this isnt the rookie because of the "distribution" not being in a pack...ok then what if star continued to have the license until 2003 and then panini came along and printed a jordan card with him in his wizards uniform but you were able to buy that panini card in pack form. Are you going to try and tell me that the panini card would be considered his rookie in my example??? I think not.
If James Beckett, as Steve directly pointed out, did not change his original designation for the 101 from RC to XRC (for some reason) then we would not even be having a debate. The star 101 would be without question be considered the RC and the 86 Fleer a third year card or First Fleer card of MJ. By the way, the story goes that Beckett only changed the designation because if the advertising dollars they were getting from Fleer thus pressure from Fleer.
I bought the 83 set in team bags from the back of a Magazine...with the Drexler, I. Thomas & Dominique Rookies. Wish I would've continued to buy thru 86 but alas, so I never owned the Jordan Rookie. So few know what they are talking about when it comes to the Star cards so I like this guy.
Hats off to Geoff Wilson and Steve Taft for producing this long overdue video about the Star brand. I value the education, awareness, and rumor squashing/myth debunking regarding these important and highly relevant cards about the golden years of NBA history. Geoff Wilson, THANK YOU!!
Amen, well said, thank you! 😊
Great educational video and Steve Taft is a true legend in our hobby!
It’s a no brainer that the very rare MJ 1984 Star 101 is MJ’s True Rookie card issued as his First base card in his First fully licensed NBA set released during his True Rookie year, so case closed!
Dr. Beckett is another legend in our hobby, but if he didn’t make the big mistake of misrepresenting the great MJ 84 Star 101 card as an incorrect XRC in his 1990’s Beckett price guides then there would be No debate!
In the near future these very rare Star basketball True Rookie cards of some of the All-Time great basketball legends will skyrocket in value, because of very low supply and much more demand once collectors/investors continue to get properly educated on how special they are to basketball history!
The star card is the rookie. I love the fleer rc...but the star is first. Been collecting since 88.
This man is a treasure for NBA fan particularly if you grew up in this time or after when the dream team ruled the sports world.... A true treasure trove of knowledge, hopefully we hear more, I'd love to show him some of mine... Never had big bucks but I have a few and a team bag
Saved this to a favorites playlist. Definitely one I'll be referring back to at some point years down the line. I was hoping he talked about the Crunch N Much set. That one was always so unique to me and how branding with food companies (Entenmann's included) became a thing with sports cards.
I remember buying the 84-85 team bags from a card dealer at a local flea market back in the day. They were a really fresh design compared to the traditional designs of the day. I've always seen this as the true rookie.
The STAR is the true Rookie card. The 86 Fleer came out 2 years later.
well said
The 5" x 7" Slam Dunk CHECKLIST card is my favorite card with Jordan and the other contestants putting their hand on a ball together
This is definitely the best episode the Star cards are a beautiful design with great photography. To get to listen to someone with a wealth of 1st hand knowledge speak about them is a pleasure.
He's a liar. He just wants his stick pile to go up
Steve sure knows his basketball! Totally agree that Magic and Bird don’t get the true appreciation they deserve in the hobby. Seems like there’s more collectors of Penny Hardaway than these 2 legends who saved the NBA 🤔
No he does not to insinuate that bird and magic are goats over jordan is blasphemy
I’ve been waiting for an interview like this with someone who knows the history of everything for years and years and years🎉❤
The first set to print an athlete's rookie card is the true rookie card. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. It's not about how you feel that constitutes a rookie card. Facts don't care about your feelings. If a athlete's first rookie card comes in the Panini Instant set, that's the true rookie card.
Right on. All the caveats of regional distribution, pack-pulled, etc., are irrelevant. The first card is the first card -- and that is the true rookie card.
So if someone prints 10 cards (under license) first and sells them to 10 of his friends, you're saying that's the true rookie card? How can it be if there is no distribution? I think the Star card is his true rookie. But my earlier scenario i don't think would qualify as a rookie
@@cditsious omg dude don't be dumb. I litteraly gave a clear example, can you not read.
The Star cards were also licensed!
Geoff doesn’t realise he’s getting caught up in the systematic pumping of these cards by a small group (who own the majority of the cards) of heavily invested Star card owners .
Goes to show - doesn’t matter if it’s stock / cards / shoes , everything can be manipulated through hype .
Great interview. Loved hearing about the history of these sets. Hope to see more like this before this type of history is lost. Imagine if you could interview the person who dumped all of the 1952 Topps cases in the ocean!! 😂
Great job having the legend come on to talk the Star Cards! These cards will continue to gain appreciation over time in my opinion.
Nah it's all for personal gain
This is a chicken or the egg debate. Star owners are trying to pump their values, Fleer owners are trying to retain value of their cards. Collect what you like and can afford. Both cards are awesome. Enough with trying to influence for your gain
I loved this interview!! I wish someone would talk about the Griffey Jr star cards. The 1988 silver series and 1989 Nova set.
Loved this episode, amazing to hear and understand part of the history of Star..! Thanks for your time and for sharing Steve 👏
Hey Geoff this interview is awesome, I have an idea, is there anyway you can get interviews with the creators of sets for example prizm, optic, topps black, origins etc.? It’s hard to believe that those sets dont have an artist behind them and this could bring more attention and appeal to different sets.
Star cards were the true rookie cards! I think beckett needs to reconsider that XRC for all those great rookies. These cards were true, and very limited unlike fleer. Maybe they should consider that 86-87 fleer mj card an XRC instead. Awesome interview with taft, cant wait to see if PSA starts grading sealed star bags. I just might send in a few myself...
STAR is his rookie. All the semantics...like he said....is crazy lol.
I don’t collect basketball cards anymore, but it is always interesting hearing the history of different sets in the hobby. Especially from someone who is so well versed in the subject
If the Star is more scarce, eventually it WILL be more valuable.
The 101 is obviously his true RC and the most undervalued card in all of sports cards! As well as the court kings, 288, and 195 cards are undervalued.
I don’t collect basketball but great listen regarding Jordan’s cards.
I have a the MJ 84 star 101. To me it’s his true rookie card.
I bought my 1986 Fleer Jordan RC in 1990 for $245. It's still ungraded. In 2012 I bought the 1984 Star Jordan RC (BGS 8.0) for $1714. I'm set.
This was such an informative and enjoyable episode! And after watching this, my opinion would be that the Star Card is the "true" Jordan rookie.
Such an IMPORDANT conversation!!!
Great interview. Luckily his still with us to share the knowledge. We lost a lot of people during the Covid-19 years. Hopefully his with us many more years
STAR is So Much More than Jordan cards!!
the 86 fleer card just looks better than the star cards, the real problem was the scandal of with the STAR company is why it was devalued compared to the FLEER set.
Another point that I would like to make is what if Star went out a business like it did and then no trading card company picked up the NBA license to make cards until 2000 let's say. And then that new company only sold its cards online and not in pack form. Fast forward to 2023 and Fanatics comes along and sells cards in packs. Does that mean that any licensed NBA cards from 1984 to 2022 are not "true rookie" cards?
ahh, the good old days when I'd ride my bike down the local liquor store to buy cards
I FIND IT FUNNY EVERYONE SAYS 52 MANTLE TO COMPARE BUT ALSO 52 MAYS IS AVAILABLE ON BOTH SETS BUT NEVER MENTIONED
I sold all my Star cards. Too many iffy situations about authenticity, reprints, etc.
I'd still buy type II who gives af where it was printed 😂
Makes them more limited in my opinion. If everyone thought he'd do what he did, people would've found a way to get to them. Just like any other collectible.
All these "rules" of what makes a card a rookie card are just laughable.. It takes common sense out of it and replaces it with numerous laughable rules
If you said to me “ I have Michael Jordan’s rookie card. “ and showed me either the Star OR the Fleer… I wouldn’t say you were wrong. One is more rare and the other is more iconic. Both cards are extremely important to the hobby and considered grail cards to a lot of collectors. If you are trying to claim one is the true rookie over the other.. good luck, people have argued this topic for years. Personally I consider the Fleer his true rookie but again I also consider the Star 101 his rookie and same with his Court Kings 5x7 Star. Just be glad you have any of Jordan’s early cards and stop fighting about which one is his true rookie. 😂
That was bs listing it as a XRC. Team bags, over-the-top briefcases......whatever. He distributed to dealers in the hobby. CRAZY, just because they weren't mass produced shouldn't discredit them. Why people [want] to be fooled is bonkers to me. This is his rookie in my opinion. They got railroaded.
The gal between MJ and others will never narrow. MJ made Basketball a global product. No one else did.
very interesting - great segment - but im still puzzled - watched this twice. how about the star baseball cards? star was around longer than 4 years, correct? or did they back date a lot more? the answers were confusing to me. I wish there was more info to research so Geoff could have asked more questions.
Wax pack hero did a story a year ago on this and mentioned the feds followed levine to the printers and busted him.
Or did i mis hear steve ? - i thought he said levine had nothin to do with the reprints.
And a former worker at the print shop took the prints or plates? I thought 2 guys bought most of the stuff? did they goto florida? they were in stars office in florida or NJ?
i question this because i met a guy who claimed he worked in the print shop in boca and was told to trash these cards but he kept them instead
and i have seen baseball cards from 1983 into the 90s - or the date printed on the cards
also basketball cards from star in the 90s - both with and without logos on uniforms
some cards are printed cherry hill and some boca raton
so they must have printed more than just the super stars cards in 97 ?
or was this all original stuff from NJ took to florida?
yeah dont think we are hearing the whole story.
Easily one of the most interesting hours Ive listened to
If the first card printed of Babe Ruth is considered his Rookie Card, then the Star 5x7 Court Kings is the first NBA card of Jordan. How the Fleer, released years later (NOT DURING HIS ROOKIE SEASON), has soo much hype is beyond me.
Simply no way to trust the provenance of a Star Company card.
Fantastic, Informative Video. Thank you for doing this.
About time 🎉🎉🎉Steve is the Man
I have seen a few people who were selling the "10" card 1986 Jordan Star Company sealed bag set ...When the bag was opened for grading it only had 9 cards in the set with the number 8 card missing...
Right now, I think Will Grier is about a 10x better investment than Michael Jordan......
The photo on there 101 Star is bad too. The 86 fleer is iconic with regards to MJ
Really interesting show! Great history lesson!
Why is the 101 considered Jordan's rookie n not roy or Olympic card BER SUBJECTIVE IVE HEARD THE GIY WOULD MANUFACTURE CARDS FEW YEARS AFTER N BACK DATE THEM
It’s Jordan’s true rookie card. I actually think XRC is the perfect label for it… as XRCs were EXTREMELY common in the 80s in baseball. No serious collector would consider 87 Topps Barry Bonds to be his true rookie card, his true rookie is the 86 Topps Traded XRC. One of MANY examples of this from the 80s. The Star cards are no different. Officially licensed, but available in hobby outlets only, thus XRC. But pretty much every collector wants the first card. It’s his true Rookie.
Take another baseball example, Bo Jackson. His true rookie is in 1986 Topps Traded… Pre packages sets only available at hobby stores… Similar to the Star. It’s his true rookie, despite the 1987 Topps being a “cooler” looking, iconic card with the future star label. Some collectors might even prefer the ‘87 Topps aesthetically, and it is considered a RC.. But his true rookie is 86 Topps Traded XRC. Very very similar to MJ’s rookie card situation IMO.
What is the amount of player bags they created for the baseball? The baseball ones don't cost much.
What about the 1985 Nike promo card? It’s also very iconic
Great content! This is work I can apprecoate!💯💪
Totally agree the jordan should have 2 official rookie cards especially because it was fully licensed by the nba.
So, what’s next ? Will the Wayne Gretzky Indianapolis Racers card become Wayne’s true rookie ? One can always speculate
Are the blue boarder and black border cards real
Steve is obviously extremely knowledgeable, probably the most knowledgeable about the Star Co cards. But, I can say with 1000% certainty that I know of at least 400 - 1984 101’s with black and white borders that were not from Shop at Home and were made available in uncut team sheet form in 1996. How do I know this?? Well I was at a location in the fall of ‘96 and saw them myself. I would say that approximately hundreds of each had thick black marker lines going through the cards. I know of only about 12-15 of each that were not ruined this way. Fascinating history.
Great video! Growing up in the 80s, I always considered the 84 his true rookie. But good to hear why it should be .
i cant find him on ebay
any links to his store on ebay appreciated
They are thru the roof!!!
Thousands of dollars for a poor grade
I love Geoff, but I feel this one may have been self-serving to reinforce his Jordan Star investment and he already knew this guy’s opinion on which card is Jordan’s rookie. I traded away my 1986 Fleer Jordan rookie 1.5 weeks ago and now have no Jordan rookie cards so I have no skin in the game. Would have been better if we had someone else on who thinks the Fleer is his true rookie card for a better well-rounded debate. Just my opinion. ✌🏻
1984 MJ star cards are ripping on eBay right now.
Bgs 8s are in the high 40s and the 8.5s are in the 60-80s. Do they keep going up or will they come back down. Idk
I thought watching this video would determine which MJ card is the true rookie. I was just confused when it was all over lol. 2 many questions left unanswered and this just boosted the $ for Fleer MJ rookie.
I am going to explain how the Star 101 is actually very UNDERVALUED right now using a graded comparison against the 1952 Topps Mantle so please read this carefully and follow along. (And by the way what I do for a living is analytical and systematic sales forecasting all day long so I pretty good with numbers and analysis.) Based on my checking from a few months back, there roughly have been around 1,600 to 1,700 of the 1952 Mantles graded in total between PSA and BGS with the vast majority being PSA. The Star 101 now has around 1,300 to 1,400 total graded between the two companies and I would estimate that on the BGS side, resubmissions probably account for at least 10 to 15% of those numbers because people wanted to see if they could bump their grades but I will still keep my total at around 1,300 to 1,400. So right off the bat, there are less graded 101's than 52 Mantles. (And after almost 40 years, there aren't going to be another 1,400 or more being sent in. More original ungraded cards may trickle in but year over year they are not much because I have been tracking it.) Now, if you look at where the Mantles fall on the grading scale, you will notice that the vast majority of them fall at the mid to lower end and that only an extremely small handful fall at the higher end PSA 7 on up, thus that is why the 52's sell for so much money in the hundreds of thousands and millions. Take the same look at the Star 101 and you will see that the majority of the grades are at the higher end of the grading scale which is the opposite of what you see with the 52's. Now why I believe the current Star 101 cards prices are undervalued by a factor of 3 to 4 times current actual prices (if not more) is first, in order to make a fair pricing comparison between the two, you need to give q fair equivalence for both based on the qty at their given grades. So to do this, I am allowing for a four - even five - downgrade price shift on the Mantles, so look at what the selling prices are for PSA 2 to 7. Why because obviously as I stated above there are less higher end 52's compared to 101 so no, it would not be fair to say that a 8 grade Star 101 should be worth the same as an 8 graded Mantle. Now when you allow for that pricing shift, you will clearly see, based on the scarcity and grading scale compared to the 52 Topps that even right now the Star 101's are greatly undervalued. I just checked completed sales on eBay and a PSA 2.5 Mantle sold for $57k. You're trying to tell me that the much more rarer RC of a fellow hyper iconic sports figure - MJ - in a 5, 6, 7, 8, 8.5 etc grade is not worth much much more than what they are selling now. Heck, I see people offering 8 and 8.5's for well under a $100k. What I believe the Star 101's prices should be is 9's at around $400k to 500K, 8.5's 200 to $300k, 8's at $100 to 100k etc etc. Sorry this was long and I hope this makes sense but I wanted to lay out my methodology. Please take the time yourself to look up the pop reports and prices and compare as well. MJ Forever !!!! - text me-815.919.5361-if you have any questions.
In the sports card collecting hobby Mickey Mantle is more iconic than Jordan especially when comparing their RC's. Jordan's cards came out in the 80's when collectors were taking better of cards compared to previous decades.
Yes, Mantle is iconic but mainly just in the united states. MJ is what I call hyper iconic where you can go anywhere on the planet and show someone his photo and they will know its jordan. His #23 jersey is worn around the world no matter if rich or poor. You cannot say any of that about Mantle. As for the card itself, the pop reports don't lie, there are three times the amount of 52 mantles graded compared to the 101.
@@johndivelbiss2762 The vast majority of sports cards collectors are in the USA who collect sports cards of US athletes so Mantle is more iconic among them than Jordan. Jordan is more well known around the world but they do not collect his cards. Context is important. Look at any ranking of sports cards and you'll see Mantle's 1952 Topps above any of Jordan's.
hello Geoff and Steve. I have the set of 18 Star 85 cards of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. They are also autographed and each one of them are in a hard plastic case. I'm thinking of getting them graded. This is my first time doing this. Any advice would be greatly helpful.
Great topic. I think "pre-rookies" are BS. Like with Ohtani... the 2018 Topps Now is the Rookie Card.
What's first, the Schedule Or the Star card???
Great Job Geoff
I didn’t know Jimmy Boheim was a sports card collector. 😂🤣
I dont own either but thanks for this interview. I knew i was right. Just wish i would've pulled the trigger on one earlier. Jersey Fusions are the next sleepers.
Who is Jersey Fusions? Interested in knowing about them
not sure about this old guy
Yeah he's just saying all this so his collection value goes up .. he's a bum
First! Leon Wood 1984 Star MJ Olympic team-mate and Cal State Fullerton small school icon!
Are there any authentic black border 1984/85 Michael jordan rookie/olympian star cards?
Geoff trying to get his star jordan card value up i see. You took a beating on this one thus far no?
I feel his take on rc vs xrc has a bit to do with his inventory of star cards
Nice real education! I learned today and that's rare!
Two predators at 35:09.
Hard to consider a card not released in packs openly available to the general public as a true rookie......hence Fleer holding that title...
The bottom line is that the STAR CARD COMPANY didn't sell their Cards through out the country they chose different geographic areas and why nobody knows! That's why the Jordan RC wasn't considered the true RC of MJ but I always considered it his true RC even though I could not find them anywhere in the south at least not NC!!!
Great show!!
What about the star 1984/85 “coaches set” or coaches bag
I didn’t hear him talk about that
I wonder if that is a legit set or was it a fake set?
I'm very into "truth" and believe everyone should be living their life truthfully. I think making a big hullabaloo about a "true" rookie sportscard is an insult to the word... Especially, when a decisive verdict on one or the other could cause huge financial wins and losses for various people.
America is too "all or nothing." The word "formidable", I think comes from the French, is under utilized in the west. Imo this video simply showcases various formidable claimants of MJ's RC. I'd be happy to own originals of any of them! Pushing too much for one over the other typically only exposes the power hungry!
It's the same argument in comic books cameos vs. first appearance what not
North Carolina collegiate card is his true rookie!!
There is no debate! It would of been virtually impossible for anyone to acquire! a rookie card from these releases as they were regional! Not a national release! This guy is biased! just as is this Geoff guy since he now has bought one! A rookie card is something that is released nationally and available to any and everyone!
Didn't know about some of these. Really interesting.
And he’s down prob 50k on his star card in one year cause he ruined the hobby I love
He never tells the whole story and leaves out some important details, yet he's revered like some type of God
PRINTING BACK WAS SUPER CHEAP! It cost pennies to print those cards that is why he would print both “new” and fakes ones of the 84. It was too easy to do both plus he didn’t want to saturate the market so fast at one time and didn’t know if the new ones might sell better without lowering the price.He sounds naive!
no one wanted basketball cards. just like no one wanted bball license in the 2000s 😂