Engaging Your Players | Running the Game
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- Опубликовано: 4 июл 2024
- Make your world more engaging and chase your players up a tree!
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"if they care about their family, threaten that" - Matt Colville, 2021
Which is why, since the DM will find a way to threaten you anyway, you should at least control the creation of what gets threatened.
@@Madhattersinjeans don’t do the classic: I have no family so you can’t use them against me. The DM will find things to use against you, so create those family and friends you care about so it’s more dramatic and fun/frustrating? when it happens
When you realize he was talking about the player's family
Starting a Crime Family: Episode 1
I laughed harder than I should have at this haha 🤣
10:35 "...the Stone of Vincibility ... Who has it?" Vince. Obviously.
Vince is really vincible
But it's inside Vince.
Vince and Billy Tee
The Stone of Vincibility, owned by legendary adventurer, Vince Ability
Now I gotta make Vince Vaughn an NPC, wow
The longer his hair gets the more powerful he becomes
He's on his way to super saiyan 3
It beautiful. Who wouldn't want a head of hair like that.
Like Samson
Quest spell: Colville's Glorious Mane; Somebody flesh out the details..
Who doesn't have a quarantine mop?
"Take away (the murderhobo's) favorite retainer"
Isn't that the plot of John Wick?
He was a retired murderhobo, but yes
It works there
He was a landowning murderer, thank you very much.
Actually... shoot, I guess I'm having a 'well, actually' moment, but actually, John Wick isn't a murderhobo.
First, unlike a murderhobo, he lets NPCs that aren't hostile to him talk to him, he has conversations with other characters that are not his enemies, and if they continue to not be his enemies, he doesn't kill them.
Second, he was previously a paid assassin, meaning he only killed people when requested and paid for by a client.
Third, when he kills in the movies, it is for revenge, it has a purpose. He only kills people who work for the guy he is after, or later, the guys who are after him. He doesn't kill innocent people.
Murderhobos often kill NPCs for no particular in-universe reason. They aren't paid to kill most, if not all, of the NPCs they kill, they aren't doing it to achieve some larger or long term goal, they just do it because they can, and their player is bored.
Also, murderhobos don't have homes, they just move from town to town staying at inns, whereas John Wick has (or had?) a house, a permanent residence, that he continued to use, even after the first movie.
@@Tiyev Hes a mass murdering hobo. Not killing literally everybody he meets does not change the fact that hes still a murder hobo. Your attempt to justify his mass murders is really pathetic. Murder hobos can have homes and a permanent residence why you think they dont is nonsense. Again you don't know what you are talking about. His reasons for killing are irreverent. Hes still a mass murderer who loves killing. The John Wick movie are about enjoying murder porn it's why I have watched it so many times, but don't try to pretend it anything other then what it is.
If the phrase "shitting out your own entrails" doesn't motivate you to action, nothing will.
I visibly shuddered at the thought. That is all the motivation needed for the upcoming decades.
I want to know the backstory to this one...
It's easy to "motivate [a player] to action", here's an ork, he says "grrrr", done, I've motivated every single player character into action.
...and they will never, ever know why that ork was so far from home.
Also known as screaming diarrhea.
"it is said, if it were to cut, he would lose his powers. For his hair was blessed by mat mercer, and mat mercer was blessed by colville, together they are legion"
Ah yes, my favorite dwarves from Snow White: Funny, Grumpy, Flirty, and Confrontational.
Telling the edgelord he'll be shitting out his own entrails is my favourite piece of advice on this channel
I swing by this video every year or so just for this.
I do kind of love the reading that Bilbo risked life and limb because he was too polite.
Viewer: How can I engage my players?
Matthew: Have them learn your lore or perish!
A good tool for this is the clock, from Apocalypse World. It’s a list of six increasingly dire things that will happen, in order, if the players do not intervene. The first few items are warnings, the next few are issues in their own right, and the last few destroy things the players care about. When the story stalls or the players fail, the clock advances.
I really like this. I've used something similar from the 3.5e sourcebook Elder Evils, which presents several apocalypse scenarios, and each one has that series of things that portend its coming, starting off relatively minor and then six months later anyone in the entire world who dies rises as a zombie.
@@maratsverdlov3974 good sourcebook.
@@maratsverdlov3974 I'm running a campaign on the edge of multiple possible apocolypses and have been looking for something like this. Just a quick look through has given me tons of ideas so thanks for passing on the good books!
@@dracothief my pleasure! Hope it helps!
@@maratsverdlov3974 that is just what I needed, thanks for the info!
Hey Matt Colville, Everybody here!
+
Here everybody, Matt Colville hey!
DM: "Thanks for that deep character backstory you came up with. I'll be sure to tie it into the world so you encounter interesting things you apparently care about!"
Characters, upon seeing plot bait pulled directly from their backstories: "Nah, I'd rather not."
DM: BUT YOU JUST... 🤦🏾♂️🤬
I've had the opposite problem. I give all sorts of hooks to be tied to the world, I flat out tell the DM "this is how my character can get involved", and the plot hooks run AWAY from my character! I've had my characters do almost everything they could TO GET INVOLVED and they just zip away from me like I stink! What the fuck! DMs all the time complain about characters not getting involved and being aloof, but if a player is taking initiative and trying to do everything they can to get involved, REWARD THEM!
@@Terestrasz That sounds really frustrating. One of my players is very much this type, and I appreciate the heck out of it as a first-time DM, even 30 sessions in. It's actually difficult to balance all they want to do while trying to creatively engage other players, but if I'm struggling for content I can always refer to their character development wish list. If only they weren't looking for opportunities to become evil...
@@LGreenGriffin It is. :/ one time I took part in a plot where the palyerbase was divided and I was the only one who didn't give up in trying to get involved after spending a whole week running around without GM interaction. The other half of the playerbase gave up because of that.
No wonder the weren't on for when the phase was going to focus on their side!
This has given the best understanding of plot hooks I’ve ever had.
2:46 - I'm glad my players aren't the only ones who use the Danger Flirt maneuver
I always flirt best with a weapon in my hands.
Like the infamous Matt colville tweet: “Lore isn’t interesting, Writing is.” (paraphrasing)
Here’s an idea: someone make a playlist of running the game videos in “new DM” order. This video for instance is last chronologically but should be early for new DMs.
Now I’m realizing that I should do this...
I've been running the game for over 5 years and I still found it useful. You're right, it would've been lovely to know earlier.
EDIT: This comment was originally a compliment about his appearance but he really dislikes when people focus on that so instead I'm editing it to be something more relevant.
I really love when GMs are able to find ways to motivate players using the characters' backstories, but as a GM, I *love* it when my players take it upon themselves to try and find reasons why their characters would care about something new instead of just "I wrote down that I care about my family and the forest when I first made my character, why should I care about anything else?"
He also hates people talking about/ focusing in appearance.
@@grantdixson1442 and does he hate when people talk about people talking about appearance?
@@BlueFlash215 I forget the exact reasoning, but I remember I watched a stream one time where he was talking about it. If I recall correctly he feels that in the D&D community or RUclips / Twitch in general, there's too large of a focus on people's appearance rather than their content. Especially when it comes to women, and it can be kinda demeaning at times. He's sort of just opted to avoid talking about appearance all together because of it.
Edit: Oops. I kinda misunderstood your comment, so this isn't really relevant.
@@BlueFlash215 Sounds like Matt has been chased up a tree of his own making.
This may be in my top 5 best "running the game" and I've watched nearly every one! Great video Matt!
Weirdly it’s not a numbered entry in the series and just says “running D&D”
What are the other 5?? I’ve watched about 10 so likely to have missed a few . Dm me pretty please
@@JakeLucGoodman The practical ones I got the most from have been Action Orientated Monsters, Skill Challenges, One-on-One D&D, Vecna & Epic Bad Guys, and The Sociology of D&D
I really like using old characters from my players in previous campaigns and using them as ways to get my players invested in lore. Matt does this in his campaign too. People like to know what happened to their characters after they left them
Used this strategy to start a full blown war when the old party didn't realise they were being misled by a spymaster. Fun times. When the party realised that they were responsible for starting a continent scale war the looks were priceless.
"People like to know what happened to their characters after they left them"
Correction, SOMETIMES the players like to know what happened to them. For some reason they get upset when their characters corpses are used as avatars of evil entities. :-S Weird I know... xDDD
@@russellstephens3580 Now this is an idea I can get behind
@@russellstephens3580 so far, I’ve turned two past PCs into vampires. They both belonged to the same player. In fact, the two vampires are currently at war with each other on opposite sides of a schism in an evil cult.
The best Idea I've seen is using a situation the players have played in before with their old characters and having their new characters witness it and actively help the old party.
I think Matt talked a little about this before but I forget what video it was.
It's such a cool idea but it's very hard to pull off.
It's not necessarily time travel but it's kind of in the same ballpark.
“To flirt with npcs... or threaten npcs... or both...”
literally all of my players-
Guilty.
MCDM: Hey everybody, Matt Colville here.
Me: *Monkey noises*
*motions at your chest, then mine* Ape together STRONG
I connect to this comment on a primal level
OOGA BOOGA BROTHA
TRUEEEE
@@simongissler ,,,,,, Zaza,,
After multiple repetitions of "chasing the heroes up a tree", my mind flashed to
"Fifteen birds
In five fir trees
Their feathers were fanned
By a fiery breeze" 🤣
Why is it that every time I'm looking for a specific answer or advice, you show up with the right video. Love your work!
He's a wizard in disguise. As a player of yours, you do great man. See ya Thursday homes.
Same! I start a new Game a few days and thinking how to engage them more!
Saaaaaame.
I think that when dms/gms say "I wish my players were more engaging" they mean
"I wish my players engaged with the plot instead of trying to meme and goof around for giggles"
@@Vedexent_ I don't think that's true. I actually think not engaging with the "plot" is precisely the point of the video.
Is the plot doesn't have any ticking clocks or immediate threats.... What's the point for the players? If they don't do anything and there's no consequences... Well you're not doing a good job of chasing them up a tree.
Dnd with a "plot" doesn't mean anything when there's no consequences for "fooling around" or not being serious. That's the point of the video right?
Plot is just code for world and lore which is exactly what this video is about. If they're giggling, goofing around and having fun... What's the problem?
Has anyone ever tried introducing Monty Python Holy Grail elements in a serious manner? Eldeberries would have a whole new meaning then.
@@kevinz8554 But there's still the matter of whether the players only want to goof around while the DM wants to be serious. If the DM confronts and punishes the players in-game for goofing around, that can have drastic results. Session Zero is your friend.
my players, now up a tree: "Now what?"
I, the DM: "I don't know"
Sounds like a player problem! The DM's work is done - sit back and see what they come up with!
My favorite notification hands down! Colville has certainly engaged us as players
I can't thank you enough for all your help. You're doing Pelor's work.
Huh, I'm having a bad day and I don't think anything cou-
"Hey everybody, Matt Colville here."
I've been saved.
Huge snow day and i have to work on boring stuff....Matt saved the day
What a way to fulfill my holiday stuck at home!
I must feed the algorithm or be eaten myself.
All shall be well and all matters of things shall be well
Wow, suddenly RUclips sounds like a Cthulhu-esc elder god...
SOMEONE QUICK TELL THE MACHINE WE LOVE MATT COLEVILLE
@@isaacm4791 VIEWS FOR THE VIEW GOD
@@Drekromancer plot twist Khorn is actually behind youtube. What do you do?
This is the exact advice I just gave to a friend of mine that is being a DM this week for the first time and I told her if the PC's don't want to engage in your adventure, MAKE the want it. I love your content and hope your all doing well. Stay safe!
Time to think, relax, ride the river for a bit.
Just DMed my first session ever last night this vid and it's series SUPER HELPFUL!
This series is so in depth it feels like it's a college course on Dungeon Mastering. Keep up the good work!
There are quite a few good GM channels on RUclips, but this was the first I found two years ago, and it remains the best. Matt is a sharp one.
The fact that each of Matt's videos is the best so far says a lot about his dedication to his content. Thanks for making my table more fun as always
Last time i was this early we had THACO
@@adamgrey268 This person THAC0-s.
Ah THAC0, those were the good old days.
@@candiedginger8729 Tbh it was a fucking mess
And subdual damage.
THAC0s con carnitas
I sincerely hope the Chain take down Ajax with “the stone of vincibility”
So, like David vs Goliath?
You really make it look so easy to understand. This is the most intelligent way of looking into the engagement problem; such an inspiration. Thank you: you made my day! ^_^
I have several categories of lore:
1. Solutions: Lore the players need in order to progress. This is knowledge, an item, an NPC, etc that will get the players through some problem and I'll build the adventure around it.
2. Interests: Lore the players can learn and engage with if interested, but I won't push it on them. I write it because I know I have players who eat this stuff up, but others don't care.
3. Foundations: Lore that I establish secretly, if only to create a consistent world. Even if players never learn about it, this is important for the way it shapes everything else.
Huh, this is something I feel I needed to hear. A lot of games I try to run feel weird for me because I put the priority in the wrong place. I want players to engage with the world properly, but in doing so I feel as though I work less with their characters and their story as I unfortunately make it my story with guests, not their story of whether or not they ever engage with the lore I have. I need to really sit myself down and work on these things for whenever I run a new one for sure
I think it's also a two way street. You are all playing together, and your players should be cool with engaging with the game they've agreed to play with you as much as you engage with their characters.
Do it, it's soooo wotrh it. Started out like you, seven years agor (and had a really murder Hobo-y group for a long time). Nothing compares to that sweet sweet feel, if they start to ask Questions for themselves about your lore, because they need it. One time they were just chasing some plot item in a big city and learned, that it was in the hands of a noble family they couldn't reach on their own. They had to find an ally. At first they worked with another family and were like "Who cares about that city, as long as we get our Item." But then a third familiy appoached them and told them "Your allies are like... the worst. They are gonna betray you. Works for us instead." And my Murderhobos were like "Why? Di you give us a betetr deal." And the third family was like "Nope. We will pay you muuuuch less. This is how you know, we won't betray you. If we did, we'd offer you the wildest things." And suddenly all my "I just want that big sword" and "can I loot it?" boys were like scheming, planing, and overthinking their choices. They couldn't just compare numbers, they really had to overthink it and take my world serious to win. I really loved that.
I was on the exercise bike warming up and I read the RUclips vid as “ENDING Your Players.”
And let out an audible “Hells Yeah !”
I thought we were about to get a Batman’s contingency plans to Kill off the Justice League type of video.
Please make this video!!!
I LOVE that JLA story arc!
Your videos receive the highest accolade I can award or think of. They are thought provoking.
Fifteen birds in five fir trees,
their feathers were fanned in a fiery breeze!
Oh thank god, a Matt Colville video that I needed.
I think there already quite a few of those
If Matt Mercer is the “king” of DMs Matt Colville is definitely the guru.
There is a type of genius that you think if I only thought of that first I could of done that the other you just step back and realize you couldn't of done that in a million years. I think Matt Colville falls into category A and Mercer into category B. Just personally I will never be good at voice acting as Matt Mercer but with practice I can make use of Colville's methods.
@@michaelduke9057 Well I meant in the fact that Mercer is all over the community (considering you can’t breath without hearing his name) but Colville I feel is not as well known but has some REALLY unique and cool stuff
@@chickeneverythingisfine9338 also accurate I guess I went a little far with the metaphor
Another good way, when you are just starting out, is to give every PC a connection to the world and the Adventure.
In my experience players want to be part of the world the trick is to not overwhelm them with to much information but to keep it simple and give them things that reinforce there characters fantasy or things that excite them.
I've definitely played with DMs that were so obsessed with how interesting and intricate their world was, and so mad that we didn't just WANT to learn everything there was to know about it, but created the world absent of our characters mattering or being necessary to it. If you don't know what motivates your players characters, or what they care about, it's a huge ask to just say "play through this world of cool stuff I made". Don't forget you're asking these people to "roleplay", and good Roleplaying is knowing when and where your character would engage with what's happening.
Mr Colville's ability to convey thoughts and scenarios is amazing! Thanks again for a great video!
Loving this, Matt you always seem to release a video that speaks exactly to the issues I have with the games I run.
I run two campaigns for the last three years, and I didn't even know how to play until I found your first running the game video. Thanks for the lessons and help all these years.
I find the easiest way to engage the players is to make the world about them and their characters. all of my encounters/adventures/places/world building is focused around the player characters and their backgrounds/desires/flaws. now they have no choice but to be engaged.
In my last session, I *literally* backed my players up a tree because a demon bad guy was chasing them through the woods, and they were out of options. They were out of spells, and low on HP. Suddenly, my players wanted to roll their knowledge skills and see if they could learn anything about this demon that would give them an edge. Sadly, I didn’t have a lot of info ready to give them, but it would have been a fantastic opportunity for world building!
In the module series (we're playtesting now for publication) I gave each one of my mewbie players a brief backstory. 1 player had her father kidnapped by a priest of Shar. She's been looking for him for 2 yrs now. Another's cousin never came back from a hidden valley. He's going after him. 2 other players don't know it yet but they're stepbrother & stepsister. They've all been commissioned by the priesthood of Oghma to go up to this lost valley & investigate why 3 other adventuring parties, (only 3 out of 17 made it back) keep going up there and dying! I gave them all "common purpose". Thus that common purposes exposes the lore of my Forgotten Realms.
Well done Matt! Hope to talk to you someday.
I had a DM who engaged one of his players once, they are now divorced....
The only time I ever took away a character's powers I expressly told them at the beggining that it was temporary and I think it worked well as it wasnt for very long either.
Knife theory baby! (from reddit, not my idea):
have your characters add knives to their characters backstory. Each thing the DM can evoke to force a player to react, like a named character, an unpayed debt, a dead family member (just make them come back like a zombie, that'll make'em hate the evil necromancer), is a knife. Experience suggest between 7 and 15 knives makes functional but exploitable backstories. DM's, use this, explain and make the players add them as a buy in.
"If your players can solve every problem with their character sheet then they don't need your world"
Thank you.
I've been watching "Running the Game" since before I started running the game, and I had such an enjoyable feeling watching this of "I already know this, I'm already doing this."
It's not that this episode was not helpful, but that I've been practicing the craft long enough to start drawing many of my own conclusions of what works and what doesn't. This feeling was so much one of validation.
I had a similar feeling a few weeks ago as well. I've been running D&D for a few years and felt so self-conscious about my abilities for so long. Over the holidays, one of my players had their child on our D&D day, when they usually wouldn't. We invited her to play with us, and I built a short sidequest that I thought we could start and complete all in one session. I warned my party in advance "Sorry, this might be the most railroady session I've ever run, but I don't want us to run out of time."
...As soon as we introduced the daughter's character she started just dumping piles and piles of backstory. Most of it had nothing to do with the campaign as it had been going, but none of it was out of the realm of possibility. It actually had some themes that tied to other players' backstories. Her dad tried to interject to get her to dial it back and keep the session on the rails, but I stopped him and told her it was all canon by just playing off of it. I threw all my session's planning out the window and started from scratch. I knew I could work with it. I had no battlemaps (playing online), no NPCs, no monsters, no encounters, no magic items... but I wanted this girl's first experience with D&D to feel like she just spoke the world into existence. It took me a little longer, but I made NPCs on the fly, and made up quirks and voices so they'd be memorable. I threw battle maps together and designed an encounter and some lore while the players roleplayed (of course, uncovering more new lore to throw some of my plans out the window and give me a good line on creating another).
In the end, we had a session that fits into the campaign with lasting concequences, engaged all the players and their characters, focused on this new player, engaged her, and gave her the experience of helping to create this fictional world, and left me with the greatest sense of accomplishment I've ever felt in D&D.
It was an intense night, and I was so exhausted after. But in the instant that I had to decide between forcing the story onto the rails, or rebuilding something magical from the ground up.... I knew there was no question. I knew I could handle it and it was the only choice. That feeling of confidence in my abilities as a DM is one of the best feelings I've ever felt.
I'm just happy you still are making this kind of videos, warms my heart. Take care.
Great video Matt. 1 addition that I've found to chasing them up the tree. If you have a long enough campaign and you can be patient, have the party plant the tree. Set them up with something so their previous decisions are what forces them into the situation. If they have a feeling of ownership of the problem, they are more likely to be engaged in the solution.
Think if the movie "The Mummy" (1999). O'Connell , Evelyn and Johnathan are coaxed into the situation with the lure of adventure and treasure. But they end up releasing Imhotep. Then Imhotep captures Evelyn (and threatens the world) which forces the rest of the party to be engaged. They learn they have to read from the book of the dead, got to the city of the dead etc - all aspects of the world created.
Also, bonus points for the fact that the character of O'Connell had in his backstory that he had been to the city of the dead before hand. Backstory tie-ins help pull people in too (but your mileage may vary on this one).
15:55 - 16:30 - 100% that is the heart of DMing! just watching them noodle-out problems at the table, feeling the world rendering in real time inside our head as they spit-ball ideas that would turn NPC plans into chaos-- realizing whatever they do will turn the rest of the session into complete fast-improv....
There is no entertainment that can even compare.
Dude, this was exactly what I needed. Thank you Mr. Colville, for introducing this life to me so I can introduce it to my friends :)
This series of videos is great! I am starting to take worldbuilding and overarching plot lines more serious in my campaign and your videos are extremely helpfull!
Thank you for taking the time to produce these videos.
Another great way for the players to care about your world is to build it with them and/or have their characters directly connected to it.
Easier to be fascinated with Excalibur when you're the one getting it from the Lady in the Lake.
Although sometimes (as Matt touches on) the simplest way to get the players to pursue a course of action, is to steal some of their valuables.
I've literally had players blow up a ship *they were on* because of what the party _perceived_ as the captain "stealing their treasure," so imagine what players do when that gemstone is their +1 Longsword.
This is exactly how I present things to my players. There always needs to be a motivator, at least one. While they are working on the "over arcing" story, they meet likable, and wonderful NPC's whom they enjoy and repeatedly visit.
So when that NPC ends up kidnapped, they scour the world for the "How" to get them back, working with other NPC's, making more branches. Then when there is a lull in the main story, inject the NPC back in. "Here is where they are, I know you've wanted to find them so I am coming to you."
Which is what is happening right now in one of my campaigns, the time is here for them to jump into a pocket realm to find their lost friend, and uncover some more secrets of their own backstories.
Glorious days ahead.
Outstanding advice Matthew! We appreciate hearing from people who are great at what they do, love doing it, and love sharing what they know! You are a river to your people!
It was foretold in the scrolls of old.
Thank you so much for these videos!
I'm running Phandelver and I'm brand new at D&D and being DM. I used some of your advice and instead of having them come back to turn in their quest and get the reward, they found the quest giver had been beaten unconscious and left to die in his burning house. They had to save him from the house and put out the fire that was spreading to the orchard, and heal the NPC.
When they found out what happened to him and also that their reward was stolen, they were super motivated to go fuck up the redbrand ruffians. The module has the redbrands pick a fight with the party in the town, and there wasn't really any reason for it. So that made it a lot more fun for them to act on behalf of an NPC and save the day.
They also had to be careful in the tavern and not hurt regular villagers or cause property damage, so they had to use a little more tactics than usual, and roleplay calming down the barkeep and Townmaster after they murdered 7 of the ruffians in it.
I got a lot more "that was really fun!" Comments after the session instead of just "thanks for running the session" so that was really satisfying.
i love how this addresses the RELUCTANT HERO aspect of a "trigger word" of the current D&D community: *railroading.*
There is a balance to World building, illustration, and chasing the players up trees, as you say.
On a more involved note-
Even I love to hawk the driving force of my methodology in that I tell my players frankly that I am *always* out to kill their characters. This is mostly a farce, but I use it to the effect that they know that this is about decision-making, teamwork, and challenge. The action can be injected by myself, and I always invite them to bring it as well an share it with the table in-game.
Thanks for being so GREAT, Matthew Coleville.
This is up there with the Lore vs. Writing and Leading a Creative Life videos as my favorite. Awesome job! Can't wait for Arcadia this week
I wouldn't 100% recommend this but last session my DM allowed me to earn a castle as a base through a quest which worked for my exiled noble back story, and because of that I have a reason to care about the world. I have to engaged diplomatically with the rest of the surrounding area and later on with the whole world. I have never been more invested in a character
The chasing up the tree I think comes from the hero’s journey where the protagonist has to deny the quest. Classic trope 😊
Matt, I can't begin to tell you how useful this was to me, even at the 2 minute mark. The rest just reinforced it all. Enough with me forcing lore on my nerds, I'll just give them what they want. Except when they need to care about something in my world. Brilliant, sir.
This is an amazing video. But it does bring up some thoughts in my mind. I like the concept of chasing the players up a tree and forcing them to care about the world and to act. Its also good in general when you have players that say they want an open world where they direct what happens, but then just... don't. Players say they want open and free range to go wherever they want and do whatever they want but rarely actually are willing to put in the effort to do so. Chasing them up a tree is a good way to make them start making decisions.
But you have to be very careful about how you go about do this. Because if you're not, it will come across as railroading them into going where you want them to. Players in my experience are very fickle. Many say they don't want to be railroaded and just want hooks thrown at them to go where they choose to do so, but then just never actually make a decision about where to go and the game stalls. Or they want a completely open world and want to direct the game where they want to go, but then just don't take the reigns and drive. Its a fine line between chasing them up a tree, and them knowing that you have chased them up a tree.
Players want agency which I completely agree is extremely important to any game, but also don't want to make decisions for fear of making the wrong decision. It takes time to learn how to chase players up a tree, and get them to think that they are the ones that chose to climb it in the first place.
This might be oversimplifying it a bit: To me it feels like "chasing up a tree" happens to characters, while "railroading" happens to players.
There is usually (or should be) some pre-game discussion about the adventure coming up. Sometimes called "session zero". This way the players (people at the table) already want to do it and it's down to hooking their characters (who only exist in the game world) into the events. So, using Matt's example of "Against the Cult of the Reptile God" the players go in knowing they will at some point end up "Against the Cult of the Reptile God". How, where, and when they get wrapped up in that is where their agency comes in but there has to be an agreement/understanding between the players and DM that a conflict "Against the Cult of the Reptile God" is the point of this adventure. Players who aren't interested in that will have had the opportunity to say as much in the pre-game discussion and elect to take part or not. - or suggest/request an alternative.
That's the comment I was looking for. Player agency is a critical part of the game, as Matt himself says in another video. I usually divide games between sandboxes and slides, and tell my players in which category we start the game. On a "slide" they expect to be reactive, as in the action movies. In a sandbox, I expect them to push the game forward (see Matt's video on West marches for that style of play)
So excited to finally have another one of these
Great video, Matt.
I think my proudest DM moments have been when my players have used my world's logic to solve problems without prompting and, in one case, theorised something entirely seperate to the plot using the world's logic....something irrelevant but also correct!
I've started trying to teach the logic in small pieces until it's absorbed as a part of an adventure solution until it's assimilated (like a video game tutorial so they learn it bit by bit) which has led to larger eureka moments. Big thing for me is not overloading new players with learning the system and the world at the same time. Let them learn the D&D 'physics' of the world and then slowly introduce them to my own idiosyncrasies. Mainly I've found it important to map out my own logic so, like a 'hard' magic system, it's something that they can bank on working and they can work out why things don't work if they make a mistake.
Mostly I loved the opening thesis statement. I world bit for my own benefit, it lets me be more reactive to the players doing weird stuff because I understand my world. I also really enjoy it but that's why I DM a lot more than I play.
The timing of this couldn't be more perfect!! I am a relatively new DM who just started a brand new campaign with players who didn't seem to care about my plot hook and I had to pull out some Deus Ex Machina junk out of my sleeve and actually have an NPC say "What can I give you to go on this mission to kill the Goblin leader?". It really helped put things in perspective and not just assume they'll take the bait of "saving the princess" or "huge cash reward!!"
Matt nails it again. This video has some really great content and is communicated perfectly. Really great stuff!
Creating the world is for DMs. The second you let go that the players should "love your world" and realize you do that work for you, the better.
It also helps for a smoother experience when they're used on the spot, but yeah. That.
@@commandercaptain4664that part. World building to me is a guideline to putting the narration down.
This is great! I'm actually having fun with worldbuilding right now, because I've made it somewhat cooperative with one of my players. The party is in a place his character frequented a lot in backstory, so we've chatted and laid out NPCs and places for him to be able to show off and go to, and as he catches up with people they can tell him about the world and what he's missed, so I can sprinkle in my favorite lore without needing to do too much chasing up trees 😄
Another way to make players care. If they are partly the authors, then they will care about that section.
"i was going to make a video about different kinds of players and how to engage your players, but it started to get long. so you're going to get 2 videos; different kinds of players, and engaging your players"
stoked to finally see part 2.
This subject comes at such a perfect time for the game I have coming up, thanks Matt!
So much of your content will have a teacher (or at least one who is thoughtful about their craft!) nodding their head the whole way through. Source: I teach elementary music 🤗
I'm so glad I got on the Patreon so I could get this script early. I read the script on Saturday in preparation for Saturday night's game and the part about forcing characters to solve a problem without their character sheet was HUGE for me this weekend. I forced the party to split by having a large enemy retreat while the dying body of one of the players was in its grasp, which made the players abandon their abilities in favor of figuring out who had a potion and how they could get it to the dying character.
Later in the session, I had a different player have an encounter with an archfey through a book and we had ZERO rolls in the entire 30 minute encounter. There was nothing the character could have done to change the course of events and they just had a conversation. This allowed me to tease several important pieces of lore without boring the players (even the ones who were passive observers at this point). I gave them just enough information to pique their interest, so hopefully that means they'll want to engage with that later in the campaign.
As always, great content timed perfectly to aid my game. Keep up the great work!
Strong motivation for characters walks a very very VERY fine line between railroading your players and a sandbox. I know the first time I tried to run a campaign, my players effectively wanted to be railroaded and saw D&D as more of a board game to play for the sake of playing instead of being characters in a story, which forced me to railroad them along the storyline to get them involved. Granted I was a new DM and was happy to go along with my story, but I wasn't getting the kind of excitement I was hoping for. Seeing videos and tips like this though have been really helpful for the second run through of that same campaign with a new group, where now my players are engaged in the story and want to interact with things to see what will happen. Nothing against the first group of players ,they were really fun to play with. But a really good and enjoyable D&D game will have that motivation for your players without necessarily forcing them to act exactly how you want them to. This has been my D&D TED talk, thank u for listening
So wonderful. Also I feel the need to say this... I can't wait to read Fighter!! :)
And here we go, i know i will rewatch this video at leat 100 times.
Preach
I'm so thankful for your video on Cult of the Reptile God! (And this one!) I have adapted it to change the beginning of Hoard of the Dragon for my players. Instead of arriving in Greenest to see the Cult attacking with a dragon - they arrived to investigate the cult. They run into kobolds in the woods. People are acting strange. They investigate a strange mist that the local apothecary convinces them is caused by a dragon's lair. The cult kidnaps a PC. They avoid being charmed/poisoned by the thralls in the village. Turns out the apothecary is a vampire whose lair they are *actually* in, (and have a 1.5 hour conversation with the vampire,) before making a deal with her to screw over the Cult she has grown to dislike in her territory and accomplish their initial mission they were hired for.
They are a very roleplay heavy group and providing them with a ton of options has meant we have had a ton of fun while I've backed them into a corner. They wouldn't invite the vampire in when she arrived at night and asked to talk over wine with the 2 PCs standing watch - so one of her thralls opened the door for her. Checkmate.
They now have a vampire as their group patron, investigating the Cult of the Dragon. :)
I clicked on this video just because it's a Matt Colville video. I had no expectation that it would be so relevant to something that I'm working on now, but lo and behold it was. Thank you for clearing my brain clog.
It's a good day when Matt uploads.
Who would've thought that directly Involving your players with your lore and story would be so effective at engaging them? :y
Freaking genius. Exactly what I needed at the stage I'm at in DMing. Matthew, thank you for inspiring me to start this. I'm having fun so far, and so are my players. What a practical perspective.
i have to say thank you sooooooo much for introducing me to Against the cult of the reptial god in one of your other episodes! i ran it for my players had was thinking "How do i get them to Careabout this village" and eventually went with the local Baron has highered then as investigators to see why he's not been receiveing his taxes.
Your videos have helped me so much with being a better DM and my players have been enjoying our games more, so thank you so, so much!
Scribbles in notes: If they don’t care, hold them hostage!
Matthew,this video, amongst ALL the "advice" videos on D&D on youtube, is amazingly refreshing and hits certain REALLY important marks. One can tell you are a writer on top of being a DM ^^
Addendum: Who in the nine hells downvotes this for what reason?
One hook like that I worked into my game which I'm pretty proud of was, when the party were about level 3 and a little directionless as the world was starting to open up, all Light-related magic stopped working. This had two notable effects - the Cleric could no longer access his main damaging spells, and a magical barrier held up by the local Sun-based religion around an undead city temporarily disappeared. Suddenly, they had a clear goal: fix whatever is wrong with the magic. This led them to learn about and get invested in a huge part of my world - that religion's role in society, the history of the Lich in that city, the dwarven terror cell that disrupted the magic in the first place, and especially the fundamentals of how magic works in the world. They're level 10 now and, while light magic is back, there's still an undead horde led by an increasingly powerful Lich wreaking havoc, which they now care about dealing with.
Speaking of world building, in the last session of the Eberron game I'm running I updated the map (it had been a hastily hand drawn w/ only the most important details marked) and this time included such things as farmland in the update, and it warmed my heart so much when one of the players commented they enjoyed the world building of actually having a large farming area near a city to support it.
Alternate title: the Correct Useage of Railroads
Or worse still they need to go down there and imagine whats standing between them and the cure they're hunting for?
That freaking Iron Golem!
In my lvl 8 Gnomish Campaign, in the first session, their underground city was invaded by goblins. After escaping to the underdark, and running around for a few days game time, they were captured while they rested after fighting a powerful foe in a pocket dimension.
They are now back inside the city, which has been deserted mostly apart from scouting parties of goblins and their mounts. They have most recently discovered the remaining city population is being held near the mine, guarded by a large number of hobgoblin and goblin minions
We had a very cool small campaign last year where we played monsters as characters. That was the initial quirk our DM used as bait. We ended with two players (less people more fun via online gaming) playing an Imp Bard and a Doppelgänger Inquisitor. It was a blast. We plotted against our Dungeon Lord (the master of our characters), the towns nearby and at each other. The characters had a realy weird relationship with each other based on raw power (doppelganger wins), status to the dungeon lord (Imp Familiar wins), and so forth. But we managed to keep balance and as our DM just stated a week ago he was surprised how naturaly the both characters get along with each other while simulatiously were ready to use any advantage against the other one.
When I just watched this video I acknowledged, the reason we had so much fun was basically the simple fact that both players used every chance they got to chase the other up the tree without the use of actual violence towards each other. Our DM just needed to implement his story and lore in our newest conspiracy and provided us with targets we realy learned to hate. Like the adventurerer group we murdered over the course of several days, throwing the whole town in a state of paranoia against their nobles and snatching them off one by one, because they simply would have crushed us if we played fair.