I guarantee that once people start to use synths like Nina with this technology, they will not want to go back to knobs that just stay in a static position when you switch between presets. It's not a gimmick. It's a totally logical evolution for digitally-controlled instruments.
Only problem with this argument is that this is not new technology at all. If it's new in being affordable and durable, then we're talking. However, there's a reason we don't see this, sadly.
But the budget synths then will beed cheaper motors. Thus it can (potentially) lead to worse quality of motors in such synths or (in a better perspective) cheaper general production of motors while the orders will become much more massive in quantity. P.S. Also don't forget that each motor weighs pretty much! Liteweighted synths will not be using this.
I think it's pretty cool, and have thought about trying to make something like this myself before. I ended up deciding it would be easier to just use light rings around the knobs instead.
If credit is your issue, Zzounds or AMS(American music supply) are FANTASTIC options. Up to 6 interest free, no credit check, debit payment plans. It's how I've been getting my gear on a low-mid income 👍🏻
The knobs alone with the magnetic detents honestly feel like such a step forward! I imagine it's one of the main reasons driving the price up, which is frankly quite inaccessible, but I'm still so happy someone went and tried to innovate in this domain *while still creating a good synth on its own merits*.
People think it’s expensive because of the motorised panel, while it is actually more like a 12 voice Pro3 with a simpler filter section (and less advanced sequencer). It sounds great and it is a lovely thing to use, and pretty stable even with the initial software.
Was impressed by the design and bought it for the sound when they were cheaper pre release. Sold a polyevolver 8 voice for it and I’m not disappointed. It sounds better to me. I’m not worried about the motors when I heard they were contactless drone motors. Should outlive any encoders+leds and it’s way nicer. One of the Best synth to come out of recent times. The price is on par with a prophet 10 or trigon and the sound and quality is in that league.
Totally love the sound and the execution, it's a lovely piece of engineering. I am already having nightmares about possible maintenance for the motors though.
Drone motors don't really require maintenance, they're magnetic. Considering they're capable of moving to fast they can literally fly, i think they'll be okay to turn back and forth a few million times. These will probably outlive me. I'm a bit more sad about the choice of USB-C port, I'd rather have a USB-B for stability. But I did buy a 180-degree usb-C adapter for my Nina which anchors it quite nicely.
I hope this thing becames a very successful product for Melbourne, they deserve it for taking chances and making something new. Also, hope this became a trend so the price gets lower but I might be dreaming too much...
Reminds me of the first time I saw flying faders in person. It just seems like magic, and the fact that they use the motors for haptic is really awesome. Not quite looking to spend anything near that but it seems worth it for the R&D. I hope it takes off.
this is such a great idea. I've always wanted a moog with motorized knobs, or even a juno106 with motorized faders. Maybe behringer will take notice and use their BCF2000 / x touch technology to build a synth with this type of control.
I just ordered one and will commit to a one year later review. After owning many properly treated synths, I'm really not worried. The developers of the instrument are highly invested (as am I, obviously). In general, I believe that mass produced motors are designed for a much higher level of wear and tear than a synth will give them. Like in cars, airplanes, etc. Let ya know in a year.
I think it's a great synth, being able to go from 1 patch to another and see exactly what the settings are is amazeballz. It's expensive, but then it should be. Thx for the upload.
This is NOT a gimmick, every one of the other synth makers should be implementing this into their synths. Having a detent for zero with endless encoders is invaluable, also having one knob where the detent can switch to smooth depending on the parameter control is so versatile. Not having to hope you got a parameter as close to the preset position after switching, priceless. True morphing between 2 patches has great potential for live performances. I am truly interested in this one!
100% a gimmick mate, no one will ever use this tech again. Encoders are infinitely more practical and there's no way the visually impaired are a big enough audience to justify this tech to serious companies
Twice the price tag with features removed to make way for motorised pots, standard sonic features swapped out for a motorised knob? no thanks. yes everyone would love motorised controls with memory, we had them on our high end mixing desks back in the 90's but it never caught on for good reasons, mainly the price. As musician and producer I would never swap sonic options for mere convenience (at a hugely inflated price)
Good to see synthdesigners utilize proper cherryswitches and keyboardkeys. The whole unit looks very nice and sounds good. Eventhough i'm not really in for the motorknobs the idea is not bad. Just a little redundant. But looks cool and morphing is always nice. Thanks for showing it! 🙂
I love the motorized knobs. The mod-matrix usage was definitely a wow! moment. This is the sort of innovation I'd like to see for a VST controller...if someone would make something like this for Diva...
Game changer indeed. This really pushes the boundaries of interaction with present based synths and controllers. And I love how they expand functionality with the mod matrix, detention and crossfade. Thanks for another great video!
I don't think i've ever wanted hands on with a synth more.... in terms of HID's... this is pretty amazing! I really feel that this is the future of all synth knobs, on premium products due to cost, of course.
When I bought my first poly synth (Prophet 6), I just ASSUMED for that kind of money all the knobs would be motorized. Glad to see companies starting to make this a reality
If this thing had overbridge-like DAW integration it would be GOD tier. Imagine bi-directional automation with a DAW with motors moving with instant recall and visual in physical space of automation.
omg this thing looks gorgeous! Full 909 style switches, mechanical knobs, analogue poly, metal (aluminum?) side cheeks, oled screen, they spared no expense. I disagree with the comments on here about it being overpriced, all these features are very cost prohibitive, especially today with chip costs and supply chain issues etc.. I can’t afford one that’s for sure but I understand why its high priced.
At first look the moto-knobs seem like a gimmick, but as you revealed how the control knobs are actually endless encoders with very high resolution and mag detent haptics, the value of physically tracking their relative orientation across modes expands considerably. I would think, however, that LED ring encoders are more practical and cost effective. As always, your comprehensive pros and cons comparisons clarify the value of this specialty "boutique" design in relation to other options.
Am I mad for wanting both? Assuming money's no object, which I think we are forced to. Motorised knobs for the eyes-free tactile indicator, LED rings to display mod depth and, through colour, routing and mode.
@@stephenspackman5573 not mad at all! I was thinking the ultimate GUI for a synth would be physical motorized encoders and all of the surrounding synth deck would actually be a display surface. This way, different patches/ modes/ playlists/ whatever “scenes” you could dream up, all of the knobs could relabel themselves as well as restructure their force feedback profile. I would call it the Chameleon. I just wouldn’t want to pay for it…
Ever since I touched my first synthesizer 5 years ago, I was wondering why they don't motorize the knobs. Finally, here it is! Hope to see it on every synth.
@@cloudfan420 Why "likely"? The potential for a physical mechanism to fail in time seems a lot higher to me, and considering the price this will be a very niche product. Chances are the company won't be around years down the line. Motorized control is sexy, of course. It would make more sense to me if they produced a generic motorized controller. And well, the BCR2000 did eight motorized controls for chump change.
So cool to see this finally getting into some hands! The UI design using motor resistance for center or end of parameters on the knobs is rad. Makes me wonder about long term maintenance and such tho Post full watch digestion: impressive feature set, but I have to wonder what direction the firmware will go. The digital fx are limited rn but it's built off raspberry pi/elk audio, so I imagine firmware updates or user mods will be excellent. I still don't feel totally sold on the raw sound of the thing tho, which is.. pretty big for something of this price point.
I'm no pro on this topic, but I would imagine the motors used here are similar to something like the stepper motors (stm) in some camera lenses, where they are used for both manual and electrical focusing. I've never seen one of those break so far. That being said they are probably still more prone to fail one day than any encoder like knobs. Let's talk again in five to ten years from now :D
Cmon guys, you all know we don’t actually use the synths, we just watch hours of videos analyzing them until we buy them and never actually touch them after the first day we have them. I’m sure all 5 people who fall into the category of actually using gear AND being able to afford it will be just fine.
127 patches per bank. And 127 banks? So, 16,127 patch slots in total? That’s insane, if so. I love that. And how many factory presets is it shipping with?
@@Malwensound I still really love it. My only complaint is that the modulation system isn’t fast enough to do clean audio rate modulation. So, oscillator 3 is a mod source, but if you use it to modulate the filter cutoff, it sounds very crappy, unless you use it in LFO mode.
Seen it at NAMM22, the knob invention is nifty, working with these is awesome, the guy had a demo knob in a transparent case, he was kind of reluctant to show it, like it is not patented yet. Nice video as always from Loopop.
I'm sure that they just use proper driver chips for the usual industry motors. That's it. Search for "sensorless homing 3d printer" and you'll get the idea.
The motorized knobs make the UI very good. It reminds me of the Hydrasynth in that someone who cares about usability clearly made this. Certainly an interesting synth but I think it would be far more competitive in the $2k range
i got to play this thing at synth expo LA, and it was phenomenal. the attendant was great at explaining how it worked, i even got to record some samples 😈
my slim phatties can handle the knob issues with light rings and special catch up modes but uh... this is on that whole other level! gorgeous and good sound here. i wish all my synths had this!
I think this will help people go back and forth from digital to analog equipment super easy because alot of DAWs have this same kind of feature where the knobs move on their own usually because of automation clips
Once again! Bravo! This is a very creative time in synthesis and user interface. As someone who makes a living playing the trumpet but who has also been using synths since the late 1970s, now is the time we have some pedagogy! Sorry got on my soapbox. Carry on!
A digitally controlled analog interface is a great idea. If you like the immediacy of analog gear without menus and DAW-oriented systems then this will probably resonate with you.
I've had one of these for about 9 months. It's amazing, if you have the time. I highly recommend for professionals. Casual hobbyists might feel out of their depth and just use the presets. The presets are good, don't get me wrong. But the power of this thing is really not having to take photos of your settings that you had in a jam one day and use it a month later. It's totally doable, but you have to read the manual. And it's got a pretty high price tag. Still not done paying for it.
Thank u for the demo 👌 I definitely think it's not a gimmick, it's really an intuitive and creative idea in a time where other companies invest in making cheap replicas Thanks again for the effort 👍
About time someone did this! Digital mixers have had motorized faders for years now, I've wanted a synth with motorized controls since first using a digital mixer. I bet a cheaper take on this idea could be done if the synth used faders/sliders instead of knobs, like on an old ARP.
@@Aetila I think it's just the price. Checkout how much replacement behringer faders cost. And you still need to add the cost of the fader motor driver.
@@drofdissonance But they already had a motorized programmer BF 2000 or similar, it didn't cost so much. I bought the Bodyssey but it was a rerminder why I din't like synths without memory, the synth itself was wonderful. I just imagined what if they had motorized faders on that one, it would have been great...but yes, it may not be reliable and would cost more. I'm done with with synth without memory anyway, lol. Peace
What a fantastic instrument both in concept and sound. Motorized knobs is anything but gimmick. Morph is a amazing way to find unique sounds. Keep my fingers crossed for such a innovation company
Kind of expensive but the features and layout look like it would be a super programmable friendly synth. 12 voice analog with friendliness of a Nord Lead 2 or 3. Very nice and compelling sounds and features. I love the motorized knobs and that does make for easy deconstruction of presets and features/fx also. Can’t say I’ll be getting it, but if I didn’t already have a Virus Ti, Ti2, Nord Lead 2X, and Waldorf Blofeld, I’d seriously consider it. Tough choice between this and a Deckard’s Dream, Kijimi, or ISE-NIN from Black Corporation
@@drofdissonance the closest example I can think of would be the M4 by Der Mann Mit Der Machine which is 4 motorized faders in a eurorack format for ~$500. So if they sold something for $2k it'd be competitive (knobs offer more precision over faders too)
@loopop Something you didn't cover is whether the knobs can be used to send Midi values out to other outboard gear or a computer. The value proposition of this as both a hardware synth AND a midi controller with preset saves and moving knobs would be very much stronger than a hardware synth alone.
I cannot believe how dismissive people are of this brilliant synth. Comparing these high resolution self rotating knobs to LED rings? Come on guys. We're talking like 100+ resolution vs like what, 15-20 leds??? This is miles ahead!!!! And to everyone shitting on the design saying the motors will fail...you must not have heard when he said it used drone motors. Does anyone here know what a drone motor is designed to withstand over the course of it's lifetime? This is way overbuilt for the use case, which was almost certainly done on purpose to extend longevity. I'm really disappointed in the synth community right now. Show this synth the love it deserves! And by the way, it's a 12 voice analog polyphonic synth, it's not expensive for what it is, motors or no motors.
Yea Loopop is by far the most thorough and knowledgeable hardware reviewers in the known synth world. Happy to watch each and everyone of his videos even if it’s too expensive for me 😂
I want one. Someone should gift me one! lol! Your reviews are just always so great. One certainly doesn't have to be shopping to enjoy them... just be a person who really likes synths. More than just product reviews, they end up be instructional just on how synths work and flow and sound. Having the index on the left is so thoughtful, and with synths I DO have... so helpful as I refer to your videos on those with some regularity. Thanks!
What I would really like to see is this hardware minus the audio component, and an industry-wide new protocol (or MIDI extension) for controlling the knobs.
Are those knobs going to work five or ten years down the line? Will the company even exist to get replacement parts from? I have a serious concerns about buying a synth with that many motors in it
On the one hand, I think that's a valid concern. On the other hand, look at professional-grade consoles for live music. You won't find one that doesn't have motorized faders. Yes, the market is mostly dominated by huge companies like Yamaha, Behringer/Midas, Presonus, Digico, etc, but motorized faders are at nearly every professionally-produced live music event. Are these a fail point on pro consoles? Hell yes. I've seen multiple issues in person--but they get fixed. Faders and scribble strips and encoders can all be repaired or replaced. I would love to see a video of someone gutting this synth, showing what's under the hood, and explaining to what degree these synths are prepared for failure, and how big of a bear it would be to repair one of these if and when the manufacturer eventually folds.
@MoogMusicInc solved the same issue 17 years ago with a much simpler design using LEDs around every knob with the Slim patty and Little Phatty. I think it was the last project to be carried out while Robert Moog was still alive.
the resolution was awful with the slim/little and the encoders felt really bad, like nothing attached to it, anyway it's just one thing that this motorised knobs can do.
![[Limbus Company - PV] Chapter.7 - Oblivion](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VUpkXPkvoxU/mqdefault.jpg)
I guarantee that once people start to use synths like Nina with this technology, they will not want to go back to knobs that just stay in a static position when you switch between presets. It's not a gimmick. It's a totally logical evolution for digitally-controlled instruments.
Unless the evolution also includes the price tag...
Only problem with this argument is that this is not new technology at all. If it's new in being affordable and durable, then we're talking. However, there's a reason we don't see this, sadly.
🥰
But the budget synths then will beed cheaper motors. Thus it can (potentially) lead to worse quality of motors in such synths or (in a better perspective) cheaper general production of motors while the orders will become much more massive in quantity.
P.S. Also don't forget that each motor weighs pretty much! Liteweighted synths will not be using this.
I think it's pretty cool, and have thought about trying to make something like this myself before. I ended up deciding it would be easier to just use light rings around the knobs instead.
I can rarely afford anything featured here, but these videos are so well made I can't help but watch.
Oh just steal it 😉
I don't how how he achieved to afford himself it all...
If credit is your issue, Zzounds or AMS(American music supply) are FANTASTIC options.
Up to 6 interest free, no credit check, debit payment plans. It's how I've been getting my gear on a low-mid income 👍🏻
@@coheedfreak06 🤦♂️😉
meanwhile, people watch The "news"
The knobs alone with the magnetic detents honestly feel like such a step forward! I imagine it's one of the main reasons driving the price up, which is frankly quite inaccessible, but I'm still so happy someone went and tried to innovate in this domain *while still creating a good synth on its own merits*.
To watch the morph and see the encoders moving is really something special ❤
being able to see exactly what the patch is doing from one to another is amazing.
I wish it also show lfo movements but they can be pretty intense so I understand why it's not implemented 😊
@@orchidsvoid i thought the same 😅
They're a hell of a lot faster than I expected, seeing them zip around as he quickly cycled the patches was truly impressive
People think it’s expensive because of the motorised panel, while it is actually more like a 12 voice Pro3 with a simpler filter section (and less advanced sequencer). It sounds great and it is a lovely thing to use, and pretty stable even with the initial software.
Was impressed by the design and bought it for the sound when they were cheaper pre release. Sold a polyevolver 8 voice for it and I’m not disappointed. It sounds better to me. I’m not worried about the motors when I heard they were contactless drone motors. Should outlive any encoders+leds and it’s way nicer. One of the Best synth to come out of recent times. The price is on par with a prophet 10 or trigon and the sound and quality is in that league.
Mind if I ask how you're getting on with it? :)
@@Malwensoundvery well thanks. Nearly sold it for a 3rd wave when I got murmux v3 but couldn’t do it in the end. It’s a great synth.
One of the most aesthetic synths I've ever seen!
me think so too
This synth is really special. Even without motorized potentiometers - it's 12 voice analog, multitimbral and morph which is rare nowadays.
Virus does more for less cost over a decade ago
@@GuitarsAndSynths yes but not analog.
@@GuitarsAndSynths Virus is nothing like this, stick to John's channel, where the blind lead the blind.
@ghost mall what do you pay for a 12 voice analog synth? Besides Behringer?
@ghost mall well you're making comments about how much it costs in relation to other synths...maybe check the prices XD
Totally love the sound and the execution, it's a lovely piece of engineering. I am already having nightmares about possible maintenance for the motors though.
Their website claims the knobs have a lifetime rating in excess of 50 million cycles. If true, pretty amazing.
Yeah, the more that things move, the more likely they'll have to be replaced over time. Still a dope piece of engineering and sound.
motors are based on drone tech so there are no issues, coreless if I remember correctly.
Drone motors don't really require maintenance, they're magnetic. Considering they're capable of moving to fast they can literally fly, i think they'll be okay to turn back and forth a few million times. These will probably outlive me. I'm a bit more sad about the choice of USB-C port, I'd rather have a USB-B for stability. But I did buy a 180-degree usb-C adapter for my Nina which anchors it quite nicely.
@@Standard.Candle so each knob has a brushless motor?
I hope this thing becames a very successful product for Melbourne, they deserve it for taking chances and making something new.
Also, hope this became a trend so the price gets lower but I might be dreaming too much...
🥰
Ehh.. their embedded software engineers could use a little work.
It’s the implementation of detents and stops via the motors that amazes me.
Reminds me of the first time I saw flying faders in person. It just seems like magic, and the fact that they use the motors for haptic is really awesome. Not quite looking to spend anything near that but it seems worth it for the R&D. I hope it takes off.
this is such a great idea. I've always wanted a moog with motorized knobs, or even a juno106 with motorized faders. Maybe behringer will take notice and use their BCF2000 / x touch technology to build a synth with this type of control.
I'd love to see someone review this in a year of regular use to see how well the knobs have held up!
This is what I'm most concerned over.
I just ordered one and will commit to a one year later review. After owning many properly treated synths, I'm really not worried. The developers of the instrument are highly invested (as am I, obviously). In general, I believe that mass produced motors are designed for a much higher level of wear and tear than a synth will give them. Like in cars, airplanes, etc. Let ya know in a year.
If they used something other than pots or mechanical encoders it will last forever
@@enginerdy It's a brushless motor with optical readout. Should be very robust.
still fine :)
I think it's a great synth, being able to go from 1 patch to another and see exactly what the settings are is amazeballz.
It's expensive, but then it should be.
Thx for the upload.
This is NOT a gimmick, every one of the other synth makers should be implementing this into their synths. Having a detent for zero with endless encoders is invaluable, also having one knob where the detent can switch to smooth depending on the parameter control is so versatile. Not having to hope you got a parameter as close to the preset position after switching, priceless. True morphing between 2 patches has great potential for live performances. I am truly interested in this one!
All you need is your ears, not to see a knob moving. This is a toy
@@tonybucks5709 I am blind, I see from feeling, plus I'm sure my ears aren't that bad, I already use my ears more than most
@@tonybucks5709 hearing has nothing to do with it, you miss the all point but yes its amazing toy :)
100% a gimmick mate, no one will ever use this tech again. Encoders are infinitely more practical and there's no way the visually impaired are a big enough audience to justify this tech to serious companies
Twice the price tag with features removed to make way for motorised pots, standard sonic features swapped out for a motorised knob? no thanks.
yes everyone would love motorised controls with memory, we had them on our high end mixing desks back in the 90's but it never caught on for good reasons, mainly the price. As musician and producer I would never swap sonic options for mere convenience (at a hugely inflated price)
Good to see synthdesigners utilize proper cherryswitches and keyboardkeys. The whole unit looks very nice and sounds good. Eventhough i'm not really in for the motorknobs the idea is not bad. Just a little redundant. But looks cool and morphing is always nice. Thanks for showing it! 🙂
haven't seen something this refreshing in the synth design world in a while
This synth will be considered a classic once more manufacturers embrace knobs like this. It sounds dope too!
agree, sounds good
It sounds nice and looks beautiful imo. The sight of the knobs turning automatically is pretty awesome.
I love the motorized knobs. The mod-matrix usage was definitely a wow! moment. This is the sort of innovation I'd like to see for a VST controller...if someone would make something like this for Diva...
Game changer indeed. This really pushes the boundaries of interaction with present based synths and controllers. And I love how they expand functionality with the mod matrix, detention and crossfade. Thanks for another great video!
this breaks my brain seeing them knobs turn themselves 😱 so freaking cool
Amazing bit of kit. I’d love it if these guys made a MIDI controller with the same knobs as a bank of 32.
Agreed! Something like the BCR 2000 with motorized knobs could be cool
even 8 will be enough.
I don't think i've ever wanted hands on with a synth more.... in terms of HID's... this is pretty amazing! I really feel that this is the future of all synth knobs, on premium products due to cost, of course.
When you brought up that detent MAGIC it went from a cool novelty to🤯😱🙌👏👏👏
Seeing the plate on the back, this bad boi is Aussie ❤ so freaking cool to see an aussie made (well assembled) product on a loopop video 😍
I realized from the plate as well. Because when I read Melbourne Instruments I thought it was canadian...
😍
Ha! Melbourne Instruments basically have fixed all complaints from this video. This synth rocks, one of my best purchases
Probably the coolest synth I've seen in my life!! I want one!
Coarse vs Fine tune functionality is nothing short of magical, I am quite in awe of these motorised pots!
I just wish it wasn’t 5 grand in my country…
What a good looking synth !! Ah and the buttons !!!
When I bought my first poly synth (Prophet 6), I just ASSUMED for that kind of money all the knobs would be motorized. Glad to see companies starting to make this a reality
That's a very strange assumption to make
@@Barefoot_Joe Why?
If this thing had overbridge-like DAW integration it would be GOD tier. Imagine bi-directional automation with a DAW with motors moving with instant recall and visual in physical space of automation.
Ok straight up, the auto motorized dials just reminded me of the Rubix clock. Cool as hell!
I absolutely love my NINA. It's a game-changer!
Mind if I ask how you're getting on with it? :)
@@Malwensound I still think it's a good synth. Is there anything specific you want to know about it?
this has been on my list for when i hit the lottery. glad you did a video on it!
As a Melburnian, I commend you for pronouncing Melbourne correctly😊
It's pronounce, Mooborne, not Maughbunn!!!
omg this thing looks gorgeous! Full 909 style switches, mechanical knobs, analogue poly, metal (aluminum?) side cheeks, oled screen, they spared no expense. I disagree with the comments on here about it being overpriced, all these features are very cost prohibitive, especially today with chip costs and supply chain issues etc.. I can’t afford one that’s for sure but I understand why its high priced.
yep AL sides. The rackmount sides are steel though
The way those knobs just dance about is so cool! 😊
At first look the moto-knobs seem like a gimmick, but as you revealed how the control knobs are actually endless encoders with very high resolution and mag detent haptics, the value of physically tracking their relative orientation across modes expands considerably. I would think, however, that LED ring encoders are more practical and cost effective. As always, your comprehensive pros and cons comparisons clarify the value of this specialty "boutique" design in relation to other options.
Am I mad for wanting both? Assuming money's no object, which I think we are forced to. Motorised knobs for the eyes-free tactile indicator, LED rings to display mod depth and, through colour, routing and mode.
@@stephenspackman5573 not mad at all! I was thinking the ultimate GUI for a synth would be physical motorized encoders and all of the surrounding synth deck would actually be a display surface. This way, different patches/ modes/ playlists/ whatever “scenes” you could dream up, all of the knobs could relabel themselves as well as restructure their force feedback profile. I would call it the Chameleon. I just wouldn’t want to pay for it…
@@chriskelvin248 this is a fantastic idea
@@stephenspackman5573 Yeah, I like having LED rings for low light playing.
There will be a reason Clavia Nord only did this once.
I really hope every single piece of equipment with knobs and memory in the future will have this functionality
Can’t wait until all synths in the future have scores of motors that will eventually fail and need repair
@@sub-jec-tiv well that still wouldn't be too bad. No need for salty sarcasm about something that's literally just fun and interesting
Ever since I touched my first synthesizer 5 years ago, I was wondering why they don't motorize the knobs. Finally, here it is! Hope to see it on every synth.
LED ringed endless rotaries solved this long ago. Looks great, but I doubt the price will convince many.
LED ring encoders don't change how they feel depending on their state, unless their state is broken (which will likely happen sooner than with these).
@@cloudfan420 Why "likely"? The potential for a physical mechanism to fail in time seems a lot higher to me, and considering the price this will be a very niche product. Chances are the company won't be around years down the line. Motorized control is sexy, of course. It would make more sense to me if they produced a generic motorized controller. And well, the BCR2000 did eight motorized controls for chump change.
So cool to see this finally getting into some hands! The UI design using motor resistance for center or end of parameters on the knobs is rad. Makes me wonder about long term maintenance and such tho
Post full watch digestion: impressive feature set, but I have to wonder what direction the firmware will go. The digital fx are limited rn but it's built off raspberry pi/elk audio, so I imagine firmware updates or user mods will be excellent. I still don't feel totally sold on the raw sound of the thing tho, which is.. pretty big for something of this price point.
yea.. endless encoder with a value display will probably live longer than motorized knobs
Hopefully, they did a failure mode analysis of those motors
I'm no pro on this topic, but I would imagine the motors used here are similar to something like the stepper motors (stm) in some camera lenses, where they are used for both manual and electrical focusing. I've never seen one of those break so far. That being said they are probably still more prone to fail one day than any encoder like knobs. Let's talk again in five to ten years from now :D
Cmon guys, you all know we don’t actually use the synths, we just watch hours of videos analyzing them until we buy them and never actually touch them after the first day we have them. I’m sure all 5 people who fall into the category of actually using gear AND being able to afford it will be just fine.
@@MrJemabaris plenty of time to fawn, buy, make music with, get over, and sell any piece of gear LOL
Wow, synths get better and better! I love all the great ideas from synth designers.
I got to play with this at NAMM in 2022! Was really fun to try out. Was my favorite thing from the show.
Very good demonstration of its capabilities! ❤
127 patches per bank. And 127 banks? So, 16,127 patch slots in total? That’s insane, if so. I love that.
And how many factory presets is it shipping with?
A few dozen, in several categories
I picked one of these up as soon as I saw a full walk-through. It's fantastic. You almost can't get it to sound bad.
Mind if I ask how you're getting on with it? :)
@@Malwensound I still really love it. My only complaint is that the modulation system isn’t fast enough to do clean audio rate modulation. So, oscillator 3 is a mod source, but if you use it to modulate the filter cutoff, it sounds very crappy, unless you use it in LFO mode.
Seen it at NAMM22, the knob invention is nifty, working with these is awesome, the guy had a demo knob in a transparent case, he was kind of reluctant to show it, like it is not patented yet. Nice video as always from Loopop.
I'm sure that they just use proper driver chips for the usual industry motors. That's it. Search for "sensorless homing 3d printer" and you'll get the idea.
The motorized knobs make the UI very good. It reminds me of the Hydrasynth in that someone who cares about usability clearly made this.
Certainly an interesting synth but I think it would be far more competitive in the $2k range
So true. At that price I’d buy it right now.
i got to play this thing at synth expo LA, and it was phenomenal. the attendant was great at explaining how it worked, i even got to record some samples 😈
I got to mess with one at Synthplex and fell in love. It sounds amazing.
I want one!. And it would be absolutely amazing if you could use all those knobs to control softsynths or a DAW, particularly my favorite, Bitwig.
my slim phatties can handle the knob issues with light rings and special catch up modes but uh... this is on that whole other level! gorgeous and good sound here. i wish all my synths had this!
I think this will help people go back and forth from digital to analog equipment super easy because alot of DAWs have this same kind of feature where the knobs move on their own usually because of automation clips
I've always dreamed of something like that- I'm glad somebody actually made it!
This has existed since the 80s
Sounds like a BEAST, making space for it on my desk as we speak
Did you get it? Thoughts?
Once again! Bravo! This is a very creative time in synthesis and user interface. As someone who makes a living playing the trumpet but who has also been using synths since the late 1970s, now is the time we have some pedagogy! Sorry got on my soapbox. Carry on!
A digitally controlled analog interface is a great idea. If you like the immediacy of analog gear without menus and DAW-oriented systems then this will probably resonate with you.
These guys said, yea, we can solve that problem pretty easily, like many others have, but let's do it on hard mode
"Sensorless homing" into a sound synthesizer! Pretty cool idea! My respect to devs!
I've had one of these for about 9 months. It's amazing, if you have the time. I highly recommend for professionals. Casual hobbyists might feel out of their depth and just use the presets. The presets are good, don't get me wrong. But the power of this thing is really not having to take photos of your settings that you had in a jam one day and use it a month later. It's totally doable, but you have to read the manual. And it's got a pretty high price tag. Still not done paying for it.
Im in love with this synth and the tech OMG
I would buy one and love it too if it was considerably cheaper than retail!! This synth will hopefully change how things are done
I always dreamed of a midi controller with motorized knobs, than you can use it for al your synths! Nice vid as allways 👍🤟✌️
Thank u for the demo 👌
I definitely think it's not a gimmick, it's really an intuitive and creative idea in a time where other companies invest in making cheap replicas
Thanks again for the effort 👍
Love the sound of this - just a little out of my price range right now. Going to have to start saving!
Oh, nice. Some of the features of the motorised knobs are already used at the Droid M4 motorised faders from Der Mann mit der Maschine in Eurorack.
It certainly sounds gorgeous.
WOW! This is a long time a com'n! Very very cool!
Didn't think I was gonna like this. Turns out I do. Great demo.
The NINA really sounds rich and thick!!!
About time someone did this! Digital mixers have had motorized faders for years now, I've wanted a synth with motorized controls since first using a digital mixer. I bet a cheaper take on this idea could be done if the synth used faders/sliders instead of knobs, like on an old ARP.
Yeah, I wonder why Behringer didn't implement this technology since they also sell moto-faders...it could have been cool on the B-Odyssey.
A programmable control surface with these would be cool
@@Aetila I think it's just the price. Checkout how much replacement behringer faders cost. And you still need to add the cost of the fader motor driver.
@@drofdissonance
But they already had a motorized programmer BF 2000 or similar, it didn't cost so much. I bought the Bodyssey but it was a rerminder why I din't like synths without memory, the synth itself was wonderful. I just imagined what if they had motorized faders on that one, it would have been great...but yes, it may not be reliable and would cost more. I'm done with with synth without memory anyway, lol. Peace
Different tech with a higher failure rate. Check out how drone motors work, rotation is optimal for that application and it translates well here.
100% Gamechanger - can't wait to see how this develops 👍👍
I would wager you'll never see this gimmick used ever again
me too, it's also sounds and looks great.
Great sound, great design. This will be in my lab once I make some real money, solely for the uniqueness.
The way the knobs can switch between different types of turning is awesome. The price however is not
What a fantastic instrument both in concept and sound. Motorized knobs is anything but gimmick. Morph is a amazing way to find unique sounds. Keep my fingers crossed for such a innovation company
As soon as there's a midi controller version of this with mapping for everything, I'm buying it
you don't ask for much :)
The sound is awesome. this is what we want in sound.
What a beautiful machine ! Color scheme and knob size is perfect. Would gladly do our next album on Nina 🖤
Kind of expensive but the features and layout look like it would be a super programmable friendly synth. 12 voice analog with friendliness of a Nord Lead 2 or 3. Very nice and compelling sounds and features. I love the motorized knobs and that does make for easy deconstruction of presets and features/fx also. Can’t say I’ll be getting it, but if I didn’t already have a Virus Ti, Ti2, Nord Lead 2X, and Waldorf Blofeld, I’d seriously consider it. Tough choice between this and a Deckard’s Dream, Kijimi, or ISE-NIN from Black Corporation
This synth sounds actually very good !
Definitely looks cool, but wouldn't it be easier/cost effective to just have LED rings like the WesAudio stuff?
Probably - I present that option in the pros and cons
I wish more gear manufacturers use key switches for their buttons. Love me some key switches
its like motorized faders but with encoders. every synths should be like this. sexy AF.
Loved it, both the concept and the sound!
I like the idea of all this, but think it would have sold better as 16 motorized knob midi controller.
That, I'd buy yesterday!
for what price? 🤔
@@drofdissonance the closest example I can think of would be the M4 by Der Mann Mit Der Machine which is 4 motorized faders in a eurorack format for ~$500. So if they sold something for $2k it'd be competitive (knobs offer more precision over faders too)
@@localhost4460 that's a way higher number than I was expecting! NGL
@loopop Something you didn't cover is whether the knobs can be used to send Midi values out to other outboard gear or a computer. The value proposition of this as both a hardware synth AND a midi controller with preset saves and moving knobs would be very much stronger than a hardware synth alone.
I cannot believe how dismissive people are of this brilliant synth. Comparing these high resolution self rotating knobs to LED rings? Come on guys. We're talking like 100+ resolution vs like what, 15-20 leds??? This is miles ahead!!!!
And to everyone shitting on the design saying the motors will fail...you must not have heard when he said it used drone motors. Does anyone here know what a drone motor is designed to withstand over the course of it's lifetime? This is way overbuilt for the use case, which was almost certainly done on purpose to extend longevity.
I'm really disappointed in the synth community right now. Show this synth the love it deserves! And by the way, it's a 12 voice analog polyphonic synth, it's not expensive for what it is, motors or no motors.
Yea Loopop is by far the most thorough and knowledgeable hardware reviewers in the known synth world. Happy to watch each and everyone of his videos even if it’s too expensive for me 😂
This is awesome! Now I just wish they'd make an iteration of Nina that replaced the two VCOs with the same wavetable oscillators as OSC 3.
Ahhh I’ve been hoping you’d get your hands on one of these!
I want one. Someone should gift me one! lol! Your reviews are just always so great. One certainly doesn't have to be shopping to enjoy them... just be a person who really likes synths. More than just product reviews, they end up be instructional just on how synths work and flow and sound. Having the index on the left is so thoughtful, and with synths I DO have... so helpful as I refer to your videos on those with some regularity. Thanks!
Glad you like them!
Woah..modulation shown on the motorized knobs would have been incredible. Good ideas for improving this machine Ziv.
Astonishing synth, super review !!
What I would really like to see is this hardware minus the audio component, and an industry-wide new protocol (or MIDI extension) for controlling the knobs.
Are those knobs going to work five or ten years down the line? Will the company even exist to get replacement parts from? I have a serious concerns about buying a synth with that many motors in it
Workaround is to bundle it with a couple of spare motors. Or at least sell them as spares. Prudent owners would buy a couple, just in case.
On the one hand, I think that's a valid concern. On the other hand, look at professional-grade consoles for live music. You won't find one that doesn't have motorized faders. Yes, the market is mostly dominated by huge companies like Yamaha, Behringer/Midas, Presonus, Digico, etc, but motorized faders are at nearly every professionally-produced live music event. Are these a fail point on pro consoles? Hell yes. I've seen multiple issues in person--but they get fixed. Faders and scribble strips and encoders can all be repaired or replaced.
I would love to see a video of someone gutting this synth, showing what's under the hood, and explaining to what degree these synths are prepared for failure, and how big of a bear it would be to repair one of these if and when the manufacturer eventually folds.
simple quality drone motors for this use case will probably outlive any of your synth pots.
@MoogMusicInc solved the same issue 17 years ago with a much simpler design using LEDs around every knob with the Slim patty and Little Phatty. I think it was the last project to be carried out while Robert Moog was still alive.
the resolution was awful with the slim/little and the encoders felt really bad, like nothing attached to it, anyway it's just one thing that this motorised knobs can do.