As a ski patroller back in the ‘80s I went through a pair of skis each season. I broke a few but most turned into “noodles”, soft and not holding an edge. I have had my Atomic Smoke mogul skis for 7 years and they are still great. I think the new components and assembly methods are all the difference.
I snapped a ski last year just behind the binding, the bottom totally delaminated in one piece and went down the hill like a luge! I panicked in the air and tried to press the backs of the skis into the ground to force myself out of the landing on my back but it just broke the ski in half.@@evanfinch4987
Summary: Old gear: you turned the skis. Modern gear: skis turn you. I wish I still had my old skis from the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s. Sigh. Thanks for this fun video!
Bought a pair of Javelins in high school. Then, went quickly through three pair of broken Hexcel's. Bought a used pair of 210c Strato 102's for ten bucks in 1974. Maybe the best I've ever had. Never dreamed they'd fail. Shovel edge eventually let go. So, bought a new pair Strat 203c 105's in 1978. Still have 'em. Storage. Cheers.
I stil have my last straight set, bought second hand in 1994. I loved the old ones, was so comfortable tackling anything and looking pro. When the new ones came I just literally fell on my face and really had to re-learn completely. Should get the oldies out and try them. Old just plowed straight down unless you make them catch, new turn by themselves and you move your body weight and steer, so interesting to see someone try both at the same time, pretty good going to only fall over once 😂
I learned to ski in 84, we went up as a family and skied every weekend thru high school. I skied all thru college. After college, around 96 I took up snowboarding and only boarded for 20 years. Around 2016 I started my daughter on skis and quickly realized I can't help a kid learn to ski while I was boarding. I picked up some of them "newfangled curvy skis", and wow times had changed. You're right, the old ones, you had to push them to turn, we kept our feet together and did quick schuss type turns, back and forth. Looking back now, it was hard work. When I got on the new skis I was able to still do those old style turns but quickly realized that the new skis turn automatically when you tip them over. These past few years I have been concentrating on learning to hold a smooth line, transition, and do the carving thing.
We all have some of that nostalgia… but the innovations and changes happened for a reason. Sure, a lot of it had to do with financial considerations (how to get more people interested in skiing, and thus buying skis) but the new gear offers so much more versatility. You can still drive them and ski whatever shape turn you want, but just like those old 2 meter straight boards, you’re only really using the middle of the ski. On the new gear, much subtler moments of the lower leg will initiate a turn. So, once you master the enormous variety of movements, you can do things undreamt of with old skis, like linking multiple turns where you’re using the entire effective edge. Feels more like surfing than anything I ever did in 35 years on my old “straight” skis. And when you’re on tele, with one ski in front of the other and you’re carving, that feeling is even more exaggerated… it feels like you’re riding one enormous 240 cm ski, using the entirety of that “single 240 cm edge.” In spring corn, there is literally nothing else like it!
Once a year, the boys bust out retro gear. I use a pair of 60's 230cm wooden Yamaha skis with screwed in edges, leather no name boots, and cable lock bindings. We wear long wool coats with scarves and it's always fun.
That's hardcore and awesome! My dad had a pair of wooden skis from when he first went, but unfortunately he decided to throw them out when we moved to a new house when I was a kid. Ugh!
Sorry if this is something "Everyone knows about", but if not search "Didier Cuche last race". It's by far the most entertaining retirement race ever. I watch it at least once a year.
Ha! I had Fischer wooden skis with screwed-in edges. Broke those at A-Basin, but I couldn't afford Heads or Harts of that era. I could keep up with skiers who could, though!
I think people who learned to ski, and skied, on straight 'retro' skis had to have a much better technique to ski properly...modern skis make it too easy - though that's not necessarily a bad thing. But take off piste for example...back then we didn't have fat, powder skis - we skied off piste on those same narrow, straight, long skis. All about technique. There's no doubt that I'm the skier I am because I used to ski on the old type of ski.
i saw these results among those who got used to classics, upon first putting on parabollic carvers, folks were merely swinging and rolling before lifts at stopping slopes😹
The term "parabolic ski" refers only to the Elan SCX all other skis with radial side cuts are "shaped skis". We thought this would revolutionize ski instruction but NO! WE WERE WRONG1 The old-fashioned way to ski..."The New Way to Ski" by Wilie Schaffler 1956 is the original source for PSIA.... is the correct answer...which they co-opted, corrupted and repackaged into PSIA dogma and claim rights to. Along with Harrold Harb, American innovation in ski instruction certification fails my examination with corruption grifting and abuses.
When I went from 207 GS skis to skiing on 187 K2 4s, it was no problem at all. It was as though my ski technique was built for skis with more side cut. I adjusted instantly.
The side cut on your K2 is barely noticeable and they are considered “straight skis“ today. I’m just ski instructor in Mammoth and for a long time I had two pairs of skis each year. My son’s skis were 207 cm long and my giant slalom skis were 210 cm long. I actually skied a season on a pair of 215 cm skis. I have to tell you I love the new stuff. Easy to turn, Houldin very well, and I have no problem going straight very fast without any issues. My 1st “Short skis“ were 193 cm. Now I settled into a great ski at 184 cm. I’m 6 foot 3 and weigh 220 pounds and I’ve actually demoed a pair of 157s that are specifically for slalom racing and had a blast. I’m glad I’ve been around long enough to see all the amazing changes.
I had those exact K2s and skied the hell out of them as a ski patroller. You definitely have to work them harder, but they will turn on a dime as long as you keep your weight forward. They turn really sloppy if you sit on the tails. Great skis!
I just noticed something I'm not an instructor but for me I'd be putting more weight on your downhill ski and get on that inside edge. You can get away with it more with the newer skis. But with the longer skis you really need to step on the Inside edge. Get that downhill ski weighted more so it doesn't swim on you.
on the new skis, and probably just in general the tips of the skis are jumping around a bunch, need to be more aggressive and push those skis through the turn to keep everything smooth, more pressure on the toes and shins to push the fronts into the snow more to keep them stable for a smoother turn.
Great point. That's a key to turning the old 80s skis. I don't think I put enough weight on it enough given how icy it was and the skis hadn't been tuned in 25 years. But that is definitely the way to get the most out of those skis.
I got back into skiing after a 20 year hiatus. Skied since 1972. Bought a new pair of skis last year. Had to relearn. So used to side scraping the straight long skis. Just a natural feel. Bought some 184/88 Kendos this year. Yep, I am now a believer. So nice to swing like a pendulum and make nice rythmed carves. Skis are better now. Much more efficient.
I'm entirely old school. I still use my Olin Mark IVs I bought in 1980 (high school for me). I've rented new skis a couple of times, and I hated them. This old dog doesn't want to learn new tricks. If I could buy brand new straight skies, I probably would -- these have a lot of years on them. But I have a style of skiing I prefer, and I just don't want to change that.
i really like my more modern Atomic Alibi's, mainly for the width (98mm under foot), but the topsheet on one tip has peeled back and also on the tail of the other ski. I never had that problem with older skis. I'll have to break out the contact cement and see if it adheres and stays that way. I used Gorilla Glue (clear, non expanding) on the tip before (placed a sand bag and a few cinder blocks over that) and it lasted 20 days of skiing before it came apart again.
My very first picture of me on skis are wooden skis with cable bindings and lace up leather boots. I've seen skis go short (70s) to long (80/90) back to short and wider. Improving materials let the skis get shorter while maintaing stiffness and stability. Of course, with those older skis with less side cut you really needed to know how to ski .
One critical thing you fail to mention is the turning radius of each ski; the Head has it written on the ski, and I believe the ski you are on is the "consumer" SL race ski, which has a very quick turning radius, probably something like 12 meters; the K2 is probably more like 30 meters, so it really makes no sense to try to compare them.
True, better to have added that fact in. The Head ski is actually a "consumer" GS race ski, so the better comparison would have been to my old Rossignol 4G "consumer" GS race ski. The K2 is a SL.
I have my old pair of Rossi 4Gs (the purples) from late 80s/early 90s...195s...thinking of putting new bindings on them as I was told the Tyrolia bindings were long recalled/toast. You've inspired me to definitely follow through on that plan!@@SkiBoyNY.
Before they started making skis with more extreme side cuts, they didn’t even bother to tell anyone what a ski’s radius was. I would guess they were a lot larger than 30m; probably closer to 40-45m (or even possibly larger). Modern GS skis for the World Cup are 35m (rules; even though they would turn better with more sidecut, a study was done that claimed that more sidecut caused more knee injuries, so they forced racers to used less sidecut). Before that they were using 27m sidecuts and more.
Same here at 6'2. I rode 215's. Great ride and they were rockets! A long GS ski is great for cruising fast, ( I even used them in bumps) however, the short ski will always be highly manuverable. It's like comparing the turning circle on a semi to a mini Cooper!
As a full time ski instructor for 30 years i relied on the best second hand ski gear I could find. Now I blackmailed my rep to get WC cosmetic equivalents. There is no comparison. Shelf skis suck. In the back room is where they keep the good stuff. They only want good skiers to be seen on their good stuff so better keep your uniform on when demoing.
Really appreciate this vid - so fun! I’ve been renting skis for the last 12 years but this year I used my 1992 Kästle RX 205cm. So much fun. The comparison is like driving a 92 manual sports car compared to a new “ computerized” automatic sports car. Find the old skis more rewarding. When you get it right it’s tons of fun but a mistake will for sure punish you quickly 🤣🤣🤣
I had racing stock Rossignok skis at the time. You had them in either SL or GS, and if you raced DH you had around 220 cm skis. The DH skis were used by many people as powder skis. You couldn't buy racing stock unless you were an elite racer. I had a pair of GS skis that had a serial number of something like 0054. The reason you couldn't buy racing stock skis (FIS skis) is that they had really thin edges and couldn't be fully sharpened more than a few times. They also flexed much different than normal skis. They had a lot of stiff torsional rigidity but were very soft at the tips and very stiff at the tails. Therefore, you couldn't use them mogul skiing because the soft tip might drive into a mogul and you would permanently bend the skis. Ted Ligety mastered the 30+ m radius skis the FIS wanted for GS. By using a slightly softer flexing boot and just loading the front of his boots he was able to load the front of the skis and get them to turn. Marco Odermatt the recent GS World Cup champion uses an old style flexion extension technique reminiscent of 1970-1990 ski technique and is crushing it. However, his technique doesn't work at all for a modern slalom. Mikaela Shiffrin can ski all disciplines with modern technique. However, even she uses a style from the past when it is warranted. I remember the old 200+ cm when trying to ski breakable crust. Only a few of us ventured into the crud and we had it all to ourselves. You technique had to be very sound; but nowadays anyone can ski crud with rocker skis.
Well, it actually was you couldn't BUY race stock skis at all. If you were good enough you were sponsored and they gave them to you. Also, Liggety mastered 35 meter skis when fis came up with that dumb idea. He basically used an old school..skid..at the top of the turn but we called it a stivot ..a direction skid..cuz no one wanted to admit you couldn't purely carve every turn at race speeds.
Reminded of the first time I put, what were called Parabolic Skis on, I couldn't stop looking at the length of my skis while on the chairlift. An interesting video.
Ran Salomon X-Scream series skies from the late 90's/early 2000's in 195. Those skis were fast, ultra stable, held an edge like crazy as long as you committed and put power into the turn. For a narrow-wasted (68) ski without any real nod toward off-piste, it was a fantastic ski for the time.
I remember my narrow Salomon 203s from the 90s needing a strong weight shift early in the turn when skiing hard pack. That resulted in a very satisfying pop into the next turn. Crud and powder required significantly different somewhat two footed technique. I ski my “current” 2012 Dynastar Legend 85s (178 cm) much more two footed in all conditions. Less physically demanding, but much harder to get that pop even if I really load the outside ski.
Crazy video, ski boy. For 2023 I'm just getting back into skiing after 15 years. I skied many days on my 1978 Rossignol CM skis, 185 length. I switched and rented newer Head skis. Yes, their is a big difference. I could still make my old skis work here in Utah. I will have new equipment for next season. I'm retired and deserve anything I want now.
Love that! Will you get the old skis tuned? I figure that a shop won't touch old skis for liability reasons. Or at least make you sign something. I'd have to dust off the old tuning equipment. But yes, in retirement, you deserve to ski and enjoy life!
@@SkiBoyNY. Yes, at start of the season I cleaned up ski edges and lubricated the Tyrolia bindings I set the din higher. I'm not as light as I was when I used them last. I used liquid Swix 4 wax. It works OK. Next season I will use a real ski iron, hot waxing them. After using my Rossignol skis, I bought a edge tuning kit and put a half degree edge on them and they carve better. You tube is great to learn most anything. I plan to buy a few used newer skis at the swap meets that they have here in Utah. I will service them myself and use them. I'm going to go all out and have custom fitted boots made. Utah has many shops that do this. Enjoy life while you can, and for me I can pick the best days for it now. Take care,
I skied in the mid-90s on K2 5500 all-terrains, 205s. Those things could carve through anything and used them from WV to Utah, ran NASTAR gates and handle everything from a long blue cruise to an ungroomed double diamond. They did take some effort to learn, but it felt so rewarding and fine tuned once I got good on them. The newer skies these days feel a bit smoother and are much easier to turn for all variety of skills it seems. I hadn't gone skiing in about 8 years and rented whatever they had at the shop and it was like riding a bike, just easier and a bit slower. Biggest they'll put me in now are like 180s so I don't feel like I can go as fast as I used to, but that's probably a good thing since old knees don't heal as fast as young ones, lol. New vs. Old is like driving a car with and without power steering.
Maybe 10 years ago, I went skiing at Silver Creek/Granby Ranch with my son's Boy Scout troop. I used to be pretty serious (for a hobbyist), but for a variety of reasons hadn't been skiing often at all for several years. I still had my 1.9m Rossignol 4S skis from that same era (my bump skis, the cruisers are 2m 3Gs) and it was pretty entertaining to watch people watching me on the slope and in the lift lines. It was entertaining being that old guy with the long skis locked together linking turns on the groomed slopes rather than the young guy watching that old guy. 8-)
My brother was a ski tech back in 68. I was 10 then and they measured skis to your wrist held above your head. Most of the rentals were cable bindings that wrapped around Lace ups or cheap buckle boot heels with one big clamp in the front. One day my brother drops me off a pair of white Hart or Head Holiday 180s. Metal skis a customer had thrown them out as the right ski had split the laminate down most of the way through. He drove off and I stared at them. They had Solomon bindings, no cables not those horrible CubCo bindings. Being the youngest and usually alone I lugged them down to the basement I had an idea . Finding a piece of flat metal ( it was probably chimney flashing) I dug a pair of tin snips out of my bros tool box and cut a piece a little bigger than a poker card. Then I hunted some screws they were all too long but I liked the big heads on them low profile and slotted His shiny drill was there and scrounging around I found a bit. Right on! We used to say. No clamps , I stepped on that scrap on top of the ski (I can smell that drill motor Still .) and bored a hole right down to the cement floor. yeah baby! Sheet Metal Spinning like a meat slicer on the drill I stomped it and pulled it out excited I got his bigass screw driver and screwed it right on thru The metal plate, the ski and into a scrap of wood under it making a nice sandwich. Admiring my skewered kebob, now what was I to do, with the sticking out screw? Hack sawed 'em off, all 4, two on each side above the split. And finally filing the screws flush. I skied in brown flannel lined corduroys. Later Army pants sprayed with scotchgard. The patch never broke and I could tighten it with a car key. Uppity turds would scoot past and snicker in the lift lines or give me more space so their was no contact. I would Just come in hard as I was trying to get as many runs as I could. The extra space was cool when maneuvering those Metal Bigasskis. When I was 12 I used them to make a bob sled but thats another story.
Love it. That's the creativity that comes so often with youth. I have a lot of vivid memories and had ideas like that about skis that when I was young but I didn't take as much action on them as you did!
I recently spoke to an Olympic skier who won gold in the 60’s. I asked her if she would like to redo her gold medal race using today’s skis. She replied that what she used then was just as good as what is used now!
I would bet that she was talking about a speed event though. Some of the skis used today for downhill at the World Cup level are decades old skis that have been resurfaced on top to look new. When they find a fast pair of skis, they keep using them and they often get passed from one racer to another (within that brand of ski of course). The technology for SL and GS has completely changed though and it’s in non speed even skiing where that change is most obvious. Having much greater side cut, and more stable skis despite being shorter makes a huge difference. I was racing and coaching during the transition from long straight skis to modern skis that have more sidecut and are shorter, and the differences are night a day. Modern skis turn sooooooooo much easier and don’t flop around at high speed.
I found this video by searching for an old vs new ski video. Thank you for making this. I learned how to ski first on a 90s Volkl, and then on an early 2000s Rossignol. I just bought a pair of a few year old K2 park skis and the performance is night and day. The new ski is exactly how you described- much easier to steer and control the ski. The skis practically ski themselves, you don't have to put much input to get the desired effect. This has made me much more confident. I'm not sure if it's the technology of the new skis that is making them better, or that the old skis have just lost their structural stability.
Your reaction sounds like it was the same as mine when I had been skiing my old K2s, stopped skiing for about 7 years, then resumed and tried a more modern, shaped parabolic ski. The difference was so dramatic that my mind was blown!
when I was 12 (1989)skied with school in Oz…hated the comfort of the boots and those things were hard to turn. Snowboarded for about 8 years before going back skiing about 5 years ago. OMG so surprised by the comfort and and turning was so easy…. 30 years difference in tech was huge…
Well this was a very cool video. I worked in a ski shop in the 80s & 90s and I bought the kvc comp in a 200cm and it was a blast to ski fast on a blowout fast turns in all different sizes. The Mahre brothers used to race on these skis back in the day. It was always awesome to see those guys tear it up on the slalom courses back in the day. And of course Scott Schmidt and Glen Plake where epic on K2s in license to thrill and many other legit thriller extreme ski vids. I got back into downhill skiing a few years ago and last season bought a pair of Nordica enforcer 88s in 179cm. And they were honestly a good ski that held an edge great through ice and variable terrain. But these skis are definitely a lot heavier and give the feeling that they just don’t response with the energy of the k2 kvc. I am 6’3” and I need a longer ski. The Nordica just didn’t do it for me and the lack of pop out of a turn and feeling very trucky in choppy or spring time snow just left me not enjoying this type of ski. So I then sold the Nordica skis and got a pair k2 disruptions 82Ti in the 184cm. This ski definitely has more energy but is still heavy and gets bogged down when the snow gets thick and clumpy during spring ski conditions. And this is where the super light k2 kvc just kicks azz all day over the new era of skis in my honest opinion. The k2 disruption is a riot on groomed steeps in the middle of winter where there are no speed limits. Absolute blast in that situation where you can’t go too fast for the ski to handle. And that is awesome. I want to try the elan ripstick 88 in a 188cm length and see if that gives me a light powerful ski like the k2 kvc and the ease of turn initiation and edge hold of the new generation. Ski fast & have fun peeps ❄️❄️
Love thinking back on Scott Schmidt and Glen Plake. I had some 195 K2 Extremes back in the 80s and they were fantastic. K2 did a good job of adding neon colors and "fun" into the designs. "Blizzard of Ahs..." Glen Plake bombing down sheer cliffs with his mohawk. So many great Warren Miller films. Thanks for the nostalgic journey.
@@joelatm96 yeah the K2 Extremes were a fun ski! I had difficult picking between that ski and the KVC. But either ski you can't go wrong!! Now I need K2 to bring these skis back in production. Make them Retro Models K2, I miss my kevlar high energy skis!!
80's ??....look at the 70's skis I used to ride for some absolute classics and boards I'd still ride today. Rossi Roc550's , Rossi Strato 102's, K2 Comps (red white and blue with 4 stars), Head HRP Comps, and Dynamic VR17's. All in a 207cm were MAGIC !! I lived in Teton Village in 1973-75. If you got on the tram back then with anything less than a 200cm ski, you were mocked mercilessly all the way up the mountain !!!
I was just out skiing on my 1978 190cm The Skis which i got my first year in college. I raced in high school but spent winter and spring break skiing with a professional mogul skier friend in college. I have bought multiple pairs of shaped skis over the years and tried to like them. Sure they are easier but that is not what i am looking for. I would not want my 1000 Ninja with an automatic transmission because it would be easier. At 62 i still ski better then most people and my skis go where i want them to go in an instant. I pick the radius of my turns not the skis and I like to vary that radius constantly without my skis 2nd guessing me. Not interested in self driving cars or skis.
I'm getting back into skiing after almost 20 years hiatus. Dynastar Course GS 205's and Atomic Super G 215's. These modern ski's were just starting to become popular a couple years after my last year of Daily ( resort photographer ) skiing for 4 years in my 20's. I have some choosing to do myself. I used some rental modern ski's and was surprised how easy it was to turn. I think your right, the ski is "self driving". Thanks for your opinion.
@@davidh8928 well that brings back memories from my days in Little Cottonwood canyon. Dynastar GS skies from the MV2 to the Course were a great ski for Utah conditions. The Course, IMO, being the best. I went back to 3 pin after that.
"I pick the radius of my turns, not the skis." I too learned on straight skis and I think this is why I can't completely adapt to modern carving skis. But I've found that I can make twin tipped full rocker/freeride skis turn whenever I want them to. They're easy to initiate the turns but I decide when and how much they do it. I probably skid more than I carve, but I don't care. It works for me.
Just finished skiing with some old RD Coyote 200s were my brothers. I was never a fan of GS type skiis but they are heavy and the metal plate makes for great crusing, not fun in fast turns or bumps. I hate the shortness of most of the newer skiis. Always skied 200s soft slalom skis. Short skis seem squirley to me.
I only started skiing in 2001 at age 46 and have only skied on parabolic skis. With proper technique the skis help your turn. I have never skied on straight skis but can imagine that you need the correct technique and have to work harder. Just like modern tennis rackets and old wooden rackets.
I bought some unwrapped Rosignol Pro Racing 170cm Skis from the 90s , slightly wider than you K2. I felt on my first intent to speed up and carve , after 6 or 7 turns I felt my skis were going faster than me until i lost control. I concentrated and worked on my descent advancing one ski slightly in front of the other in turns , raising my leg almost in the air to turn with the other. I agree that we got lazy and used to modern skis we called Parabolics back in the days
That's what I remember you pretty much would unweight and lift. I took 25 years off and rented parabolics and couldn't believe how easy I could ski them. Went out and bought all new equipment the next day!
Better get going fast because the sport is going fast and I mean really fast the sport is going so fast there will be no sport no more we can't keep up it left us behind it goes so fast it's already in the past.
Very interesting comparison! I skied back in the 80s using 185s. It’s been years since I last skied but I’ve always wondered how and why ski design changed so dramatically, and how it would feel skiing todays designs. It appears todays skis are a lot easier to ski. The shorter, wider, more pronounced hourglass design looks like fun! Thanks for the great info! 👍
I think that's what's behind the change - everyone I know who skied 80s skis felt it was a lot easier to turn on more shaped, modern skis. The trade off is that at high speed, if you're going straight, they can be a bit less stable than the older skis in my opinion.
@@SkiBoyNY. That makes sense. Longer is more stable, but isn’t a great feature for a market wanting maneuverability. It took some time but the manufacturers found new designs which were superior to the old design, from beginner to expert! The parabolic design is the biggest advancement in ski tech in my lifetime.
@@SkiBoyNY. : That all depends on which skis you are comparing. Todays skis are designed for specific markets, and once you get outside of the design envelope,of course they are going to be less stable!
Props for the fun review with an excellent choice of music for this specific review. I ski with my 1992 215mm Rossis for moguls and straight down the hill runs. You really do need a different headspace to kick out the tails to finish turns! Mostly, they look super cool on a garage wall!
Kicking out the tails to finish turns apparently was the way I learned to ski as well. After recently taking a lesson it became clear to me that my ski technique needed revamping. I’ve since worked on making sure I don’t lift my ski during my turns and my skiing has improved substantially. Much left effort involved and allows me to ski all day with much less strain on the knees.
Don't forget bells, whistles, flashing lights and ultimate unnecessary affectations to make frivolous nonsense. We may be better off in the past but what was then is still now as we never learn...stupid humans we are.
I've skied on my old straight Atomics in the US until around 2005 (I think I've dumped them in 2010), I've had at the same time a second newer set of carving skis for Europe (which I've kept there between skiing trips). Massive difference in how you turn. These days I mostly travel only with my boots (if I have to fly) and rent skis in the resort. I normally go for giant slalom ones for wider turns and better high speed control. They are still significantly shorter than the older straight "slalom" ones.
This was fun to watch! I've rented skis for the last 15 years but own a pair of 205 cm Head SL skis from the late 80's. Those no longer have enough 'spring' in them, but I wish I could rent a modern pair that will actually be stable at speed! Sure, the easy turning is nice, but everything I've rented the last decade doesn't seem to track straight. Am I missing something? I mean, they still race downhill and super-G on something??
Thanks! And totally agree. The older, straighter skis were a lot more stable for going straight. Modern carving skis want to turn, even when you may not want to!
Wonderful concept! Thanks for putting that together. Now compare a late 70s to a late 80s ski! I remember moving from a mid-80s Atomic ARC to a 1991 Rossignol and that felt like a quantum leap in performance. Not sure if you ever competed in the 80s, but to finish the turn some element of step/skate was required to make up for the ski's unwillingness to "finish". I saw you getting the tails crossed on the K2s which a challenge to avoid
Thanks! An another comparison in addition to late 70s to late 80s would be my father's wood skis to any ski! At least, they looked like they were wood to me when I was a kid. They may not have been. But sadly, he got rid of them. Yes, I had a bit of a challenge skiing the K2s since I hadn't used them in decades, they weren't tuned, and it was extremely icy that day. So I felt like I was all over the place and not skiing them the way I used to be able to.
I loved my 80s skis and my 90s skis!! I used 203 Blizzards and 195 Elans!! But today I do not ski because the prices are pathetic!! My trip to Taho and Batchelor and Whistler was my last ski adventure in 03!!
I loved the video and all the insights that came with it. That said, I still prefer my 195 Head Racing skis that I bought in the early 80's. I haven't used them very much in the past few decades but I recently skied on them at Copper Mt. in January and my old reliable skis did not disappoint me. As in the past, they were very stable while cruising and turning was as easy as when they were new. I think I'll keep them a little longer. While watching coverage of the recent Olympics in China, there was no shortage of Head skis on the slopes by both men and women.
Yes, I noticed that too about the success of Head in the Olympics. I was at Mont Tremblant in Canada a few weeks ago, and several companies had set up tents, including Head. They were rightfully bragging about the results! And awesome that the old skis still hold up. I think mine would too - just need to tune them and get back into the feel of the old technique.
@@monkmchorning Hi Eric, I bought the Head Racing skis because I was a Franz Klammer wannabe at the time. If you have never seen his 1976 Olympic downhill run, I suggest you go to You Tube asap. It was perhaps the greatest downhill race ever. The pressure on Klammer to win the gold medal in his home country was enormous. I was 25 in 1976. I will add that Klammer used Atomic skis that day if I remember correctly after watching the video on You Tube. I took my Head skis to Austria in 1983 and went down the steep Hahnenkamm Strief race course at Kitzbuhel along with the other recreational skiers. It was the dream of a lifetime and something I will never forget.
@@brucerehberger9080 I've seen it dozens of times, young man. Yeah, it's breathtaking. I followed racing, too, but was more into the technical events. My heroes of that period were Gustavo Theoni and Jean-Noel Augert.
@@monkmchorning Theoni and Augert were great skiers without a doubt but my favorite slalom skier is Ingemar Stenmark who always appeared to ski effortlessly while winning an unbelievable 86 races during his career. One has to also admire Mikaela Shiffrin who has 73 wins and is only 26 years old. Mercy!! Love to talk skiing.
I used the Insta360 One X2 360 camera on the end of their invisible selfie stick. Holding the selfie stick in one hand with one of my poles, with the camera down near the ski tips. Today's video camera technology is incredible.
Fan fact, it was snowboard which pushed the evolution of ski design forward. Although the technology and its benefits were ignored by ski manufacturers for almost two decades until snowboarding gained enough popularity.
Dude, I literally had those k2 comps in the 80-90's . Me and a buddy of mine had the same ones and we would pound them in the bumps. You had to be aggressive and get over the tips and they would come alive! Sadly mine were stolen and I switched to a pair of heads because they didn't make them anymore. I currently run fishers and I'm still in the the bumps! Thanks for bringing me back to the 80's.
Yes, they were actually pretty great in the bumps. I did the same. Sucks that yours were stolen. Looks like I'm following your lead though, from K2 to Head!
This is very interesting - have skied both sticks and shaped, of course shaped MUCH better (why did it take someone so long to figure out the advantages of shapes until the 90s?). Skiing one of each, what a great comparison.
I used to ski on Kastle 210 mostly in the 80's now Fischer 198 GS racing skis. Still short but not like everyone else on the mountain, with super short skis. I like high speed stability at 40-50 mph speeds.
Thanks for sharing! That unstable dynamic can happen with certain modern skis too (long/light/stiff). The solution for me was a boot setup that allowed skiing from the feet instead of the shins. If you ski around slowly with your cuffs unbuckled and find yourself more balanced, then I would guess it's forward lean and/or too stiff. You can shim the back of the boot and/or remove the bolts on the back to soften it up.
I would be curious to see how they compare with a fresh tune. Good wax and especially edge makes such a huge difference. May go borrow some and do an 80's-90's-00's-10's-20's comparison myself!
i got a pair of 211cm super g skis and it's such a weird feeling comming from short tight turning skis. you had to go 80kph+ for them to feel like they were even turning at slow speed you had to skid them but they had amazing grip on the edge.
The power is in those Head skis too, even more actually. You just need the proper technique. Just look at pro racers and their course times now Vs mid-80’s. Bode Miller was one of the first racers to go on the parabolics…he destroyed his competition on the ‘straight’ skis.
@@SkiBoyNY. The ‘old’ skis were definately more stiff thru their length which can very well feel like power. Add in the length and you get an effective spring effect if you can flex them. Bonus with todays skis is the materials they can selectively use in the ski to tailor the energy response. Much more side cut allows for a ‘shorter’ ski too. More flex…ski side cut does the work and properly skied gives tremedous energy out of the turn. One of the many upsides of todays skis is how much less effort we have to use to get the performance out of them. Funny how skies of old defined how “manly” you were by their length. 😆. 210 or even 220’s were bad ass. Now nobody blinks at a165 length. Enjoy the rest of the season my friend! Off to Big Sky next week for me and some friends. ⛷🎉
I don't ski, but I watched this because I'm fascinated by the comparison. I'm a bicycle guy and I've done the same comparisons with bikes. MTBs: night and day difference in handling and contruction- 80's bike is still fun, but more of a cruiser. BMX: New bikes built 100 times better, they're longer, but 80's bikes are more agile and have infinite handling options. Road Bikes: new bikes shift better and are way lighter, but I'd rather use an 80's bike, they were perfection.
I still ski 1996 Elan CR with a length of 195 cm. I like it - the long edge holds the slope well and when descending in a straight line the skis do not wobble and hold the direction well. Short, fast turns are no problem either! I won't change it. PS About 15 years ago I made a monoski from a snowboard, you can watch a video of skiing on my channel. It's cool, I hope. :)
The comparison is a little weird because you are using the old fashion technique on both skis. Modern shaped skies are meant to be fully carved by rolling the ski in edge and applying pressure at the tip mid the turn to flex the ski (you can apply a stupid amount and it’s very fun).
Throughout the late 1970s, 80s and 90s I always used to prefer GS skis. I had Fischer C4s, Atomic ARCs, K2 612, Dynastar, and even a pair of Authier Competition skis (Authier later went out of business). I am 181 cm tall, and my GS skis were usually 195-200 cm. These days I enjoy Stöckli skis, preferably the red GS model (the retail version of Marco Odermatt’s WC champion skis), but still prefer them to be fairly long, my GS skis are 185 cm. They are really great high speed cruising skis. I’ve kept a pair of old Atomic ARCs with Salomon 737 Equipe bindings, which are still very stiff (almost like downhill skis) and which, with their center groove, have great straight-line stability.
I've always been a Rossi guy....I still have my '94 7X Kevlar GS skis at a 208cm...I loved piloting them, whether it was long turns at freight train speed, or banking short turns like a Tomcat, they responded with such ease and pleasure, and still asked for more!...Today it's the 9GS World Cup Cascade Ibox at 180cm- which is the length I started from getting in to skiing!...Of all the pairs I've owned, have I ever felt so much power out of these skis!
that's a fun test. Skis have come a long way. Much more accessible than back in the day. On a different note - has anybody told you that you ski on your dominant left leg .. or maybe its from holding the camera. Your right turns work well but you carry on skiing on your left in the left turns. Just a friendly observation from a trained eye.
You ain't done s&&t yet until you try the old 80's sawed off skis. Those were the bomb for speed, but you had to learn how to use them. Sawed off right behind the rear boot mount... way less drag = much more speed. But you have to learn to lean forward (instead of backward) and learn to turn differently. Then once you master that then you have to learn to ski on the inside edges going straight with your feet bent out to the sides. Edge skiing on sawed off 80s skis is fast.... real fast. That was fun.
Also an interesting comparison is two modern skis - but one your regular length (whatever that is) and something seriously short. Did a PSIA clinic ton seriously short skis in western MA a couple decades ago - that was one of the things we tried.
My guess is that would be a lot more challenging if you try one of each at the same time. But it sounds like a great way to show the impact of length if your alternating between lengths.
Haven't skied in 23 years. My last pair was 1988 190cm Rossignol Mogul skis with the US Freestyle Ski Team logo because I kept breaking thinner skis when landing tricks on the hardpack snow up in Maine. Would be interesting to see how modern freestyle skis hold up.
I owned five different ski's from 80's and still use them until I purchased some Atomic race bench ski's - shorter than accustomed to but have never looked back. They are 178cm and carve beautifully ]
I have my old Dynastar straight skis from 1983. Last year, I got them waxed and sharpened, and mounted some modern (but inexpensive) bindings to try them out. It was a disaster--actually frightening. I don't know how I used to ski on them 40 years ago, but now they feel like stiff 2x4s with sharp edges. It was absolutely treacherous compared to my modern skis (Blizzard Quattros and Blizzard Firebird HRCs). After 2 runs, I took them off and I'm too afraid to put them back on. Modern skis are way better and safer.
One of the more interesting videos I have seen on different era Technology. My "saved all summer" skis were K2 812 Comp 204cm, so seeing somebody drag out a relic was really entertaining. I think it goes to show that most people put skis in the "For Sale" bin LONG before the skis have lost their mechanical use. I have to wonder what the comparison would have been if the K2 skis were tuned and sharpened.
Thanks! Yes, my K2s have also just been sitting in the basement for decades. Not over used or damaged. Nothing that a little tuning can't fix. I agree - if they were tuned, and I practiced the technique needed to ski them properly, they probably would have outperformed the current skis!
I had the SL version of that ski, in 205. Fabulous in New England. When I took them to Colorado, though, they just dove into the soft snow. Later I picked up a sort of beer league version of their GS ski. I think it was called the 8800 or something like that. It had a slightly softer, rounder flex and a hunk of metal in the tip for plowing through crud. Perfect, if a bit heavy in the bumps.
89'-90' Volkl P9 RS 205cm 90'-92' Kastle SuperGSM 213cm 92'-93' Dynastar Course GS 210 cm from 90' w/ Riva cable telemark bindings. My favorite tele set up of all-time. Merrell Super Comp boots were the only option for steering those things. I used Super Comps up until April 96'. Then I reluctantly went to plastic Terminators. The ultimate sin!
Can you tell me how you are filming yourself going down the mountain, are you using a drone? If so which drone and do they allow you to use a drone on the mountain?
I'm using the Insta360 One X2 camera with their invisible selfie stick. The selfie stick is about 4 feet long, so the camera looks like it is floating. They also have a really long extension pole that you can stick the camera on when filming other people and it really looks like a drone. I'm not aware of any ski resorts in the U.S. that allow drones to be used without prior permission.
Back in the '80s a friend picked up a pair of Fischer RSL racing skis for £5. I think they were 1970's vintage or possibly older. He used them for several seasons. I had a go on them and they were almost impossible to turn. How he managed I will never know.
What do GS racers use today? All I know is that it seems there is always somebody at the bottom of the hill to take their skis away and hand them a recreational ski to hold on camera. The sponsors don’t want you to see what they actually use.
Learned at seven years old without lessons. Had lace-up leather boots with spring bindings and tickets were $5. Next, Cubco was high-tech. Next, new Hart Javelins with Markers were like my trophy. Next, went through three pair of new Hexcel's with Solomon. Next, college buddy sold me a pair of 210cm Rossi Strato 102's. The most Power Full skis I ever owned. Granted, a bitch in the bumps.
I remember Cubco bindings. Waiting in line for the chair lift, you'd notice it stopped. You'd look at the chair that just loaded and there'd be a kid sitting in it with a ski dangling by the safety strap, with Cubco bindings. The toepiece,designed for upward release, didn't like the new higher, stiffer boots. The pressure on the ski tails from sitting down would pop the toe.
I picked up a used pair of Strato 102s back around 1975. 207s. Compared to what I'd been using (Kneissel Racing Team SLs) they were quite nice in the bumps. They were a lot better in powder, too. I liked the way I could lean on the tips and they'd neither hook nor let the tails slide out.
@@JB91710 Ah, remember "Lange bang?" The one-piece Lange Comp boots, from the 1973-74 season, I believe? Well I had the 1974-75 Banshees, the two-piece comp with the cuff that was held rigid with four rivets and epoxy. For the next season they softened it a bit by leaving out the epoxy. I swear, coming off a jump it was my tib-fibs bending, not the boot cuff.
Brilliant stuff! I'm crying that I got rid of my Dynastar Verticals (80's) and Salomons from the 90's. Cleared out the basement just a few years ago. Muppet !
My skis are older than me but ive been using them for years. They are really heavy compared to modern skis and they are long matching my height. Im so ready for an upgrade
I had the first model of the KV Comp and that was a stiff ski that loved to make short, quick turns. Used those and a pair of TRCs from the same time for about a dozen years.
Thanks! I used the Insta360 One X2 camera with the Insta360 invisible selfie stick. I held the selfie stick in one of my hands as I skied. Along with the pole. It affects your ability to pole plant a bit, but the camera technology today is incredible. GoPro has a similar 360 camera, but I haven't used it. When I was buying the camera, reviews tended to view the Insta360 processing app as better than GoPro's app (you have to process 360 footage a bit after filming), so I went with that.
Lotta great comments here..and a lot of great skiers I’m sure. Just a reminder that taking lessons really does make you better. Racing makes you humble.
I had to most fun with my 201cm Rossignol Equipe 9X giant slalom racing ski from the 1990s. Today I ski the 193cm Head GS FIS. I don’t know why short skis with big sidecut are so popular. The long racing skis are a lot more fun on hard packed conditions.
My take is: parabolic skis are great in the bumps because the concave shape leads you into turns. But, downhill and GS or any higher speed situations I prefer the old school long non-parabolic skis. Far superior edging and stability on fast hard surfaces with lots of pitch. Modern short parabolic skis get the shimmy at high speeds.
Raced nationally way back when on various pairs of Dynamic VR17's. Phenomenal ski for the time. Broke my last pair back in '78, and bought a pair of Olin Mark 5's- no where near the performance of the VR17's, but a lot easier turning for just recreational skiing. Moved, and then didn't ski any for about 35 years, and got back into it 10 years ago with a pair of Rossi Exp 88's. Great ski, easy to turn, excellent high speed control, etc. Wanted to try a pair of FIS slalom skis just to see what they were like, and finally bought a pair of Head e-SL RDs - their top racing ski. It is a total blast to ski with - extremely stable, easy to turn, easy to make tighten up a turn when needed to get out of trouble, great on ice even without razor-sharp edges, and while heavy, the weight really is not that noticeable.. Of course, they don't have the full racing bottom prep, which would most likely make them not want to track in a straight line on groomers, so you could say that because of that, they are not a full, all-out racing ski. That said, they are an incredible ski that rewards you with a lot of fun.
I dreamed of VR17s but never got around to owning a pair. FRP wet-wrap (vs. laminated) was considered the way to tame ice back in the day. Olin Mk III was their do-it-all cruiser and the V was like that but with more kick. I was used to a bit more kick than the Vs could deliver, but they could have mad me very happy when I moved to Colorado..
As a ski patroller back in the ‘80s I went through a pair of skis each season. I broke a few but most turned into “noodles”, soft and not holding an edge. I have had my Atomic Smoke mogul skis for 7 years and they are still great. I think the new components and assembly methods are all the difference.
I heard a crack noise from one of my 80s skis in the lift line the other night and my heart sank recalling this specific comment. So far still ok.
I snapped a ski last year just behind the binding, the bottom totally delaminated in one piece and went down the hill like a luge! I panicked in the air and tried to press the backs of the skis into the ground to force myself out of the landing on my back but it just broke the ski in half.@@evanfinch4987
Summary: Old gear: you turned the skis. Modern gear: skis turn you. I wish I still had my old skis from the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s. Sigh. Thanks for this fun video!
Bought a pair of Javelins in high school. Then, went quickly through three pair of broken Hexcel's. Bought a used pair of 210c Strato 102's for ten bucks in 1974. Maybe the best I've ever had. Never dreamed they'd fail. Shovel edge eventually let go. So, bought a new pair Strat 203c 105's in 1978. Still have 'em. Storage. Cheers.
I stil have my last straight set, bought second hand in 1994. I loved the old ones, was so comfortable tackling anything and looking pro. When the new ones came I just literally fell on my face and really had to re-learn completely. Should get the oldies out and try them. Old just plowed straight down unless you make them catch, new turn by themselves and you move your body weight and steer, so interesting to see someone try both at the same time, pretty good going to only fall over once 😂
I learned to ski in 84, we went up as a family and skied every weekend thru high school. I skied all thru college. After college, around 96 I took up snowboarding and only boarded for 20 years. Around 2016 I started my daughter on skis and quickly realized I can't help a kid learn to ski while I was boarding. I picked up some of them "newfangled curvy skis", and wow times had changed.
You're right, the old ones, you had to push them to turn, we kept our feet together and did quick schuss type turns, back and forth. Looking back now, it was hard work. When I got on the new skis I was able to still do those old style turns but quickly realized that the new skis turn automatically when you tip them over. These past few years I have been concentrating on learning to hold a smooth line, transition, and do the carving thing.
We all have some of that nostalgia… but the innovations and changes happened for a reason. Sure, a lot of it had to do with financial considerations (how to get more people interested in skiing, and thus buying skis) but the new gear offers so much more versatility. You can still drive them and ski whatever shape turn you want, but just like those old 2 meter straight boards, you’re only really using the middle of the ski.
On the new gear, much subtler moments of the lower leg will initiate a turn. So, once you master the enormous variety of movements, you can do things undreamt of with old skis, like linking multiple turns where you’re using the entire effective edge. Feels more like surfing than anything I ever did in 35 years on my old “straight” skis.
And when you’re on tele, with one ski in front of the other and you’re carving, that feeling is even more exaggerated… it feels like you’re riding one enormous 240 cm ski, using the entirety of that “single 240 cm edge.” In spring corn, there is literally nothing else like it!
Once a year, the boys bust out retro gear. I use a pair of 60's 230cm wooden Yamaha skis with screwed in edges, leather no name boots, and cable lock bindings. We wear long wool coats with scarves and it's always fun.
That's hardcore and awesome! My dad had a pair of wooden skis from when he first went, but unfortunately he decided to throw them out when we moved to a new house when I was a kid. Ugh!
Sorry if this is something "Everyone knows about", but if not search "Didier Cuche last race". It's by far the most entertaining retirement race ever. I watch it at least once a year.
Ha! I had Fischer wooden skis with screwed-in edges. Broke those at A-Basin, but I couldn't afford Heads or Harts of that era. I could keep up with skiers who could, though!
Ah yes! Orthopedic surgery is always a blast !! ;-)
@@PR-rh9qmeven after you broke them? lol. Cheers!
I think people who learned to ski, and skied, on straight 'retro' skis had to have a much better technique to ski properly...modern skis make it too easy - though that's not necessarily a bad thing. But take off piste for example...back then we didn't have fat, powder skis - we skied off piste on those same narrow, straight, long skis. All about technique. There's no doubt that I'm the skier I am because I used to ski on the old type of ski.
I remember when I first tried parabolic skis. I was used to using so much torque to turn my old skis that every time I turned I’d be facing up hill.
i saw these results among those who got used to classics, upon first putting on parabollic carvers, folks were merely swinging and rolling before lifts at stopping slopes😹
Interesting! I’ve never skied parabolics. Sounds like easy turning when you get used to them!
The term "parabolic ski" refers only to the Elan SCX all other skis with radial side cuts are "shaped skis". We thought this would revolutionize ski instruction but NO! WE WERE WRONG1 The old-fashioned way to ski..."The New Way to Ski" by Wilie Schaffler 1956 is the original source for PSIA.... is the correct answer...which they co-opted, corrupted and repackaged into PSIA dogma and claim rights to. Along with Harrold Harb, American innovation in ski instruction certification fails my examination with corruption grifting and abuses.
Haha. Fun story probably a true story if your skis where on the long side.
When I went from 207 GS skis to skiing on 187 K2 4s, it was no problem at all. It was as though my ski technique was built for skis with more side cut. I adjusted instantly.
The side cut on your K2 is barely noticeable and they are considered “straight skis“ today. I’m just ski instructor in Mammoth and for a long time I had two pairs of skis each year. My son’s skis were 207 cm long and my giant slalom skis were 210 cm long. I actually skied a season on a pair of 215 cm skis. I have to tell you I love the new stuff. Easy to turn, Houldin very well, and I have no problem going straight very fast without any issues. My 1st “Short skis“ were 193 cm. Now I settled into a great ski at 184 cm. I’m 6 foot 3 and weigh 220 pounds and I’ve actually demoed a pair of 157s that are specifically for slalom racing and had a blast. I’m glad I’ve been around long enough to see all the amazing changes.
I had those exact K2s and skied the hell out of them as a ski patroller. You definitely have to work them harder, but they will turn on a dime as long as you keep your weight forward. They turn really sloppy if you sit on the tails. Great skis!
i used to love my old K2 Extreme ... amazing skis
I just noticed something I'm not an instructor but for me I'd be putting more weight on your downhill ski and get on that inside edge. You can get away with it more with the newer skis. But with the longer skis you really need to step on the Inside edge. Get that downhill ski weighted more so it doesn't swim on you.
on the new skis, and probably just in general the tips of the skis are jumping around a bunch, need to be more aggressive and push those skis through the turn to keep everything smooth, more pressure on the toes and shins to push the fronts into the snow more to keep them stable for a smoother turn.
Great point. That's a key to turning the old 80s skis. I don't think I put enough weight on it enough given how icy it was and the skis hadn't been tuned in 25 years. But that is definitely the way to get the most out of those skis.
I was thinking the exact same thing!
That’s just fundamental ski technique. Even if both skis are on the snow, most of the weight is on the outside ski.
@@SkiBoyNY.
Wait. You didn’t even bother to tune those old skis first? 🤦🏻♀️
I got back into skiing after a 20 year hiatus. Skied since 1972. Bought a new pair of skis last year. Had to relearn. So used to side scraping the straight long skis. Just a natural feel. Bought some 184/88 Kendos this year. Yep, I am now a believer. So nice to swing like a pendulum and make nice rythmed carves. Skis are better now. Much more efficient.
I'm entirely old school. I still use my Olin Mark IVs I bought in 1980 (high school for me). I've rented new skis a couple of times, and I hated them. This old dog doesn't want to learn new tricks. If I could buy brand new straight skies, I probably would -- these have a lot of years on them. But I have a style of skiing I prefer, and I just don't want to change that.
I still love the colors we had in the 80s. Great video. I've always wondered about this issue.
Way better!
Pure hype
Yeah skis are ugly now
Old Skis made s skier out of ya!! I had no issues with any skis!!
I still occasionally break out my KVC Comps for the annual Retro Day at the area where I patrol.
i really like my more modern Atomic Alibi's, mainly for the width (98mm under foot), but the topsheet on one tip has peeled back and also on the tail of the other ski. I never had that problem with older skis. I'll have to break out the contact cement and see if it adheres and stays that way. I used Gorilla Glue (clear, non expanding) on the tip before (placed a sand bag and a few cinder blocks over that) and it lasted 20 days of skiing before it came apart again.
My very first picture of me on skis are wooden skis with cable bindings and lace up leather boots. I've seen skis go short (70s) to long (80/90) back to short and wider. Improving materials let the skis get shorter while maintaing stiffness and stability. Of course, with those older skis with less side cut you really needed to know how to ski .
Terrific! 😂 you are crazy! 😂
One of best ways to get injuries to themself 😱
I have to congratulate you for your courage 👍☺
One critical thing you fail to mention is the turning radius of each ski; the Head has it written on the ski, and I believe the ski you are on is the "consumer" SL race ski, which has a very quick turning radius, probably something like 12 meters; the K2 is probably more like 30 meters, so it really makes no sense to try to compare them.
True, better to have added that fact in. The Head ski is actually a "consumer" GS race ski, so the better comparison would have been to my old Rossignol 4G "consumer" GS race ski. The K2 is a SL.
@@thealienrobotanthropologist Great suggestion - I was just limited to the skis I own, which are the consumer/retail K2s and Rossi 4Gs.
I have my old pair of Rossi 4Gs (the purples) from late 80s/early 90s...195s...thinking of putting new bindings on them as I was told the Tyrolia bindings were long recalled/toast. You've inspired me to definitely follow through on that plan!@@SkiBoyNY.
Before they started making skis with more extreme side cuts, they didn’t even bother to tell anyone what a ski’s radius was. I would guess they were a lot larger than 30m; probably closer to 40-45m (or even possibly larger). Modern GS skis for the World Cup are 35m (rules; even though they would turn better with more sidecut, a study was done that claimed that more sidecut caused more knee injuries, so they forced racers to used less sidecut). Before that they were using 27m sidecuts and more.
That was fun. I had 207cm Blizzard Quattro Race Skis in the late 1980s and loved them. Today I am riding 165cm Atomic Redster, I am 6'2" 😊
I still look at my current skis and can't believe how short they are in comparison. But easier to fit in a rental SUV for sure!
Same here at 6'2. I rode 215's. Great ride and they were rockets! A long GS ski is great for cruising fast, ( I even used them in bumps) however, the short ski will always be highly manuverable. It's like comparing the turning circle on a semi to a mini Cooper!
As a full time ski instructor for 30 years i relied on the best second hand ski gear I could find. Now I blackmailed my rep to get WC cosmetic equivalents. There is no comparison. Shelf skis suck. In the back room is where they keep the good stuff. They only want good skiers to be seen on their good stuff so better keep your uniform on when demoing.
@@MrDogonjonhow would you recommend a person to get their hands on skies like that?
Really appreciate this vid - so fun!
I’ve been renting skis for the last 12 years but this year I used my 1992 Kästle RX 205cm. So much fun. The comparison is like driving a 92 manual sports car compared to a new “ computerized” automatic sports car. Find the old skis more rewarding. When you get it right it’s tons of fun but a mistake will for sure punish you quickly 🤣🤣🤣
Manual to computerized automatic is a great analogy!
@@SkiBoyNY. thanks 🤣
that was fun to look at. i forgot how the old skis felt but i remember my first time on modern skis "they turn on their own!" haha
I had racing stock Rossignok skis at the time. You had them in either SL or GS, and if you raced DH you had around 220 cm skis. The DH skis were used by many people as powder skis. You couldn't buy racing stock unless you were an elite racer. I had a pair of GS skis that had a serial number of something like 0054. The reason you couldn't buy racing stock skis (FIS skis) is that they had really thin edges and couldn't be fully sharpened more than a few times. They also flexed much different than normal skis. They had a lot of stiff torsional rigidity but were very soft at the tips and very stiff at the tails. Therefore, you couldn't use them mogul skiing because the soft tip might drive into a mogul and you would permanently bend the skis.
Ted Ligety mastered the 30+ m radius skis the FIS wanted for GS. By using a slightly softer flexing boot and just loading the front of his boots he was able to load the front of the skis and get them to turn. Marco Odermatt the recent GS World Cup champion uses an old style flexion extension technique reminiscent of 1970-1990 ski technique and is crushing it. However, his technique doesn't work at all for a modern slalom.
Mikaela Shiffrin can ski all disciplines with modern technique. However, even she uses a style from the past when it is warranted.
I remember the old 200+ cm when trying to ski breakable crust. Only a few of us ventured into the crud and we had it all to ourselves. You technique had to be very sound; but nowadays anyone can ski crud with rocker skis.
Well, it actually was you couldn't BUY race stock skis at all. If you were good enough you were sponsored and they gave them to you. Also, Liggety mastered 35 meter skis when fis came up with that dumb idea. He basically used an old school..skid..at the top of the turn but we called it a stivot ..a direction skid..cuz no one wanted to admit you couldn't purely carve every turn at race speeds.
Great video! Never skiied with straight skis but got 2 pairs of them and I'm gonna give them a try tomorrow, hopefully it works ok lol
It should be quite a change!
Reminded of the first time I put, what were called Parabolic Skis on, I couldn't stop looking at the length of my skis while on the chairlift. An interesting video.
Ran Salomon X-Scream series skies from the late 90's/early 2000's in 195. Those skis were fast, ultra stable, held an edge like crazy as long as you committed and put power into the turn. For a narrow-wasted (68) ski without any real nod toward off-piste, it was a fantastic ski for the time.
Had ‘em, loved ‘em. Could handle moguls, but you really had to pressure the tips. Paid the price for tentativeness!
I remember my narrow Salomon 203s from the 90s needing a strong weight shift early in the turn when skiing hard pack. That resulted in a very satisfying pop into the next turn. Crud and powder required significantly different somewhat two footed technique. I ski my “current” 2012 Dynastar Legend 85s (178 cm) much more two footed in all conditions. Less physically demanding, but much harder to get that pop even if I really load the outside ski.
To be fair though, the legend 85 is a very very easy going ski.
Had the exact same set up. K2 Comp 90 8;3 with Salomon 957. Miss them!
Crazy video, ski boy. For 2023 I'm just getting back into skiing after 15 years. I skied many days on my 1978 Rossignol CM skis, 185 length. I switched and rented newer Head skis. Yes, their is a big difference. I could still make my old skis work here in Utah. I will have new equipment for next season. I'm retired and deserve anything I want now.
Love that! Will you get the old skis tuned? I figure that a shop won't touch old skis for liability reasons. Or at least make you sign something. I'd have to dust off the old tuning equipment. But yes, in retirement, you deserve to ski and enjoy life!
@@SkiBoyNY. Yes, at start of the season I cleaned up ski edges and lubricated the Tyrolia bindings I set the din higher. I'm not as light as I was when I used them last. I used liquid Swix 4 wax. It works OK. Next season I will use a real ski iron, hot waxing them. After using my Rossignol skis, I bought a edge tuning kit and put a half degree edge on them and they carve better. You tube is great to learn most anything. I plan to buy a few used newer skis at the swap meets that they have here in Utah. I will service them myself and use them. I'm going to go all out and have custom fitted boots made. Utah has many shops that do this. Enjoy life while you can, and for me I can pick the best days for it now. Take care,
I skied in the mid-90s on K2 5500 all-terrains, 205s. Those things could carve through anything and used them from WV to Utah, ran NASTAR gates and handle everything from a long blue cruise to an ungroomed double diamond. They did take some effort to learn, but it felt so rewarding and fine tuned once I got good on them. The newer skies these days feel a bit smoother and are much easier to turn for all variety of skills it seems. I hadn't gone skiing in about 8 years and rented whatever they had at the shop and it was like riding a bike, just easier and a bit slower. Biggest they'll put me in now are like 180s so I don't feel like I can go as fast as I used to, but that's probably a good thing since old knees don't heal as fast as young ones, lol. New vs. Old is like driving a car with and without power steering.
That's the one thing I really notice on the newer skis - a lot less stable at higher speeds. But I probably shouldn't be going that fast at my age!
Same skis I have!!
You have to tune the old ski edges and wax with same wax. Hard to compare if edge are not clean and fairly sharp
Maybe 10 years ago, I went skiing at Silver Creek/Granby Ranch with my son's Boy Scout troop. I used to be pretty serious (for a hobbyist), but for a variety of reasons hadn't been skiing often at all for several years. I still had my 1.9m Rossignol 4S skis from that same era (my bump skis, the cruisers are 2m 3Gs) and it was pretty entertaining to watch people watching me on the slope and in the lift lines.
It was entertaining being that old guy with the long skis locked together linking turns on the groomed slopes rather than the young guy watching that old guy. 8-)
I too had those K2 skis. They were excellent skis.
Cuz I built them while working at K2 in WA
I took my lawyer out on a pair of 165 Rossi Cut... he landed on his ass... he was defending me... there is a gag order....
I had a pair of K2 5500 red white & blue 180’s - I love my skiis & still have them.
The more important is that it gaves you so many old memories
My brother was a ski tech back in 68.
I was 10 then and they measured skis to your wrist held above your head. Most of the rentals were cable bindings that wrapped around Lace ups or cheap buckle boot heels with one big clamp in the front.
One day my brother drops me off a pair of white Hart or Head Holiday 180s. Metal skis a customer had thrown them out as the right ski had split the laminate down most of the way through.
He drove off and I stared at them.
They had Solomon bindings, no cables not those horrible CubCo bindings. Being the youngest and usually alone I lugged them down to the basement
I had an idea .
Finding a piece of flat metal ( it was probably chimney flashing) I dug a pair of tin snips out of my bros tool box and cut a piece a little bigger than a poker card. Then I hunted some screws they were all too long but I liked the big heads on them low profile and slotted
His shiny drill was there and scrounging around
I found a bit. Right on! We used to say.
No clamps , I stepped on that scrap on top of the ski (I can smell that drill motor Still .)
and bored a hole right down to the cement floor. yeah baby! Sheet Metal Spinning like a meat slicer on the drill I stomped it and pulled it out excited I got his bigass screw driver and screwed it right on thru
The metal plate, the ski and into a scrap of wood under it making a nice sandwich.
Admiring my skewered kebob, now what was I to do, with the sticking
out screw? Hack sawed 'em off, all 4, two on each side above the split.
And finally filing the screws flush.
I skied in brown flannel lined corduroys.
Later Army pants sprayed with scotchgard. The patch never broke and I could tighten it with a car key.
Uppity turds would scoot past and snicker in the lift lines or give me more space so their was no contact.
I would
Just come in hard as I was trying to get as many runs as I could.
The extra space was cool when maneuvering
those Metal Bigasskis.
When I was 12 I used them to make a bob sled but thats another story.
Love it. That's the creativity that comes so often with youth. I have a lot of vivid memories and had ideas like that about skis that when I was young but I didn't take as much action on them as you did!
Underrated channel
I recently spoke to an Olympic skier who won gold in the 60’s. I asked her if she would like to redo her gold medal race using today’s skis. She replied that what she used then was just as good as what is used now!
I would bet that she was talking about a speed event though. Some of the skis used today for downhill at the World Cup level are decades old skis that have been resurfaced on top to look new. When they find a fast pair of skis, they keep using them and they often get passed from one racer to another (within that brand of ski of course).
The technology for SL and GS has completely changed though and it’s in non speed even skiing where that change is most obvious. Having much greater side cut, and more stable skis despite being shorter makes a huge difference. I was racing and coaching during the transition from long straight skis to modern skis that have more sidecut and are shorter, and the differences are night a day. Modern skis turn sooooooooo much easier and don’t flop around at high speed.
I found this video by searching for an old vs new ski video. Thank you for making this. I learned how to ski first on a 90s Volkl, and then on an early 2000s Rossignol. I just bought a pair of a few year old K2 park skis and the performance is night and day. The new ski is exactly how you described- much easier to steer and control the ski. The skis practically ski themselves, you don't have to put much input to get the desired effect. This has made me much more confident. I'm not sure if it's the technology of the new skis that is making them better, or that the old skis have just lost their structural stability.
Your reaction sounds like it was the same as mine when I had been skiing my old K2s, stopped skiing for about 7 years, then resumed and tried a more modern, shaped parabolic ski. The difference was so dramatic that my mind was blown!
@@SkiBoyNY. I think getting those K2s tuned would help a lot. Or sell them to me!
when I was 12 (1989)skied with school in Oz…hated the comfort of the boots and those things were hard to turn. Snowboarded for about 8 years before going back skiing about 5 years ago. OMG so surprised by the comfort and and turning was so easy…. 30 years difference in tech was huge…
Well this was a very cool video. I worked in a ski shop in the 80s & 90s and I bought the kvc comp in a 200cm and it was a blast to ski fast on a blowout fast turns in all different sizes. The Mahre brothers used to race on these skis back in the day. It was always awesome to see those guys tear it up on the slalom courses back in the day. And of course Scott Schmidt and Glen Plake where epic on K2s in license to thrill and many other legit thriller extreme ski vids. I got back into downhill skiing a few years ago and last season bought a pair of Nordica enforcer 88s in 179cm. And they were honestly a good ski that held an edge great through ice and variable terrain. But these skis are definitely a lot heavier and give the feeling that they just don’t response with the energy of the k2 kvc. I am 6’3” and I need a longer ski. The Nordica just didn’t do it for me and the lack of pop out of a turn and feeling very trucky in choppy or spring time snow just left me not enjoying this type of ski. So I then sold the Nordica skis and got a pair k2 disruptions 82Ti in the 184cm. This ski definitely has more energy but is still heavy and gets bogged down when the snow gets thick and clumpy during spring ski conditions. And this is where the super light k2 kvc just kicks azz all day over the new era of skis in my honest opinion. The k2 disruption is a riot on groomed steeps in the middle of winter where there are no speed limits. Absolute blast in that situation where you can’t go too fast for the ski to handle. And that is awesome. I want to try the elan ripstick 88 in a 188cm length and see if that gives me a light powerful ski like the k2 kvc and the ease of turn initiation and edge hold of the new generation. Ski fast & have fun peeps ❄️❄️
Yes, the Maher brothers were awesome. And Schmidt and Plake - 80s legends! I didn't know Nordica made skis back then.
Love thinking back on Scott Schmidt and Glen Plake. I had some 195 K2 Extremes back in the 80s and they were fantastic. K2 did a good job of adding neon colors and "fun" into the designs. "Blizzard of Ahs..."
Glen Plake bombing down sheer cliffs with his mohawk.
So many great Warren Miller films.
Thanks for the nostalgic journey.
@@joelatm96 yeah the K2 Extremes were a fun ski! I had difficult picking between that ski and the KVC. But either ski you can't go wrong!! Now I need K2 to bring these skis back in production. Make them Retro Models K2, I miss my kevlar high energy skis!!
They were Kastle@@SkiBoyNY. Mahers skied VO Slalom disguised as 712
80's ??....look at the 70's skis I used to ride for some absolute classics and boards I'd still ride today. Rossi Roc550's , Rossi Strato 102's, K2 Comps (red white and blue with 4 stars), Head HRP Comps, and Dynamic VR17's. All in a 207cm were MAGIC !! I lived in Teton Village in 1973-75. If you got on the tram back then with anything less than a 200cm ski, you were mocked mercilessly all the way up the mountain !!!
I was just out skiing on my 1978 190cm The Skis which i got my first year in college. I raced in high school but spent winter and spring break skiing with a professional mogul skier friend in college. I have bought multiple pairs of shaped skis over the years and tried to like them. Sure they are easier but that is not what i am looking for. I would not want my 1000 Ninja with an automatic transmission because it would be easier. At 62 i still ski better then most people and my skis go where i want them to go in an instant. I pick the radius of my turns not the skis and I like to vary that radius constantly without my skis 2nd guessing me. Not interested in self driving cars or skis.
I'm getting back into skiing after almost 20 years hiatus. Dynastar Course GS 205's and Atomic Super G 215's. These modern ski's were just starting to become popular a couple years after my last year of Daily ( resort photographer ) skiing for 4 years in my 20's. I have some choosing to do myself. I used some rental modern ski's and was surprised how easy it was to turn. I think your right, the ski is "self driving". Thanks for your opinion.
I love you
@@davidh8928 well that brings back memories from my days in Little Cottonwood canyon. Dynastar GS skies from the MV2 to the Course were a great ski for Utah conditions. The Course, IMO, being the best. I went back to 3 pin after that.
Master Skier comments always welcome
"I pick the radius of my turns, not the skis." I too learned on straight skis and I think this is why I can't completely adapt to modern carving skis. But I've found that I can make twin tipped full rocker/freeride skis turn whenever I want them to. They're easy to initiate the turns but I decide when and how much they do it. I probably skid more than I carve, but I don't care. It works for me.
Just finished skiing with some old RD Coyote 200s were my brothers. I was never a fan of GS type skiis but they are heavy and the metal plate makes for great crusing, not fun in fast turns or bumps. I hate the shortness of most of the newer skiis. Always skied 200s soft slalom skis. Short skis seem squirley to me.
I only started skiing in 2001 at age 46 and have only skied on parabolic skis. With proper technique the skis help your turn. I have never skied on straight skis but can imagine that you need the correct technique and have to work harder. Just like modern tennis rackets and old wooden rackets.
I bought some unwrapped Rosignol Pro Racing 170cm Skis from the 90s , slightly wider than you K2. I felt on my first intent to speed up and carve , after 6 or 7 turns I felt my skis were going faster than me until i lost control. I concentrated and worked on my descent advancing one ski slightly in front of the other in turns , raising my leg almost in the air to turn with the other.
I agree that we got lazy and used to modern skis we called Parabolics back in the days
That's what I remember you pretty much would unweight and lift. I took 25 years off and rented parabolics and couldn't believe how easy I could ski them. Went out and bought all new equipment the next day!
I always wanted to start snowboarding but after watching this video im slowly starting to realy love the vibe of the skis
Better get going fast because the sport is going fast and I mean really fast the sport is going so fast there will be no sport no more we can't keep up it left us behind it goes so fast it's already in the past.
Very interesting comparison!
I skied back in the 80s using 185s. It’s been years since I last skied but I’ve always wondered how and why ski design changed so dramatically, and how it would feel skiing todays designs.
It appears todays skis are a lot easier to ski. The shorter, wider, more pronounced hourglass design looks like fun!
Thanks for the great info! 👍
I think that's what's behind the change - everyone I know who skied 80s skis felt it was a lot easier to turn on more shaped, modern skis. The trade off is that at high speed, if you're going straight, they can be a bit less stable than the older skis in my opinion.
@@SkiBoyNY.
That makes sense. Longer is more stable, but isn’t a great feature for a market wanting maneuverability. It took some time but the manufacturers found new designs which were superior to the old design, from beginner to expert! The parabolic design is the biggest advancement in ski tech in my lifetime.
@@SkiBoyNY. : That all depends on which skis you are comparing. Todays skis are designed for specific markets, and once you get outside of the design envelope,of course they are going to be less stable!
Props for the fun review with an excellent choice of music for this specific review.
I ski with my 1992 215mm Rossis for moguls and straight down the hill runs. You really do need a different headspace to kick out the tails to finish turns!
Mostly, they look super cool on a garage wall!
Yes, mine may end up on a wall someday!
Kicking out the tails to finish turns apparently was the way I learned to ski as well. After recently taking a lesson it became clear to me that my ski technique needed revamping. I’ve since worked on making sure I don’t lift my ski during my turns and my skiing has improved substantially. Much left effort involved and allows me to ski all day with much less strain on the knees.
I had that pair of K2's purchased used in the early 90's! What a shock to see them appear here!
K2 recycles their graphics redundant decadal progressions hard to tell any more it's all the same to me very boring not enough nonsense.
Great video! Crazy how the technology in skis has progressed since then.
Yes, and the ski design has changed the technique to turn too!
Don't forget bells, whistles, flashing lights and ultimate unnecessary affectations to make frivolous nonsense. We may be better off in the past but what was then is still now as we never learn...stupid humans we are.
I've skied on my old straight Atomics in the US until around 2005 (I think I've dumped them in 2010), I've had at the same time a second newer set of carving skis for Europe (which I've kept there between skiing trips). Massive difference in how you turn. These days I mostly travel only with my boots (if I have to fly) and rent skis in the resort. I normally go for giant slalom ones for wider turns and better high speed control. They are still significantly shorter than the older straight "slalom" ones.
This was fun to watch! I've rented skis for the last 15 years but own a pair of 205 cm Head SL skis from the late 80's. Those no longer have enough 'spring' in them, but I wish I could rent a modern pair that will actually be stable at speed! Sure, the easy turning is nice, but everything I've rented the last decade doesn't seem to track straight. Am I missing something? I mean, they still race downhill and super-G on something??
Thanks! And totally agree. The older, straighter skis were a lot more stable for going straight. Modern carving skis want to turn, even when you may not want to!
Wonderful concept! Thanks for putting that together. Now compare a late 70s to a late 80s ski! I remember moving from a mid-80s Atomic ARC to a 1991 Rossignol and that felt like a quantum leap in performance. Not sure if you ever competed in the 80s, but to finish the turn some element of step/skate was required to make up for the ski's unwillingness to "finish". I saw you getting the tails crossed on the K2s which a challenge to avoid
Thanks! An another comparison in addition to late 70s to late 80s would be my father's wood skis to any ski! At least, they looked like they were wood to me when I was a kid. They may not have been. But sadly, he got rid of them. Yes, I had a bit of a challenge skiing the K2s since I hadn't used them in decades, they weren't tuned, and it was extremely icy that day. So I felt like I was all over the place and not skiing them the way I used to be able to.
Interesting. I was watching some Olympic races from 1984 and noticed that skate bit, thought it was interesting. Certainly do not see that today.
I loved my 80s skis and my 90s skis!! I used 203 Blizzards and 195 Elans!! But today I do not ski because the prices are pathetic!! My trip to Taho and Batchelor and Whistler was my last ski adventure in 03!!
I loved the video and all the insights that came with it. That said, I still prefer my 195 Head Racing skis that I bought in the early 80's. I haven't used them very much in the past few decades but I recently skied on them at Copper Mt. in January and my old reliable skis did not disappoint me. As in the past, they were very stable while cruising and turning was as easy as when they were new. I think I'll keep them a little longer. While watching coverage of the recent Olympics in China, there was no shortage of Head skis on the slopes by both men and women.
Yes, I noticed that too about the success of Head in the Olympics. I was at Mont Tremblant in Canada a few weeks ago, and several companies had set up tents, including Head. They were rightfully bragging about the results! And awesome that the old skis still hold up. I think mine would too - just need to tune them and get back into the feel of the old technique.
HRP Comps?
@@monkmchorning Hi Eric, I bought the Head Racing skis because I was a Franz Klammer wannabe at the time. If you have never seen his 1976 Olympic downhill run, I suggest you go to You Tube asap. It was perhaps the greatest downhill race ever. The pressure on Klammer to win the gold medal in his home country was enormous. I was 25 in 1976. I will add that Klammer used Atomic skis that day if I remember correctly after watching the video on You Tube. I took my Head skis to Austria in 1983 and went down the steep Hahnenkamm Strief race course at Kitzbuhel along with the other recreational skiers. It was the dream of a lifetime and something I will never forget.
@@brucerehberger9080 I've seen it dozens of times, young man. Yeah, it's breathtaking.
I followed racing, too, but was more into the technical events. My heroes of that period were Gustavo Theoni and Jean-Noel Augert.
@@monkmchorning Theoni and Augert were great skiers without a doubt but my favorite slalom skier is Ingemar Stenmark who always appeared to ski effortlessly while winning an unbelievable 86 races during his career. One has to also admire Mikaela Shiffrin who has 73 wins and is only 26 years old. Mercy!! Love to talk skiing.
Can't figure out how you got those close-up skiing shots?
I used the Insta360 One X2 360 camera on the end of their invisible selfie stick. Holding the selfie stick in one hand with one of my poles, with the camera down near the ski tips. Today's video camera technology is incredible.
Fan fact, it was snowboard which pushed the evolution of ski design forward. Although the technology and its benefits were ignored by ski manufacturers for almost two decades until snowboarding gained enough popularity.
Dude, I literally had those k2 comps in the 80-90's . Me and a buddy of mine had the same ones and we would pound them in the bumps. You had to be aggressive and get over the tips and they would come alive! Sadly mine were stolen and I switched to a pair of heads because they didn't make them anymore. I currently run fishers and I'm still in the the bumps! Thanks for bringing me back to the 80's.
Yes, they were actually pretty great in the bumps. I did the same. Sucks that yours were stolen. Looks like I'm following your lead though, from K2 to Head!
Getting the one piece snow suit like your pants would be the only thing better. I learned on those k2 skis. Great content👍
Thos are my old K2 KVCs - had the exact ones in 200cm that I took to college!
This is very interesting - have skied both sticks and shaped, of course shaped MUCH better (why did it take someone so long to figure out the advantages of shapes until the 90s?). Skiing one of each, what a great comparison.
I don't even know why this video gave me a feeling of nostalgia, I never skied in my life 🤣🤣🤣 great video, I really appreciate how scientific it was.
I ski on a pair of Rosy Bandits LOVE em.
I used to ski on Kastle 210 mostly in the 80's now Fischer 198 GS racing skis. Still short but not like everyone else on the mountain, with super short skis. I like high speed stability at 40-50 mph speeds.
Thanks for sharing!
That unstable dynamic can happen with certain modern skis too (long/light/stiff). The solution for me was a boot setup that allowed skiing from the feet instead of the shins.
If you ski around slowly with your cuffs unbuckled and find yourself more balanced, then I would guess it's forward lean and/or too stiff. You can shim the back of the boot and/or remove the bolts on the back to soften it up.
That's actually a great tip! May have to try it out with the old skis.
I haven't been skiing since the 80s. I learned on those narrow, flat, pointy things
Love the video dude... lots of good memories
I would be curious to see how they compare with a fresh tune. Good wax and especially edge makes such a huge difference.
May go borrow some and do an 80's-90's-00's-10's-20's comparison myself!
Yes, it was definitely fun to try, so you may enjoy it. And definitely agree that having a freshly tuned old ski makes for a better comparison!
i got a pair of 211cm super g skis and it's such a weird feeling comming from short tight turning skis. you had to go 80kph+ for them to feel like they were even turning at slow speed you had to skid them but they had amazing grip on the edge.
The power is in those Head skis too, even more actually. You just need the proper technique. Just look at pro racers and their course times now Vs mid-80’s. Bode Miller was one of the first racers to go on the parabolics…he destroyed his competition on the ‘straight’ skis.
Yes, power may not have been the right word for what I was experiencing.
@@SkiBoyNY. The ‘old’ skis were definately more stiff thru their length which can very well feel like power. Add in the length and you get an effective spring effect if you can flex them.
Bonus with todays skis is the materials they can selectively use in the ski to tailor the energy response. Much more side cut allows for a ‘shorter’ ski too. More flex…ski side cut does the work and properly skied gives tremedous energy out of the turn.
One of the many upsides of todays skis is how much less effort we have to use to get the performance out of them.
Funny how skies of old defined how “manly” you were by their length. 😆. 210 or even 220’s were bad ass. Now nobody blinks at a165 length.
Enjoy the rest of the season my friend! Off to Big Sky next week for me and some friends. ⛷🎉
I don't ski, but I watched this because I'm fascinated by the comparison. I'm a bicycle guy and I've done the same comparisons with bikes. MTBs: night and day difference in handling and contruction- 80's bike is still fun, but more of a cruiser. BMX: New bikes built 100 times better, they're longer, but 80's bikes are more agile and have infinite handling options. Road Bikes: new bikes shift better and are way lighter, but I'd rather use an 80's bike, they were perfection.
Thanks for the comment - really interesting comparison.
I still ski 1996 Elan CR with a length of 195 cm. I like it - the long edge holds the slope well and when descending in a straight line the skis do not wobble and hold the direction well. Short, fast turns are no problem either! I won't change it. PS About 15 years ago I made a monoski from a snowboard, you can watch a video of skiing on my channel. It's cool, I hope. :)
The comparison is a little weird because you are using the old fashion technique on both skis. Modern shaped skies are meant to be fully carved by rolling the ski in edge and applying pressure at the tip mid the turn to flex the ski (you can apply a stupid amount and it’s very fun).
I got some 80s Rossis I'll be rocking this week.
4G? 4S?
@@SkiBoyNY. 740 E series 165mm
Throughout the late 1970s, 80s and 90s I always used to prefer GS skis. I had Fischer C4s, Atomic ARCs, K2 612, Dynastar, and even a pair of Authier Competition skis (Authier later went out of business). I am 181 cm tall, and my GS skis were usually 195-200 cm. These days I enjoy Stöckli skis, preferably the red GS model (the retail version of Marco Odermatt’s WC champion skis), but still prefer them to be fairly long, my GS skis are 185 cm. They are really great high speed cruising skis. I’ve kept a pair of old Atomic ARCs with Salomon 737 Equipe bindings, which are still very stiff (almost like downhill skis) and which, with their center groove, have great straight-line stability.
I've always been a Rossi guy....I still have my '94 7X Kevlar GS skis at a 208cm...I loved piloting them, whether it was long turns at freight train speed, or banking short turns like a Tomcat, they responded with such ease and pleasure, and still asked for more!...Today it's the 9GS World Cup Cascade Ibox at 180cm- which is the length I started from getting in to skiing!...Of all the pairs I've owned, have I ever felt so much power out of these skis!
that's a fun test. Skis have come a long way. Much more accessible than back in the day. On a different note - has anybody told you that you ski on your dominant left leg .. or maybe its from holding the camera. Your right turns work well but you carry on skiing on your left in the left turns. Just a friendly observation from a trained eye.
You ain't done s&&t yet until you try the old 80's sawed off skis. Those were the bomb for speed, but you had to learn how to use them. Sawed off right behind the rear boot mount... way less drag = much more speed. But you have to learn to lean forward (instead of backward) and learn to turn differently. Then once you master that then you have to learn to ski on the inside edges going straight with your feet bent out to the sides. Edge skiing on sawed off 80s skis is fast.... real fast. That was fun.
Say what you want but that’s the stuff I learned on in the 90s and they look kool!
Also an interesting comparison is two modern skis - but one your regular length (whatever that is) and something seriously short. Did a PSIA clinic ton seriously short skis in western MA a couple decades ago - that was one of the things we tried.
My guess is that would be a lot more challenging if you try one of each at the same time. But it sounds like a great way to show the impact of length if your alternating between lengths.
Haven't skied in 23 years. My last pair was 1988 190cm Rossignol Mogul skis with the US Freestyle Ski Team logo because I kept breaking thinner skis when landing tricks on the hardpack snow up in Maine. Would be interesting to see how modern freestyle skis hold up.
I owned five different ski's from 80's and still use them until I purchased some Atomic race bench ski's - shorter than accustomed to but have never looked back. They are 178cm and carve beautifully ]
I have my old Dynastar straight skis from 1983. Last year, I got them waxed and sharpened, and mounted some modern (but inexpensive) bindings to try them out. It was a disaster--actually frightening. I don't know how I used to ski on them 40 years ago, but now they feel like stiff 2x4s with sharp edges. It was absolutely treacherous compared to my modern skis (Blizzard Quattros and Blizzard Firebird HRCs). After 2 runs, I took them off and I'm too afraid to put them back on. Modern skis are way better and safer.
It's such a difference, right? Using the 80s skis again really makes you realize how much advancements actually change the sport.
One of the more interesting videos I have seen on different era Technology. My "saved all summer" skis were K2 812 Comp 204cm, so seeing somebody drag out a relic was really entertaining. I think it goes to show that most people put skis in the "For Sale" bin LONG before the skis have lost their mechanical use. I have to wonder what the comparison would have been if the K2 skis were tuned and sharpened.
Thanks! Yes, my K2s have also just been sitting in the basement for decades. Not over used or damaged. Nothing that a little tuning can't fix. I agree - if they were tuned, and I practiced the technique needed to ski them properly, they probably would have outperformed the current skis!
I had the SL version of that ski, in 205. Fabulous in New England. When I took them to Colorado, though, they just dove into the soft snow. Later I picked up a sort of beer league version of their GS ski. I think it was called the 8800 or something like that. It had a slightly softer, rounder flex and a hunk of metal in the tip for plowing through crud. Perfect, if a bit heavy in the bumps.
I have a pair of K2 KVC Como World Cup race skis with marker Roto mat bindings. About to grace the walk. GOAT
89'-90' Volkl P9 RS 205cm
90'-92' Kastle SuperGSM 213cm
92'-93' Dynastar Course GS 210 cm from 90' w/ Riva cable telemark bindings. My favorite tele set up of all-time. Merrell Super Comp boots were the only option for steering those things. I used Super Comps up until April 96'. Then I reluctantly went to plastic Terminators. The ultimate sin!
Can you tell me how you are filming yourself going down the mountain, are you using a drone? If so which drone and do they allow you to use a drone on the mountain?
I'm using the Insta360 One X2 camera with their invisible selfie stick. The selfie stick is about 4 feet long, so the camera looks like it is floating. They also have a really long extension pole that you can stick the camera on when filming other people and it really looks like a drone. I'm not aware of any ski resorts in the U.S. that allow drones to be used without prior permission.
@@SkiBoyNY. thanks. I had no idea this was possible.
Do your KVC's even have any camber anymore? I used to really like the KVC's back in the day.
Back in the '80s a friend picked up a pair of Fischer RSL racing skis for £5. I think they were 1970's vintage or possibly older. He used them for several seasons. I had a go on them and they were almost impossible to turn. How he managed I will never know.
What do GS racers use today? All I know is that it seems there is always somebody at the bottom of the hill to take their skis away and hand them a recreational ski to hold on camera. The sponsors don’t want you to see what they actually use.
Learned at seven years old without lessons. Had lace-up leather boots with spring bindings and tickets were $5. Next, Cubco was high-tech. Next, new Hart Javelins with Markers were like my trophy. Next, went through three pair of new Hexcel's with Solomon. Next, college buddy sold me a pair of 210cm Rossi Strato 102's. The most Power Full skis I ever owned. Granted, a bitch in the bumps.
I remember Cubco bindings. Waiting in line for the chair lift, you'd notice it stopped. You'd look at the chair that just loaded and there'd be a kid sitting in it with a ski dangling by the safety strap, with Cubco bindings. The toepiece,designed for upward release, didn't like the new higher, stiffer boots. The pressure on the ski tails from sitting down would pop the toe.
I picked up a used pair of Strato 102s back around 1975. 207s. Compared to what I'd been using (Kneissel Racing Team SLs) they were quite nice in the bumps. They were a lot better in powder, too. I liked the way I could lean on the tips and they'd neither hook nor let the tails slide out.
@@JB91710 A buddy of mine bought the Rosemounts, used. "Hard-pack" was the euphemism for clear blue ice.
@@JB91710 Ah, remember "Lange bang?" The one-piece Lange Comp boots, from the 1973-74 season, I believe? Well I had the 1974-75 Banshees, the two-piece comp with the cuff that was held rigid with four rivets and epoxy. For the next season they softened it a bit by leaving out the epoxy. I swear, coming off a jump it was my tib-fibs bending, not the boot cuff.
All i had to do was look at my old ski's and look at the new ones. The hourglass shape of the new ski's do all the work for you.
Brilliant stuff! I'm crying that I got rid of my Dynastar Verticals (80's) and Salomons from the 90's. Cleared out the basement just a few years ago. Muppet !
Yes, mine were at my parents' house all this time. If they were with me and I had to move, I might have done the same thing!
@2:36 "Nice easy carved turns"???? I only see skid turns dude.
He's carving but very imperfectly - mostly skidding
My skis are older than me but ive been using them for years. They are really heavy compared to modern skis and they are long matching my height. Im so ready for an upgrade
I had the first model of the KV Comp and that was a stiff ski that loved to make short, quick turns. Used those and a pair of TRCs from the same time for about a dozen years.
I think the first model is when I really began focusing on the K2s. Saw a lot of them popping up in Warren Miller videos!
Great vid! How did you shoot the slope footage?
Thanks! I used the Insta360 One X2 camera with the Insta360 invisible selfie stick. I held the selfie stick in one of my hands as I skied. Along with the pole. It affects your ability to pole plant a bit, but the camera technology today is incredible. GoPro has a similar 360 camera, but I haven't used it. When I was buying the camera, reviews tended to view the Insta360 processing app as better than GoPro's app (you have to process 360 footage a bit after filming), so I went with that.
@@SkiBoyNY. Thank you. Well done! Looked like you had a drone flying ahead of you!
I own a pair of 2002 Atomic Beta Carv 9.18 190cm and they are my go to on icier days. Love them
Lotta great comments here..and a lot of great skiers I’m sure. Just a reminder that taking lessons really does make you better. Racing makes you humble.
I had to most fun with my 201cm Rossignol Equipe 9X giant slalom racing ski from the 1990s. Today I ski the 193cm Head GS FIS. I don’t know why short skis with big sidecut are so popular. The long racing skis are a lot more fun on hard packed conditions.
My take is: parabolic skis are great in the bumps because the concave shape leads you into turns. But, downhill and GS or any higher speed situations I prefer the old school long non-parabolic skis. Far superior edging and stability on fast hard surfaces with lots of pitch. Modern short parabolic skis get the shimmy at high speeds.
Raced nationally way back when on various pairs of Dynamic VR17's. Phenomenal ski for the time. Broke my last pair back in '78, and bought a pair of Olin Mark 5's- no where near the performance of the VR17's, but a lot easier turning for just recreational skiing. Moved, and then didn't ski any for about 35 years, and got back into it 10 years ago with a pair of Rossi Exp 88's. Great ski, easy to turn, excellent high speed control, etc. Wanted to try a pair of FIS slalom skis just to see what they were like, and finally bought a pair of Head e-SL RDs - their top racing ski.
It is a total blast to ski with - extremely stable, easy to turn, easy to make tighten up a turn when needed to get out of trouble, great on ice even without razor-sharp edges, and while heavy, the weight really is not that noticeable.. Of course, they don't have the full racing bottom prep, which would most likely make them not want to track in a straight line on groomers, so you could say that because of that, they are not a full, all-out racing ski. That said, they are an incredible ski that rewards you with a lot of fun.
I dreamed of VR17s but never got around to owning a pair. FRP wet-wrap (vs. laminated) was considered the way to tame ice back in the day. Olin Mk III was their do-it-all cruiser and the V was like that but with more kick. I was used to a bit more kick than the Vs could deliver, but they could have mad me very happy when I moved to Colorado..