This New Technology will Keep Moore’s Law Going!
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- In this video I explain the Cooling Technologies of the Future.
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Absolutely terrible pun. Love it.
cool stuff
You stated that silicon is more conductive than copper (6:53), which is not true. I otherwise loved the video and the puns!
Are there risks of any buildup that can block those channels the water flows through? Or any kind of corrosion?
I think you made a mistake at around 6:58 when you say that Copper is 4 times less heat conductive than Silicon... its the opposite.
The fan club talks about how cool they are, but they're just blowing hot air.
Are you expecting the chips to tank?
the fan club joke was marvelous
She is the president of the CPU fan club.🤣
I still don't understand why this channel doesn't have more subscribers. It's a great cutting edge tech channel.
Part of what makes it good is that every damn video doesn't have a thumbnail with her mouth hanging open and a title like "new cooling tech supercharges your computer."
Also, I suspect many people either don't want this level of detail or don't want the intro explaining it all. It's great content but it's a bit lengthy if you know the background (that's fine for me but that's a consideration).
I don't watch a ton of CPU content but I suspect those people form a majority of subscribers to CPU channels.
@@petergerdes1094 On point
I already have a big subscription list and don't want to add new channels to it (so i made an extension to add channels to popup list)
@@petergerdes1094 It's perfect. We want IQ 115s to trickle down knowledge from here, not IQ 94's to dumb-down a rich information source. She's doing a great job on the balance-beam where she's at.
190k IS A LOT!
00:49 This cooling episode was so cool that the whole club chilled xD
You should have been a Bond girl scientist during the cold war Bond movies
Here is one of the best technology channels that there is you are clear you always have the best and most innovative tech and I really appreciate these videos
loosening up in your style there Anastasi, telling jokes, laughing, having fun.......i like it
Indeed. She seems in a really good mood
Yes great
As a simple homelab guy, wondering how we can harness this energy for cooling and heating? I live in Michigan, a state getting a ton of new love from Data Centers due to the amount of fresh water we have. I can see a data center in Detroit whose excess heat is delivered to low income households, to large apartment structures. Heat Pumps and Enterprise IT need to have a meeting.
They're already doing exactly this with LUMI in Finland - it's the fastest supercomputer in Europe and it provides 20% of the district heating to the city of Kajaani
@@felinefireaudiodistrict heating is underrated
Her energy with cpus is contagious !!!!
@@FULLTILTSWIFF Sorry, I don't believe in fairy tales ...
That's my kind of humor! My wife tells me I'm weird, but I believe that dad jokes are a rite of passage in life.
Its fact! Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
@@Zucr_ If you're not weird you're just consuming energy without putting new information vectors into the collective space.
@@freecivweb4160 My machinations that envelop the vectors for which I possess don't incessantly need to be superimposed onto the collective space.
@@freecivweb4160 The machinations that envelop the vectors for which I possess don't incessantly need to be superimposed onto the collective space.
@@Zucr_ I feel like my membership in the collective space just got superimposed upon by your response vector.
At 6:52 "four times less conductive than silicon" ? A chilling statement, upended my understanding of materials. 🙃
Indeed 😅
@@biggityboggityboo8775 You must be from a large family ! 🖖
its actually 4 times MORE conductive...
@@WacKEDmaN I know, and I see some already pointed the blup out.
Audio really good this time, every word nice and clear with no audio adjustment 👌
Cooling implies heat which implies energy waste an inefficiency from obtaining power via higher energy use.
So the interesting part of the thesis that cooling = Moore's law going ahead, is the assumption of energy as not being a scarce resource, and the only problem is how to disperse the heat.
What this really represents is more-than-linear increase in entropic heat consumption, or "chaos animals chewing up orderly stored energy and dispersing it into heat and chaos." This definitively puts a ceiling on Moore's Law but we seem to keep breaking through the ceilings just in time to keep it going. But what's also still going is the higher-than-linear (not exponential) increase in entropic heat-generation order-destroying chaos consumption.
As a philosopher I know these are new ideas to you you're just the right person to spend 22 seconds in a video comment to kickstart the idea.
Pressure and flow rate come to mind as the biggest challenges with this. Super tiny cooling channels could also be super easy to destroy with pressure from the coolant.
Anastasi getting more cooling halfway through the video.
I noticed that too
That wafer scale chip taking 15-25kW is crazy. For comparison, that converts to 20.1-33.5 horsepower which is about how much power it takes to drive a car at highway speeds.
Subscribed, and i have told so many people i know who operate at this level of intelligence about your work. Thanks so much for all i have learned from you.
Thank you!
this type of liquid cooling has been seen in nuclear reactor technology and in computers and science-fiction. It's quite exciting to finally see this coming to reality.
I love the joke and seeing you laugh. My wife and I love your channel. Take care.
I've been water cooling most of my technology for many years and i see a few issues with some of the things mentioned. Using deionized water (0PPM) will over time leach metals and other material in the loop leading to corrosion. Also cleaning water blocks is a pain in the butt, i can't see how cleaning the microchannels on a chip is going to work out.
What some people think is impossible may take a little longer to solve. No one fully understands an atom, but we can still use it to our advantage.
I think the option of having phase change cooling just build into the CPU is a good option, so like a vapour chamber, but built into the CPU with the capillaries going right down into the CPU, then you shouldn't even need water cooling because you will be able to transport heat to air cooled heat sinks so efficiently it's no biggy, in cases were you want to have a heat spreader you can integrate the condenser into the heat spreader.
Like in a data centre you would still cool the air with water because it means you can efficiently transport heat outside the building meaning you can pack thermal density more tightly, but going with air cooling within each machine isn't about being cheaper for the hardware it's about the ongoing maintenance being more expensive over a 3 - 5 year period that is the big deal, the cost of the hardware compared to that is a none concern.
Encapsulation of a phase change material in microfluidics directly in the silicon perhaps in place of the through silicon wires might be an interesting approach to moving heat out from the center of thicker vertically stacked chiplets to the heat spreader without as much need for radical changes to the rest of the current cooling setup.
I literally had this coolant idea at the start of your video. It's easy to have a good idea, much harder to implement, even harder to implement at scale and make cost effective.
Great video Anastasi, it's interesting that cooling technologies could be the neccesary breakthrough we all need to advance in chips, not the chips architecture, not software layer, even ai implementation, but cooling. Temperature is computation final challenge.
I think that's clear for a very, very long time. Probably Seymour Cray was the last systems designer who was advocating the principle of more compute power by consuming more electric power. To give a slightly more realworld example than Cray supercomputers, BIT Technologies did develop the MIPS R6000 processor in about 1988. It ran at for the time insane 80 Mhz. A 3 CPU R6000 system did consume about 3.6 kW or 16A @ 220 V. The crazy heat prevented higher integration but higher integration is required for higher clocks, larger caches, FPUs and specialized accelerators. Aside of an even more successless attempt at building an ECL PowerPC that meant CMOS won the battle. And within the realm of CMOS the Pentium 4 was one of the lastt speed daemon designs. It's not that lower clocks are iinherently superior but all these designs since at least the 80s in the end werre dominated by how one can get the heat out of the chip.
And once the heat has been pushed out from the system the next challenge is to get it out of the building. I know data centres built in former cold war underground bunkers were any change to the building in order to improve cooling is extremely expensive and the operators have opted to rather leave some floorspace unused. That difficult cooling can become!
Battery powered devices are at the other end. Cooling there tends to be even more limiting (want your phone to burn your hand?) as is the energy supply.
Whatever, software is also in charge to optimize power consumption, optimize cooling. Challenging times but I like it 🙂
Thanks for the vid, Anastsi 🙂
This is why engine blocks in cars have so many holes for surface area cooling. So interesting.
I'm an electronic engineer and I like the way explain it
Thank you
You are very beautiful and super smart 🤓
I found this video very captivating and I am utterly impressed!
Years ago I worked for a silicon wafer manufacture as an electrical maintenance tech. It was one of the most interesting, challenging and rewarding jobs in my entire career history. The stuff you cover is fascinating to see where the industry is headed for the future. Cooling at a transistor level , they would of laughed in the past.
Ha, I was worrying about cooling in a previous video of yours. This feels like it was made for me. Thanks!
With 1 kW GPU, your computer is a kettle. You played a game for 10 minutes, you brewed 4 mug of coffee or tea.
Fluorinert is the trademarked brand name for the line of electronics coolant liquids, used on the Cray 2 in 1985.
The performance of the biological compute of our brains is so impressive, we think up all of these advances using only a fraction of the power our inventions need. We then cool our brans with blood flow. The more one thinks about humans the more impressive we are. Great to see how the leading players are planning to cool their inventions. Thank you for sharing!
The fan club joke made me hit the like button 😂
Your attention to video editing and synchronization with the audio is next level ...
Paragraf is a company making inroads into graphene based semiconductors (not at chip level yet but certainly FETs; potential for better heat management and performance density using the same manufacturing process.
Wow! The information density of your content is amazing! So many mega interesting current and historical developments in chip cooling delivered superbly in just a little over 19 minutes. Super great!
You’re adorable. Love how you cracked yourself up with your own joke. That was awesome. Hope you do that more often.
08:29 So here it is, how strange, i was thinking the same like Transistor level cooling Today before you posted this video, idk how this idea only got into my brain today 🤔
At some point the cooling tech used in quantum computers may have to be applied to advanced "conventional" cpu's and gpu's. YES !?!?!?
How do you want the normal PC user to use such cooling solutions at such cold temps.
I highly doubt, cos that level of cooling is crazy
The current quantum cooling is for early human first gen quantum computers. State of the art quantum computers require the same cooling as the leaf, one of nature's quantum computing devices. When the brain is better recognized as a quantum computer, the only cooling that may be needed is a cap on a sunny day.
Make sure to give the likes folks she works hard and deserves them
11:21 with closed captions is crazy
Actually thinking of joining your channel because i think its great.
Awesome and informative video yet again, Anastasia! Thank you
While watching this video about liquid cooling the CPUs that maybe a closed loop system can be set up to create steam to generate electricity to power the CPUs. Probably not the first person to come up with that idea.
Or steam to froth some milk
Ha. Loving all the dad humor in the comments. I didn't know most of this stuff about our cooling technology and it's so amazing! Things are going to begin getting very weird. "begin". I, for one, am here for it. Great video well written and edited. I'll be checking out your others.
very interesting. Even if, it seems clear to me that the real next huge lap in computing technology will be make computing power not lineary related to the amount of heat produced by the conputing chip.
Great presentation. So good I will watch it twice!
A fantastic and informative video
Thank you
Thanks Anastasia..
You're amazing. Very good content, deserving of far more subscribers..
Keep it up 👍
Subscribed. I thought I was for months now but your prompt made me double check. Oops 😂 I'm that guy.
I estimate that compared to the 5nm technology node, we can look forward to a performance gain of approximately 1.8 times or a power consumption reduction of 2.6 times as we move into the chiplet phase. Therefore, I believe it is imperative to focus on improving the efficiency of mathematical calculations to resolve pertinent problems in software.
As cooling is actually transferring the heat (on chip or other) elsewhere; the ancillary opportunity is to turn that heat back into electrical energy for powering the cooling systems or the data centers. I know this become feasible only if the cost makes it so.
Learning something and having a laugh...I wish my teachers would have been like this
What if, someday, we could harness quantum tunneling to teleport heat away from a chip, just enough to alleviate the issues?
Love the video! Been catching up again. Got to say I've been thinking of acoustic resonance cooling combined with a jules Thompson cooling effect to the integrated heat spreader for a while. It would use a "balanced armature" (very small diaphragm pump) that would help with power delivery through soaking up emi areas and collecting free errant electrons during expansion. Basically it's shaped to bend during heating, but also has these tiny capacitors they just developed that have power get delivered from these tiny coils placed around transistor areas to soak up emi and z style electromagnetic fields produced via current delivery. They pump coolant around like this talks about but it changes the stability of band gap frequencies as it flows because it's conductive (slightly) as it changes pressure during flow.
Which captures more electron hole potentials and electro magnetic/static fields into itself. Granted it becomes more resistive to follow as it does this and gains more heat. So it has to go into a much larger expanse area into the heat spreader to release it energy, electromagnetic potential energy, and it's kinetic energy so I figured a passive diaphragm capture for acoustic resonance would be good to do as it then places a phonoic force wave through the material to keep "still", I guess, the material but gains reflective disorder and kinetic energy back to it that can be dissipated into a regular heart sink/spreader.
But I was also getting into light fiber optics for cooling that can be conductive, if we could reflect light in through the liquid that take advantage of the pumps, them we could create a photon cooling area into transition area that works off of a grid reflection pattern. This would in turn help with the acoustic resonance cooling, while being able to help deliver switching help. Either make a switch happen, or reduce it's chance. But then conductive fiber optics get into the conversations with that for power delivery for old school tube TV tech that can alter frequency, direction, reflective properties, placement on target, photon resonance emittance, and so on. It becomes more of a hybrid qbit & regular transistor chip design. Something I put up on my other RUclips channel but it's long winded for some I'm sure.
These improvements in cooling would also allow clock speeds to increase considerably. And if graphene comes on the scene (which is possible now that we can make semiconductors with them) that could get even faster.
Plug =[□]= and play, keeping chips cool is an ever changing challenge!
This EXACT Cooling Method is used by the Mainframe Computer In the Movie Sunshine .. Which came out some years ago !! This one also had a high degree of A.I. and A.V. input & feedback .. (pretty wild) 😮
I thoroughly enjoyed your updating archaic me, on what are clearly critical information regarding the requirements for our new personal super computers. Thank You 😁🌹
I knew radio techs in the early 70's using "Can-tenna" products as dummy loads for r.f. outputs. A 1 gal. paint can could dump a kilowatt of radio energy output into mineral oil while the set was tested and adjusted.
I retired recently and this helps me stay up-to-date. 👍
Fascinating. At first I thought you were integrating peltier electric cooling into the chips.
Just one addition: the problem is not the power or generated heat itself. A power plant with e.g. 1200 MW power output has roughly 1800MW of additional power that is simply heat (assuming a 40% efficiency of process)
The issue is power density and how to transfer this high density power output to a larger area where it in the end is air cooled.
Using a coolant other than water might be more efficient. Something like gallium or rubidium. However, these have much higher viscosity so you'd need bigger pumps. They're also very air sensitive so the transport system would need to be designed around oxygen impermeable materials, increasing cost and complexity. But for a server farm these would be worthwhile investments.
It becomes clear that light will have to replace electricity for switching. Interference, both destructive and constructive will provide the 1s and 0s.
Power can be provided by the results of the SAFIRE experiment and the adoption of the Structured Atom model (SAM) of the nucleus.
Your jokes are soo cool as well, you have your own fan club either! 😀I loved that joke 🤣🤣🤣
6:50 Copper's thermal conductivity is 3.4x that of silicon.
Copper: 395 (W/m)/K @80°C
Silicon: 117 (W/m)/K @80°C
Wow that's amazing 😻🤩
So Much Love From Nepal 🇳🇵🇳🇵
Cool! Thanks for the conference link!
Anastasia is the kind of presenter that could make videos about why moths circle lightbulbs, and it would be a hit
immersion cooling is basically phase change cooling. Finding replacement for coolant should be as easy as varying the pressure. They could use water at 1/10 bar, which boils at 40C. They could also vary the pressure for different cooling needs
I also think so. However, could it be that keeping water from interfering with electrical networks is tough? That, even de-ionised water isnt working?
@@catman4859 Sure could. There's also a question of how different materials interact with the electronic components at these phase change points. Maybe liquid de-ionized water doesn't present any issues but its gaseous form corrodes them.
@@mikelord93 yeah. So there are probably lots of complexities here that we are unaware of. Otherwise, such a problem would have been already solved.
Yeah I thought that using phase change inside the chip would be what this video was about. Not just water.
Isn't liquid pretty thick relative to the transistors! How thick are these channels?
I thought water had a capillary limit of .0001mm. Or 100 nanometers.
I remember seeing a solid state fan demo. Think it was called AirJet. I wonder how that company was doing. I guess this technology blows it out of the water.
When water becomes gas - that spot stops being cooled until its covered with water again, because gas has bad heat conductivity. I think its hard to predict and control hotspots in such a setup. When boiling water in a pot, you can see air bubbles forming on the bottom and staying on one place for a long time. These bubbles will cause overheating of a chip, if not moved quickly.
I want to see the full out-take of your uncontrolled laughter from your FAN joke. You could tell it was all you could do to keep a straight face while presenting it.
Now i want chocolate on a Sunday morning first thing. Thanks Anastasia
😂
Wondering when they go full Graphene instead of silicon that we currently use. We can see the physical limit in the Intel 13-14th gen 13900K-14900K heat limit from the voltage pushed to these CPUs.
2:58 I’d love a run down of the different transistor architectures (?) showing in this diagram.
I know what finFET and GAA are but what’s FSFET and CFET?!?!
Thanks
That dense micro-channels won't work, water molecules will create friction, and mechanical force on the molecules of the Chip; also water oxides Copper, another liquid element needs to be used. So, more spaced micro-channels, would work but the Volume for useful transistors will be reduce, so Dies need to be Bigger, to keep the density, making less Chips/Wafer, increasing the price a lot, maybe for those huge Chips. I think a variation would work: Submerging the Big Chips in that liquid that bubbles but stays cool, so the liquid will be picked by small tubes that will be shaped in the form of the current air coolers, so they'll be cooled with air there; from there it'll go to a Chiller, and back to the Big Chip
Nice job explaining,
but if liquid leaks, short circuits everywhere
Problems do not exist, only new opportunities.
Such a cool video, ty Anastasi
I hope Intel is taking notes, with all the recent 13th & 14th gen CPUs overheating...
Wow definitely in love with this technology
Only the technology?
Maybe combating overheating batteries could help solve this with graphene which has the best thermal qualities .maybe sandwich the component's ,but then their might be electrical run off,where a similar material with better resistance could work
Before we talk about technological improvement we should talk about how to make modern enterprises care about selling less products with longer longevity instead of intentionally selling the opposite.
Like you, the video was perfect. Thanks.
Look into the cooling system on the old Cray X-MP super computer. A very cold high pressure liquid pumped through each small component board. The liquid was Flor-n-nert (spelling is wrong ) NOT Freon .... a person could breath this stuff for ever but it would kill the lungs so you would have to stay on it for a life time. In the Cray-2, the whole system (all boards) was in a tub (beautiful C-shaped rack). It would be a great subject for a video.
At the beginning of 1970’s, the communication satellite dishes (for telecom companies) had cryogenic cooling attached to the rear to cool the LNA (low noise amplifiers). By the later 70’s the newer dishes used semiconductor LNA’s that did not require cooling.
Thank you
Amazing video! Thanks for that!
I don't need subtitles to understand you anymore (except technical terms I didn't already know). I think your English pronunciation has improved markedly since I started watching your videos.
Thank you Anastasia! Even for the pun (joke).
I'm a retired Industrial Design Engineer (Mechanical, Electrical, Electronic, Software). You explained this very complex system very well. I suspect that the answer to the heat dissipation problem, will eventually require new materials & techniques. That is one area a lot of research effort is being conducted (no pun intended!) 🙄😏
I subscribed & look forward to more. I will also pass your channel link to other tech streamers that I think will find this interesting or useful. Thank you again, and I wish you the best of luck. 👍
All that heat is a valuable recourse if it can be captured and recycled into electricity. It could help compensate for the large power needed to run the computers in the first place.
This issue is the same as faced by the home audio industry back in the 70's when regulations required that the advertised output be able to be maintained for, say, 1/2 hour, rather than momentary peak output. Heat sinks grew exponentially and started including heat pipes and thermosiphons for the output transistors.
The sleeping mode, donotspypro, glasswire, the switch button cooles the Klima . Digital Electronic is the Combustion engine, Cloud saving and useless Traffic is the world danger. But I Love the Power of my Threadripper and all this Information in this channel. Please Shutdown all Cloudsystems for 25 days per month, for saving energy! And the world is getting as beautiful as Anastasia ❤
6:55 copper has a higher thermal conductivity or lower thermal resistance
And it's not 4 times higher, but more like 2-3 times, also depending on the purity of the copper.
The technology is fascinating, but I'm really puzzled about why we even need such astronomical computational power. Also, without priorities changing somewhat we're going to burn through our energy and mineral supplies at a rapid pace this way.
Mineral oil is nonconductive but is very messy especially if you have to replace something before you are replacing your whole system. And as far as the masturbating that can hit a whole office building with that kind of heat. Maybe they should look into heat for office buildings with that much heat. Btw u r so intelligent and pretty it makes me think about going straight!
I never used liquid cooling . However, Today It is getting to the place you need a sag brace for the CPU air cooler due to the weight and the size. Today you can get a ligiid cooler for about teh same price as an air cooler. . I mostly work with 65 w and I do have one 105 w chip a Ryzen 5900X. Air is simpler in so many ways.
Very fun and Kool as always, Thank you.
Fan club! Good one. I need a fan while watching your presentation...But seriously, concurrent engineering is a must with AI and perhaps drawing from biological inspirations...
That amd Athlon chip brings back some good old memories:)