I have no problem buying Klevv here in Melbourne Australia. I'm only running an R5-3600 CPU, on a TUF X570 wireless board. My RAM is Klevv c16-3200, I have 4x16GB (64GB) sticks which I am running at c16-3600 at 1.35v stable. All I've done is change the frequency, all XMP timings are untouched otherwise, including voltage. I've found this to be a nice stable balance, although I've managed to run them at 14-14-14-42-3800, with IF at 1900, with a few other timing tweaks, with 1.5v , but I'm not comfortable pushing it that hard, and it can be a little flakey at those settings. I sold some Samsung B-Die (4x8 Hyper-X c19-4000) which could only do c14-16-16-46-3600 at the same settings I'm using for the Klevv sticks, on the same board. Being Zen2 it certainly wouldn't run 4000 regardless of settings, even pushing as much as 1.8v into it. I couldn't do better than 1850 IF with those sticks either. I could run the B-Die at 3733 at best, but a bit flakey. My Klevv RAM is CJR Hynix. I'll be buying a 5900X when the dust settles, and I'm hoping to get a little more from my RAM. What is your opinion of CJR Hynix and do you think it likely that I'll be able to push it a bit harder with my current mid range board and incoming Zen3?
1 hour later and my head is smoking but im glad that i somehow managed to pick 3200 cl16 micron Rev.e 8gb modules on a b1 board out of this confusing mess without really knowing what i was doing. Cost-effective and fast enough for me. Crucial Ballistix Sport LT v2 16gb Dual-Rank modules ending with "AESB" if anyone cares.
@@killswitchscar1060 Not yet since im running GPU limited in pretty much all games and for other stuff the system is fast enough. Gonna look into it though if i switch to a 3rd or 4th gen Processor or get a new GPU.
My 2x16 3000c15 dual rank ballistix runs @3800-16-19-16-16 on my ASRock b350 itx board. Haven't tried higher than 3800Mhz because the fclk on my ryzen 3700x max out @1900mhz.
Quality Video. I swear, AHOC is the only channel on youtube where you can find legitimate detailed info about RAM overclocking. Everyone else is just drooling on their keyboards like a degenerate, telling you to turn on XMP.
@@musek5048 I can only reliably vouch for Micron here (own experience + experience being Tomoya from Clannad towards others with their issues on Discord) best to worst E >>> D probably > B >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A dunno bout Spectek, most likely lower grade bins of respective Microns (can be traced by the 5-unit code in SPD)
It's because of your recommendation that I ended up replacing my unstable 3200 CL16 Corsair Dominator with the Patriot 4400 CL19. I have it doing 4266 16-16-16-37 with 1.5v and my memory instability issues are gone, so I'd like to thank you!
What CPU are you using? Are you overclocked? I have 2x8 TForce Vulcan Z 3000 (with xmp profile, but stock is 2400). Because of running apps and games I find I might need more memory, looking to get 2x16. Anyway, I was told by the PC manufacturer (as I have a prebuilt) that my Ryzen 7 3700x, B450M/ac mobo, only supports RAM at 3200MHz at the fastest. I heard on a forum that it's possible to go faster with RAM but then you'd have to start playing with FCLK and I'm still to new to this to be messing with that so it looks like I'm stuck with 3200 RAM for now, not that I'm complaining.
High quality DDR4 is so important!. For the first time in my life, I spent $439.99 dollars on my 32GB memory kit. I got sick of black screens with even the tiniest of memory adjustments in the bios on my old memory set. I purchased G.Skill Royal Z 4x8GB DDR4 4000Mhz CL15 with 1.5 volts XMP profile. They are phenomenal! And well worth $440 bucks. With taxes and 1 day shipping they were almost $500 dollars. These are high quality binned Samsung B-Die using the A2 PCB design. I run a delidded 7980XE at 4.8Ghz on a X299 Dark motherboard. So I wanted the best matching 4,000Mhz quad channel set I could find with the lowest possible timmings. And CL15 4,000Mhz was the absolute best I could find. I have optimized the timmings and secondary timmings quite a bit, and I can even run 14-14-14-32-1T-290 at 4,000Mhz with 1.6V. Very very very fast! Very low latency! It is stable in my day to day usage, and very fun for benchmarking and gaming. I have managed to get 15-15-15-340-1T/ 4,000Mhz 100% memtest stress stable which is more realistic for daily usage, better get a fan pointed on them though! They can hit 55-60C, and lose stability. A matching quality memory set is the most important part of a build! And I will never cheap out on memory again! Thanks G.Skill for offering such a cool and well binned kit, but I certainly paid for it though! And thanks Buildzoid for providing such helpful information. Don’t buy K SKU processors, and then cheap out on memory people! You are wasting your time. Latency and bandwidth is important.
I just got started on my better memory journey. Snapping up some last-one-in-stock discounted B-dies and pretty happy about it. On a side note my kinda crappy CPU performance may have in fact been caused by crappy memory...
The reason DRAM is referred to in bits rather than bytes is historical. The earliest 3 generations of DRAM were all in a bitwise configuration. EG the 4104 (4kx1) 4116 (16kx1) and 4164 (64kx1) all of those fitted in 16 pin DIP which would not have been possible for bytewise. It was only with 256kx1 that things changed and a 46464 was made(64kx4).By this time the chip could not fit in a 16 pin DIP anyway so going for a few more pins was not as much of an issue. Remember back then there was /RAS, /CAS, /RD, /Write, /Refresh and /CS. The /Rd and /Write pins got changed to a single Read/Write quite quickly for the 4164 and I think some variants had RAS/CAS to keep them in a 16 pin DIP instead of 18 but it's decades since I designed with them.
If you want to use Zen 1 on a X470 Gaming Plus Max (daisy chain) and somewhat high memory clock with using all 4 DIMM slots, please use "Bankgroupswap enabled" and "Bankgroupswap_alt disabled". This changes "blackscreen and no boot" to "working without errors" on my system for some reason. I have got 4 Samsung M378A1K43CB2-CTD C-Dies. 2 sticks are from week 35 / year 19, the other 2 from 23/18. They come with DDR4-2666 Cl-19 out of the box and all can do DDR4-2800 with 14-16-16-34-52 and 1.29V (geardown and bankgroupswap enabled). Any higher clockrates are not possible, no matter the timings or voltage. I am possibly running to the limits of Zen 1 with 4 used DRAM slots or board signal quality limit. ... could be worse. :)
@@elhuron8819 well, yes and no. I'm not saturating 16gig in the foreseeable future, but games I play are CPU bound. Cs, wow, etc. All at 165Hz synced. Faster ram is useful every day.
Just to correct a (slight) inaccuracy - Micron did not "buy" Crucial. Crucial was a brand created by Micron (September, 1996) specifically to market their DRAM direct-to-consumer. It has always been owned by Micron. I still have some old SDR sticks which are Crucial-branded with a "by Micron" logo in small lettering underneath.
I'm a beginner memory overclocker and i havent left after 5 minutes eheh Every minute of your videos is worth the time, i love to learn this kind of stuff. (sorry for my bad english)
Klevv科赋, they are actually quite popular in China. You can easily find them in Taobao(淘宝) or JD(京东). I saw discussions about them in Chiphell every once in a while due to their relative low price and mild OC capability.
You are good at selling those socks at the end! I kinda want to get some now Also, great video overall, kept watching while building a PC. Will come back to this vid when I am choosing a new memory kit. Thank you!
I buy all my Samsung B-die from Team Group. They are the only ones that set the XMP on their 3200MHz to 14-14-14-31 as all other companies set it to 14-14-14-34.
2:33 - speaking of cruicial/micron, I wonder what can be done with 2x16GB of 3200 Micon Rev-B (but CL22 xD) 10:23 - oh boy Ive seen a few posts saying "Hynix A-Die" or even "CJR-Die"
One thing I say different than BZ, about the 3200c16 (or even lower) memories---------- Some are worthy to buy, but you only buy when you know how to take the risk. Samsung B Die request binning since not all B-Die ICs are consistent, but Hynix CJR/Micron Rev E both are relatively consistent and mostly clocks pretty well. Let's put some example here: 1. Crucial green PCB 8GB 2400 -- Some using "C9BJZ" and "D9VPP" ICs, which both is Micron Rev E, and those without binning, will most likely do 3600+ to even 4000+, with tCL16 and tRCD on 20+ 2. Kingston ValueRAM 8G 2400/2666 --- Recent batch are mostly Nanya A Die, which most likely does 3200C16 or 3600c18. Buying cheap low end RAMs and get 3200 is not bad. 3. Kingston HyperX Fury/Predator (RGB/Non RGB) 8G*2 kit 3200, I see a good number of Hynix CJR combined with Nanya A Die and Hynix JJR, if you luckily getting the CJR you can push 3600c16/3733c16/ 3800c16/4000c17, if you unlucky and got JJR or Nanya, 3600c18. 4. Good number of Kelvv memory (child company of Hynix) are using CJR, which OC pretty well. 5. Corsair Vengeance 8G*2 or 16G *2 3200 speed bin, with Version 4.31 (Samsung B-Die), or Version 5.32(Hynix CJR) both likely clock pretty well. 6. All the recent batch of Thermaltake Ram I've touched (8G*2 3000/3200) are all CJRs. DO NOT BUY G.SKILL and try your luck at OC, G.Skill's binning process will out smart you, but Kingston/Corsair/Crucial/ADATA/etc do have certain model to try your luck with.
3. HyperX Predator RGB owner here. Bought two 2x8GB 3200 CL16 kits. Both have JJR. Aside from tRFC being worse JJR appears similar to CJR. Total cost about 200€ for 4x8GB. And yes i can confirm it does 3733 16-20-20-36.
Raivo K Kingston is a bit weird there, some of the JJR was labelled as CJR, some CJR was labelled JJR....... some other was labelled correctly, I had a Kingston HyperX Fury 16g*2 was labelled as CJR, thaiphoon read as CJR, beheave exactly like JJR, does 3600c18 only.....
@@OMGJL Well then i might have mislabeled CJR because mine does 3733 CL16 despite thaiphoon showing all sticks as JJR. Still the tRFC does not match what the Ryzen DRAM Calculator gives me. The calculator does no have a JJR profile yet and the CJR profile does not match exactly.
@@Raivo_K DRAM Calculator is only a "estimate", it's never going to be identical..... I found the DRAM calculator setting are quite optimistic, and often I need to bump up some latency by a tick or two.... Also regarding the "miss-label", I personally think it's Hynix that does it not Kingston, as Kelvv have sticks labelled as CJR and only does JJR performance too from time to time...
Patriot can do that because they use dram chips in ssds. I assume they bin a few from each batch and take the most promising batches to the memory division for further binning.
I started this video in my BR, left the house to go have a colonoscopy, came back and it was just wrapping up. Thank you for the long-form videos. Apologize to NOBODY for it.
I can relate to the statement of 3200mhz cl16 kits using everything under the sun. I bought a ripjaws V 2x8 cl16 kit proceed to get some variation of micron memory and one stick flatlines on its stock xmp profile(actually it needed 1.5v to reach that which looking back after a year YIKES)... which is great, microcenter was nice about after the one month it committed sudoku they give me an exchange ripjaws V kit, I proceed to get 8gb bdie in it and it has had no issues rn at 3600 mhz cl14/5, I would go further but a 2600x imc can only do so much. Recently I had a post error which I couldn't figure out what the issue was so I cleared cmos because nothing was fixing it, my bet is this 2600x has the silicon equivalent of having a screw loose and its just making an issue for no reason
Running G-Skill 3800 CL16 @ 1.38 volts. 4 sticks, 32 GB. F4-3600C16D-16GTZNC on a 3950X. Was stable on my 3800X as well. Aorus Master X570 board. Hynix DJR chips on the memory sticks.
They use Gbit, because a 8Gbit chip equals a 8GB single rank module or a 16GB dual rank module. Eg a ECC 8GB single rank module uses 9x512MB chips, but the chips are 8Gbit, so 8GB module for single rank in this case. Like always with units, you try to use the unit that makes use for the intended application as simple as possible. Its just more intuative.
7:06 i think the reason we still use BIT VS BYTE is because of the old school "core" memory... like.... where they had iron "donuts" with wires running threw them . each donut was literally one bit...... and your total memory size was how many donuts you had . sure.... today everything works off the byte.... but back then, each bit was important
"there are definitely chips out there that won't do 3200 CL16" Oh hey, Rev. B downbin in my PC, Buildzoid is talking about you! Don't worry, I still love you. You at least do 3000 CL14, and your tRFC is surprisingly good too.
I have a supplier for KLEVV memory sticks(Im from Malaysia) out of stock now for obvious reasons but their basic stuffs are not that bad, the KLEVV value line of 2666 cl19 can do 3200 cl16(or better) and so far no problems.
Hi Buildzoid I think you made a mistake, the A2 PCB version of the Team Extreem only has a 8 layer PCB if you look closely and it is the same one as the Antec S3 bdie kit you have which has a 8 layer PCB. I managed to have my Team Extreem 8 pack edition with A2 PCB RMAed in the past and got a 10 layer A0 version in return after I made a complaint to Teamgroup about this though Teamgroup never admitted about that. Interestingly I noticed their marketing material no longer has 10 layer PCB in the Team Extreem marketing material shortly I got my kit from RMA.
I bought some Corsair Vengeance Pro DDR4-3200 C16 and got CJR. It would be cool if you could do a video on it, just to show how it overclocks, and then you could show why it should be avoided.
my question is.... why is the "slot interface" shaped like a very shallow U?? . like... why are the edges the shortest.... and the middle the tallest?? . is it just to help with alignment / insertion into the different designs of RAM sockets? or is it because the middle part is power or data.... and it helps to have more surface area to contact with? . like.... im sure its a JDEC or ISO standard shape.... because EVERY stick is like that but why?
In South Korea, samsung sells C-die oem sticks at very cheap price. (compared to other manufacturers binned kits) So we tend to use a lot of those. And it is okay, especially for zen2 systems. Most c-die oem sticks usually go up to 3600 CL18 and often up to 3733~3800 CL16~18. Which is a good spot for a zen2 system.
What about Patriot Viper kits? Anything below their 4000mhz kits isn't b-die, but their 4000 and 4400mhz kits are b-die, not sure if there are others. In my recent build I bought their 4000 cl19 kit because it was the cheapest option for the given specs. I want to run 1:1 with the IF. I'm currently running 1800mhz IF with 3600mhz 16-18-18-16-38-60 1T with a few other sub-timings added in that I estimated based on the DOCP profile numbers. I haven't done any further testing to try to optimize things. Anyone have any tips/suggestions? I tried running the dram calculator thing and it was way too confusing. What are the best timings I should expect to run at 3600mhz if I feed it 1.4 or 1.45v (if that's safe 24/7... I think it is...), and in case I can run 1933mhz IF what are the best 3866mhz timings I should expect to run? And can someone help me fill in some other subtimings? This is with a ryzen 3800x and an Asus x570 TUF pro wifi, with the latest bios from Asus which I haven't had any problems with at the above settings. CPU is currently stock... if anyone wants to help me OC/optimize my CPU as well it would be much appreciated. Cooling is a noctua u12s, in a p400a with 4 fans, so very good airflow. And again, it's a 2x8 patriot viper ddr4000 cl19 kit, and a sapphire nitro+ 5700xt, with a silicon power 1tb ssd, the phison e12 TLC kind, 3400/3000mb/s. Comments and suggestions highly welcome and if anyone is willing to chat in discord let me know and we'll make that happen. My CPU voltage is hitting higher numbers than it needs to I believe, and if I can get 4400-4500 or higher all-core I would prefer to do that. But I'm not sure how AMD setups work (I came from a 2500k)... can I run an all-core OC where it will still automatically drop the clocks at desktop/idle situations and then boost to the all-core OC undner load? That would be ideal. I don't necessarily want to run an all core OC for browsing the web.... unless that's normal and it can drop the voltage and be safe 24/7 and not pull too much power.
So my memory sticks are trash. Wish I knew half this stuff when I bought them. Corsair LPX 3000-CL16....A0 DDR4-2133P Hynix CJR No wonder they wont clock over 3066.
Corsair LPX owner as well. Yes, they're not fast, but you primarly buy them for the low profile (guess that's what LPX stands for) and price, not out of specs performance.
I'm currently trying to decide if a team group 4400 kit upgrade from my 2933kit that won't push any further would help my 2700x get some better cpu scores in time spy.
well i cannot over clock my CPU (i3 8100) so i tried overclocking my RAM and with a bit of success but i got thinking, while i did overclock it, i know not enough about it in the RAM department... can RAM be too fast for a CPU? like by example to dumb it down, if all RAM in the world had the same timings, and only MHz mattered, if i had a 3.6 GHz Processor (4 core) and 4 sticks of RAM (does not matter the size) and the RAM was 4 GHz, is the RAM uselessly too fast for the Processor? like is there a point where the processor can't use the RAM speed? i do not think i reached that point tho.i did a BCLK overclock of 2.5 MHz making my i3 8100 is at 3.69 GHz and i only have 2400 MHz DDR4 CL15 but i put it is on 2533 and the BCLK makes it 2596 MHz with a timing of 14,15,15,34,384 instead of 15,15,15,35,420. (400 something... would need to go in BIOS to remember... maybe 440...) the only test i could do was using the boot menu (i dual boot with Windows 7 and Linux) and load memtest86 and press F2 for all core usage, the test 1 to 5 went about 30 seconds faster and stable. but i have no actual tool to test if it is worth it or if i am just beating up my RAM for unusable performance due to lack of Processor speed! i guess in short: is there a ratio of processor to RAM in a general rule of thumb for speed and is there a free tool to test the performance on Windows 7 or Linux that i can at least weight my gains if any! (well there is a gain but memtest86 really just test stability and who knows what the BCLK does to it's "perceived" speed and time...)
Ram advertises the double data rate, it's actual clock speed is half of what it says. Often a CPU memory controller runs at a lower speed that the CPU though. But essentially no a 4ghz ram stick is actually running at 2ghz and the CPU is still running faster. Not only that, you can't access ram every clock cycle. Your timing numbers are how many cycles it takes to do a given operation. On Ryzen you want your true ram clock speed to match your memory controller speed FCLK, which is capable of at least 1800mhz and up to 2000mhz, then tighten the timings from there. For Bulldozer I'm not sure.
I went from B-Die to CJR because I pulled 32gb of RAM from a "non-working" eBay PC and sold my old 16gb kit. Dont regret it, it does 3466 16-18-18-36 @1.45V, so it's not that awful.
I guess i got lucky then. I gambled on Patriot Viper Steel 32gb 3200 16-18-18-36 CJR, found it can run 3666mhz 1.35v 16-18-18-20-38 and 3733mhz 1.4v 16-20-20-38-58-496 with MSI daisy chain b450.
They're referred to in bits because they come in varying data bus widths and it'd be a bit confusing to call a 4×2G chip "1 GByte"; the "8 GBit" name is agnostic to the actual data bus width. DIMMs generally use 8/9 chips with 8 bit data bus width so they *could* be named in GByte, but SODIMMs and embedded area chips also use 4b, 16b and 32b widths. There's only a handful of DIMM vendors designing their DIMMs but a zillion of embedded systems engineers designing some wireless router that needs a RAM chip, so it's to avoid pitfalls for the latter.
My 16GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600MHz (CL18) kit is Samsung B-die, and does 3800MHz @ 16-15-15-40 1T 1.39v. Latency: 63.9ns / Read: 56,000+. Doesn't get any better for my Ryzen 3700X!
From my experience, the only chip from Samsung OEM that is consistent is E-die 22nm on 4gb single rank server style pcbs. I've binned about 20 sticks in pairs, from different purchases and I think only one of them was not able to do 3866 without errors. Typically they do it at c19, but can go lower. It's not bad considering how cheap it is and works good for budget ryzen zen1/+ 3466/3533c16 . Small sample, but worth a shot if anyone is looking into playing with memory, it's a fun IC.
I have a new Corsair RAM that came out a couple of weeks ago (Vengeance RT) that can handle 4600 MHz Cl18 and 3200 cl 22 @ 1.2V. I thought that it was Samsung b-die but after watching this video I think it’s probably this new Samsung d-die. I managed to get 3800 cl15 stable.
You can now the die by looking at the version number of the stick. ver 4.33 I samsung 8-bit d-die, ver 4.31 is samsung 8-bit b-die If you do check it out, please could you reply to this with the version number?
So, is there a good way to determine how good a memory is without overclocking? In EU we have 14 day return no questions asked for online purchases, Recently I found I can order to a local store and 0 post fees. I can also return to the local store during 14 days. I am planning on getting a big load of ram next time, test it out and return them.
No wonder I was having such a hard time with this 16G Corsair 3200 cl16 (b die) kit. Only got it to boot into 3600 at cl19 once so far... Have a Gskill 16G 3600 cl19 (djr) kit booting at 3800Mhz 16-16-20-34 1.4v, best Aida64 latency 63.3 ns.
They are referred in bits bc there are memories that are not arranged in bytes, the bus has an arbitrary data size, it's easier for the datasheet, specially since most memories have a parallel data bus. 8GB of memory may well be 8 chips with 8Gb x 1 bit bus :P
So, I bought the Corsair Dominator 3200 CL16 kit (4x8GB) before I knew much about DDR4 memory. I don't have any problems with it, it's running stably with the XMP spec. The timing is 16-18-18-36 which I gather is considered a bit loose. According to this video, this memory could have crappy memory chips on the PCB. If I'm not overclocking then is there anything I should be worried about? Also, I have a Z390 board which is dual channel but I have 4 x 8GB sticks. Should I consider upgrading to 2 x 16Gb sticks of 3600 CL16?
i read something about DDR5 as they implemented on-chip ECC, so means they can churn out plenty of DDR5 chips for both servers and consumers in 1 go ? cheaper perhaps?
ngl i went to grab some ddr4 i had laying around. a 2x4 kit from 2017, a 2x8 kit from 2018 and a 1x16 stick from 2021. not only did i manage to somehow lose onef of the 4 gig sticks, none of them have Samsung memory. only micron, team elite and sk hynux.
Loving the videos, really makes me want to see how far I can push my memory. Even if it means "blowing" the sticks up. But I'm running into a wall I hope someone can help me with. I have a couple of sticks of 8Gb B-die, rated at 3200 CL14. I had problems getting as far as I wanted because anything over 1.45v would crash because of the temp going past 50C. Added aftermarket cooling and now the sticks never goes above 35C which has allowed me to push it quite a bit further, but I'm now running into a wall when trying to push the voltage past 1.6. Even at XMP speeds it's unstable at 1.65v. I've tried lowering the VTTDDR, but that didn't seem to help. Any suggestions? Are there any other settings that might allow me to push the voltage any further? Or is it the memory controller, motherboard or something else that is struggling? Other specs are Ryzen 3700x on an Asus Crosshair VII Hero. Btw, my current best result is 3800 14-16-16-14-28-288-1T. I wanna keep it at 3800 since I'm running the memory controller and IF at 1:1:1 and I can't seem to push my IF any further.
STOP!! Raising the voltage to the memory also raises the voltage to the memory controller in the CPU. You can and WILL kill your CPU if you go above certain voltages like 1.45V (can't remember the recommended values right now).. it's not linear either as you might get three years at a certain voltage and a little more drops it to one year then a little more might give you a month or whatever... and your ACTUAL VOLTAGE might be much higher than the reported voltage as well so be really careful... so again, you aren't just risking damaging your memory but also the CPU... and you've taken things pretty far anyway... why do you want to push further? It's unlikely you'd see any real-world performance gains so do you have some ARBITRARY benchmark result you're aiming for?
For my ryzen 3700x build i got myself two 16GB kits of Rev. E for ~$140 or ~130€, they run 3600 CL18 which is almost fast enough I will probably try and get them lower although I suspect that my motherboard keeps resetting my ram voltage back down to 1.35V, which made it unstable at CL16
Considering Samsung ect are manufacturing, binning and selling to JEDEC specs what incentive would they have to increase the granularity of their binning process? It seems like they could probably make a few extra cents per unit when selling to stick mfgs because it is closer to their target - at the risk of having to sell some of those intermediately binned chips at their nominal JEDEC bin cost / rating anyway because a huge order for something that is not PC RAM and specced to JEDEC standards came in.
Hello Buildzoid, i have an intel 6700k on a Gigabyte Z170x Gaming G1 motherboard. I recenlty upgraded my RAM from an old (PV416G266C5QK)-4x4gb patriot viper 2666 cl 15 kit to 2 kits of (F4-3600c18d-32gtzn) 2x8gb Gskill Trident Z Neo 3600mhz with a cas latency of 18-22-22-42 totaling 32gb. My choice is either that 3600mhz cl18 kit or 3200mhz cl16. I just went with the 3600mhz just because they cost the same. My questions are: 1. are these Gskills CJR? if it is, what possible overclocks can i get from them beyond xmp? 2. They are 1.35 volts. Is it safe to run on my motherboard? How high dram voltage can i run on my z170 board? 3. will i get noticeable increase in performance by going beyond the xmp of this kits? 4. will the 6700k benefit from frequencies past 3600 (if it can even run those)? Thank you buildzoid.
2x8GB cl14 B-die from G.skill is currently at around $125 per kit (at newegg)... I believe G.skill's prices have dropped significantly. I just bought 2x16Gb 3200cl14 for $260 with RGB (and a kit with no RGB was ~$230). Patriot is actually more expensive now, $170 for 4400 cl19@1.45V, which on paper has a higher latency than 3200cl14@1.35V. www.newegg.com/g-skill-16gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232530
Jayden 97 We’re talking about memory overclock here, you could run the 3200cl14 kit at higher frequencies and voltages, it’s b-die. It’s binned at a latency of 8,75ns @ 1,35V, while the 4400cl19 kit is binned a latency of 8,63V @ 1.45V. If you need the XMP profile the 4400 is obviously better, but only if you have Intel, for Ryzen the optimal frequency is 3600-3800, so you can run FCLK=UCLK and not have the latency penalty.
Yo buildzoid bro. How did you remove the heatsink on some annoying DDR4 module like trident z? Did you used LN2 like the last video of Steve and Beard Overclocking Metal viking? Or brute force + heat? Rumbling video about it would be great!
Buildzoid: "Overclocking behaviour is entirely depending on those memory chips ..."
Ryzen 1st gen memory controller: ... exactly
"See this memory? It's TERRIBLE! ... Wanna buy?"
It does work... not fast... but it does... mostly
will he sign it with the gold marker? lol
I don't understand what he says but I watch to feel smarter
Confused uonga bounga
I feel attacked
@@kristapsjj8520 Video makes me feel like going to my Safe Space.
Voltz pluz timingz make brrrrrrrrrrrrr
Thank you for finally going over these simple but important details! This kind of content keeps me coming back to this channel.
An hour of staring at 11 RAMs, entertaining!
lol
It doesn't help that he keeps saying "and THESE can do blabla, but THESE can't", so you have to actually look at the video.
He really RAMS it down in this one
Listening to Buildzoid for an hour on the other hand is very boring right :D
But he is Right... :D
I've learned so damn much from your channel
Buildzoid - the only RUclipsr I know who corrects his own corrections, and leaves them in the video.
God bless ya Buildzoid!!!!! Thanks to you i learn sooo much about new and old hardware!!! :X!!! Keep up the good work!!!
I'm impressed and jealous of how fluent he is with all sorts of secondary timings
I have no problem buying Klevv here in Melbourne Australia. I'm only running an R5-3600 CPU, on a TUF X570 wireless board. My RAM is Klevv c16-3200, I have 4x16GB (64GB) sticks which I am running at c16-3600 at 1.35v stable. All I've done is change the frequency, all XMP timings are untouched otherwise, including voltage.
I've found this to be a nice stable balance, although I've managed to run them at 14-14-14-42-3800, with IF at 1900, with a few other timing tweaks, with 1.5v , but I'm not comfortable pushing it that hard, and it can be a little flakey at those settings.
I sold some Samsung B-Die (4x8 Hyper-X c19-4000) which could only do c14-16-16-46-3600 at the same settings I'm using for the Klevv sticks, on the same board. Being Zen2 it certainly wouldn't run 4000 regardless of settings, even pushing as much as 1.8v into it. I couldn't do better than 1850 IF with those sticks either. I could run the B-Die at 3733 at best, but a bit flakey.
My Klevv RAM is CJR Hynix. I'll be buying a 5900X when the dust settles, and I'm hoping to get a little more from my RAM. What is your opinion of CJR Hynix and do you think it likely that I'll be able to push it a bit harder with my current mid range board and incoming Zen3?
1 hour later and my head is smoking but im glad that i somehow managed to pick 3200 cl16 micron Rev.e 8gb modules on a b1 board out of this confusing mess without really knowing what i was doing. Cost-effective and fast enough for me. Crucial Ballistix Sport LT v2 16gb Dual-Rank modules ending with "AESB" if anyone cares.
That's honestly some of the best bang for buck RAM right now. I've got 32gb in a 4x8gb config. You overclock it at all?
@@killswitchscar1060 Not yet since im running GPU limited in pretty much all games and for other stuff the system is fast enough.
Gonna look into it though if i switch to a 3rd or 4th gen Processor or get a new GPU.
My 2x16 3000c15 dual rank ballistix runs @3800-16-19-16-16 on my ASRock b350 itx board. Haven't tried higher than 3800Mhz because the fclk on my ryzen 3700x max out @1900mhz.
4 years later, i have 4x8GB 3200CL16 Single Rank Ballistix Sport running at 3600-16-18-13-13
Quality Video. I swear, AHOC is the only channel on youtube where you can find legitimate detailed info about RAM overclocking. Everyone else is just drooling on their keyboards like a degenerate, telling you to turn on XMP.
Rest in peace a0.
Thanks buildzoid your videos about the "basics" are always full of good information.
Thank you for bringing my noob self up to par with what is going on.🙏🏼
I don't know what it is, but your style of teaching is perfect for me
B, E, D, (G), (T), (Z)
lets use all the letters that kinda sound the same!
which order do they go from worst to best? i dont think i've heard buildzoid explain that yet
@@musek5048 I can only reliably vouch for Micron here (own experience + experience being Tomoya from Clannad towards others with their issues on Discord)
best to worst
E >>> D probably > B >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
dunno bout Spectek, most likely lower grade bins of respective Microns (can be traced by the 5-unit code in SPD)
lol, all that's missing is a "C-die!"
It's because of your recommendation that I ended up replacing my unstable 3200 CL16 Corsair Dominator with the Patriot 4400 CL19. I have it doing 4266 16-16-16-37 with 1.5v and my memory instability issues are gone, so I'd like to thank you!
What CPU are you using? Are you overclocked?
I have 2x8 TForce Vulcan Z 3000 (with xmp profile, but stock is 2400).
Because of running apps and games I find I might need more memory, looking to get 2x16. Anyway, I was told by the PC manufacturer (as I have a prebuilt) that my Ryzen 7 3700x, B450M/ac mobo, only supports RAM at 3200MHz at the fastest. I heard on a forum that it's possible to go faster with RAM but then you'd have to start playing with FCLK and I'm still to new to this to be messing with that so it looks like I'm stuck with 3200 RAM for now, not that I'm complaining.
High quality DDR4 is so important!. For the first time in my life, I spent $439.99 dollars on my 32GB memory kit. I got sick of black screens with even the tiniest of memory adjustments in the bios on my old memory set.
I purchased G.Skill Royal Z 4x8GB DDR4 4000Mhz CL15 with 1.5 volts XMP profile. They are phenomenal! And well worth $440 bucks. With taxes and 1 day shipping they were almost $500 dollars. These are high quality binned Samsung B-Die using the A2 PCB design.
I run a delidded 7980XE at 4.8Ghz on a X299 Dark motherboard. So I wanted the best matching 4,000Mhz quad channel set I could find with the lowest possible timmings. And CL15 4,000Mhz was the absolute best I could find.
I have optimized the timmings and secondary timmings quite a bit, and I can even run 14-14-14-32-1T-290 at 4,000Mhz with 1.6V. Very very very fast! Very low latency! It is stable in my day to day usage, and very fun for benchmarking and gaming. I have managed to get 15-15-15-340-1T/ 4,000Mhz 100% memtest stress stable which is more realistic for daily usage, better get a fan pointed on them though! They can hit 55-60C, and lose stability. A matching quality memory set is the most important part of a build! And I will never cheap out on memory again! Thanks G.Skill for offering such a cool and well binned kit, but I certainly paid for it though! And thanks Buildzoid for providing such helpful information.
Don’t buy K SKU processors, and then cheap out on memory people! You are wasting your time. Latency and bandwidth is important.
I just got started on my better memory journey. Snapping up some last-one-in-stock discounted B-dies and pretty happy about it.
On a side note my kinda crappy CPU performance may have in fact been caused by crappy memory...
So..... how do you enable XMP profile ? :D
humanity may never know...
You need to pump 2.0V to your memory controller on AMD system, so that it's visible in the BIOS.
@@AlfaPro1337 Do you smell something? Smells burnt. lol
@@AlfaPro1337 I think you got that wrong, you mean 2.0V offset.
first you need to overclock your bios
I blame buildzoid for my hording of bdie sticks. Damn you buildzoid !
When you have a bdie collection more valuable than most people's "it ain't much but its mine" reddit builds 😂😂
I maybe can help you with that. Do you have any kits you want to dump?
I blame him and Luumi....8 b die 16gb kits, 3 32gb kits...and eyeing a few micron kits for fun.
... ... I may have just hoarded 2 last sticks from Microcenter today. I maaay be thinking about hoarding more in the future.
Freaking wonderful video, I get all the facts I want without hours and hours of reading and trying to find photos
The reason DRAM is referred to in bits rather than bytes is historical. The earliest 3 generations of DRAM were all in a bitwise configuration. EG the 4104 (4kx1) 4116 (16kx1) and 4164 (64kx1) all of those fitted in 16 pin DIP which would not have been possible for bytewise. It was only with 256kx1 that things changed and a 46464 was made(64kx4).By this time the chip could not fit in a 16 pin DIP anyway so going for a few more pins was not as much of an issue. Remember back then there was /RAS, /CAS, /RD, /Write, /Refresh and /CS. The /Rd and /Write pins got changed to a single Read/Write quite quickly for the 4164 and I think some variants had RAS/CAS to keep them in a 16 pin DIP instead of 18 but it's decades since I designed with them.
Midway into the vid and IMHO this could serve as a very neat TL;DR to your collective postings on YT and elsewhere :P
Great job 👍
If you want to use Zen 1 on a X470 Gaming Plus Max (daisy chain) and somewhat high memory clock with using all 4 DIMM slots, please use "Bankgroupswap enabled" and "Bankgroupswap_alt disabled". This changes "blackscreen and no boot" to "working without errors" on my system for some reason.
I have got 4 Samsung M378A1K43CB2-CTD C-Dies. 2 sticks are from week 35 / year 19, the other 2 from 23/18. They come with DDR4-2666 Cl-19 out of the box and all can do DDR4-2800 with 14-16-16-34-52 and 1.29V (geardown and bankgroupswap enabled). Any higher clockrates are not possible, no matter the timings or voltage. I am possibly running to the limits of Zen 1 with 4 used DRAM slots or board signal quality limit.
... could be worse. :)
Thanks!
With 32 GB of Rev E and 16 GB of B-Die costing roughly the same, I went with Rev E. Maybe dual rank makes up for some of the difference in timings.
Twice the memory vs. better timings is a no brainer for 99% of use cases. Basically anything but enthusiast level overclocking.
Maybe I missed it but which PCB design is used on the Rev E Ballistix?
LebenundToddes Ballistix Elite is the BEST E-die crucial makes. Meaning it doesn’t matter
@@elhuron8819 well, yes and no. I'm not saturating 16gig in the foreseeable future, but games I play are CPU bound. Cs, wow, etc. All at 165Hz synced. Faster ram is useful every day.
@@myownsite 7 days to die, I use 16g no problem
Just to correct a (slight) inaccuracy - Micron did not "buy" Crucial. Crucial was a brand created by Micron (September, 1996) specifically to market their DRAM direct-to-consumer. It has always been owned by Micron.
I still have some old SDR sticks which are Crucial-branded with a "by Micron" logo in small lettering underneath.
Yes Buildzoid, were here cause we just play games :D Im here cause I respect your knowledge and love your honesty.
I'm a beginner memory overclocker and i havent left after 5 minutes eheh
Every minute of your videos is worth the time, i love to learn this kind of stuff.
(sorry for my bad english)
Klevv科赋, they are actually quite popular in China. You can easily find them in Taobao(淘宝) or JD(京东). I saw discussions about them in Chiphell every once in a while due to their relative low price and mild OC capability.
Klevv actually is a subsidiary of Hynix
Great video! Now if you could make a guide on how to OC Rev. E on B450 it'd be the best thing ever.
You are good at selling those socks at the end! I kinda want to get some now
Also, great video overall, kept watching while building a PC. Will come back to this vid when I am choosing a new memory kit. Thank you!
I buy all my Samsung B-die from Team Group. They are the only ones that set the XMP on their 3200MHz to 14-14-14-31 as all other companies set it to 14-14-14-34.
I call them hard drives to piss you off
2:33 - speaking of cruicial/micron, I wonder what can be done with 2x16GB of 3200 Micon Rev-B (but CL22 xD)
10:23 - oh boy Ive seen a few posts saying "Hynix A-Die" or even "CJR-Die"
Are there 16Gbit chips
One thing I say different than BZ, about the 3200c16 (or even lower) memories---------- Some are worthy to buy, but you only buy when you know how to take the risk.
Samsung B Die request binning since not all B-Die ICs are consistent, but Hynix CJR/Micron Rev E both are relatively consistent and mostly clocks pretty well.
Let's put some example here:
1. Crucial green PCB 8GB 2400 -- Some using "C9BJZ" and "D9VPP" ICs, which both is Micron Rev E, and those without binning, will most likely do 3600+ to even 4000+, with tCL16 and tRCD on 20+
2. Kingston ValueRAM 8G 2400/2666 --- Recent batch are mostly Nanya A Die, which most likely does 3200C16 or 3600c18. Buying cheap low end RAMs and get 3200 is not bad.
3. Kingston HyperX Fury/Predator (RGB/Non RGB) 8G*2 kit 3200, I see a good number of Hynix CJR combined with Nanya A Die and Hynix JJR, if you luckily getting the CJR you can push 3600c16/3733c16/ 3800c16/4000c17, if you unlucky and got JJR or Nanya, 3600c18.
4. Good number of Kelvv memory (child company of Hynix) are using CJR, which OC pretty well.
5. Corsair Vengeance 8G*2 or 16G *2 3200 speed bin, with Version 4.31 (Samsung B-Die), or Version 5.32(Hynix CJR) both likely clock pretty well.
6. All the recent batch of Thermaltake Ram I've touched (8G*2 3000/3200) are all CJRs.
DO NOT BUY G.SKILL and try your luck at OC, G.Skill's binning process will out smart you, but Kingston/Corsair/Crucial/ADATA/etc do have certain model to try your luck with.
3. HyperX Predator RGB owner here. Bought two 2x8GB 3200 CL16 kits. Both have JJR. Aside from tRFC being worse JJR appears similar to CJR. Total cost about 200€ for 4x8GB.
And yes i can confirm it does 3733 16-20-20-36.
Raivo K Kingston is a bit weird there, some of the JJR was labelled as CJR, some CJR was labelled JJR....... some other was labelled correctly, I had a Kingston HyperX Fury 16g*2 was labelled as CJR, thaiphoon read as CJR, beheave exactly like JJR, does 3600c18 only.....
@@OMGJL Well then i might have mislabeled CJR because mine does 3733 CL16 despite thaiphoon showing all sticks as JJR. Still the tRFC does not match what the Ryzen DRAM Calculator gives me. The calculator does no have a JJR profile yet and the CJR profile does not match exactly.
@@Raivo_K DRAM Calculator is only a "estimate", it's never going to be identical..... I found the DRAM calculator setting are quite optimistic, and often I need to bump up some latency by a tick or two....
Also regarding the "miss-label", I personally think it's Hynix that does it not Kingston, as Kelvv have sticks labelled as CJR and only does JJR performance too from time to time...
Patriot can do that because they use dram chips in ssds. I assume they bin a few from each batch and take the most promising batches to the memory division for further binning.
I started this video in my BR, left the house to go have a colonoscopy, came back and it was just wrapping up. Thank you for the long-form videos. Apologize to NOBODY for it.
I can relate to the statement of 3200mhz cl16 kits using everything under the sun. I bought a ripjaws V 2x8 cl16 kit proceed to get some variation of micron memory and one stick flatlines on its stock xmp profile(actually it needed 1.5v to reach that which looking back after a year YIKES)... which is great, microcenter was nice about after the one month it committed sudoku they give me an exchange ripjaws V kit, I proceed to get 8gb bdie in it and it has had no issues rn at 3600 mhz cl14/5, I would go further but a 2600x imc can only do so much. Recently I had a post error which I couldn't figure out what the issue was so I cleared cmos because nothing was fixing it, my bet is this 2600x has the silicon equivalent of having a screw loose and its just making an issue for no reason
Running G-Skill 3800 CL16 @ 1.38 volts. 4 sticks, 32 GB. F4-3600C16D-16GTZNC on a 3950X. Was stable on my 3800X as well. Aorus Master X570 board. Hynix DJR chips on the memory sticks.
I got the same kit but I am running r7 2700x with x570 ASUS TUF at 3200mhz c14
I have the same 4 sticks 32GB on X570 Aorus Master but using Hynix JJR. It's HyperX Predator RGB tho. 3733 16-20-20-36
@@Raivo_K Same sticks but not at all..ok. I'm running 3800 CL 16-19-19-19 @ 1.38v
They use Gbit, because a 8Gbit chip equals a 8GB single rank module or a 16GB dual rank module.
Eg a ECC 8GB single rank module uses 9x512MB chips, but the chips are 8Gbit, so 8GB module for single rank in this case.
Like always with units, you try to use the unit that makes use for the intended application as simple as possible.
Its just more intuative.
Thanks for sharing knowledge that's worth learning.
I have a Crucial 3200 CL16 and according to Thaiphoon it is a Micron 8Gb D-die, never heard of it before.
7:06 i think the reason we still use BIT VS BYTE is because of the old school "core" memory...
like.... where they had iron "donuts" with wires running threw them
.
each donut was literally one bit...... and your total memory size was how many donuts you had
.
sure.... today everything works off the byte.... but back then, each bit was important
"there are definitely chips out there that won't do 3200 CL16"
Oh hey, Rev. B downbin in my PC, Buildzoid is talking about you!
Don't worry, I still love you. You at least do 3000 CL14, and your tRFC is surprisingly good too.
I have a supplier for KLEVV memory sticks(Im from Malaysia) out of stock now for obvious reasons but their basic stuffs are not that bad, the KLEVV value line of 2666 cl19 can do 3200 cl16(or better) and so far no problems.
Hi Buildzoid I think you made a mistake, the A2 PCB version of the Team Extreem only has a 8 layer PCB if you look closely and it is the same one as the Antec S3 bdie kit you have which has a 8 layer PCB.
I managed to have my Team Extreem 8 pack edition with A2 PCB RMAed in the past and got a 10 layer A0 version in return after I made a complaint to Teamgroup about this though Teamgroup never admitted about that. Interestingly I noticed their marketing material no longer has 10 layer PCB in the Team Extreem marketing material shortly I got my kit from RMA.
For A0 PCB’s, Patriot still has B-Die on A0. They come in 4000 CL19 or 3866 CL18(rarely). G-Skill’s non RGB 3600 CL16 CJR are A0 too.
I just purchased the Patriot Viper 4000 CL19 and can confirm A0 PCB. Sucks, thinking of sending them back. I knew I should have bought the 4400 set.
I bought some Corsair Vengeance Pro DDR4-3200 C16 and got CJR. It would be cool if you could do a video on it, just to show how it overclocks, and then you could show why it should be avoided.
Very interesting actually, thank you!
I want the gigabyte x570 elite boards, but whats putting me off are the cold boot issues people are having? Anyone have these issues?
great video,
I wish I had watched it before buying my 3200 CL16 kit 😂
Sub'd. This is fascinating stuff. Well done.
It's been two years since Samsung chips has been used on any Crucial parts. It's all Micron now.
my question is....
why is the "slot interface" shaped like a very shallow U??
.
like... why are the edges the shortest.... and the middle the tallest??
.
is it just to help with alignment / insertion into the different designs of RAM sockets?
or is it because the middle part is power or data.... and it helps to have more surface area to contact with?
.
like.... im sure its a JDEC or ISO standard shape.... because EVERY stick is like that
but why?
Wondering what the fastest ecc memory you can get your hands on is. Running hynix afr right now, 3333 cl15 @ 1.36
Same. Did you figure it out? Specifically 32GB per module fastest ECC :)
In South Korea, samsung sells C-die oem sticks at very cheap price. (compared to other manufacturers binned kits) So we tend to use a lot of those. And it is okay, especially for zen2 systems. Most c-die oem sticks usually go up to 3600 CL18 and often up to 3733~3800 CL16~18. Which is a good spot for a zen2 system.
7:33 what about "waybackmachine" similar? They might have logged every change on the websites where you usually look that up
What about Patriot Viper kits? Anything below their 4000mhz kits isn't b-die, but their 4000 and 4400mhz kits are b-die, not sure if there are others. In my recent build I bought their 4000 cl19 kit because it was the cheapest option for the given specs.
I want to run 1:1 with the IF. I'm currently running 1800mhz IF with 3600mhz 16-18-18-16-38-60 1T with a few other sub-timings added in that I estimated based on the DOCP profile numbers.
I haven't done any further testing to try to optimize things. Anyone have any tips/suggestions? I tried running the dram calculator thing and it was way too confusing.
What are the best timings I should expect to run at 3600mhz if I feed it 1.4 or 1.45v (if that's safe 24/7... I think it is...), and in case I can run 1933mhz IF what are the best 3866mhz timings I should expect to run? And can someone help me fill in some other subtimings?
This is with a ryzen 3800x and an Asus x570 TUF pro wifi, with the latest bios from Asus which I haven't had any problems with at the above settings. CPU is currently stock... if anyone wants to help me OC/optimize my CPU as well it would be much appreciated. Cooling is a noctua u12s, in a p400a with 4 fans, so very good airflow. And again, it's a 2x8 patriot viper ddr4000 cl19 kit, and a sapphire nitro+ 5700xt, with a silicon power 1tb ssd, the phison e12 TLC kind, 3400/3000mb/s.
Comments and suggestions highly welcome and if anyone is willing to chat in discord let me know and we'll make that happen. My CPU voltage is hitting higher numbers than it needs to I believe, and if I can get 4400-4500 or higher all-core I would prefer to do that. But I'm not sure how AMD setups work (I came from a 2500k)... can I run an all-core OC where it will still automatically drop the clocks at desktop/idle situations and then boost to the all-core OC undner load? That would be ideal. I don't necessarily want to run an all core OC for browsing the web.... unless that's normal and it can drop the voltage and be safe 24/7 and not pull too much power.
And from here I start my DDR4 in-depth journey to OC my memory on my ZE X399 quad channel 😅
So my memory sticks are trash. Wish I knew half this stuff when I bought them.
Corsair LPX 3000-CL16....A0 DDR4-2133P Hynix CJR
No wonder they wont clock over 3066.
oh boy i wish the same , bought a kit of corsair lpx 3000 16x2 it was god awful.
yeah, I have same kit, they have overclocked it already, no more room, that sucks
Corsair LPX owner as well. Yes, they're not fast, but you primarly buy them for the low profile (guess that's what LPX stands for) and price, not out of specs performance.
@@linhgt Same with the 3200 2x16GB kits. Can't get higher.
3000 c15 here, hynix mfr. Doesn't do 3133 but does 3000 c13. Just gotta play around with the timings
Have you tried using the Wayback Machine for looking up old Samsung chips?
Lets get ready to rambleeeeeeee!!!!!!
i think i need more memory then i came with just trying to remember almost most of your videos
I'm currently trying to decide if a team group 4400 kit upgrade from my 2933kit that won't push any further would help my 2700x get some better cpu scores in time spy.
so how do i get 3600mhz with cl 16..when i could only buy OEM parts
well i cannot over clock my CPU (i3 8100) so i tried overclocking my RAM and with a bit of success but i got thinking, while i did overclock it, i know not enough about it in the RAM department... can RAM be too fast for a CPU?
like by example to dumb it down, if all RAM in the world had the same timings, and only MHz mattered, if i had a 3.6 GHz Processor (4 core) and 4 sticks of RAM (does not matter the size) and the RAM was 4 GHz, is the RAM uselessly too fast for the Processor? like is there a point where the processor can't use the RAM speed?
i do not think i reached that point tho.i did a BCLK overclock of 2.5 MHz making my i3 8100 is at 3.69 GHz and i only have 2400 MHz DDR4 CL15 but i put it is on 2533 and the BCLK makes it 2596 MHz with a timing of 14,15,15,34,384 instead of 15,15,15,35,420. (400 something... would need to go in BIOS to remember... maybe 440...)
the only test i could do was using the boot menu (i dual boot with Windows 7 and Linux) and load memtest86 and press F2 for all core usage, the test 1 to 5 went about 30 seconds faster and stable. but i have no actual tool to test if it is worth it or if i am just beating up my RAM for unusable performance due to lack of Processor speed!
i guess in short: is there a ratio of processor to RAM in a general rule of thumb for speed and is there a free tool to test the performance on Windows 7 or Linux that i can at least weight my gains if any! (well there is a gain but memtest86 really just test stability and who knows what the BCLK does to it's "perceived" speed and time...)
Ram advertises the double data rate, it's actual clock speed is half of what it says. Often a CPU memory controller runs at a lower speed that the CPU though.
But essentially no a 4ghz ram stick is actually running at 2ghz and the CPU is still running faster. Not only that, you can't access ram every clock cycle. Your timing numbers are how many cycles it takes to do a given operation.
On Ryzen you want your true ram clock speed to match your memory controller speed FCLK, which is capable of at least 1800mhz and up to 2000mhz, then tighten the timings from there. For Bulldozer I'm not sure.
I went from B-Die to CJR because I pulled 32gb of RAM from a "non-working" eBay PC and sold my old 16gb kit. Dont regret it, it does 3466 16-18-18-36 @1.45V, so it's not that awful.
I guess i got lucky then. I gambled on Patriot Viper Steel 32gb 3200 16-18-18-36 CJR, found it can run 3666mhz 1.35v 16-18-18-20-38 and 3733mhz 1.4v 16-20-20-38-58-496 with MSI daisy chain b450.
They're referred to in bits because they come in varying data bus widths and it'd be a bit confusing to call a 4×2G chip "1 GByte"; the "8 GBit" name is agnostic to the actual data bus width. DIMMs generally use 8/9 chips with 8 bit data bus width so they *could* be named in GByte, but SODIMMs and embedded area chips also use 4b, 16b and 32b widths. There's only a handful of DIMM vendors designing their DIMMs but a zillion of embedded systems engineers designing some wireless router that needs a RAM chip, so it's to avoid pitfalls for the latter.
This video would have been 1000 times better if there was a script before recording was started.
I don't know much about memory. I forgot.
Add capacitor on ram?
Even if it's not cost-effective because other components could use the budget, I'm always obsessed with getting top-binned b-die somehow.
My 16GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600MHz (CL18) kit is Samsung B-die, and does 3800MHz @ 16-15-15-40 1T 1.39v. Latency: 63.9ns / Read: 56,000+. Doesn't get any better for my Ryzen 3700X!
What are the components just over the gold pads. What are they called? What do they do? I bought 2 stick where there is 2 of them ripped of.
@ which voltage are you running the patriots for ~4200ish cl 12? Is that stable or just barely posting?
I had purchased one of those Patriot Viper 4400Mhz C19, and it ended overclocking a lot less than my 8Pack 3600Mhz C16 kit.
From my experience, the only chip from Samsung OEM that is consistent is E-die 22nm on 4gb single rank server style pcbs. I've binned about 20 sticks in pairs, from different purchases and I think only one of them was not able to do 3866 without errors. Typically they do it at c19, but can go lower. It's not bad considering how cheap it is and works good for budget ryzen zen1/+ 3466/3533c16 . Small sample, but worth a shot if anyone is looking into playing with memory, it's a fun IC.
I have a new Corsair RAM that came out a couple of weeks ago (Vengeance RT) that can handle 4600 MHz Cl18 and 3200 cl 22 @ 1.2V. I thought that it was Samsung b-die but after watching this video I think it’s probably this new Samsung d-die. I managed to get 3800 cl15 stable.
You can now the die by looking at the version number of the stick. ver 4.33 I samsung 8-bit d-die, ver 4.31 is samsung 8-bit b-die
If you do check it out, please could you reply to this with the version number?
So, is there a good way to determine how good a memory is without overclocking?
In EU we have 14 day return no questions asked for online purchases,
Recently I found I can order to a local store and 0 post fees. I can also return to the local store during 14 days.
I am planning on getting a big load of ram next time, test it out and return them.
No wonder I was having such a hard time with this 16G Corsair 3200 cl16 (b die) kit. Only got it to boot into 3600 at cl19 once so far...
Have a Gskill 16G 3600 cl19 (djr) kit booting at 3800Mhz 16-16-20-34 1.4v, best Aida64 latency 63.3 ns.
They are referred in bits bc there are memories that are not arranged in bytes, the bus has an arbitrary data size, it's easier for the datasheet, specially since most memories have a parallel data bus.
8GB of memory may well be 8 chips with 8Gb x 1 bit bus :P
I have the G.Skill Flare X 32GB 3200 CL14-14-14-34 (F4-3200C14D-32GFX) which seem to be B0 binned... those are REALLY bad for oc, right?
So, I bought the Corsair Dominator 3200 CL16 kit (4x8GB) before I knew much about DDR4 memory. I don't have any problems with it, it's running stably with the XMP spec. The timing is 16-18-18-36 which I gather is considered a bit loose. According to this video, this memory could have crappy memory chips on the PCB.
If I'm not overclocking then is there anything I should be worried about?
Also, I have a Z390 board which is dual channel but I have 4 x 8GB sticks. Should I consider upgrading to 2 x 16Gb sticks of 3600 CL16?
i read something about DDR5 as they implemented on-chip ECC, so means they can churn out plenty of DDR5 chips for both servers and consumers in 1 go ? cheaper perhaps?
My hope is that someday (DDR5 or DDR6) they also just make SO-DIMM the standard format for all workloads.
that day will come when they stacking HBM on top of the APU as system+graphics unified memory architecture
How about that G.Skill DDR4-2400 14.14.14.34 F4-2400C14Q-64GVK kit.... thoughts? Bought it 3 years ago.
I've got the Patriot Viper 4400MHz CL19 kit. What are good settings paired with my 10700K you think for timings and voltage etc.?
ngl i went to grab some ddr4 i had laying around. a 2x4 kit from 2017, a 2x8 kit from 2018 and a 1x16 stick from 2021. not only did i manage to somehow lose onef of the 4 gig sticks, none of them have Samsung memory. only micron, team elite and sk hynux.
Loving the videos, really makes me want to see how far I can push my memory. Even if it means "blowing" the sticks up. But I'm running into a wall I hope someone can help me with.
I have a couple of sticks of 8Gb B-die, rated at 3200 CL14. I had problems getting as far as I wanted because anything over 1.45v would crash because of the temp going past 50C. Added aftermarket cooling and now the sticks never goes above 35C which has allowed me to push it quite a bit further, but I'm now running into a wall when trying to push the voltage past 1.6. Even at XMP speeds it's unstable at 1.65v. I've tried lowering the VTTDDR, but that didn't seem to help. Any suggestions? Are there any other settings that might allow me to push the voltage any further? Or is it the memory controller, motherboard or something else that is struggling? Other specs are Ryzen 3700x on an Asus Crosshair VII Hero.
Btw, my current best result is 3800 14-16-16-14-28-288-1T. I wanna keep it at 3800 since I'm running the memory controller and IF at 1:1:1 and I can't seem to push my IF any further.
STOP!!
Raising the voltage to the memory also raises the voltage to the memory controller in the CPU. You can and WILL kill your CPU if you go above certain voltages like 1.45V (can't remember the recommended values right now).. it's not linear either as you might get three years at a certain voltage and a little more drops it to one year then a little more might give you a month or whatever... and your ACTUAL VOLTAGE might be much higher than the reported voltage as well so be really careful... so again, you aren't just risking damaging your memory but also the CPU... and you've taken things pretty far anyway... why do you want to push further? It's unlikely you'd see any real-world performance gains so do you have some ARBITRARY benchmark result you're aiming for?
For my ryzen 3700x build i got myself two 16GB kits of Rev. E for ~$140 or ~130€, they run 3600 CL18 which is almost fast enough I will probably try and get them lower although I suspect that my motherboard keeps resetting my ram voltage back down to 1.35V, which made it unstable at CL16
Considering Samsung ect are manufacturing, binning and selling to JEDEC specs what incentive would they have to increase the granularity of their binning process? It seems like they could probably make a few extra cents per unit when selling to stick mfgs because it is closer to their target - at the risk of having to sell some of those intermediately binned chips at their nominal JEDEC bin cost / rating anyway because a huge order for something that is not PC RAM and specced to JEDEC standards came in.
I run b-die 3733 cl16 at 1.35v, 3600x ryzen b450. Do you think it's worth trying tighter cl with 1.45v on a daily basis?
holy shit, i knew jack shit about RAM. this video is amazing.
So i have Corsair Ven Rgb Pro 3600mhz ram, that has micron 8gb E-die (MT40A1G8SA-075E:E) im OC to 3800mhz atm, do you think it could reach 4ghz or 5?
Hello Buildzoid, i have an intel 6700k on a Gigabyte Z170x Gaming G1 motherboard. I recenlty upgraded my RAM from an old (PV416G266C5QK)-4x4gb patriot viper 2666 cl 15 kit to 2 kits of (F4-3600c18d-32gtzn) 2x8gb Gskill Trident Z Neo 3600mhz with a cas latency of 18-22-22-42 totaling 32gb. My choice is either that 3600mhz cl18 kit or 3200mhz cl16. I just went with the 3600mhz just because they cost the same.
My questions are:
1. are these Gskills CJR? if it is, what possible overclocks can i get from them beyond xmp?
2. They are 1.35 volts. Is it safe to run on my motherboard? How high dram voltage can i run on my z170 board?
3. will i get noticeable increase in performance by going beyond the xmp of this kits?
4. will the 6700k benefit from frequencies past 3600 (if it can even run those)?
Thank you buildzoid.
Klevv is quite common in asia and are priced quite competitively.
They are literally everywhere where i am residing currently.
Oh good... I purchased TeamGroup Xtreem memory and was worried about the IC quality. Happy to see they are binned nicely.
The XTREEMs are good, you get great RAM for dirt cheap. For example their 4133 19-19-19 kit for like $120 is a fucking steal.
2x8GB cl14 B-die from G.skill is currently at around $125 per kit (at newegg)... I believe G.skill's prices have dropped significantly. I just bought 2x16Gb 3200cl14 for $260 with RGB (and a kit with no RGB was ~$230). Patriot is actually more expensive now, $170 for 4400 cl19@1.45V, which on paper has a higher latency than 3200cl14@1.35V.
www.newegg.com/g-skill-16gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232530
Jayden 97 We’re talking about memory overclock here, you could run the 3200cl14 kit at higher frequencies and voltages, it’s b-die. It’s binned at a latency of 8,75ns @ 1,35V, while the 4400cl19 kit is binned a latency of 8,63V @ 1.45V.
If you need the XMP profile the 4400 is obviously better, but only if you have Intel, for Ryzen the optimal frequency is 3600-3800, so you can run FCLK=UCLK and not have the latency penalty.
Yo buildzoid bro. How did you remove the heatsink on some annoying DDR4 module like trident z? Did you used LN2 like the last video of Steve and Beard Overclocking Metal viking?
Or brute force + heat?
Rumbling video about it would be great!
I've use LN2 for some dimms and isopropyl and heat for others.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking thank you! They look very clean! Great job! It's harder than it seems!