In 13 games each, Caicedo vs Gravenberch: goals 1-0, assists 2-1, chances created 12-8, long passes completed 28-17, through balls 5-4, tackles made 43-26, duels won 82-75, clearances 15-15, interceptions 21-24, blocked shots 5-3. What the Liverpool fan is not able to understand is that football is a team game. The league table does not completely indicate how good players have been individually.
Yeah, i don't see why anything else matters. Caicedo has been doing it for years. Why does it matter in this discussion that gravenberch is new to the position? To say he has a higher ceiling? We aren't talking about potential.
When Chelsea played Liverpool caicedo was way better than Gravenberch 😂😂 jones was liverpools best midfielder. Panel does not like Chelsea 💀 they would never admit it
@@samkelorashuza5949 If midfields that this season were surpassed on multiple occasions and even worse than against Liverpool, like Madrid vs Barcelona at the Bernabeu where Pedri and Casado simply surpassed the Real Madrid midfield with all their physicality on the field or Beliba against City
Caicedo is on a class of his own in his position. Master class passing along with tacking and interceptions. Plus can play anywhere you put him, he’s in his prime at only at 23 years young.
Caicedo has been doing this in this league for 4 years now. Gravenberch 6 game hype he was shite last year. Caicedo was Liverpools first choice for a reason. His engine and defense is on a different level, u put him in front of VVD and Konate and this wouldn’t even be a debate
Gravenberch has been good but he hasn't even been remotely close to Caicedo's level this season, let's be real. He came up against Caicedo and there's still missing person posters up around Liverpool for Gravenberch. Even Lavia bossed him a few weeks back, just so happened that Curtis Jones turned into prime Messi for his one game per season against Chelsea. Caicedo just played the inverted RB role on the weekend to cover for injuries and was incredible, against a Champions League side that beat Bayern earlier in the season.
@@jevonjohnson2052 well thats a blatant lie. Caicedo higher than Gravenberch p/90 on: - successful tackles - blocks - chances - big chances - poss won - key passes - duels won - goals - assists - accurate long balls - shot creating actions Don't be sorry, its life, people lie, no hard feelings.
@@scottyh1238 Where you getting these stats from DataMB literally has Gravenberch excelling in more stats. Guy includes 1 goal and 1 assist and shooting as a metric for a DM lmao. Chelsea defend more than Liverpool as well.
Remember CAICEDO is 23 this year and full year that CHELSEA actually meshed together with better coach now in third place. Not to mention CAICEDO at 18 was playing in his National ECUADORIAN team, competing for the world cup with the likes of MESSI, SUAREZ, D MARIA, NEYMAR, VIDAL etc. in South America and qualified for the world cup. This year his team is in third place qualifying again for world cup.
Caicedo is clear as day why is this even a debate 💀 Goals 1-0 Assists 2-1 Big chances created 3-2 Passes 719-780 passes forward 198-208 through balls 5-4 dispossessed 8-4 blocks 5-3 interceptions 21-24 tackles 43-26 succesful tackles 27-15 headed clearances 8-6 aerial battles won 13-11yellow cards 3-3 fouls 25-20
@@antoniodiamonte3424 Not saying there is anything wrong with him. But he he's not playing at Caicedo or Gravenberch levels. That guy just wanted to mention an Arsenal player for the sake of it.
@@keeptheblueflagflyinghigh Thats in your opinion. Partey has been doing the same thing caicedo is doing. Hes just better on the ball and smarter in his play. Maybe because of his age. But just cause u support chelsea and think hes better doesnt mean everyone things that. Imo partey is the best DM out of the 3 to begin with. But they are both lucky rice is not playing DM to begin with cause arteta is trolling. Or this video would be 1 minute lon.
@@antoniodiamonte3424 Lol Partey is the best CDM? Unfortunately a lot of my family and friends are gooners, and they don't think like you cos they have more than one brain cell.
Gravenberch didn't play well against Chelsea, Tom pls don't lie what kind of revisionism is this. He was shit when Chelsea came to Anfield and Caicedo played better than him
What a ridiculous comment firstly we won the game second has caicedo been a man of match contender pretty much every game? Grav pretty much has. A one of game means nothing consistency is everything
@@Aaron82-p6x see why you’re the ridiculous one, winning a game shouldn’t cloud someone’s poor individual performance especially when the segment was on individual performance 😂 and this is also how I know you don’t watch Chelsea cos if you do you’ll know Caicedo has been in every MOTM voting after every game, I’m sorry Gravenberch is overrated at this point it’s embarrassing
@@Aaron82-p6xhe didn’t play well was quite the whole game barely touched the ball we all watched the game in 4k stop crying and admit caicedo is levels above him 🤡
Why are you lying? In Duels, Defensive actions, Carrying, Forward passes, Forward pass percentage, Key passes and Progressive passes - Gravenberch is better in 5 areas compared to Caicedo at 2. Caicedo only beats Gravenberch in Key passes and Progressive passes. Caicedo doesn't dominate every category behave.
@@Kizzster In 13 games each, Caicedo vs Gravenberch: goals 1-0, assists 2-1, chances created 12-8, long passes completed 28-17, through balls 5-4, tackles made 43-26, duels won 82-75, clearances 15-15, interceptions 21-24, blocked shots 5-3.
@lwc2349 Caicedo let Jones walk all over him and got a goal and MOTM. Caicedo hasn't won vs the big 6 this season. Chelsea defend more than Liverpool. In player performance index Gravenberch is the best DM this season. You picking out stats like goals, assists, key passes and chances created is hilarious we aren't talking about 10's. Grav plays deeper to carry the ball and start transitions which is one of the key reasons Liverpool are top of the table. Grav is also the best performing CL midfielder this season. Based on every performance Grav is clear 👍
@@Kizzster Caicedo is a player not a team, he is not expected to beat another team all by himself, Gravenberch just happens to be a team with a better over all defense ,but on an individual basis Caicedo is the superior player.
I’m team Caicedo bc he is a monster but the stats I have looked at, they’re basically even thus far this season so a toss up in that regard. I will say I think Caicedo more of an MVP to Chelsea than Grav is for Liverpool. Slotted in at RB against Villa and Chelsea absolutely bossed Villa, don’t think Grav has the same versatility
Midfield is a position that makes you look great or shit depending on how good your team is. Gravenberg is slightly above average. When Liverpool decline he won't be anything special. Caicedo is special and even he struggled at times last season because of how shit his team were. Imagine how people used to be certain that Rice is better 😂
@@DrBased123 EXACTLY! Gravenberch looks good because he’s surrounded by a top-tier team that helps him shine and makes him look better. In a terrible team, he wouldn’t do much or would just be average. Caicedo has shown he can play incredibly well in both scenarios.
Ofc tom doesnt mention the fact he has vvd and konate behind him, most of the games we drop points have been down to defenders mistakes and the goalies and also madueke being in the team, if they were the centre back partnership for chelsea he'd use that as a reason as to why caicedo isnt as good as gravenberch because the defenders behind him are better, theres a reason liverpool were also willing to pay over 100 mil for him aswell
@@NanaNano-g1r Liverpool have dominant CB's but Gravenberch is still putting up high numbers, Chelsea defence is nothing special so it gives Caicedo more opportunity to make tackles. Gravenberch is a key figure in our clean sheets as he compliments VVD and Konate perfectly. Chelsea can't even beat a big 6 club lol
Tom should go back and watch the Liverpool v Chelsea premier league encounter which chelsea lost 2-1 at Anfield this season... yes chelsea might have lost marginally 1-2 but they had 57.5% of the possession in that game and that was partly because Caicedo and Lavia bossed the midfield (Gravenberch rarely saw the ball let alone use it in that match!). Liverpool converted their chances no doubt but chelsea from most parts controlled the game from the midfield. Needless to say Caicedo is a man apart from Gravenberch in defensive midfield role based on current form. Caicedo has a bit more in terms of dimension to his game - the tackles, interceptions, successful pass completions (short or long), and although he rarely scores but when he does Boy are his goals a thing of beauty! And did I add how Caicedo is also an adaptable utility player? He can play as an 8 in midfield and in the game recently as a right back against Southampton.
Caicedo SLAMMED Gravenberch when they played against each other. An 8-level game v a 6-level game. Gravenberch is not "droppable" because ANYONE could play that role in a team as well oiled, experienced, filled with players in their prime, as Liverpool. Hell, I could play there. ENDO, that mediocre has-been could play there (and be praised as a decent player, when we all know he's nobody in world football!) It doesn't mean Gravenberch is bad... he's decent enough (better than Endo, which is not saying much) and can improve, but Caicedo has proven to be far better, at least than him, as of yet. And I'm not speaking THIS season. It was last season when he proved his value, when he came into a shambles of a team, the youngest in the league with a lazy coach, him being among the youngest in the squad. By the second half of the season, every time he didn't play, Chelsea tied or lost. And finally, when Enzo was dropped, he played 3 roles in one and absolutely cooked. He bossed the team. Now, is he "the best" in his position in the league is still a non-sensical argument, because we're still in the first half of the season, because he's only 23, because Chelsea isn't in Champions League... there are many reasons why Caicedo still has a ways to go before he can truly claim that accolade... but I would take Caicedo over Gravenberch ANY DAY. Gravenberch would be very droppable at Chelsea. He'd be fighting the spot v. Lavia.
Even if he is the best, the gap between him and the others fighting for top 4 is not that big. Further, the real question which Midfield unit combo is the best and most effective for how they want to play. At the moment, Liverpool are slightly ahead on that front, but we will see by the end of the season if Chelsea and Arsenal or even City can make up the ground.
People like to conflate the performance of a team to that of all it's players. Gravenberch has been good, but just because his team is 9 points clear doesn't mean he's the best. That logic would say that their entire starting XI is the best at each of their positions, which clearly isn't true. Caicedo has been the best MF this year.
This debate is unrelated in every way, shape, or form. Let’s wait till the league ends then we talk! Last year all of you would have claimed Rodri to be the best, it was not his injury, still, the argument will hold! We can’t differentiate the 2 right now. Let’s wait until the end of the season! We have so much more games in order for us all to see a clear picture. The saddest point all of you are making is Cai was not good last year! Really! Sad!
Putting Caceido as an inverted right back has been a game changer. It enables Lavia and Enzo to play in midfield. Inverted right back might be Caceido's best position.
@@pablovicuna2133inverted don’t mean he’s not in midfield. He spend nearly 80% of the game still in midfield, just needs to cover fullback in transitions which he’s good at anyway
@@anthonyigbonaju7081he can't play like that every game if Aston Villa has tricky winger he won't play there gusto could have played but because Aston Villa always love to play through the middle that's why we could play the three mieldfield of caicedo,lavia and Enzo so we can have 5 in defense and 5 in attack
@ the whole point playing him as the inverted RB is to deal with tricky wingers. De Zerbi already did that against United and Arsenal when he was at Brighton and he locked up Martinelli and Rashford.
Can Gravenverch preform in this Chelsea team, bcuz if you put Caicedo in this Liverpool team you we see the difference, wen Liverpool face Chelsea Caicedo treach him how to pay in midfield ok
Comparing a guy who is playing in a conference league and a guy who is facing champion league elite midfields is not fair.. Liverpool are on top because of that guy
Don’t know what that Liverpool kid chocking on when the question was raised? I get it you believe Gravenberch has been the best but the reaction from you it’s as if the comparison was between gravenberch and Saul. They’ve both been amazing this season and it boils down to preference. Last season I had to sit here and listen to braindead takes by Liverpool fans having Caicedo/Endo comparisons cos of that donkey Poche constantly isolating him and hanging him to dry. Where is Endo now? And by the way way how was your boy gravy the other day against Newcastle? Absolutely stomped on
He did nothing against caicedo. Jones was Liverpool's best player in the game against Chelsea. GRAV was completely lost in the gane against Chelsea and not anywhere near Caicedo's performance on the game. The Chelsea game ended this debate because Caicedo dominated Grav in that game. It's not even a debate as far as that Liverpool vs Chelsea match is concern.
Jones was not Liverpool’s best player, Jones WAS THE BEST PLAYER ON THE PITCH. A performance in one game doesn’t matter because if that was the case then Jones has been better than Caicedo this season because of that one game
@@samkelorashuza5949 ... Perhaps you need to read through my comments against. I said Jones was Liverpool's best player in the game against Chelsea. I never said he was the best player in Liverpool football club.
@@olakunlepeter-eq1gr That’s my point he was the best player between Chelsea and Liverpool not only for Liverpool in that game. He was the man of the match not just “Liverpool’s” man of the match
Gravenberch has VVD and Konate behind him! Of course his defensive stats are going to be better! How can you measure a players statistics on things that the defence is also responsible for? Pointless debates!
The LFC fan is annoying when he here’s the truth. Caicedo is the best DM/ 6 in the league. The stats prove he’s better than gravenberch (who btw I think is class) more tackles, clearances, headed clearances, more duels won. Gravenberch has 3 more interceptions though but caicedo is even better going forward and being able to play as a RB.
As a Chelsea fan I would not swap him for ANY OTHER in the league and look at his AGE!! 😂😂KTBFFH Moisés was being Called a Flop only last season now you all are talking top3 Atleast? 🎉🎉 He will continue to prove you all WRONG
Gravenberch is the best midfielder in the league this season. Stop believing in lies. In Duels, Defensive actions, Carrying, Forward passes, Forward pass percentage, Key passes and Progressive passes - Gravenberch is better in 5 areas compared to Caicedo at 2. The only areas Caicedo has been better is Key passes and Progressive passes. Have some respect for Gravenberch he has been flawless in the Premier League and Champions League. Caicedo is great but is 2nd best to Gravenberch the stats prove that. Yet I'm seeing "no one is close to Caicedo" have some respect. Caicedo hasn't even won vs the big 6. DataMB literally proves that Gravenberch has been better.
Gravenbach is not even close to Caicedo. Caicedo is miles clear all round. Gravenbach is having purple patch in team doing very well in all areas that’s all. Caicedo is everywhere on the pitch, interceptions tackles progressive passes carrying the ball covering multiple positions and pitching in assists and goals now and then. Gravenbach has been really good but nowhere near Caicedo. Will know why before end of season
@@rockymaniaster It's hilarious that you didn't read my message at all. Gravenberch has more defensive actions and duels and better at ball carrying, Guy can't even spell Gravenberch get out of here man. Gravenberch has dropped masterclasses against 3 countries champions where as Caicedo is in the conference league and can't beat a big 6 club lol
@ lol 😂 Liverpool fans are worst in the world for a reason😂 Caicedo has done much better job defensively. Even his performances in Copa America and World Cup qualifiers have been excellent 👌 he even has been more productive going forward. He even gave master performance playing at RB against Villa. Defensive lineup behind him is nowhere close to Liverpool. Gravenberch is good but nowhere close to Caicedo. If he was in this Chelsea team, he would be a big flop😂 u matrices lack common sense. Bet u never watched Caicedo play at Chelsea or in Ecuador 🤦🏻♂️
@@rockymaniaster The worst fans are Arsenal fans. My claims are backed by stats. Gravenberch has been Netherlands best player in the recent nations league games, Also if you're talking about Copa America Mac Allister owns that competition as a midfielder. It seems Chelsea fans know f all about football. Can't even beat a big 6 club.
Honestly, I listen to other programs from other channels but for some weeks now, the topics/discussion on the terrace has been not so making sense, I loved the terrace but its not just it, the analysis and the analysts are just not objective in most cases. On a serious note.
Gravenberch best technicall midfielder period. His ability on ball is unmatched. Defensively Caicedo is best. On the ball and eye test no one touches Gravenberch 😂. Stats never beats eye test . Lmao 😂
He isnt the best, Rodri is clearly the best DM in the league but he is second and he will evolve into one of the best DMs in world football. The silly "sniggering" is infantile.
If you watch football you can't even bring an argument between those two Caisedo is just from another planet of DM's
It seems you don't watch football or CL at all and it's hilarious.
Honestly he is not great 😂 to small makes a lot of mistakes and fouls. Partey is better. Scores more makes more done it for longer.
@mpd7878 did you really just say partey😂😂😂
@@mpd7878Your just a CAICEDO hater mate 😅
And if it comes down to stats Caicedo is a million miles away. He has been unreal .
In 13 games each, Caicedo vs Gravenberch: goals 1-0, assists 2-1, chances created 12-8, long passes completed 28-17, through balls 5-4, tackles made 43-26, duels won 82-75, clearances 15-15, interceptions 21-24, blocked shots 5-3.
What the Liverpool fan is not able to understand is that football is a team game. The league table does not completely indicate how good players have been individually.
Yeah, i don't see why anything else matters. Caicedo has been doing it for years. Why does it matter in this discussion that gravenberch is new to the position? To say he has a higher ceiling? We aren't talking about potential.
He is, everyone is just jealous that it’s working
FACTO!
When Chelsea played Liverpool caicedo was way better than Gravenberch 😂😂 jones was liverpools best midfielder. Panel does not like Chelsea 💀 they would never admit it
So Jones has been the best midfielder then?
I dnt even know wat that blind Liverpool fans there watch to evn compare any Liverpool midfielder to caicedo.
@@sunnyernest7264 Liverpool fans who have watched him boss Man city and Madrids midfields like they are nothing are the ones who think that
@@samkelorashuza5949 If midfields that this season were surpassed on multiple occasions and even worse than against Liverpool, like Madrid vs Barcelona at the Bernabeu where Pedri and Casado simply surpassed the Real Madrid midfield with all their physicality on the field or Beliba against City
So what that's one game, the entire season Gravenberch has been a monster
Caicedo is on a class of his own in his position. Master class passing along with tacking and interceptions. Plus can play anywhere you put him, he’s in his prime at only at 23 years young.
Caicedo has been doing this in this league for 4 years now. Gravenberch 6 game hype he was shite last year. Caicedo was Liverpools first choice for a reason. His engine and defense is on a different level, u put him in front of VVD and Konate and this wouldn’t even be a debate
He by far this best, these guys crazy smh
caceido has been unreal this season .. playing multiple positions and still killing it
Gravenberch has been good but he hasn't even been remotely close to Caicedo's level this season, let's be real. He came up against Caicedo and there's still missing person posters up around Liverpool for Gravenberch. Even Lavia bossed him a few weeks back, just so happened that Curtis Jones turned into prime Messi for his one game per season against Chelsea.
Caicedo just played the inverted RB role on the weekend to cover for injuries and was incredible, against a Champions League side that beat Bayern earlier in the season.
Must be why Gravenberch takes 5 of 7 of the top metrics. Caicedo 2. Sorry not sorry.
@@jevonjohnson2052 well thats a blatant lie.
Caicedo higher than Gravenberch p/90 on:
- successful tackles
- blocks
- chances
- big chances
- poss won
- key passes
- duels won
- goals
- assists
- accurate long balls
- shot creating actions
Don't be sorry, its life, people lie, no hard feelings.
@@scottyh1238 Where you getting these stats from DataMB literally has Gravenberch excelling in more stats. Guy includes 1 goal and 1 assist and shooting as a metric for a DM lmao. Chelsea defend more than Liverpool as well.
😂😂😂 yeah, Caisedo and lavia really bossed that Liverpool midfield
@@NanaNano-g1r indeed they did.
Remember CAICEDO is 23 this year and full year that CHELSEA actually meshed together with better coach now in third place. Not to mention CAICEDO at 18 was playing in his National ECUADORIAN team, competing for the world cup with the likes of MESSI, SUAREZ, D MARIA, NEYMAR, VIDAL etc. in South America and qualified for the world cup. This year his team is in third place qualifying again for world cup.
Caicedo played as an inverted RB and a DM next to lavia against Aston villa.
bro says gravenberch did it against caicedo when caicedo out played him when chelsea played Liverpool. Check the stats.
Caicedo is clear as day why is this even a debate 💀 Goals 1-0 Assists 2-1 Big chances created 3-2 Passes 719-780 passes forward 198-208 through balls 5-4 dispossessed 8-4 blocks 5-3 interceptions 21-24 tackles 43-26 succesful tackles 27-15 headed clearances 8-6 aerial battles won 13-11yellow cards 3-3 fouls 25-20
Gravenberch was mediocre when against Chelsea. Slot admitted they lost the midfield battle lmao
Does 1 game matter?
@samkelorashuza5949 Ask the Liverpool fan that brought it up as a justification of Gravenberch being better 🤣🤦♂️
That guy mention Partey ? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Whats wrong with that? partey has been balling.
@@antoniodiamonte3424 Not saying there is anything wrong with him. But he he's not playing at Caicedo or Gravenberch levels. That guy just wanted to mention an Arsenal player for the sake of it.
@@keeptheblueflagflyinghighSo what’s wrong with that?
@@keeptheblueflagflyinghigh Thats in your opinion. Partey has been doing the same thing caicedo is doing. Hes just better on the ball and smarter in his play. Maybe because of his age. But just cause u support chelsea and think hes better doesnt mean everyone things that. Imo partey is the best DM out of the 3 to begin with. But they are both lucky rice is not playing DM to begin with cause arteta is trolling. Or this video would be 1 minute lon.
@@antoniodiamonte3424 Lol Partey is the best CDM? Unfortunately a lot of my family and friends are gooners, and they don't think like you cos they have more than one brain cell.
Look at it this way, if caicedo was at liverpool and gravenberch was at chelsea, liverpool would be much better and chelsea would be much worse.
Gravenberch didn't play well against Chelsea, Tom pls don't lie what kind of revisionism is this. He was shit when Chelsea came to Anfield and Caicedo played better than him
What a ridiculous comment firstly we won the game second has caicedo been a man of match contender pretty much every game? Grav pretty much has. A one of game means nothing consistency is everything
spot on, Caicedo and even Lavia bossed Gravenberch in that game.
@@Aaron82-p6x see why you’re the ridiculous one, winning a game shouldn’t cloud someone’s poor individual performance especially when the segment was on individual performance 😂 and this is also how I know you don’t watch Chelsea cos if you do you’ll know Caicedo has been in every MOTM voting after every game, I’m sorry Gravenberch is overrated at this point it’s embarrassing
@@Aaron82-p6xhe didn’t play well was quite the whole game barely touched the ball we all watched the game in 4k stop crying and admit caicedo is levels above him 🤡
@@scottyh1238 Bossed? 😂😂😂
Just look at the numbers, he dominates in almost every category.
Why are you lying? In Duels, Defensive actions, Carrying, Forward passes, Forward pass percentage, Key passes and Progressive passes - Gravenberch is better in 5 areas compared to Caicedo at 2. Caicedo only beats Gravenberch in Key passes and Progressive passes. Caicedo doesn't dominate every category behave.
@@Kizzster In 13 games each, Caicedo vs Gravenberch: goals 1-0, assists 2-1, chances created 12-8, long passes completed 28-17, through balls 5-4, tackles made 43-26, duels won 82-75, clearances 15-15, interceptions 21-24, blocked shots 5-3.
@lwc2349 Caicedo let Jones walk all over him and got a goal and MOTM. Caicedo hasn't won vs the big 6 this season. Chelsea defend more than Liverpool. In player performance index Gravenberch is the best DM this season. You picking out stats like goals, assists, key passes and chances created is hilarious we aren't talking about 10's. Grav plays deeper to carry the ball and start transitions which is one of the key reasons Liverpool are top of the table. Grav is also the best performing CL midfielder this season. Based on every performance Grav is clear 👍
@@lwc2349 enough said.
@@Kizzster Caicedo is a player not a team, he is not expected to beat another team all by himself, Gravenberch just happens to be a team with a better over all defense ,but on an individual basis Caicedo is the superior player.
Just compared the stats caicedo wins by a landslide 😂
I’m team Caicedo bc he is a monster but the stats I have looked at, they’re basically even thus far this season so a toss up in that regard. I will say I think Caicedo more of an MVP to Chelsea than Grav is for Liverpool. Slotted in at RB against Villa and Chelsea absolutely bossed Villa, don’t think Grav has the same versatility
Once Trent, Virgil, Salah leaves we’ll see if Gravenberch is the same.
Midfield is a position that makes you look great or shit depending on how good your team is. Gravenberg is slightly above average. When Liverpool decline he won't be anything special. Caicedo is special and even he struggled at times last season because of how shit his team were. Imagine how people used to be certain that Rice is better 😂
@@DrBased123 EXACTLY! Gravenberch looks good because he’s surrounded by a top-tier team that helps him shine and makes him look better. In a terrible team, he wouldn’t do much or would just be average. Caicedo has shown he can play incredibly well in both scenarios.
CAICEDO CLEARLY AND DEFINITELY IS THE BEST MIDFIELDER OF THE PREMIER LEAGUE SO FAR... TO SAY OTHERWISE IS TO BE BLIND AND FOOLISH!..
Ofc tom doesnt mention the fact he has vvd and konate behind him, most of the games we drop points have been down to defenders mistakes and the goalies and also madueke being in the team, if they were the centre back partnership for chelsea he'd use that as a reason as to why caicedo isnt as good as gravenberch because the defenders behind him are better, theres a reason liverpool were also willing to pay over 100 mil for him aswell
Your defenders being bad means Caicedo is stat padding tackles and constantly has to defend, Making him look better than what he is 😂
@@Kizzsterlast time I checked, defenders don’t play in the middle of the field and that’s where Caisedo gets his stats from.
@@KizzsterBadiasheil and Cowell add gravity or whatever u called him u will see the player u have😂
@@NanaNano-g1r Liverpool have dominant CB's but Gravenberch is still putting up high numbers, Chelsea defence is nothing special so it gives Caicedo more opportunity to make tackles. Gravenberch is a key figure in our clean sheets as he compliments VVD and Konate perfectly. Chelsea can't even beat a big 6 club lol
@@ighalogodstime6815 Baddieshitey and Colwill can't lace VVD or Konate's boots 😎
Tom should go back and watch the Liverpool v Chelsea premier league encounter which chelsea lost 2-1 at Anfield this season... yes chelsea might have lost marginally 1-2 but they had 57.5% of the possession in that game and that was partly because Caicedo and Lavia bossed the midfield (Gravenberch rarely saw the ball let alone use it in that match!). Liverpool converted their chances no doubt but chelsea from most parts controlled the game from the midfield. Needless to say Caicedo is a man apart from Gravenberch in defensive midfield role based on current form. Caicedo has a bit more in terms of dimension to his game - the tackles, interceptions, successful pass completions (short or long), and although he rarely scores but when he does Boy are his goals a thing of beauty! And did I add how Caicedo is also an adaptable utility player? He can play as an 8 in midfield and in the game recently as a right back against Southampton.
Finally given his flowers.
Caicedo SLAMMED Gravenberch when they played against each other. An 8-level game v a 6-level game. Gravenberch is not "droppable" because ANYONE could play that role in a team as well oiled, experienced, filled with players in their prime, as Liverpool. Hell, I could play there. ENDO, that mediocre has-been could play there (and be praised as a decent player, when we all know he's nobody in world football!) It doesn't mean Gravenberch is bad... he's decent enough (better than Endo, which is not saying much) and can improve, but Caicedo has proven to be far better, at least than him, as of yet. And I'm not speaking THIS season. It was last season when he proved his value, when he came into a shambles of a team, the youngest in the league with a lazy coach, him being among the youngest in the squad. By the second half of the season, every time he didn't play, Chelsea tied or lost. And finally, when Enzo was dropped, he played 3 roles in one and absolutely cooked. He bossed the team. Now, is he "the best" in his position in the league is still a non-sensical argument, because we're still in the first half of the season, because he's only 23, because Chelsea isn't in Champions League... there are many reasons why Caicedo still has a ways to go before he can truly claim that accolade... but I would take Caicedo over Gravenberch ANY DAY. Gravenberch would be very droppable at Chelsea. He'd be fighting the spot v. Lavia.
He is and it ain’t even close let’s be real.
Get off the crack
Liverpool wanted to sign Caicedo
Against caicedo gravenberch turned to a ghost.
I can't believe that there's not one comment from an Arsenal fan saying that Decline Rice is the best MF in the EPL!!
He's not mate, relax 😂
@dimitryanyanwu7681 But he cost £105m so he's the best in the world right? 😅
absolute pagan you are 😂
@@MichaelNnnachetam Thanks hun xx
How's your goat ?
Rice is better than Caicedo that's for certain
Chelsea owned that mid against pool. Crazy how bro said graven performed against us this season
how you compare partey to caceido? blows my mind
Liverpool fan : i dont rate stats because i got eyes
Also Liverpool fan : gravenderch got better stats than caicedo
😂😂😂😂😂
Even if he is the best, the gap between him and the others fighting for top 4 is not that big. Further, the real question which Midfield unit combo is the best and most effective for how they want to play. At the moment, Liverpool are slightly ahead on that front, but we will see by the end of the season if Chelsea and Arsenal or even City can make up the ground.
They're actually not ahead though in terms of midfield. It's because they have Salah and VVD.
Your argument became flawed when you said we... Is szoboslai a better midfielder than kdb because city are 4th?
Liverpool are not 11 points ahead of KDB because of Szoboszlai
No buddy, it's because rodri and kdb is injured
People like to conflate the performance of a team to that of all it's players. Gravenberch has been good, but just because his team is 9 points clear doesn't mean he's the best. That logic would say that their entire starting XI is the best at each of their positions, which clearly isn't true. Caicedo has been the best MF this year.
Wait when gravenberch faced caicedo he was mid don't make that 2-1 win fool u
We dominated Liverpool on their home turf, dominated their midfield too.
Caicedo best midfielder in league hands down
Disasi, Chucka, Nkunku, Mudryk, chillwell will all go, the majority in Jan if the price is right, mudryk might go on loan
Terry " id love to play orient"
Football gods "Oh yeah" 😆 🤣
arsenal fans always gon hate on a chelsea player
Gravenberch better than Caicedo? Hmm please don’t make me laugh
It's not a debate the guy is Blue Firee
This debate is unrelated in every way, shape, or form. Let’s wait till the league ends then we talk! Last year all of you would have claimed Rodri to be the best, it was not his injury, still, the argument will hold!
We can’t differentiate the 2 right now. Let’s wait until the end of the season! We have so much more games in order for us all to see a clear picture.
The saddest point all of you are making is Cai was not good last year! Really! Sad!
💯
Only 2 point lead now. Liverpool fans are still butt hurt he didn’t choose them.
Remember when Liverpool fans were trying to say Endo was better?!
Putting Caceido as an inverted right back has been a game changer. It enables Lavia and Enzo to play in midfield. Inverted right back might be Caceido's best position.
Naaa fam, he needs to be bossing the mid
@@pablovicuna2133inverted don’t mean he’s not in midfield. He spend nearly 80% of the game still in midfield, just needs to cover fullback in transitions which he’s good at anyway
@@anthonyigbonaju7081he can't play like that every game if Aston Villa has tricky winger he won't play there gusto could have played but because Aston Villa always love to play through the middle that's why we could play the three mieldfield of caicedo,lavia and Enzo so we can have 5 in defense and 5 in attack
@ the whole point playing him as the inverted RB is to deal with tricky wingers. De Zerbi already did that against United and Arsenal when he was at Brighton and he locked up Martinelli and Rashford.
@@anthonyigbonaju7081It worked well for De Zerbi. Maresca could try it again.
Caicedo is a better rb than Trent too
Staffy HATES Chelsea
9 points clear now down to 2 points.
Tom is just sick he picked chelsea over Liverpool 🤣🤣
Liverpool would swap gravenberch and caicedo in a heartbeat
Can Gravenverch preform in this Chelsea team, bcuz if you put Caicedo in this Liverpool team you we see the difference, wen Liverpool face Chelsea Caicedo treach him how to pay in midfield ok
Come on man, when they were on the same pitch gravenberch wasn’t even the second best Liverpool midfielder
Gravenberch failed the Caicedo test did he play that game?
The league is not yet over. Fofana is now out injured. Maybe Van Dijk could follow.
Weird comment
@seannewlands2803 there is nothing weird about life and uncertainty.
How can you compare Gravenberg with Caicedo?
You compare Caicedo with Kante, some people watch football with resentments
Caicedo is a top player for a youngster put it that way
This Tomlittle guy got told by his own fanbase
Moises el "NORMALITO" Caicedo...! 🐙🐐🔥
CAICEDO IS THE BEST DM IN THE LEAGUE
Comparing a guy who is playing in a conference league and a guy who is facing champion league elite midfields is not fair.. Liverpool are on top because of that guy
Only 1 with common sense.
What game has Caicedo played in the conference league?
Chelsea vs Liverpool
Caisedo and lavia bossed your midfield
Maybe you should go watch the match again.
Is caicedo playing conference?
😂
Your comment just summed up how much of an "expert" people like you are. Caicedo isn't even in conference league squad
Take any Scouser as what they say as oveehyped, they could sell tap water and make you think it's voss 😂
If chelsea have amon goeth and Eichmann in midfield.................😅
If he is not then who is it?
Caicedo Agenda
Party is good but dude is right Grevenbech and cacedo r best
Liverpool hate caused cause he rejected them 😭 but Chelsea vs Liverpool caicedo 7.5 gravenberch that apparently played better 6.6
Kante at Caicedo's age wasn't a popular player.
Granvenberg did What Against CHELSEA??😅
Don’t know what that Liverpool kid chocking on when the question was raised? I get it you believe Gravenberch has been the best but the reaction from you it’s as if the comparison was between gravenberch and Saul. They’ve both been amazing this season and it boils down to preference. Last season I had to sit here and listen to braindead takes by Liverpool fans having Caicedo/Endo comparisons cos of that donkey Poche constantly isolating him and hanging him to dry. Where is Endo now? And by the way way how was your boy gravy the other day against Newcastle? Absolutely stomped on
Just check the stats it will show you
Staffy is the worse on the TFT man thinks he’s have the most knowledge but honestly man is just disgusting
He did nothing against caicedo. Jones was Liverpool's best player in the game against Chelsea. GRAV was completely lost in the gane against Chelsea and not anywhere near Caicedo's performance on the game. The Chelsea game ended this debate because Caicedo dominated Grav in that game. It's not even a debate as far as that Liverpool vs Chelsea match is concern.
Jones was not Liverpool’s best player, Jones WAS THE BEST PLAYER ON THE PITCH. A performance in one game doesn’t matter because if that was the case then Jones has been better than Caicedo this season because of that one game
@@samkelorashuza5949 ... Perhaps you need to read through my comments against. I said Jones was Liverpool's best player in the game against Chelsea. I never said he was the best player in Liverpool football club.
@@olakunlepeter-eq1gr That’s my point he was the best player between Chelsea and Liverpool not only for Liverpool in that game. He was the man of the match not just “Liverpool’s” man of the match
For this episode,if you want to talk about a player or a team make sure we have at least a fan of that team so it will be more professional thank.
Gravenberch has VVD and Konate behind him! Of course his defensive stats are going to be better! How can you measure a players statistics on things that the defence is also responsible for? Pointless debates!
The LFC fan is annoying when he here’s the truth. Caicedo is the best DM/ 6 in the league. The stats prove he’s better than gravenberch (who btw I think is class) more tackles, clearances, headed clearances, more duels won. Gravenberch has 3 more interceptions though but caicedo is even better going forward and being able to play as a RB.
As a Chelsea fan I would not swap him for ANY OTHER in the league and look at his AGE!! 😂😂KTBFFH Moisés was being Called a Flop only last season now you all are talking top3 Atleast? 🎉🎉 He will continue to prove you all WRONG
Caicedo raw dogged Gravenberch when they played lol. Go back and look at the game/stats
These guys don’t know 😂😂 Caicedo will make them look dumber later
I thought he was a FLOP? 😂😂😂😂😂 eat your words, Moises Caicedo is the BEST midfielder in the PL
But Chelsea dominated the Liverpool midfield 👀 .
Jones was the best player on the pitch
Gravenberch is the best midfielder in the league this season. Stop believing in lies. In Duels, Defensive actions, Carrying, Forward passes, Forward pass percentage, Key passes and Progressive passes - Gravenberch is better in 5 areas compared to Caicedo at 2. The only areas Caicedo has been better is Key passes and Progressive passes. Have some respect for Gravenberch he has been flawless in the Premier League and Champions League. Caicedo is great but is 2nd best to Gravenberch the stats prove that. Yet I'm seeing "no one is close to Caicedo" have some respect. Caicedo hasn't even won vs the big 6. DataMB literally proves that Gravenberch has been better.
Gravenbach is not even close to Caicedo. Caicedo is miles clear all round. Gravenbach is having purple patch in team doing very well in all areas that’s all. Caicedo is everywhere on the pitch, interceptions tackles progressive passes carrying the ball covering multiple positions and pitching in assists and goals now and then. Gravenbach has been really good but nowhere near Caicedo. Will know why before end of season
@@rockymaniaster It's hilarious that you didn't read my message at all. Gravenberch has more defensive actions and duels and better at ball carrying, Guy can't even spell Gravenberch get out of here man. Gravenberch has dropped masterclasses against 3 countries champions where as Caicedo is in the conference league and can't beat a big 6 club lol
@ lol 😂 Liverpool fans are worst in the world for a reason😂 Caicedo has done much better job defensively. Even his performances in Copa America and World Cup qualifiers have been excellent 👌 he even has been more productive going forward. He even gave master performance playing at RB against Villa. Defensive lineup behind him is nowhere close to Liverpool. Gravenberch is good but nowhere close to Caicedo. If he was in this Chelsea team, he would be a big flop😂 u matrices lack common sense. Bet u never watched Caicedo play at Chelsea or in Ecuador 🤦🏻♂️
@@rockymaniaster 100% i agree.
@@rockymaniaster The worst fans are Arsenal fans. My claims are backed by stats. Gravenberch has been Netherlands best player in the recent nations league games, Also if you're talking about Copa America Mac Allister owns that competition as a midfielder. It seems Chelsea fans know f all about football. Can't even beat a big 6 club.
Partey and Rice are the best midfielders
Ur drunk
@t-royal8627 I don't drink
In FIFA 22 maybe!!….🎮😂😅
@@PLEYADIANO79 What's that?
Honestly, I listen to other programs from other channels but for some weeks now, the topics/discussion on the terrace has been not so making sense, I loved the terrace but its not just it, the analysis and the analysts are just not objective in most cases. On a serious note.
Caicedo is way better than Gravenberch
Liverpool fans delulu.. too much.. Just compare your CBs and Chelsea's CB.. who is easier to play in front of these
CBs?
Need to change quality of the panel. Banter aside, but literally zilch football knowledge except terry !!
That's a Big lie granvenbach s a six go watch him when he was at Ajax
Yeah, gravenberch is definitely a natural 6
Gravenberch best technicall midfielder period. His ability on ball is unmatched. Defensively Caicedo is best. On the ball and eye test no one touches Gravenberch 😂. Stats never beats eye test . Lmao 😂
'Playing like the best midfielder' but isn't. Right Staffy, right.
You said palmer was worlds best 😂 now these 2 bums 😂 partey and ric 3:00 e are level above. You lot do this every season 😂
A rapist and rice better than caicedo shut up
A panel of the biased..... Caicedo is the 👑
2:21 Partey is rubbish
Partey is the best.
These comments are crazy.
He isnt the best, Rodri is clearly the best DM in the league but he is second and he will evolve into one of the best DMs in world football.
The silly "sniggering" is infantile.
Yes.
Why am I listening to this barsh.You lot's hate for Chelsea overclouding your judgement. Caicedo has been doing way better than Gravenberchh .
Gravenberch beats Caicedo in 5 of the 7 top metrics. Its not even close.
Gravenberch 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀who ? 😀😀😀😀😀😊
😂😂😂😂 Gravenbroke