STEAM ENGINE VALVE TIMING - MODEL STEAM ENGINES FOR BEGINNERS #1
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
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The first in a Tutorial series called "Model Steam Engines for Beginners". Help & information about the running and maintenance of model steam engines. Contains many useful tips.This video shows hot to set the valvle timing accurately.
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"After installing one of his engines, Watt wrote to Boulton... 'The velocity, violence, magnitude, and horrible noise of the engine give unusual satisfaction to all beholders. ... I have once or twice trimmed the engine to end its strokes gently and make less noise; but Mr. ----- cannot sleep unless it seems quite furious ... and by the by, the noise seems to convey great ideas of its power to the ignorant, who seem to be no more taken with modest merit in an engine than in a man.' "
Thermodynamics V.M. Faires Fourth Edition 1962 pg 340
Thank you for this fine video, I've watched it a few times in order to set the valve timing on my newly completed Tiny Power 104 engine. With this information I was able to set the timing so that the engine is smooth and quite running. I'm able the take away a little something from each of your videos that helps me in my steam building hobby.
one of my favourite instructional videos...thank you Keith.
You being a musician greatly enhances your ability to hear when things are right. I’ve noticed every musician I know has the ability to do that. I tend to rely on my eyes more than my ears!
I'm no musician but go by sound and that said I can tell when a loco driver isn't hooking or winding the loco up right and getting the best out of an engine.
Keith, I just completed a video build series on my first steam engine, and many comments suggested I locate and watch this video. I found it very useful and will return to explore your catalog of videos. Thank you Sir and Happy New year to you. New subscriber here too !
Thanks Joe, Happy New Year to you also - Stay Healthy }:-)))
That was the best explanation of steam engine valve timing I have ever witnessed.Thank you
Glad it helped {:-)))
I have watched your videos avidly now for a good while and thanks to your patient manner, managed to get a broken engine I got off of ebay to actually fire up and steam today (you can see it on my channel) its still got to be tweaked as not a consistent steam but the soldering especially was very helpful to see how its done :)
Hello.
the right man to teach.
The right place to learn.
Thanks a lot, Keith.
It seems so easy when you explain.
Kind regards.
Hello!
When I have a doubt, I know where to get the answer.
Thanks Mr Appleton!
Hello Keith I like watching your videos .
I was wondering what is the best way to drill the boiler for the cylinder block on a 4 inch scale Burrel Showmans engine.
I can get a long series drill on most of the bottom ones but would have to mark out the ones at each end of the block and the top rows which are underneath the casting?
Any advice would be most helpful and appreciated
Thanks
Sorry, I can only give limited help to my Patreon supporters: www.patreon.com/keithappleton
Hello! Collect the steam engine. What should be the diameter of the hole for the flow of steam to the cylinder. Dimensions: piston diameter 60 mm , stroke 75 mm. Initially make the hole 10mm
I really like your way of explaining en your expertise I this field, I have a replica of the Tesla machanical oscillator, it's also a steam engine en it has a built in valve system as it is a self switching liniaire piston engine, I've also experienced that it runs way better on steam than on compressed Air en now I know way, thank you so much, I'm a subscriber now
Thanks Keith. A clear and informative video. You certainly have the knack, many other Stuart engines on RUclips clatter along loudly ...
A small comment on your bolt-or-screw discussion.
According to the swedish book for engineers, a bolt is: a cylindrical body with or without a head.
A screw is: a cylindrical body with or without a head with an outside thread.
The difference is the thread. No matter the size or the type of thread.
I guess that applies also in books written in the anglosaxen tounge.
73
Anders in Sweden.
How important is it for the valve to be square to the ports? Are there any benefits to the port opening gradually instead of opening full width at once. You might not want full steam flow/pressure for the first few degrees or mm of travel. It could also allow a bit of condensate to drain at near tdc. Just thinking ...
Thanks, great service you are providing!
Best to have the valve square across the ports.
Hi Keith - many thanks for a very informative video. I'm currently in the process of making my first engine - a Stuart S50. No doubt this video will help me to get it to run smoothly.
Cheers
Andrew
You made that engine sound like a long case clock movement, thumbs up to you.
hi keith great video very useful info.I have a question about displacement lubricators.I have recently purchased two stuart models steam engines.One is a stuart s50 the other is a stuart 10v machined kits.She who must be obeyed wont let me turn the kitchen into a workshop for some reason.My question is I will be running both engines on compressed air until I get boiler.would a lubricator work with compressed air,if not what other options are.
Displacement lubricators don't work with compressed air. If you get an inline oiler like you would use with air tools, that would suffice for all but very high speed running.
thanks for that.Will look on the auction site we all love.Again think your videos are great and done in a way that anyone can understand.
Not to get ahead of the class, but during construction, would you lap the slide to the sealing surface of the steam chest? Great videos, and I'll be ordering a Victoria as my first engine project. In short order it'll be quite cold outside in the midwest.
Slide valves (with correct lubrication) tend to "wear in" rather than "Wear Out" so lapping face to port is unnecessary ........
For us almost steam heads that own double acting production steam engines, mine is Wilesco D22 twin cylinder. The engine runs very well but the left cylinder has a small clunk to it. The lightest of pressure on the steam chest slide valve applied to the end of the valve silences the clunk. I am figuring that this is pre-loading the eccentric on this cylinder modifying its valve timing slightly. I do not believe any adjustment is offered to this construction. I was thinking a very light spring lever could be attached to apply the pressure needed to silence this clunk. This pressure on the valve quiets it in clockwise and counter-clockwise rotation.
On a separate note author Bill Bryson had moved from the US to England and live there for several years now. Not than it has any affect on my intelligence but Bill and I grew up together going to the same schools. I think he was one year behind me. Wondrously knowledgeable and humorous individual. A story about his wife and history. During WW 2 a German pilot was flying over the English countryside. He was low on fuel so released his bomb so he could make the flight back to his German base. The bomb fell on Bill's wife's grandparents home where her parents were also living. No one was home at the time the house was lost. How random events can change history. If you have not read any of his work I recommend you do so. His venues are travel, language and science.
Thank you for this very informative video, a couple of years ago I purchased a box of live steam parts off ebay, inside were quite a few parts that looked as if they had come off a twin cylinder engine, there is one gunmetal cylinder that has a sleeve down the middle drastically reducing the bore, my idea is to use these parts to build a table engine and your video had just the information needed to time and work out the crank throw plus eccentric size, would like to send some photos to get your opinion on the cylinder but don,t know how to, can you help with advise please. regards Nigel Cox.
A very helpful, practical, hands-on video. Thank you very much!
Thanks Keith. Clear and informative video. While watching I thought it might be useful to have some markings at the eccentric. When I build one I may do that. You've certainly got the touch, other Stuart engines I've observed on RUclips clatter along loudly.
Great videos Keith. Keep up the good work.
Very interesting. I wasn't sure what that lever was for.
I have a Stuart 5A that was part of a pile of machinists tools.
It's in very good condition, runs very smooth on shop air.
I'm interested in selling it but there were no Stuart 5A's listed on Ebay as a guide.
Is there a better source for steam engine, classifieds?
Thanks for your help.
Jeff
Very good info. I just built my first scratch built Wobbler and was wondering how to drill the holes for the ports. This should help a lot. Thank you... Fred
Did you ever get any parafin & charcoal to light your boiler ? Absolutely love you're video's. The narration's are very informative and hilarious. Thank You for every one of them.
+Nukl Yes sometimes if I have any charcoal laying about, but usually I use small bits of wood from the floor of my workshop near the bandsaw . . . .
Mr Appleton. I live in Canada and watch your videos thanks. I am not a patron so maybe you won't answer my question. I have a aluminum casting furnace and have cast and made a steam engine that runs on air. I was wondering can I make a steam engine out of aluminum and run it on steam. Thanks
I would just say that it's not a good idea.
This is a great video do you have any on setting the timing up for a twin cylinder loco the Stephenson's valve gear
with a twin cylinder steam engine, I find it best to set the valve timing on one side at a time. Feed in low pressure compressed air to one cylinder only, set the valve timing for that cylinder, then do the same with the other side.
Good video but looks quite hard to do. My minnie doesn't run well slowly but hasn't been run in much. Does it need running in or need adjustment?
Run it is for afcew weeks, then tweak it . . . let everything settle down first.
Excellent video! Thank you for making this, its exactly what i was looking for. Cheers
Where can I purchase one of these model engines? I really want to build one, and have been trying to build one from scratch and have learned it is a little more than I can design on my own without a machine shop.
Stuart Models - mail order from the United Kingdom.
Reliable steam engine ,Tripple Expansion Engine , In Spanish ,it's Premiera ,Segunda Baja ,,+ vacuum pump ,then Condansador ., I spent my Cadetship On this engine ,very durable and easy to operate ,started my Rank as an Steam engineer in this Engine
nothing more than 90 degrees so good
Great video Keith - thanks for posting. I am looking forward to any other ones you do - have duly subscribed.
Regards, A
Hey keith, I has a small query about something you say at the 2:00~ minute mark, so please bear with my ignorance here for a minute :p
You say that an eccentric coverts rotary motion into reciprocating motion, but not vice versa, were you making this statement in the sole context of steam engines? Or in engineering more broadly? Because while I’m very much so ignorant when it comes to steam engines, I know a passable amount about internal combustion engines, and the role of a crankshaft is to turn reciprocal motion into rotational motion, so is a crankshaft different to a eccentric? If not, then what am I getting confused about here? XD
An eccentric converts rotary motion into reciprocating motion, but not the other way round - it is just down to mechanical principles. An eccentric is very different to a crankshaft in this way.
Very informative as always great stuff, Thanks for taking the time and for sharing your skills.
What if you have a double cylinder engine ? Does this make it more difficult ?
Keith, I have recently recieved a Stuart mill engine and a mamod stationary engine after my grandfathers death, can to advise please on running the stuart on an air pump?, should I buy a airbrush compressor or some other kind of pump?
+Mark Kirkham if it is a small mill engine like an S50 or a 10H, then an airbrush compressor will suffice - don't forget to oil the cylinder as well as the bearings though.
I've really fallen behind in following Mr. Appleton. Time to catch up with the rest of this series; especially the one about the reversing engine. My 3" Aveling & Porter has started to go a little _funny_ with the reverser lever.
Thanks for the great videos. Just wondering where #9, 10 and 11 are? I'd like to make sure I can read all these.
Please look at my Playlists - there are over 800 videos listed in my playlist area. The playlists are on ruclips.net/user/keithappleton ..... or to make it simpler, here is the playlist for "Model Engineering For Beginners" ruclips.net/p/PLDV_TkPc48RGAdjlqcTlX-TcIXZyr5Lm-
What if the delivery lines are too long? Will it effects the pressure to decrease?
Excellent video...very informative. Thanks
Hi Keith Love your comments on your vids regarding idioy comments. I have just finished building a Burrell showman's engine . have you got any vid regarding valve timing as this is the first model I.ve built and am a bit out of my depth. Cheers
Try this one for starters , there are a few on my channel: ruclips.net/video/YyIZQb-t9mc/видео.html
@@keithappleton Excellent thank you
@@keithappleton Hi Kieth do know my mate Giorgio Uccellini who played key board with Freddy and the dreamers I believe
keith, on a reversing engine how do you set the eccentric for the reversing direction? is it set 90 deg to the crankpin in the opposit direction?
I quite chuffed with this video!
Thanks for the great video. I have an engine that I have been struggling with for a while to get timed right. Does this video show timing your engine for air or steam? I run all my engines on air. Should they be timed later than if I ran then on steam, since air is less expansive than steam?
The timing is the same for air & steam.
Have you ever worked with an engine with discrete valve action rather than eccentric?
No, only steam engines with eccentric driven valve gear.
Hello Keith, thanks for your great videos. Is it possible for a vertical slide valve to become unseated from the port face? On compressed air, when I open the throttle on my Gauge 1 loco, the air just whooshes up the blast pipe, no piston power at all. The loco has a single inside cylinder, slip eccentric. Impossible to open the valve chest without dismantling the loco. Thanks for any idea on how to remedy this.
sometimes you need to quickly snap open the regulator to slam the valve onto the port face - try that :-)))
Thanks, Keith. Finally got it to seat by disconnecting the valve spindle from the valve rod, easing off on the valve gland, then grabbing the end of the valve spindle with a pair of pliers and coaxing the valve onto the port face. Did this with about 80 pounds of air going into the boiler until the piston (disconnected from the con rod) began to convincingly slap to and fro in the cylinder. Reconnected the valve and con rods and got it going on air, loads of power (0-6-0 Cali Jumbo). Just need to set timing now. Thanks again for your vids!
probably the valve driver was gummed up with old steam oil etc . The slide valve always needs to 'Float" on the valve rod.
Yup, my thoughts, too. New engine to me, probably has not been run in many years as evidenced by the old cracking rubber hose connecting the tender meths to the burner. Nice old asbestos wicks, too! Thanks again!
Great video Keith
Now the real question. Does this method work on 3 & 4 cylinder locos??
Yes, The Gresley Conjugated Valve Gear on 3 cylinder locomotives can be tricky to adjust, but the principles are the same . . .
more please it was great
Just found this video after asking exactly this question on another of yours, sorry!
i have a stuart turner compound launch engine and i am wondering how do you set the valve on the low pressure side of a compound engine? is there a difference to how you set a single cylinder valve
should you set the first valve as advised on the above video and the second valve to only open after a complete stroke of the HP cylinder?
I'm pretty sure that you set each valve as for the cylinder it's running on. So you would set the HP valve like in the video, and set the LP valve as in the video. There should be no need to have to do anything fancy. If the problem is listening for the openings on the LP cylinder, take the pipe off and make a little fitting to put air directly in the LP cylinder.
Thanks for the video, very informative.
A great description on valve timing, but you mention that cooling steam expands in volume. I not understand this. Creating a steam cushion to decelerate the piston and change it's direction is logical and is also found in Victorian books. Keep up the good work.
I love watching your video's more people should.
Thanks, I wish more people would watch too .....
Fantastic engin .
Nice educational video.
i have a very old stuart v10 can you help me i got it from my late grandfather and he said he used to tinker with it but could never get it working well i have one problem that IT HAS NO OUTPUT for steam i am VERY confused please help
+london smith I can't say without seeing it - at least a digital photograph. . . .
Keith Appleton whats your email i have pictures (thank you so much for the help)
do you have a video on setting the piston on an oscillating steam engine? (just curious because im trying to figure mine out)
Setting the piston ?? Sorry I don't understand.
I'm sorry about that I was just wondering if you have a video on how to properly set the piston in a wobbler steam engine.
the specific engine I am curious about setting the piston on is the PM research model 2AM im new to working with steam engines this is my first one.
I figured it out I made a very novice mistake when I was setting the piston rod I didn't realize how much oil was in the cylinder and I thought I was hearing a knocking when I turned it over but it was just the oil making the sound. I wish you the best take care.
I like the hand on flywheel load test
Sir what is stroke length of valve rod and main cylinder
www.stuartmodels.com/item/109/stuart-5a-unmachined (The stroke of the valve rod is usually half of the main piston stroke).
Imagine having a disc sander powered by one of those.
i have a twin cylinder burrel road loco .it runs ok forward but wont in reverse
4:57 Did I understand you correctly? Did you say steam expands when it COOLS? 🤨
yes, Steam expands as it cools.
Bloody magic. nice useful
Mainly from the teachings of LBSC who wrote for "Model Engineer" in the 1950's . . . .
How do you know if your steam engine can run in both ways or not?
If it has reversing gear then it will run in both directions.
@@keithappleton thank you for the fast comment! Another question: How do you know which direction it is?
it depends on which side of the crank web that the eccentric sheaves are set to ......
very useful
Glad to hear that - thank you {:-)))
do the highest points on the eccentrics have to bo opposit from on another?
+chubby7570 YES
Castings are available from Blackgates Engineering but they would need machining.
I am trying to build one from scrap :)
a brilliant vidio
"As it cools it expands"... hmmm not heard that one before?
🔧😊👍
I say to this Valve in German so; Flach-schieber
But they call me an eccentric