I timed their runs out of curiosity. Russel / Karl 3x scope ... 35.82 sec / 45.43 sec 5x scope ... 34.24 sec / 31.65 sec ...pretty cool and (originally) surprising to me. I realize that a big part of them speeding up on their second run is due to being familiar with the excercise, but still. Being able to actually see your reticle seems to be a definite advantage.
I was considering the 3x for my DMR-ish AR but I was waiting on the Primary Arms Micro Prism 3x to come out before pulling the trigger. This is the first time I've heard of the reticle scaling issue on the 3x. Thanks, you probably saved me some disappointment.
I like the 5x so much I bought two of them and relegated my ACOGs to storage. When you couple it with an RDS (offset not piggyback) it’s so fast, forgiving, and versatile, that it’s hard to imagine that it’s not the future of combat optics. NOTE: One of mine does have a much brighter red than the other, and they definitely seem to prefer lithium ion batteries.
The eye relief on the 3.5x ACOG is slightly worse than the Spitfire 5x, and the famous 4x is much worse, like 50% worse. If you said, “I like the Schott glass, the brightness of the reticle, and its combat record, and that means more to me than measurable data.” you would have valid criticism. But that is not who you are. You’re a keyboard warrior that does’t own either optic, and I can tell because you said obviously inaccurate things.
@@jackjmaheriii Well, I have a 3x ACOG (TA33), and as an Army Veteran, I know what I'm talking about. There's a reason why the Spitfire 5X was on sale at PSA for $199 last year. That's also where and when I bought my Spitfire, and now I'm considering selling it. I must admit, you're a better keyboard warrior than me :)
There are two families of ACOG 3x, both have shorter eye relief and smaller FOV than the spitfire, so you’re still wrong. “As a veteran…” is an appeal to authority so you’ve also committed a logical fallacy. Also, I’m active duty.
I agree, love my first 5x so much I bought a second one. And if anyone out there is wondering, any red dots with the Doctor/Noblex footprint will work atop the 5x. I run a Viper on one and a TruGlo Tru-Tec micro on the other.
Would love to see how the upcoming PA 3x Microprism stacks up against these. Shame the reticle is so small on the lesser power Vortex, that looks borderline unusable.
I looked through the 3x in person, you nailed the description at borderline unusable. I'd like to get something similar to the 3x for a 10/22 as I think it'd be a killer combo.
I'm confused about these "small reticle" comments. The reticle is sized based on the ballistics of the 5.56 round. If it weren't this size, it wouldn't be an accurate BDC. What am I missing?
@@brandonreed70 The actual thickness of the lines and the horsehoe outer ring could be increased, making it much easier to see, without effecting the graduation scale at all. The lines are so fine they are barely visible.
Perfect timing Karl, my WWSD has a Vortex Spitfire on it becouse of my astigmatism. I've been very curious about the 3X gen 2 for my next build. Looks like I might go with a 5X.
My thought exactly when they finished describing the test. Well; that's a new stage at 2GACM and Brutality matches. For Brutality I imagine it paired with multiple targets and variable target engagements much like a few other stages have included. Like 4 targets and 2 spinners and you engage different ones based on whether your rifle and pistol have serial numbers that are odd or even or add up to an odd or even number and which version you get is based on a roll of a dice or something. Something that includes mental stress and choosing targets based on that mental stress. Unfortunately you can't really spin a spinner when you have to move positions between shots; at least as a stage event in a competition that is expecting people to finish the stage (I'm sure there is at least one person who thinks they could spin a spinner whilst doing the Kasarda drill), but, I could easily see having two targets and a spinner and having to alternate between the static targets and the spinner. As in hitting one of the statics, spinner, other target, spinner before going for the first static again.
Karl, I'm curious how the two of you would compare this with a red-dot and equivalent powered magnifier? Something like your standby Holosun and Vortex 3x magnifier.
I personally use a spitfire 1x on my AR and the main pro for me is the etched reticle. Any red dot has potential to run out of battery, the etched reticle is always there.
@@MrOystaCatz at reported 50K'ish, let's just call it 30K, hours on a battery, I'm not terribly concerned about battery life, especially with the availability of solar panels on them.
@@MrOystaCatz Another plus for me that the etched reticle supplies is I think it is clearer for me. I have some astigmatism and the holographic reticles tend to be fuzzy, where as the illuminated etched ones are easier to see.
Glad you talked about the reticle size. I tried the Primary Arms 1x prism (the first version) and found the reticle so small as to be useless beyond just being a blob to superimpose over the target. I have astigmatism even with corrected vision and the reticle was so small that my eye couldn’t focus on it no matter the diopter setting. I think these optic manufacturers are a little optimistic about putting these range-finding, BDC, leading reticles on these low power prisms.
Optimistic, but it sells to the crowd that sig thought needed a color coding scheme to match accessories to guns 🤦 on the other hand, what else can they offer for reticles? A simple boring dot? Technically all you need is a 1-2 moa dot. Zero a little high at 100 and you're fine for dot shooting distance. But the market thinks they need a bdc (that's probably not exact) for shooting 25-100 yard paper and steel so they buy stuff like this.
I have the 3x gen 2 mounted on my AK. Honestly the reticle isn't as small as you make it out to be. i can pick up the reticle and the sections in it very easy. If you cant, i suggest a visit to your eye doctor for some glasses. The picture they show in the video does not do it justice. It definitely isn't the same as what you actualy see with your eye. Photos have a way of making things seem smaller than they really are when looking through optics. If you're interested, i suggest looking at one in a shop to see for yourself. I'm very happy with the 3x. I can use it close quarters as well by using my off eye to focus on targets and my reticle eye to project the reticle. Only con I have is the eyebox is abit strict but I have yet to see a micro 3x prism that isn't strict on the eyebox.
I use an old Gen I x3 on my practice rifle (actually a BRN-180 that I got in part due to your endorsement- thanks!), and I find that the illumination helps during the day. Those have a green setting as well, and while I prefer it, I find that either one makes the relatively small reticle easier to pick up on.
Best review on this optic. I went with the 5X because of your review. I opted for a Burris Fastfire 3 for the top. I think the PA Cyclops 3x when it come out.
I used a Primary Arms 2,5 fixed scope at FB2021. It also has a tiny reticle. It was very hard to zero this optic on paper. But when shooting these unpainted steel targets I didn't even needed the illumination. Targets were very easy to find and hit.
I've used the PA prisms extensively and have a 5x Spitfire Gen 2. The Spitfire is much lighter but the glass is fairly comparable. The PAs have excellent glass for the price. I also have owned a TA31 ACOG, which crushes the cheaper optics on FOV but loses on eye box.
i got the 3x and mated it with a monstrum prism magnifier that mounts the opposite as most maginifers and love it, with the monstrum prism magnifier makes the reticle perfect on the 3x
I love optic reviews, and you guys make the best, most impartial, concise and practical ones out there. Any update on when could we see a video about the best optics to put on top of the WWSD btw?
I'd assume everything they said in the 2017 mostly still applies. I know Karl's still a huge fan of his Holosun (which is both great and suck; I had a defective Holosun the company absolutely refused to work with me on and it soured me on the entire brand), and the other optics they tested back then were all fine. Frankly I'd mostly just look at their optic reviews, and reviews you trust from other sources on other opticsa, and figure out what works for you. The Stoner guns aren't so different from baseline AR-15s that they need special-snowflake optics, at least not ballistically. Best rifles in their class by a wide margin, but still shooting the same round from the same length of barrel.
@@yurei8368 i know, but a lot of optics came out in the meanwhile and I was curious about which one, in their opinion, fits the purpose of the rifle the best. Not because it needs it, just because it complements it well
@@lordhellfire153 thanks! I would love the accupoint or the acss holosun, but not of them are unobtanium here in Italy, so I wanted to know if they recommended anything else
I like this test a lot. Intuitively the 5x would be much better at the spinner in a static test with its greater magnification (judging it's position while swinging) and the 3x would be better at rapid target acquisition with its greater field of view. This gives more of a real world balance than a single factor test.
Спасибо за обзор, как раз хотел себе прикупить вортекс 5х ( но у нас даже первое поколение не купить, только 3х gen1 в продаже). И цена для России демократичная, а ВОМЗ с ПСО ужасны.
im very interested in a 5 or 6x prism w/ dot combo, so this video really hit the spot! Any idea if the 5x only fits the venom? Or would it be compatible with other micro dots? I can't keep up with all the mounting base interchangeability anymore lol 😄👍
Docter, Eotech MRDS, Insight, Meopta, Vortex Venom/Viper, Burris Fastfire III share a mounting platform as far as I'm aware. I have a MRDS on top of mine.
Plan on mounting a 3x on my Type 81 LMG. Here in Canada we don’t have many options for cool semi’s so I find the 3x perfect for 7.62x39 with a bipod. 25-250 yards the 3x is perfect for the job (given you have decent eyesight). Beyond that distance the reticle would be hard to use given how small it is but the round limits the usable range so the 3x Gen II is perfect.
I got the gen 1 three power at bass pro the other day for a steal at only $250. I guess they are phasing it out for the new one. It’s bigger and beefier, but that’s what I like about it. It also has the two Picatinny rails on top at 45° angles. For the money, I was excited to get it. Looking forward to mounting it on my AR and having some fun.
I have the 3x on an X95 and find it to be an excellent optic. Definitely don't find the reticle too small. Personally I find 3x magnification to be perfect for 15 -300 yards if you want to be more precise than with a red dot. With anything more than 4x (Also have an ACOG) closer range performance becomes too limited imo. Yes you can mount the red dot but that adds cost. All depends on the distance you intend to shoot at.
I put the 5x and venom on my AUG when it was released. The illumination isn't daylight bright (which is OK to me since it's etched) and the eye box isn't as forgiving as I had hoped... but I still really like it, especially for how crazy light it is. I'd love to see a video with your thoughts on this setup vs like a dot + magnifier.
I was looking at the 5x since its currently on sale for $250 but even with the 5x that reticle looks a little too small and dim for me to really use comfortably. I could do it, but it wouldn't be optimal especially when paired with that poor eye relief and my corrective lenses. So thanks for the review! I'll keep shopping around.
They didn't touch on eye relief. Common with prism optics is shitty eye relief and this is no exception here. I found a cantilever for a red dot that I mounted backwards so I didn't have to remove my backup irons, works great. I'd recommend a cantilever mount for the option of eye relief whether you want back up irons or not. And when I say I mount the cantilever backwards most red dot cantilevers move the optic forward but in this case you want it backwards to move it closer. Edit: Also the Spitfire Gen 2 uses the Aimpoint T1 footprint so if you don't like the Vortex mount you can change it just read your manual on height and/or email Vortex they'll help you out.
I've been curious about running one of the 5x models with an offset/45-degree red dot for close work. Would be interesting to see that sort of setup compared to an LPVO or red dot + magnifier combo.
With the piggy backed RDS, rather than moving from cheek to chin weld, you can simply rotate the rifle just the same as you would for an offset RDS. Rather than looking through the offset RDS with your right eye (assuming right handed shooter), you are looking through the piggy backed RDS with your left eye. The only problem with this approach is the height over bore, which will have a greater effect on POA / POI than you would have with on offset RDS. At close quarters, however, the difference is trivial - unless you're counting on those hostage head shots. Past the point of zero, this starts to become a problem, as the round is drifting and dropping at a very odd curve relative to your sight. But if you zero your RDS out to 50 or 100, all of your quick engagement range targets are going to be within that initial shrinking triangle that goes from about a three inch base at the rifle to a point at your zero.
Completely agree. I have the 3x spitfire and the reticle is almost completely unusable. The bdc is soooo small I thought there was something wrong with it. Also they should offer a green reticle illumination.
@@usarmyisthebest9193 lack of batteries is a dumb reason to go with a suboptimal optic with eye relief when red dots have batteries that last five years or more and then have a solar backup. A handful of batteries will last longer than you’ll ever need them to.
For people that don’t shoot often or don’t shoot a specific rifle often, not having batteries is a good option for some people. Yeah I can change batteries easily and keep extras in all my range bags and the storage compartment on the rifle, but I still have irons for the case where I need it immediately and a battery is dead.
Yeah I run sigs romeo & juliet combo, so I really don't see the use for any of the 3x and with 5x optics you might as well just go for the tango 6 or any competing 6-8x optic at that point it's really not much more.
Just going to confirm part of this review: I got to look at the 3x Spitfire Gen II, and it indeed has a tiny reticle as well as a tight eye box/eye relief. So small a reticle I would question whether the BDC features are actually usable, exactly as the review here said. For the price asked, I really don’t see a good case for the Spitfire 3x optic. Can’t speak to the 5x. Looking at the side by side footage here the 5x reticle definitely appears better.
I don't know if you're an appropriate resource for this but I recently bought a WWSD2020 for my dad for an xmas gift. I watch your channel because of the old guns, vignettes, etc. mostly and don't know much about the latest tactimus soperatoremeus and want to get him him cheap but reliable sighting so he can plink targets at the range or whatever. Should I go iron sights or something else? Any in particular you might recommend? Just Googling options is like drinking from a fire hose.
That's an awesome gift. Well done! I've put together one and am in the process of assembling the second for my two kids, mostly faithful copies except in 6.5G for a bit more hunting versatility and am pondering the same question. I want to keep it light to not negate the handiness but need some magnification for less that perfect lighting, seeing branches and obstacles, good shot placement, etc. I've got a year until next season and a spare dot and 1x5 so I may mount and play with those in the mean time but I'd love to capitalize on others' experiences too to save time and money avoiding dead ends.
I have the 5x prism. I have a few issues with it. Firstly, the adjustments aren't tactile at all. They border on sloppy. They're really easy to turn. Then I have an issue with the optic holding zero. I put it in my back seat (cased), drive down a dirt road a bit, and my zero shifts up to 5MOA. The last gripe I have is that there's dust sealed all up inside the optic. If you catch it at the right angle, it's everywhere. Anyone else have these issues?
My 1x spitfire and my crossfire red do have been rock solid. Drive mine down grids all the time. Shake my sub2000 around and ever carry it by the optic. I'd call vortex for a warranty claim on your 5x
Can we get a review on that Sig Bravo4 battle pack Russell was using a while back? The 4x prism with the Romeo0 stacked on top. After the excellent reviews you gave other Sig optics, I'm eying them for a future AR308 battle rifle-ish build.
Is there a measurable tactical/tactile advantage that a flat trigger gives you over a curved? I have both and can't really tell the difference other than the flat feels heavier/has more finger pad pressure. Eta: Pricing schemes on optics in the same family seem odd. Case in point, vortex lpvo. 1-4, 1-6, 1-8. 200, 300, 400$. I have mostly 1-8 and a single 1-6. The 1-6 is bigger but 100$ less. Is there really 100$ worth of material difference between each one? And here on your reviewed sights.. is there 100$ of difference or is it a simple case of 'more mags, more dollars'?
I would be interested what your opinion is regarding the Burris AR536 Prism Optic compared to the 5x vortex , its a bit heavy and by this point dated i guess.
That Burris and the older gen Primary Arms, and the original Spirfire prisms are all nearly twice the weight of the newest gen of Spitfire Gen 2 HD and Primary Arms microprisms
@@Tornado1861 for me, no, but I have a long neck. If you're in a position where eye relief is a problem you have a 2.26 height heads up red dot right there.
I would be interested in this compact looking vortex device strictly in the form of a magnifier. I have a 3x magnifier and while it is great, I wish it were a compact 5x to truly make use of more zoom when you want it. Any recommendations for a flip to side 5x magnifier?
Interesting! I have the same problem with a triji 1-4 and it's BDC. The circle is fine, but the hashes are too fine to pick up easily and the numbers are so hard to read it's stupid. I generally love that LPVO but it makes you wonder who fked that part up.
Does the 5x have a venom specific mount. It is it 1913 on top? And if it's not 1913, do you know if the vortex venom has the same footprint as the vortex viper rds?
I timed their runs out of curiosity.
Russel / Karl
3x scope ... 35.82 sec / 45.43 sec
5x scope ... 34.24 sec / 31.65 sec
...pretty cool and (originally) surprising to me. I realize that a big part of them speeding up on their second run is due to being familiar with the excercise, but still.
Being able to actually see your reticle seems to be a definite advantage.
I was considering the 3x for my DMR-ish AR but I was waiting on the Primary Arms Micro Prism 3x to come out before pulling the trigger. This is the first time I've heard of the reticle scaling issue on the 3x. Thanks, you probably saved me some disappointment.
Definitely, i'm seeing some 3x on the secondhand market.
I like the 5x so much I bought two of them and relegated my ACOGs to storage. When you couple it with an RDS (offset not piggyback) it’s so fast, forgiving, and versatile, that it’s hard to imagine that it’s not the future of combat optics. NOTE: One of mine does have a much brighter red than the other, and they definitely seem to prefer lithium ion batteries.
TBH ACOG is better. I have both, the eye relief for splitfire 5X is bad...
The eye relief on the 3.5x ACOG is slightly worse than the Spitfire 5x, and the famous 4x is much worse, like 50% worse. If you said, “I like the Schott glass, the brightness of the reticle, and its combat record, and that means more to me than measurable data.” you would have valid criticism. But that is not who you are. You’re a keyboard warrior that does’t own either optic, and I can tell because you said obviously inaccurate things.
@@jackjmaheriii Well, I have a 3x ACOG (TA33), and as an Army Veteran, I know what I'm talking about. There's a reason why the Spitfire 5X was on sale at PSA for $199 last year. That's also where and when I bought my Spitfire, and now I'm considering selling it. I must admit, you're a better keyboard warrior than me :)
There are two families of ACOG 3x, both have shorter eye relief and smaller FOV than the spitfire, so you’re still wrong. “As a veteran…” is an appeal to authority so you’ve also committed a logical fallacy. Also, I’m active duty.
I agree, love my first 5x so much I bought a second one. And if anyone out there is wondering, any red dots with the Doctor/Noblex footprint will work atop the 5x. I run a Viper on one and a TruGlo Tru-Tec micro on the other.
Would love to see how the upcoming PA 3x Microprism stacks up against these. Shame the reticle is so small on the lesser power Vortex, that looks borderline unusable.
I looked through the 3x in person, you nailed the description at borderline unusable. I'd like to get something similar to the 3x for a 10/22 as I think it'd be a killer combo.
I know its over video. Over video its a hard pass. Might as well just have been a high powered dot.
The portion with the reticle …. had me going …. What reticle?
I'm confused about these "small reticle" comments. The reticle is sized based on the ballistics of the 5.56 round. If it weren't this size, it wouldn't be an accurate BDC. What am I missing?
@@brandonreed70 The actual thickness of the lines and the horsehoe outer ring could be increased, making it much easier to see, without effecting the graduation scale at all. The lines are so fine they are barely visible.
Plus points for the Space Marine sticker;)
Not only is it a Space Marine sticker, it is a Flashgitz Black Templar
@@Grok_Fractal No pity! No remorse! No fear!
@@Hamzat22 We will spay and we will neuter until there is nothing left!
@@Grok_Fractal SPAY AND NEUTER UNTIL THERE IS NOTHING LEFT!!!
Perfect timing Karl, my WWSD has a Vortex Spitfire on it becouse of my astigmatism. I've been very curious about the 3X gen 2 for my next build. Looks like I might go with a 5X.
Testing the reticule, totally not testing a Desert Brutality stage idea
My thought exactly when they finished describing the test. Well; that's a new stage at 2GACM and Brutality matches. For Brutality I imagine it paired with multiple targets and variable target engagements much like a few other stages have included. Like 4 targets and 2 spinners and you engage different ones based on whether your rifle and pistol have serial numbers that are odd or even or add up to an odd or even number and which version you get is based on a roll of a dice or something. Something that includes mental stress and choosing targets based on that mental stress. Unfortunately you can't really spin a spinner when you have to move positions between shots; at least as a stage event in a competition that is expecting people to finish the stage (I'm sure there is at least one person who thinks they could spin a spinner whilst doing the Kasarda drill), but, I could easily see having two targets and a spinner and having to alternate between the static targets and the spinner. As in hitting one of the statics, spinner, other target, spinner before going for the first static again.
Don’t think I don’t see that Flashgitz sticker.
Purge the Furries in Holy Fire! No Mercy!
Karl, I'm curious how the two of you would compare this with a red-dot and equivalent powered magnifier? Something like your standby Holosun and Vortex 3x magnifier.
I personally use a spitfire 1x on my AR and the main pro for me is the etched reticle. Any red dot has potential to run out of battery, the etched reticle is always there.
They usually say they prefer red dots, I think they like the 1x
@@rollastudent right, that's why I called his standby. There's functionality differences between them.
@@MrOystaCatz at reported 50K'ish, let's just call it 30K, hours on a battery, I'm not terribly concerned about battery life, especially with the availability of solar panels on them.
@@MrOystaCatz Another plus for me that the etched reticle supplies is I think it is clearer for me. I have some astigmatism and the holographic reticles tend to be fuzzy, where as the illuminated etched ones are easier to see.
Awesome video, had a hard time finding a review for this optic
Good info. These prism optics are appealing but it's helpful to be able to see the reticle comparison and get feedback on what it's like to use.
Glad you talked about the reticle size. I tried the Primary Arms 1x prism (the first version) and found the reticle so small as to be useless beyond just being a blob to superimpose over the target. I have astigmatism even with corrected vision and the reticle was so small that my eye couldn’t focus on it no matter the diopter setting. I think these optic manufacturers are a little optimistic about putting these range-finding, BDC, leading reticles on these low power prisms.
Optimistic, but it sells to the crowd that sig thought needed a color coding scheme to match accessories to guns 🤦 on the other hand, what else can they offer for reticles? A simple boring dot? Technically all you need is a 1-2 moa dot. Zero a little high at 100 and you're fine for dot shooting distance. But the market thinks they need a bdc (that's probably not exact) for shooting 25-100 yard paper and steel so they buy stuff like this.
The reticle was too small on the gen 1 Cyclops but the gen 2 is perfect.
YES! Brother Arkados!
Love it. Pretty sure that reticle is the same one that’s in the Strike Eagle.
I have the 3x gen 2 mounted on my AK. Honestly the reticle isn't as small as you make it out to be. i can pick up the reticle and the sections in it very easy. If you cant, i suggest a visit to your eye doctor for some glasses. The picture they show in the video does not do it justice. It definitely isn't the same as what you actualy see with your eye. Photos have a way of making things seem smaller than they really are when looking through optics. If you're interested, i suggest looking at one in a shop to see for yourself. I'm very happy with the 3x. I can use it close quarters as well by using my off eye to focus on targets and my reticle eye to project the reticle. Only con I have is the eyebox is abit strict but I have yet to see a micro 3x prism that isn't strict on the eyebox.
"And They Shall Know No Fear."
Been waiting for this one for a while. Thanks for the informative and wise presentations!
Good stuff. Any possibility of doing a prismatic round up comparing the new Primary Arms Cyclops and Swampfox to these two with the same testing?
Love the Space Marine sticker on the stock.
Thank you both. Best comparison of the two. Was on the fence for either. made my choice easier. 5x it is. Bravo
I use an old Gen I x3 on my practice rifle (actually a BRN-180 that I got in part due to your endorsement- thanks!), and I find that the illumination helps during the day. Those have a green setting as well, and while I prefer it, I find that either one makes the relatively small reticle easier to pick up on.
informative content like this is why I'm a Patron. keep up the good work, guys.
Best review on this optic. I went with the 5X because of your review. I opted for a Burris Fastfire 3 for the top. I think the PA Cyclops 3x when it come out.
I used a Primary Arms 2,5 fixed scope at FB2021. It also has a tiny reticle. It was very hard to zero this optic on paper. But when shooting these unpainted steel targets I didn't even needed the illumination. Targets were very easy to find and hit.
Would be interested how these stack up against Primary Arms' offerings. They get a lot of praise for clarity
I've used the PA prisms extensively and have a 5x Spitfire Gen 2. The Spitfire is much lighter but the glass is fairly comparable. The PAs have excellent glass for the price. I also have owned a TA31 ACOG, which crushes the cheaper optics on FOV but loses on eye box.
i got the 3x and mated it with a monstrum prism magnifier that mounts the opposite as most maginifers and love it, with the monstrum prism magnifier makes the reticle perfect on the 3x
Excellent informative video keep up the great work, content all the best from Scotland
Damn you guys made that shit look easy, I kept waiting for Russel to miss... Still waiting
I love optic reviews, and you guys make the best, most impartial, concise and practical ones out there. Any update on when could we see a video about the best optics to put on top of the WWSD btw?
I'd assume everything they said in the 2017 mostly still applies. I know Karl's still a huge fan of his Holosun (which is both great and suck; I had a defective Holosun the company absolutely refused to work with me on and it soured me on the entire brand), and the other optics they tested back then were all fine. Frankly I'd mostly just look at their optic reviews, and reviews you trust from other sources on other opticsa, and figure out what works for you. The Stoner guns aren't so different from baseline AR-15s that they need special-snowflake optics, at least not ballistically. Best rifles in their class by a wide margin, but still shooting the same round from the same length of barrel.
@@yurei8368 i know, but a lot of optics came out in the meanwhile and I was curious about which one, in their opinion, fits the purpose of the rifle the best. Not because it needs it, just because it complements it well
@@lordhellfire153 thanks! Which month’s Q&A was that?
@@lordhellfire153 thanks! I would love the accupoint or the acss holosun, but not of them are unobtanium here in Italy, so I wanted to know if they recommended anything else
I have horrible eyesight and astigmatism, so very useful review.
I like this test a lot. Intuitively the 5x would be much better at the spinner in a static test with its greater magnification (judging it's position while swinging) and the 3x would be better at rapid target acquisition with its greater field of view. This gives more of a real world balance than a single factor test.
Спасибо за обзор, как раз хотел себе прикупить вортекс 5х ( но у нас даже первое поколение не купить, только 3х gen1 в продаже). И цена для России демократичная, а ВОМЗ с ПСО ужасны.
im very interested in a 5 or 6x prism w/ dot combo, so this video really hit the spot! Any idea if the 5x only fits the venom? Or would it be compatible with other micro dots? I can't keep up with all the mounting base interchangeability anymore lol 😄👍
Docter, Eotech MRDS, Insight, Meopta, Vortex Venom/Viper, Burris Fastfire III share a mounting platform as far as I'm aware. I have a MRDS on top of mine.
EGW also makes an adapter that allows mounting of RMR footprint optics on top, but does add a little bit more height as well.
AT3 also has one that fits - that's what I have on mine.
Yo it's the flashgitz black templar
Plan on mounting a 3x on my Type 81 LMG. Here in Canada we don’t have many options for cool semi’s so I find the 3x perfect for 7.62x39 with a bipod. 25-250 yards the 3x is perfect for the job (given you have decent eyesight).
Beyond that distance the reticle would be hard to use given how small it is but the round limits the usable range so the 3x Gen II is perfect.
Love the gear comparisons!
I got the gen 1 three power at bass pro the other day for a steal at only $250. I guess they are phasing it out for the new one. It’s bigger and beefier, but that’s what I like about it. It also has the two Picatinny rails on top at 45° angles. For the money, I was excited to get it. Looking forward to mounting it on my AR and having some fun.
Food for the algorithm
I have the 3x on an X95 and find it to be an excellent optic. Definitely don't find the reticle too small. Personally I find 3x magnification to be perfect for 15 -300 yards if you want to be more precise than with a red dot. With anything more than 4x (Also have an ACOG) closer range performance becomes too limited imo. Yes you can mount the red dot but that adds cost. All depends on the distance you intend to shoot at.
Hah! I just purchased the 5x for my X95 and wound up here for reviews. Nice to know. Edit* It was half off on Palmetto so I couldn't pass it up lol.
That spinner/steel plate challenge seems like a real good test as in the real world multiple things might be going on etc.
It certainly rewards quick accuracy & 'field focus'
I put the 5x and venom on my AUG when it was released. The illumination isn't daylight bright (which is OK to me since it's etched) and the eye box isn't as forgiving as I had hoped... but I still really like it, especially for how crazy light it is.
I'd love to see a video with your thoughts on this setup vs like a dot + magnifier.
Any updated thoughts?
Good to see some Flashgitz love!
I was looking at the 5x since its currently on sale for $250 but even with the 5x that reticle looks a little too small and dim for me to really use comfortably. I could do it, but it wouldn't be optimal especially when paired with that poor eye relief and my corrective lenses. So thanks for the review! I'll keep shopping around.
I'd like to put the 3x on a lever action carbine for a touch more precision in low light when hunting in the thick East Texas stuff I frequent.
Palmetto State Army had been dropping the price on the 5x. Their current price is $200.
Excellent review!!
Angry black templar!! I love that sticker.
Great vid. I have a request .. more wild west vignettes. Or history in general. You are good at it man .
Russel out here flexing dem flashgitz
rocking that black templars sticker 👍👍
Organic algorithm here, reporting for video consumption duty. Take me to your leader.
Holy hell he found another lefty!
Nice flashgitz sticker Russell.
They didn't touch on eye relief. Common with prism optics is shitty eye relief and this is no exception here. I found a cantilever for a red dot that I mounted backwards so I didn't have to remove my backup irons, works great. I'd recommend a cantilever mount for the option of eye relief whether you want back up irons or not. And when I say I mount the cantilever backwards most red dot cantilevers move the optic forward but in this case you want it backwards to move it closer.
Edit: Also the Spitfire Gen 2 uses the Aimpoint T1 footprint so if you don't like the Vortex mount you can change it just read your manual on height and/or email Vortex they'll help you out.
What mount do you use?
I have been eyeballing the 5x for a few months for my KP15. Is the short eye relief a problem with the fixed stock?
How’s the eye box tho? I would have liked to see some use in weird positions to see how it does.
I have been thinking about getting a prismatic sight. The 5x looks like a good option.
I've also not liked any BDC in low or no power sights and find they end up just being clutter in the reticle.
I've been curious about running one of the 5x models with an offset/45-degree red dot for close work. Would be interesting to see that sort of setup compared to an LPVO or red dot + magnifier combo.
With the piggy backed RDS, rather than moving from cheek to chin weld, you can simply rotate the rifle just the same as you would for an offset RDS. Rather than looking through the offset RDS with your right eye (assuming right handed shooter), you are looking through the piggy backed RDS with your left eye.
The only problem with this approach is the height over bore, which will have a greater effect on POA / POI than you would have with on offset RDS. At close quarters, however, the difference is trivial - unless you're counting on those hostage head shots. Past the point of zero, this starts to become a problem, as the round is drifting and dropping at a very odd curve relative to your sight. But if you zero your RDS out to 50 or 100, all of your quick engagement range targets are going to be within that initial shrinking triangle that goes from about a three inch base at the rifle to a point at your zero.
Спасибо за видео и ваш труд
Would you recommend the new PA 3x SLX micro prism ACSS scope instead of this Vortex 3X?
Is that a flashgitz sticker?
Space Marine sticker, instant like.
Very useful
Russell sneaking in that 40k. 👍
Thank you
Completely agree. I have the 3x spitfire and the reticle is almost completely unusable. The bdc is soooo small I thought there was something wrong with it. Also they should offer a green reticle illumination.
Great video!
Yeah but why stack a dot on a prism when you could do a removable/flip to side magnifier on a dot?
For shtf scenarios
Weight. The prism with a dot is less than half the weight of a magnifier / red dot combo
@@usarmyisthebest9193 lack of batteries is a dumb reason to go with a suboptimal optic with eye relief when red dots have batteries that last five years or more and then have a solar backup. A handful of batteries will last longer than you’ll ever need them to.
For people that don’t shoot often or don’t shoot a specific rifle often, not having batteries is a good option for some people. Yeah I can change batteries easily and keep extras in all my range bags and the storage compartment on the rifle, but I still have irons for the case where I need it immediately and a battery is dead.
Yeah I run sigs romeo & juliet combo, so I really don't see the use for any of the 3x and with 5x optics you might as well just go for the tango 6 or any competing 6-8x optic at that point it's really not much more.
Somehow I see this drill coming to DB21, only at 600 yards shot with pistols while carrying a 70lbs kettlebell.
liking for the flashgitz sticker
Just going to confirm part of this review: I got to look at the 3x Spitfire Gen II, and it indeed has a tiny reticle as well as a tight eye box/eye relief.
So small a reticle I would question whether the BDC features are actually usable, exactly as the review here said.
For the price asked, I really don’t see a good case for the Spitfire 3x optic.
Can’t speak to the 5x. Looking at the side by side footage here the 5x reticle definitely appears better.
*BROTHER!*
Glad I pumped the brakes on one of these.
Any chance of a review on the Swampfox 3x prism?
Black Templars represent!
I don't know if you're an appropriate resource for this but I recently bought a WWSD2020 for my dad for an xmas gift. I watch your channel because of the old guns, vignettes, etc. mostly and don't know much about the latest tactimus soperatoremeus and want to get him him cheap but reliable sighting so he can plink targets at the range or whatever. Should I go iron sights or something else? Any in particular you might recommend? Just Googling options is like drinking from a fire hose.
That's an awesome gift. Well done! I've put together one and am in the process of assembling the second for my two kids, mostly faithful copies except in 6.5G for a bit more hunting versatility and am pondering the same question. I want to keep it light to not negate the handiness but need some magnification for less that perfect lighting, seeing branches and obstacles, good shot placement, etc. I've got a year until next season and a spare dot and 1x5 so I may mount and play with those in the mean time but I'd love to capitalize on others' experiences too to save time and money avoiding dead ends.
I have the 5x prism. I have a few issues with it. Firstly, the adjustments aren't tactile at all. They border on sloppy. They're really easy to turn. Then I have an issue with the optic holding zero. I put it in my back seat (cased), drive down a dirt road a bit, and my zero shifts up to 5MOA. The last gripe I have is that there's dust sealed all up inside the optic. If you catch it at the right angle, it's everywhere. Anyone else have these issues?
My 1x spitfire and my crossfire red do have been rock solid. Drive mine down grids all the time. Shake my sub2000 around and ever carry it by the optic. I'd call vortex for a warranty claim on your 5x
@@sheslikeheroin1661 Yeah I'm doing that. Just wanted to know if that's a common theme with these new prisms
Awesome video!
But my question would be ….
3X for a 22lr or still 5X ?
Obviously 5X is the upgrade.
But my question stands
3X good enough for a 22lr?
Can we get a review on that Sig Bravo4 battle pack Russell was using a while back? The 4x prism with the Romeo0 stacked on top. After the excellent reviews you gave other Sig optics, I'm eying them for a future AR308 battle rifle-ish build.
It’s in the queue…
@@SinistralRifleman awesome, looking forward to it 👍
If the reticle size in the 3x optic was as large as the 5x, would you prefer the 3x unit?
Where did the black Templar sticker come from?
Looks like a FlashGitz sticker. They send then out to their channel supporters.
@@goldenhide purge brothers!!!!!!!
That would mean it could be run offset
Zeroing would suck but it would be an interesting concept to test
Is there a measurable tactical/tactile advantage that a flat trigger gives you over a curved? I have both and can't really tell the difference other than the flat feels heavier/has more finger pad pressure.
Eta: Pricing schemes on optics in the same family seem odd. Case in point, vortex lpvo. 1-4, 1-6, 1-8. 200, 300, 400$. I have mostly 1-8 and a single 1-6. The 1-6 is bigger but 100$ less. Is there really 100$ worth of material difference between each one? And here on your reviewed sights.. is there 100$ of difference or is it a simple case of 'more mags, more dollars'?
Have you used the Bravo5? Curious to see how that compares with the 5x here.
5x ftw
Damn, Vortex prices are approaching Aimpoint territory. I'll stick with Primary Arms.
That price is MSRP, not retail
Yeah, MSRP... I got my Vortex 5x for 437.99 shipped. And that Primary Arms 5x weighs in at a chunky 18.4 ounces.
I always knew Russell was genetically modified to purge xenos. With that hulking frame, we should have known he serves the emperor.
I would be interested what your opinion is regarding the Burris AR536 Prism Optic compared to the 5x vortex , its a bit heavy and by this point dated i guess.
That Burris and the older gen Primary Arms, and the original Spirfire prisms are all nearly twice the weight of the newest gen of Spitfire Gen 2 HD and Primary Arms microprisms
Any thoughts on if your decision would change if the 3x had a larger reticle?
I have a 5x Spitfire with a Holosun 507 on top on a KP-15 lower right now.
Is the eye relief a problem with the fixed stock?
@@Tornado1861 for me, no, but I have a long neck. If you're in a position where eye relief is a problem you have a 2.26 height heads up red dot right there.
I would be interested in this compact looking vortex device strictly in the form of a magnifier. I have a 3x magnifier and while it is great, I wish it were a compact 5x to truly make use of more zoom when you want it. Any recommendations for a flip to side 5x magnifier?
I’m pretty sure aimpoint makes one, although it probably won’t be as compact as you’d like
What do you think about a 45 degree mounted rmr vs having the rmr on top of your main optic?
It will be interesting to see how would micro prism at 1x fare with red dot sight. Would a magnifier work with a 1x micro prism?
I only use this spitfire 5x with Burris Fastfire on my AR22. For serious guns, I use ACOG.
Would the 5x be ok for deer hunting ?
Is that...mauler on russel's stock?
Interesting!
I have the same problem with a triji 1-4 and it's BDC. The circle is fine, but the hashes are too fine to pick up easily and the numbers are so hard to read it's stupid. I generally love that LPVO but it makes you wonder who fked that part up.
Does the 5x have a venom specific mount. It is it 1913 on top? And if it's not 1913, do you know if the vortex venom has the same footprint as the vortex viper rds?
Nice