I was sitting in 1D and as we were climbing out on takeoff I was watching the female flt attendant lean forward from her position buckled in and her eyes were large snd looking. Own the aisle and I heard her say to the male f/a why are these people running up the aisle? Next thing I heard was a female pax state fire fire.., this startled me as I had watched a movie the week before about an A/C with a fire..,,. I m a Senior and a lot of things ran through my head got a few moments… bottom line it was a battery explosion that had been contained by this flight crew. Was very late getting to Memphis but thanks to entire crew of Southwest Airlines from the Flight Deck to the Attendants I am here today with my loved ones. Bruce
@@RLTtizMEyeah you're right. The real risk is from some Lithium batteries, not Nickel Cadmium or alkaline batteries. But so many devices use these now, shavers, toothbrushes, tablets, phones, computers, medical devices that it's inevitable that they are in luggage.
Checked luggage is screened too. I got several "we opened your luggage" notices (with contents apparently undisturbed) before I figured out that they were checking the AA batteries in the top zipper pocket. They weren't lithium, but there was no way to know that without checking. Now I keep spare batteries in individual packets in my checked luggage.
Onboard fire is one of the most feared emergencies. Good job to the flight crew and all the safety people for developing and using equipment that can address these lithium fires.
Lithium fires are a big deal in the nuclear industry. Had an incident one time where a guy threw his gear in his locker, accidentally turning on his flashlight. Because flashlights are typically sealed, it went off like a tiny pipe bomb starting a fire in the armory. Now, normally, small arms ammunition fires aren't a huge deal, but since some genius decided we should store our weapons loaded, they started launching rounds all over the place. It was a complete shit show.
It sounds like the flight crew was wearing masks for a few transmissions until they determined it wasn't a respiratory hazard, a very appropriate response.
from what I have seen/read, if there are 3 dings in a row, that means there is some sort of major issue and the flight deck is calling the cabin crew. 2 dings means they are calling the cabin crew but non-emergency, and 1 ding is a passenger calling a flight attendant. Reminds me of the days when department stores used that kind of ding to communicate before everyone started wearing radios.
I figured it was another lithium thermal runaway. Once that delta-P starts rising and the cabin altitude starts climbing above 6-7000’ (only about 2000’ AGL for KDEN) it seems some of the more poorly designed cells with substandard protection ladders start to have a higher potential for issues. Looks like they taxied back to gate C33 on the north side of concourse C. Hope the passenger didn’t get to badly burned, Lithium battery runaways can leave you in pretty bad shape if you can’t get away, they can be extremely violent and exothermic.
I saw an FAA video about this. How to put out a battery fire with what you have in the service cart. Fire extinguisher? No. Bucket of ice? No. Lots and lots of bottled water to get the heat down. Yes.
Charging these batteries super fast causes them internal damage there getting to hot. These batteries contents are under pressure. Damage can cause them to catch fire at extreme temperatures.
Damage can cause a single cell within the battery to overheat. Or a manufacturing defect can do it, or some other cause. Then that one cell gets hot. But thermal runaway happens because even a perfectly fine and undamaged lithium cell responds to high heat by failing and producing even more heat. So one failing cell produces enough heat that all its neighboring (perfectly fine) cells then fail and start producing heat too, and so forth, until every cell in the entire battery is producing heat.
Should be a legal requirement to keep electricals in cabin overhead lockers only problem is some low cost airlines put cabin luddage in hold if no room in cabin lockers
My guess is a 'vape'. Are single use/ dispoable vapes commonplace in the States? In England, they're endemic, I used to use them myself, they all contain a very small non rechargeable lithium battery. One has failed on me by short circuiting, and I was able to throw it in the sink under water to kill the fire off (of course with a large lithium battery this is not a good idea) which caused me to stop using as they are made my unscupilous Chinese tech companies; many can't be recycled and many don't know the risks of lithium batteries in a cheap mass produced product especially. If this wasn't the cause of this incident, I think it's only a matter of time before it becomes one.
@@stevendoerfler Exactly the same here then; 10 year old vaping. I stopped smoking 20 cigsa day and moved over to a vape about 7 yeard ago, but these new vapes are way too easy to buy and often sold by, in our country by some shop keepers who shouldn't have a business (clearly drug front stores) let alone the ability to sell these products to children. I always wonder if these kids would have smoked or not if these vapes which taste like sweets (as we call them)/ candy hadn't been available. Ironically I only started to smoke once I went to College/Uni.
They actually got a Lithium Ion battery fire put out? How'd they do it? What kinda new fancy tech or skills goes into putting out one of those fires? I heard they burn hot as hell and are suuuper vicious.
@@CMDRFandragon I don't think the goal is really to put out the fire, just contain it until they get on the ground. The bag is supposed to keep the intense heat inside from reaching the outside for long enough, and to be strong enough to contain a possible explosion. Sometimes they pour water in with the battery,. (Some of the heat then gets used up to heat the water and turn it into steam.) And I'm not sure anyone ever said the fire was out, I think they just said "contained". As in, safely inside a bag. But they still need to get on the ground ASAP and get the bag off the plane, since the bag might not be sufficient to keep the battery contained until it finally burns itself out. It just buys time.
Li fires cannot be put out with regular water or foam, and suffocation won't work either. You need a carbon dioxide estinguisher, or you can use pure carbon powder. Activated charcoal is almost pure carbon so that would probably work.
@@avgeek-and-fashion ... did you really just recommend using _charcoal_ to put out a *fire* and if suffocation wont work, how will suffocating it with co2 work? or are you suggesting to using liquified co2 to freeze it? It's an exothermic chemical reaction.
So, so, so many of these videos have ATC needing to clarify with the crew if they’re trying to declare an emergency. This is unnecessary and avoidable by the unmistakable “MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY” like the rest of the world uses.
@@cruisinguy6024 No. It is not the choice of words. It is the status of exactly how things will be handled. EMERGENCY works just fine and in fact...in America is preferred over nonsense words such as Pan Pan. There are NO INSTANCES where EMERGENCY was declared instead of Mayday resulting in a negative outcome. None.
Danielle was the pilot flying, and Steve was the pilot monitoring. The reason you heard both talking was because the Captain (Danielle) was coordinating with the flight Attendants over the interphone, so Steve had to communicate with ATC.
Fire is the one word no air crew wants to hear. These tech gadget manufacturers need to make a safer battery. Forget saving weight and make a battery case than can contain a fire in the battery.
@vulvacioustottie Where can we buy these "safe" batteries and what are they called and are they comparable to the performance of Lithium batteries. Thanks sparky.
The good news is they are working on safer batteries that don't use lithium! One of the ones I'm really looking forward to is the sodium ion battery, it's a lot less likely to combust under normal conditions than lithium is.
@@RLTtizME Never had an Apple gadget in my life and have no plans to. I have been quite satisfied with my Samsung phones going back to the S3 and currently have a Samsung Tablet.
Yes. If formally landing overweight. The aircraft structure and brakes will need to be assessed before it can depart again. It’s very unlikely it’ll be back in circulation for a few days minimum unless the overweight landing is barely overweight.
@@OH-qi1od would the captain be required to evaluate the extent of the injury before making a decision on whether to dump fuel or land over weight or as soon as it’s determined there’s a injury it’s automatic?
@@OH-qi1od- 737 can’t dump fuel. It is not equipped to do so. If they wanted to reduce weight to land they would have to fly a holding pattern until they burned off the fuel.
PAN PAN is the phonetic spelling of "Panne Panne". "Panne" means "broken" in French, as in "Panne le moteur" (The motor is broken). MAYDAY is phonetic for the French "M'aidez", which means "Help me".
That's never going to happen, its like banning all smartphones, tablets and laptop. Even the pilots use like 2 to 4 tablets for maps tables in the deck
@@df446 They'll be able to keep theirs with detailed protocols to be observed. But with so much trash batteries out there, it would be impossible to screen every passenger. The easy, simple solution is to simply ban passengers from having them. Certified phones and tablets would be exempted.
Man I can’t wait to see what happens when there are 100,000,000 electric vehicles on the road between fires and shutting down the power grid it should be a exciting. Insurance maybe a little high. A lithium car fire requires 60,000 gallons of water to put out.
60,000 gallons of water and hours to extinguish. Fire department tankers usually carry 1000 to 2500 gallons of water, where ( and if) they have them available. In contrast, a typical (non lithium) car fire takes less than 100 gallons to extinguish in a couple of minutes.
@@sallybrookner4158 It has nothing to do with the power grid, it is the battery technology and it's too frequent bursting into difficult to extinguish fires.. I have seen video of even iPhones bursting into flame. NYC has banned the charging of electric bicycles in apartment buildings, they have had numerous major fires and fatalities.
@@gerardmoran9560 It only does when under the correct air to fuel ratio, which just doesn't happen that often on fires. There's a reason slight problems on an engine make it run poorly. Besides they are far easier to extinguish, meanwhile Li-Ion batteries are self oxidizing, they literally produce their own oxygen to keep burning, and their own heat to keep it going.
@@sallybrookner4158 Keep dreaming the maths are against this delusional idea ! There are simply NOT enough resources on this planet to do a 1:1 switch . Best to create blue diesel and retrofit existing ICE cars !
So sick of people and their e-cigarettes. 100% that's what this was. My guess is it went thermal in their pocket. Seen this happen firsthand no less than nine times. These things are dangerous.
Not a sterling performance by the crew..."OK" response to traffic call doesn't even give call sign acknowledging much less data / SWA663 carrier only calls mean pilot flustered wrong com switch position [losing his cool] / call, we WILL be declaring an emergency [BS] declare the emergency asshole / ATC ILS 35R = SWA663 "Thank You"..reback incorrect should acknowledge & confirm intended landing rwy / SWA pilot doesn't seem to know to give > 1) nature of emergency 2) souls on board 3) fuel on board in time NOT pounds... all in all just unprofessional and disorganized /
3:52 "do you know where the fire is at?" Abysmal English, and unnecessary for getting the emergency aircraft safely to the field. Just adds distraction and comms workload. Fire service can determine this directly from the crew, once they land. 5:17 "equipment will be standing by for ya" The crew already made that request, which was acknowledged, and therefore it should be considered done. Unnecessary/redundant comms. The FAA HAS to do a better job training controllers in communications. Fire has potentially grave consequences. In all cases comms should be (a) non-conversational: clear and crisp using standard phraseology, (b) pertain to only what is absolutely necessary for the safe conduct of the flight, (c) non-redundant (coordinated between controllers and others), (d) properly managed with utmost consideration for crew workload. I rate this one a C minus.
I think both of those comments are perfectly fine. The first one is important because it helps the ATC better understand what conditions to expect when the plane lands (and is vital information for the accident report in case the plane crashes before it gets back to the airport) - and the second one is just a reassurance for both the pilot *and* the ATC, who may be nervous about having an emergency. Nothing wrong with reassurances. Neither of these comments burdened the pilots, and they were both related to the issue at hand.
We give your comment a D+. Wordy. Presumptuous and officious. Unpleasant. Pedantic. Overtones of arrogance. Nit Picky. Cluck your way right out of this chat and try instead...criticizing your relatives over on Facebook. Cheers and bye bye now.
I was sitting in 1D and as we were climbing out on takeoff I was watching the female flt attendant lean forward from her position buckled in and her eyes were large snd looking. Own the aisle and I heard her say to the male f/a why are these people running up the aisle? Next thing I heard was a female pax state fire fire.., this startled me as I had watched a movie the week before about an A/C with a fire..,,. I m a Senior and a lot of things ran through my head got a few moments… bottom line it was a battery explosion that had been contained by this flight crew. Was very late getting to
Memphis but thanks to entire crew of Southwest Airlines from the Flight Deck to the Attendants I am here today with my loved ones. Bruce
That’s why we keep batteries onboard with you. Not in the hold where it can go unnoticed for ages and can’t be contained well.
There are batteries in the hold ......don't kid yourself. God knows what people put in their luggage.
@@RLTtizMEyeah you're right. The real risk is from some Lithium batteries, not Nickel Cadmium or alkaline batteries. But so many devices use these now, shavers, toothbrushes, tablets, phones, computers, medical devices that it's inevitable that they are in luggage.
@@RLTtizME Of course. But the huge portable chargers and laptop ones have more potential to cause a bigger issue and have higher capacity.
@@OfficialSamuelC Don't forget the powered latex novelties.
Checked luggage is screened too. I got several "we opened your luggage" notices (with contents apparently undisturbed) before I figured out that they were checking the AA batteries in the top zipper pocket. They weren't lithium, but there was no way to know that without checking. Now I keep spare batteries in individual packets in my checked luggage.
Onboard fire is one of the most feared emergencies. Good job to the flight crew and all the safety people for developing and using equipment that can address these lithium fires.
Lithium fires are a big deal in the nuclear industry.
Had an incident one time where a guy threw his gear in his locker, accidentally turning on his flashlight. Because flashlights are typically sealed, it went off like a tiny pipe bomb starting a fire in the armory.
Now, normally, small arms ammunition fires aren't a huge deal, but since some genius decided we should store our weapons loaded, they started launching rounds all over the place. It was a complete shit show.
@@jackstecker5796the further I got reading your comment the more questions and concerns I had lol
@@mertonallowicious Not to worry, it wasn't anywhere near plant safety equipment.
It sounds like the flight crew was wearing masks for a few transmissions until they determined it wasn't a respiratory hazard, a very appropriate response.
@@jackstecker5796You’re saying his flashlight exploded?
At 1:16 that ding ding sound that can be heard I believe is the cabin crew calling the flight deck.
My guesses are the same.
from what I have seen/read, if there are 3 dings in a row, that means there is some sort of major issue and the flight deck is calling the cabin crew. 2 dings means they are calling the cabin crew but non-emergency, and 1 ding is a passenger calling a flight attendant. Reminds me of the days when department stores used that kind of ding to communicate before everyone started wearing radios.
Holy moly! I’m surprised I havnt heard about this until just now. That was a massive incident
Sarcasm?
ATC you are the best friend of a pilot, to the point and clear. Good job!
OMG, she just changed the runway assignment for emergency aircraft. Denver never ceases to amaze!
I figured it was another lithium thermal runaway. Once that delta-P starts rising and the cabin altitude starts climbing above 6-7000’ (only about 2000’ AGL for KDEN) it seems some of the more poorly designed cells with substandard protection ladders start to have a higher potential for issues. Looks like they taxied back to gate C33 on the north side of concourse C. Hope the passenger didn’t get to badly burned, Lithium battery runaways can leave you in pretty bad shape if you can’t get away, they can be extremely violent and exothermic.
Exothermic? No way.
@mudchair16 Exothermic means it produces heat. Are you claiming that a lithium thermal runaway doesn't produce heat?
I saw an FAA video about this. How to put out a battery fire with what you have in the service cart. Fire extinguisher? No. Bucket of ice? No. Lots and lots of bottled water to get the heat down. Yes.
I really liked that controller.
Holy crap, very well handled 👏
Charging these batteries super fast causes them internal damage there getting to hot. These batteries contents are under pressure. Damage can cause them to catch fire at extreme temperatures.
Damage can cause a single cell within the battery to overheat. Or a manufacturing defect can do it, or some other cause. Then that one cell gets hot. But thermal runaway happens because even a perfectly fine and undamaged lithium cell responds to high heat by failing and producing even more heat. So one failing cell produces enough heat that all its neighboring (perfectly fine) cells then fail and start producing heat too, and so forth, until every cell in the entire battery is producing heat.
@@stevendoerfler ya just about anything reacts with lithium ion
It's only a matter of time before something bad happen....
This is true everywhere, for everything.
Should be a legal requirement to keep electricals in cabin overhead lockers only problem is some low cost airlines put cabin luddage in hold if no room in cabin lockers
My guess is a 'vape'. Are single use/ dispoable vapes commonplace in the States? In England, they're endemic, I used to use them myself, they all contain a very small non rechargeable lithium battery. One has failed on me by short circuiting, and I was able to throw it in the sink under water to kill the fire off (of course with a large lithium battery this is not a good idea) which caused me to stop using as they are made my unscupilous Chinese tech companies; many can't be recycled and many don't know the risks of lithium batteries in a cheap mass produced product especially. If this wasn't the cause of this incident, I think it's only a matter of time before it becomes one.
Endemic in the US too. The industry was very effective at suckering young people into addiction.
@@stevendoerfler Exactly the same here then; 10 year old vaping. I stopped smoking 20 cigsa day and moved over to a vape about 7 yeard ago, but these new vapes are way too easy to buy and often sold by, in our country by some shop keepers who shouldn't have a business (clearly drug front stores) let alone the ability to sell these products to children. I always wonder if these kids would have smoked or not if these vapes which taste like sweets (as we call them)/ candy hadn't been available. Ironically I only started to smoke once I went to College/Uni.
They actually got a Lithium Ion battery fire put out? How'd they do it? What kinda new fancy tech or skills goes into putting out one of those fires? I heard they burn hot as hell and are suuuper vicious.
A heavy duty thermal bag. The burning phone is put inside and then the bag is sealed.
@@dabda8510 Suffocate it?
@@CMDRFandragon I don't think the goal is really to put out the fire, just contain it until they get on the ground. The bag is supposed to keep the intense heat inside from reaching the outside for long enough, and to be strong enough to contain a possible explosion. Sometimes they pour water in with the battery,. (Some of the heat then gets used up to heat the water and turn it into steam.) And I'm not sure anyone ever said the fire was out, I think they just said "contained". As in, safely inside a bag. But they still need to get on the ground ASAP and get the bag off the plane, since the bag might not be sufficient to keep the battery contained until it finally burns itself out. It just buys time.
Li fires cannot be put out with regular water or foam, and suffocation won't work either. You need a carbon dioxide estinguisher, or you can use pure carbon powder. Activated charcoal is almost pure carbon so that would probably work.
@@avgeek-and-fashion ... did you really just recommend using _charcoal_ to put out a *fire*
and if suffocation wont work, how will suffocating it with co2 work? or are you suggesting to using liquified co2 to freeze it?
It's an exothermic chemical reaction.
What’s with these controllers giving speed control on final to an emergency aircraft, ridiculous?
you're not on site, you don't know, so stop assuming you know everything! And I guess you missed the part whey they said the fire was contained.
@@malahammer Don’t need to be on site, heard it with my own ears, stupid call.
@@malahammer It’s an emergency status aircraft, did you hear the pilot say it was no longer an emergency? Do you have any experience in aviation?
@@180mph9I guess you don't either. What's wrong with 170 or greater? Airplane is on fire, so you know I'll be coming in fast.
@@TB-um1xz One of the things you learn over the years is you don’t get in a big rush.
Three words that can’t be spoken in the USA…MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY
So, so, so many of these videos have ATC needing to clarify with the crew if they’re trying to declare an emergency. This is unnecessary and avoidable by the unmistakable “MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY” like the rest of the world uses.
It’s not the USA…. It’s some of the pilots. They’re afraid to say it.
That is so silly....Mayday declarations are nonsense. EMERGENCY gets the point across.
@@cruisinguy6024 No. It is not the choice of words. It is the status of exactly how things will be handled. EMERGENCY works just fine and in fact...in America is preferred over nonsense words such as Pan Pan. There are NO INSTANCES where EMERGENCY was declared instead of Mayday resulting in a negative outcome. None.
@@luv2fly452 They have an aversion to EuroBrit nonsense words. EMERGENCY is the way to go Orville.
Both pilots on the radio? Who was PF and who was PNF?
They can switch off as needed in an emergency.
Danielle was the pilot flying, and Steve was the pilot monitoring. The reason you heard both talking was because the Captain (Danielle) was coordinating with the flight Attendants over the interphone, so Steve had to communicate with ATC.
Fire is the one word no air crew wants to hear. These tech gadget manufacturers need to make a safer battery. Forget saving weight and make a battery case than can contain a fire in the battery.
Then enjoy your IPAD with a battery life of 20 minutes.
@vulvacioustottie Where can we buy these "safe" batteries and what are they called and are they comparable to the performance of Lithium batteries. Thanks sparky.
The good news is they are working on safer batteries that don't use lithium! One of the ones I'm really looking forward to is the sodium ion battery, it's a lot less likely to combust under normal conditions than lithium is.
"Forget saving weight"
Yeah that'll go over well...
@@RLTtizME Never had an Apple gadget in my life and have no plans to. I have been quite satisfied with my Samsung phones going back to the S3 and currently have a Samsung Tablet.
I pray my husband never has to deal with this situation.
Can anyone tell me if they land over weight is it necessary to change aircraft? I know in this case there was interior damage so I’m sure they did!!
Yes. If formally landing overweight. The aircraft structure and brakes will need to be assessed before it can depart again. It’s very unlikely it’ll be back in circulation for a few days minimum unless the overweight landing is barely overweight.
@@OfficialSamuelC thank you!
@@OH-qi1od would the captain be required to evaluate the extent of the injury before making a decision on whether to dump fuel or land over weight or as soon as it’s determined there’s a injury it’s automatic?
@@OH-qi1od A 737 can't dump fuel.
@@OH-qi1od- 737 can’t dump fuel. It is not equipped to do so.
If they wanted to reduce weight to land they would have to fly a holding pattern until they burned off the fuel.
Where are the men?
> Denver
Well we know what they were blazing back there, eh
Pan pan, is that chynese take out??
PAN PAN is the phonetic spelling of "Panne Panne". "Panne" means "broken" in French, as in "Panne le moteur" (The motor is broken). MAYDAY is phonetic for the French "M'aidez", which means "Help me".
They always asking for souls onboard like they don't care if there are any ginger passengers. 😢
I imagine it's just a matter of time before lithium batteries are banned on commercial aircraft.
That's never going to happen, its like banning all smartphones, tablets and laptop. Even the pilots use like 2 to 4 tablets for maps tables in the deck
How about all the lithium batteries the carriers equip the crew with?
That's never going to happen.
@@df446 They'll be able to keep theirs with detailed protocols to be observed. But with so much trash batteries out there, it would be impossible to screen every passenger. The easy, simple solution is to simply ban passengers from having them. Certified phones and tablets would be exempted.
They should! I’m not flying again.
Man I can’t wait to see what happens when there are 100,000,000 electric vehicles on the road between fires and shutting down the power grid it should be a exciting. Insurance maybe a little high. A lithium car fire requires 60,000 gallons of water to put out.
60,000 gallons of water and hours to extinguish. Fire department tankers usually carry 1000 to 2500 gallons of water, where ( and if) they have them available. In contrast, a typical (non lithium) car fire takes less than 100 gallons to extinguish in a couple of minutes.
Thank god gasoline never explodes.
@@sallybrookner4158 It has nothing to do with the power grid, it is the battery technology and it's too frequent bursting into difficult to extinguish fires.. I have seen video of even iPhones bursting into flame. NYC has banned the charging of electric bicycles in apartment buildings, they have had numerous major fires and fatalities.
@@gerardmoran9560 It only does when under the correct air to fuel ratio, which just doesn't happen that often on fires. There's a reason slight problems on an engine make it run poorly.
Besides they are far easier to extinguish, meanwhile Li-Ion batteries are self oxidizing, they literally produce their own oxygen to keep burning, and their own heat to keep it going.
@@sallybrookner4158
Keep dreaming the maths are against this delusional idea ! There are simply NOT enough resources on this planet to do a 1:1 switch .
Best to create blue diesel and retrofit existing ICE cars !
So sick of people and their e-cigarettes. 100% that's what this was. My guess is it went thermal in their pocket. Seen this happen firsthand no less than nine times. These things are dangerous.
Please don't say "fifty" or "sixty" when in Pan-Pan or MAYDAY status. Talk by the book.
yawn....
@@malahammer If you are bored, then perhaps you should not be on here?
This is standard phraseology, it is said all day everyday in USA.
@@alextaviate Sure, but those syllables sound alike. It's not best practice.
Not a sterling performance by the crew..."OK" response to traffic call doesn't even give call sign acknowledging much less data / SWA663 carrier only calls mean pilot flustered wrong com switch position [losing his cool] / call, we WILL be declaring an emergency [BS] declare the emergency asshole / ATC ILS 35R = SWA663 "Thank You"..reback incorrect should acknowledge & confirm intended landing rwy / SWA pilot doesn't seem to know to give > 1) nature of emergency 2) souls on board 3) fuel on board in time NOT pounds... all in all just unprofessional and disorganized /
3:52 "do you know where the fire is at?"
Abysmal English, and unnecessary for getting the emergency aircraft safely to the field. Just adds distraction and comms workload. Fire service can determine this directly from the crew, once they land.
5:17 "equipment will be standing by for ya"
The crew already made that request, which was acknowledged, and therefore it should be considered done. Unnecessary/redundant comms.
The FAA HAS to do a better job training controllers in communications. Fire has potentially grave consequences. In all cases comms should be (a) non-conversational: clear and crisp using standard phraseology, (b) pertain to only what is absolutely necessary for the safe conduct of the flight, (c) non-redundant (coordinated between controllers and others), (d) properly managed with utmost consideration for crew workload.
I rate this one a C minus.
I think both of those comments are perfectly fine. The first one is important because it helps the ATC better understand what conditions to expect when the plane lands (and is vital information for the accident report in case the plane crashes before it gets back to the airport) - and the second one is just a reassurance for both the pilot *and* the ATC, who may be nervous about having an emergency. Nothing wrong with reassurances.
Neither of these comments burdened the pilots, and they were both related to the issue at hand.
Lighten up, Francis.
Your soliloquy is about as fun to read as a visit to the proctologist.
I think the moron is rather funny... all anal-retentive and all!
We give your comment a D+. Wordy. Presumptuous and officious. Unpleasant. Pedantic. Overtones of arrogance. Nit Picky. Cluck your way right out of this chat and try instead...criticizing your relatives over on Facebook. Cheers and bye bye now.