All Master Class Blueprints are available on FactorioBin Overview and direct links to all Blueprints: nilaus.atlassian.net/l/cp/HBEUm524 (Pastebin links no longer work)
How ironic, yesterday I was looking for a master class on modules, and I was surprised that I didn't find one, then today you just release it! You never fail to surprise us, thank you so much for keeping this series up :))
If you output along the bottom with the greens, you can bend it down a lane without a gap in assemblers. Then you can cross the blues underground (or have a one-tile gap) and avoid the extra two beacons. Also, if you're making efficiency modules you can put some in where you took out speed! lol
What about a recycling Class @Nilaus? I know you just throw down some chests and have bots put the stuff back in but I am wondering if I am doing it in the right way or if there's even better ways to do it in the first place.
10:19 This right here is why I don't think I will ever be "good" at this game. I would never think of this in a million years. Give me 7,000 lifetimes and this would never cross my mind. Not once. How do you think of things like this? Was it a group effort? A flash of inspiration? Divine intervention?
Like in other your builds, belts interleaving will decrease build cost by 2 beacons and 4 speed modules, and also takes less space (but this is not important for megabases)
I don't understand in what sense modules are essential. If I upgrade production by adding more machines, I get 1:1 ratio on energy and pollution per production. If I use modules, I get a worse ratio, like 1:1,3. The only reason to use modules would seem to be to save space?
Hi Nilaus, I'm a big fan. I watch all your videos and I've been subscribed for quite a long time. Although I've been the silent silent man, nothing to say. But I just wanted to ask you a question. I hate city blocks, I love order and neatness, but my particular kind of OCD means I love order in things that come natural. city blocks are far too forced and to me they don't seem like order in chaos. Can you do a video where you don't use city blocks and make a factory that is neat and tidy but looks natural to the make? Thanks for reading my comment, love your videos :)
Can we get a masterclass on train station designs? I really like your loopy deathworld blueprint and am wondering what you do when you need multiple inputs to arrive at the same station.
Because it's starting out right next to the assemblers, you'd need to go up first so you have room for an underground, and even without that issue, you need every single tile on the top side to fit the red circuit inputs and the outputs. His solution leaves the top side clear.
You could output all the modules on the bottom side, they all end up on one side, so the other side of the belt can already be filled with blue circuits. That way, you don't need to switch sides between Mk1 and Mk2
@@tejing2001 I think you're misunderstanding maybe. I believe Hedning's solution is to just side load an underground exactly how the Mk2's are loaded above their respective machines. It leaves the above space clear for red circuits and no regular up or down belt routing. Just side load the underground, go under the machine and then mix with the blue circuits. Or I misunderstood your comment and then I just wasted a lot of time.. either way. No harm, just trying to help. Edit: Spent obscene amount of time making awful illustration with keyboard... (Red Chip Belt) ----> (Mk2)----->\ / | | | |
@@Jay-fy4zy I hadn't considered that option. I'm not sure whether it's what the OP was suggesting, but let's give that the benefit of the doubt. However, my point still stands about the mk3 machines' outputs and red circuit inputs requiring every tile of space. That underground would take up the tile needed for the inserter putting red circuits into the first machine.
@@tejing2001 My point was that getting the mk2 modules to the other side was not impossible, but easy. Since the introduction of filters on the splitter people have forgotten how powerful undergrounds are. It's a tool that is very good to have in your toolbox. Of course you can't continue exactly like he did if you are using that tile, but nothing says you have to. I would continue the row with weaving, and probably save 2 beacons including that other gap, but you can do it with just blue undergrounds as well. For example like this: i.imgur.com/6XznFHO.png It might not always be possible to move an underground exit like he did here. That should not force you to trash the entire design because you don't know how to use undergrounds.
Next up... LTN!!! Would love to know how to monitor inventory and govern LTN on the same network, as all use the city block power pole layout. Trying to build your dashboard idea. Also trying to run a main power breaker where I can manually turn on and off each section of the city grid.
@@MaxMustermann-om2ji it's no problem monitoring the network when it's only LTN on the network. I would like a system where LTN doesn't interfere with inventory levels if both networks are on the same grid. That, and a dashboard that not only displays the total inventory, but also shows how active the LTN is for each item, and a power station that can turn off each individual city block once capacity is reached.
So how many city blocks worth of his MC green circuit build do you need to start with to get all the stuff for reds, and blues, and this build to provide one city block worth of module production? Problem for a rainy weekend.
Don't know about city blocks, but you need about 48 fully beaconed and moduled red circuit assemblers, 18 green and 14 blue to supply one of those rows.
Personally, I prefer making my first module setup without them. Space isn't a huge issue at that point in the game, and I don't like having to wait so long to get the ball rolling. Alternatively you could place the modules after they're made, like Jake suggests, and kill time by improving energy output, which you'll definitely need when you start using beacons, and clearing land for later use.
Nitpick: you missed the opportunity to fill the empty module slots with efficiency modules, and downgrade the sections of belt that don't need to be blue.
Maybe the question was already asked but is it worth it to replace some speed modules by productivity and to scale the input to it ? You will have a longer lane but maybe it's more efficient ?
So I have often wondered at what point modules actually make sense. Because Factorio has unlimited space you could just build infinite copies, gather infinite resources, and never need modules. Plus there is the non-trivial cost of the modules themselves. For something like early Koverex and Science they are so resource intensive it makes sense to have some modules to reduce the material demand of the system. But at the level of green circuits how cost effective is it to have a 8 beacon setup or does it just save space and FPS?
Yeah, I feel the same. Belts and inserters and assemblers are so much cheaper and faster to produce than beacons and modules that building more seems like the cheaper option. Eventually UPS might be an issue and if you have artificially constrained your space for some reason beacons/modules might be a way to push up throughput in the limited space available. But just using this example in the video tripling the amount of machines would have been a much easier and quicker way of using a full belt of reds. Ratio of 10/5/2 only producing 1/3rd of what you need? Build 30/15/6 assemblers.
Productivity modules drastically decrease the amount of total resources that have to be consumed. For a given science per minute, you need like 1/3 as many green circuits if you use prod3 modules. This decreases the logistical overhead and allows simpler designs.
That only applies to prod modules. But the same can't be said about speed modules and beacons, which is what this video is all about. In fact they INCREASE the total amount of resources needed because building those modules is very expensive. The only reason to ever use them is in very niche situations or if your UPS can't keep up anymore.
@@MrGlugz If your machines are running slower, you're just going to need more productivity modules anyway. Speed modules increase speed, and productivity modules in a faster machine are doing more work than they would in regular speed machines. Plus, even if space isn't an issue, it's easier to work out logistics in a smaller factory, not to mention fixing mistakes, getting from one production block to another faster, etc. Anyone who thinks modules aren't useful or are for niche situations, I implore you to look up a calculator and mess around with it. Just for quick reference, you can make 45 red circuits per second using 360 smelters for copper, or just 20. You can put them (copper plates) on 5 belts, or just 3. You can make 25 assemblers for the finish product, or you can make 216. So yeah, look at the numbers before you decide you'd rather use all that space. Because it's a loooot of space just for a single blue belt of red circuits. Try getting 1000 SPM with a setup like that. As for which uses more resources, that same red circuit setup I use 13,500 copper per minute, you use just under 16,000. That's 150k per hour more. That's enough copper for 75 modules right there. The more hours you play, the better it gets. And I didn't even factor in the insane amount of drills, smelters, belts, and inserters you have to make. And that's just a single belt of one item, I need just under 3 belts of red circuits for 1000 SPM. You'd need 5 belts.
Why not just build more assemblers? It's considerably cheaper than adding speed modules, both in power and resources, and I don't see why the savings in space are so significant. I understand the use of them in conjunction with productivity modules, where a single assembler effectively costs an assembler plus four lvl 3 modules, making it cheaper to use beacons than more assemblers.
@@Nilaus I didn't make a single argument against them, I made an argument supporting them. I'm asking what's the point of putting speed modules in assemblers.
@@jozefuhasis1338 The reason to keep the number of assemblers low is to also keep the amount of unsaturated belts (and overall "entities") at a minimum. When you're transitioning towards a mega base, or you're already running a smaller mega base at 2,000 or such science per minute, the resources you require to build something, just anything in the game matters less and less as you keep ramping up - meanwhile, the resources your computer will have available to process everything will become more and more precious. Unsaturated belts and liquid mechanics are a significant contributor to how many calculations per second the game needs to make in order to function - and most importantly function at 60 updates (and therefore 60 frames) per second, if possible. It's for that reason that you want any setup you run in the late game to be as "belt efficient" as possible, even if the amount of in-game resources it requires to accomplish this might seem out of place on a cursory glance, assuming your point of view is that you're looking at it in terms of in-game resources spent to output generated...
@@nineinchheels2041 I've asking this question for years. I've seen this seemingly completely nonsenical thing in so many bases. Didn't matter how big or how small, it was there. Finally, after years, I actually got a proper answer. I stand corrected, but I wasn't wrong completely, as even the bases that have no hope of becoming megabases use this.
@@E-102_Gamma Not those two I was talking about the substation on its left but You are right he didnt forget i just got confused because he put the inserters beside the underground instead on it like he did for the other ones
All Master Class Blueprints are available on FactorioBin
Overview and direct links to all Blueprints: nilaus.atlassian.net/l/cp/HBEUm524
(Pastebin links no longer work)
Interesting blueprint at 2:04
you have a good eye
lol hashashasdhshaHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHa
ASSKEYART lol
Clever Girl
this is tyler durden style shit
I genuinly love how his own words confuse him sometimes. Not an insult at all, I think it's very funny
red belt, blue belt, belt, lane... whatever. ;)
12:23 "Hey! Symetry is important." - Love it 💜
0:00 Introduction
0:52 Proper Ratios
9:07 Patreon
9:36 The Design
19:15 Conclusion
How ironic, yesterday I was looking for a master class on modules, and I was surprised that I didn't find one, then today you just release it!
You never fail to surprise us, thank you so much for keeping this series up :))
Good timing. I'm building my first mega-base and I just reached the stage where I need to ramp up module production.
Nice build. I like the driven-by-input-belt-speed of most-used resource. Cool!
My friend who didn't play Factorio asked me, what this video about?
Me: Modular Factory Module produces modules
The factory must grow!
*W I D E E X P A N S I O N (Crack boice)*
The very thing I was waiting for
Building my first city blocks last night, and was wondering how to do modules effectively
Fantastic! Thanks for the build, I love how dense and scalable it is
If you output along the bottom with the greens, you can bend it down a lane without a gap in assemblers. Then you can cross the blues underground (or have a one-tile gap) and avoid the extra two beacons.
Also, if you're making efficiency modules you can put some in where you took out speed! lol
What about a recycling Class @Nilaus? I know you just throw down some chests and have bots put the stuff back in but I am wondering if I am doing it in the right way or if there's even better ways to do it in the first place.
18:29 when can we get a masterclass on that one?
Thanks I tried building my own but this tops it on several levels thanks!!
Love the factorio content, the best on RUclips! I always love seeing your Notifications appear with new Factorio videos!!❤️💯💯💯💯
10:19 This right here is why I don't think I will ever be "good" at this game. I would never think of this in a million years. Give me 7,000 lifetimes and this would never cross my mind. Not once. How do you think of things like this? Was it a group effort? A flash of inspiration? Divine intervention?
1:10 one thing, and only ONE thing: UPS
Very informative and very helpful. Thank you for making this!!
Like in other your builds, belts interleaving will decrease build cost by 2 beacons and 4 speed modules, and also takes less space (but this is not important for megabases)
I really like it! Now I gotta get my red cirucit game together!
Another Great Master Class. Thanks for sharing
loving the mega base masterclasses lately!
I think it should be possible to squeeze yellow logistics boxes for mk1 and mk2 in the layout. So you can automatically recycle old modules
Another amazing build with a few great tricks. Nicely done N!
I don't understand in what sense modules are essential. If I upgrade production by adding more machines, I get 1:1 ratio on energy and pollution per production. If I use modules, I get a worse ratio, like 1:1,3. The only reason to use modules would seem to be to save space?
Hi Nilaus, I'm a big fan. I watch all your videos and I've been subscribed for quite a long time. Although I've been the silent silent man, nothing to say. But I just wanted to ask you a question. I hate city blocks, I love order and neatness, but my particular kind of OCD means I love order in things that come natural. city blocks are far too forced and to me they don't seem like order in chaos. Can you do a video where you don't use city blocks and make a factory that is neat and tidy but looks natural to the make? Thanks for reading my comment, love your videos :)
Love it, thanks. I still want a master class on LTN, though. ;)
Can we get a masterclass on train station designs? I really like your loopy deathworld blueprint and am wondering what you do when you need multiple inputs to arrive at the same station.
13:44 That is actually very simple, instead of curving the belt down just take the underground straight under the assembler.
Because it's starting out right next to the assemblers, you'd need to go up first so you have room for an underground, and even without that issue, you need every single tile on the top side to fit the red circuit inputs and the outputs. His solution leaves the top side clear.
You could output all the modules on the bottom side, they all end up on one side, so the other side of the belt can already be filled with blue circuits. That way, you don't need to switch sides between Mk1 and Mk2
@@tejing2001 I think you're misunderstanding maybe. I believe Hedning's solution is to just side load an underground exactly how the Mk2's are loaded above their respective machines. It leaves the above space clear for red circuits and no regular up or down belt routing. Just side load the underground, go under the machine and then mix with the blue circuits. Or I misunderstood your comment and then I just wasted a lot of time.. either way. No harm, just trying to help.
Edit: Spent obscene amount of time making awful illustration with keyboard...
(Red Chip Belt) ---->
(Mk2)----->\ / | |
| |
@@Jay-fy4zy I hadn't considered that option. I'm not sure whether it's what the OP was suggesting, but let's give that the benefit of the doubt. However, my point still stands about the mk3 machines' outputs and red circuit inputs requiring every tile of space. That underground would take up the tile needed for the inserter putting red circuits into the first machine.
@@tejing2001 My point was that getting the mk2 modules to the other side was not impossible, but easy. Since the introduction of filters on the splitter people have forgotten how powerful undergrounds are. It's a tool that is very good to have in your toolbox.
Of course you can't continue exactly like he did if you are using that tile, but nothing says you have to. I would continue the row with weaving, and probably save 2 beacons including that other gap, but you can do it with just blue undergrounds as well. For example like this: i.imgur.com/6XznFHO.png
It might not always be possible to move an underground exit like he did here. That should not force you to trash the entire design because you don't know how to use undergrounds.
What are those purple underground belts where things just come out of and go into like magic?
Next up... LTN!!! Would love to know how to monitor inventory and govern LTN on the same network, as all use the city block power pole layout. Trying to build your dashboard idea. Also trying to run a main power breaker where I can manually turn on and off each section of the city grid.
To Monitor your LTN inventory you can use the LTN Monitor mod
@@MaxMustermann-om2ji it's no problem monitoring the network when it's only LTN on the network. I would like a system where LTN doesn't interfere with inventory levels if both networks are on the same grid. That, and a dashboard that not only displays the total inventory, but also shows how active the LTN is for each item, and a power station that can turn off each individual city block once capacity is reached.
Thankfully when 1.1 comes out LTN will be a thing of the past
@@winkbrace for real?!? I've been out of the loop in Factorio. Only updated from 0.16 a week or two ago.
@@cfworthy It's being explained here factorio.com/blog/post/fff-361
Did not ask, but was (also) waiting for this
Nice layout
So how many city blocks worth of his MC green circuit build do you need to start with to get all the stuff for reds, and blues, and this build to provide one city block worth of module production? Problem for a rainy weekend.
Don't know about city blocks, but you need about 48 fully beaconed and moduled red circuit assemblers, 18 green and 14 blue to supply one of those rows.
Great, to make to lots of modules you need to lots of modules in the first place
Just build the blueprint and as it makes the modules put them in to speed it up
Personally, I prefer making my first module setup without them. Space isn't a huge issue at that point in the game, and I don't like having to wait so long to get the ball rolling.
Alternatively you could place the modules after they're made, like Jake suggests, and kill time by improving energy output, which you'll definitely need when you start using beacons, and clearing land for later use.
Modules should be used first in the production of advanced circuits, as that will be your bottleneck for module builds, especially this one.
Nitpick: you missed the opportunity to fill the empty module slots with efficiency modules, and downgrade the sections of belt that don't need to be blue.
Nilaus, Pastebin removed the blueprint :( - as being harmful, is it possible to reupload it ?
Well done you!
Maybe the question was already asked but is it worth it to replace some speed modules by productivity and to scale the input to it ? You will have a longer lane but maybe it's more efficient ?
You can't use Productivity Modules on Module production
Useful.. thanks
Thanks for the video! I tried accessing the blueprint but it says it was taken down. Is this happening for everyone else as well?
So I have often wondered at what point modules actually make sense. Because Factorio has unlimited space you could just build infinite copies, gather infinite resources, and never need modules. Plus there is the non-trivial cost of the modules themselves. For something like early Koverex and Science they are so resource intensive it makes sense to have some modules to reduce the material demand of the system. But at the level of green circuits how cost effective is it to have a 8 beacon setup or does it just save space and FPS?
Yeah, I feel the same. Belts and inserters and assemblers are so much cheaper and faster to produce than beacons and modules that building more seems like the cheaper option. Eventually UPS might be an issue and if you have artificially constrained your space for some reason beacons/modules might be a way to push up throughput in the limited space available. But just using this example in the video tripling the amount of machines would have been a much easier and quicker way of using a full belt of reds. Ratio of 10/5/2 only producing 1/3rd of what you need? Build 30/15/6 assemblers.
Productivity modules drastically decrease the amount of total resources that have to be consumed. For a given science per minute, you need like 1/3 as many green circuits if you use prod3 modules. This decreases the logistical overhead and allows simpler designs.
That only applies to prod modules. But the same can't be said about speed modules and beacons, which is what this video is all about. In fact they INCREASE the total amount of resources needed because building those modules is very expensive. The only reason to ever use them is in very niche situations or if your UPS can't keep up anymore.
@@MrGlugz
If your machines are running slower, you're just going to need more productivity modules anyway. Speed modules increase speed, and productivity modules in a faster machine are doing more work than they would in regular speed machines.
Plus, even if space isn't an issue, it's easier to work out logistics in a smaller factory, not to mention fixing mistakes, getting from one production block to another faster, etc.
Anyone who thinks modules aren't useful or are for niche situations, I implore you to look up a calculator and mess around with it. Just for quick reference, you can make 45 red circuits per second using 360 smelters for copper, or just 20. You can put them (copper plates) on 5 belts, or just 3. You can make 25 assemblers for the finish product, or you can make 216. So yeah, look at the numbers before you decide you'd rather use all that space. Because it's a loooot of space just for a single blue belt of red circuits. Try getting 1000 SPM with a setup like that.
As for which uses more resources, that same red circuit setup I use 13,500 copper per minute, you use just under 16,000. That's 150k per hour more. That's enough copper for 75 modules right there. The more hours you play, the better it gets. And I didn't even factor in the insane amount of drills, smelters, belts, and inserters you have to make. And that's just a single belt of one item, I need just under 3 belts of red circuits for 1000 SPM. You'd need 5 belts.
13:46 You can't use an underground belt?
Blueprint didn't work for me will try again tomorrow though
I always have problems producing enough red circuits to feed stuff like this.
same.. reds take up so much space in my base good thing there's a master class on that too!
Why not just build more assemblers? It's considerably cheaper than adding speed modules, both in power and resources, and I don't see why the savings in space are so significant. I understand the use of them in conjunction with productivity modules, where a single assembler effectively costs an assembler plus four lvl 3 modules, making it cheaper to use beacons than more assemblers.
Free stuff from Productivity modules beat any of your arguments
@@Nilaus I didn't make a single argument against them, I made an argument supporting them. I'm asking what's the point of putting speed modules in assemblers.
@@jozefuhasis1338 The reason to keep the number of assemblers low is to also keep the amount of unsaturated belts (and overall "entities") at a minimum.
When you're transitioning towards a mega base, or you're already running a smaller mega base at 2,000 or such science per minute, the resources you require to build something, just anything in the game matters less and less as you keep ramping up - meanwhile, the resources your computer will have available to process everything will become more and more precious.
Unsaturated belts and liquid mechanics are a significant contributor to how many calculations per second the game needs to make in order to function - and most importantly function at 60 updates (and therefore 60 frames) per second, if possible.
It's for that reason that you want any setup you run in the late game to be as "belt efficient" as possible, even if the amount of in-game resources it requires to accomplish this might seem out of place on a cursory glance, assuming your point of view is that you're looking at it in terms of in-game resources spent to output generated...
@@nineinchheels2041 I've asking this question for years. I've seen this seemingly completely nonsenical thing in so many bases. Didn't matter how big or how small, it was there. Finally, after years, I actually got a proper answer. I stand corrected, but I wasn't wrong completely, as even the bases that have no hope of becoming megabases use this.
using beacons is not more efficient than not for power consumption, but it does use less space.
just use bots especially for complex luxary products like modules
Ola! ☝🏼
But you've built it horizontally! What a disgrace! For real, slightly annoying, but love the build, great job!
Yay me!!! LOL
WTF? we are supposed toi launch "hundreds" of rockets BEFORE the megabase??? how the fuck are we supposed to do that ?
I was just wondering what each module did and when to use them... this is completely not what I wanted.
Any excuses doing it experimental like this instead of wasting 5 mins doing some calculations to figure out perfect ratio?
dude is super confusing. He even gets confused
You forgot to add inserters at 16:45 when you were adding the substation
He didn't, though?
@@E-102_Gamma Yeah 2 inserters going into the undergrounds
@@nanomat920 16:51 These two?
@@E-102_Gamma Not those two I was talking about the substation on its left but You are right he didnt forget i just got confused because he put the inserters beside the underground instead on it like he did for the other ones
Wow... 3rd viewer, noice!!!