100 years ago only the rich had cars and the poor rode horses , now everyone has a car and only the rich can afford to keep a horse ...... How the stables have changed
One of the most memorable lines from Lonesome Dove was when someone said there were 10000 Comanche braves was something like” if there were that many Comanche they would ob been ripping up the streets of Washington DC and no one could stop them”
"not exactly graceful people" "short" "bow legged" Sounds in keeping with huns and mongols so exactly what you would expect makes a culture of great riders
Yeah, it seems that they evolved a perfect physique for riding. Almost as if they were designed with the knowledge that horses would show up to complement them.
By horse technology they mean how to make stirrups, saddles and other horse-related equipment. And also the techniques for how to break in a horse and train them for riding.
So are they saying natives wouldn’t go into battle riding on horses pre Cortez or whenever the Europeans re-Introduced them to the americas? I totally understand the tech of breaking a horse in but why would a saddle be so valuable? I’m a dumb city kid that’s never caught a fish, fired a gun, rode a horse or gone camping so bare with me please.
@@pat442389 I used to ride horses alot when I was younger and I've done it a few times without a saddle and it's a very different experience. It is definately possible to ride without it but it's much harder to remain seated on the horse without falling off (especially if you're in battle I would assume). It's also harder to steer the horse. Doing battle without the proper equipment on the horse would just be very ineffective and it would probably be a waste of healthy horses which would have been very valueable. Even the Vikings who had such equipment for their horses would rarely use their horses in combat because they didnt want their very valuable animals to die in combat. This is why Knights even made plate armor for their warhorses in the medieval age. People throughout history put alot of effort in to making horses as effective as possible for warfare.
@@DonArques Yeah i get that but i was thinking people of that age would be more used to "roughing it" and dealing with the pain that riding a horse without a saddle would bring because they knew nothing else. Like i cant miss air conditioning if ive never seen it or be inside a room with it. do you know what i mean? i wish this guy went into more detail.... maybe he does in the full episode. Im sure the european horses would have been trained better for war though. but the namidian / nubian horse archers of northern africa were incredible more than 1,000 years before this ( i realize they never came into contact with native americans). i guess im just surprised that the natives werent already experts with their horses. thanks for the answer though. im sure a saddle makes it much more sturdy, lets you ride for longer distances and helps you stay on the horse during battles.
@@pat442389 Sure you can "rough it", but no matter how good you are at riding you are still at a massive disadvantage compared to someone who has the right equipment. You cant compare it to not being used to having airconditioning. You can probably ride a bike without using your hands too, but making turns is going to be harder and it's also going to be more work for your legs. Remember that the Native Americans first saw horses in the 15th century when they were brought over by the Spanish - they only had a few generations to learn how to use horses, and despite that very short time they did it anyway. The Spanish saw this rapid progression and didnt want the Natives to get their hands on their "horse technology". It's comparable to WW2 in a way; the Germans had the best tanks in the early war but the soviets drew inspiration and technology from the panther tanks of the germans and developed the T-34 tank. After that they had evened the odds and could fight the Germans most powerful tanks. Horses evolved in america yes, but they went extinct by a combination of climate change and overhunting by ice-age humans. Some horses managed to migrate over the landbridge into Asia - where they have spread all over the place and eventually were domesticated by humans - it was those horses that the spanish "brought back" to america in the 15th century.
@@DonArques I use to ride bare back, from my experience your relying on the horse to do the steering and speed adjustment. Mind you I only ever rode with one horse, and had a great relationship with him.
Im still waiting for trump to pay that mil to charity... he blew her just mentioning she had native american in her blood as a throw away up and said if she proved it with dna hed pay a mil to charity, she proved it and he just ignored it lmao
@@alwaysplay13 How funny is that?!!!!She proved she’s 1/1034th Native American.....less than the typical American. Yet, she still got a position at Harvard based on her “minority” status. How that insane, ignorant, hateful woman hasn’t been run out of the country on a rail is beyond me. She’s the WORST kind of person I can imagine.
Lol. He compared Spartans with Comanches. No serious historian would ever do that. He says that the Spaniards didn’t want the technology to get out to the native tribes of Mexico. 😂😂😂 come on now. It’s just bivouac he know squad about Mexican topography.
It's very simple how the Indians adopted horse technology, they would capture Spanish and Mexican youngsters in Texas and Mexico who would teach them about European technologies like horsemanship and guns. Many early American settlers were startled to find many Commanches and other tribes were very fluent in Spanish. They were Mexican and Spanish kids adopted by the tribe. Look up the story of Quanah Parker.
Adopted? They where kidnapped. The Comanches and Apaches always did raids and attacks against northen Mexicans settlers mostly white immigrants Europeans (northen Mexico was forbidden to indigenous mexicans and non Catholic citizens).
Look up Hees Hoos Sanchees, he was a Mexican captive raised as a Comanche and noted Warrior. His picture is at the the Smithsonian in Washington DC, it was painted by George Catlin in the 1830's
From what I have read about the Comanche they seemed more analogous to the Mongolian horseman than to Spartans. The Spartans weren't nomadic and had slaves that tended farms for them. The Comanche and Mongolians were both nomadic, both expert horse riders, and both by all accounts excelled beyond belief with their bows.
@@jonboy9734, didn't know that. But I brought up the slaves part only because the Spartans only trained in their land warfare skills, but needed to eat, so they left the farming to slaves. My point was that the Spartans were not a nomadic people.
@@jonboy9734 the Comanche actually did use their land later to cropshare because they didn't want to farm but had the land. Even after the nomadic times
It wasn't until the Pueblo Revolt (Pope's Rebellion) of 1680 near Santa Fe that the horse came into significant use and influence among the Plains Indians changing their way of life for ever. It would be fascinating to learn how the Comanche became such skilled horseman.
Yeah its actually draining to read the comments and see a Joe" " Rogan meme every other comment. And then you find an actually positive comment and a troll turns it into a comment war
I had the privilege of learning about the Navajos when I worked in New Mexico for a while. But, I don't remember them talking about horses except as a source of food.
Another native group people should look up is the chichimeca natives, the word closes means savage but it as widely recognized that these people were related to the Aztec, these people came from the cities that the mexica created as the travelled south to central Mexico. When they were some of the first natives to use horse against Spanish, fought a war for almost 40 years against them and their natives allies.
Important to remember that horses were tools of military dominance in the Old World. To keep a horse in Europe, where all land was owned and parceled was prohibitively expensive and thus was a tool and symbol of the aristocracy. Some common Europeans could afford a mule or an ass but not a horse you would ride in battle.
“The Comanche were a bow legged, short, unimpressive people compared to other tribes.” So they became a horse people because it was their only chance to have power.
This probably is true. When at war and pressured people will do whatever they need to survive. They saw this resource, understood the power of it, and as a people strove to control it to great effect.
Unless you just pay to have a horse in some stable and someone else takes care of it while you come by every once in a while and give it a carrot and pat it while you pretend the horse gives two shits about you, owning horses and taking care of them is a huge amount of work. I've had girlfriends with them, they are beautiful animals but at the same time they scare the shit out of me.
What people need to realise is that the native Americans/first nation people were literally living in the stone age by the time Europeans arrived. Think about that. All of the history based around the development of technology that defined the growth and eventual dominance of Europeans completely passed the native Americans by. No guns or gunpowder, no swords, no shields, no armour, no battle formations, no sturctured military, no ships, no compasses, no 'horse technology' (first time hearing it put like that but it'll suffice) no astronomy, no written word, not even the wheel... What they had was a magnificent culture, far beyond any Europeans as far as spirituality goes, and is one that I admire but in essence, all they had were wall paintings and stories passed down by their elders. The poor bastards never stood a chance. .
In reality there wasn’t that much of a disparity. The Spanish had a hard time fighting the natives, and some people say that it was only the germs that brought them out on top.
@@kevinclass2010 Modern Hungarians are only in small parts descendents of the Uralic Magyars. Most of their ancestors are the conquered people who lived there all along.
Most folks have this idea north America was this vast sparsely populated continent. Actually the western hemisphere was populated by millions of indigenous people. Before the pilgrims arrived Portuguese fisherman introduced diseases that killed thousands in New England. It only got worse within 10 years 90% of the indigenous population was dead!
This is like playing Civilisation. I always forget to do the horse riding technology and end up doing it in the Renaissance or something, alongside muskets.
It would have only taken one ' horse whisper' to start a major movement. One man with courage, discipline, and teaching skills who could have broken horses, learned to ride well, and then taught thee skills to others. Often, n history, one man, or a small group, redirects evolution. Still true today.
If I was on an alien continent surrounded by a civilization that made theatre out of seperating people from their beating hearts I would not share the secrets of my get-away vehicle.
The natural horse was originally much smaller. Too small to ride. But the Indo-Europeans were clever, and used chariots. After centuries of selective breeding, they got bigger and stronger... Horses are like bio-technology. :)
saw a documentary on the Mustangs from there is a quote i like, "the combination of the plains Indian and the mustang was a recipe for the greatest light cavalry the world had ever seen"
@john connolly A medieval templar and muslim saracen did not have access to rifles... i also said light Cavalry, light cavalry and heavy cavalry function differently and server different purposes.
@john connolly yes they were, the horse wasn't always but the rider most defiantly was. and again I'm talking about a time period where guns are the primary weapon.
Just to be clear the Horse technology they are talking about is the training techniques that infused the rider and Horse into one unit making it almost invincible compared to the troops on foot and that's where they get 'The Centaur' from. Greeks, Spanish, English, Arabs they all had this technology until machines were invented, now it's all games and Equestrian sports.
Horses arrive to north america with spanish soldiers named Dragrones de Cuera, these soldier had comercial relations with some indians and taugth them how to handle and take care of horses, when soldiers die in combat or some Horses scape, the reproduced and that was the new breed named mesteño/mustang, originaly andaludians horses. First time an Apache saw a Pale Face was a spanish. For futher information read the book BANDERAS LEJANAS that contains all the maps, laws and documents of that era.
0:53 Paleo Indians didn't use the indigenous North American horses because they were much smaller than the modern horses that Europeans re-introduced. However, I've not been in the recent archaeological literature for a while so, while my prior experience tells me horses were not utilized (prior to the pleistocene extinctions) as they were after the Spanish brought them, it's not difinitive that Paleo Indians couldn't have and that artifacts haven't yet been found or haven't been preserved to be found. Basically, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Further, Paleoindians had well developed spear and atlatl technology and skills to hunt the pleistocene mega fauna: mammoths, mastodons, ancient bison (B. antiquus), etc. Thus, the utilization of horses likely wouldn't have given the advantage that it later with European horses.
The issue with that is not everything he says or talks about has anything to do with a topic or he’s inaccurate so the teacher would need to correct his mistakes constantly
I was somewhat kidding. But I agree with your point. The issue is the textbooks we have in most history classes are filled with propaganda and not the actual truth. There are literally hundreds of examples of this, especially with US history.
Yeah like the statement the comanches were the best at riding horses as if knights who trained their whole lifes on horseback would obliterate them with the power of stirrups and lance or longsword, as well as not even mentioning the huns and mongols.
We Blackfoot were a warring culture too. We harried many other tribes both because we could and because the last great herds of bison (not Buffalo Joe, no Buffalo in the Americas, only Africa and Indonesia, although I would argue the steppe Bison were actually a type of Buffalo, not really a bison) congregated in our territory in Montana and Alberta Canada. We became a bison culture and to protect it and hoard it, became a very warring nation. Other tribes feared us and rightly so, they were all afraid at some level to come to our lands and try to harvest Bison for themselves!
"The Comanche Empire" which is an excellent book was written two years before S.C. Gwynne's book on them. I've noticed a trend where authors have a tendency to pick up on a trend and not give credit to those who started it. I definitely noticed that with Nassim Taleb; he's created a whole genre and many are copying him without giving due to where these ideas came from.
Writing a book about a certain group of people is not a trend or being a copycat. It’s actually better to have a lot of perspectives in a field of study, especially history, to allow for alternate interpretations and peer review
@@bobsherman904 yeah people that don’t read as much as others maybe don’t realize that all these books usually have wildly different interpretations of the history presented
@@healthymealthy775 credit for what? He didn’t use any info from that other book, he wrote his own on the same topic. Even if that book inspired him to write his own, which may not even be true, the original doesn’t deserve any credit if this dudes book didn’t use anything from it. The first guy doesn’t own the topic of “Comanches”
Horses were indeed re-introduced by the Spanish. But, as is said horses evolved into it's current form in the Americas as did the cameloids (camels, llamas, alpacas etc.) they came from Asia via Beringia and after evolving they migrated back to Asia or to South-America or both. Then they died out for unknown reasons in North-and Central-America. Interesting fact, the die of by many megafauna ( big mammals like mammoth) coincided with human arrival and climate change at the end of second last ice age 50.000 years ago. The last of that megafauna other then what's considered big now died of 12.800 til 11.800 years (see JRE with Graham Hancock).
What is this guy talking about? "...they (the comanche) are a more stripped down culture that looked like Sparta." What part of Sparta was stripped down? The highly hierarchical social life? The diplomatic powerhouse that Sparta was? The high arts like Theater, poetry, pottery, metallurgy, astronomy that were practiced in Sparta? The, in their age, highly efficient "constitution", the so called rhetra. The most efficient propaganda mashine in their time? This guy clearly don't know what he is talking about!
Yeah, I'm not really sure what he is talking about here either. There is really no comparison at all between the two societies. He might know alot about the commanche but he doesn't seem to know shit about Sparta.
did the natives not have any of that, or are you just buying the white narrative that the natives were "savages"? youre over here acting like poetry, pottery, art, and a social hierarchy didnt exist among the natives lol PS "savages" is pretty ironic term, especially coming from europeans and their incredibly long history with war and suffering, huh? LMAO
@@zappbrannigan8352 I tackled his stupid argument that the two cultures ,like he said, are "stripped down" from my point of expertise. I'm not an expert of native culture, so it's difficult for me to say something about that. But I'm a scholar of grecko-roman history and I can say for sure there is nothing stripped down in spartan culture. Obviously he is buying in a philosophy of prejudice and stupidity to sell his book. I called him out as the grifter that he is. On the other hand you should stop scolding other people for the assumtions you are producing through your own prejudice. I would advise better read a second and third time and think about what was written instead of making a fool out of yourself by attacking allies. PS: I never wrote anything about "savages". You brought up this term and that says a hole lot about you.
Okay, he's not saying sparta was stripped down, but that comanche society was. Sparta was a military centric society with all the arts and science you mention. His point is the comanche society was also military centric, but less developed science and arts, aka, stripped down--as expected of a society closer to stone age than bronze age.
The Spanish did recruited Native American tribesmen in their cavalry elite, "Soldado De Cuera", who showed loyalty to Spain, at the time. These are some of these Natives became excellent horsemen in Spanish-owned ranches. These "Soldados De Cuera" were effective in protecting towns, hacienda ranches, roads, and borders of tbe upper North American frontier from criminals, aggressive Native attacks, and foreign invaders.
Joe is right that the oldest horse fossils have been found in North America, but I am pretty sure they were way different from modern horses. His guest is a goober for referring to Indians in Mexico and in North America because Mexico and all those little countries south of it are part of North America.
He's referring to it like that so you can understand where SPECIFICALLY he's talking about. Being nondescript of the region doesn't help paint the picture of what area he's referring to.
100 years ago only the rich had cars and the poor rode horses , now everyone has a car and only the rich can afford to keep a horse ...... How the stables have changed
How the turn stables
Poor people walked bro they never had horses lol
And lobster was considered to be a food for the lower classes.
Lol well played sir
Horses r just awesome
One of the most memorable lines from Lonesome Dove was when someone said there were 10000 Comanche braves was something like” if there were that many Comanche they would ob been ripping up the streets of Washington DC and no one could stop them”
"not exactly graceful people" "short" "bow legged"
Sounds in keeping with huns and mongols so exactly what you would expect makes a culture of great riders
@Marten Dekker he’s saying that’s how they looked before they had horses
they were huns and mongols thats the secret
@Marten Dekker that literally makes no sense
Yeah, it seems that they evolved a perfect physique for riding. Almost as if they were designed with the knowledge that horses would show up to complement them.
@@RogueReplicant Did Ye, aye?
By horse technology they mean how to make stirrups, saddles and other horse-related equipment. And also the techniques for how to break in a horse and train them for riding.
So are they saying natives wouldn’t go into battle riding on horses pre Cortez or whenever the Europeans re-Introduced them to the americas? I totally understand the tech of breaking a horse in but why would a saddle be so valuable? I’m a dumb city kid that’s never caught a fish, fired a gun, rode a horse or gone camping so bare with me please.
@@pat442389 I used to ride horses alot when I was younger and I've done it a few times without a saddle and it's a very different experience. It is definately possible to ride without it but it's much harder to remain seated on the horse without falling off (especially if you're in battle I would assume). It's also harder to steer the horse. Doing battle without the proper equipment on the horse would just be very ineffective and it would probably be a waste of healthy horses which would have been very valueable.
Even the Vikings who had such equipment for their horses would rarely use their horses in combat because they didnt want their very valuable animals to die in combat. This is why Knights even made plate armor for their warhorses in the medieval age. People throughout history put alot of effort in to making horses as effective as possible for warfare.
@@DonArques Yeah i get that but i was thinking people of that age would be more used to "roughing it" and dealing with the pain that riding a horse without a saddle would bring because they knew nothing else. Like i cant miss air conditioning if ive never seen it or be inside a room with it. do you know what i mean? i wish this guy went into more detail.... maybe he does in the full episode. Im sure the european horses would have been trained better for war though. but the namidian / nubian horse archers of northern africa were incredible more than 1,000 years before this ( i realize they never came into contact with native americans). i guess im just surprised that the natives werent already experts with their horses. thanks for the answer though. im sure a saddle makes it much more sturdy, lets you ride for longer distances and helps you stay on the horse during battles.
@@pat442389 Sure you can "rough it", but no matter how good you are at riding you are still at a massive disadvantage compared to someone who has the right equipment. You cant compare it to not being used to having airconditioning. You can probably ride a bike without using your hands too, but making turns is going to be harder and it's also going to be more work for your legs.
Remember that the Native Americans first saw horses in the 15th century when they were brought over by the Spanish - they only had a few generations to learn how to use horses, and despite that very short time they did it anyway.
The Spanish saw this rapid progression and didnt want the Natives to get their hands on their "horse technology". It's comparable to WW2 in a way; the Germans had the best tanks in the early war but the soviets drew inspiration and technology from the panther tanks of the germans and developed the T-34 tank. After that they had evened the odds and could fight the Germans most powerful tanks.
Horses evolved in america yes, but they went extinct by a combination of climate change and overhunting by ice-age humans. Some horses managed to migrate over the landbridge into Asia - where they have spread all over the place and eventually were domesticated by humans - it was those horses that the spanish "brought back" to america in the 15th century.
@@DonArques I use to ride bare back, from my experience your relying on the horse to do the steering and speed adjustment.
Mind you I only ever rode with one horse, and had a great relationship with him.
*slaps horses ass
"This baby can take an LS"
Joe Schmoe honestly the real question is what cant? I recently LS swapped by bros original brain which was slugged by downsyndrome
@@smallerfreeze damn man that's some good techin' right there. Hows his mileage?
Joe should bring a Spartan historian now.
@Dale Doback Yes.
@Dale Doback It is a myth.They went down there and found only adult man skeletons probably criminals.
Good god no lol. It would just be 2 hours of joe spouting common nonsense about Sparta and the expert correcting him lol.
That would be Paul Cartledge.
Horses in most conditions are superior it depends on the weather and the terrain
Elizabeth Warren: I was the first native american to tame a horse.
😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
That what her grandmother told her.
Freaking OUTSTANDING comment!!!!!
Im still waiting for trump to pay that mil to charity... he blew her just mentioning she had native american in her blood as a throw away up and said if she proved it with dna hed pay a mil to charity, she proved it and he just ignored it lmao
@@alwaysplay13 How funny is that?!!!!She proved she’s 1/1034th Native American.....less than the typical American. Yet, she still got a position at Harvard based on her “minority” status.
How that insane, ignorant, hateful woman hasn’t been run out of the country on a rail is beyond me. She’s the WORST kind of person I can imagine.
Horses conquered this world. They are the real heros. Without them mankind is changed forever
the unsung heroes of history
I think the f14 tomcat would disagree
@Fady Al Qaisy And the Mongols.
@ both had great horses, Mongols just had more.... A lot more. Excellent horse archers
@ well if youre able to fight that many civilizations, spanning vast distances. you definitely have a lot of horses.
other tribes : we dance and make arts
the Comanches : we go Mongols on you
The book by Dan Flores, "American Serengeti", is an absolutely awesome read.
I could listen to this guy all day! ........I love his knowledge & frankness.
Lol. He compared Spartans with Comanches. No serious historian would ever do that.
He says that the Spaniards didn’t want the technology to get out to the native tribes of Mexico.
😂😂😂 come on now. It’s just bivouac he know squad about Mexican topography.
It's very simple how the Indians adopted horse technology, they would capture Spanish and Mexican youngsters in Texas and Mexico who would teach them about European technologies like horsemanship and guns. Many early American settlers were startled to find many Commanches and other tribes were very fluent in Spanish. They were Mexican and Spanish kids adopted by the tribe. Look up the story of Quanah Parker.
this guy talks about Quanah parker later in the podcast, he wrote a book about him, that's why he is there.
Adopted? They where kidnapped. The Comanches and Apaches always did raids and attacks against northen Mexicans settlers mostly white immigrants Europeans (northen Mexico was forbidden to indigenous mexicans and non Catholic citizens).
@@jorgehdz2030 remember non whites people can't do bad things
Look up Hees Hoos Sanchees, he was a Mexican captive raised as a Comanche and noted Warrior.
His picture is at the the Smithsonian in Washington DC, it was painted by George Catlin in the 1830's
Definitely is truth most don't think about
Horses? I thought the Comanches used jeeps.
They used attack helicopters ya dingus.
😂😂😂😂
No the Blackhawks were first to use helicopters duhh
Ahh yes the majestic Jeep grand cherokees
They used mustangs
I learned more interesting facts from joes podcast then I did in community college.
The Internet sure changed how much information we consume.
I mean you went to Community College what did you expect.
@@lamolambda8349 Were you born a dickhead or did you have to work at it?
@@lamolambda8349 It's the same shit but way cheaper for half of a 4 year degree. It's the smart move.
Well yeah you are supposed to learn about your field not fucking horses
@@redpillamerican4361 sure… LMAO😂
Joe “Did you know Comanches smoked DMT” Rogan
@Jackson Q maybe he just like drugs? 🤷♀️😅
@Jackson Q I’m not trying to start an argument or sound like an ass, but how is that sad?
From what I have read about the Comanche they seemed more analogous to the Mongolian horseman than to Spartans. The Spartans weren't nomadic and had slaves that tended farms for them. The Comanche and Mongolians were both nomadic, both expert horse riders, and both by all accounts excelled beyond belief with their bows.
BrewCity44 Panthers Comanche had slaves as well, they just didn’t know how to farm.
@@jonboy9734, didn't know that. But I brought up the slaves part only because the Spartans only trained in their land warfare skills, but needed to eat, so they left the farming to slaves. My point was that the Spartans were not a nomadic people.
He was comparing their cultures, not their lifestyles...
@@jonboy9734 the Comanche actually did use their land later to cropshare because they didn't want to farm but had the land. Even after the nomadic times
@@jonboy9734 In nomadic culture slaves were like servant had more "right" Its hard to keep slaves when you constantly moving
The Iroquois ate more horses than they rode.
I read that somewhere long ago and thought it was so cool that I always remembered it.
So do the french nowadays or people who eat at IKEA.
Probably true for the Mongols too.
@@d4n4nable Mongols ate mostly mutton. Horses were too valuable
lamo lambda wtf are u gamling about IKEA serves good food
@@LinusWatches don't you remeber when it was discovered there was horse meat in the meat balls
We can finally ride them! we got the horse-technology
He does have a ton of buddies! Imagine trying to keep track of the tens of thousands of interesting people he has befriended and interacted with!
It wasn't until the Pueblo Revolt (Pope's Rebellion) of 1680 near Santa Fe that the horse came into significant use and influence among the Plains Indians changing their way of life for ever. It would be fascinating to learn how the Comanche became such skilled horseman.
Right it’s striking to realize how quick that period of time was.
Everyone strives to be a comedian in the comments
It's getting old. I always scroll to maybe see a conversation. Nope.
Yeah its actually draining to read the comments and see a Joe" " Rogan meme every other comment. And then you find an actually positive comment and a troll turns it into a comment war
The joe rogan effect
LOL I'm dead 💀😂
Your mom strives to be a comedian
I had the privilege of learning about the Navajos when I worked in New Mexico for a while. But, I don't remember them talking about horses except as a source of food.
Another native group people should look up is the chichimeca natives, the word closes means savage but it as widely recognized that these people were related to the Aztec, these people came from the cities that the mexica created as the travelled south to central Mexico. When they were some of the first natives to use horse against Spanish, fought a war for almost 40 years against them and their natives allies.
I once rode a pony at the fair.
Good story bro
Ok, actually caught me off guard, sounds like some stand-up shit.
Save a pony, ride a cowboy
The first native American to jump on a horse must've been a madman
The commanches sound like they had the perfect horse jockey physique.
Important to remember that horses were tools of military dominance in the Old World.
To keep a horse in Europe, where all land was owned and parceled was prohibitively expensive and thus was a tool and symbol of the aristocracy.
Some common Europeans could afford a mule or an ass but not a horse you would ride in battle.
“The Comanche were a bow legged, short, unimpressive people compared to other tribes.” So they became a horse people because it was their only chance to have power.
lol...
This probably is true. When at war and pressured people will do whatever they need to survive. They saw this resource, understood the power of it, and as a people strove to control it to great effect.
The Navajo drove them toward Texas but ended up being intermittently raided by them after they got horses.
This 'historian' is so full of shit. Like his 'angelic' reference about the Sioux.
@@nabiji yeah, he seems pseudo lol
Imagine having a horse vs having a donkey or lama 😂 horses are op
depends. Comanches would steal mules first before they would touch horses.
NLJeff EU nothing kicks like a donkey
@@letsdebate839 kicking is useless and nothing as fast as a horse.
when you need a wrench 100 hammers wont work
NLJeff EU yeah until you need to trek up a mountain in the Andes let’s see what you’d rather have then.
Keep these videos coming , they're great
I'm an Indian outlaw.
Half Cherokee and Choctaw.
My momma, she's a Chippewa,
Her Crab Dip's one of a kind.
Jared Zufelt Cherokee people, Cherokee tribe.
Best man made products, the dog and the horse. They change everything.
I am surprised that Joe Rogan doesn't own couple of horses.
My family had horses. It sucks.
Myy Name ruclips.net/video/xfdIgYZczSk/видео.html
Unless you just pay to have a horse in some stable and someone else takes care of it while you come by every once in a while and give it a carrot and pat it while you pretend the horse gives two shits about you, owning horses and taking care of them is a huge amount of work. I've had girlfriends with them, they are beautiful animals but at the same time they scare the shit out of me.
Bet he's had one...with a side of jalapenos.
The professor to have on the podcast concerning the Comanche is Lindsay Montgomery. This guy is great too though.
My Corolla from the 90's is old horse technology
Dude my corolla from 2010 is old horse technology. You can probably track yours right back to the comanchee horse breeders
Finally I’ve found the information I need at 6am and now I can sleep.
The best analogy I've heard is that the Comanches had more in common with a biker gang than a culture by the time they met Europeans. '
Either I'm way too high, or this is the best video title I've ever seen
See this baby right here....that's right 1 horse power!
What people need to realise is that the native Americans/first nation people were literally living in the stone age by the time Europeans arrived.
Think about that.
All of the history based around the development of technology that defined the growth and eventual dominance of Europeans completely passed the native Americans by.
No guns or gunpowder, no swords, no shields, no armour, no battle formations, no sturctured military, no ships, no compasses, no 'horse technology' (first time hearing it put like that but it'll suffice) no astronomy, no written word, not even the wheel...
What they had was a magnificent culture, far beyond any Europeans as far as spirituality goes, and is one that I admire but in essence, all they had were wall paintings and stories passed down by their elders.
The poor bastards never stood a chance.
.
You should read 1491 by Charles C Mann
Wrong! They used astronomy: twitter.com/brettachapman/status/1102253051337998337
In reality there wasn’t that much of a disparity. The Spanish had a hard time fighting the natives, and some people say that it was only the germs that brought them out on top.
@@Mattiac1980 Good one mate, u learn something new every day ;-) Thanks for the info
They also had no resistance to European diseases such as small pox.
I always learn so much from watching this podcast
Horse technology sounds like horse armor 2.0
First horse back to the Americas:
"kindly let me re-introduce myself, my name is Horse..
Eurasians had a 10,000 year head start on horse domestication
10,000yrs ago there were horses in the Americas...but the only thing the natives could think of doing with them was to eat them!!!
The Turks, Mongols, Persians, Parthians, and Hungarians all originated from the Central Asian plains.
@@Master...deBater Not the only thing...wait what?
@@kevinclass2010 Modern Hungarians are only in small parts descendents of the Uralic Magyars. Most of their ancestors are the conquered people who lived there all along.
@@j.s.t.6515: Hey now...let's keep it clean!!!
I’m surprised Joe didn’t ask about Comanche and DMT usage..
They had peyote
They definitely had cane toads
2:34 Damn it feels good to be a gangster
Mexico "is" North America
Mexico is Mexico
@@i-never-look-at-replies-lol and its located on what continent?? yeah North America buddy
Mexico is half and half, north and central.
@@CarlosPerez-ut5ze We're embarassed by that shithole 3rd world country so we dont claim them
37 pirate The Tropic of cancer line is what divides north america from central america
Most folks have this idea north America was this vast sparsely populated continent. Actually the western hemisphere was populated by millions of indigenous people. Before the pilgrims arrived Portuguese fisherman introduced diseases that killed thousands in New England. It only got worse within 10 years 90% of the indigenous population was dead!
This is like playing Civilisation. I always forget to do the horse riding technology and end up doing it in the Renaissance or something, alongside muskets.
Good trade imo. Guns > horse
But, if you get the horse techs super fast/quick a Civ can just run over another before they even get started...
It would have only taken one ' horse whisper' to start a major movement. One man with courage, discipline, and teaching skills who could have broken horses, learned to ride well, and then taught thee skills to others. Often, n history, one man, or a small group, redirects evolution. Still true today.
Of course we heavily guarded horse technology, it’s a huge military advantage. We classify military technology today for the same reason.
We? "We" didnt do shit.
If I was on an alien continent surrounded by a civilization that made theatre out of seperating people from their beating hearts I would not share the secrets of my get-away vehicle.
Wow I genuinely learnt about horses today
The natural horse was originally much smaller.
Too small to ride.
But the Indo-Europeans were clever, and used chariots.
After centuries of selective breeding, they got bigger and stronger...
Horses are like bio-technology. :)
The C'manshees learned how to tame their dragons ;)
I bet kids today are dumbfounded when they see technology & horses in the same sentence...
Alex Torvi u am how did you know you old fuck?
Native American: NOW THIS IS HORSE POWER!
so yeah, I don't like some of joe rogan's rants and arguments, but he does read a lot and stays informed.
script
ҳҲ̸Ҳ̸ҳ you think he has writers?
@boomer420d yes . every episode is scripted .
Joe, you should have Wes Studi on the show to share his view of Native America.
I met him in Charlies bar in Missoula Montana...hella nice guy!!!
Agreed. He is so fascinating.
I can't find the full podcast on RUclips or Spotify
saw a documentary on the Mustangs from there is a quote i like, "the combination of the plains Indian and the mustang was a recipe for the greatest light cavalry the world had ever seen"
@john connolly A medieval templar and muslim saracen did not have access to rifles... i also said light Cavalry, light cavalry and heavy cavalry function differently and server different purposes.
@john connolly yes they were, the horse wasn't always but the rider most defiantly was. and again I'm talking about a time period where guns are the primary weapon.
Just to be clear the Horse technology they are talking about is the training techniques that infused the rider and Horse into one unit making it almost invincible compared to the troops on foot and that's where they get 'The Centaur' from. Greeks, Spanish, English, Arabs they all had this technology until machines were invented, now it's all games and Equestrian sports.
There is Przewalski's (Mongolian wild) horse, which also went extinct, in the wild.
Who else thought about The Revenant intro
Sounds like the horse was the predecessor to modern day helicopters
horses are dope.
I shall nameth thee Horsee Technology.
Something tells me Joe might be descended from Comanche's
Mind officially fuckin blown. Now I gotta see a documentary on the Pueblo uprising. I demand knowledge NOW!!!
This guys microphone in his nose
Hahahah
Horses arrive to north america with spanish soldiers named Dragrones de Cuera, these soldier had comercial relations with some indians and taugth them how to handle and take care of horses, when soldiers die in combat or some Horses scape, the reproduced and that was the new breed named mesteño/mustang, originaly andaludians horses. First time an Apache saw a Pale Face was a spanish. For futher information read the book BANDERAS LEJANAS that contains all the maps, laws and documents of that era.
Joe should interview Mr Horse from the Ren & Stimpy show on the next episode
No sir, I don't like it!
They just couldn't overcome Samuel Colt's game changing apparatus lol
Joe, Did Comanches ever use DMT?
George Black they did peyote
They probably had their own drugs
Loves giving YAKUBS children credit lol
Joe is so high he's now talking about ancient Europeans' pet horses
@Khabib cherrypicking Weight bully Ha I figured as much. I'm not complaining though, I do love strange high conversations
They were not pets.
He was absolutely fried in the recent clip about South Park
Why all the food commercials when I watch Joe? I want a hoagie now.
Yo Philly!
Joe: Did the horses do DMT?
0:53 Paleo Indians didn't use the indigenous North American horses because they were much smaller than the modern horses that Europeans re-introduced. However, I've not been in the recent archaeological literature for a while so, while my prior experience tells me horses were not utilized (prior to the pleistocene extinctions) as they were after the Spanish brought them, it's not difinitive that Paleo Indians couldn't have and that artifacts haven't yet been found or haven't been preserved to be found. Basically, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Further, Paleoindians had well developed spear and atlatl technology and skills to hunt the pleistocene mega fauna: mammoths, mastodons, ancient bison (B. antiquus), etc. Thus, the utilization of horses likely wouldn't have given the advantage that it later with European horses.
They should teach history classes in school with JRE clips. I would’ve been a way better student
The issue with that is not everything he says or talks about has anything to do with a topic or he’s inaccurate so the teacher would need to correct his mistakes constantly
I was somewhat kidding. But I agree with your point. The issue is the textbooks we have in most history classes are filled with propaganda and not the actual truth. There are literally hundreds of examples of this, especially with US history.
You wouldn't actually know anything about history if they did lol.
Yeah like the statement the comanches were the best at riding horses as if knights who trained their whole lifes on horseback would obliterate them with the power of stirrups and lance or longsword, as well as not even mentioning the huns and mongols.
We Blackfoot were a warring culture too. We harried many other tribes both because we could and because the last great herds of bison (not Buffalo Joe, no Buffalo in the Americas, only Africa and Indonesia, although I would argue the steppe Bison were actually a type of Buffalo, not really a bison) congregated in our territory in Montana and Alberta Canada. We became a bison culture and to protect it and hoard it, became a very warring nation. Other tribes feared us and rightly so, they were all afraid at some level to come to our lands and try to harvest Bison for themselves!
This guy darthing the mic
6000 horsemen was as big a cavalry force as any but the biggest ancient armies had.
europeans invented the horse by mixing brown sugar and pieces of wood.
What?
Have the horses tried DMT? - Joe Rogan
"The Comanche Empire" which is an excellent book was written two years before S.C. Gwynne's book on them. I've noticed a trend where authors have a tendency to pick up on a trend and not give credit to those who started it.
I definitely noticed that with Nassim Taleb; he's created a whole genre and many are copying him without giving due to where these ideas came from.
Writing a book about a certain group of people is not a trend or being a copycat. It’s actually better to have a lot of perspectives in a field of study, especially history, to allow for alternate interpretations and peer review
@@bobsherman904 yeah people that don’t read as much as others maybe don’t realize that all these books usually have wildly different interpretations of the history presented
Sounds like someone needs to learn a lesson on how the world works
@@bobsherman904 pretty easy solution. Give credit to those who came before you. This used to be considered normal and necessary.
@@healthymealthy775 credit for what? He didn’t use any info from that other book, he wrote his own on the same topic. Even if that book inspired him to write his own, which may not even be true, the original doesn’t deserve any credit if this dudes book didn’t use anything from it. The first guy doesn’t own the topic of “Comanches”
Horses were indeed re-introduced by the Spanish. But, as is said horses evolved into it's current form in the Americas as did the cameloids (camels, llamas, alpacas etc.) they came from Asia via Beringia and after evolving they migrated back to Asia or to South-America or both. Then they died out for unknown reasons in North-and Central-America. Interesting fact, the die of by many megafauna ( big mammals like mammoth) coincided with human arrival and climate change at the end of second last ice age 50.000 years ago. The last of that megafauna other then what's considered big now died of 12.800 til 11.800 years (see JRE with Graham Hancock).
What is this guy talking about? "...they (the comanche) are a more stripped down culture that looked like Sparta." What part of Sparta was stripped down? The highly hierarchical social life? The diplomatic powerhouse that Sparta was? The high arts like Theater, poetry, pottery, metallurgy, astronomy that were practiced in Sparta? The, in their age, highly efficient "constitution", the so called rhetra. The most efficient propaganda mashine in their time? This guy clearly don't know what he is talking about!
Yeah, I'm not really sure what he is talking about here either. There is really no comparison at all between the two societies. He might know alot about the commanche but he doesn't seem to know shit about Sparta.
Thought the same when he said that.
did the natives not have any of that, or are you just buying the white narrative that the natives were "savages"? youre over here acting like poetry, pottery, art, and a social hierarchy didnt exist among the natives lol
PS "savages" is pretty ironic term, especially coming from europeans and their incredibly long history with war and suffering, huh? LMAO
@@zappbrannigan8352 I tackled his stupid argument that the two cultures ,like he said, are "stripped down" from my point of expertise. I'm not an expert of native culture, so it's difficult for me to say something about that. But I'm a scholar of grecko-roman history and I can say for sure there is nothing stripped down in spartan culture. Obviously he is buying in a philosophy of prejudice and stupidity to sell his book. I called him out as the grifter that he is. On the other hand you should stop scolding other people for the assumtions you are producing through your own prejudice. I would advise better read a second and third time and think about what was written instead of making a fool out of yourself by attacking allies. PS: I never wrote anything about "savages". You brought up this term and that says a hole lot about you.
Okay, he's not saying sparta was stripped down, but that comanche society was. Sparta was a military centric society with all the arts and science you mention. His point is the comanche society was also military centric, but less developed science and arts, aka, stripped down--as expected of a society closer to stone age than bronze age.
YALL TAKE EVERYBODY SWAGG
Mexico is in North America...
I laughed when he said that lol
Well it is actually in North America
Horses helped Humanity to become who we are , all over planet Earth.
Eohippus: Dawn Horse
The Spanish did recruited Native American tribesmen in their cavalry elite, "Soldado De Cuera", who showed loyalty to Spain, at the time. These are some of these Natives became excellent horsemen in Spanish-owned ranches. These "Soldados De Cuera" were effective in protecting towns, hacienda ranches, roads, and borders of tbe upper North American frontier from criminals, aggressive Native attacks, and foreign invaders.
Epstein
Did not kill himself?
Who did it?
@ricky gore or trump, or maybe both sides...as both sides had an interest. Either way, the ped is probably still alive on one of his islands...
Spartans of the Plains. Interesting take. Spot on.
"and flourished here?"
No... They died out mate... I mean...
@John Mariano they evolved there? Are u on drugs?
@@mothurman , en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_the_horse
@@SwampFeet678 oh I thought he was talking about the native americans
Plenty of evidence they didn’t go extinct and indeed they did flourish.
The Spaniards incorporated Comanches to tend to their horses as grooms. They caught on quickly.
Joe is right that the oldest horse fossils have been found in North America, but I am pretty sure they were way different from modern horses. His guest is a goober for referring to Indians in Mexico and in North America because Mexico and all those little countries south of it are part of North America.
He's referring to it like that so you can understand where SPECIFICALLY he's talking about. Being nondescript of the region doesn't help paint the picture of what area he's referring to.
Good for Joe for presenting his audience with a wide array of subjects that they otherwise would have no clue or have heard of.
The natives didn’t utilize the horse and they didn’t even create the wheel until they saw Europeans
Aimee12345 B what would they use the wheel for without any draft animals and no horses until the europeans arrived
What? The Mayans, Aztecs. Toltecs, Cuzcos, and Incas all had the wheel, what the fuck are you talking about?
My guess is that someone somewhere told a Comanche chief about the history of the Golden Horde.