A lot of people were on board with Oz being Willow’s love interest since he first appeared, but the scene they had this episode cemented everyone’s love for Oz
Yeah, I read somewhere that Joss actually wrote this scene to address fans who still wanted Willow to be with Xander. Viewers hardly knew him by this point. Joss wrote this to get them all on board with Team Oz!
The look of absolute disgust and horror on Rana and Marketas faces when Angelus just destroyed Buffy's heart in his apartment was priceless.....and Toxic Angel hasn't even started to f**k shit up
All 3 really accent "life really isn't fair, but it's what you do with what comes to you that counts." I feel like Lie To Me doesn't get the recognition it deserves. It really forces the perspective to light that everything isn't black and white, but that there is definitely still right and wrong.
Absolutely agree. After this episode, everything about the show seemed to just change for the better. I swear there was better, writing, better action, better storylines, better acting etc. Like up to this point i enjoyed buffy, but after, i was a fan.
Ladies and gentlemen...meet Angelus, one of the most vicious, sadistic and dangerous vampire ever ! That switch is amazing and really show the acting skills of David Boreanaz, becoming that insane monster...
Of all the strange things that happened in Sunnydale that nobody in town felt the need to ever comment on again after it happened, I think the rocket launcher in the mall is my favorite.
When he gave that whole spiel about it being used by his people like it was from Ancient Mesopotamia, I was very unimpressed. I grew up around them all my life and didn’t know they weren’t ubiquitous.
If you remember from the Halloween episode, Angel says that when you become a vampire you lose your soul and a demon takes its place. What happened to Angel was the curse restored his soul, so that the crushing guilt and horror of everything he'd done over the previous century weighed on him and he could never be happy. Falling in love and having that love reciprocated (or having sex if you prefer) gave him a moment of happiness, the curse was broken, he lost his soul and the demon retook its place. The (somewhat overt) metaphor of the high-school boyfriend becoming a "monster" once he got what he wanted from the high-school girlfriend was just cranked up to 11 (as all good horror metaphors are). Also age of consent in California was 17.
I always loved the contrast between Angelus and the way he treated Buffy, compared to Oz and Giles being decent and loving, saying just the right things. Specially Giles at the end there, that speech was beautiful and much needed. Not all men are monsters, this is good writing. Also, Buffy was heartbroken and crushed, but she still did her job, I've always admired her for that.
The show is versatile enough that it also explored the concept of men supposedly having inner monsters ("Beauty and the Beasts") and hurting the women around them ("Harsh Light of Day").
It wasn't the sex because they were just sleeping beside each other in the bed and that's when the curse activated. It was the afterglow when he was at maximum happiness! It was because he felt super close to buffy in that moment :'''(((
100% facts! it was the moments after, when he was feeling most human and happy, holding the woman he loves in his arms. he was at peace and momentarily forgot all his pain- then BAM, thats exactly when it happened.
One of my favorite things about the show and what most people forget is Angel didn't lose his soul just because he had sex he lost it afterwards when he was just laying in bed holding Buffy. His moment of true happiness was just being with the person he loves both physically and emotionally
I called it pretty early on that this show was going to make Rana and Marketa yell at Pat A LOT. I'm now amending that prediction. This show is going to make Rana and Marketa physically fight Pat.
I'm so happy that Rana is back for this episode! Sucks to have no Suraj and Mickey though! Also, I said it elsewhere, but special shout out to Marketa, "That's my fucking purse!" You go Bobby :)
11:17 crosses burn vampires like it’s a searing metal, Angelus was probably thrown off because he was close to being burned, and probably surprised Xander got so close to him, since he was focused primarily on Buffy and didn’t think normal humans would try anything against him. Though vampires have been shown to growl when they see a cross so maybe that’s part of it.
This episode is the literal "Welcome to the REAL Buffy experience!" episode. Quality-wise, with some exceptions, it's all uphill from here, and this was already on a peak!
It's been 24 years and this episode is still so painful to watch, the Angelous/Buffy scene in Angel's flat is truly one of the most emotionally brutal scenes. Also could it be anymore obvious that David Boreanaz has the time of his life playing Angelous, it leaps off the screen like when Jeffrey Dean Morgan plays Negan.
Yeah I always prefered him as Angelus because he was better in that role, probably cuz he was having more fun and generally it's a more dynamic role. Kinda always wished his own show was centered around Angelus finding his humanity and making non monstrous choices despite not having a soul...but it was probably too controversial back then to have a protag start out being evil and horrible.
@@sickleweed3270 "Soulless vampires can't not be horribly evil" was a big part of the show's DNA at this point in its development and Angel starts at the end of the season after this tbf. Obviously they changed it later but it took them a while
@@ReXtion88 Yeah the show may have started after this season but who knows when they decided on creating the spin off...show planning takes time. I just feel they never went too far with Angelus cuz they had to keep his hands relatively clean for his own show.
@@sickleweed3270 I don’t know, man. Souled Angel does some extremely morally questionable things on AtS. I think that show does a great job keeping what could be a pretty flat protagonist really interesting. It helps that by then Boreanaz has improved a lot as Angel and can provide a lot more nuance in his performance compared to “S1 of Buffy Angel”
This episode is iconic and soooo good, as awful (emotionally) as it is. Buffy gets put through the gd ringer y'all. At all times. Just... embrace it. Continue to be mad on her behalf, but like... it's not going to change. Poor girl. Additionally, Giles' speech to Buffy in the car at the end sets the standard for how a parent should react to things. Support and respect. Ditto with him siding with Buffy against Jenny showing up. So good.
Angelus is in the building. Let's Go !!!! R.I.P. Angel. Xander came in clutch with getting his hands on the rocket launcher. Glad he retained his memories of becoming a solider in episode 2x06 | "Halloween". This particular episode was written and directed by Joss Whedon. Juliet Landau aka Drusilla is the gift that keeps on giving.
Woooo! You guys have officially started Buffy! Training wheels are OFF. Growing pains are pretty much done. I can't wait for the rest of this season. Rana's gonna lose her mind next episode. Marketa is going to rage at the one after that.
Sarah Michelle Gellar absolutely knocking it out of the park yet again. It sucks that this show was never considered for any big acting awards (e.g. Emmys) because she deserves.
angelus always goes hard, and gellar sells it so good, u can see it in her face how much it hurt. By this point in the series u are totally invested so u hurt too... unless u are pat lol
This is my favourite episode in the whole series. I think there is so so much more to take in that they skipped over or missed, but I know it's their first time watching and I've watched the show probably 50 times, so it's totally understandable. It's such a turning point for all of our characters though. And the conversation in the bedroom always has me holding my breath, Sarah and David nailed it.
4:11 That's the beauty of Buffy's writing. This is actually an allegory to guys that play the part well, say all the right things but then switch up on a girl once they've gotten what they wanted. " *Some guys, some guys are only about that thing, that thing, that thiing.* "
Honestly, Buffy obliterating The Judge with a rocket launcher is one of the most badass and best "thinking outside the box" moments in the whole series.
I remember this point in the show, ending this episode and being like OHHHHkay, so it’s like THIS. This episode took the show and gave it a full blown drop kick into epic status. Angelus is just… SO good. David Boreanaz’s acting is insane.
Of all the metaphors in this show so far, having your first lover suddenly become a different person overnight is really tough. A pivotal episode in the Buffyverse. Stakes (hah!) are getting higher.
I think everyone following your Buffy reactions has probably been waiting for you to react to this episode. Angelus telling Buffy that he loves her too and pointing his finger at her kills me every time.
One curiosity: Spiffy...Spuffy 😏 Can it be considered a foreshadowing...? 'cause the choice of words had nothing to do with Spiffy face. I mean, the "guy" was an alien. And after that word the camera points quickly to Spike...
8:56 *Marketa:* _"I wanna kill him."_ OMG 😱 Poor *Marketa!* Just watching her reaction was heartbreaking! Then her reaction to *Pat's* reaction (11:24) made me even more sad. And then 13:10 😔 Thankfully it all ends in giggles.😏 I'm sure you know (and I'm likely not the only one to point this out), but remember the show is always exploring through metaphor painful underlying truths and themes of youth.
I laugh so much at people trying to apply hard core realism onto a show like this. The emotions are the realities, the situations are fantastical. It's been established that the police in Sunnydale are deeply stupid, so expecting them to be at the mall for ~realism~ is just laughable. lol
I mean the police have also been shown in School Hard to be in the know about the supernatural of the town, so they are less likely to show up in situations like this as well.
As an Irish person, I can assure you that the Claddagh ring is a real tradition, from Claddagh, County Galway, Ireland. Angel's character is supposed to be from Galway originally.
The one thing that always kind of takes me out of the final fight of this episode in the movie theater is you can see a ton of promotional posters for Quest for Camelot in the background, that 90s animated movie. So there trying to have this big emotional moment between the two characters and I can’t help but think about the two headed dragons musical number with then both do Elvis impersonations, so that scene is very… in the 90’s lol But very glad we’ve gotten to the Angelus parts, he’s my favorite villain in the whole show, he’s so evil but so carefree, devilish, and interesting to watch, were in for a fun ride.
Joyce didn’t know because this was before 24-7 news and easy, quick access to the news online. This was only five years after most people got access to email for the very first time, and online news wasn’t even close to what it is now. For your average busy adult, if you didn’t watch your local news in the evening (and they’re clearly watching an old movie together), you read about it the next day in the paper. I was the same age as Buffy when this aired. We’d only had our home computer for two years at the time, and my family used it for fun stuff and homework, not the news.
it was not the 6,,,,it was the calm afterward, Angel was 100% at peace, he was no longer plagued by what the demon had done when it used his body, he at a tiny short moment was happy and at peace, for first time since he was cursed and whoooop there goes the soul and the demon is control again...sure, the 6 might have helped, but it was more that moment after, he reached true happiness and fulfillment lying next to his soulmate and boom, the curse activated
Sunnydale is located on top of a Hellmouth and has been there for a long, long time. Generations of families have lived with all the evil that pops up there and the people seem to be in a survivalist's mode; they tend to ignore or brush off that which they really can't fight or do anything about. This type of phenomenon is more explicitly explained in Stephen King's "IT". I think it may help you with this continued non understanding of the attitudes (or lack there of) of the populace as a whole in Sunnydale.
Been waiting so I can watch all 4 of the most recent reactions back-to-back. Marketa last episode: I'm just not comfortable with Angel and Buffy's relationship. This episode: Yes, we agree with you.
Did y'all forget how much Willow loved Xander? Even tho she's starting to move on, she still loves Xander. She wasn't dating Oz at this point. Add her being a teenager and it's honestly pretty understandable of her feelings.
Just to answer the questions brought up on the video. Angel has been so far in the show a dual being. When he was turned, his soul was removed and was replaced with a demon. So a vampire is a play on the wolf in sheep's clothing type of thing. When he was cursed with a soul, his soul was put back and given control of the body. It was a torture for both the soul and the demon. The soul remembered every terrible thing the demon did and it tore at its conscience. The demon was doubly tortured because it both had to feel the emotions of the soul, but also was imprisoned by it, forever to watch without being able to do. When he lost his soul, Angel reverted back to Angelus, which is just the demon. No conscience, no remorse, a hatred for human emotions like love and regret. Plus, Angelus from the past was even known to the Master, a thousand year old vampire, as one of the most vicious vampires to have ever existed.
Meet Angelus, the evil.. Dont forget it's Not Angel anymore...Damn David IS so good in This character. Perfect acting. But damn where are the others dudes ?
Mark 2:19. A poll like that seems to be based on both series as a whole, when they know everything about each character. Yet, your group has not seen all of both series yet, including the movie. But you weren't afraid of, "spoilers"? 🤔
The American army has on several occasions misplaced nuclear weapons. And while only a very small percentage of munitions get stolen, it's a small percentage from a very large number.
Gotta say it's interesting watching the men laugh at angel being toxic while the women are sitting in silence. This episode, and hearing Angel being so awful to Buffy after their first time was heartbreaking. Especially considering the emotional state of a 17 year old girl (this was also the day after her birthday). I didn't find it funny at all.
@@x-man9473 "humorous lines" is subjective. You find misogyny funny while others do not. And belittling a person's slowness or fastness of mental capacity is pretty low.
still one of the best twists in tv history. to take one of your main characters and turn him into the most vile person on the show is brilliant. appreciated your alls talk at the end recognizing that the Angel we know is essentially dead -- that's important to remember as the show goes on. Angelus is a whole new beast though it's not always that cut and dry which is why I love Angel as a character. joss whedon has a lot to answer for, and there are elements of Buffy that don't hold up well now considering everything that's come out about Joss and I think the "boyfriend turns evil right after sex" is one of those aspects so in that regard it's not my favorite thing but for season 2's overall plot it works really well and sends the show -- and Angel the show -- into all new territory, and for that, I'll always be blown away by the show's willingness to go there.
@@Teaspooncat I figured, but can you imagine their reactions to this one with the group?! I feel like they need a list of my not miss with the group episodes, except that would be sorta spoiler-y. It’s a catch-22.
Now you know we always kept saying that form Mid S2 onwards this show really takes off. This episode Innocence along with preceding episode Surprise are where the show changed. I think this is the best episode by far up until this point, but believe it or not there are two more episodes in this Season that surpass this! There are so many reveals and jaw dropping scenes coming up, but this episode Innocence definitely a Top 20 from the whole series of 144 episodes. Here we now know that Angel has changed into Angelus, where the Gypsy curse has come to pass. Buffy realising that Miss Calendar was behind it was a great scene where she grabs her by the throat in the classroom. There are so many brilliant scenes it this it is hard to pinpoint any. The pain Buffy feels when Angel is talking about her losing her virginity and sexual performance is just so hard to watch. 'Innocence' of course also refers to Willow who is devastated to see Xander kiss Cordelia, and you can also see the 'Innocence' of her budding relationship with Oz. The rocket launcher scene in the mall is epic. Strap in for the ride guys there is even better to come!
Drusilla is one of my absolute favorite Buffy/Angel characters. She's so psychotic and yet calculating at the same time. It's fantastic. Spike is in my top favorite list alongside her. And I admit Angelus was sadistic and dark but that's what makes him so wonderful to watch.
Finally, they’re taking the show, themes, characterizations, and moments seriously. Having real dialogue on what’s going on and understanding the depth of the situation lol like you can laugh and have fun while watching this show but sometimes the forced jokes from 8 people ruins the experience. No offense. But I’m glad it’s only 6 people on the couch for episodes like this instead of all 9 or 10 lol Especially for THIS episode.
13:56 BEST. NORMIES. MOMENT EVER. f yeah! thank you dude. finally someone said it i've been rolling my eyes into the back of my head forever now. re: Oz, I feel you Rana. one-hundo percent.
This episode doubles down on the self aware fact that it's messed up a teenage just had sex with a 200 year old vampire especially with him calling her kid BECAUSE SHE IS A KID Also in this episode...angel said she was like a pro...so basically she sucked the soul out of him?......
Because Angelus isn’t all depressed and broody and tortured, he gets to be funny and makes more jokes than Angel , so that’ a fun change in character…also, notice how Angelus wears leather pants and angel usually doesn’t. Lol
"Why y'all just torturing Buffy these last few episodes?" Because SMG is one of the best criers on television and they'd be silly not to use that.
Torture your main character and their triumphs will take them from likable to loved.
PERIOD!!!! Her emotional face and those easily watery eyes she has is a gift!!
It's a good thing this is the last awful thing Buffy goes through in the series.
She’s GREAT in Do Revenge ❤
@@SethRGray I have to check that out. How much is she actually in the movie?
man, I can't believe that gang on PCP fired that rocket launcher in the mall
lol
A lot of people were on board with Oz being Willow’s love interest since he first appeared, but the scene they had this episode cemented everyone’s love for Oz
Yeah, I read somewhere that Joss actually wrote this scene to address fans who still wanted Willow to be with Xander. Viewers hardly knew him by this point. Joss wrote this to get them all on board with Team Oz!
The look of absolute disgust and horror on Rana and Marketas faces when Angelus just destroyed Buffy's heart in his apartment was priceless.....and Toxic Angel hasn't even started to f**k shit up
“Prophecy girl”, “Lie to me” and “Innocence” are the episodes with the biggest emotional resonance so far. For me that’s what the show is all about.
Hear, hear. Whedon started off with a great fun, quirky show, then in these episodes he showed what it's really capable of.
All 3 really accent "life really isn't fair, but it's what you do with what comes to you that counts." I feel like Lie To Me doesn't get the recognition it deserves. It really forces the perspective to light that everything isn't black and white, but that there is definitely still right and wrong.
This is the episode where I went from a casual viewer to a fan for life. They really took the show to a higher level.
Absolutely agree. After this episode, everything about the show seemed to just change for the better. I swear there was better, writing, better action, better storylines, better acting etc. Like up to this point i enjoyed buffy, but after, i was a fan.
Ladies and gentlemen...meet Angelus, one of the most vicious, sadistic and dangerous vampire ever ! That switch is amazing and really show the acting skills of David Boreanaz, becoming that insane monster...
Yep, and I love him for everything he does as Angelus.
Sadistic and vicious, but not an drop of anger of hatred fueled his savagery. To him, it was all for fun.
"I wish this was a sword fight" ~ Chris
Sarah Michelle Gellar absolutely *crushed* it this episode. Now the series really kicks into another gear.
I had the same thought, I actually laughed out loud at that
Of all the strange things that happened in Sunnydale that nobody in town felt the need to ever comment on again after it happened, I think the rocket launcher in the mall is my favorite.
I NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT THAT!
Claddagh rings are real things, guys, lol.
Can confirm. I have one 😊
When he gave that whole spiel about it being used by his people like it was from Ancient Mesopotamia, I was very unimpressed. I grew up around them all my life and didn’t know they weren’t ubiquitous.
I literally had one when I was a teenager.
This week on High School is Hell: You sleep with your boyfriend for the first time and he becomes a totally different person afterwards.
aint it great when art imitates life
I'm surprised they didn't catch that metaphor!
I nicknamed this episode “The One Where Angel Comes and Goes”
😂
lol
- berserk
If you remember from the Halloween episode, Angel says that when you become a vampire you lose your soul and a demon takes its place. What happened to Angel was the curse restored his soul, so that the crushing guilt and horror of everything he'd done over the previous century weighed on him and he could never be happy. Falling in love and having that love reciprocated (or having sex if you prefer) gave him a moment of happiness, the curse was broken, he lost his soul and the demon retook its place.
The (somewhat overt) metaphor of the high-school boyfriend becoming a "monster" once he got what he wanted from the high-school girlfriend was just cranked up to 11 (as all good horror metaphors are).
Also age of consent in California was 17.
Small nitpick but California raised the age of consent to 18 in 1913.
11:27 Marketa giving Pat that “I know you’re a Pat but… really Pat??” look. 😂😭
Pat is trying too hard.
@@michaelwhite8119Pat's a idiot and annoying
I also love how the 'army base' set is clearly just the Bronze exterior set
yeah, and the 'cemetery' is a car park but shhhhhhh 🙃
@@whedonobsessed hey I'm all for creative set reuse
The armory scene would 100% have worked with the pre-9/11 "weekend soldiers" that were the National Guard.
People don't account that life Pre 9/11 was so vastly different.
This is truly the meaning of ICONIC. Classic and groundbreaking tv.
I always loved the contrast between Angelus and the way he treated Buffy, compared to Oz and Giles being decent and loving, saying just the right things. Specially Giles at the end there, that speech was beautiful and much needed. Not all men are monsters, this is good writing. Also, Buffy was heartbroken and crushed, but she still did her job, I've always admired her for that.
Your last line sums up the show in its entirety. Omgosh!
The show is versatile enough that it also explored the concept of men supposedly having inner monsters ("Beauty and the Beasts") and hurting the women around them ("Harsh Light of Day").
Giles continues to be the best daddy
He went from being a ‘father figure’ back in the day to being a ‘daddy.’ Thank you, Ladies & Germs…I’ll be here all week!😊
It wasn't the sex because they were just sleeping beside each other in the bed and that's when the curse activated. It was the afterglow when he was at maximum happiness! It was because he felt super close to buffy in that moment :'''(((
100% facts! it was the moments after, when he was feeling most human and happy, holding the woman he loves in his arms. he was at peace and momentarily forgot all his pain- then BAM, thats exactly when it happened.
One of my favorite things about the show and what most people forget is Angel didn't lose his soul just because he had sex he lost it afterwards when he was just laying in bed holding Buffy. His moment of true happiness was just being with the person he loves both physically and emotionally
One of the things about this arc that stands out for me is how The Judge was just a red herring for who the real villain of this season would be.
I called it pretty early on that this show was going to make Rana and Marketa yell at Pat A LOT. I'm now amending that prediction. This show is going to make Rana and Marketa physically fight Pat.
I'm so happy that Rana is back for this episode! Sucks to have no Suraj and Mickey though! Also, I said it elsewhere, but special shout out to Marketa, "That's my fucking purse!" You go Bobby :)
11:17 crosses burn vampires like it’s a searing metal, Angelus was probably thrown off because he was close to being burned, and probably surprised Xander got so close to him, since he was focused primarily on Buffy and didn’t think normal humans would try anything against him. Though vampires have been shown to growl when they see a cross so maybe that’s part of it.
Yeah he was basically jump scared there :)
This episode is the literal "Welcome to the REAL Buffy experience!" episode. Quality-wise, with some exceptions, it's all uphill from here, and this was already on a peak!
Angel didn’t turn right after the sex, but when he woke up next to Buffy, his moment of ultimate happyness.
exactly, even the characters on the show will do that same mistake of thinking it was sex they changed Angel.
One of the goat episodes of the show.
That last Buffy and Giles scene always hits!
It's been 24 years and this episode is still so painful to watch, the Angelous/Buffy scene in Angel's flat is truly one of the most emotionally brutal scenes. Also could it be anymore obvious that David Boreanaz has the time of his life playing Angelous, it leaps off the screen like when Jeffrey Dean Morgan plays Negan.
Yeah I always prefered him as Angelus because he was better in that role, probably cuz he was having more fun and generally it's a more dynamic role. Kinda always wished his own show was centered around Angelus finding his humanity and making non monstrous choices despite not having a soul...but it was probably too controversial back then to have a protag start out being evil and horrible.
@@sickleweed3270 "Soulless vampires can't not be horribly evil" was a big part of the show's DNA at this point in its development and Angel starts at the end of the season after this tbf. Obviously they changed it later but it took them a while
@@ReXtion88 Yeah the show may have started after this season but who knows when they decided on creating the spin off...show planning takes time. I just feel they never went too far with Angelus cuz they had to keep his hands relatively clean for his own show.
@@sickleweed3270 I don’t know, man. Souled Angel does some extremely morally questionable things on AtS. I think that show does a great job keeping what could be a pretty flat protagonist really interesting. It helps that by then Boreanaz has improved a lot as Angel and can provide a lot more nuance in his performance compared to “S1 of Buffy Angel”
Angelus Not Angelous
This episode is iconic and soooo good, as awful (emotionally) as it is. Buffy gets put through the gd ringer y'all. At all times. Just... embrace it. Continue to be mad on her behalf, but like... it's not going to change. Poor girl.
Additionally, Giles' speech to Buffy in the car at the end sets the standard for how a parent should react to things. Support and respect. Ditto with him siding with Buffy against Jenny showing up. So good.
The latest video to really make you question how Pat is the "Senior Human Resource Manager" lmao
Angelus is in the building. Let's Go !!!! R.I.P. Angel.
Xander came in clutch with getting his hands on the rocket launcher.
Glad he retained his memories of becoming a solider in episode 2x06 | "Halloween".
This particular episode was written and directed by Joss Whedon.
Juliet Landau aka Drusilla is the gift that keeps on giving.
The wait is over.. the pain is gone!
"Just say you're a virgin pat" had me dying
Woooo! You guys have officially started Buffy! Training wheels are OFF. Growing pains are pretty much done. I can't wait for the rest of this season. Rana's gonna lose her mind next episode. Marketa is going to rage at the one after that.
Sarah Michelle Gellar absolutely knocking it out of the park yet again. It sucks that this show was never considered for any big acting awards (e.g. Emmys) because she deserves.
Yeah, Buffy paved the way for genre shows but never earned the recognition it deserved critically because of it.
angelus always goes hard, and gellar sells it so good, u can see it in her face how much it hurt. By this point in the series u are totally invested so u hurt too... unless u are pat lol
This is my favourite episode in the whole series. I think there is so so much more to take in that they skipped over or missed, but I know it's their first time watching and I've watched the show probably 50 times, so it's totally understandable. It's such a turning point for all of our characters though. And the conversation in the bedroom always has me holding my breath, Sarah and David nailed it.
Like Suraj has said, they were cast for their chemistry.
That scene absolutely breaks me every time.
This is it guys, buffy the masterpiece starts now with this episode. The rest of the season in amazing
Angelus has arrived. R.I.P. the Judge. Dru continues to be delightful. Can't wait for the rest of the season.
4:11 That's the beauty of Buffy's writing. This is actually an allegory to guys that play the part well, say all the right things but then switch up on a girl once they've gotten what they wanted. " *Some guys, some guys are only about that thing, that thing, that thiing.* "
I think we all get it, it's not that subtle
This is absolutely one of the best Buffy episodes on so many levels.
This is the best episode of Buffy at this point in the show imo.
I love the scene with Giles and buffy in the end. It always makes me tear up. 😢
I could still feel the Angel's nuts aching even up to this day 😂😂
Ooof 😅
Honestly, Buffy obliterating The Judge with a rocket launcher is one of the most badass and best "thinking outside the box" moments in the whole series.
Believe it or not the Buffyverse just got inevitably better. Buffy and Joyce and ? on the sofa is one of my favourite scenes in all of Buffy.
I remember this point in the show, ending this episode and being like OHHHHkay, so it’s like THIS. This episode took the show and gave it a full blown drop kick into epic status. Angelus is just… SO good. David Boreanaz’s acting is insane.
Of all the metaphors in this show so far, having your first lover suddenly become a different person overnight is really tough. A pivotal episode in the Buffyverse. Stakes (hah!) are getting higher.
One of the most emotional episodes of the show and important for Buffy as a person.
I think everyone following your Buffy reactions has probably been waiting for you to react to this episode. Angelus telling Buffy that he loves her too and pointing his finger at her kills me every time.
Pat keeps setting off my alarm system, TOXIC ANGEL IS COOL?!?!
One curiosity: Spiffy...Spuffy 😏 Can it be considered a foreshadowing...?
'cause the choice of words had nothing to do with Spiffy face. I mean, the "guy" was an alien.
And after that word the camera points quickly to Spike...
Omg pause at 8:45 to see the look of absolute horror on everyone's face, except for Spidey who looks delighted.
Oops S2 arc sets in fully LET’S GO
13:56 that was an amazing burn 😂
8:56 *Marketa:* _"I wanna kill him."_
OMG 😱 Poor *Marketa!* Just watching her reaction was heartbreaking! Then her reaction to *Pat's* reaction (11:24) made me even more sad. And then 13:10 😔
Thankfully it all ends in giggles.😏
I'm sure you know (and I'm likely not the only one to point this out), but remember the show is always exploring through metaphor painful underlying truths and themes of youth.
I laugh so much at people trying to apply hard core realism onto a show like this. The emotions are the realities, the situations are fantastical. It's been established that the police in Sunnydale are deeply stupid, so expecting them to be at the mall for ~realism~ is just laughable. lol
I mean the police have also been shown in School Hard to be in the know about the supernatural of the town, so they are less likely to show up in situations like this as well.
Agree. I've asked someone to show me the law/regulations/cases that deal with consent between teenagers and 200+ year old vampires...
As an Irish person, I can assure you that the Claddagh ring is a real tradition, from Claddagh, County Galway, Ireland. Angel's character is supposed to be from Galway originally.
Angel's birth name was Liam.
The build-up to the season finale is something really special. Get the Kleenexes ready though and buckle up, it's going to be a wild ride.
She’s back!!! Yay. Missed you Rana.
The one thing that always kind of takes me out of the final fight of this episode in the movie theater is you can see a ton of promotional posters for Quest for Camelot in the background, that 90s animated movie. So there trying to have this big emotional moment between the two characters and I can’t help but think about the two headed dragons musical number with then both do Elvis impersonations, so that scene is very… in the 90’s lol
But very glad we’ve gotten to the Angelus parts, he’s my favorite villain in the whole show, he’s so evil but so carefree, devilish, and interesting to watch, were in for a fun ride.
6:23 Awwww yeah, bring on the popcorn, indeed 😁 It's gonna be a wild ride.
Joyce didn’t know because this was before 24-7 news and easy, quick access to the news online. This was only five years after most people got access to email for the very first time, and online news wasn’t even close to what it is now. For your average busy adult, if you didn’t watch your local news in the evening (and they’re clearly watching an old movie together), you read about it the next day in the paper. I was the same age as Buffy when this aired. We’d only had our home computer for two years at the time, and my family used it for fun stuff and homework, not the news.
are we not gonna talk about how he woke up naked nd in pain just to put on clothes run outside then faint
Rana definitely gives off Cordelia vibes
Yes.. she definitely does!
Buffy Season 2 second half synopsis: 12:15
it was not the 6,,,,it was the calm afterward, Angel was 100% at peace, he was no longer plagued by what the demon had done when it used his body, he at a tiny short moment was happy and at peace, for first time since he was cursed and whoooop there goes the soul and the demon is control again...sure, the 6 might have helped, but it was more that moment after, he reached true happiness and fulfillment lying next to his soulmate and boom, the curse activated
Sunnydale is located on top of a Hellmouth and has been there for a long, long time. Generations of families have lived with all the evil that pops up there and the people seem to be in a survivalist's mode; they tend to ignore or brush off that which they really can't fight or do anything about. This type of phenomenon is more explicitly explained in Stephen King's "IT". I think it may help you with this continued non understanding of the attitudes (or lack there of) of the populace as a whole in Sunnydale.
Sunnydale is Night Vale
One of the best episodes in the series. This is when shit gets truly gets epic!!!
Fuck y'all for not crying. I sobbed this episode. 😭
"that's depressing"
Well, it's a Buffy birthday afterall.
Been waiting so I can watch all 4 of the most recent reactions back-to-back.
Marketa last episode: I'm just not comfortable with Angel and Buffy's relationship.
This episode: Yes, we agree with you.
13:56 “Just say you’re a virgin, Pat.”
“Hello, Police? I’d like to report a murder.”
Did y'all forget how much Willow loved Xander? Even tho she's starting to move on, she still loves Xander. She wasn't dating Oz at this point. Add her being a teenager and it's honestly pretty understandable of her feelings.
11:25 Rana pretended to be disgusted but was actually turned on 👀
I feel like doing those character quizzes is the perfect way to spoil the show for yourselves...
Excellent Giles’ impression, Chris!
What happens to the "In the 90s" song when we eventually hit the later seasons? "In the 2000s" doesn't roll off the tongue as well.
"In the noughties" i guess? Lol.
Angelus is still my favorite villain, he’s a piece of shit but he’s so good at it.
Also Oz was always the man.
Just to answer the questions brought up on the video. Angel has been so far in the show a dual being. When he was turned, his soul was removed and was replaced with a demon. So a vampire is a play on the wolf in sheep's clothing type of thing. When he was cursed with a soul, his soul was put back and given control of the body. It was a torture for both the soul and the demon. The soul remembered every terrible thing the demon did and it tore at its conscience. The demon was doubly tortured because it both had to feel the emotions of the soul, but also was imprisoned by it, forever to watch without being able to do.
When he lost his soul, Angel reverted back to Angelus, which is just the demon. No conscience, no remorse, a hatred for human emotions like love and regret. Plus, Angelus from the past was even known to the Master, a thousand year old vampire, as one of the most vicious vampires to have ever existed.
Meet Angelus, the evil.. Dont forget it's Not Angel anymore...Damn David IS so good in This character. Perfect acting. But damn where are the others dudes ?
How do you skip the second part of a 2 parter. Angel's turn is so good this episode
Been waiting literal months for this. From the moment you guys started buffy. Such a fun journey
Mark 2:19. A poll like that seems to be based on both series as a whole, when they know everything about each character. Yet, your group has not seen all of both series yet, including the movie. But you weren't afraid of, "spoilers"? 🤔
The American army has on several occasions misplaced nuclear weapons. And while only a very small percentage of munitions get stolen, it's a small percentage from a very large number.
I call this version Angelus and he's the best but he is definitely toxic as hell
Gotta say it's interesting watching the men laugh at angel being toxic while the women are sitting in silence. This episode, and hearing Angel being so awful to Buffy after their first time was heartbreaking. Especially considering the emotional state of a 17 year old girl (this was also the day after her birthday). I didn't find it funny at all.
A lot of the men on this channel are kind of toxic. Suraj, Spidey & Micky are the only ones that don't seem gross.
I found it a lil funny because it's a show lol
@@michaelsaylor4903 i found it weird bc the show has themes that reflect real life.
Because the character is intentionally delivering humorous lines. Are you slow?
@@x-man9473 "humorous lines" is subjective. You find misogyny funny while others do not. And belittling a person's slowness or fastness of mental capacity is pretty low.
still one of the best twists in tv history. to take one of your main characters and turn him into the most vile person on the show is brilliant. appreciated your alls talk at the end recognizing that the Angel we know is essentially dead -- that's important to remember as the show goes on. Angelus is a whole new beast though it's not always that cut and dry which is why I love Angel as a character.
joss whedon has a lot to answer for, and there are elements of Buffy that don't hold up well now considering everything that's come out about Joss and I think the "boyfriend turns evil right after sex" is one of those aspects so in that regard it's not my favorite thing but for season 2's overall plot it works really well and sends the show -- and Angel the show -- into all new territory, and for that, I'll always be blown away by the show's willingness to go there.
"This is where the fun begins" :)
We really needed Micky and Surge to see this one.
They watched it on their own tho, the episodes which reactions they weren't able to join
@@Teaspooncat I figured, but can you imagine their reactions to this one with the group?!
I feel like they need a list of my not miss with the group episodes, except that would be sorta spoiler-y. It’s a catch-22.
@@RLucas3000 Yup, I agree. It would be best if all of them were able to be in every ep but I also get why they can't
Now you know we always kept saying that form Mid S2 onwards this show really takes off. This episode Innocence along with preceding episode Surprise are where the show changed. I think this is the best episode by far up until this point, but believe it or not there are two more episodes in this Season that surpass this! There are so many reveals and jaw dropping scenes coming up, but this episode Innocence definitely a Top 20 from the whole series of 144 episodes. Here we now know that Angel has changed into Angelus, where the Gypsy curse has come to pass. Buffy realising that Miss Calendar was behind it was a great scene where she grabs her by the throat in the classroom. There are so many brilliant scenes it this it is hard to pinpoint any. The pain Buffy feels when Angel is talking about her losing her virginity and sexual performance is just so hard to watch. 'Innocence' of course also refers to Willow who is devastated to see Xander kiss Cordelia, and you can also see the 'Innocence' of her budding relationship with Oz. The rocket launcher scene in the mall is epic. Strap in for the ride guys there is even better to come!
Angel is like a cooking show whereas Angelus is like a Vegas Show with sadistic acts of murder set to Barry Manilow music.
Though Angel loves Mannilow and has been to his concerts, and Angelus hates Barry Mannilow and finds him sappy. That is my favorite detail from Angel.
Drusilla is one of my absolute favorite Buffy/Angel characters. She's so psychotic and yet calculating at the same time. It's fantastic. Spike is in my top favorite list alongside her. And I admit Angelus was sadistic and dark but that's what makes him so wonderful to watch.
Finally, they’re taking the show, themes, characterizations, and moments seriously. Having real dialogue on what’s going on and understanding the depth of the situation lol like you can laugh and have fun while watching this show but sometimes the forced jokes from 8 people ruins the experience. No offense. But I’m glad it’s only 6 people on the couch for episodes like this instead of all 9 or 10 lol Especially for THIS episode.
11:20 "Things are about to get very interesting."
There is a ton of foreshadowing in this series. This is one of them.
Whedon would not top that rocket launcher scene until Avengers.
Excellent episode!
13:56 BEST. NORMIES. MOMENT EVER. f yeah! thank you dude. finally someone said it i've been rolling my eyes into the back of my head forever now.
re: Oz, I feel you Rana. one-hundo percent.
This episode doubles down on the self aware fact that it's messed up a teenage just had sex with a 200 year old vampire especially with him calling her kid BECAUSE SHE IS A KID
Also in this episode...angel said she was like a pro...so basically she sucked the soul out of him?......
That moment unfairly puts the onus on Buffy that she's a "succubus".
Because Angelus isn’t all depressed and broody and tortured, he gets to be funny and makes more jokes than Angel , so that’ a fun change in character…also, notice how Angelus wears leather pants and angel usually doesn’t. Lol