Sonic was initially designed to be "cute" for his Japanese design for Sonic 1 but when Judy Toyota created "Miles", Sonic had to be made more serious to create balance between them.
It’s funny how people take issue with Classic Sonic being mute now. Back when Gens came out, so many people were praising his lack of speech. Classic fans in 2011 hated anything to do with Sonic talking or having a story, not realizing (as you pointed out) he could always talk.
Something that I really don’t like about modern classic is that he’s supposed to be cute now. I’m pretty sure that’s also why he doesn’t talk anymore, because pantomiming is cute ig? It’s incredibly clear that this wasn’t the main goal for this design, just look at CD’s cutscenes. They show off his cool factor incredibly well, and so does his Jam art.
The whole point of him being a hedgehog is to show the cool/cute dynamic. Sonic has always had a softer, friendlier side, and the (quite literally) spikier, wilder side. The thing about Modern "Classic" Sonic is that the balance between those two sides is carelessly executed.
@@RandomHomoSapiens this is why I edited my comment to say that it wasn't the main goal of the design. My problem isn't necessarily that he's cute, it's that it's become his main thing now, like if he's that little brother that everyone calls cute. I should've phrased that better in my original comment lol
@@lordraiden7397 I don't know, the original design still looks less round, spikier and his expressions give him more of an attitude than the new version of Classic Sonic. Not to mention he was drifting further away from cute with each iteration. They definitely got rid of that edge he had and emphasised on the cuter aspects to contrast more with Modern Sonic (which himself had already lost his late 90s/ early 2000s flare from Adventure).
Sega in 2010s or 2020s is not 1990s Sega. The original guys are gone. Dont expect similar quality. At best sega can try to mimic older games. And yes, a Sonic Adventure 3 would fail at bringing back Adventure Sonic just as Sega failed to bring a proper Classic Sonic
Fun fact, when Ian Flynn first pitched the first Classic Sonic comic, he pitched it as a silent comic - without speech bubbles - because he figured classic characters couldn't talk. But then he was told that "no, everyone talks actually", so classic characters talk in the comics now lol. I guess not letting Classic Sonic talk in the games is a stylistic choice, then? (Source for this: BumbleKast for June 21st, 2021, timestamp at 25:12) Also YIPPEE Eustace Winner cameo 🙌
@@autumn7 Lol I don't know. Consistency, maybe? Or maybe they just really don't want Classic Sonic to talk in anything with a Press Start button specifically Oh, also, another BumbleKast-related fun fact (this time in the one for November 13th, 2023, timestamp at 32:07) is Ian Flynn's headcanon-y explanation for the Metal Sonic / Mecha Sonic's inconsistencies - the Sonic robots deployed after Metal Sonic might have been older models that Eggman decided to use once his main plan failed.
@@Miju001 It makes more sense that the Mecha Sonic series are robots designed for copying Sonic's abilities, while Metal was copying his speed. The Metals originally couldn't spindash, while the entire known Mecha line could, besides model 29, AKA Rocket Metal. Mecha MK 1 was likely a rushed creation, but could still do everything Sonic could do at the time, while MK 2 could imitate Sonic's elemental sheild abilities, and when he was super, he could even use some of the powers Sonic would learn in Frontiers. The Mecha series was phased out after a while.
Another thing; Classic Tails & Eggman can talk. So- What? Has Classic Tails just accepted that he couldn’t for a while or- did classic sonic just fuck with modern for fun? Im going with the latter one because that actually seems like something his younger form would do LOL
Maybe for some reason, when Classic Sonic Travelled trought time into the modern era, something made him unable to talk, and when he came back he talked again, that doesn’t explain why classic tails doesn’t seem weirded out by the fact he cant talk.
I'm still confused that classic sonic can't talk, tails and eggman can in the game hes in but he cant? Also he talks in the comics and thise are apparently cannon so idk segas weird
They tried with Gens but he was busy. That influenced them to make him silent. Modern was also gonna be Ryan Drummond in gens but dipped cause Ryan wouldn't leave his union. Me personally, I'd want Martin Burke
@@CosmicSponge2004 Jason Griffith should've played Modern Sonic, and if this game had Classic Amy, and Classic Knuckles, those four would've been played by child actors.
I HATE Classic Sonic. Not the character and the games themselves but the concept of it and its brand separation from Modern Sonic. I dislike seeing Classic and Modern Sonics in the same game, the story implications, him not talking, and the cute rebranding instead of cool and edge. As someone old enough to have witnessed the transition to 3d, this differentiation feels particularly weird. Also I definitely agree about the gampeplay in Generations as the physics and level design actually reminds me more of Adventure than anything else (especially the broken spindash).
@@seriesx9508 elaborate pls And frontiers isn't mediocre But blame sega for dragging this franchise into the mud for yrs . Is only now they try to " fix " their sins .
But Sonic has always been divided, Sonic Generations just canonized that, you can see a clear difference between Classic Sonic and Modern Sonic, they are completely different interpretations of the same character
15:21 I’ll say they do slightly retcon Amy. Since SA1 implies she and Sonic hasn’t seen each other since CD. And with the story of the 2000s, unless Amy’s hormones got really strong since SA1, I don’t think Sonic would’ve let Amy tag along without her forcing him to let her.
They kinda did, especially in heroes. In SA 2, the marrying thing felt a little more like an inside joke, while in Heroes, she had lost her sanity. Adventure 1 fealt like she had matured since CD. Her modern design kinda sucks. They should have still had her hair look a little more like the other hedgehogs.
I think Sonic CD should be a prequel. Sonic 1 is not the first time Sonic and Eggman met, but it's the first time Eggman used animals to power robots, something he never stopped doing in the Classic series and even the Adventures. It would be weird for Eggman to go back to using other power sources (seeds) only to stick with animals after that, even more so when there are plenty of animals on little planet.
That was my belief when I first played CD, as the bosses were very weak, but I changed it to what Sega now decided is canon about a year before Origins.
I'm honestly not the type of person who respects canon all the time. Of course i won't go there saying my headcanon is canon, but i'll always defend it because Sega's decision is arbitrary as mine. They didn't even think this through back then, so why bother.
Good stuff! In general (and just for perspective, speaking as someone who thinks Sonic 3 & Knuckles is the best game of the franchise and one of the top 5 video games ever made, and generally prefers the classic titles, but still enjoys plenty of other Sonic stuff): I don't really like that "Classic Sonic" has become this official, capitalized "Brand" with this rigid set of Dos and Don'ts attached. You've highlighted a lot of the weirdness and inconsistencies that arose from this, and it also just feels very limiting, creatively. The Sonic Advances and Sonic Rushes happily threw in elements from different eras of Sonic (heck, Sonic Rush overall feels a lot more like a Genesis Sonic than, say, a 6th-console-generation game, but it's arguably the game that introduced boosting, THE hallmark of Modern Sonic). And now you have fans going "Shadow can't be in this game, he's a Modern Sonic character," like it's some fundamental law. Even in Generations, it never really worked thematically. The branding of that game is all about two eras, two Sonics, etc...except when things like the levels are centered around THREE major eras. It's just this completely forced division that is handcuffing the games. As a side note, I always found the "Metal Sonic is more advanced than Mecha Sonic" as some irrefutable evidence that CD takes place after 3 was silly. Like, fans can't accept that Robotnik may have created robots in a counterintuitive order? The megalomaniacal nutjob who often builds exploitable weak spots into his own machines, was shocked when he found out that Gamma was more powerful than his predecessor (after he created both), and will let themes and aesthetics take precedence over robots' actual functionality? It's some sort of surprise that he may have made a less advanced Sonic doppelganger after a more advanced one? Let alone mundane, logical explanations like "Mecha Sonic was designed and built first, but some logistical issue prevented it from going live until later." And I'm not even convinced Metal IS "more advanced," at least not in their respective debuts (obviously, Metal later got a ton more appearances and more abilities). Mecha Sonic shows tons more versatility, can double jump, air dash, spin dash, etc., can survive tons of damage, effortlessly and accidentally one-shotted a robot that Knuckles had spent all game trying and failing to destroy, and has a super mode. By what we see onscreen, it clears Metal in several categories, only losing in top speed (and with its dash and spin dash, it may actually be able to compete there...we never see it travel much more than a screen length) and having a clunkier appearance.
Ngl im not a huge fan of modern classic sonic, the darker blue and overall shinier look of older classic sonic and his pals is definitely my go to classic sonic
yeah i didnt really touch on design much here but i prefer darker blue too and i have some issues with the current classic sonic model, i think he looks good in superstars though bc the animations are really good even if the model is still not quite right
One problem with Classic Sonic Timeline split idea is that, it does mess with Silver’s character. He’s all about saving his future, and unless Sega wants to go in that direction with his character and see how things can go, it would make Silver’s efforts saving his future pointless. As the split timeline would just mean his home world is still destroyed. Now, I’m not super bummed by this idea, as again, this is a massive story opportunity for Silver. Having to come to terms that his initial efforts were pointless. But becomes determined to use his good future as a safe haven for anyone from the bad futures. Sure, it would mean ripping people from their homes, but at the same time, he’s helping people get a new safer home they live in prosperity in.
I feel that Sonic CD's placement in the timeline was chosen, officially, for gameplay in Origins. I heard this from a RUclipsr I saw, where he theorized the reason they did it, was that it would be really weird if it went from the gameplay 1 to 2 to 3K to CD in one sitting, were each game feels like it was biulding from the last, on for CD to regress from 3K. So I feel the choice was for gameplay rather than lore.
That point u made about the another dimension line is actually really good what the hell. Now I’m kinda mad they retconned that recton that was partially a retcon in of itself lol
I'll be real I was a little happy they put classic back on the same timeline bc I usually don't like AU stories much but you lowkey made me realize what we lost now...
Classic Sonic not controlling exactly like himself in Generations honestly shows how strong the game design is in that game. They chose the cohesion of their own game over replicating another game's controls, I can respect that.
@@sumnahlennon5449 Not to be a prick but that's kind of a different thing to what I said. I was talking about the game design itself, not how accurate it is to the classic games. Does that make sense?
To some extent I agree that Classic Sonic doesn't necessarily need to control exactly like the classics to feel good, but I feel like things like rolling downhill to gain more speed, which is a fundamental part of classic gameplay, should be replicated to some extent. It's weird that it isn't and I think the game suffers for it. Speaking as someone who likes the Classic levels in Generations.
@@autumn7 Yea I understand, as someone who's pretty regularly faced with having to make game design decisions, I do think Classic controlling the way he does makes Generations a better game in a vaccuum, as it'd be bad to switch up the controls/level design philosophy completely between playstyles. For instance, it's weird to introduce the gimmick of pinball physics and rolling when half of the game has nothing to do with it. I think this is part of the reason why Classic's "go fast move" (spindash) is on the same button as Modern's "go fast move" (boost). It just has to do with the cohesion principle of game design.
The classic levels in Sonic Generations are absolutely not well designed. The levels are fun when you breeze through the mindlessly easy ones. But the moment Sega tried to add difficulty in later levels like Crisis,City and Planet Wisp they sucked. Then again thats a flaw in Generations in general.
Thing is they easily could have kept cohesion with the game while keeping the controls for Classic the same. All that would need to be done is design the playstyle first, then design the levels around that. Without that, he still controls fine-ish but he doesn't feel as advertised and instead feels more like Modern Sonic but with less abilities and in 2D.
Fun fact: according to the 30th Anniversary Deluxe Edition comic, the Classic comics originally weren't going to have dialogue. I'm so, so glad that they didn't go through with that.
7:45 Well, the whole thing about Classic Sonic being from "another dimension" might have been a Translation Error when the writers of Sonic Forces were working on the English script for the US Release of the game. But in the Japanese version of the game, Tails actually says that Classic Sonic is from The Past. And this was later confirmed in the TailsTube episode with Amy Rose that Classic Sonic is how Sonic looked in the past, and Modern Sonic is what Classic Sonic grew up to be in his later adventures. So, the whole timeline split theory thing after generations is retcon/debunked.
Unlike the other games where classic Sonic couldn’t talk. Generations actually had a reason for him to not speak, it’s because he was meant to speak. Jaleel white was originally going to voice classic sonic, but at the time, he was busy and as such, classic sonic remained voiceless.
In Generations, something I've noticed is that it's not just lacking in high bounces, it also doesn't have low bounces either. In the original games, bouncing could propel you just slightly, or affect your movement in a detrimental way outright, meaning some jumps can end be affected by damaging enemies the wrong way. In Generations, you're propelled after damaging an enemy, both forward and upwards, meaning that at least in most scenarios, it's beneficial to "ram" them with jumps. I might be wrong though, but this is how it was from my experience
when sonic cd was placed before sonic 2 and 3, i always thought that the mecha sonics we fight after sonic cd are the prototypes of metal sonic eggman made, and he decided to use those prototypes against sonic after metal sonic was killed.
Wow, I always thought it was so weird that they removed his voices from Sonic CD in Sonic Origins but never stopped to think that it was probably because of this "Classic Sonic doesn't talk" trend that they've been going with since Generations.
What I hate about Modern Classic Sonic is Sega's insistence that Classic Sonic is just Sonic from the past. TailsTube can try and retcon it all they want, but there are numerous contradictions to that. Like you pointed out, if that were the case, Modern Sonic would have remembered the Phantom Ruby and the Time Eater. Furthermore, Eggman would have had the Phantom Ruby in his data logs before the events of Sonic Forces. Why would he go for that plan after what happened with the Hard Boiled Heavies? And then there are just Classic characters that never appear in the Modern Games. Nack, Bean, Bark, Mighty & Ray. Not even the Tails Doll! The Chaos Emeralds having different variations does explain a lot from the OG games. I think they could still work if we only take Sonic 1 into account. It could also explain the Super Emeralds from Sonic 3 & Knuckles and why Sonic never went Hyper again lore-wise. Another problem I find with Modern Classic Sonic is that he's too cutesy compared to the edge he had back in the 90s where he was advertised to have an attitude compared to Mario or Mega Man. He feels more childlike and silly from the bright colours. Where's the coolness that hooked us originally?
He doesn’t talk because classic purists were complaining and saying “I wish we went back to the simple times when sonic didn’t talk and theres no story and the games were good” all points there are wrong but seem correct on surface level. And now they keep trying to pander to those fans when now most older fans grew up on 2000s media so they are only just starting to realise this in sxshg 12:09 there is other evidence for the more than one set of emeralds theory but for that it was purely due to a lack of communication when South Island was supposed to be the setting of all sonic sonic games but they changed that in sonic 2 but the game gear games kept doing that. The multi emerald theory would have probably been the original intention but it already got retconned in sa1 when tails says the seven chaos emeralds. The way I explain the metal sonic thing is Eggman went to the past to build metal sonic since he had all the time in the world literally he built metal sonic perfectly and while trying to recreate him had to make 2 less advanced versions while he finishes up metal sonic which you then see in sa1 final egg hub and the sonic heroes. And as for the timeline split? It’s real imo. Sonic would already know how to deal with the phantom ruby and he learns chaos control in sonic superstars without shadow (slow yellow chaos emerald power up) And it still wouldn’t be classic shadow because shadow was created in his modern form. And it would pot be interesting because we know the biolizard and the arks gonna crash and everything so I’d rather them just do new story’s
i don't really WANT shadow to appear in the classic games, i was just saying they theoretically could as a means of saying if there was a split timeline they could basically do anything they wanted with the classic titles. the reasoning for him not talking makes sense, not in a "oh i agree with that reasoning" way but in a "...yeah sega WOULD do that" way i still think referencing the sonic chaos manual is fair game bc that is the canon story of the game and we know sonic chaos and triple trouble are canon bc like, yk, fang is in superstars, but yeah there is other evidence there that i know of it's just referencing a mainline game feels more reputable and i didn't wanna go on for too long on one point and in one of the TailsTube videos they did around when superstars was coming out, the modern cast talked about their adventures on the northstar islands, which means it happened in the same timeline as the modern canon. so the timeline split isn't considered canon by sega.
If each island was supposed to have its own set of Chaos Emeralds, then wouldn't that mean that Sonic took away Westside Island's emeralds in Sonic 2's good ending? And since Knuckles takes the emeralds Sonic already had at the beginning of Sonic 3, are we collecting that same set in that game or Angel Island's own set? What happened to the other?
13:40 my theory on metal sonic is, since he is only in the bad future, an alternative timeline sonic who was robotisized by Eggman. Which isvwhy in later titles he isn't as powerful. Since he has been blown up so so many times. Amd why Eggman praises metal as his ultimate creation. Because it's hi one and only successful defeat of sonic.
I always liked to think that Metal Sonic was created under way more time than the Mechas were. After all, Eggman did had access to time travel in CD. (Of course there's always the "Metal Sonic is a robotizied Sonic from the Bad Future" theory, but that's more so a fun headcanon than anything concrete)
i headcanon that classic just immediately got his mind wiped through time portal/phantom ruby shenanigans after gens and forces its the only way i can make sense of him still being from the past🙏🙏😭
i feel like CD is most likely between 1 and 2 for the main reason that 2 and CD were supposed to be the same game, with CD having been supposed to be an upgraded version of 2 for the Sega CD addon, however, along the way CD and 2 split paths in development, and considering CD seems more similar to 1 than 2 and has the “see you next game” screen with Tails, i’m very inclined to believe CD takes place before 2, where Sonic 1 happens, a little time passes, Little Planet appears, Eggman chains it in place, Sonic goes and kickstarts CD, then shortly after freeing Little Planet Sonic goes after Eggman, starting 2
5:33 no one EVER talks about this game! I loved this version. Sad that this games levels won't get ported in the new re-release. This game will sadly be lost to time and forgotten by everyone...
Until Sega inevitably retcons something again I'm choosing to believe Classic Sonic _can_ talk, he just chooses not to because he's a little shit and thinks it's funny.
I strongly believe that CD's timeline placement via Origins was a retcon. If I recall correctly, the way that Sonic 4 Episode 2 was advertised seemed to imply CD was after 3&K but I could be remembering wrong. I also believe Ian Flynn said something regarding CD's placwment prior to Origins but I don't remember.
13:02 Counter point with Metal Sonic. All he does is race Sonic and nothing else, aside from either shock or boost into him. Not really being combat oriented. I like to believe post 3&K, Eggman took more time to refine some of the advancements the Mecha Sonic line had into Metal Sonic.
I know unpopular opinion but Classic Sonic brand should always represent the past it’s in the name. If they were to make a new original 2D game that evolves from the traditional formula then it’d be Modern. Also Tails referring to Classic Sonic being from another dimension I saw as being meta like from the 2D dimension.
Dude, can you make a video talking about Knuckles' Chaotix and whether if it is canon or not? I think it would be an interesting video and honestly idk if it is canon.
TBH I think Classic Sonic side should have at least 1 or 2 more game(s), mostly because back in the late 2000s during the dark age of Sonic, Sonic Fanboys at that time where demanding a new 2D Classic Sonic game after games like Sonic Heroes, Shadow the Hedgehog, the two Riders games, the Rivals series, the Storybook games, Sonic Chronicles and especially Sonic 06 ruined the series reputation. 2010 came and We got Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode I and one didn't complain about how the gameplay (which is why Sonic 4 sucked) was he was complain about the fact that they used Modern Sonic and Modern Eggman from Sonic Adventure 1-Today instead of Classic Sonic and Classic Eggman, few followed but those with brains called him out on that nitpick, 2011 came Sega brought back Classic Sonic for Sonic Generations and 2017 came and We got Sonic Mania and it got DLC with Sonic Mania Plus. Sonic Mania/Sonic Mania Plus I felt that this is what Classic Sonic games should be to please those who grew up with the series since 1991 and that Modern Sonic should please those who grew up with the series since 1998 and especially that the Sonic Movies brought back those older fans from the Genesis/Mega Drive era and gave up on it since 2006, I think something like a Neo Classic Sonic trilogy should be a thing like the Genesis/Mega Drive Trilogy are a thing, Sonic Mania/Sonic Mania Plus, Sonic Superstar and whatever they're going to call the next Classic Sonic game Sonic Robo Crisis where you play as Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, Mighty and Ray fighting the hard boiled heavies or something to wrap up the Classic Sonic games and have a transition into Sonic Adventure 1.
If anything, Classic Sonic doesn't talk to make Classic Sonic look good by comparison. It's like they're going "Look, he doesn't have an annoying voice! He's not saying Baldy Nose Hair like that awful green eyed imposter Sonic!" It's kind of frustrating.
I’m pretty indifferent to this ‘modern’ classic sonic stuff. Classic sonic can definitely talk it’s just SEGA being SEGA. Classic sonic being “cute” just removes the whole point of his personality. But it’s accepted cuz’ Sonic Mania was absolutely peak and most are okay with Superstars (I hate it). But really now Sonic Mania is like officially licensed fan game by passionate fans who later became programmers and developers themselves and it’s the last real breathe of fresh air the sonic series has had in terms of gameplay. Even if that game is super derivative at times it still does a LOT of new great things and it’s overall the best playing sonic game. But the last… iconographically unique sonic game I remember is Colors and even then, that was very clearly trying to be Super Mario Galaxy, then Generations speaks for itself… aside from the great gameplay and level design and music that game is mostly empty but whatever 20th anniversary. Lost World is Mario 3D Land and whatever. Zeti are the Koopalings even. Obtuse gameplay yay. Forces is a mish mash of half baked “ideas” or ACTUALLYYY really now stipulations from SEGA • serious story • sonic friends back-ish • Eggman competent again • Chaos • Shadow • Gromit • OKAY, that’s the pretentious lot out of the way! Classic sonic • Modern sonics • hey let’s do ocs as a gimmick that’ll save the game cuz’ we just recycled assets from previous games and slapped this together in a few months lol Frontiers is breath of the wild but sonic-ified lol and most of the gameplay is whatever puzzles and traversing barren and soulless maps and everything the game does has been done better in previous sonic games or different games in general (combat is so bad lol) And the music has lost a lot of its sonic appeal now. Sonic superstars is new super Mario bros with Sonic and friends and it’s also ‘We have sonic Mania at home’ and with absolutely horrid boss fights making this one of the most frustrating sonic games ever and it doesn’t really bring anything new to the table. New character with one dragon gimmick? (Insert cubot going ‘check’) no real definable story (‘check!’) recycled zone aesthetics creating the false illusion of new stuff? (‘Check! Got it all boss.’) thanks cubot. Oh yea there’s origins which isn’t that bad cuz’ it’s just the classics and they’re more consumer friendly but the deluxe options are horrid lol. Same for Superstars, frontiers and especially sonic x shadow. An extra ten quid for a worthless skin but then a whole level? In c o n c l u s i o n , the series has bigger problems lol. It’s completely creatively bankrupt and ripping off fans cuz’ SEGA knows they’ll eat it up… Third film looks sweet though.
I know this is a very dumb thing to mention but in the genesis games, when sonic rolls then jumps, he cant turn around but thats changed in mania… yes i spent too much time on those games how can you tell?
I have an issue with the split timeline theory. If we're going by what Generations established, the Classic characters are the younger versions of the Modern characters, obviously meaning that they grew up into the Modern characters. Now if the split timeline is real, and it means that the Classic series can be separate to the Modern series without contradicting anything, then does that just mean that the characters aren't going to grow into their Modern counterparts anymore? Plus if they suddenly include Modern elements into the Classic series then what's even the point of a Classic/Modern split in the first place? That's what really bugs me about all of this. It really does feel like this entire split was made to appease all of the whiney fan boys who complained about Sonic's darned eye colour in Sonic 4, and Sega have been desperately trying to appease them ever since. It just comes across as petty and ridiculous!
Sonic cd should take place after sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles cause it makes more sense cause why would Eggman go from really advanced robot to clunky robot to more advanced but not as advanced as metal sonic robot back to metal sonic it makes no sense
@@Angel-jackal One thing that makes sense is the fact that Metal Sonic's big battle happens in the FUTURE, which might imply that he is from the future. This makes sense because he seems very advanced compared to all his basic badniks. Another fact to point out about this is that according to Sonic 4, eggman left metal sonic on little planet and couldn't use him for a long time because he was stuck there. Or I don't know, this game series is silly sometimes 😂
I do not like "modern" classic sonic, hes way too cutsey like he literally looks more rounder and shorter and chivi than he actualy was in the 90s and that light blue fucking ew. I can't wait for alaxender gogolevs sonic mod for gens to come out his model is spot on to 90s sonic
although I agree with the person who is talking about how modern classic sonic is bad because they try to make them look cute when really he was cool but things that I don’t hear despite them being really big changes is how they literally took his voice and shrunk the cast down to six or seven like why not bring back the classic chaotix with their fun designs or or even the the tails sky patrol characters
also, personally, I don’t believe there’s more shits of chaos or modes in the original personally, I think that all 5 or 4 islands are supported by the chaos emerald an egg man using them as a battery source and personally, I believe metal sonic should come Second with both mechas from Sonic 2 and eight bit Sonic 2 being the first one being prototypes and then personally, I believe the rest of the mechas are are more of spin offs of metal sonic like have you noticed that each mecha sonic even the prototypes all have gimmicks but not metal sonic(neo metal don’t count he did that to himself)
Sonic was initially designed to be "cute" for his Japanese design for Sonic 1 but when Judy Toyota created "Miles", Sonic had to be made more serious to create balance between them.
Yeah in pretty much all the art after 1 they made him slightly taller
He was actually planned to be edgier in Japan until America toned him down
It’s funny how people take issue with Classic Sonic being mute now. Back when Gens came out, so many people were praising his lack of speech.
Classic fans in 2011 hated anything to do with Sonic talking or having a story, not realizing (as you pointed out) he could always talk.
Something that I really don’t like about modern classic is that he’s supposed to be cute now. I’m pretty sure that’s also why he doesn’t talk anymore, because pantomiming is cute ig? It’s incredibly clear that this wasn’t the main goal for this design, just look at CD’s cutscenes. They show off his cool factor incredibly well, and so does his Jam art.
My dear friend early marketing for sonic and his Japanese design leaned for the cute look.
The whole point of him being a hedgehog is to show the cool/cute dynamic. Sonic has always had a softer, friendlier side, and the (quite literally) spikier, wilder side.
The thing about Modern "Classic" Sonic is that the balance between those two sides is carelessly executed.
@@RandomHomoSapiens this is why I edited my comment to say that it wasn't the main goal of the design. My problem isn't necessarily that he's cute, it's that it's become his main thing now, like if he's that little brother that everyone calls cute. I should've phrased that better in my original comment lol
@@lordraiden7397 I don't know, the original design still looks less round, spikier and his expressions give him more of an attitude than the new version of Classic Sonic. Not to mention he was drifting further away from cute with each iteration.
They definitely got rid of that edge he had and emphasised on the cuter aspects to contrast more with Modern Sonic (which himself had already lost his late 90s/ early 2000s flare from Adventure).
Sega in 2010s or 2020s is not 1990s Sega. The original guys are gone. Dont expect similar quality. At best sega can try to mimic older games.
And yes, a Sonic Adventure 3 would fail at bringing back Adventure Sonic just as Sega failed to bring a proper Classic Sonic
Fun fact, when Ian Flynn first pitched the first Classic Sonic comic, he pitched it as a silent comic - without speech bubbles - because he figured classic characters couldn't talk. But then he was told that "no, everyone talks actually", so classic characters talk in the comics now lol. I guess not letting Classic Sonic talk in the games is a stylistic choice, then? (Source for this: BumbleKast for June 21st, 2021, timestamp at 25:12)
Also YIPPEE Eustace Winner cameo 🙌
then why did origins remove sonic's voice clips in cd if they decided classic sonic could talk by that point... sega continues to bewilder me 😭
@@autumn7
Maybe they needed permission from the person who did the voice lines and couldn’t get it?
Honestly, feels like a really superfluous change.
@@autumn7 Lol I don't know. Consistency, maybe? Or maybe they just really don't want Classic Sonic to talk in anything with a Press Start button specifically
Oh, also, another BumbleKast-related fun fact (this time in the one for November 13th, 2023, timestamp at 32:07) is Ian Flynn's headcanon-y explanation for the Metal Sonic / Mecha Sonic's inconsistencies - the Sonic robots deployed after Metal Sonic might have been older models that Eggman decided to use once his main plan failed.
@@Miju001 It makes more sense that the Mecha Sonic series are robots designed for copying Sonic's abilities, while Metal was copying his speed. The Metals originally couldn't spindash, while the entire known Mecha line could, besides model 29, AKA Rocket Metal. Mecha MK 1 was likely a rushed creation, but could still do everything Sonic could do at the time, while MK 2 could imitate Sonic's elemental sheild abilities, and when he was super, he could even use some of the powers Sonic would learn in Frontiers. The Mecha series was phased out after a while.
@@WikiThis The voice lines were in the mobile version last I checked. One of the devs voiced Sonic.
Another thing; Classic Tails & Eggman can talk. So- What? Has Classic Tails just accepted that he couldn’t for a while or- did classic sonic just fuck with modern for fun? Im going with the latter one because that actually seems like something his younger form would do LOL
Maybe he was so starstruck by his older self's coolness that he was stunned into silence :P
Maybe Sonic had issues with using his voice and learned to make sounds with his mouth way too late
Maybe for some reason, when Classic Sonic Travelled trought time into the modern era, something made him unable to talk, and when he came back he talked again, that doesn’t explain why classic tails doesn’t seem weirded out by the fact he cant talk.
@@KyndlingStoneCB wouldn't he know he's pranking himself??
I'm still confused that classic sonic can't talk, tails and eggman can in the game hes in but he cant? Also he talks in the comics and thise are apparently cannon so idk segas weird
If Classic Sonic did have a voice, I wonder if they would try to get Jaleel White.
How about Dante Basco?
They tried with Gens but he was busy. That influenced them to make him silent.
Modern was also gonna be Ryan Drummond in gens but dipped cause Ryan wouldn't leave his union.
Me personally, I'd want Martin Burke
@@CosmicSponge2004 Jason Griffith should've played Modern Sonic, and if this game had Classic Amy, and Classic Knuckles, those four would've been played by child actors.
@@krystiancharos889 I personally think a child actor for Knuckles would be an awful idea but I'm a bit intrigued
@@CosmicSponge2004 Thanks, I was imagining the classic versions of Sonic, Tails, Amy, and Knuckles portrayed like realistic kids.
I HATE Classic Sonic.
Not the character and the games themselves but the concept of it and its brand separation from Modern Sonic.
I dislike seeing Classic and Modern Sonics in the same game, the story implications, him not talking, and the cute rebranding instead of cool and edge. As someone old enough to have witnessed the transition to 3d, this differentiation feels particularly weird.
Also I definitely agree about the gampeplay in Generations as the physics and level design actually reminds me more of Adventure than anything else (especially the broken spindash).
I hate Modern Sonic. Then again I havent played these mediocre games in years.
@@seriesx9508 elaborate pls
And frontiers isn't mediocre
But blame sega for dragging this franchise into the mud for yrs .
Is only now they try to " fix " their sins .
@@seriesx9508 Cool dawg
Yep can't stand how cutesy he looks now
But Sonic has always been divided, Sonic Generations just canonized that, you can see a clear difference between Classic Sonic and Modern Sonic, they are completely different interpretations of the same character
15:21
I’ll say they do slightly retcon Amy. Since SA1 implies she and Sonic hasn’t seen each other since CD. And with the story of the 2000s, unless Amy’s hormones got really strong since SA1, I don’t think Sonic would’ve let Amy tag along without her forcing him to let her.
They kinda did, especially in heroes. In SA 2, the marrying thing felt a little more like an inside joke, while in Heroes, she had lost her sanity. Adventure 1 fealt like she had matured since CD. Her modern design kinda sucks. They should have still had her hair look a little more like the other hedgehogs.
I think Sonic CD should be a prequel. Sonic 1 is not the first time Sonic and Eggman met, but it's the first time Eggman used animals to power robots, something he never stopped doing in the Classic series and even the Adventures. It would be weird for Eggman to go back to using other power sources (seeds) only to stick with animals after that, even more so when there are plenty of animals on little planet.
That was my belief when I first played CD, as the bosses were very weak, but I changed it to what Sega now decided is canon about a year before Origins.
I'm honestly not the type of person who respects canon all the time. Of course i won't go there saying my headcanon is canon, but i'll always defend it because Sega's decision is arbitrary as mine. They didn't even think this through back then, so why bother.
Good stuff!
In general (and just for perspective, speaking as someone who thinks Sonic 3 & Knuckles is the best game of the franchise and one of the top 5 video games ever made, and generally prefers the classic titles, but still enjoys plenty of other Sonic stuff): I don't really like that "Classic Sonic" has become this official, capitalized "Brand" with this rigid set of Dos and Don'ts attached. You've highlighted a lot of the weirdness and inconsistencies that arose from this, and it also just feels very limiting, creatively. The Sonic Advances and Sonic Rushes happily threw in elements from different eras of Sonic (heck, Sonic Rush overall feels a lot more like a Genesis Sonic than, say, a 6th-console-generation game, but it's arguably the game that introduced boosting, THE hallmark of Modern Sonic). And now you have fans going "Shadow can't be in this game, he's a Modern Sonic character," like it's some fundamental law.
Even in Generations, it never really worked thematically. The branding of that game is all about two eras, two Sonics, etc...except when things like the levels are centered around THREE major eras. It's just this completely forced division that is handcuffing the games.
As a side note, I always found the "Metal Sonic is more advanced than Mecha Sonic" as some irrefutable evidence that CD takes place after 3 was silly. Like, fans can't accept that Robotnik may have created robots in a counterintuitive order? The megalomaniacal nutjob who often builds exploitable weak spots into his own machines, was shocked when he found out that Gamma was more powerful than his predecessor (after he created both), and will let themes and aesthetics take precedence over robots' actual functionality? It's some sort of surprise that he may have made a less advanced Sonic doppelganger after a more advanced one? Let alone mundane, logical explanations like "Mecha Sonic was designed and built first, but some logistical issue prevented it from going live until later."
And I'm not even convinced Metal IS "more advanced," at least not in their respective debuts (obviously, Metal later got a ton more appearances and more abilities). Mecha Sonic shows tons more versatility, can double jump, air dash, spin dash, etc., can survive tons of damage, effortlessly and accidentally one-shotted a robot that Knuckles had spent all game trying and failing to destroy, and has a super mode. By what we see onscreen, it clears Metal in several categories, only losing in top speed (and with its dash and spin dash, it may actually be able to compete there...we never see it travel much more than a screen length) and having a clunkier appearance.
Ngl im not a huge fan of modern classic sonic, the darker blue and overall shinier look of older classic sonic and his pals is definitely my go to classic sonic
yeah i didnt really touch on design much here but i prefer darker blue too and i have some issues with the current classic sonic model, i think he looks good in superstars though bc the animations are really good even if the model is still not quite right
13:00 cd taking place after 3 was decided since the release of sonic 4, when they finally decided for the first time it's place in the timeline
Sonic 4 was about a year after CD. CD would've taken place at least a year before 4, an by extension, 3.
One problem with Classic Sonic Timeline split idea is that, it does mess with Silver’s character. He’s all about saving his future, and unless Sega wants to go in that direction with his character and see how things can go, it would make Silver’s efforts saving his future pointless. As the split timeline would just mean his home world is still destroyed.
Now, I’m not super bummed by this idea, as again, this is a massive story opportunity for Silver. Having to come to terms that his initial efforts were pointless. But becomes determined to use his good future as a safe haven for anyone from the bad futures. Sure, it would mean ripping people from their homes, but at the same time, he’s helping people get a new safer home they live in prosperity in.
I feel that Sonic CD's placement in the timeline was chosen, officially, for gameplay in Origins. I heard this from a RUclipsr I saw, where he theorized the reason they did it, was that it would be really weird if it went from the gameplay 1 to 2 to 3K to CD in one sitting, were each game feels like it was biulding from the last, on for CD to regress from 3K. So I feel the choice was for gameplay rather than lore.
That point u made about the another dimension line is actually really good what the hell.
Now I’m kinda mad they retconned that recton that was partially a retcon in of itself lol
I'll be real I was a little happy they put classic back on the same timeline bc I usually don't like AU stories much but you lowkey made me realize what we lost now...
Classic Sonic not controlling exactly like himself in Generations honestly shows how strong the game design is in that game.
They chose the cohesion of their own game over replicating another game's controls, I can respect that.
@@sumnahlennon5449 Not to be a prick but that's kind of a different thing to what I said. I was talking about the game design itself, not how accurate it is to the classic games. Does that make sense?
To some extent I agree that Classic Sonic doesn't necessarily need to control exactly like the classics to feel good, but I feel like things like rolling downhill to gain more speed, which is a fundamental part of classic gameplay, should be replicated to some extent. It's weird that it isn't and I think the game suffers for it. Speaking as someone who likes the Classic levels in Generations.
@@autumn7 Yea I understand, as someone who's pretty regularly faced with having to make game design decisions, I do think Classic controlling the way he does makes Generations a better game in a vaccuum, as it'd be bad to switch up the controls/level design philosophy completely between playstyles. For instance, it's weird to introduce the gimmick of pinball physics and rolling when half of the game has nothing to do with it. I think this is part of the reason why Classic's "go fast move" (spindash) is on the same button as Modern's "go fast move" (boost). It just has to do with the cohesion principle of game design.
The classic levels in Sonic Generations are absolutely not well designed. The levels are fun when you breeze through the mindlessly easy ones. But the moment Sega tried to add difficulty in later levels like Crisis,City and Planet Wisp they sucked.
Then again thats a flaw in Generations in general.
Thing is they easily could have kept cohesion with the game while keeping the controls for Classic the same. All that would need to be done is design the playstyle first, then design the levels around that. Without that, he still controls fine-ish but he doesn't feel as advertised and instead feels more like Modern Sonic but with less abilities and in 2D.
Sonic the Hedgehog
I agree!
Yes
Nein.
Super Mario Bros.
Tails the Mutant Squirrel
Classic Sonic: can't talk.
Classic Tails: talks.
That is really weird.
Fun fact: according to the 30th Anniversary Deluxe Edition comic, the Classic comics originally weren't going to have dialogue. I'm so, so glad that they didn't go through with that.
7:45 Well, the whole thing about Classic Sonic being from "another dimension" might have been a Translation Error when the writers of Sonic Forces were working on the English script for the US Release of the game.
But in the Japanese version of the game, Tails actually says that Classic Sonic is from The Past. And this was later confirmed in the TailsTube episode with Amy Rose that Classic Sonic is how Sonic looked in the past, and Modern Sonic is what Classic Sonic grew up to be in his later adventures.
So, the whole timeline split theory thing after generations is retcon/debunked.
Unlike the other games where classic Sonic couldn’t talk.
Generations actually had a reason for him to not speak, it’s because he was meant to speak.
Jaleel white was originally going to voice classic sonic, but at the time, he was busy and as such, classic sonic remained voiceless.
In Generations, something I've noticed is that it's not just lacking in high bounces, it also doesn't have low bounces either. In the original games, bouncing could propel you just slightly, or affect your movement in a detrimental way outright, meaning some jumps can end be affected by damaging enemies the wrong way. In Generations, you're propelled after damaging an enemy, both forward and upwards, meaning that at least in most scenarios, it's beneficial to "ram" them with jumps. I might be wrong though, but this is how it was from my experience
when sonic cd was placed before sonic 2 and 3, i always thought that the mecha sonics we fight after sonic cd are the prototypes of metal sonic eggman made, and he decided to use those prototypes against sonic after metal sonic was killed.
Really liking these videos. Really happy I came across this channel!
Wow, I always thought it was so weird that they removed his voices from Sonic CD in Sonic Origins but never stopped to think that it was probably because of this "Classic Sonic doesn't talk" trend that they've been going with since Generations.
What I hate about Modern Classic Sonic is Sega's insistence that Classic Sonic is just Sonic from the past. TailsTube can try and retcon it all they want, but there are numerous contradictions to that.
Like you pointed out, if that were the case, Modern Sonic would have remembered the Phantom Ruby and the Time Eater. Furthermore, Eggman would have had the Phantom Ruby in his data logs before the events of Sonic Forces. Why would he go for that plan after what happened with the Hard Boiled Heavies?
And then there are just Classic characters that never appear in the Modern Games. Nack, Bean, Bark, Mighty & Ray. Not even the Tails Doll!
The Chaos Emeralds having different variations does explain a lot from the OG games. I think they could still work if we only take Sonic 1 into account. It could also explain the Super Emeralds from Sonic 3 & Knuckles and why Sonic never went Hyper again lore-wise.
Another problem I find with Modern Classic Sonic is that he's too cutesy compared to the edge he had back in the 90s where he was advertised to have an attitude compared to Mario or Mega Man. He feels more childlike and silly from the bright colours. Where's the coolness that hooked us originally?
He doesn’t talk because classic purists were complaining and saying “I wish we went back to the simple times when sonic didn’t talk and theres no story and the games were good” all points there are wrong but seem correct on surface level. And now they keep trying to pander to those fans when now most older fans grew up on 2000s media so they are only just starting to realise this in sxshg
12:09 there is other evidence for the more than one set of emeralds theory but for that it was purely due to a lack of communication when South Island was supposed to be the setting of all sonic sonic games but they changed that in sonic 2 but the game gear games kept doing that. The multi emerald theory would have probably been the original intention but it already got retconned in sa1 when tails says the seven chaos emeralds.
The way I explain the metal sonic thing is Eggman went to the past to build metal sonic since he had all the time in the world literally he built metal sonic perfectly and while trying to recreate him had to make 2 less advanced versions while he finishes up metal sonic which you then see in sa1 final egg hub and the sonic heroes.
And as for the timeline split? It’s real imo. Sonic would already know how to deal with the phantom ruby and he learns chaos control in sonic superstars without shadow (slow yellow chaos emerald power up)
And it still wouldn’t be classic shadow because shadow was created in his modern form. And it would pot be interesting because we know the biolizard and the arks gonna crash and everything so I’d rather them just do new story’s
i don't really WANT shadow to appear in the classic games, i was just saying they theoretically could as a means of saying if there was a split timeline they could basically do anything they wanted with the classic titles.
the reasoning for him not talking makes sense, not in a "oh i agree with that reasoning" way but in a "...yeah sega WOULD do that" way
i still think referencing the sonic chaos manual is fair game bc that is the canon story of the game and we know sonic chaos and triple trouble are canon bc like, yk, fang is in superstars, but yeah there is other evidence there that i know of it's just referencing a mainline game feels more reputable and i didn't wanna go on for too long on one point
and in one of the TailsTube videos they did around when superstars was coming out, the modern cast talked about their adventures on the northstar islands, which means it happened in the same timeline as the modern canon. so the timeline split isn't considered canon by sega.
If each island was supposed to have its own set of Chaos Emeralds, then wouldn't that mean that Sonic took away Westside Island's emeralds in Sonic 2's good ending? And since Knuckles takes the emeralds Sonic already had at the beginning of Sonic 3, are we collecting that same set in that game or Angel Island's own set? What happened to the other?
13:40 my theory on metal sonic is, since he is only in the bad future, an alternative timeline sonic who was robotisized by Eggman. Which isvwhy in later titles he isn't as powerful. Since he has been blown up so so many times. Amd why Eggman praises metal as his ultimate creation. Because it's hi one and only successful defeat of sonic.
I wanna boost this video's engagement but don't really have an interesting opinion on this so, uh... classic rouge would be cool to see ig
The sonic from another dimension thing was a miss translation I believe
8:01 While I was watching this video before this part I was thinking the exact same thing
I always liked to think that Metal Sonic was created under way more time than the Mechas were. After all, Eggman did had access to time travel in CD.
(Of course there's always the "Metal Sonic is a robotizied Sonic from the Bad Future" theory, but that's more so a fun headcanon than anything concrete)
Santiago must pay for his crimes.
i headcanon that classic just immediately got his mind wiped through time portal/phantom ruby shenanigans after gens and forces
its the only way i can make sense of him still being from the past🙏🙏😭
also so jealous you have the cell shaded superstars skin
2:51 ah yes my favorite classic sonic line
i feel like CD is most likely between 1 and 2 for the main reason that 2 and CD were supposed to be the same game, with CD having been supposed to be an upgraded version of 2 for the Sega CD addon, however, along the way CD and 2 split paths in development, and considering CD seems more similar to 1 than 2 and has the “see you next game” screen with Tails, i’m very inclined to believe CD takes place before 2, where Sonic 1 happens, a little time passes, Little Planet appears, Eggman chains it in place, Sonic goes and kickstarts CD, then shortly after freeing Little Planet Sonic goes after Eggman, starting 2
5:33 no one EVER talks about this game! I loved this version. Sad that this games levels won't get ported in the new re-release. This game will sadly be lost to time and forgotten by everyone...
ngl ill never understand those inconsistencies but uh good video
I have a theory why he doesn't talk there's no reason for him to talk he
can talk just chooses not to
Until Sega inevitably retcons something again I'm choosing to believe Classic Sonic _can_ talk, he just chooses not to because he's a little shit and thinks it's funny.
I strongly believe that CD's timeline placement via Origins was a retcon. If I recall correctly, the way that Sonic 4 Episode 2 was advertised seemed to imply CD was after 3&K but I could be remembering wrong. I also believe Ian Flynn said something regarding CD's placwment prior to Origins but I don't remember.
13:02
Counter point with Metal Sonic. All he does is race Sonic and nothing else, aside from either shock or boost into him. Not really being combat oriented.
I like to believe post 3&K, Eggman took more time to refine some of the advancements the Mecha Sonic line had into Metal Sonic.
His name is Santiego
I know unpopular opinion but Classic Sonic brand should always represent the past it’s in the name. If they were to make a new original 2D game that evolves from the traditional formula then it’d be Modern. Also Tails referring to Classic Sonic being from another dimension I saw as being meta like from the 2D dimension.
Dude, can you make a video talking about Knuckles' Chaotix and whether if it is canon or not?
I think it would be an interesting video and honestly idk if it is canon.
TBH I think Classic Sonic side should have at least 1 or 2 more game(s), mostly because back in the late 2000s during the dark age of Sonic, Sonic Fanboys at that time where demanding a new 2D Classic Sonic game after games like Sonic Heroes, Shadow the Hedgehog, the two Riders games, the Rivals series, the Storybook games, Sonic Chronicles and especially Sonic 06 ruined the series reputation.
2010 came and We got Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode I and one didn't complain about how the gameplay (which is why Sonic 4 sucked) was he was complain about the fact that they used Modern Sonic and Modern Eggman from Sonic Adventure 1-Today instead of Classic Sonic and Classic Eggman, few followed but those with brains called him out on that nitpick, 2011 came Sega brought back Classic Sonic for Sonic Generations and 2017 came and We got Sonic Mania and it got DLC with Sonic Mania Plus.
Sonic Mania/Sonic Mania Plus I felt that this is what Classic Sonic games should be to please those who grew up with the series since 1991 and that Modern Sonic should please those who grew up with the series since 1998 and especially that the Sonic Movies brought back those older fans from the Genesis/Mega Drive era and gave up on it since 2006, I think something like a Neo Classic Sonic trilogy should be a thing like the Genesis/Mega Drive Trilogy are a thing, Sonic Mania/Sonic Mania Plus, Sonic Superstar and whatever they're going to call the next Classic Sonic game Sonic Robo Crisis where you play as Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, Mighty and Ray fighting the hard boiled heavies or something to wrap up the Classic Sonic games and have a transition into Sonic Adventure 1.
Can the Slow power from Superstars count as a retcon? It kinda is just Chaos Control before SA2.
Classic sonic doesn’t talk to make modern sonic look good
If anything, Classic Sonic doesn't talk to make Classic Sonic look good by comparison. It's like they're going "Look, he doesn't have an annoying voice! He's not saying Baldy Nose Hair like that awful green eyed imposter Sonic!" It's kind of frustrating.
I’m pretty indifferent to this ‘modern’ classic sonic stuff. Classic sonic can definitely talk it’s just SEGA being SEGA. Classic sonic being “cute” just removes the whole point of his personality. But it’s accepted cuz’ Sonic Mania was absolutely peak and most are okay with Superstars (I hate it).
But really now Sonic Mania is like officially licensed fan game by passionate fans who later became programmers and developers themselves and it’s the last real breathe of fresh air the sonic series has had in terms of gameplay. Even if that game is super derivative at times it still does a LOT of new great things and it’s overall the best playing sonic game.
But the last… iconographically unique sonic game I remember is Colors and even then, that was very clearly trying to be Super Mario Galaxy, then Generations speaks for itself… aside from the great gameplay and level design and music that game is mostly empty but whatever 20th anniversary.
Lost World is Mario 3D Land and whatever. Zeti are the Koopalings even. Obtuse gameplay yay.
Forces is a mish mash of half baked “ideas” or ACTUALLYYY really now stipulations from SEGA
• serious story
• sonic friends back-ish
• Eggman competent again
• Chaos
• Shadow
• Gromit
• OKAY, that’s the pretentious lot out of the way! Classic sonic
• Modern sonics
• hey let’s do ocs as a gimmick that’ll save the game cuz’ we just recycled assets from previous games and slapped this together in a few months lol
Frontiers is breath of the wild but sonic-ified lol and most of the gameplay is whatever puzzles and traversing barren and soulless maps and everything the game does has been done better in previous sonic games or different games in general (combat is so bad lol)
And the music has lost a lot of its sonic appeal now.
Sonic superstars is new super Mario bros with Sonic and friends and it’s also ‘We have sonic Mania at home’ and with absolutely horrid boss fights making this one of the most frustrating sonic games ever and it doesn’t really bring anything new to the table. New character with one dragon gimmick? (Insert cubot going ‘check’) no real definable story (‘check!’) recycled zone aesthetics creating the false illusion of new stuff? (‘Check! Got it all boss.’) thanks cubot.
Oh yea there’s origins which isn’t that bad cuz’ it’s just the classics and they’re more consumer friendly but the deluxe options are horrid lol. Same for Superstars, frontiers and especially sonic x shadow. An extra ten quid for a worthless skin but then a whole level?
In c o n c l u s i o n , the series has bigger problems lol. It’s completely creatively bankrupt and ripping off fans cuz’ SEGA knows they’ll eat it up…
Third film looks sweet though.
I know this is a very dumb thing to mention but in the genesis games, when sonic rolls then jumps, he cant turn around but thats changed in mania… yes i spent too much time on those games how can you tell?
Mf i just realized that classic sonic is literally 33 years old not modern💀☠️😭😭😭😭
Ok I like two timelines I love classic amy
I have an issue with the split timeline theory. If we're going by what Generations established, the Classic characters are the younger versions of the Modern characters, obviously meaning that they grew up into the Modern characters.
Now if the split timeline is real, and it means that the Classic series can be separate to the Modern series without contradicting anything, then does that just mean that the characters aren't going to grow into their Modern counterparts anymore? Plus if they suddenly include Modern elements into the Classic series then what's even the point of a Classic/Modern split in the first place?
That's what really bugs me about all of this. It really does feel like this entire split was made to appease all of the whiney fan boys who complained about Sonic's darned eye colour in Sonic 4, and Sega have been desperately trying to appease them ever since. It just comes across as petty and ridiculous!
I genuinely feel like the Classic characters were able to talk, they just didnt because of the limitations of the Genesis
Sonic cd should take place after sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles cause it makes more sense cause why would Eggman go from really advanced robot to clunky robot to more advanced but not as advanced as metal sonic robot back to metal sonic it makes no sense
@@Angel-jackal One thing that makes sense is the fact that Metal Sonic's big battle happens in the FUTURE, which might imply that he is from the future. This makes sense because he seems very advanced compared to all his basic badniks. Another fact to point out about this is that according to Sonic 4, eggman left metal sonic on little planet and couldn't use him for a long time because he was stuck there. Or I don't know, this game series is silly sometimes 😂
I do not like "modern" classic sonic, hes way too cutsey like he literally looks more rounder and shorter and chivi than he actualy was in the 90s and that light blue fucking ew. I can't wait for alaxender gogolevs sonic mod for gens to come out his model is spot on to 90s sonic
although I agree with the person who is talking about how modern classic sonic is bad because they try to make them look cute when really he was cool but things that I don’t hear despite them being really big changes is how they literally took his voice and shrunk the cast down to six or seven like why not bring back the classic chaotix with their fun designs or or even the the tails sky patrol characters
also, personally, I don’t believe there’s more shits of chaos or modes in the original personally, I think that all 5 or 4 islands are supported by the chaos emerald an egg man using them as a battery source and personally, I believe metal sonic should come Second with both mechas from Sonic 2 and eight bit Sonic 2 being the first one being prototypes and then personally, I believe the rest of the mechas are are more of spin offs of metal sonic like have you noticed that each mecha sonic even the prototypes all have gimmicks but not metal sonic(neo metal don’t count he did that to himself)