I got a scam by somebody where I bought a farmer tech a 660 and I thought it was a Stihl 660. When they put OEM bars and chains on these they really do look like stihl saws. But I've actually loved the farmer tech saw.
Very informative video my Dad was a Stihl man and so am I. They do this with soda pop to you go buy a pack of them and the bottles are thin but go to a gas station and get a single one and the bottles are a harder plastic and I can tell the difference in taste also yet there is so many knock off things out there.
I built the ms 660 farmertec kit and it was AMAZING!!! I had it on an Alaskan mill with a 4' bar. I had to sell it years ago and now plan on getting another to slab again.
Awesome video... I use a lot of the holzfforma products! I'm able to completely work on them so a rebuild for me is an afternoon of good times. However, I agree if a guy is not able to work on them probably not the saw for them. However, it's a awesome option for when I have a customer come in that can't afford a OEM rebuild. Also, the clone saws allowed me to take my self to chainsaw school by working on and modification of them without the OEM price. Thanks for the video sir
This is one of the better videos comparing the clones with the original. I have a had few Husqy saws and a couple Stihl saws. Both last for many years without trouble. Been wondering about a china clone tho. I might buy one for fun and video comparison one day when I have some extra money to blow on it. But for daily use I will stick with an original.
Good video. I like that you were open and honest about what Farmertec offers and what you are getting when buying one. I thought about buying one a year ago, but I found a good used Stihl 026 for $100 and a 193t for $65. I'm not opposed to buying a China made saw if it will a trim a tree or help cut one down. I think Stihl is way overpriced and mfg's. like Echo offer a nice alternative for the arborist. I think for home owners Farmertec may be a nice alternative rather than spending a bunch of money on a saw you may only used a few times.
I have run a lot of saws In my life, and I agree with what you said. I own a lot of older Stihl saws that are great and have hundreds of hours on them. I have recently started buying Echo saws, as I believe their saws are the best bang for the buck at this point. There is no reason for your average non-pro to buy a Stihl anymore. Too expensive, they don’t want to work with you to warranty anything, and the quality isn’t as good as it once was.
True unless it's something you want to last or you want a warranty so yeah I like stihl and husqvarna there top dog for a reason there expensive because people will pay
I'm a Stihl die hard fan, so I picked up a Stihl off market place that was burn't up and rebuilt it with farmertec rings and piston, it runs ok but I for my daily saws I would opt for OEM parts.
Most of those parts are really good, the Achilles heel of those parts are the carburetors. Get a walbro rebuild it and it should run just as good as a real sthil.
I have looked for this video for years. It wouldnt pull up in search. This video got me into the chinese saw industry, im very very deep in it now, way deeper than farmertec and holtzfforma/hutzle.....i can provide some amazing saws....im literally on a daily contact with factory owners who make amazing incredible saws, like with OEM factory parts, no joke. The big saw companies contract secretly with non-disclosure agreements, nearly everything is chinese made....i dont know exact parts but there are three contracted factories and i know cylinders are chinese now.....maybe still brazillian too but not the "Molly" which is like mahale.
hell i got a hulzforma 372 xp i use it all the time work great i have had it for 3 years now.i use it for work and for firewood i never had mine to stop working.its payed for its self so many times. if mine stopped working trw i go buy me one again.
Great informative video, thanks. Any experience with the JonCutter 2500? I hear it's a good/small cutter especially for tree climbing at only about 3 kilos.
I'm very sorry but I can't totally agree with your assessment of these saws. I mean yes, certain parts can be inferior, but generally speaking once you've ironed out the kinks these saws last and perform just as well as the OEM saws, and even if you're unlucky and you trash an engine then so what! You can buy a pot, piston and crank ect for absolute peanuts direct from farmertec. For example I could literally rebuild a 375xp clone half a dozen times or more for the price of one original saw!! And they perform just as well in the woods. We've run these and original huskies and there's very little difference overall, the cut rate is pretty much identical, at least that's the case for the husky clones anyway. To be honest apart from the price they make a lot more sense in other ways as well. Firstly they are based on older tech, the new saws now are more complicated and can be troublesome to deal with, sometimes requiring them to go in to be fixed by a dealer. Also there's plenty of people who experience issues such as poor hot starting, premature piston wear, overheating issues etc. All problems associated with engines that use a stratification engine design and autotune carbs. It's becoming almost impossible to buy a new professional grade saw now that doesn't use such tech, however buying a clone means that you still can. Another perhaps overlooked aspect is that these saws aren't as valuable. Having a stable full of OEM huskies and stihls is a big investment, it's also an attractive proposition for anyone who want to steal them! This has happened to me a few times over the years. But now I'm not so worried, firstly they're not as likely to want to steal a load of Chinese knock offs! And even if they do it's no great loss by comparison. Actually I've started buying the all blue versions of these saws as they are even less attractive to any would be thief. Regards
Your point really isn't valid....IMO I understand what you're saying but why would you want to be inconvenienced with an inferior product and additional work to keep it running. ??
@@victormarinelli5660 In my experience there's actually very little difference between the OEM saws and the clones.....once you've gone through them and changed out the parts that are likely to be a problem. In operation they perform and hold up just as well, and they're certainly not inferior once you take costs into consideration! Like I've said, these saws are older tech, there's nothing you can't fix yourself, and have it up and running again with minimal down time. Even if I had to do a full rebuild on one, it would only take a few hours and cost absolute peanuts to do, the saw would be back in the woods and working the same day! i.e. if I did the same with an OEM saw and used OEM parts to repair it how much extra work would I need to do to pay for that? So even in that equation they make more sense to me. I'm not into brand snobbery or preconceptions, I prefer to assess a product by how well it actually performs, and on that basis I think calling them inferior products is a tad inaccurate. They are simply project saws for someone who doesn't mind tinkering a little bit to get the best out of them. It's one of the reasons I was buying them in kit form and building them up myself, so I could check everything was good as it could be. Regards
@@JimN_AustinTx Pay more then if you really think you'll get a better deal. But bear in mind you can have four or more of these saws for the same cost as one new OEM saw!
the first one i got was the g888 and love it, the handle i had to change. The 395 you have to change the piston(slap) now a great saw. i have oem 394 and 395 and the jugs from hiyway are just as good to me.
Good video I am interested in buying equipment from China but disagree with companies like farmertec just ripping off Stihl etc. However I think the Farmertec Holzforma is a good idea for most people. Have you ever had any dealings with Gezhi equipment? They do a range of equipment that I'm interested in as a landscaper. TIA if anyone has experience with the brand.
Let's be fair here. Though the country is well-known for it's industrial espionage, it is fully legal and moral for Farmertec to build/sell these saws using expired monopolized US/German patents. The fact that they can build, ship, and sell them back to us for so much cheaper may say more about us than they? There is no dispute about their sub-standard quality, but every consumer product has a balance between quality .vs cost. We each must determine our own break-even point for our individual use. In the past decade many import products have increased in quality while many locally produced products have decreased in quality while exponentially increasing in cost. I own many OEM orange saws, but also purchase and use clones when the crossover error rate favors it.
Is everyone just going to ignore how much dirt had gotten past the filter!? That cheap 066 copy won’t be running long with a faulty fitting air filter or whatever is going on there
I'm the "tree guy" or "chainsaw" guy for the small company I work for and was thinking of buying one of the ms660 clones for our bigger trees . We're not a tree service , but I do alot of clearing for farms .... Would it hold up? I'm really looking into this saw and adding a few upgrades and or just replacing parts with stihl parts . Would you recommend this saw for commercial use (light commercial) I'm tired of running small stihls (because that's what my boss buys) or his brother's husky 460 that just needs thrown in the river.
I’ve been running a g660 clone saw for over 2 years milling with it falling trees etc etc…for myself on our land but nevertheless it has hours & hours on it if hard use good bar/chain real stihl air filter rebuild the carb with genuine parts replaced the decompression valve and run it a little richer then my 562xp it sings everytime I genuinely have no complaints we run a 36 & 42” bar on it I’m by no means easy on it because I wanted it to break I wanted to be able to say it sucks but I can’t 😂 it runs!! & runs strong everytime
Overall they are very good. The rubber and plastic parts aren’t great but can easily be replaced with oem Stihl or Husky parts. You can save a ton of money on the large cc saws.
I bought and ran two 066. I had to put a OEM carb to get them to run, OEM handle bars and chain adjuster. They ran great until they blew up fairly quickly, maybe 200 mbf on each. I don’t buy them anymore.
Super random question. Any idea why are chainsaw engines like 1/3-1/4 the hp of a comparable sized dirtbike engine? Like whys a 125cc dirtbike 35+ hp and a 881 is only 8ish, is just the increased weight of the rotating mass in the engine?
It’s mainly because of the exhaust, an expansion chamber adds a MASSIVE amount of power to a 2 stroke engine, it’s pretty much the equivalent of a supercharger.
Don't forget those dirt bikes are also water cooled so you can run more compression and rpm to make that power. As everyone else said also have that expansion chamber, reed vales and bigger flywheel to help with low end torque.
Is neotech the same? I've also seen that you can get saw that comes with brand name parts like a Walbro carburettor, spark plugs and more, how much does this improve the saw and is it worth paying the bit extra to get the upgrades
The parts are interchangeable, yes, but inferior quality. The metal is soft, the plastic gets brittle and they don’t last. The blue ones were pretty, though, and cheap, but they don’t last especially if you put oem on them.
I’d probally get a farmertech and then replace parts as they brake with stihl OEM and then if the motor ever gives out. I can then buy a real stihl and take the oem parts off farmer tech and use them as spares on the stihl. I feel this will be the cheapest long term option
You've discovered the same thing I did in that they come with their issues to be resolved. They are a work in progress, so I hope you have a working saw while you're working on the Farmertec.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw they are great saws, slight downfall has been cost of parts. I've offered it as suggestion in the Farmertec group to Manny and others, but it sounds like you have the strongest relationship stateside with them.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw and the "g" option for the 070/090 platform. As well as the 090 clutch. I'd love to have an 090g clone to run a huge bar for milling monster logs
i just bought a blue one for 99 $ its new if its a box of parts il assemble it better than they can its getting ripping blade on a 29 inch bar thats attached to mill i got mantle orders to fill live edge is on fire so i dont burn it
I asked this on another video too... But if they are clones... then why do they specify a different fuel mixture/ratio from the OEM ones? I.e. I know a Husq 372xp uses 50:1 fuel, but all these Holz saws specify 25:1 in their documentation... And 25:1 is pretty extreme for a fuel mix no? What fuel mix ratio do you actually run in them?
Out side USA husqvarna calls for 33 to 1 oil mix. Guess oil mix depends on EPA requirements .I run 40 to 1 in ever thing. Never seen a 2 cycle engine last long on 50 to 1 mix.
All my saws run 50:1 u have to tune your saws or any 2-cycle engines to fuel mixture unless u have an auto tuner & then u have to run it through their specific tuning process. Also u have to tune chainsaws to the size bar & ANY engine mod esp advanced timing, head & exhaust porting. If you're not mechanically inclined these after market saws are far more forgiving, cost effective, & use OEM parts from original manufacturer.
25:1 is bogus because your engine will build way too much heat. I use VP full synthetic at a 40:1 ratio and adjust the high jet so that it four strokes when I let up in the cut. That way it's slightly rich and you'll never score a piston and cylinder a bit rich, but lean is trouble.
@@yungsmile7546 you obviously don't know what you're talking about. 25:1 is richer that 50:1. Don't give advice you don't know what you're talking about. Lol you made me chuckle when you said 4 stroking. Come on man.
@@ajcutler3472 four stroking is a term used to describe what happens when the high-speed jet is backed out too far. I know because that is the term used by factory technicians, and I was a Stihl tech for a long time.
There are several folks on FB running them in mills. Just know going in they may not live as long as the OEM. Considering a ms661 is 1500 and an ms881 2200 a clone 660 for 500 or 880 for 800 is less than half the price. If it smokes a cylinder in the 1st season opt for a high quality or even OEM replacement cylinder and piston and keep on moving.
To me any American or Canadian citizen should have a real problem with supporting Chinese businesses and manufacturers. If you favor doing that you should consider possibly moving there and supporting them to your fullest potential.
Happens all the time. Stihl and OEM Husqvarna always have part numbers stamped into the part. The Chinese made parts never have part numbers on anything.
The content and background are appreciated. A few questions though: 1:Are these aftermarket manufacturers in china peddling their product as stihl counterfeits or are they transparent about it not being OEM? 2: are the chinese made knock off products made using expired patents or some kind of licensing process or is it just a criminal operation based on blatant intellectual property theft? 3: many of the farmertec products are copies of products no longer available. The OEM phased out those models because they didn't meet EPA emissions requirements. How are the clones getting a free pass on emissions? Anyone with factual insight, please clarify if able.
I am frustrated by, and avoid all counterfeit products. The Chinese clone saws (ie Farmertek/Holzfforma) that I have, are clearly marketed as Stihl-compatible clones and not counterfeits. I have no problem with that. They are made from expired patents. (Though I am fully aware that there is a lot of past/present foreign industrial espionage occurring)
to each their own...if you are willing to put up with the component failures of the china saw, having the mechanical ability to troubleshoot, fix and perhaps increase your investment by substituting OEM saw parts then maybe it is worth the gamble. For the occasional sawyer that has just this clone I think it is a bad idea. It is one thing to have critical need to clear downed trees or travel distance into back country to cut firewood and have backup saws including some name brand that are reliable and quite another to have just the clone and find it craps on you when needed most. Yeah I read all the comments and hundreds more across you tube channels and many have experienced, by their report, excellent service life from the clones. But when you have knowledge of the many, many deficiencies...starting with piston fit, cylinder finish as the most important...then you begin to realize the builtin increased odds of failure in the clones. Maybe you get a really good one...maybe not... but you can never get away from the lingering uncertainty of the clones reliability and durability.
Looks like you are in pretty tight with Farmertec and give them feed back, Could you maybe put a bug (so to say) in their ear to possibly produce a Husqvarna 570, 575, 576 series of saws and/or a complete line of replacement parts instead of the few they now how ? I've tried but with no response.
To many company's in china already making the parts for the 570 575 saws. They are very cheap. And thank god they are, because the 570 and 575 are two of the worst saws ever sold by husqvarna. Might as well keep extra parts on hand. Or buy 570 cheap and install new 575 cylinder and piston.
I was at Canton Fair in China when I first met them. I was originally over in China buying some left over Caterpillar parts from the factory over there. I saw some of the Chainsaw parts booths, and we have been friends ever sense.
@@rockymountainchainsaw I wish they'd make jonsered clones I have the 2077 turbos and the 2083 turbo and I have a bear of a time finding parts and have had for awhile and now that they no longer make jonsered chainsaws it's even harder to get parts
Thank you, How would a person get in contact with you about spare parts? Do you have a Farmertec reseller/distributor for a person to by a complete saw or a kit saw? Thank you for sharing your experiences.
I just bought two Hulzfforma saws, a 372XP and a MS660, the 372 ran for about 20 minutes and stopped, the 660 started once, and now I cant get it to fire at all. Two paper weights.
I believe the difference is modular vs integral design. However, stihl has pushed from as much integral design. They have a lot of cheaper modular saws that aren’t worth their weight.
the difference is one company steals designs while the other puts millions into R&D. However these are all old designs and Stihl and Husky have more advanced current products. The problem is consumers buy cheap throw away single use items that they throw away. At some point the world will realize we need to build quality items that last vs single use. The other issue is first world companies need to stop charging an arm and a leg for products. Catch 22.
Weird if Farmertec ends up buying Stihl...they're probably outselling them 1000 to 1 * seems that you hold Farmertec in high regard for producing a decent quality chainsaw at a "very" reasonable price point...you're not alone
Hard to justify buying American anymore in our countries current form... In an economy where America doesn't own anything, and the price of basic living and goods are through the roof, having all our production being over seas.... seeing how china pretty much owns everything already, it's easier and more affordable to buy Chinese, Indian, or Taiwanese, as bad as that sounds. Once we start bringing more factories back to America and we start sourcing our own materials here in our home land and we can get the price down on American made parts and equipment by having enough factories open where we can have competitive pricing, at that point, it would make sense to buy American, but until our leaders stop being sell outs to foreign nations, going in making 6 figures and coming out making 7 or 8, that is our reality. I support America all day long, but it's not doing anything besides hurting your wallet buying American (with some exceptions), and these dealers that sell American (with some exceptions) are making big profit margins, there needs to be real legislation passed to bring production back to America before anything changes. If you want to support America in the large scope that will trickle down and effect the little man, we have to vote in people who will bring these positive changes to our country so we can actually benefit off buying American made products. We should be able to buy a big boy American made saw for 500$ but we cannot, and the money we make doesn't justify it unless you are making a whole lot of money, and at that point, you probably arn't boots on the ground.
Why create a new wheel that already has proven itself reliable! Buy quality tools the first time! I couldnt support any product made outside our alliance countries and would rather have everything made in America. What a mess our government has put us in. Embarassing.. Work hard...save your money and buy quality....period.
How do you explain models that no one else even has parts for? Farmertec is the only place that you can buy ALL the parts, or a complete kit, or a complete clone ms200t? This comment is in response to them being only a trading agent.
That's what I usually say. Sometimes you get lucky and the thing works as well as OEM and lasts almost as long. My friend has a 372xp clone and uses it daily just about for tree work. Runs good so far, has only had it a few months so time will tell. Hell, a piston and jug is pennies to rebuild. I hate shitty tools as much as the next guy but theres something to be said for these things. Especially when the OEM is moving to more and more Chinese parts anyway, and sometimes are unavailable.
Stihl was never American made . . . smh but them 250's 44's 66's & 88's if you know them are bad ass & run with any of these new shits unless they're modded auto tuners like 201 261 362 462 and so on, but they were never American to begin with.
Stihl Group Manufacturing has state-of-the-art assembly plants in: Austria Brazil China Germany Switzerland United States The majority of gas-powered Stihl products sold in the US are finished at Stihl’s Virginia Beach manufacturing plant. However, many of the parts and components come from abroad.
@@dlostyles2578 assembly - - - not made, but assembled as are toyota and chevy vehicles the saws are different in only being assembled in the USA all the parts are made in another country. shucks my Subaru had parts made in Japan, Germany, China my GMC was assembled in Mexico the other truck was assembled in Canada [both "claim" to be American vehicles but have a few metric parts that came to be assembled on another country outside the USA - was your saw made in America? are all Harley Davidson's made in America? hmm . . just something to think about . . . hmmm. . .
@@toknowlj I didn't realize I wasn't clear & needed someone to reiterate . . . I mean u just underlined what I put dwn, I'm glad someone was tracking at least. Very few things are "made in the USA" they are only assembled here there & everywhere. If everyone threw out everything made in China, well thats a different story. Dyslexia & procrastination plagues the United States.
Farmertec was not selling kits here when you said and the blue saws and such came much later, I saw none on your table. They did sell parts in bulk but kits were overseas only. The owner used to send his card to the VIPs in the saw kits. Their weakness is the chinese "good enough" attitude. A note, the part#s on Stihls many of them are internal #s and don't show up when you search, internally they refer to another part number, but your correct the parts are easy to tell apart. Guys way back bought all the farmertec parts separately and assembled them and tried to get over on people on craigslist and ebay. The kit story was very interesting to guys that want to save money but post covid saving money is real hard if not impossible. Lots of forum posts on the kits. Funny thing is there are now knockoffs of the knockoffs. Project farm did a video recently on a farmertec knockoff
There is always a poorer third country ready to steal designs and have 8 years old put them together ... and a local entrepreneur eager to make a buck out of it. Here my friends is where ethics, step in. It’s all up to us, the buying bunch, todecide what’s best for our Country and it’s people !
@@rockymountainchainsawThat would be great but just buying from manufacturers located in countries with decent living conditions would be a great leap forward cause what do you know, they usually have quality standards. The problems stems from that continuous search for ever lower cost goods. Something has to give in so it usually comes down with cutting corners on quality, slavery-like working conditions and total environment disregard.
@@stevenbrown5210 you are right in pointing out most people's inconsistent behaviour but for one, my Walmart outings are limited to food and produce and as for my cell, I chose a "second chance" (aka remanufactured) cell from my service provider to minimize its negative impact. Regards !
I got a scam by somebody where I bought a farmer tech a 660 and I thought it was a Stihl 660. When they put OEM bars and chains on these they really do look like stihl saws. But I've actually loved the farmer tech saw.
Great review - appreciate your honesty too
Thank you for such an informative video. You have made it all very clear and it makes perfect sense.
Very informative video my Dad was a Stihl man and so am I. They do this with soda pop to you go buy a pack of them and the bottles are thin but go to a gas station and get a single one and the bottles are a harder plastic and I can tell the difference in taste also yet there is so many knock off things out there.
I built the ms 660 farmertec kit and it was AMAZING!!! I had it on an Alaskan mill with a 4' bar. I had to sell it years ago and now plan on getting another to slab again.
Awesome video... I use a lot of the holzfforma products! I'm able to completely work on them so a rebuild for me is an afternoon of good times. However, I agree if a guy is not able to work on them probably not the saw for them. However, it's a awesome option for when I have a customer come in that can't afford a OEM rebuild. Also, the clone saws allowed me to take my self to chainsaw school by working on and modification of them without the OEM price.
Thanks for the video sir
This is one of the better videos comparing the clones with the original. I have a had few Husqy saws and a couple Stihl saws. Both last for many years without trouble. Been wondering about a china clone tho. I might buy one for fun and video comparison one day when I have some extra money to blow on it. But for daily use I will stick with an original.
Good video. I like that you were open and honest about what Farmertec offers and what you are getting when buying one. I thought about buying one a year ago, but I found a good used Stihl 026 for $100 and a 193t for $65. I'm not opposed to buying a China made saw if it will a trim a tree or help cut one down. I think Stihl is way overpriced and mfg's. like Echo offer a nice alternative for the arborist. I think for home owners Farmertec may be a nice alternative rather than spending a bunch of money on a saw you may only used a few times.
I have run a lot of saws In my life, and I agree with what you said. I own a lot of older Stihl saws that are great and have hundreds of hours on them. I have recently started buying Echo saws, as I believe their saws are the best bang for the buck at this point. There is no reason for your average non-pro to buy a Stihl anymore. Too expensive, they don’t want to work with you to warranty anything, and the quality isn’t as good as it once was.
True unless it's something you want to last or you want a warranty so yeah I like stihl and husqvarna there top dog for a reason there expensive because people will pay
StihL 660 con ko bạn
@@FreedomotorsportsLlc😊
I'm a Stihl die hard fan, so I picked up a Stihl off market place that was burn't up and rebuilt it with farmertec rings and piston, it runs ok but I for my daily saws I would opt for OEM parts.
Most of those parts are really good, the Achilles heel of those parts are the carburetors. Get a walbro rebuild it and it should run just as good as a real sthil.
Lemme just have one spare I'll trade ya a carving! What a beautiful collection
Good video man ide like to add some of those older huskys for my collection
I have looked for this video for years. It wouldnt pull up in search. This video got me into the chinese saw industry, im very very deep in it now, way deeper than farmertec and holtzfforma/hutzle.....i can provide some amazing saws....im literally on a daily contact with factory owners who make amazing incredible saws, like with OEM factory parts, no joke. The big saw companies contract secretly with non-disclosure agreements, nearly everything is chinese made....i dont know exact parts but there are three contracted factories and i know cylinders are chinese now.....maybe still brazillian too but not the "Molly" which is like mahale.
I follow ur stuff and I’ve subscribed to ur channel, these saws are good saws
Those orange and white chainsaws are awesome
Great honest info thanks
hell i got a hulzforma 372 xp i use it all the time work great i have had it for 3 years now.i use it for work and for firewood i never had mine to stop working.its payed for its self so many times. if mine stopped working trw i go buy me one again.
Yes I totally agree.
Glad I went with an OEM Husky. I went down the China knockoff path years ago on a generator. Nothing but a headache.
The 372xp clone is a great saw.
Great informative video, thanks. Any experience with the JonCutter 2500? I hear it's a good/small cutter especially for tree climbing at only about 3 kilos.
I'm very sorry but I can't totally agree with your assessment of these saws. I mean yes, certain parts can be inferior, but generally speaking once you've ironed out the kinks these saws last and perform just as well as the OEM saws, and even if you're unlucky and you trash an engine then so what! You can buy a pot, piston and crank ect for absolute peanuts direct from farmertec. For example I could literally rebuild a 375xp clone half a dozen times or more for the price of one original saw!! And they perform just as well in the woods. We've run these and original huskies and there's very little difference overall, the cut rate is pretty much identical, at least that's the case for the husky clones anyway.
To be honest apart from the price they make a lot more sense in other ways as well. Firstly they are based on older tech, the new saws now are more complicated and can be troublesome to deal with, sometimes requiring them to go in to be fixed by a dealer. Also there's plenty of people who experience issues such as poor hot starting, premature piston wear, overheating issues etc. All problems associated with engines that use a stratification engine design and autotune carbs. It's becoming almost impossible to buy a new professional grade saw now that doesn't use such tech, however buying a clone means that you still can.
Another perhaps overlooked aspect is that these saws aren't as valuable. Having a stable full of OEM huskies and stihls is a big investment, it's also an attractive proposition for anyone who want to steal them! This has happened to me a few times over the years. But now I'm not so worried, firstly they're not as likely to want to steal a load of Chinese knock offs! And even if they do it's no great loss by comparison. Actually I've started buying the all blue versions of these saws as they are even less attractive to any would be thief.
Regards
Dudé i enjoy reading your reply, so much true on every aspect
Your point really isn't valid....IMO
I understand what you're saying but why would you want to be inconvenienced with an inferior product and additional work to keep it running. ??
@@victormarinelli5660 In my experience there's actually very little difference between the OEM saws and the clones.....once you've gone through them and changed out the parts that are likely to be a problem.
In operation they perform and hold up just as well, and they're certainly not inferior once you take costs into consideration! Like I've said, these saws are older tech, there's nothing you can't fix yourself, and have it up and running again with minimal down time. Even if I had to do a full rebuild on one, it would only take a few hours and cost absolute peanuts to do, the saw would be back in the woods and working the same day! i.e. if I did the same with an OEM saw and used OEM parts to repair it how much extra work would I need to do to pay for that? So even in that equation they make more sense to me. I'm not into brand snobbery or preconceptions, I prefer to assess a product by how well it actually performs, and on that basis I think calling them inferior products is a tad inaccurate. They are simply project saws for someone who doesn't mind tinkering a little bit to get the best out of them. It's one of the reasons I was buying them in kit form and building them up myself, so I could check everything was good as it could be. Regards
But my time is worth more than this trash.
@@JimN_AustinTx Pay more then if you really think you'll get a better deal. But bear in mind you can have four or more of these saws for the same cost as one new OEM saw!
the first one i got was the g888 and love it, the handle i had to change. The 395 you have to change the piston(slap) now a great saw. i have oem 394 and 395 and the jugs from hiyway are just as good to me.
Good video I am interested in buying equipment from China but disagree with companies like farmertec just ripping off Stihl etc. However I think the Farmertec Holzforma is a good idea for most people. Have you ever had any dealings with Gezhi equipment? They do a range of equipment that I'm interested in as a landscaper. TIA if anyone has experience with the brand.
That sounds good until you realize stihl is ripping you off.
Let's be fair here. Though the country is well-known for it's industrial espionage, it is fully legal and moral for Farmertec to build/sell these saws using expired monopolized US/German patents. The fact that they can build, ship, and sell them back to us for so much cheaper may say more about us than they? There is no dispute about their sub-standard quality, but every consumer product has a balance between quality .vs cost. We each must determine our own break-even point for our individual use. In the past decade many import products have increased in quality while many locally produced products have decreased in quality while exponentially increasing in cost. I own many OEM orange saws, but also purchase and use clones when the crossover error rate favors it.
I own a small tree company do you recommend we use our Stihl chainsaw every day. Will thay handle like the Stihl?
THATS A GOOD LOOKING TRAILER !
Is everyone just going to ignore how much dirt had gotten past the filter!? That cheap 066 copy won’t be running long with a faulty fitting air filter or whatever is going on there
They don’t run very long anyways
How long do they run?@@HubertofLiege
New sub here love this type of content
Is Farmertec and Neotec the same company! Good video, thanks!!!
I have an 024 av wood boss I am wanting to put a 44.7 mm cylinder and piston in it do I also need to change crankshaft
And I've been using the 372xp models beating the crap out of them, daily use
I'm the "tree guy" or "chainsaw" guy for the small company I work for and was thinking of buying one of the ms660 clones for our bigger trees .
We're not a tree service , but I do alot of clearing for farms ....
Would it hold up?
I'm really looking into this saw and adding a few upgrades and or just replacing parts with stihl parts .
Would you recommend this saw for commercial use (light commercial) I'm tired of running small stihls (because that's what my boss buys) or his brother's husky 460 that just needs thrown in the river.
I’ve been running a g660 clone saw for over 2 years milling with it falling trees etc etc…for myself on our land but nevertheless it has hours & hours on it if hard use good bar/chain real stihl air filter rebuild the carb with genuine parts replaced the decompression valve and run it a little richer then my 562xp it sings everytime I genuinely have no complaints we run a 36 & 42” bar on it I’m by no means easy on it because I wanted it to break I wanted to be able to say it sucks but I can’t 😂 it runs!! & runs strong everytime
Overall they are very good. The rubber and plastic parts aren’t great but can easily be replaced with oem Stihl or Husky parts. You can save a ton of money on the large cc saws.
I bought and ran two 066. I had to put a OEM carb to get them to run, OEM handle bars and chain adjuster. They ran great until they blew up fairly quickly, maybe 200 mbf on each. I don’t buy them anymore.
Máy tốt quá a ơi.
Will you sell the 500i shown in video?
Thanks for vid
Why is there so much saw dust past the air filter?
Super random question. Any idea why are chainsaw engines like 1/3-1/4 the hp of a comparable sized dirtbike engine? Like whys a 125cc dirtbike 35+ hp and a 881 is only 8ish, is just the increased weight of the rotating mass in the engine?
It’s mainly because of the exhaust, an expansion chamber adds a MASSIVE amount of power to a 2 stroke engine, it’s pretty much the equivalent of a supercharger.
dirtbikes are reed valve engines not piston port and they have tuned pipes with expansion chambers not can mufflers
Don't forget those dirt bikes are also water cooled so you can run more compression and rpm to make that power. As everyone else said also have that expansion chamber, reed vales and bigger flywheel to help with low end torque.
Is neotech the same? I've also seen that you can get saw that comes with brand name parts like a Walbro carburettor, spark plugs and more, how much does this improve the saw and is it worth paying the bit extra to get the upgrades
Yes the performance model isn't much more and it's the way to go. They have the good carb ngk plug etc.
The parts are interchangeable, yes, but inferior quality. The metal is soft, the plastic gets brittle and they don’t last. The blue ones were pretty, though, and cheap, but they don’t last especially if you put oem on them.
oh,man , you are showing off, but I love it
I’d probally get a farmertech and then replace parts as they brake with stihl OEM and then if the motor ever gives out. I can then buy a real stihl and take the oem parts off farmer tech and use them as spares on the stihl. I feel this will be the cheapest long term option
A new engine, available for less than $100, might bolt right into it.
My oil ports only line up half way with hole. New g660 and 25 in bar hollzfarma, leaks oil at motor but doesn't oil chain.
You've discovered the same thing I did in that they come with their issues to be resolved. They are a work in progress, so I hope you have a working saw while you're working on the Farmertec.
“You get what you pay for!”
Heck if you would sell a farmertec 660 whole I’d like to know a price I might buy one to try out in wood cutting thxs in advance…
You can buy them on Amazon. Or buy the powerhead + bar + chain on Amazon.
Get them to clone the Makita/Dolmar 6401 to 7900 series.
There is a HUGE following for them and Makita will be stopping support for them
Wow....thanks for the info. That is a good idea.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw they are great saws, slight downfall has been cost of parts.
I've offered it as suggestion in the Farmertec group to Manny and others, but it sounds like you have the strongest relationship stateside with them.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw and the "g" option for the 070/090 platform.
As well as the 090 clutch.
I'd love to have an 090g clone to run a huge bar for milling monster logs
i just bought a blue one for 99 $ its new if its a box of parts il assemble it better than they can its getting ripping blade on a 29 inch bar thats attached to mill i got mantle orders to fill live edge is on fire so i dont burn it
I asked this on another video too... But if they are clones... then why do they specify a different fuel mixture/ratio from the OEM ones? I.e. I know a Husq 372xp uses 50:1 fuel, but all these Holz saws specify 25:1 in their documentation... And 25:1 is pretty extreme for a fuel mix no? What fuel mix ratio do you actually run in them?
Out side USA husqvarna calls for 33 to 1 oil mix. Guess oil mix depends on EPA requirements .I run 40 to 1 in ever thing. Never seen a 2 cycle engine last long on 50 to 1 mix.
All my saws run 50:1 u have to tune your saws or any 2-cycle engines to fuel mixture unless u have an auto tuner & then u have to run it through their specific tuning process.
Also u have to tune chainsaws to the size bar & ANY engine mod esp advanced timing, head & exhaust porting.
If you're not mechanically inclined these after market saws are far more forgiving, cost effective, & use OEM parts from original manufacturer.
25:1 is bogus because your engine will build way too much heat. I use VP full synthetic at a 40:1 ratio and adjust the high jet so that it four strokes when I let up in the cut. That way it's slightly rich and you'll never score a piston and cylinder a bit rich, but lean is trouble.
@@yungsmile7546 you obviously don't know what you're talking about. 25:1 is richer that 50:1. Don't give advice you don't know what you're talking about. Lol you made me chuckle when you said 4 stroking. Come on man.
@@ajcutler3472 four stroking is a term used to describe what happens when the high-speed jet is backed out too far. I know because that is the term used by factory technicians, and I was a Stihl tech for a long time.
Dam that 372 was 385 hp ! Thats insane ! Lol
Do you think a Farmertec would work for a part time chain saw mill?
Yeah that is what I use.
i had all my jonsered chainsaws stolen from me once wish i could find them again. how do you feel about makita?
That's what I run for chainsaws is jonsered I've got the 2077 and 2083 turbos good saws I really like mine
So would it be a no for Farmertec for an Alaskan chainsaw mill?
There are several folks on FB running them in mills. Just know going in they may not live as long as the OEM.
Considering a ms661 is 1500 and an ms881 2200 a clone 660 for 500 or 880 for 800 is less than half the price.
If it smokes a cylinder in the 1st season opt for a high quality or even OEM replacement cylinder and piston and keep on moving.
Can you get a 462 stihl clone
Billy Ray says there not a good saw that he used one and it failed in one of his videos.what do u think about this.
Billy Ray is a hack.
A g888 would be nice.
Thanks for the vid. But
Chuck Finia!
Do you have a complete farmertech ms250 engine
Yes I do please email Snowxparts@gmail.com
To me any American or Canadian citizen should have a real problem with supporting Chinese businesses and manufacturers. If you favor doing that you should consider possibly moving there and supporting them to your fullest potential.
how much are them china saws
\
Id be pretty mad buying a Husky or Stihl that's had many of its OEM parts swapped to farmer tec and I wasn't aware of it.
Happens all the time. Stihl and OEM Husqvarna always have part numbers stamped into the part. The Chinese made parts never have part numbers on anything.
The content and background are appreciated. A few questions though:
1:Are these aftermarket manufacturers in china peddling their product as stihl counterfeits or are they transparent about it not being OEM?
2: are the chinese made knock off products made using expired patents or some kind of licensing process or is it just a criminal operation based on blatant intellectual property theft?
3: many of the farmertec products are copies of products no longer available. The OEM phased out those models because they didn't meet EPA emissions requirements. How are the clones getting a free pass on emissions?
Anyone with factual insight, please clarify if able.
I am frustrated by, and avoid all counterfeit products. The Chinese clone saws (ie Farmertek/Holzfforma) that I have, are clearly marketed as Stihl-compatible clones and not counterfeits. I have no problem with that. They are made from expired patents. (Though I am fully aware that there is a lot of past/present foreign industrial espionage occurring)
Hy where i can buy a this price ?
Wow
I’m looking for a real O 44 or MS 440
I have two 660s and a 881 they run good, ran them hot for hours
to each their own...if you are willing to put up with the component failures of the china saw, having the mechanical ability to troubleshoot, fix and perhaps increase your investment by substituting OEM saw parts then maybe it is worth the gamble. For the occasional sawyer that has just this clone I think it is a bad idea. It is one thing to have critical need to clear downed trees or travel distance into back country to cut firewood and have backup saws including some name brand that are reliable and quite another to have just the clone and find it craps on you when needed most. Yeah I read all the comments and hundreds more across you tube channels and many have experienced, by their report, excellent service life from the clones. But when you have knowledge of the many, many deficiencies...starting with piston fit, cylinder finish as the most important...then you begin to realize the builtin increased odds of failure in the clones. Maybe you get a really good one...maybe not... but you can never get away from the lingering uncertainty of the clones reliability and durability.
Looks like you are in pretty tight with Farmertec and give them feed back, Could you maybe put a bug (so to say) in their ear to possibly produce a Husqvarna 570, 575, 576 series of saws and/or a complete line of replacement parts instead of the few they now how ?
I've tried but with no response.
To many company's in china already making the parts for the 570 575 saws. They are very cheap. And thank god they are, because the 570 and 575 are two of the worst saws ever sold by husqvarna. Might as well keep extra parts on hand. Or buy 570 cheap and install new 575 cylinder and piston.
😲
How did you first get involved with farmertec?
I was at Canton Fair in China when I first met them. I was originally over in China buying some left over Caterpillar parts from the factory over there. I saw some of the Chainsaw parts booths, and we have been friends ever sense.
@@rockymountainchainsaw I wish they'd make jonsered clones I have the 2077 turbos and the 2083 turbo and I have a bear of a time finding parts and have had for awhile and now that they no longer make jonsered chainsaws it's even harder to get parts
If you want the truth and honest opinion from a small engine business owner. Your better off with a poulan than a farmertec
No
there was MORE dust behind the filter then on it... HOW is that possible... Thats nuts... ive never seen anything like that....
Thx for the info. I’m out on the China crap
máy này bán sao ở Việt Nam mua nổi
Thank you,
How would a person get in contact with you about spare parts?
Do you have a Farmertec reseller/distributor for a person to by a complete saw or a kit saw?
Thank you for sharing your experiences.
why are they blue now. Are they trying to stand out or was it a legal thing.
You can get the original orange and white or the blue and white.
Got any Rolexes? 🤣
Give me one stihl 440
I just bought two Hulzfforma saws, a 372XP and a MS660, the 372 ran for about 20 minutes and stopped, the 660 started once, and now I cant get it to fire at all. Two paper weights.
BS
Haha
What are you doing with that bunch of old saws? 😅
@ 1 min that saw had a lot of dust inside the intake.
Buenas
No entiendo Nadaaaa,,, seguro ke hubiera sido un gran Vidio si pudiera traducir a Spain
Si se puede.
Mane lol send/sale me a few THATS burned or something lol
I believe the difference is modular vs integral design. However, stihl has pushed from as much integral design. They have a lot of cheaper modular saws that aren’t worth their weight.
the difference is one company steals designs while the other puts millions into R&D. However these are all old designs and Stihl and Husky have more advanced current products. The problem is consumers buy cheap throw away single use items that they throw away. At some point the world will realize we need to build quality items that last vs single use. The other issue is first world companies need to stop charging an arm and a leg for products. Catch 22.
1113, 1115, 1117, 1118, 1119, 1121, 1122, 1128. All Stihl families of saws that were more or less modular, and all were commercial saws.
Tăng mình 1 cái được không
So farmertec is like Harley Davidson
Lol...that is one way to put it. Very well said.
Weird if Farmertec ends up buying Stihl...they're probably outselling them 1000 to 1
* seems that you hold Farmertec in high regard for producing a decent quality chainsaw at a "very" reasonable price point...you're not alone
I’m about to order one of these if you are selling pm me.
Email Snowxparts@gmail.com
Can I have a couple
can i buy you a farmetec !?
Hard to justify buying American anymore in our countries current form... In an economy where America doesn't own anything, and the price of basic living and goods are through the roof, having all our production being over seas.... seeing how china pretty much owns everything already, it's easier and more affordable to buy Chinese, Indian, or Taiwanese, as bad as that sounds. Once we start bringing more factories back to America and we start sourcing our own materials here in our home land and we can get the price down on American made parts and equipment by having enough factories open where we can have competitive pricing, at that point, it would make sense to buy American, but until our leaders stop being sell outs to foreign nations, going in making 6 figures and coming out making 7 or 8, that is our reality. I support America all day long, but it's not doing anything besides hurting your wallet buying American (with some exceptions), and these dealers that sell American (with some exceptions) are making big profit margins, there needs to be real legislation passed to bring production back to America before anything changes. If you want to support America in the large scope that will trickle down and effect the little man, we have to vote in people who will bring these positive changes to our country so we can actually benefit off buying American made products. We should be able to buy a big boy American made saw for 500$ but we cannot, and the money we make doesn't justify it unless you are making a whole lot of money, and at that point, you probably arn't boots on the ground.
Spit it out…
Why create a new wheel that already has proven itself reliable! Buy quality tools the first time! I couldnt support any product made outside our alliance countries and would rather have everything made in America. What a mess our government has put us in. Embarassing.. Work hard...save your money and buy quality....period.
All you need to do to any of the Holzfforma saws is add a ported muffler & a tank guard
How do you explain models that no one else even has parts for?
Farmertec is the only place that you can buy ALL the parts, or a complete kit, or a complete clone ms200t?
This comment is in response to them being only a trading agent.
Well known fact Chinesium is weaker than badly made Pastry you get what you pay for is a very true saying
😂😂😂😂! I love that comment. Chinesium! Very funny, but oh so true.
That's what I usually say. Sometimes you get lucky and the thing works as well as OEM and lasts almost as long. My friend has a 372xp clone and uses it daily just about for tree work. Runs good so far, has only had it a few months so time will tell. Hell, a piston and jug is pennies to rebuild. I hate shitty tools as much as the next guy but theres something to be said for these things. Especially when the OEM is moving to more and more Chinese parts anyway, and sometimes are unavailable.
Can I have one
maybe you should move to china
Kind of sickening watching middle america race to the bottom.
Nie chcę Ciebie obrażać ale myślę że chciwość takich ludzi jak Ty sprowadza ten świat do upadku. Tylko ilość się liczy.
Yeah I wish there was a saw manufacture here in the USA.
This is why America is finished...there is always a price point and a bargain shopper. Thanks for the back story.
Stihl was never American made . . . smh but them 250's 44's 66's & 88's if you know them are bad ass & run with any of these new shits unless they're modded auto tuners like 201 261 362 462 and so on, but they were never American to begin with.
@@dlostyles2578 Stihl is made in Virginia 😂👍🏻
Stihl Group Manufacturing has state-of-the-art assembly plants in:
Austria
Brazil
China
Germany
Switzerland
United States
The majority of gas-powered Stihl products sold in the US are finished at Stihl’s Virginia Beach manufacturing plant. However, many of the parts and components come from abroad.
@@dlostyles2578 assembly - - - not made, but assembled as are toyota and chevy vehicles
the saws are different in only being assembled in the USA
all the parts are made in another country.
shucks my Subaru had parts made in Japan, Germany, China
my GMC was assembled in Mexico the other truck was assembled in Canada [both "claim" to be American vehicles but have a few metric parts that came to be assembled on another country outside the USA - was your saw made in America? are all Harley Davidson's made in America?
hmm . . just something to think about . . . hmmm. . .
@@toknowlj I didn't realize I wasn't clear & needed someone to reiterate . . . I mean u just underlined what I put dwn, I'm glad someone was tracking at least.
Very few things are "made in the USA" they are only assembled here there & everywhere.
If everyone threw out everything made in China, well thats a different story.
Dyslexia & procrastination plagues the United States.
Farmertec was not selling kits here when you said and the blue saws and such came much later, I saw none on your table. They did sell parts in bulk but kits were overseas only. The owner used to send his card to the VIPs in the saw kits. Their weakness is the chinese "good enough" attitude. A note, the part#s on Stihls many of them are internal #s and don't show up when you search, internally they refer to another part number, but your correct the parts are easy to tell apart. Guys way back bought all the farmertec parts separately and assembled them and tried to get over on people on craigslist and ebay. The kit story was very interesting to guys that want to save money but post covid saving money is real hard if not impossible. Lots of forum posts on the kits. Funny thing is there are now knockoffs of the knockoffs. Project farm did a video recently on a farmertec knockoff
what are you a sales man i dont need to spend 2-3 times as much for a saw the farmer tech one is built better
There is always a poorer third country ready to steal designs and have 8 years old put them together ... and a local entrepreneur eager to make a buck out of it. Here my friends is where ethics, step in. It’s all up to us, the buying bunch, todecide what’s best for our Country and it’s people !
Yeah let's find a company here in USA to make these products!
@@rockymountainchainsawThat would be great but just buying from manufacturers located in countries with decent living conditions would be a great leap forward cause what do you know, they usually have quality standards. The problems stems from that continuous search for ever lower cost goods. Something has to give in so it usually comes down with cutting corners on quality, slavery-like working conditions and total environment disregard.
Germany is as bad as China if not worse. Sweden is cool but if you buy German made might as well buy Chinese.
@@danielrobert7181I bet you shop at Walmart. Buy a cellphone lately?
🤦♂️
@@stevenbrown5210 you are right in pointing out most people's inconsistent behaviour but for one, my Walmart outings are limited to food and produce and as for my cell, I chose a "second chance" (aka remanufactured) cell from my service provider to minimize its negative impact. Regards !
You sound exasperated.
You get what you pay for!!!