I just saw this to a japanese channel that's also a lance main. I saw your video about lance DPS discussing that guard dash has access to leaping thrust then wide sweep. Well on the jp channel I learned from her that you could technically still have access to leaping thrust then wide sweep. However the combo goes like this. After shield tackle > cancel thrust > power guard > then leaping thrust and wide sweep. The transition of this from cancel thrust is really fast, I mean it's really really fast. that's why after learning this move I never went back to guard dash anymore though if I just wanted to loop the leaping thrust I still have it on my switch skill swap. Oh btw pros of this shield tackle cancel to leaping thrust combo is that it's always guarded because technically you are cancelling from power guard. So you can reposition the leaping thrust also 360 deg. Because of this I never stop attacking anymore
Just saw you comment, never seen anyone mention this combo before. I tried it on the Dummy and it seems to flow really well, and the input is kinda fun too (pressing the buttons from the top to the bottom and then repeat) I'll have to see it handles in practice. Only worry i have is it's a little slower to execute and might be a little less dps.
Best thing about shield tackle is using it into huge attacks to land extremely safe punish through them. Shield tackling into valstrax stabs and that kind of thing is amazing and I've had so many situations where I broke a valstrax wing when he stabbed it at me and it feels incredible.
Really respect you putting so much effort into videos researching and explaining the whys and hows of speedrun-meta vs non-meta. It must be taking an awful lot of time, but it feels great to hear and see things in action rather than just being told and expected to trust what's given. Earnestly really thankful + I wish your kind of effort was the more popular type of video than bigger channels' clickbait titles and second-hand info parroting.
YESSS. this is exactly the video I needed today, realizing I've been permanently fused to my Lance since sunbreak. Love both skills a lot, really excited to hear your view on these! Leaping thrust is easily one of my favorites moves in the entire series.
Guard dash fan here, tried shield tackle but didn't like the feeling and the lack of mobility. It feels so good when you learn to guard dash through monster attacks to keep harassing the same weak point, nothing can beat that ^^
Shield Tackle does have it's perks for directional repositioning. When we didn't have it, the only way outside of just walking to redirect your line of focus was to use power guard or either anchor/spiral silkbinds.
I'm so very confused by this topic as I haven't played much sunbreak and am only hr7. I have been "guard dashing" this whole time but I don't have it equipped as a switch skill as I haven't unlocked it. On xbox you hold right trigger and press Y and direction towards the monster to guard dash into either the leaping thrust or shield bash or you do the same after an attack to move away from the monster and both are guarding while dashing and that's just a standard movement ability. Am I missing something here? because that seems like what the switch skill is supposed to do but I don't need it to use it
I use both tbh. I'll switch to the scroll with Shield tackle if stamina use is getting to be real tight and dangerous, cause tackle doesn't use stamina. I'll also switch to it if I know I'm near stunning a monster and just want a moment to breath, so I'll prioritize stun damage. I try to be in the dash scroll when the monster is downed or if I need to be more evasive or move more, or if I'm in a good position and wanna prioritize damage. The big issues is just remembering if my facing direction will change or not, lol.
I have two sets, one with Shield Tackle and Insta Guard so I can as you said reset to neutral and insta block to use the cross move while getting Spiral Thrust for dishing damage without countering; thene in the other scroll I have Guard Dash and the standard Guard to abuse combos with Leaping Trust on each opening keeping Anchor Rage there to buff the move, it is nice to see I was able to get a decent feel of the gameplay by myself, your videos help a lot
Causal here. I use shield tackle as an instant block similar to the Great Sword. I find it useful for monsters that are hyper aggressive/ leave you will little breathing room such as Lucent Narga, Golden Rath, Seregios (affected too) and powered up Zino.
8:38 from my own experience right now i might wanna add: it seems you can go back into guarded position as soon as the dmg hits, meaning if youre very close to the enemy, the lance will hit sooner and youre thus able to cancel back into a guarded backstep sooner. making the opening for receiving dmg yourself smaller.
I remember reading a breakdown of a guy that measured all the MVs of each attack and compared them to the execution time on reddit. Essentially it came down to, if every attack landed on the exact same zone, B&B guard dash combo had 6% higher DPS than the B&B shield tackle combo. Everything else was pretty much laid out in this vid very clearly, namely that: -Guard dash combo has better lateral mobility, easier lockdown and more concentrated on a single point that is relatively static -Shield tackle combo has better centrifugal mobility around a single point being able to change direction very easily (both defensively and offensively significant), and access to more stun damage. Ultimately if that 6% difference doesn't phase you, go with whatever's more comfortable
Keep in mind: Assuming that (including time spent ensuring your safety) you spend at least 6 more seconds out of every 100 seconds sharpening on average than you would if you weren't shredding sharpness with leaping thrust, that advantage is completely nullified, even ignoring all other advantages of shield tackle (some of which are either not stressed enough in this video imo or not mentioned at all; for example, a KO scored with shield charge will never proc Offensive Guard, meaning your OG timer from the start of the KO is (usually much) shorter, while a KO scored with guard dash's shield bash at best starts out with one second less than a KO initiated by shield tackle, which will in most cases proc OG _with the hit that KOs;_ shield tackle's entire guard duration counts for OG, and its damage and stun instance are during this duration, which is why you would use shield tackle over guard dash for stun). I think shield tackle is being underrated both here and in general.
@@harpingon are you sure it doesnt actually use 1 tick of sharpness per hit? (aka 3 since you land 3 hit) edit: ok, looking at some video, it does look like it's 1 tick for the entire move so it looks pretty efficient :D I think it was in world/iceborne that this move used more sharpness
I really appreciate your in-depth, no nonsense explanations. I'm very new to Lance and I'm still trying to figure it out, and your videos are easy to understand and, most importantly, not in the least bit condescending. I enjoy guides that don't make me feel like a dumbass.
I definitely find shield tackle more useful in multiplayer, specifically because the monster's erratic movement leads to needing to change what direction you're guarding way more often
awesome video! I used shield tackle for the first part of my MR playthrough and then saw your initial video on dps. now I can't stop leaving thrusting!
the idea of lots of knockdowns being bad for lance makes a ton of sense to me, it would end really interesting to see if that were true! I play lots of multiplayer and have found leaping thrust much more useful than shield tackle for exactly the reason you said, it makes it easier to close the gap on an erratic monster. thanks Gobul!
@@LanceLoverPartDeux after a leaping thrust i do a shield tackle and go back into perfect guard. It's def not the best for dps but it helps me turtletackle through a lot of monster animations. 😄
shield tackle works best against smaller monsters that flail a lot and have less telegraph on their attacks, also typicall easier to hit them in the face, guard dash is more consistent against larger monsters, and typically the better option for downed monsters.
Great video as always. A twin vines madman here. _And_ a shield tackle user. I don't doubt any info given in this channel for solo hunting, but in multiplayer I don't believe DPS (over the entire hunt) can be sustained when the monster is jumping all around the place targeting different hunters erratically. Twin vines tether means you're always right back at poking the monster, virtually non-stop, since it's a safe aerial shield bash (pressing ZR while homing). Shield bash is for pivoting to counteract the erratic monster movement, not for the stun. Anyway I'm probably very "wrong" seeing that I've never seen _any_ lancer play the tether game in multiplayer hunts, and I'm alright with my (scrub) ways.
The running lance charge and spiral thrust can be used to close long to very long distances. Sheathing retreat has more utility than twin vines in my opinion. You can leap over a downed monster to get to its head, while airborne you can chuck flash bombs and barrel bombs and it's quicker access to healing items. In the case where a Diablos or Tigrex is doing it's final charge you can Anchor Rage or block then use the sheathing retreat to reposition closer to it immediately after.
I started playing monster hunter in world and picked up the lance because of how funny I thought the charge was and then the more I played it realized how good it is. Only to then see how good it was in rise but eventually drop it at the beginning for the SnS. Once i decided it was time to pick up a new weapon again one of your videos came across my feed and made me think to use lance and now I love it even more than I did in world. Love your videos man.
Also twin vine seems pretty useful in sunbreak, you get more guard, lesser stamina consumption and increased monster aggro chance. All of which are things I want as lance. Maybe the only gripe I have is the long recovery animation.
I find that Shield Tackle is best used in scraps, slugfests and just chaotic match-ups in general. Tobi Kadachi is a perfect early game example of this. He won't stay still. His moves send him all over the place. He even has a two-hit attack that involves him hitting you from the front and then from behind. Shield Tackle is perfect for dealing with that. Sure you can Insta Block the first move, hop to cancel the recovery frames, turn your camera and character around and then Insta Block the second hit, but that just feels awkward and cumbersome. Shield Tackling is more convenient in that type of a messy situation. So as you mentioned in your video, it's really good against fanged beast type of monsters (that aren't Rajang and Furious Rajang). Otherwise, I mainly use Guard Dash.
I appreciate making use of Shield Tackle for turning around and not consuming stamina, and I find it funny to use for forcing stuns quickly, but I see why Guard Dash is still important for Lance. I've run both in my Lance before, and with Furious Rajang's armor skill, I can run Shield Tackle on my Red Scroll for use while I tank, stun and build Fury, and then switch to the Blue Scroll once that Fury's built up to use Guard Dash to dish out damage with infinite stamina.
10:58 i wouldve cut that pause in speach a bit shorter. feels a bit off, somehow im trippin over it xd guess im too used to content creators cutting out their breathing breaks.
Man you are a lifesaver, so glad I subscribe to your channel, you are so helpful and informative. Can't wait for a video on status lance after the first update (too bad the new lance are kinda lackluster)
9 месяцев назад
I like to use both for each Switch Skill. Dereliction, especially on Lv3, makes elemental attacks stronger with the Red Scroll, and the Blue Scroll favours stun damage.
Thanks so much for the video! I do enjoy the feeling of shield tackle better, so I will continue to play it, but I also try to play my own playstyles optimally. Would love to get your thoughts on my two standard combos: Poke x3 -> shield tackle (repeat) Poke x2 -> charged slash -> shield tackle (repeat) I really hate the charged slash in rise and am constantly torn between my love for poking and my love for DPS. Would love your input on this and maybe a video on optimal use of shield tackle!
Hey, it all depends on what you are looking for tbh. In terms of pure strength/damage this is pretty bad for a lot of reasons. First you have shield tackle but you know why it is suboptimal thanks to the video, then the pokes are both far worse it terms of dps and a lot less sharpness efficient than charged slashes, (I don't like charged slash either but right now it is way stronger than the other options in neutral). And then if you try to use a charged slash in your combo while still keeping 2 pokes in, in theory you should always use the charged slash as your first or second hit instead of the third since the third poke has a damage boost while charged slash always does the same damage no matter when you use it in the combo. So while charged slash -> high poke -> charged slash is still better, if you only use one charge out of the 3 hits it should not be in third. But obviously in the end do what is fun to you, DPS does not matter if you are not having fun. Tho if you want to farm efficiently you probably lose at least 30% DPS doing this compared to a meta combo. (Considering the extra sharpening in the mix) I hope that could help, but keep having fun that's the most important !
Twin Vine might unironically be worth running with that Lucent skill Sneak Attack, in order to maintain a position behind the monster. It would definitely be worth testing to say the least
I feel like any effort to make that skill work in singleplayer is a waste of time (except maybe for gunners using traps/status), especially with the armour investment involved. That's a gut feeling and not something I've theorycrafted out or anything, but it's a gut feeling in which I'm pretty confident.
Sneak Attack is actually good for Gunlance, because (1) there's blast dash & bullet barrage and (2) it increases all forms of damage including shelling.
One idea for the next video. How about a look into different ways of playing the lance? The new Raths give us some nice status options in Foray, Chain Crit and Status Trigger, perhaps the return of evade lancing? Or maybe the skill works with instablock (I doubt it)? Either way, I always loved the poison, para lances in World, maybe they can make a comeback? With your knowledge I am sure you can figure it out, or just tell me I am way off and just keep the meta as usual
I play Evade Lance. And while it's definitly worse it's the playstyle I enjoy more. And all my hunts are sub 10 minutes which is good enough for me. I haven't tested Lucents new skill, but maybe it would make raw evande lance better.
Another thing to consider is that you can go right from a shield tackle -> counter guard-> power guard, which is a really safe option if you don’t feel like you can land an insta-block. It effectively makes shield tackle as safe as guard dash once you get used to it.
Shield tackle all the time. It allows super aggressive lance play with better control of direction and counter block timing, also keeps offensive guard up much more reliably. I love it. I am not nearly so find of guard dash. To me it feels very clunky.
I think prioritizing raw damage with a slight emphasis on element would do more damage due to the 0.4 element multiplier on leaping thrust. You would have to use combos that have less raw dps in order to fully utilize a full element-focused build. I could be wrong though, so I’d love to see this as a vid as well
I had been exclusively been using shield tackle throughout sunbreak because of how good the spam combo with it felt and just dismissed guard dash. I hadn’t realized how good the buff for leaping thrust was, so i changed some of my switch skills to have more diversity/flexibility in hunts instead of being identical aside from one attack skill.
Shield tackle --> instablock also has a small pocket of window where you are vulnerable between tackle end and instablock start up it seems, that doesn't seem to be there if you are running regular guard.
Hey what set are you using for this video? I have a Lance set that consists of Risen Teostra and Flaming Espinas armor for attack boost(along with other skills but its mainly attack boost focused) but it doesnt feel like Im doing enough damage, but just enough to comfortably live and attack the monster at the same time.
9:20. "Unfortunately it's not quite as powerful in Sunbreak as it used to be because we have access to Sheathing Retreat." Well, that, and the fact that default hop distances for Lance (and any weapon with hopping in general) has been gutted compared to World and Iceborne.
Being you're a Lance player as well, I want to know if you've noticed the same or similar. I heavily used guard dash in base rise, it always felt good. I still use it as well as shield tackle but I've noticed being hit or getting carted when I know for sure I guarded attacks. I've only noticed this during anomaly quests. I always run Guard 5 and I know which attacks are considered "unblockable" for guard up but it seems that the anomaly monsters have a much higher capacity for dealing chip damage even with attacks that wouldn't be considered unblockable. So I'm trying to figure out if somethings were changed with guard itself, if these are specific to anomaly quests or if for some reason there's just some jank going on due to it being a new update. There have been several occasions where I've been hit by attacks I guarded, or hit by attacks or explosions that were no where near me or I take a bunch of chip damage that doesn't feel justified. I do run bloodlust on my build and I know that ticks away with some red health but even then. When blocking in the past the attacks didn't chip away your red health that I was aware of.
I never could guard dash through moves and ended up using it for movement and attacking but ooo when i got shield tackle mmmf just so responsive and you get a whole second of basically invulnerability that you can chain rapidly or go into a thrust, and i think he undervalues the fact that the entire shield tackle move except just a brief moment at end is blocking whers guard dash only the moment at the start is blocking (he clearly wrote 3/8ths of the attack is the block)
I'm a bit late to the party, but as a shield tackle user, the biggest thing to learn imo is how to use shield charge to approach the monster when it gets far away. Yes it consumes quite a bit of stamina, but it is vital for being able to keep up with a monster. It works on multiplayer too
For my part, having come back to lance for the first time since Iceborne(base Iceborne to be specific), I think of shield tackle as the training wheels. I'm still using it while I get used to the inputs and timing for Lance moveset, but I plan to switch over to guard dash when I've got those down better. I honestly might not make it far enough with the weapon to switch though since it's only a secondary I use to mix things up when I get tired of my mains.
So the blue flash is just a temporary guard raise? I read somewhere that someone timed their shield tackle perfectly and got a cross slash follow up, but they must have meant insta block, because I have been using shield tackle a long time and have never managed that. I don't think timing it well does anything unique, honestly
I do have a question. We do talk about the bread and butter combos a lot. How is lance supposed to keep good dps uptime in a multiplayer hunt? I'm saying better redults in solo play than in multiplayer hunts as I'm using insta block quite a lot
Once I figured out to do a leaping guard when the monster’s about to attack, Lance ended up being my most consistently damaging weapon in the whole game. I’m getting knockdowns just by attacking when I never did my entire time playing the game (in both base Rise and Sunbreak), and it’s taking me *much* less time to complete a quest. All because I learned the biggest advantage of Leaping Guard. I don’t see nearly as much success with Shield Tackle
I love them both so dog bless switch skill sets. While guard dash is pretty much objectively the better dps option I really like shield tackle because of its quickness and snappiness, to me it feels like there's a lot more control over what I'm doing since I can change out of it very quickly, even if guard dash actually has more maneuverability. I'm not speedrunning, I'm playing for comfy, typically I start off the fight on shield tackle and go unga bunga on the head until I get a KO and a break or three then I switch over to my guard dash set and turn on the jets for the rest of the fight with the benefit of fat heals from Blood rite and the better dps options of guard dash. Almost counterintuitively I also really like shield tackle because it preserves a bit more of the classic lance style, making the good old 3 poke combo a little bit better in 2022 to keep up with all the flashy new moves. If leaping thrust and the wide sweep weren't there then the lance would be pretty terrible compared to other weapons but shield tackle helps to bridge the gap by giving more dps to the 3 poke combo and the KO potential. For us who want to poke 3 times then reset it's a great way to make that play style just a bit better. I think both moves are fantastic and I use them both almost equally during every hunt.
Regarding the usefulness of knockdowns as a lance, gives me time to sharpen for protective polish or activate felvine when it recharges. In multiplayer, im the second out of my friends to invest into melee weapons; I usually knock down the monster then I leave my friends to do dps.
A good breakdown of the two skills. There was definitely a lot of confusion at the beginning of Sunbreak about whether shield tackle or guard dash was better. The meta guide you have mentioned in a past video should be updated soon (just getting it proof read) to remove any misinformation mentioned there as well.
It certainly didn't help that people on Sunbreak's launch were triumphantly and prematurely praising Shield Tackle as Lance's "savior" without properly looking into motion values and experimenting with what actually works best in practice instead of what looks good on paper.
I like shield tackle just because it’s quick repositioning combining with guarding at the same time. Basically I can attack non-stop at monster head 😅 I saw your chart on another video it doesn’t seem to have that low of dps. Also idk if it’s true or it’s in my head. I used focus 2 since I have extra 4 slot. I felt charging a slap is really quick. I think it made the second charge became the third charge. I assume that also increases dps.
I guard dash ALOT. i use it to reposition after a combo so its pretty much part of my bread and butter. With guard dash im able to stick on to the enemy due to the mobility.
btw a simple answer to the lack of mobility of shield tackle should be to use charge attack instead of shield charge as you pointed. i am a big fan of charge attack, its double finisher is also pretty strong.
I see some guard dash fans here which I get. However, if you are on PC and use M + KB shield tackle is so smooth. You can reposition your direction of attack really easily and is satisfying. With Twin Vine and Shield Bash you become ultra aggressive and assaulting the monster relentlessly. Additionally - if you run Protective Polish you are not punished for using leaping thrust. I have done my own DPS testing - not using a spreadsheet or a stationary dummy and average about 4-5 dps higher.
I like both alot, but use Guard Dash more cause i like the mobility. Plus I think its move fun to use. Shield Tackle is great too and I like to use it for a change of pace.
What’s is the difference in sharpness consumption? I assume shield tackle is better for low sharpness lances? I like positioning of guard dash but shield tackle is also nice for hitting armour like metal rath heads. I carry each on blue and red scroll, they both feel pretty good. Thanks for the info!
Leaping thrust only consumes one hit of sharpness so charged slash into leaping is by far the best dps/sharpness combo you can get (technically if you only spam shield tackle into charged slash you save 1 hit of sharpness each time but this isn't practical to use and does way less damage)
I'm not saying I think this is likely to happen, but if Capcom sees fit to give leaping thrust to shield tackle, do you think that would alter things significantly? Unrelated, but I'm also curious what the benefit of running the vanilla lance charge is. Most lance users I see solely use the guard charge.
I'm not exactly a person who's extremely hip to the meta, but the lance charge is great at crossing large distances without having to sheathe your weapon or do a bunch of complicated hop inputs, and it can be put to some respectable damage in the finisher. In comparison, the shield charge gives you guard, KO damage on the finisher, at the cost of a capped and much shorter range. While getting back into the feel of lance for this game I'd end up falling short with shield charge a *lot*, but it's not an issue once you know what you're doing. Also there's some interesting dps weirdness with the constant damage from lance charge but like, it's not as good as the leaping thrust combo I'm PRETTY SURE so just end it and go back to leaping thrusting asap.
I just tried lance on the other day and its one of the best weapon in game. I haven't able to clear primordial Malzeno with other weapon but with lance its just too easy
I prefer shield tackle. Doing triple poke and reseting with shield tackle does soooo much damage. I have guard dash on one scroll and shield tackle on another so im technically never locked out of either.
I actually thought the initial consensus was Shield Tackle being the savior of Lance, so the intro surprised me. I personally don't like Shield Tackle in multiplayer. I really feel the shorter distance covered when the monster turns to someone else.
Casually, I 've been trying to keep in mind that skill swaps exist being new to lance this go round. Anecdotal on my end but I use shield tackle to power through and keep attacking. In single I feel like the distance is kind of null due to you being the main target (pals can get aggro but I run diversion thanks to the new augmentations). But when the monster trips up, falls, or i get time to drop down a trap, I skill swap to guard dash and begin the poke barrage. I honestly couldnt tell you if this is madlad damage or just bare bones but I can happily take down most anomalies down within 10ish mins. This does change with 1 monster and thats Lunagaron lol I feel like twinvine is needed on that fool in unarmored phase because he gets the zoomies. But appreciate the vid and information!
Twin Vine is quite useful, especially if you don't have Evade Extender fit into your build. Just the mobility alone allows you to stick to the monster, along with the surprisingly strong guard during the leap that can sometimes be a life saver at times. Note I said "useful", not "powerful as (x)"
I'm seeing some pretty crazy bias towards guard dash despite the fact that it was so hated in base rise I like KO Lance I understand that's very niche but shield bash is also very nice to have for that
Honestly they're both pretty bad now that I think about it but it is necessary for Lance to have to be any sort of viable which is unfortunate because of how strong some of the other weapons are in comparison
What do you think about the Nargacuga lance? I've been using it as my go-to against dragon resistant enemies in place of Valstrax lance, I am using Mastery 3 & Handicraft 2 through augments/decos.
I've not done any testing on it but Lucent's new skill is definitely good for evade lance, whether its good enough i don't know but it will shorten the gap at the least
Thank you so much for the video and your insight. Since I am a madman I do use Twin Vine but mostly due to mp, in mp hunts the combo of twin vines and shield tackle is extremely valuable for repositioning but I would say only in that situation since sadly Diversion is useless and even the combo of Diversion and Twin Vines is useless to have the monster on you at all times like the tank I wish I could be
Lance in this game feels much worse for me than in World and I really missed that feeling of unrelenting assault until I tried Shield Tackle. Sadly it really drops off in the endgame, especially in MP 😢
As a hammer main I'm very familiar with scripting stuns and the way you do it with lance seems very interesting. I would assume that going out of your way to KO with lance would be bad because it locks you out of Offensive Guard and Cross Slash so knowing how to avoid it sounds quite handy. Looks fun!
I swapped from a very defensive (def 7, guard 5 guard up 3) gameplay with shield tackle/skyward thrust to a comfy but more aggressive set with guard dash/anchor rage. My hunts were taking 20mn+ in MR4-5. It's a lot more fun but man is the switch difficult. I cart A LOT.
I think a breakdown of KO potential would be Interesting. Speaking from my experience, in Rise averaged 2 KOs per hunt, sometimes 3 when I ran Slugger 2 in addition to my blunt weapon dogs and dango slugger. In Sunbreak, I have been getting a consistent 3 KOs, sometimes 4 with just dango level 3/4 with blunt dogs
At this point, so much of my lance play is based around using guard dash to strafe backwards that it just feels wrong to not have access to that. Plus nothing will beat guard dashing forwards through a attack and just barely clipping the monster at max range with leaping thrust.
The only better things in shield tackle is the higher stun rate and the redirectional ability. You lose everything else... in a vacuum. With enough creativity and experience, you can use it for extra fast microadjustments and extra pokes in the middle of awkward positions while exploiting monster moveset recovery/positioning. I have seen this with "jyo" a japanese lance runner in his latest Malzeno Heroics run. For most runs, I would still recommend Guard dash though... Unless someone as bold as Razard tried practicing unpopular skills to a point that they discovered unique mechanical usages for it.
After using both a fair amount, i still favor guard dash over shield tackle for two reasons: 1. the obvious mobility and damage of leaping thrust, but also 2. shield tackle feels incredibly unsafe in comparison. The fact that it's such a quick move that immediately drops all guard frames and resets to neutral got me hit an insane amount in comparison to the coziness of guard dash's excessive block frames, however shield tackle also felt like an endless onslaught with its ability to turn any direction instantly and continue your normal combos with no break in-between. I've since gone back to guard dash and am enjoying the charged wide sweep -> leaping thrust combo and my near-constant block frames way more
if you use shield tackle you lose a lot of damage. i like it for repositioning and aggressivness but that's it. guard dash + lunging thrust is just better.
I just saw this to a japanese channel that's also a lance main. I saw your video about lance DPS discussing that guard dash has access to leaping thrust then wide sweep.
Well on the jp channel I learned from her that you could technically still have access to leaping thrust then wide sweep. However the combo goes like this. After shield tackle > cancel thrust > power guard > then leaping thrust and wide sweep.
The transition of this from cancel thrust is really fast, I mean it's really really fast. that's why after learning this move I never went back to guard dash anymore though if I just wanted to loop the leaping thrust I still have it on my switch skill swap.
Oh btw pros of this shield tackle cancel to leaping thrust combo is that it's always guarded because technically you are cancelling from power guard. So you can reposition the leaping thrust also 360 deg. Because of this I never stop attacking anymore
Just saw you comment, never seen anyone mention this combo before.
I tried it on the Dummy and it seems to flow really well, and the input is kinda fun too (pressing the buttons from the top to the bottom and then repeat)
I'll have to see it handles in practice.
Only worry i have is it's a little slower to execute and might be a little less dps.
Best thing about shield tackle is using it into huge attacks to land extremely safe punish through them. Shield tackling into valstrax stabs and that kind of thing is amazing and I've had so many situations where I broke a valstrax wing when he stabbed it at me and it feels incredible.
You can pry my twin vine from my cold dead hands!
Really respect you putting so much effort into videos researching and explaining the whys and hows of speedrun-meta vs non-meta. It must be taking an awful lot of time, but it feels great to hear and see things in action rather than just being told and expected to trust what's given. Earnestly really thankful + I wish your kind of effort was the more popular type of video than bigger channels' clickbait titles and second-hand info parroting.
YESSS. this is exactly the video I needed today, realizing I've been permanently fused to my Lance since sunbreak. Love both skills a lot, really excited to hear your view on these! Leaping thrust is easily one of my favorites moves in the entire series.
Guard dash fan here, tried shield tackle but didn't like the feeling and the lack of mobility. It feels so good when you learn to guard dash through monster attacks to keep harassing the same weak point, nothing can beat that ^^
Shield Tackle does have it's perks for directional repositioning. When we didn't have it, the only way outside of just walking to redirect your line of focus was to use power guard or either anchor/spiral silkbinds.
Back guard dash to tank the attack & just jump right back with the leap thrust is just too satisfying
I'm so very confused by this topic as I haven't played much sunbreak and am only hr7. I have been "guard dashing" this whole time but I don't have it equipped as a switch skill as I haven't unlocked it. On xbox you hold right trigger and press Y and direction towards the monster to guard dash into either the leaping thrust or shield bash or you do the same after an attack to move away from the monster and both are guarding while dashing and that's just a standard movement ability. Am I missing something here? because that seems like what the switch skill is supposed to do but I don't need it to use it
I use both tbh. I'll switch to the scroll with Shield tackle if stamina use is getting to be real tight and dangerous, cause tackle doesn't use stamina. I'll also switch to it if I know I'm near stunning a monster and just want a moment to breath, so I'll prioritize stun damage. I try to be in the dash scroll when the monster is downed or if I need to be more evasive or move more, or if I'm in a good position and wanna prioritize damage.
The big issues is just remembering if my facing direction will change or not, lol.
I have two sets, one with Shield Tackle and Insta Guard so I can as you said reset to neutral and insta block to use the cross move while getting Spiral Thrust for dishing damage without countering; thene in the other scroll I have Guard Dash and the standard Guard to abuse combos with Leaping Trust on each opening keeping Anchor Rage there to buff the move, it is nice to see I was able to get a decent feel of the gameplay by myself, your videos help a lot
Causal here.
I use shield tackle as an instant block similar to the Great Sword. I find it useful for monsters that are hyper aggressive/ leave you will little breathing room such as Lucent Narga, Golden Rath, Seregios (affected too) and powered up Zino.
8:38 from my own experience right now i might wanna add: it seems you can go back into guarded position as soon as the dmg hits, meaning if youre very close to the enemy, the lance will hit sooner and youre thus able to cancel back into a guarded backstep sooner. making the opening for receiving dmg yourself smaller.
I remember reading a breakdown of a guy that measured all the MVs of each attack and compared them to the execution time on reddit. Essentially it came down to, if every attack landed on the exact same zone, B&B guard dash combo had 6% higher DPS than the B&B shield tackle combo. Everything else was pretty much laid out in this vid very clearly, namely that:
-Guard dash combo has better lateral mobility, easier lockdown and more concentrated on a single point that is relatively static
-Shield tackle combo has better centrifugal mobility around a single point being able to change direction very easily (both defensively and offensively significant), and access to more stun damage.
Ultimately if that 6% difference doesn't phase you, go with whatever's more comfortable
Keep in mind: Assuming that (including time spent ensuring your safety) you spend at least 6 more seconds out of every 100 seconds sharpening on average than you would if you weren't shredding sharpness with leaping thrust, that advantage is completely nullified, even ignoring all other advantages of shield tackle (some of which are either not stressed enough in this video imo or not mentioned at all; for example, a KO scored with shield charge will never proc Offensive Guard, meaning your OG timer from the start of the KO is (usually much) shorter, while a KO scored with guard dash's shield bash at best starts out with one second less than a KO initiated by shield tackle, which will in most cases proc OG _with the hit that KOs;_ shield tackle's entire guard duration counts for OG, and its damage and stun instance are during this duration, which is why you would use shield tackle over guard dash for stun). I think shield tackle is being underrated both here and in general.
@@vitriolicAmaranth Leaping thrust does not shred sharpness really. It's one hit of sharpness for three pokes. It's quite sharpness efficient
@@harpingon are you sure it doesnt actually use 1 tick of sharpness per hit? (aka 3 since you land 3 hit)
edit: ok, looking at some video, it does look like it's 1 tick for the entire move so it looks pretty efficient :D
I think it was in world/iceborne that this move used more sharpness
I really appreciate your in-depth, no nonsense explanations. I'm very new to Lance and I'm still trying to figure it out, and your videos are easy to understand and, most importantly, not in the least bit condescending. I enjoy guides that don't make me feel like a dumbass.
I definitely find shield tackle more useful in multiplayer, specifically because the monster's erratic movement leads to needing to change what direction you're guarding way more often
Totally agree
awesome video! I used shield tackle for the first part of my MR playthrough and then saw your initial video on dps. now I can't stop leaving thrusting!
the idea of lots of knockdowns being bad for lance makes a ton of sense to me, it would end really interesting to see if that were true! I play lots of multiplayer and have found leaping thrust much more useful than shield tackle for exactly the reason you said, it makes it easier to close the gap on an erratic monster. thanks Gobul!
For me guard dash is a core lance skill. I feel like it looses too much mobility without it, not to mention leaping thrust.
You can do a leaping thrust from a perfect guard
@@aeontek you can’t chain it like that though, and to me that’s the fun of it
@@LanceLoverPartDeux after a leaping thrust i do a shield tackle and go back into perfect guard. It's def not the best for dps but it helps me turtletackle through a lot of monster animations. 😄
shield tackle works best against smaller monsters that flail a lot and have less telegraph on their attacks, also typicall easier to hit them in the face, guard dash is more consistent against larger monsters, and typically the better option for downed monsters.
Great video as always.
A twin vines madman here. _And_ a shield tackle user. I don't doubt any info given in this channel for solo hunting, but in multiplayer I don't believe DPS (over the entire hunt) can be sustained when the monster is jumping all around the place targeting different hunters erratically. Twin vines tether means you're always right back at poking the monster, virtually non-stop, since it's a safe aerial shield bash (pressing ZR while homing). Shield bash is for pivoting to counteract the erratic monster movement, not for the stun. Anyway I'm probably very "wrong" seeing that I've never seen _any_ lancer play the tether game in multiplayer hunts, and I'm alright with my (scrub) ways.
The running lance charge and spiral thrust can be used to close long to very long distances. Sheathing retreat has more utility than twin vines in my opinion. You can leap over a downed monster to get to its head, while airborne you can chuck flash bombs and barrel bombs and it's quicker access to healing items. In the case where a Diablos or Tigrex is doing it's final charge you can Anchor Rage or block then use the sheathing retreat to reposition closer to it immediately after.
I'm right there with you brother. Plus Twin Vine ruins Chameleon and Lucent's stealth.
I really like both and the different playability styles it provides.
I started playing monster hunter in world and picked up the lance because of how funny I thought the charge was and then the more I played it realized how good it is. Only to then see how good it was in rise but eventually drop it at the beginning for the SnS. Once i decided it was time to pick up a new weapon again one of your videos came across my feed and made me think to use lance and now I love it even more than I did in world. Love your videos man.
Also twin vine seems pretty useful in sunbreak, you get more guard, lesser stamina consumption and increased monster aggro chance. All of which are things I want as lance.
Maybe the only gripe I have is the long recovery animation.
Even with the buffs I still feel wirebugs are better served and used on spiral thrust, anchor rage or the other one I don't use.
I find that Shield Tackle is best used in scraps, slugfests and just chaotic match-ups in general. Tobi Kadachi is a perfect early game example of this. He won't stay still. His moves send him all over the place. He even has a two-hit attack that involves him hitting you from the front and then from behind. Shield Tackle is perfect for dealing with that. Sure you can Insta Block the first move, hop to cancel the recovery frames, turn your camera and character around and then Insta Block the second hit, but that just feels awkward and cumbersome. Shield Tackling is more convenient in that type of a messy situation. So as you mentioned in your video, it's really good against fanged beast type of monsters (that aren't Rajang and Furious Rajang). Otherwise, I mainly use Guard Dash.
I appreciate making use of Shield Tackle for turning around and not consuming stamina, and I find it funny to use for forcing stuns quickly, but I see why Guard Dash is still important for Lance.
I've run both in my Lance before, and with Furious Rajang's armor skill, I can run Shield Tackle on my Red Scroll for use while I tank, stun and build Fury, and then switch to the Blue Scroll once that Fury's built up to use Guard Dash to dish out damage with infinite stamina.
10:58 i wouldve cut that pause in speach a bit shorter. feels a bit off, somehow im trippin over it xd guess im too used to content creators cutting out their breathing breaks.
Man you are a lifesaver, so glad I subscribe to your channel, you are so helpful and informative. Can't wait for a video on status lance after the first update (too bad the new lance are kinda lackluster)
I like to use both for each Switch Skill.
Dereliction, especially on Lv3, makes elemental attacks stronger with the Red Scroll, and the Blue Scroll favours stun damage.
Thanks so much for the video! I do enjoy the feeling of shield tackle better, so I will continue to play it, but I also try to play my own playstyles optimally. Would love to get your thoughts on my two standard combos:
Poke x3 -> shield tackle (repeat)
Poke x2 -> charged slash -> shield tackle (repeat)
I really hate the charged slash in rise and am constantly torn between my love for poking and my love for DPS. Would love your input on this and maybe a video on optimal use of shield tackle!
Hey, it all depends on what you are looking for tbh. In terms of pure strength/damage this is pretty bad for a lot of reasons.
First you have shield tackle but you know why it is suboptimal thanks to the video, then the pokes are both far worse it terms of dps and a lot less sharpness efficient than charged slashes, (I don't like charged slash either but right now it is way stronger than the other options in neutral).
And then if you try to use a charged slash in your combo while still keeping 2 pokes in, in theory you should always use the charged slash as your first or second hit instead of the third since the third poke has a damage boost while charged slash always does the same damage no matter when you use it in the combo.
So while charged slash -> high poke -> charged slash is still better, if you only use one charge out of the 3 hits it should not be in third.
But obviously in the end do what is fun to you, DPS does not matter if you are not having fun. Tho if you want to farm efficiently you probably lose at least 30% DPS doing this compared to a meta combo. (Considering the extra sharpening in the mix)
I hope that could help, but keep having fun that's the most important !
Twin Vine might unironically be worth running with that Lucent skill Sneak Attack, in order to maintain a position behind the monster. It would definitely be worth testing to say the least
Wow, great point. Hope Gobul sees this.
I feel like any effort to make that skill work in singleplayer is a waste of time (except maybe for gunners using traps/status), especially with the armour investment involved. That's a gut feeling and not something I've theorycrafted out or anything, but it's a gut feeling in which I'm pretty confident.
Sneak Attack is actually good for Gunlance, because (1) there's blast dash & bullet barrage and (2) it increases all forms of damage including shelling.
One idea for the next video. How about a look into different ways of playing the lance? The new Raths give us some nice status options in Foray, Chain Crit and Status Trigger, perhaps the return of evade lancing? Or maybe the skill works with instablock (I doubt it)? Either way, I always loved the poison, para lances in World, maybe they can make a comeback? With your knowledge I am sure you can figure it out, or just tell me I am way off and just keep the meta as usual
I feel guard step is even more necessary with a status build. There are so many parries that evade lance is pretty pointless
I play Evade Lance. And while it's definitly worse it's the playstyle I enjoy more. And all my hunts are sub 10 minutes which is good enough for me. I haven't tested Lucents new skill, but maybe it would make raw evande lance better.
Another thing to consider is that you can go right from a shield tackle -> counter guard-> power guard, which is a really safe option if you don’t feel like you can land an insta-block. It effectively makes shield tackle as safe as guard dash once you get used to it.
your damage is so much higher than mine on lance, holy moly
Shield tackle all the time. It allows super aggressive lance play with better control of direction and counter block timing, also keeps offensive guard up much more reliably. I love it. I am not nearly so find of guard dash. To me it feels very clunky.
I would like to see a further discussion about elemental builds now with the new skill from silver rathalos, is it worth it?
Yes! I second that. Definitely want to know if its worth changing up my lance builds for
I think prioritizing raw damage with a slight emphasis on element would do more damage due to the 0.4 element multiplier on leaping thrust. You would have to use combos that have less raw dps in order to fully utilize a full element-focused build.
I could be wrong though, so I’d love to see this as a vid as well
I had been exclusively been using shield tackle throughout sunbreak because of how good the spam combo with it felt and just dismissed guard dash. I hadn’t realized how good the buff for leaping thrust was, so i changed some of my switch skills to have more diversity/flexibility in hunts instead of being identical aside from one attack skill.
Shield tackle --> instablock also has a small pocket of window where you are vulnerable between tackle end and instablock start up it seems, that doesn't seem to be there if you are running regular guard.
Hey what set are you using for this video? I have a Lance set that consists of Risen Teostra and Flaming Espinas armor for attack boost(along with other skills but its mainly attack boost focused) but it doesnt feel like Im doing enough damage, but just enough to comfortably live and attack the monster at the same time.
9:20. "Unfortunately it's not quite as powerful in Sunbreak as it used to be because we have access to Sheathing Retreat."
Well, that, and the fact that default hop distances for Lance (and any weapon with hopping in general) has been gutted compared to World and Iceborne.
Have you experiment on guard dash, lunging thrust, poke, poke combo for elemental?
It’s seem to have slightly higher dps(5%) than lunging thrust, slap
8:15 a leaping what???
Being you're a Lance player as well, I want to know if you've noticed the same or similar. I heavily used guard dash in base rise, it always felt good. I still use it as well as shield tackle but I've noticed being hit or getting carted when I know for sure I guarded attacks. I've only noticed this during anomaly quests. I always run Guard 5 and I know which attacks are considered "unblockable" for guard up but it seems that the anomaly monsters have a much higher capacity for dealing chip damage even with attacks that wouldn't be considered unblockable. So I'm trying to figure out if somethings were changed with guard itself, if these are specific to anomaly quests or if for some reason there's just some jank going on due to it being a new update. There have been several occasions where I've been hit by attacks I guarded, or hit by attacks or explosions that were no where near me or I take a bunch of chip damage that doesn't feel justified. I do run bloodlust on my build and I know that ticks away with some red health but even then. When blocking in the past the attacks didn't chip away your red health that I was aware of.
I never could guard dash through moves and ended up using it for movement and attacking but ooo when i got shield tackle mmmf just so responsive and you get a whole second of basically invulnerability that you can chain rapidly or go into a thrust, and i think he undervalues the fact that the entire shield tackle move except just a brief moment at end is blocking whers guard dash only the moment at the start is blocking (he clearly wrote 3/8ths of the attack is the block)
Shield tackle feels just right for me. I couldn't get the hang of the other one, but after watching this I'll give it another try.
I'm a bit late to the party, but as a shield tackle user, the biggest thing to learn imo is how to use shield charge to approach the monster when it gets far away. Yes it consumes quite a bit of stamina, but it is vital for being able to keep up with a monster. It works on multiplayer too
I use both, Guard Dash feels more offensive.
Shield Tackle feels more defensive, least to me.
For my part, having come back to lance for the first time since Iceborne(base Iceborne to be specific), I think of shield tackle as the training wheels. I'm still using it while I get used to the inputs and timing for Lance moveset, but I plan to switch over to guard dash when I've got those down better. I honestly might not make it far enough with the weapon to switch though since it's only a secondary I use to mix things up when I get tired of my mains.
I love your videos! And lance feels even better now :)
Btw can you share the build you used in this video?
So the blue flash is just a temporary guard raise? I read somewhere that someone timed their shield tackle perfectly and got a cross slash follow up, but they must have meant insta block, because I have been using shield tackle a long time and have never managed that. I don't think timing it well does anything unique, honestly
I do have a question. We do talk about the bread and butter combos a lot. How is lance supposed to keep good dps uptime in a multiplayer hunt? I'm saying better redults in solo play than in multiplayer hunts as I'm using insta block quite a lot
Once I figured out to do a leaping guard when the monster’s about to attack, Lance ended up being my most consistently damaging weapon in the whole game. I’m getting knockdowns just by attacking when I never did my entire time playing the game (in both base Rise and Sunbreak), and it’s taking me *much* less time to complete a quest. All because I learned the biggest advantage of Leaping Guard. I don’t see nearly as much success with Shield Tackle
I love them both so dog bless switch skill sets.
While guard dash is pretty much objectively the better dps option I really like shield tackle because of its quickness and snappiness, to me it feels like there's a lot more control over what I'm doing since I can change out of it very quickly, even if guard dash actually has more maneuverability. I'm not speedrunning, I'm playing for comfy, typically I start off the fight on shield tackle and go unga bunga on the head until I get a KO and a break or three then I switch over to my guard dash set and turn on the jets for the rest of the fight with the benefit of fat heals from Blood rite and the better dps options of guard dash.
Almost counterintuitively I also really like shield tackle because it preserves a bit more of the classic lance style, making the good old 3 poke combo a little bit better in 2022 to keep up with all the flashy new moves. If leaping thrust and the wide sweep weren't there then the lance would be pretty terrible compared to other weapons but shield tackle helps to bridge the gap by giving more dps to the 3 poke combo and the KO potential. For us who want to poke 3 times then reset it's a great way to make that play style just a bit better.
I think both moves are fantastic and I use them both almost equally during every hunt.
Regarding the usefulness of knockdowns as a lance, gives me time to sharpen for protective polish or activate felvine when it recharges. In multiplayer, im the second out of my friends to invest into melee weapons; I usually knock down the monster then I leave my friends to do dps.
A good breakdown of the two skills. There was definitely a lot of confusion at the beginning of Sunbreak about whether shield tackle or guard dash was better.
The meta guide you have mentioned in a past video should be updated soon (just getting it proof read) to remove any misinformation mentioned there as well.
It certainly didn't help that people on Sunbreak's launch were triumphantly and prematurely praising Shield Tackle as Lance's "savior" without properly looking into motion values and experimenting with what actually works best in practice instead of what looks good on paper.
I like shield tackle just because it’s quick repositioning combining with guarding at the same time. Basically I can attack non-stop at monster head 😅 I saw your chart on another video it doesn’t seem to have that low of dps. Also idk if it’s true or it’s in my head. I used focus 2 since I have extra 4 slot. I felt charging a slap is really quick. I think it made the second charge became the third charge. I assume that also increases dps.
I guard dash ALOT. i use it to reposition after a combo so its pretty much part of my bread and butter. With guard dash im able to stick on to the enemy due to the mobility.
I use gaurd dash to quickly move to blocked stance if the saw a attack incoming and i am in a combo.
Spamming leaping thrust is so freaking fun.
btw a simple answer to the lack of mobility of shield tackle should be to use charge attack instead of shield charge as you pointed. i am a big fan of charge attack, its double finisher is also pretty strong.
I see some guard dash fans here which I get. However, if you are on PC and use M + KB shield tackle is so smooth. You can reposition your direction of attack really easily and is satisfying. With Twin Vine and Shield Bash you become ultra aggressive and assaulting the monster relentlessly.
Additionally - if you run Protective Polish you are not punished for using leaping thrust.
I have done my own DPS testing - not using a spreadsheet or a stationary dummy and average about 4-5 dps higher.
yo gobul, can you do a foray statustrigger build ? might be fun and actually usable
I like both alot, but use Guard Dash more cause i like the mobility. Plus I think its move fun to use. Shield Tackle is great too and I like to use it for a change of pace.
Shield tackle is agyle and allows to walk though almost everything while moving arround a monster that wont stop attacking
just wondering what outfit is that. I really like it
5:51 PARKOUR!
What’s is the difference in sharpness consumption? I assume shield tackle is better for low sharpness lances? I like positioning of guard dash but shield tackle is also nice for hitting armour like metal rath heads. I carry each on blue and red scroll, they both feel pretty good. Thanks for the info!
Leaping thrust only consumes one hit of sharpness so charged slash into leaping is by far the best dps/sharpness combo you can get (technically if you only spam shield tackle into charged slash you save 1 hit of sharpness each time but this isn't practical to use and does way less damage)
I'm not saying I think this is likely to happen, but if Capcom sees fit to give leaping thrust to shield tackle, do you think that would alter things significantly? Unrelated, but I'm also curious what the benefit of running the vanilla lance charge is. Most lance users I see solely use the guard charge.
I'm not exactly a person who's extremely hip to the meta, but the lance charge is great at crossing large distances without having to sheathe your weapon or do a bunch of complicated hop inputs, and it can be put to some respectable damage in the finisher. In comparison, the shield charge gives you guard, KO damage on the finisher, at the cost of a capped and much shorter range. While getting back into the feel of lance for this game I'd end up falling short with shield charge a *lot*, but it's not an issue once you know what you're doing.
Also there's some interesting dps weirdness with the constant damage from lance charge but like, it's not as good as the leaping thrust combo I'm PRETTY SURE so just end it and go back to leaping thrusting asap.
Does status trigger/adrenaline rush help make evade lance closer to meta dps?
I just tried lance on the other day and its one of the best weapon in game. I haven't able to clear primordial Malzeno with other weapon but with lance its just too easy
Gonna need some more meta sets going into this new armor system in the update lol
damn didn't know there is a cohoot nest in elgado lmao
The thing with Shield Tackle, is that you can joust with a Barroth.
What mixed set is that?
Great video.
I prefer shield tackle. Doing triple poke and reseting with shield tackle does soooo much damage. I have guard dash on one scroll and shield tackle on another so im technically never locked out of either.
I dont understand why so many people said the same thing that shield in MHR:S is now useless. Shield in MHR:S are no longer able to block everything?
I actually thought the initial consensus was Shield Tackle being the savior of Lance, so the intro surprised me.
I personally don't like Shield Tackle in multiplayer. I really feel the shorter distance covered when the monster turns to someone else.
I personally just have them on swap scrolls and play differently depending on my mood
I use shield tackle to cancel the O parry into thrust animation
I really want Capcom to buff counter thrust next. Counter should be big damage number.
I've found I use Shield Tackle against monsters I'm not confident against or the Furious Rajang. Guard Rush just feels much better in my opinion.
So you're saying sheathing retreat is just straight up better than twin vine?
So in a way is this good line of skills
Insta guard
Shield charge
Guard dash
Sky/spiral
Twin vine
Casually, I 've been trying to keep in mind that skill swaps exist being new to lance this go round. Anecdotal on my end but I use shield tackle to power through and keep attacking. In single I feel like the distance is kind of null due to you being the main target (pals can get aggro but I run diversion thanks to the new augmentations). But when the monster trips up, falls, or i get time to drop down a trap, I skill swap to guard dash and begin the poke barrage. I honestly couldnt tell you if this is madlad damage or just bare bones but I can happily take down most anomalies down within 10ish mins. This does change with 1 monster and thats Lunagaron lol I feel like twinvine is needed on that fool in unarmored phase because he gets the zoomies. But appreciate the vid and information!
Twin Vine is quite useful, especially if you don't have Evade Extender fit into your build. Just the mobility alone allows you to stick to the monster, along with the surprisingly strong guard during the leap that can sometimes be a life saver at times.
Note I said "useful", not "powerful as (x)"
I'm seeing some pretty crazy bias towards guard dash despite the fact that it was so hated in base rise I like KO Lance I understand that's very niche but shield bash is also very nice to have for that
Honestly they're both pretty bad now that I think about it but it is necessary for Lance to have to be any sort of viable which is unfortunate because of how strong some of the other weapons are in comparison
What do you think about the Nargacuga lance? I've been using it as my go-to against dragon resistant enemies in place of Valstrax lance, I am using Mastery 3 & Handicraft 2 through augments/decos.
Is evade lancing viable after lucent narga made a return?
I've not done any testing on it but Lucent's new skill is definitely good for evade lance, whether its good enough i don't know but it will shorten the gap at the least
Thank you so much for the video and your insight. Since I am a madman I do use Twin Vine but mostly due to mp, in mp hunts the combo of twin vines and shield tackle is extremely valuable for repositioning but I would say only in that situation since sadly Diversion is useless and even the combo of Diversion and Twin Vines is useless to have the monster on you at all times like the tank I wish I could be
Lance in this game feels much worse for me than in World and I really missed that feeling of unrelenting assault until I tried Shield Tackle. Sadly it really drops off in the endgame, especially in MP 😢
As a hammer main I'm very familiar with scripting stuns and the way you do it with lance seems very interesting. I would assume that going out of your way to KO with lance would be bad because it locks you out of Offensive Guard and Cross Slash so knowing how to avoid it sounds quite handy. Looks fun!
More important question, is there a good ice lance?
I swapped from a very defensive (def 7, guard 5 guard up 3) gameplay with shield tackle/skyward thrust to a comfy but more aggressive set with guard dash/anchor rage.
My hunts were taking 20mn+ in MR4-5.
It's a lot more fun but man is the switch difficult. I cart A LOT.
I think a breakdown of KO potential would be Interesting. Speaking from my experience, in Rise averaged 2 KOs per hunt, sometimes 3 when I ran Slugger 2 in addition to my blunt weapon dogs and dango slugger. In Sunbreak, I have been getting a consistent 3 KOs, sometimes 4 with just dango level 3/4 with blunt dogs
I men we have scroll swap for a reason
At this point, so much of my lance play is based around using guard dash to strafe backwards that it just feels wrong to not have access to that.
Plus nothing will beat guard dashing forwards through a attack and just barely clipping the monster at max range with leaping thrust.
I never get to heal when i used shield charge n shield tackle more combo instead of keep healy u can also cancel anomaly blast knocked back
The only better things in shield tackle is the higher stun rate and the redirectional ability. You lose everything else... in a vacuum. With enough creativity and experience, you can use it for extra fast microadjustments and extra pokes in the middle of awkward positions while exploiting monster moveset recovery/positioning. I have seen this with "jyo" a japanese lance runner in his latest Malzeno Heroics run. For most runs, I would still recommend Guard dash though... Unless someone as bold as Razard tried practicing unpopular skills to a point that they discovered unique mechanical usages for it.
After using both a fair amount, i still favor guard dash over shield tackle for two reasons: 1. the obvious mobility and damage of leaping thrust, but also 2. shield tackle feels incredibly unsafe in comparison. The fact that it's such a quick move that immediately drops all guard frames and resets to neutral got me hit an insane amount in comparison to the coziness of guard dash's excessive block frames, however shield tackle also felt like an endless onslaught with its ability to turn any direction instantly and continue your normal combos with no break in-between. I've since gone back to guard dash and am enjoying the charged wide sweep -> leaping thrust combo and my near-constant block frames way more
"the madman who wants to use twinvine" 🙋♀️
TO BE HONEST. I run shield tackle for Raw and I run Guard Dash for Evade (Evade skills this patch are AMAZING) / Elemental / Chain Crit Shenanigan's.
u sacrifice a lot of potential dps and mobility for shield tackle
if you use shield tackle you lose a lot of damage. i like it for repositioning and aggressivness but that's it. guard dash + lunging thrust is just better.