GRAIN WARS Part 1: The Phantom Coal Part 2: Attack of the Coals Part 3: REVENGE OF THE COAL Part 4: A New Grain Part 5: The Coal Strikes Back Part 6: Return of the Grains Part 7: The Grain Awakens Part 8: The Last Grain Part 9: The Rise of Snyderwalker
I love how Snyder decided to have all the main characters do a round table trauma dump of their backstories and didn't realize he made it so they all literally have the exact same backstory of "Empire killed my men/family/village, and I want revenge" So it renders all of them pointless and redundant.
I know it's been brought up a lot when part 1 came out, but this is really where Battle Beyond the Stars did well. Each character had a different but believable reason for being there. Barbarian chick seeks glory in battle as per her culture. Mercenary guy has nowhere else to go so food and refuge are worth a pitched battle to him. Cowboy trucker guy owes them a debt (and didn't actually want to fight but got stuck there). Weird hive mind guys are just bored. And of course, lizard man hates the villain for killing his people. Notice they're all pretty distinct but tell you something about their values and their backstory without having to have an entire slow motion flashback.
Civilization with spaceships capable of FTL travel. Power Source: -Interstellar space god -Coal Food Source: -Grain Someone check if Zack Snyder actually has a brain.
I'm honestly convince that the story for Rebel Moon is actually just some medevial fantasy story that he repurposed into a sci-fi story when he got approached by Netflix to make them a movie property to rival Star Wars.
@@LuckyTheReviewer Rebel Moon is just a sci-fi remake of Seven Samurai. Unfortunately Snyder didn't understand that the stakes of a small village being raided by a band of bandits in Edo Period Japan, doesn't translate to a massive empire regime for some reason needing flour to feed their army from a supplied by a small village.
@@samzilla567 Very much especially given that same Space spanning Empire would have to have several planets dedicated to farming and supplying the empire with food. Hell we don't even have to point to something like WH40k, look at the Roman Empire: One of the reasons Egypt was so important for the Roman Empire was because of how much grains it produced. Supply lines and logistics are crucial for Empires to function yet Snyder couldn't even do the barest of minimum of research for how Empires work.
During the stream, chat was doing its thing and added 'Grain' to movie titles. I said 'Das Grain' and saw a bit later someone saying 'Das Oat'. To the guy saying that (sorry, can't remember your name) I highly applaud you! Very clever and funny!
Timestamps 0:00 The Muted Mauler 3:22 The Title Card 4:26 Where is Rags? 4:54 Welcome to Rebél Moon 9:26 The Editor 10:03 The Actor 11:20 Anthony Hopkins & Part 1 Recap 22:18 Script 24:12 Notes From the Previous Movie 27:08 Slow Mo, Dialogue, Timeline & World 37:03 Technology 40:33 Dialogue & Story 46:18 A Parody? 56:09 Framed! 1:05:50 Zack's Choices 1:10:33 Grain 1:11:44 The Best Character 1:15:16 Visuals 1:21:32 Yes Men & Complete Control 1:23:12 Middle Grounds 1:25:23 The Cool Edgy Villain 1:31:07 The Guide 1:32:18 Budget 1:33:00 Saw 1:34:14 Grain 1:36:54 The Robot 1:39:07 Defective 1:43:07 The Grain Matters 1:48:00 Solutions 1:49:10 Implied Character Development 1:53:04 Animals & Symbolism 1:54:58 Storm 1:58:38 Night Sky 1:59:56 Setting Up The Shield 2:04:51 Experience & Zack's Accomplishment 2:20:35 Gary Leaves 2:23:40 Part 3 2:25:18 The Village 2:27:42 The Long Short, The Music & The Plan 2:30:49 The Robot 2:35:47 Attacking The Village 2:44:59 Perspective 2:47:44 Hairstyle 2:49:22 Tech, Food & Tactics 2:55:26 The Battle 2:59:00 The Light/Laser/Plasma Saber-Sword-Thingy 3:03:08 The Children 3:04:02 Farmerman 3:06:47 The Plan 3:08:42 Simpatetic Fascists & Careless Heroes 3:12:20 Reinforcements & Save the Private Ryan 3:16:35 Battles 3:29:06 Weapons 3:30:42 War Criminal Protagonist 3:34:48 The Battle Continues 3:38:30 Warhammer 3:43:16 Questionable Morals 3:46:02 Coal & Snyder's Reputation 3:47:53 Mission Objective 3:51:03 Sword Fight & Plot Armor 3:53:16 Kimmy 3:556:37 The Elk 3:58:21 Fight Scene 4:05:56 The Mature Star Wars & The Teen Director 4:07:59 Acting 4:10:00 Mauler Leaves 4:12:05 Evilman 4:18:00 Return, Death & the Rebels 4:22:37 Screams, Tears, Grain & Confessions 4:25:34 Ending 4:27:00 Reception 4:29:37 Factions & Robots 4:30:59 Snyder's Comment 4:32:00 Best, Worst & The Future Of The Franchise 4:56:53 Closing Get The Plushies!
@@bad-people6510 and i'd also point out that even Avatar 2 knew better than to pretend the unsupported primitives had a prayer of standing up to coordinated retaliation from a military capable of interstellar travel. let that sink in... Avatar 2 is a smarter film than Rebel Moon 2.....
Co-writer: they have this godlike being in a state of perpetual trance in the engine room. Snyder: Brilliant! The god can shovel coal into the furnace without ever needing a break! Co-writer: I had more of a warp core thing in mind.. 🤦♂️
@@petriew2018 I agree. I watched one of his more recent films, 6-Underground, which felt quite self aware. It was ridiculous as a film, but entertaining and valuable in its own right. Snyder GENUINELY believes that his films are the gold standard of art.
"The grain is what gives a rebel its power. It's a cereal field valued by all living things. It surrounds us and captivates us. It binds the shallow excuse for a plot together."
Rebel Moon genuinely reminds me of one of those rip-off Sci-fi Channel original movies that are on at midnight starring some past it action star from the 1990s who is now about five stone heavier. But the thing is, those movies are made for a quid. The studio probably isn't making much of a loss on ''Star Trek Wars vs Super Shark.'' But with Rebel Moon the exact opposite is true. This cost a lot of money to make and almost certainly will not make most of that back. It is very confusing to me how and why this was greenlit even to a corporation with as much money to spare as Netflix.
I’m willing to bet it was the Synder Cut that got Netflix interested. They saw the power of raw passion and pure internet autism to go, “You know, we could probably make a lot of money off this.” The problem is Zack has now exposed himself to everybody that he is absolutely terrible and destroyed this illusion that he was blameless in the DCEU. He’s not gonna get any second chances.
Not only that, but if me and my brothers were up late and looking for something to watch on the Sci-Fi network late at night we'd have given this probably 5 minutes and then turned it off. It's not even amusing to riff on because the tone is so dour and overwrought.
“No, just wait guys. The directors cut will fix everything. Just wait you’ll see!” -Surprisingly no one actually. I guess Rebel Moon was just that bad. I don’t know. I haven’t seen it.
@@samwallaceart288 might have been improved with OJ accidentally getting injured in the background. Honestly it is so silly it isn’t even really worthy of parody.
One of the things that stuck out to me was in the ship's coal room, when she shoots the guard and he falls, they show one of the workers catch his body as it rolls down... why show that? It's not a big deal but it makes me side with those guys over the protag. It's basically a smaller version of the medics scene earlier. I guess it's on a similar line but with the scene with the princess getting shot, i find it odd she's unsure about shooting. Maybe i'm missing the point but i would think having her either be a cold killer (brainwash/conditioned type of thing) or have her fail at helping the princess escape and resulting in a having to do a mercy kill (not that it makes sense). The latter would require changing up the scene, which is probably for the better. You could probably say that about a lot of the scenes, a few (or many) changes and it could, maybe, work. I get it has to be the big bad empire but replacing the empire general with a rogue/bandit (ex-/empire) captain would of probably fit better. Ignoring the details, it seemed like a perfect setup for a fractured empire where any amount of resources is a must. I recently watched Seven Samuari (or re-watched) and holy hell, 40 bandits (with 3 matchlock rifles) seem far more dangerous than a giant spaceship and an army. Like damn, the guns are actually a threat and the shifting of balance between the numerous villagers and armed bandits was great (like the bandits are a threat until they are isolated and swarmed by the villagers). I didn't know who was safe as it seemed like anyone could die. And then the ending, that it really didn't feel like a victory. That said, the grain scenes could have done with some slow-mo shots.
I had to remind myself several times today that this was a real film I watched. What made this very difficult is that I had a coworker who came in talking about how great the movie was.
@@ProjectRedfoot He's like 70. I mostly just had to sit quietly while he explained the plot in great detail, out of order, with scenes that weren't in the movie. At least it was only a twelve hour shift.
Which is dumber (in a non-comedic movie/scene): -A high-tech stealth/defense barrier being operated by a DJ turntable -A group of musicians playing adaptive background music to match a deadly fight happening in front of them I honestly don't have a good answer.
Number one! The musicians could just be in a state of denial or hope to be ignored if they don´t move and just continue to behave like inventory. In contrast the turntable (which was actually a water drum, if i remember correctly) is a needlessly complicated mechanism that serves no purpose beyond the meta.
If the larger context for the musician scene is that they are playing for a hunger games style death match and it’s in-universe entertainment for the audience then it would be fine. The DJ turntables are inexcusable though (given that actually are DJ turntables and don’t simply look similar to them). Also was this question a reference to when a similar scene happened in Wakanda Forever but with a drum set?
@@sedrie34 Yeah, I meant the water splish splashers in Wakanda Forever, I misremembered what the instrument was. I think the only ways to justify having a complicated musical instrument control a barrier is if literal magic is involved (like how singing channels magic in some JRPGs). Aside from that, best case scenario, it's a Resident Evil puzzle (play Taiko/Rock Band to gain entry). The background musicians are absurd at worst, they don't nuke worldbuilding like hooking up the very essential shield system of your country to a drumset does. Unless Snyder doubles down (grain, anyone?), and every scene has background musicians like a theatre play in the next one.
Anyone remember Samurai 7? It's another homage to Kurosawa's Seven Samurai (hence the name) also set in a futuristic setting. Worth a watch if you need a pallet cleanse after watching this train wreck.
So, hit the part where the crew talks about "why grain" and I had that thought too, like, why grain? And Zack didn't even bother giving it something interesting, like the grain is infused with X because it's harvested on this specific planet, which is required for... super strength, or SOMETHING. Anything. Straight lifting ideas from dune, but give it more than "well, they need the food".
Their enemy released a bio weapon that wiped out their foof production so they are spreading out like locusts to find food for their starving population
Okay, since this movie is doing a Seven Samurai comparison, it is also important to note that the currency at the time, the Koku, was backed by rice. Feudal Japan's economy was measured by the amount of rice it could produce for tax purposes, hence one of the reasons why it was so important. That, and it is better than millet. So, is Rebel Moon implying that grain is what backs the Imperium's currency instead of coal? The silliness of coal as a modern power source aside, coal is what allows for interstellar travel, but their currency is backed by grain? Yet another way Zack Synder fails aside from the more obvious ways.
@@666lupine666 Wow, that's a good one. It reminds me of a wise saying: "Do you know why a stone sinks but grain floats? Because a stone looks only down but the grain looks up!"
@@apocryphicdeathit means that if we had told Zack Synder the truth sooner (you are making bad films), perhaps we could have prevented the downfall of the DCEU. That amount of acting talent (minus Gal Gadot), budget, and lore to draw from, and he burned it all to the ground.
@@nhagan001 I don't think you can lay that entirely at Snyder's feet. The DCEU needed an ascendancy before it could have a descent and it never really did.
You see, burning coal for energy harms the environment, and so the evil space empire loves to do it. Plus they don't want people to think that nuclear is a viable alternative.
This is probably the last nail in the coffin for Snyder's career. He pulled a M Night Shyamalama-ding-dong. But worse, because his movies are terrible but also long and super boring. I'd much rather watch an M Night movie. I can watch After Earth on repeat, it's an endless font of laughter.
Didn’t part one just come out? I thought there’d be more of a delay between them to try and build up hype between movies, like every other franchise ever. Or does even the studio understand that they’re not getting their money back and just want it over and done with? 😂
Delaying to build hype only works if there is any hype in the first place....these were both DOA with only a small minority of twitter users actually enjoying this crap.
So these Roylaist Robots who serve the King, he didn't have them as part of his Royal bodyguard detail? If Antony Robotkins had been there he'd probably still be alive
Wasn’t it revealed that the “Release The Snyder Cut” movement on Twitter was fueled by bot farms? Anyway, no reason why I bring that up after seeing all these “people” defending Rebel Moon and Snyder as a director….
You know it’s bad when Fringy says he’d rather watch Quantumania instead. It’s really hilarious that they did the whole main “hero” tries to surrender to the baddies to save everyone. When every one of the “heroes” backstories is we made a deal with them and then they killed everyone I love
I thought the title “Scargiver” would be a redo of Batman branding people where Kora leaves one as a calling card, but in Snyder fashion it’s poorly thought out and written
4:13:16 In terms of Ed Skrein just having an evil face, that might be entirely it. Is he ever not a villain? In Alita he was literally just his evil face put onto a robot body.
They milled the grain to put into sacks. Flour explodes when scattered. So after it blocks one shot and gets dispersed into the air the person behind it returns fire and promptly erupts into a fireball.
I'm tempted to go back in the comment section of the open bar episode when they discussed Zack's Rogan interview and ask his defenders "So... have you seen Rebel Moon 2?"... 😂😂😂
Fringy unintentionally reminded me of the 96 power rangers movie where Adam receives the totem of the frog, and he's disappointed at first but learns to appreciate it
Snyder: "It is really hard to get the movie I want made, unlike other movies that have done the same thing I am saying is impossible, because studio interference." Also Snyder: "I am the Writer, producer, screen writer, director, visionary, very smart, cinematographer and have more credits than the actors." Snyder interview: "I avoid criticism online, its a dark place. I tend to only let close friends and people who agree with me preview my work. If you throw criticism at me I am going to ignore it and use more test groups instead because I am a thin skinned bitch that makes edgy movies."
GRAIN WARS Part 1: The Phantom Coal Part 2: Attack of the Coals Part 3: REVENGE OF THE COAL Part 4: A New Grain Part 5: The Coal Strikes Back Part 6: Return of the Grains Part 7: The Grain Awakens Rebel Moon: A Grain Wars Story Part 8: The Last Grain Kai: A Grain Wars Story Part 9: The Rise of Snyderwalker
Slow motion igniting of grain lightsabers wielded by the "blood lickers" who are edgy robo humans dressed in all black, spiky My chemical romance shirts and ripped jeans. Zack Snyder, dont let me down.
Star Wars made sense with the plans for Death Star being super important and warranting Darth Vadar and the Empire hunting for them but this grain stuff is just really silly. Can't believe they couldn't have thought of something better.
I've seen several reviews say the image of admiral Noble at the beginning looks like Christ on the cross but to me it looks more like the Vitruvian Man by Da Vinci because of the circle around Noble and the cables connecting him to the machine
2:46:17 Noble was incredibly fair until he was lied to. Remember he was quite generous to the villagers at the start, only wanting what the village had to spare, and offering triple the price they would normally sell it for. He also offered free robotics and machinery to help the village produce more, and ease their burdens. It wasn't until Gunnar said Modok had been lying to him that he got upset, and all murdery.
12:37 This recap reminds me of that Rick and Morty bit where they describe how a plumbis is made. How did no one read through that and realize how ridiculous it sounds when it's all bunched up?
3:45:07 Also how can the officer identify the intruder is a woman that quickly, amidst all the gunfighting and in a semi-dark environment? Kora is also sporting the same hairstyle as the soldiers! ZS missed a golden opportunity here. The officer should have identified the intruder as a man (which makes more logical sense), gets shot in the back, and Kora saying this line while standing over his body. "I am no man." 😂
So the farm is big enough to feed an intergalactic army but it is small enough to be farmed by hand and horse? And all they eat is bread? And coal? Really? The ships run on steam? How? And they shovel it by hand? No robots? How does that not burn up all the oxygen on the ship? And where do they get the water? And where do the keep the massive amounts of coal they need to run a ship that size? And how do they.... oh nevermind....
The whole "Layers of defense" thing is a real, effective tactic, usually referred to as "Defense in Depth". The theory of it is to continually provide resistance to the enemy such that as they push through one layer they are already being struck by the next (multiple further lines if possible) and are broken up into smaller and smaller units. Additionally, by breaking up your defenses into separate lines it minimizes the damage artillery or air support can inflict since the enemy would have to cover far wider areas rather than just plastering a single line and causing heavy losses (a number of old-fashioned French commanders packing their men into the first line of resistance in 1918 so as to not lose a single inch of ground took shatteringly heavy losses before German troops even left their trenches). And yes, the guys in the first lines, usually pickets or outposts of some sort, do tend to suffer high casualties, but they serve to slow down the enemy and alert their compatriots of an attack. The thing than Snyder (and many other cinematic would-be generals) gets wrong is that the first two lines, outposts/pickets and machine gun nests respectively, DO have ways to try to minimize losses. For the first line, this is usually a protected method of withdrawal, namely that rearward lines will open fire and cover the movement of the first line backward when they are in danger of being overrun. Preferably, this movement will utilize protective terrain or defensive works, such as a trench or ditch, to allow them to move back without getting hit either by the enemy or friendly fire. The second line traditionally is better fortified, with strongholds like pillboxes and bunkers equipped with things like machine guns or other mass-casualty producing weapons, which are designed not to stop the enemy, but to slow them and funnel them into predetermined areas around the positions and break up attackers. Basically, the attackers conclude that the strongpoint isn't worth the time and/or casualties and try to go around it, only to wander into fun things like minefields or pre-registered artillery impact zones. All this will hopefully mean that the enemy, when they hit the main line of resistance, will already have been broken up into IBUs and taken serious casualties (particularly of leaders to cripple communication and coordination) and will not penetrate very heavily, if at all. Ideally, a commander wouldn't "sacrifice" the first lines the way they do in this movie (and others) but use them to slow and break up an attack. You'd want folks from the first line coming back to reinforce rearward defenses and passing along any information they've gathered, not sticking it out until they're toast. This isn't always possible (the enemy does get a say in things too) and some militaries with a rather more cavalier attitude to casualties do/did practice the old "Die in Place" strategy, it's not common among most professional troops like the Imperials in this are supposed to be. It sounds like the writers skimmed the idea of defense in depth but didn't really grasp it. Furthermore, you fellas talked about "why not send everyone?". This is actually a really BAD idea most of the time. In any battle that is expected to last more than a few minutes, you really need to manage your reserves. You don't want to send everyone in one big wave because that leaves them very vulnerable in the open (to the point a single shell could wipe out scores of your people) and causes your forces to essentially all become exhausted at the same time. Furthermore, hitting the enemy with a big mob of folks doesn't work well in most forms of warfare because a large percentage of your folks aren't contributing to the fight (their comrades ahead of them preventing them from helping), but are still exposed to enemy action. If you commit reserves gradually, you are ensuring that you always have fresh troops reinforcing exhausted or depleted formations (though if you do it too gradually it's called piecemeal reinforcement and is VERY bad because the fellas ahead have already gotten wiped out before you get there, and you get wiped out before any further help arrives), while theoretically the enemy is getting tired/low on ammunition/dead or wounded at a faster rate. This is why both offensive and defensive planners maintain reserves, to take advantage of any breaks in the line or mend said breaks as appropriate. Now, there definitely have been cases where a "Let's get 'em lads!" charge has worked, mainly by being psychologically effective and terrifying the enemy into a rout, but this is a hell of a gamble, since if the enemy stands firm you've exhausted your reserves and the enemy's reserves will likely maneuver to put you in a world of hurt. I'm not defending Snyder here, but just trying to point out that as silly as the battle was designed, some of the suggestions offered aren't as valid as you might think even though the writers seem to have gone almost entirely for "Rule of Cool" and Hollywood tactics. Other suggestions, like the classic "Why is he running forward to hit them with his gun?" are on the money though, ha!
I love the line in the Making Of video that accompanied the Rebel Moon release. "We have wholly original characters" hmmm -Main character with a dark past trying to run away from/atone for their sins -Love interest in their new home that can see past the darkness in their past -Literally Conan the Barbarian -Katana-wielding asian assassin lady -Disgraced, drunken general trying to run away from/atone for the deaths of his men after his final battle went horribly wrong Yep! totally original characters, never once have I seen these guys anywhere else.
I can't wait for the second part of the 6 movie trilogy when a village of pastoral herders are harassed by the space empire to use their 1000 cows to make butter, or the village of peaceful millers are threatened into grinding the grain into flour, or the village of peasants who have to use solar evaporation pools to make salt, or the village of beekeepers so that the empire can finally have some sugar for their bread.
Gunnar’s decision to kick off the battle to save sCaRgiVEr reminded me of Rose saving Finn from saving the rebels in the Last Jedi A decision made “in love” which would cost so many lives. The tragedy LOL
4:43:20 The answer is: everyone involved in making/producing/marketing/acting is making money by the boatload. It’s the studio that’s losing it. Think of the studio as a corrupt Government handing out grants. They are invested or are receiving kickbacks from the people they are paying to make the movie. It’s not about movies, or the writing or the directing, the “movie” is just a front for making money. It’s…money laundering
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
"He was in the fields with my mom when she was researching grain just before she died".
"The grain grew, wilted, and died before she managed to harvest or research a single grain because she was moving in slow motion"
This comment was sponsored by Pepsi
@@ElecManEXE she moved in slow motion with the exaggerated swagger of a young black grain harvesting teen.
@@mykr0324Black Grain Magic!
So the spider was hiding in the grain??
"I don't like grain. It's coarse, rough, irritating... and it gets everywhere"
- Princess Rey Snyderwalker, Rouge Moon, Part 3: The Coalgiver
Work the Gluten, Luke!
SNEEDwalker
"No pain, no grain."
Grainwalker
GRAIN WARS
Part 1: The Phantom Coal
Part 2: Attack of the Coals
Part 3: REVENGE OF THE COAL
Part 4: A New Grain
Part 5: The Coal Strikes Back
Part 6: Return of the Grains
Part 7: The Grain Awakens
Part 8: The Last Grain
Part 9: The Rise of Snyderwalker
Rags faked having an injury just to avoid watching this movie.
Makes for a better EFAP tbh. Metal had some great commentary in this episode.
@@boojaliciousiii3797 For me this is immediately a more pleasant episode to listen to
Rags injured his right arm celebrating the holiday.
Rags doesn't do hw. He is the comedian commentator, not one of the analysts.
Understandable.
I love how Snyder decided to have all the main characters do a round table trauma dump of their backstories and didn't realize he made it so they all literally have the exact same backstory of "Empire killed my men/family/village, and I want revenge" So it renders all of them pointless and redundant.
but emperor Balasarius Baggins has not yet been defeated. Snyder could introduce a dozen more such characters in the extended cut.
I know it's been brought up a lot when part 1 came out, but this is really where Battle Beyond the Stars did well. Each character had a different but believable reason for being there. Barbarian chick seeks glory in battle as per her culture. Mercenary guy has nowhere else to go so food and refuge are worth a pitched battle to him. Cowboy trucker guy owes them a debt (and didn't actually want to fight but got stuck there). Weird hive mind guys are just bored. And of course, lizard man hates the villain for killing his people. Notice they're all pretty distinct but tell you something about their values and their backstory without having to have an entire slow motion flashback.
It's like the Suicide Squad joke of introducing Elba as totally unique and then introducing John Cena as having the same skill set and backstory.
As the great Bilbo Baggins once said, “I feel thin, like slo-mo spread across too much grain.”
BWAHAHAHA
This comment 🔥🔥🔥
@@TheReaIHoneybadger , not just that, it’s peak fire
I feel thin like a Zach Snyder's directors cut spread across two movies.
Also metals joke about “I grew up surrounded by grain” went criminally unnoticed
You merely adopted the grain, I was born in it!
Grain is the only thing that brings them joy in life.
“Where did you learn to re-bel? ON A MOON?”-Warry McKrieger
My favorite German-Scottish poet.
sounds like a name that could belong to an '80 action movie
@@mattmark94 I'd watch it.
War-wick Baggins
Rheba
Civilization with spaceships capable of FTL travel.
Power Source:
-Interstellar space god
-Coal
Food Source:
-Grain
Someone check if Zack Snyder actually has a brain.
I'm honestly convince that the story for Rebel Moon is actually just some medevial fantasy story that he repurposed into a sci-fi story when he got approached by Netflix to make them a movie property to rival Star Wars.
Zack sure didnt read Asimov....
404 Brain Not Found
@@LuckyTheReviewer Rebel Moon is just a sci-fi remake of Seven Samurai. Unfortunately Snyder didn't understand that the stakes of a small village being raided by a band of bandits in Edo Period Japan, doesn't translate to a massive empire regime for some reason needing flour to feed their army from a supplied by a small village.
@@samzilla567 Very much especially given that same Space spanning Empire would have to have several planets dedicated to farming and supplying the empire with food. Hell we don't even have to point to something like WH40k, look at the Roman Empire: One of the reasons Egypt was so important for the Roman Empire was because of how much grains it produced. Supply lines and logistics are crucial for Empires to function yet Snyder couldn't even do the barest of minimum of research for how Empires work.
During the stream, chat was doing its thing and added 'Grain' to movie titles. I said 'Das Grain' and saw a bit later someone saying 'Das Oat'.
To the guy saying that (sorry, can't remember your name) I highly applaud you! Very clever and funny!
Can clarify that for 5 hours 'Grain' was the real star of the show in the chat
The Wong train has morphed into the Grain train! Hail to the train!
I got a laugh out of "Judge Bredd."
The Good, the Grain, and the Scargiver
Bröther, I crave das OATS!!!!
Timestamps
0:00 The Muted Mauler
3:22 The Title Card
4:26 Where is Rags?
4:54 Welcome to Rebél Moon
9:26 The Editor
10:03 The Actor
11:20 Anthony Hopkins & Part 1 Recap
22:18 Script
24:12 Notes From the Previous Movie
27:08 Slow Mo, Dialogue, Timeline & World
37:03 Technology
40:33 Dialogue & Story
46:18 A Parody?
56:09 Framed!
1:05:50 Zack's Choices
1:10:33 Grain
1:11:44 The Best Character
1:15:16 Visuals
1:21:32 Yes Men & Complete Control
1:23:12 Middle Grounds
1:25:23 The Cool Edgy Villain
1:31:07 The Guide
1:32:18 Budget
1:33:00 Saw
1:34:14 Grain
1:36:54 The Robot
1:39:07 Defective
1:43:07 The Grain Matters
1:48:00 Solutions
1:49:10 Implied Character Development
1:53:04 Animals & Symbolism
1:54:58 Storm
1:58:38 Night Sky
1:59:56 Setting Up The Shield
2:04:51 Experience & Zack's Accomplishment
2:20:35 Gary Leaves
2:23:40 Part 3
2:25:18 The Village
2:27:42 The Long Short, The Music & The Plan
2:30:49 The Robot
2:35:47 Attacking The Village
2:44:59 Perspective
2:47:44 Hairstyle
2:49:22 Tech, Food & Tactics
2:55:26 The Battle
2:59:00 The Light/Laser/Plasma Saber-Sword-Thingy
3:03:08 The Children
3:04:02 Farmerman
3:06:47 The Plan
3:08:42 Simpatetic Fascists & Careless Heroes
3:12:20 Reinforcements & Save the Private Ryan
3:16:35 Battles
3:29:06 Weapons
3:30:42 War Criminal Protagonist
3:34:48 The Battle Continues
3:38:30 Warhammer
3:43:16 Questionable Morals
3:46:02 Coal & Snyder's Reputation
3:47:53 Mission Objective
3:51:03 Sword Fight & Plot Armor
3:53:16 Kimmy
3:556:37 The Elk
3:58:21 Fight Scene
4:05:56 The Mature Star Wars & The Teen Director
4:07:59 Acting
4:10:00 Mauler Leaves
4:12:05 Evilman
4:18:00 Return, Death & the Rebels
4:22:37 Screams, Tears, Grain & Confessions
4:25:34 Ending
4:27:00 Reception
4:29:37 Factions & Robots
4:30:59 Snyder's Comment
4:32:00 Best, Worst & The Future Of The Franchise
4:56:53 Closing
Get The Plushies!
Thanks!
@@coolvibesradio3267 you are welcome
TY, very grainful! I could barley wheat for the timestamps.
@@Ceyx000 Grain you grained it!
Thank you.
Imagine rebelling twice in the same moon
I would never. Have some self-respect!
A galactic scale military is the same threat level as 40 medieval bandits.
Even _Battle Beyond the Stars_ was smart enough to make them pirates.
@@bad-people6510 and i'd also point out that even Avatar 2 knew better than to pretend the unsupported primitives had a prayer of standing up to coordinated retaliation from a military capable of interstellar travel.
let that sink in... Avatar 2 is a smarter film than Rebel Moon 2.....
@@petriew2018
Well, James Cameron was once a smart movie maker. Zack Snyder never was, so, this tracks.
@@petriew2018 That is not that shocking
@@petriew2018and it's a pmc. Also humanity are still "early" in the colonization of the galaxy not an empire that last 1000 generation.
Co-writer: they have this godlike being in a state of perpetual trance in the engine room.
Snyder: Brilliant! The god can shovel coal into the furnace without ever needing a break!
Co-writer: I had more of a warp core thing in mind.. 🤦♂️
"Let's have the heroine blow that thing up by sticking a dozen explosive charges with big flashing lights to its forehead."
They're just trying to avoid being sued by Games Workshop by making the Navigator too similar
Michael Bay somehow managed to be more respectful to Anthony Hopkins in his Transformers movie than Zack Snyder in this one.
Hard to sleep on a Bay Movie with that Bombast Sound always...
You can tell that Hopkins was having the time of his life filming that movie lmao
@@magma_fire_bagwan Because those films are dumb fun - this one is simply dumb haha
@@viddykhaos2896 Micheal Bay has never had pretensions of greatness. He has the self awareness Zack Snyder lacks.
@@petriew2018 I agree. I watched one of his more recent films, 6-Underground, which felt quite self aware. It was ridiculous as a film, but entertaining and valuable in its own right.
Snyder GENUINELY believes that his films are the gold standard of art.
I'd really hate to think that Rebel Moon might be Anthony Hopkins's last movie.
:(
Same vibe as Suicide Squad game being Kevin Conroy’s last portrayal as Batman
more of him in the extended version.
@@nont18411I believe Kevin is still going to feature in some animated Batman movies, so hopefully those are decent; or at least better than TSS:KJL
@@nont18411 😢
My favorite part was when the Re-bels said "It's grainin' time" and then threshed grain all over the Scargiver
It would be hilarious if that genuinely wasn’t an improvement on the movie’s current writing…
F**k…
Where did you defeat an empire? _ON A FARM?_
Through the power of grain based fortifications!
Tell that to my grain’s snapped stalk!!!!
This man is literally the Rian Johnson of DC.
How he ever got as many gigs as he did is beyond my understanding.
Because he is the best director of our generation, simple.
@@dadocta5168😂😂😂
@@dadocta5168You having fun being the 2nd coming of the Biggles?
@@GeeMannn It is funny people will call him the Rian Johnson of DC when those people have the intelligence & dignity of TLJ fans.
@@charlesruteal9062 I don' know what that is but I'm sure it is unrelated.
"A complete graindown of Zack Snygrain's Rebel Grain - Part 2 - The Graingiver"
Grain
Grain
Zack's ICONIC slow-mo
Grain
Grain Gang Rise!
Harvest Moon: Rebel Gluten
"The grain is what gives a rebel its power. It's a cereal field valued by all living things. It surrounds us and captivates us. It binds the shallow excuse for a plot together."
Slow motion is the only thing that brings Zack Synder joy in life.
religious symbols, sexual abuse and stupid action is my only joy in life
-znidor zackiggns
Slow motion being the only thing that brings Zack Snyder joy in life is the only joy in my life.
I thought it was his collection of Rebel Moon rubber ducks
EFAG: Every Frame a Grain
Rebel Moon genuinely reminds me of one of those rip-off Sci-fi Channel original movies that are on at midnight starring some past it action star from the 1990s who is now about five stone heavier. But the thing is, those movies are made for a quid. The studio probably isn't making much of a loss on ''Star Trek Wars vs Super Shark.'' But with Rebel Moon the exact opposite is true. This cost a lot of money to make and almost certainly will not make most of that back. It is very confusing to me how and why this was greenlit even to a corporation with as much money to spare as Netflix.
I can't wait for Rebel Moon vs. Super Shark 2.
@@CharlesUrban Grain Sharks...FD: There is a "Sand Sharks" Movie out there...
I’m willing to bet it was the Synder Cut that got Netflix interested. They saw the power of raw passion and pure internet autism to go, “You know, we could probably make a lot of money off this.”
The problem is Zack has now exposed himself to everybody that he is absolutely terrible and destroyed this illusion that he was blameless in the DCEU. He’s not gonna get any second chances.
Not only that, but if me and my brothers were up late and looking for something to watch on the Sci-Fi network late at night we'd have given this probably 5 minutes and then turned it off. It's not even amusing to riff on because the tone is so dour and overwrought.
@@CharlesUrban Rebel Moon vs. Sharks of the Corn (yes, SotC is a real movie).
The scars are the wounds we earned along the way.
“No, just wait guys. The directors cut will fix everything. Just wait you’ll see!”
-Surprisingly no one actually. I guess Rebel Moon was just that bad. I don’t know. I haven’t seen it.
People have seen through the grift of watching one shitty Snyder film and expecting the directors cut to be any less shitty.
#releasethesnydercut
After Josstice League: "Let him cook!"
After Snydercut: "Who let him cook?!"
Now: "Cooking was a mistake."
@@RanOutOfChannelNames
He burned the grain 😔
The Julius Caesar assassination scene was so hilarious. So funny and bad 😂
That scene needs a Leslie Nelson edition
The orchestra has an entire piece written out and the characters fighting are lead by it
@@samwallaceart288 might have been improved with OJ accidentally getting injured in the background.
Honestly it is so silly it isn’t even really worthy of parody.
"Concealed within his studio, the lord of Snyder sees all. His gays pierce cloud, shadow, earth, and grain."
errm i think you meant his gaze lol
Grain piercing gays are way funnier though
@@vespenegas261 Just a gay dude going around banging bales of grain
One of the things that stuck out to me was in the ship's coal room, when she shoots the guard and he falls, they show one of the workers catch his body as it rolls down... why show that? It's not a big deal but it makes me side with those guys over the protag. It's basically a smaller version of the medics scene earlier.
I guess it's on a similar line but with the scene with the princess getting shot, i find it odd she's unsure about shooting. Maybe i'm missing the point but i would think having her either be a cold killer (brainwash/conditioned type of thing) or have her fail at helping the princess escape and resulting in a having to do a mercy kill (not that it makes sense). The latter would require changing up the scene, which is probably for the better. You could probably say that about a lot of the scenes, a few (or many) changes and it could, maybe, work.
I get it has to be the big bad empire but replacing the empire general with a rogue/bandit (ex-/empire) captain would of probably fit better. Ignoring the details, it seemed like a perfect setup for a fractured empire where any amount of resources is a must.
I recently watched Seven Samuari (or re-watched) and holy hell, 40 bandits (with 3 matchlock rifles) seem far more dangerous than a giant spaceship and an army. Like damn, the guns are actually a threat and the shifting of balance between the numerous villagers and armed bandits was great (like the bandits are a threat until they are isolated and swarmed by the villagers). I didn't know who was safe as it seemed like anyone could die. And then the ending, that it really didn't feel like a victory. That said, the grain scenes could have done with some slow-mo shots.
"I feel thin, like grain used to make too much bread"
-- Bilbo Belasaurius Bagrains
I had to remind myself several times today that this was a real film I watched. What made this very difficult is that I had a coworker who came in talking about how great the movie was.
Wait, this is *REAL?!*
@@ProjectRedfoot He's like 70. I mostly just had to sit quietly while he explained the plot in great detail, out of order, with scenes that weren't in the movie.
At least it was only a twelve hour shift.
I'm sorry to tell you that your coworker has dementia.
@@rsh8057 That's okay. We don't make him carry a gun anymore.
Dementia makes everything better.
So, to use the super hot "oracle blade"/light saber, you either have to have robotic arms, or an oven mitt.
Which is dumber (in a non-comedic movie/scene):
-A high-tech stealth/defense barrier being operated by a DJ turntable
-A group of musicians playing adaptive background music to match a deadly fight happening in front of them
I honestly don't have a good answer.
Number one! The musicians could just be in a state of denial or hope to be ignored if they don´t move and just continue to behave like inventory. In contrast the turntable (which was actually a water drum, if i remember correctly) is a needlessly complicated mechanism that serves no purpose beyond the meta.
Imagine you are a Baddy with your Own Live Orchestra for Boss Music!!! Thats Hot Shots Level of Comedy....😂😂😂
@@superfuss1984 i´m pretty sure they did that in one of the Turtles movies.
If the larger context for the musician scene is that they are playing for a hunger games style death match and it’s in-universe entertainment for the audience then it would be fine. The DJ turntables are inexcusable though (given that actually are DJ turntables and don’t simply look similar to them). Also was this question a reference to when a similar scene happened in Wakanda Forever but with a drum set?
@@sedrie34 Yeah, I meant the water splish splashers in Wakanda Forever, I misremembered what the instrument was.
I think the only ways to justify having a complicated musical instrument control a barrier is if literal magic is involved (like how singing channels magic in some JRPGs). Aside from that, best case scenario, it's a Resident Evil puzzle (play Taiko/Rock Band to gain entry). The background musicians are absurd at worst, they don't nuke worldbuilding like hooking up the very essential shield system of your country to a drumset does. Unless Snyder doubles down (grain, anyone?), and every scene has background musicians like a theatre play in the next one.
Anyone remember Samurai 7? It's another homage to Kurosawa's Seven Samurai (hence the name) also set in a futuristic setting. Worth a watch if you need a pallet cleanse after watching this train wreck.
As bloated as that steampunk anime is, it is better than Re-bel moon.
@@dragonknightleader1 It's Citizen Kane, comparatively.
“We are Rebel Moons… we rebel moon.”
- Bigideas
"LIAR!"
- "what was I supposed to do? Let them grain?"
-"maybe."
What grinded my gears the most was near the end when the rebels show up in the last minute.
_Where the heck were you guy?!_
“Oh god! IM GOONING!”
John Goonar, 2024 colorized
Just as the Elder Scars foretold…
In their tongue she is Dovahkin: the Scargiver
I am so, so happy to see Random Film Talk on this panel. Haven't even seen 2 minutes and yet I'm already loving it.
I just said he deserves to be invited onto EFAP on his stream and got informed he did in fact already get invited. Very happy to see it.
Zack Snyder is honestly doing more than we ever could in terms of staining his reputation.
Staining his reputation with praise for delivering a proper War movie unlike that worthless POS Dune Part 2.
@@zogwort1522 Good thing Rebel Moon is based in a fantasy universe... just like Dune except managed to stick the landing like Superman.
@@dadocta5168 there is no way you're serious.
@@SatanLiterally It's a troll. Or an actual Snyder fan. Either one makes their opinion on coherent storytelling irrelevant.
@@dadocta5168 if you think Dune 2 is a 'war movie' i dunno what to tell you, besides clearly you're not smart enough to be commenting in public
3rd film introduces grain grenades
Grainades, if you will.
@@robo-nidai4236
And I do
Loaded with wheat phosporous.
So, hit the part where the crew talks about "why grain" and I had that thought too, like, why grain? And Zack didn't even bother giving it something interesting, like the grain is infused with X because it's harvested on this specific planet, which is required for... super strength, or SOMETHING. Anything. Straight lifting ideas from dune, but give it more than "well, they need the food".
Their enemy released a bio weapon that wiped out their foof production so they are spreading out like locusts to find food for their starving population
...you know, some reason that would tKe 1 line of dialog, if there had been an ounce of tallent and a second of thought
Okay, since this movie is doing a Seven Samurai comparison, it is also important to note that the currency at the time, the Koku, was backed by rice. Feudal Japan's economy was measured by the amount of rice it could produce for tax purposes, hence one of the reasons why it was so important. That, and it is better than millet. So, is Rebel Moon implying that grain is what backs the Imperium's currency instead of coal? The silliness of coal as a modern power source aside, coal is what allows for interstellar travel, but their currency is backed by grain? Yet another way Zack Synder fails aside from the more obvious ways.
Wasnt it as well about how much People you could feed ( Army Size wise). More Rice, bigger Army?
@@superfuss1984 Yes.
If slow-mo was an actual person, Zack Snyder would have started an entire dynasty with how much he loves it.
If slo-mo was a person, Zack would be him, and his own grandfather
May the grain be with you. Always!
And also with you 🌾
@@HectorLopez0217 Oh thank you! Much appreciated! More grain for everyone!
"The Grain is always right!"
@@666lupine666 Wow, that's a good one. It reminds me of a wise saying:
"Do you know why a stone sinks but grain floats? Because a stone looks only down but the grain looks up!"
So Zack Snyder not only gave us a real life swatiska on a red banner, he was brave enough to give us a black man threshing grain in slow motion!!
It's grain not cotton, no connotations there.
Since you are supporting Man United, I would say that watching Man United play has the identical experience to watching Zack Snyder movies.
@@nont18411 when a Snyder movie occasionally gives you hope just to immediately smash it in your face?!
At least this movie's light saber got a kill XD
You know, I’m beginning to think that this Zack Snyder fella isn’t a very good filmmaker.
Well, better stop thinking that because he is greatest director we have atm.
Speaking as someone that doesn't care for Snyder's films, you haters are just as annoying as the die hard fans.
@@zogwort1522 Lol whatever that means
@@apocryphicdeathit means that if we had told Zack Synder the truth sooner (you are making bad films), perhaps we could have prevented the downfall of the DCEU.
That amount of acting talent (minus Gal Gadot), budget, and lore to draw from, and he burned it all to the ground.
@@nhagan001 I don't think you can lay that entirely at Snyder's feet. The DCEU needed an ascendancy before it could have a descent and it never really did.
How high was Snyder when he came up splitspace ships that run on Coal?
You see, burning coal for energy harms the environment, and so the evil space empire loves to do it. Plus they don't want people to think that nuclear is a viable alternative.
He was high on grain
@@scottski02 or high on coal
"Flour for Algernon" will give you a nice insight into the world according to Zack.
This is probably the last nail in the coffin for Snyder's career.
He pulled a M Night Shyamalama-ding-dong. But worse, because his movies are terrible but also long and super boring. I'd much rather watch an M Night movie. I can watch After Earth on repeat, it's an endless font of laughter.
speaking of M Night Shyamalan, he's back tho...
I'm so looking forward to see what the people who thought Dune had an exposition problem think about this movie.
Random film talks is such a great addition!
"Why do you think Zack decided to make it grain?"
Because *Seven Samurai.* That's the reason, I guarantee it.
Didn’t part one just come out?
I thought there’d be more of a delay between them to try and build up hype between movies, like every other franchise ever.
Or does even the studio understand that they’re not getting their money back and just want it over and done with? 😂
I completely forgot that rebeel moon exists
Delaying to build hype only works if there is any hype in the first place....these were both DOA with only a small minority of twitter users actually enjoying this crap.
So these Roylaist Robots who serve the King, he didn't have them as part of his Royal bodyguard detail? If Antony Robotkins had been there he'd probably still be alive
Wasn’t it revealed that the “Release The Snyder Cut” movement on Twitter was fueled by bot farms? Anyway, no reason why I bring that up after seeing all these “people” defending Rebel Moon and Snyder as a director….
Alternate title: Scar Wars - A New Oat
Next film alt title: Scar Wars - Fempire Strikes Back
@@avoxprime9562 Part 3: Return of the Breadai.
@@RM_VFX Part 4: The Bread (A)bakens
Scar Wars: A New Oat
The Return of the Space Quakers
Rebel moon 3: the good, the bad and the grainy
Whoever controls the grain, controls the Harvest.
He who controls the Harvest, controls the Universe.
The Grain must Flow.
“This is the Grain”
- Din Djarin of Graindalorian
“This is the Wheat.” ;D
Grain of thrones is a great name for 3rd film
"A song of chaff & threshing"
Game of Grains is better due to catchy alliteration.
"They may take our lives, but they'll never take our flour!"
Rebel Moob: Part Four
The Dark Yeast Rises
@@brockdavid LOL!
You know it’s bad when Fringy says he’d rather watch Quantumania instead.
It’s really hilarious that they did the whole main “hero” tries to surrender to the baddies to save everyone. When every one of the “heroes” backstories is we made a deal with them and then they killed everyone I love
When did he say that
4:31:07
I thought the title “Scargiver” would be a redo of Batman branding people where Kora leaves one as a calling card, but in Snyder fashion it’s poorly thought out and written
Ay she left one on Peakynazi's chest! Rolllll credits!
That would make sense though...
Gunnar's backstory flashback for why he's fighting should have been scenes from the start of the first movie in slow-motion
At least the doggo was spared
4:13:16 In terms of Ed Skrein just having an evil face, that might be entirely it. Is he ever not a villain? In Alita he was literally just his evil face put onto a robot body.
The “Lmao” got me 😂
They milled the grain to put into sacks. Flour explodes when scattered. So after it blocks one shot and gets dispersed into the air the person behind it returns fire and promptly erupts into a fireball.
Too long for the Longman? Heresy.
I wonder how Mootal felt about the German film "All Grains on the Western Field."
All Quiet on the Wheat Fields
Everyone watching this at 0.25 speed for the true Snyder experience?
Sure there are some Depressive Masochists out there...
Having forgot about the Rebel Moon "saga", this EFAP came as a happy surprise.
I'm tempted to go back in the comment section of the open bar episode when they discussed Zack's Rogan interview and ask his defenders "So... have you seen Rebel Moon 2?"... 😂😂😂
Fringy unintentionally reminded me of the 96 power rangers movie where Adam receives the totem of the frog, and he's disappointed at first but learns to appreciate it
Snyder: "It is really hard to get the movie I want made, unlike other movies that have done the same thing I am saying is impossible, because studio interference."
Also Snyder: "I am the Writer, producer, screen writer, director, visionary, very smart, cinematographer and have more credits than the actors."
Snyder interview: "I avoid criticism online, its a dark place. I tend to only let close friends and people who agree with me preview my work. If you throw criticism at me I am going to ignore it and use more test groups instead because I am a thin skinned bitch that makes edgy movies."
He is the closest thing to a real life Garth Marenghi we have
GRAIN WARS
Part 1: The Phantom Coal
Part 2: Attack of the Coals
Part 3: REVENGE OF THE COAL
Part 4: A New Grain
Part 5: The Coal Strikes Back
Part 6: Return of the Grains
Part 7: The Grain Awakens
Rebel Moon: A Grain Wars Story
Part 8: The Last Grain
Kai: A Grain Wars Story
Part 9: The Rise of Snyderwalker
Slow motion igniting of grain lightsabers wielded by the "blood lickers" who are edgy robo humans dressed in all black, spiky My chemical romance shirts and ripped jeans.
Zack Snyder, dont let me down.
Are you saying Snyder is writing the sequel to My Immortal?
A battle is coming brothers, to hot topic to suit up for battle!
Star Wars made sense with the plans for Death Star being super important and warranting Darth Vadar and the Empire hunting for them but this grain stuff is just really silly. Can't believe they couldn't have thought of something better.
I've seen several reviews say the image of admiral Noble at the beginning looks like Christ on the cross but to me it looks more like the Vitruvian Man by Da Vinci because of the circle around Noble and the cables connecting him to the machine
Arise, arise, Growers of Veldt! Spears shall be shaken, scars shall be given...
2:46:17 Noble was incredibly fair until he was lied to. Remember he was quite generous to the villagers at the start, only wanting what the village had to spare, and offering triple the price they would normally sell it for. He also offered free robotics and machinery to help the village produce more, and ease their burdens. It wasn't until Gunnar said Modok had been lying to him that he got upset, and all murdery.
12:37
This recap reminds me of that Rick and Morty bit where they describe how a plumbis is made.
How did no one read through that and realize how ridiculous it sounds when it's all bunched up?
It's amazing how focused the conversation is when one member is away.
3:45:07 Also how can the officer identify the intruder is a woman that quickly, amidst all the gunfighting and in a semi-dark environment? Kora is also sporting the same hairstyle as the soldiers!
ZS missed a golden opportunity here. The officer should have identified the intruder as a man (which makes more logical sense), gets shot in the back, and Kora saying this line while standing over his body.
"I am no man." 😂
I didnt even know the released part 2 in fact its kinda shocking it came out so fast after the first part with no buildup.
You ever seen the ending of Up The Academy where they pause, rewind, and slow down the movie over and over again?
That's this movie.
So the farm is big enough to feed an intergalactic army but it is small enough to be farmed by hand and horse? And all they eat is bread?
And coal? Really? The ships run on steam? How? And they shovel it by hand? No robots? How does that not burn up all the oxygen on the ship? And where do they get the water? And where do the keep the massive amounts of coal they need to run a ship that size? And how do they.... oh nevermind....
The whole "Layers of defense" thing is a real, effective tactic, usually referred to as "Defense in Depth". The theory of it is to continually provide resistance to the enemy such that as they push through one layer they are already being struck by the next (multiple further lines if possible) and are broken up into smaller and smaller units. Additionally, by breaking up your defenses into separate lines it minimizes the damage artillery or air support can inflict since the enemy would have to cover far wider areas rather than just plastering a single line and causing heavy losses (a number of old-fashioned French commanders packing their men into the first line of resistance in 1918 so as to not lose a single inch of ground took shatteringly heavy losses before German troops even left their trenches). And yes, the guys in the first lines, usually pickets or outposts of some sort, do tend to suffer high casualties, but they serve to slow down the enemy and alert their compatriots of an attack. The thing than Snyder (and many other cinematic would-be generals) gets wrong is that the first two lines, outposts/pickets and machine gun nests respectively, DO have ways to try to minimize losses. For the first line, this is usually a protected method of withdrawal, namely that rearward lines will open fire and cover the movement of the first line backward when they are in danger of being overrun. Preferably, this movement will utilize protective terrain or defensive works, such as a trench or ditch, to allow them to move back without getting hit either by the enemy or friendly fire. The second line traditionally is better fortified, with strongholds like pillboxes and bunkers equipped with things like machine guns or other mass-casualty producing weapons, which are designed not to stop the enemy, but to slow them and funnel them into predetermined areas around the positions and break up attackers. Basically, the attackers conclude that the strongpoint isn't worth the time and/or casualties and try to go around it, only to wander into fun things like minefields or pre-registered artillery impact zones. All this will hopefully mean that the enemy, when they hit the main line of resistance, will already have been broken up into IBUs and taken serious casualties (particularly of leaders to cripple communication and coordination) and will not penetrate very heavily, if at all.
Ideally, a commander wouldn't "sacrifice" the first lines the way they do in this movie (and others) but use them to slow and break up an attack. You'd want folks from the first line coming back to reinforce rearward defenses and passing along any information they've gathered, not sticking it out until they're toast. This isn't always possible (the enemy does get a say in things too) and some militaries with a rather more cavalier attitude to casualties do/did practice the old "Die in Place" strategy, it's not common among most professional troops like the Imperials in this are supposed to be. It sounds like the writers skimmed the idea of defense in depth but didn't really grasp it.
Furthermore, you fellas talked about "why not send everyone?". This is actually a really BAD idea most of the time. In any battle that is expected to last more than a few minutes, you really need to manage your reserves. You don't want to send everyone in one big wave because that leaves them very vulnerable in the open (to the point a single shell could wipe out scores of your people) and causes your forces to essentially all become exhausted at the same time. Furthermore, hitting the enemy with a big mob of folks doesn't work well in most forms of warfare because a large percentage of your folks aren't contributing to the fight (their comrades ahead of them preventing them from helping), but are still exposed to enemy action. If you commit reserves gradually, you are ensuring that you always have fresh troops reinforcing exhausted or depleted formations (though if you do it too gradually it's called piecemeal reinforcement and is VERY bad because the fellas ahead have already gotten wiped out before you get there, and you get wiped out before any further help arrives), while theoretically the enemy is getting tired/low on ammunition/dead or wounded at a faster rate. This is why both offensive and defensive planners maintain reserves, to take advantage of any breaks in the line or mend said breaks as appropriate. Now, there definitely have been cases where a "Let's get 'em lads!" charge has worked, mainly by being psychologically effective and terrifying the enemy into a rout, but this is a hell of a gamble, since if the enemy stands firm you've exhausted your reserves and the enemy's reserves will likely maneuver to put you in a world of hurt.
I'm not defending Snyder here, but just trying to point out that as silly as the battle was designed, some of the suggestions offered aren't as valid as you might think even though the writers seem to have gone almost entirely for "Rule of Cool" and Hollywood tactics. Other suggestions, like the classic "Why is he running forward to hit them with his gun?" are on the money though, ha!
Good read, thanks!
I've seen Random Film Talk's Hobbit breakdown many many times. it's so entertaining
I love the line in the Making Of video that accompanied the Rebel Moon release. "We have wholly original characters" hmmm
-Main character with a dark past trying to run away from/atone for their sins
-Love interest in their new home that can see past the darkness in their past
-Literally Conan the Barbarian
-Katana-wielding asian assassin lady
-Disgraced, drunken general trying to run away from/atone for the deaths of his men after his final battle went horribly wrong
Yep! totally original characters, never once have I seen these guys anywhere else.
Snyder does it again, a suspicious lack of doggo on the panel #ReleaseTheRagsCut
3:40:40 So they are just Plants from Trigun...
I can't wait for the second part of the 6 movie trilogy when a village of pastoral herders are harassed by the space empire to use their 1000 cows to make butter, or the village of peaceful millers are threatened into grinding the grain into flour, or the village of peasants who have to use solar evaporation pools to make salt, or the village of beekeepers so that the empire can finally have some sugar for their bread.
Gunnar’s decision to kick off the battle to save sCaRgiVEr reminded me of Rose saving Finn from saving the rebels in the Last Jedi
A decision made “in love” which would cost so many lives. The tragedy LOL
4:43:20 The answer is: everyone involved in making/producing/marketing/acting is making money by the boatload. It’s the studio that’s losing it. Think of the studio as a corrupt Government handing out grants. They are invested or are receiving kickbacks from the people they are paying to make the movie. It’s not about movies, or the writing or the directing, the “movie” is just a front for making money. It’s…money laundering
Really starting to enjoy Random Film Talk on these
‘The grain montage’ lol
“I grew up surrounded by grain.” 😂