How To Use The Zone System - Black and White Metering
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- Опубликовано: 16 сен 2020
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Using the zone system can seem daunting but in this video, Braedon breaks it down into digestible, easy to use bites. He walks you through different situations, showing you how to expose black and white film to get a good dynamic range between your blacks and whites in your photographs.
Shooting film can be very accurate and precise and we hope this video, and the others on the channel, help you get a better understanding of how to expose your film for good results.
Let us know what you think and thanks for being a part of our community.
Hi Braedon, always struggled to understand the zone system so thank you for making a clear video about it. Just wondering how you personally make the decision to use the zone system vs. just taking a reading from the spot/incident/ttl meter?
Hey Kenny. I think the main point of what we were trying to get across is for people to start understanding that they have control of how their images come out. And to your question, I (this is Braedon responding) mainly shoot people so I'm metering for my subject vs shooting landscapes or city scapes. So typically, I shoot with an incident spot meter - knowing that the reading it is giving me is middle grey, or Zone 5. For color film, I just meter for the darkest area (check this video if you haven't: ruclips.net/video/tS8QnzxPJB4/видео.html ), knowing that my highlights will hold. For black and white film, I typically meter the highlights and shadows to see the range and then make my exposure somewhere in the middle. I hope that is helpful.
I agree, much thanks, I have a test tomorrow :)
Hi Braedon,
Thanks for bringing the Zone System to the attention of younger photographers. I applaud your effort because the it’s a pretty simple concept but it can be a challenge to explain clearly. But even (or especially) in a video designed to be short and 'entertaining', I think it helps a lot to first explain -before diving directly into the cold water of metering for Zone System- the rules of the game: that normal black and white film can only record a range -from the deepest black in the scene to “paper-base” white- of around seven f/stops . . . and that real world “scene brightness ranges” (SBR) can vary widely …for example, some outdoor scenes can have a shadow-to-highlight ratio of up to 1:10,000. Obviously, in this case, one might want to expose and develop the film in a way which will compress the SBR into the film’s seven stop limitation. On the other end, some low contrast -or ’short range’- subjects can range fewer than even those seven stops (the extra room given in this type of situation being known as “film latitude”) .......................................................................................................................................................................................Secondly, it’s extremely important to understand that exposure affects the mid-to-high values (from light gray to white) much more than the shadow values. To oversimplify; white is *always* gonna be white, whether you over- OR under-expose* your film (*within reasonable limits) … but *OVER*-exposure can bring a black up to a gray. On the other hand -and just as important to understand- it’s the film development that tweeks the *whites* in a scene, and *HAS DISPROPORTIONALLY LESS EFFECT* on the shadow areas. Therefore, since we can *not* "develop detail into" a the shadows or low values of scene; it must be put there by a sufficient amount of exposure.
.....................................................................................................................
All of the above really doesn't take so long to get across. And, once explained, exposure placement in fact becomes simpler for a beginner to grasp and (in my experience) they more easily understand how to use the Zone System to obtain -- if they want! -- a finished print with a rich palette from black-to-white with enough details to help get across what was visualised in the first place. (And by the way, one only needs to “place” the lowest value [on the gray scale] in which you want detail ... then check to see where the highest value falls. These two meter measurements are usually all that’s needed to know how to expose your film in order to expand or contract the contrast range [in development] ..or not.. and subsequently create the most ideal negative to fit the paper you are using. You can of course check other values in the scene just to see where they fall on the gray scale, and to get an idea of how the values relate to one another, but it's more useful to actually SEE these relationships. In the olden days we'd use a Polaroid shot for this, but today a quick b&w digital shot of the scene will do the job. Short of this, a brown "monochromatic viewing filter" gives you a good approximation of b&w (or just a pair of sunglasses with brown lenses.. but used in an "off and on" type viewing method)..
Lastly, even if it's beyond the scope of this particular video-metering-, I think it's important to get across the point that the Zone System cannot fully work unless its user has first done simple (if tedious!) little bit of testing to make sure that what you meter as “middle gray” PRINTS as darned middle gray! (I call this “zeroing out”). Without this first basic testing of exposure, development and printing -yep, all three- you can't arrive at the holy grail: A consistently predictable result! Therefore, if you’ve *not* first zeroed-out, you can’t really call it Zone System, but instead, I don’t know, “careful metering”, or "a more refined technique" or something. But don’t forget, the Zone System is a SYSTEM, so it’s meant to tie-in the whole chain of events starting with seeing and visualising what you want to get across, right through to the print hanging on the wall. Not just metering, or even just metering and developing. I hope my remarks are taken in the constructive and helpful spirit in which they're intended! Again, great thanks for putting this out there!
@@chickenitsa your comment and this video is sorta helpful however I’ve usually just found this intuitive and when I tried to use the zones and metering I get confused when it comes time to make the exposure.
Then again I think there’s too much technical how to on RUclips… Is that really what Ansel Adams would want to see more than visualization?
Somehow even though I’ve a hard time fully using these techicalities I could still make a decent well exposed photo… But now I’m trying to understand why would I want to expose one way or another. That is something a little less talked about on RUclips… Can you or him talk about the why and the zone system at the same time?
@@DanielleDeutschTV If you want a better understanding of the zone system that Ansel Adams used, you should look into Nick Carver's "Precision Method for Manual Metering" course. I just watched his course and it's helped me, finally, to understand exposure using a spotmeter. I never understood the zone system, but after it was explained to me a different way it's painfully clear what's going on. FYI, you have to pay for the course but it's worth it. Nick Carver uses a different method but the concept is the same. What you are basically doing is choosing how you want your highlights or your shadows to look based on the EV reading from your spotmeter/lightmeter. I highly recommend looking into it if you want a better understanding of exposure and how spotmeters and TTL metering really work.
How to understand the EV values and exposure settings with his spot meter:
1. The spot meter internally displays an LED EV value, with 1 being the darkest reading, and 20 being the brightest reading possible.
2. There are two rotational dials on the meter; an EV/Shutter Speed dial (upper) and an Aperture/ISO dial (lower).
3. Both dials have two scales attached with numerical values.
4. For each dial, the two scales are locked with the dial's rotation.
5. For example, turning the upper dial, moves the top and middle-upper scales.
6. The EV/Shutter dial moves the upper and middle-upper scales.
7. EV values are the top-most scale (big orange numbers), and shutter speeds are the middle-upper scale.
8. The Aperture/ISO dial moves the middle-lower and lowest scale. Aperture scale is middle-bottom, ISO/ASA scale on very bottom.
9. To get started, first look at the two aligned white dots on the top and bottom of the device.
10. The first dot is above the EV scale and the second dot is below the ISO/ASA scale on the bottom.
11. To get an exposure, he must align values exactly between these two dots.
12. To get started, first he must set his film ISO speed.
13. He is shooting Tri-X 400, so turning the bottom dial to align ISO 400 with the bottom white dot would be normal in this case.
14. But as stated, he is metering this film at ISO 320. You can see that he sets the dial to one marker lower than 400, which is the ISO 320 setting.
15. With his ISO set, he can now use the device and read the measured EV values.
16. In the video, when he meters the restaurant, he gets a bright EV value of 17 and a dark value of EV 10, a total of 7 stops of light.
17. He decides that EV 13 is a good mid-point between 10 and 17, allowing him to retain detail throughout the image (using the Zone System).
18. Aligning the upper dial's EV 13 value with the upper white dot, gives him his needed exposure settings.
19. Between the dots, he gets the following exposure settings, Shutter: 1/250, Aperture: f/9.0.
20. With these values aligned, all of the current aligned values, encircling the device, will result with the exact same exposure if he used them.
21. Using '1/125 - f/13' would result with the same exact exposure as '1/250 - f/9.0', or '1/500 - f/6.4'.
22. Instead of using the values between the dots, he instead opts to use the slower shutter speed of 1/125.
23. At this shutter speed, the meter actually says that he must use aperture value f/13, but he "rounds down" to f/11, which is not a problem.
24. In a nut shell, that how it works :)
Thanks 🙏
So did he push or pull the film?
@loveclubfilms1634 he doesn't have to
We hardly see the meter, and you don’t discuss that EV chart you have taped to it anyway. There is no explanation that you’re measuring in E.V. (Exposure Value) or how that relates to the exposure triangle of shutter speed, aperture and ISO. You discuss the placing of certain EVs into specific zones, but this would have been more helpful with a discussion of how EV relates to the exposure triangle, how that chart applies to the light meter, how the spot meter differs from wider pattern meters, incident and reflected metering, etc.
All good points. This was already our longest video yet and it's that tricky balance between being too long, people clicking away because of that, staying entertaining while also being educational and informative. We tried to make the zone system as easy as possible in this one vs a super in depth explanation. It's a huge topic to cover in one video and the point was to give a very simple understanding of what the zone system is and how it can be used. We do appreciate your comment though and the points are taken.
@@FilmSupplyClub yes, I get that. Fair enough. Topic for a future video maybe
Agreed! I spent half the video trying to figure out how that taped scale on your meter related to anything. Just meter and shoot for middle gray.
Not everything needs to be spoonfed.
agreed, the whole video doesnt mean anything unless the audience have the basic concept of the EV stops, but i guess he has explained how to read the spot meter in the past?.... may be? i am not a subscribed so I arent sure.
Do you carry a Sawzall in your kit to cut down stop signs and other traffic devices that get in your way?
You can simplify the metering process a lot (multiple readings are rarely needed):
Negatives (b&w and color): It almost never matters how bright the highlights will be because the dynamic range is so large. You can lower the contrast of the print or dodge&burn. So, all you have to do is spot meter the darkest shadow you want detail in, then set the camera two stops less than middle grey, thus exposing it at zone 3. For example, if the meter says f/1.4 at 1/60 when you meter the shadow, set the camera to f/2.8 at 1/60 (or change the shutter speed instead: f/1.4 at 1/250).
Slides: Spot meter the brightest highlight instead, or use an incident (“artificial highlight”) meter instead. Adjust the camera to expose it at zone 7 (or to taste).
That is definitely a good method. This was an attempt to get people to understand a complicated topic in a simple way. Or even to understand why they would be using your method and how.
Would it not be f/2.8 at 1/125 (as opposed to f/2.8 at 1/60) since you're stopping down by 2?
@@orngpeelr9017 Close! That's three stops down from a meter reading of f/1.4 at 1/60 (two stops down from f/1.4 to f/2.8, plus one stop down from 1/60 to 1/125) .
@@UglyCameras really? I thought a stop is halving/doubling of exposure, so then how could going from 1.4 -> 2.8 be 2 stops instead of 1, since ur only doubling/halving by 1?
@@orngpeelr9017 1.4>2 is a full stop (half the light) and 2 > 2.8 is another full stop (half the light again). two stops total.
Ive watched this video several times as a refresher, thanks Braedon, really great!!!
Very nice video, thank you for uploading this, very interesting and well crafted
This really helps to explain metering using the zone system. I never understood it before. Thanks.
I think well explained!! 👏
It is a very helpful video for metering the scene. Thank you.
Thank you for this video. It was very informative.
Thank you so much! I learned a lot with this video. Spot meters are really cool.
Man thanks bro! Appreciate this knowledge on zone focusing.
great explanation, thank you so much
Brilliant material full of very useful knowledge, thanks a lot :)
so glad to hear that! We're trying to create useful content so it's always good to hear when it connects.
Wow this video is great! Fantastic explanation, I understood everything, thanks! :)
So glad to hear! Thanks for saying so.
awesome video man! thanks for very kind and informative video!
Thanks for the comment Ryan. Really appreciate that and we'll keep more coming.
It is the best way to explain the Zone System... Doing it by shooting! Thanks for your video!
Hi Braedon. Thanks for your video introducing the zone system. I like videos where the process is shown and you have done a great job. Could you please tell me what exposure meter app you showed us in your phone? Also, I have a Lunasix F light meter with zone system reverence on the dial. Can I use a camera light meter to get the EV and then dial it into the Lunasix? Thanks
Hi Braedon, loved the video thank you. I have just purchased one of the spot meters you are using in the video. On the written scale you have 0-10. To make my own, is it as simple as lining up the EV scale on 5 on the dot and then marking off the increments 0 -10 as you have done? Thank you. Best regards Paul
I picked up the same spot meter a couple of months ago, as my basic Sekonic Twinmate was no long doing the trick when shooting with a 4x5 camera. I almost immediately started learning/using the Zone System and pix are perfectly exposed now. A great video tutorial, too!
So glad to hear. Spot meters are such great tools!
what's the name of the moel of this spot meter?
@@philipv7555 I use a Soligor spot meter, which looks similar to the one in the video. But the Pentax Spotometer (a more popular meter) is likely the one in the video.
@@jasonjeandron9380 and they all basically function the same way (the ol ones) in that they give you the EVs of the certain parts of the frame?
I love working with EVs@@philipv7555
07:04 that place used to be called Fantastic Cafe about 10 years ago. It was fantastic.
hello I listened to several tutorials on the zone system and yours helped me the most to explain these clearly and precisely thank you very much
Glad it helped! So glad to hear that. Keep practicing that zone system and you'll start to see it everywhere you look.
Nicely done. I think you’d benefit from a camera with a removable back. That way you can shoot with intent to push and pull in development. That really maximizes the control shooting with the zone system provides.
When I first decided to do MF film photography one decision was the choice of camera, between the Pentax 67 and Mamiya RB67. A deciding factor was the removable film back.
I really like your attitude, Brandon for teaching, which I value very much, I saw sincerity in your person. Thank you in advance for sharing. I went back to using film, it has more warmth and more natural colours, it's more handmade to make the photo, therefore more value and you have to be thinking about everything before you take your shot. Hopefully you will make a video with the reciprocity failure for long exposures. Take care. All the best.
Thanks for that thoughtful comment Federico. Film definitely has something to it that I'm drawn to. Reciprocity failure would be a great topic. Adding it to the list.
Awesome & Thanks :)
Hi Braedon, awesome guide on the zone system. I like the way you explained the concept. What gadget did you use to shoot the video?
Thank you. It helps me out on many issures about the zone system
So glad to hear it. The zone system is so helpful once you get it.
Great video thank you. I've just bought a Pentax Spotmeter and would like to incorporate the zone system when using it so let me see if I've got this straight. I see you have a hand printed sticker on the front of your lightmeter that you've graduated for zones. My question is, are EV values and zone scale proportional?
For example lets say I have a rock in my image that I've metered and it gives me an EV value of say 12 and if I use this reading as my exposure it would fall into the 5 zone on the zone scale. But lets say I want it to be darker in my image and want to move the rock down from 5 to zone 3. Would this be the same as moving the EV value up 2 values from 12 to 14?
Actually I think I have answered my own question ... each EV value represents a difference of one stop. Google has shown me that each zone on the zone scale represents a difference of one stop, so yes, it appears EV values and scales on the zone system are proportional. Which means it should be a fairly simple matter to make my own Zone scale to put on the barrel of my spotmeter ... yeh!
This is very simplified, i believe you need to explain also push/ pull and development/ print techniques to make people understand how to contain or extend contrast
He said he will pull the film development to ASA/ISO 320. In other words he rate the film to 320 instead of 400 and he sets the spotmeter at 320 ASA/ISO and get the exposure for that ASA/ISO.
Expose for the shadows.
Develop for the highlights.
This is a very simple explanation of exposure but says nothing about tests of film and densitometer measurements. Nor about development times to get the zone placements where you want them. Ansel did not teach us to go half way with the Zone System. If your highlights fall too high you must use a minus development time. If highlights are too low you must use a plus development time. And to determine development times you must test each film / developer combination and measure the results. We did that in college at the direction of the professor, Ansel Adams and Brett Weston. It took a full term and lots of film and time. But the results spoke for themselves and the concept is easy, but to learn it requires a deeper dive.
awesome
Hey Braedon, Great video, I was looking for that!
the spotmeter you are using is an old one. It still uses 1.35V batteries. Were you able to recalibrate it somehow and how accurate was it?
I want to get one too, however I am worried since the mercury batteries are no longer available and the adapters can never produce the correct voltage.
Have you been able to calibrate it?
Regards
Good questions. I didn’t do any calibrations and have found most older batteries have substitutes that work just fine. Testing it compared to readings with an incident meter seemed accurate. I hope that helps a bit.
@@FilmSupplyClub If it is accurate, it will helps me a lot!
I learned the Zone System from Adams Books with 1° Honeywell spot meter back in 1970 when spot meters had just become affordable and quickly realized the easiest way to use it with a spot meter was directly read the Zone 1 shadow areas of the scene for the exposure with the ISO setting of the meter adjusted, via a single simple bracket test so the aperture / shutter needed to get perfectly exposed Zone 1 shadows on negative and print could be read directly without any interpretation and mental gymnastics.
To recalibrate the meter for a direct zone 1 reading start by setting the meter at the nominal ISO speed of the film (e.g. 400) shoot a bracketed series of exposures by changing the meter ISO to 200, 100, 50, 25, etc, and shooting with the indicated shutter and apertures. Make a contact print of the negatives on #2 grade paper exposed just enough to render the border maximum black as Adams suggested and the ISO setting for the meter directly reading Zone 1 will be easy to see on the print and then corollate to the shadow density above film base seen on the negative.
Something photographers shooting digital today might not realize is that with B&W the contrast of the negative, and how it rendered the highlights on the print when print exposure was based on correctly rendering the shadows was controlled by either: 1) The Kodak approach of developing all negatives for the same time regardless of scene range, then changing the print paper contrast to match the density range of the negative, or; 2) the Ansel Adams approach of adjusting the development time of the negatives based on the brightness range of the scene, the approach photographers used in the darkroom in the days before Panchromatic B&W films required development in total darkness.
Prior to the mid 1920s B&W emulsions were Orthochromatic meaning they did not react to red wavelengths. That allowed the photographers of the day to develop their film under red safelights the same as prints and watch as the density in the highlight areas of the negative increased. Back then there was only a single contrast grade of print paper and with experience they were able to judge by eye under the safelights when the shadow-to-highlight range of the negative fit the range of the paper and stop the development.
With the Adams system, after correcting nominal ISO for correct rendering of the shadows with a bracket exposure test you put a subject wearing black and white clothing in direct sun and shot 4 sheets (or rolls) of film at the same exposure but then developed each of them for a different time starting with what was recommended by Kodak on the data sheet for the developer. As with the first test you printed the negatives for film border = max., black with min. exposure on #2 grade paper and inspected the highlight areas of the print to find which develop time produced a density range on the negative which matched the contrast range of the paper - around a ten-stop 3.0 negative density range between Zone 0 (clear film) to Zone 10 (white paper base) specular highlights, with the non-specular Zone 9 whites actually rendered on the print as a light shade of gray.
The need to render the non specular whites in a scene as a gray tone on the print is necessary to create the illusion of 3D shape on smooth white objects, such as the hood of a white car. It is the position of the specular highlights on objects (not just the shadows) which create the illusion of 3D in any 2D rendering, photo or artwork, which is the reason with transparency film and digital capture highlight exposure is so critical. With the Adams Zone system getting the development time of the negative was critical if the goal was to always reproduce the full tonal range of the scene without dodge / burn manipulation when making the prints.
The “Sunny Day” development time was Adams’ “normal” development time. The same systematic development time test performed in open shade, partly cloudy skies, overcast or very contrasty lighting of beach and snow scenes allowed him to know when shooting how each negative would need to be developed to meet his goal of printing the full range on #2 paper. It makes print making pretty much a no brainer and much simpler and cheaper than the Kodak roll film approach of developing all negative for the same time then making test prints on different grade papers to find the one which matched the range of the negative, or using a densitometer based enlarging meter the highlight and shadow area of the negative were read to determine exposure and paper grade.
Equipped with a spot meter adjusted for direct Zone 1 exposure readings I would meter the shadows to set exposure then the Zone 9 highlights to determine the scene range and know via the testing how long to develop the film. I was using roll film cameras but bulk loading my own 10 shot film cassettes, exposing an entire roll for each different scene EV range.
The problem with applying the Adams Zone system to digital is that the recording medium, the camera sensor, has a fixed range which is shorter than the range. The histogram and overexposure warning are much better indicators of exposure than the meter readings. Just take a shot exposed so only the specular highlights are blinking to preserve Zone 9 /10 separation them look at the left side of the histogram to see how the range of the scene fits the sensor. If the left side is piled up (underexposed shadows) bracket exposure enough to record the shadows then blend the exposures in Photoshop automatically with HDR or manually with layers and masks.
Great video mate, and finally understanding the zone system. One question, the hand written zone scale on your meter, are the numbers spaced the same as the ones on the EV scale, with zone 5 being over the red dot?
What is your development charts for zone system and sheet film like? Let’s say for hp5 4x5 film?
Great, short and to the point. Easy to understand, just put the tones where you want to see them. Thanks
Good video Braiden. What meter you using? Looks like Soligor pr Pentax.
I also noticed that on the couple spots we can see the f stop and it's always f8 but that doesn't lign up with any of the reading, what f stops did you use in the different pictures taken ?
this channel deserves more subs
Thanks for that! We're definitely trying to put out helpful content.
Great vid ... how do you transfer EV values to Zone System values? I see you do it with a bit of tape but not sure how one replicates this. Might make a good topic for another vid
Can you explain to me why, in some shots with Adam's zone scale, your squares sometimes are not predictably lighter than the lower numbered squares? For example, take a look zone 9 vs zone 8 at 12:48. Something seems off.
Looks like it was just a mistake in making the graphic. The 9 box there should be light. All the other boxes in that frame are consistent.
Nice video! what is that app for light metering bro>
I just acquired a Rolleiflex and a Leica M3 and I've been looking for a good light meter besides the phone apps, I've been looking into the Sekonic 508,558 ect. Would you say a dedicated spot meter like the one you're using in this video is a good way to go for landscapes, buildings, portraits and street photography?
The Zone System work only with reduced metering angles. Professional spotmeters habe an fixed measuring angle of 1°. Common lightmeters habe measuring angles around 30°.
@@ingowalkerling5141 Thanks for the reply, I guess prissy boy couldn't be bothered
5:14
Zone 2 is likely why camera manufacturer's use 2 for spot metering in digital cameras.
They tend to use 0 for matrix on older models and for modern digital they can go lower like -3 and highlights as high as 20. (Center weighted too).
Highlight metering is great for editing raw in post. You get everything. 0-20
I wonder if we'll ever get a hybrid film/digital camera that shoots film exposures with a raw file.
Your spot on. Photography IS more impotant than traffic safety/flow etc.
FYI you can get a zone sticker for your soligar spot sensor 2 ( i use it too) on ebay
Merci beaucoup friend from brussel belgium very clear viva Ansel Adams
Hi Braedon, ..
Thanks for bringing the Zone System to the attention of younger photographers. I applaud your effort because it’s a pretty simple concept, but it can be a challenge to explain clearly. But even (or especially) in a video designed to be short and 'entertaining', I think it helps a lot to first explain -before diving directly into the cold water of metering for Zone System- the rules of the game: that normal black and white film can only record a range -from the deepest black in the scene to “paper-base” white- of around seven f/stops . . . and that real world “scene brightness ranges” (SBR) can vary widely …for example, some outdoor scenes can have a shadow-to-highlight ratio (going beyond the dynamic range) of up to 1:10000. Obviously, in this case, one might want to expose and develop the film in a way which will compress the SBR into the film’s seven stop limitation. On the other end, some low contrast -or ’short range’- subjects can range fewer than even those seven stops (the extra room given in this type of situation being known as “film latitude”) ......It's a little disturbing to see a whole video on the Zone System, even if short, not linking exposure of the film to it's DEVELOPMENT. I think you hardly mentioned it, even if your development happens to be standard. It's like showing how to make a cake by mixing the batter, but not talking about the time and temperature needed to bake it for a perfect result (not to mention the icing!) ........Secondly, it’s extremely important to understand that exposure affects how much detail you want to 'put' into the low-to-mid values (shadows) much more than the high values. To oversimplify; white is *always* gonna be white, whether you over- OR under-expose* your film (*within reasonable limits) … but *OVER*-exposure can bring a black up to a gray. On the other hand -and just as important to understand- it’s the film's development that tweeks the *whites* in a scene, and *HAS DISPROPORTIONALLY LESS EFFECT* on the shadow areas. Therefore, since we can *not* "develop detail into" the shadows or low values of a scene; it must be put there by a sufficient amount of exposure.
...........
All of the above really doesn't take so long to get across. And, once explained, exposure placement in fact becomes simpler for a beginner to grasp and (in my experience) they more easily understand how to use the Zone System to obtain -- if they want! -- a finished print with a rich palette from black-to-white with enough details to help get across what was visualised in the first place. (And by the way, one only needs to “place” the lowest value [on the gray scale] in which you want detail ... then check to see where the highest value falls. These two meter measurements are usually all that’s needed to know how to expose your film in order to expand or contract the contrast range [in development] ..or not.. and subsequently create the most ideal negative to fit the paper you are using. You can of course check other values in the scene just to see where they fall on the gray scale, and to get an idea of how the values relate to one another, but it's more useful to actually SEE these relationships. In the olden days we'd use a Polaroid shot for this, but today a quick b&w digital shot of the scene will do the job. Short of this, a brown "monochromatic viewing filter" gives you a good approximation of b&w (or just a pair of sunglasses with brown lenses.. but used in an "off and on" type viewing method)..
Lastly, even if it's beyond the scope of this particular video-metering-, I think it's important to get across the point that the Zone System cannot fully work unless its user has first done simple (if tedious!) little bit of testing to make sure that what you meter as “middle gray” PRINTS as darned middle gray! (I call this “zeroing out”). Without this first basic testing of exposure, development and printing -yep, all three- you can't arrive at the holy grail: A consistently predictable result! Therefore, if you’ve *not* first zeroed-out, you can’t really call it Zone System, but instead, I don’t know, “careful metering” or "a more refined technique" or something. But don’t forget, the Zone System is a SYSTEM, so it’s meant to tie-in the whole chain of events starting with seeing and visualising what you want to get across, right through to the print hanging on the wall. *Not* *just* *metering* or even just metering and developing. I hope my remarks are taken in the constructive and helpful spirit in which they're intended! Again, great thanks for putting this out there!
I've thought about this topic thousands of times but I still can't fully understand it. My question (perhaps too simple) would be: if I identify a middle gray value in my scene and I measure with my spot meter there...the rest of the values don't fall into place by themselves? I just bought my first spot photometer. If I make an average reading of two values, measuring the area of more light and the area of less light in which I want detail and ask for an average... wouldn't I have a correct exposure? I always talk about black and white film, which I understand has much more latitude than slides or color.
@@dandyroll7610 ===========
I can really sympathizes with you; when I first tried to learn the Zone System, as a kid, I read and re-read Ansel’s books and ended-up confused. It wasn’t until I met Ansel’s colleague, Al Weber, that things became straight in my head. First, to answer your question: If you measure and shoot a middle gray in a scene - a true middle gray, such as a ‘gray card’ - yes, you should normally succeed at exposing the normal range of the scene. But this is not necessarily the “Zone System”; this is just regular, old “averaging”.
First and foremost, the Zone System is about being able to *visualize* the values of your scene, vis-a-vis the final print. This is only possible, though, through the *understanding of your materials* and the *“management”* of the exposure and development of your film as it relates to that understanding. ••••••
Therefore, first, you’re right that black and white film normally has a “recording range” of about 7 stops, from shadow to highlight (color negative film has about a 5 stop range, and color slide film, about 3 stops). *Zone V (your meter reading)* is right in the middle or that range. So if you measure a scene on a flat day, for instance, and the shadow-to-highlight range is only 4 stops, the exposure should be easy because you’ve got 3 stops of latitude. •••••
Secondly - and most importantly (even though it’s usually ignored or not understood !) - is that the zone system only really “works” AFTER you have calibrated, though simple testing, your *own* system (the chain of tools and materials from camera to photo paper developer) to gain *absolute predictability that the zone you visualize will end-up in your final print as that same zone* (simply put: a photo you take of a gray card should come out, in the print, as the *identical* gray … right?).. If not - duh - what’s the point of all the special metering? You might as well just use an incident meter and trust the gods! Plus, without this *certainty and predictability*, you really precisely record the ‘palette’ you have in mind; a bit like a painter who doesn’t know how to mix paint colors, so the trees in his landscape are always too bluish. The only way to gain this state of predictability is to calibrate your chain-of-events system (meter, shutter, development, etc) so they work together toward this goal. All it takes is some very basic testing, but once in place the last part of the system - your eyes - will see the benefit immediately. A musician who reads a “C” note on the sheet music and then plays what should be a “C” on his instrument, might not get a “C” sound UNLESS HIS INSTRUMENT IS TUNED. See what I mean? •••••
But the ZS is not only about middle gray. The ZS easily helps you expand or contract the scene values to fit within the recording range of the film, and thereby create a “normal range negative” that’s easier to use as a starting point for creative printing (otherwise, part of your printing process become correction work for arriving at that same starting point, and the creative departure can only happen after that). •••••
OK. Take a breath. From this point. After your testing has been done, everything becomes simple. Find your scene. Visualize your photo. Measure the dynamic* range, shadows-to-highlight (*the range with wanted details). Reminder: This is just TWO readings. Count the stop difference. Does it fit the recording range of your film? If more - or less -, you can plan to adjust your development accordingly. Now, concentrate on the shadow value which is most important to you because, don’t forget that *only the exposure step will guarantee that the detail in those shadows will arrive on the film*. Where do you want to place them? Z-III? Z-IV? Higher? If a meter normally gives a Z-V (Zone five) Metering a shadow and placing on ZVIII means closing down two stops, right? So what you’re doing is “sliding” the whole range also, two stops down. This makes your Z-VIII highlight fall at Z-VI, so you’d extend you film development to “stretch” your range back (don’t forget that development affects the highlights more than the shadows … kind if like a one sided accordion!). There. Hope this explanation was clear.
@@chickenitsa Hello
I really appreciate your explanation. I have understood much more now. I'm going to watch the video again with this explanation in hand to fix the concepts. Thank you very much.
@@dandyroll7610 That's great, Dandy, however keep in mind that this video - while great for giving a general idea of how the Zone System works (and a big thanks, again, to Braedon!) - doesn't really give the details which are necessary to apply the Zone System correctly. You'd be better off reading Ansel Adam's "The Negative", or Fred Picker's "Zone VI Workshop". Cheers
@@chickenitsa Thank you very much for these recommendations!
Are you overexposing the film 1/3rd a stop it pulling it in exposure? I was thinking with that shot of the side of the building I would have shot a stop up but your result was brighter than expected
Did Ansel have a zone set aside for Work Zone?
By far the best media (book, video, article, print) I have seen that fully explains and demonstrates the Zone System, by far. Thanks dude.
When combining spot metering technique with the theory of adding brightness and subtracting darkness in exposure, photographers can more precisely control the exposure of different surfaces of objects, thus achieving better tonal and detail representation.
Spot metering is a technique that measures the brightness of a specific area pointed by the camera lens. By conducting spot metering in different areas, photographers can understand the lighting conditions on different surfaces of objects in order to adjust exposure.
Guided by the theory of adding brightness and subtracting darkness in exposure, photographers can adjust exposure based on the information obtained from spot metering. For bright object surfaces, photographers may reduce exposure appropriately to prevent overexposure and retain details; for darker object surfaces, exposure can be increased appropriately to ensure details are not lost in shadows.
Furthermore, combining spot metering technique with the theory of adding brightness and subtracting darkness in exposure can help photographers address challenges posed by high-contrast scenes. By selecting representative areas for spot metering and adjusting exposure based on measurement results, photographers can effectively control details in highlights and shadows, thus achieving a more balanced exposure.
In conclusion, by combining spot metering technique with the theory of adding brightness and subtracting darkness in exposure, photographers can more accurately control the exposure of different object surfaces, creating photographs that are more expressive and artistic.
How do you place the tape with the Zones on it? Where does that align on the meter so that you can figure out where to align the target zone?
Dear Sir, please can you re-upload this excellent zs video without background music?
Great background 'music' thanks, it wasn't distracting even when I kept having to adjust the volume between hearing your speech and the uncomfortably loud intermediate 'music' bits. What a shame.
great video! the holding line music its quiet a pain though
What's the name of the light meter app you used? Thanks in advance.
it's called 'Pocket Light Meter' from the App store.
I'm just embarking in the film world and while your video does help, I'm still a little confused. I see some numbers written on white tape on the spot meter. Where did you get those numbers? I don't think you explain how the spot meter works. Thanks for your help.
I usually use my Sekonic 358 with 1 degree spotmeter attachment but I measure like 4-6 points in the area that I consider different and then I hit the "Average" button to throw me that Zone 5 value... is this similar ?
This is very in depth! I usually just find my meter reading for the darkest areas, then compensate by 2 stops to push those darks back into zone 3.
Definitely a good method. We were trying to get people to understand a bit of the zone system or even why they would be using that method of yours.
Overall I don't personally have the zone system wrapped around my head but I do understand the concept. I think using a meter that shows the EV and also lines up the possible exposures for you when set doesn't help the broad spectrum of those learning. Most people will be getting a simple exposure reading and will have to count out stops which is not that simple when you're on a half or third stop. I need to work more with the zone system because I see how it can be super handy I just wanted to put my thoughts out on the way this video was made and the meter used.
Please try to talk with a lower speed. Too fast man too fast....Try to show how you use the spot meter try to insist why you did that action....Thanks anyways !
@@vedranr.glavina7667 Who are you talking to?
So most film will have a dynamic range of 10 EV or do we ignore that, as it's just about getting details in darker areas, while highlights are retained well most of the time?
Hi, what’s the name of the light meter? Or how can I find it? Thank you
First! Here we go!
Edit: That was a fantastic video btw
On it!
Very useful video, What is name of app @10.28. Thanks
Thanks, I got it. Saw your response
This is super difficult to understand, especially cause I never use a spot meter vs indecent meter. It’s a totally different setup
Sounds like you are zone 20 on your indecent meter.
PLEASE HELP, it's urgent. For my photography class, I need to take a pic which contains a tonal range with zones 2-8. I'm still confused about how to do that. We can only cange one setting - ISO, F values or shutter speed. Any help? :/
The good - The video gives some of the clearest explanations of how the pre-visualization, metering, and exposure placement should work together in the Zone System. The bad (really bad): Like nearly every other YT video on the Zone System, it starts with the assumption that every film and developer combination will produce a ten stop range from white to black, and that the box ISO rating of every film will properly determine the baseline for a "black" exposure. Both of those assumptions are false, so this exercise in "placing" subject densities on "zones" is objectively nonsense. Until your film/developer combination is calibrated for use of the zone system, what you learn from this is a concept of how to measure exposure by spot reading subject densities which are not "middle grey" per your meter's calibration, then adjusting exposure to compensate, more or less - an approximation. That's a positive step, but it's not the zone system in any serious way. For example, Adox sells a slow B&W film of great sharpness and almost non-existent grain. If it were processed in D-76 developer, it would have less than five zones, white to black, because it is microcopying film. It requires use of a special developer to yield a conventional range of "zones". By contrast, were you take Tri-X and develop it in POTA, a developer with an exceptionally low contrast result, you'd probably get 15-20 "zones". Generally, the published ISO for a film works adequately in conventional developers like D-76 or Xtol. The development time/temp required to yield ten zones is going to be a matter of testing to find a working combination before you start using your personal zone system. As a side note, Adams organized his zone system around a ten stop range of printable negative densities from white to black, using films from the 1940s. By the 1970s, he concluded that film makers had cheapened the quality of their films to the point where a ten zone range was no longer optimal, recommending use of a nine zone range thereafter.
correct. And some people are developing at home, some labs are using kodak chemicals, some are using fuji, some are using others....there's dip and dunk, there's machines. We're doing our best to get people who don't know the zone system to start trying to use it. We're big advocates of people being successful with their film images so they continue to want to grow and learn. You obviously sound a bit more on the advanced side so potentially this video wasn't quite for you. But I hope that explains where we're coming from and what we're trying to do. Trying to rise the tide to rise all ships. Thanks for taking the time to watch and comment.
So trying to find the light meter you are using in the video cant find it anywhere
I`m a very beginner but although this is a great explanation it seems to me, though I can be very confused, that the scale of grays you use to show the system has something stange, like 8 is lighter than 9 and 7. Am I wrong or confused? Or blind.
This video is so underrated
Thanks Jared!! Love this thought.
@4:00 you did what you should of done at first and that is putting your shadows in zone 4 not 3 , then develop and print to 3.
What is the make and model of that spot meter?
So, I think I can figure this out, if I remember to expose for the shadows and develop for the highlights. But, I guess the developing bit won’t matter, until I begin to develop my own film, and make my own prints.
Your presentation was excellent, but left out so much of the Zone System. You took advantage of the full tonal range and didn't need to compensate with reducing or increasing development. In particular, expanding the tonal range is one of the most valuable things the Zone System can offer. Maybe next time ?
Nice, What is that Light meter app?
Thanks for making the zone system clear.
4 points here:
1. Fantastic freaking tutorial. Thank you.
2. I must buy a Pentax 67ii.
3. You remind me of Ryan Reynolds.
4. Where do you buy your t-shirts?
Hi!! Very cool information! What Is your spotmeter?
Looks like a Soligor Spot-Sensor II. I like the Pentax Digital Spot meters with an I.R.E. scale, too.
In the Gossen Spotmaster the Zone System after Ansel Adams is intergrated in the display.
True. And as long as the meter continues to function, it makes using the zone system significantly easier. It was made in two successive versions over 12 years. They were hugely overpriced in among spot meters, a group which was very expensive in any event. Relative to other brands, few were sold. They seemed to suffer failures, which might relate to Gossen's de facto abandonment of the production quality level its meters had held for prior decades. (Ex., the Digisix, made about the same time - a piece of junk by any standard.)
Dude this was a very nice video and I understood most of it but when you're talking about the numbers 11 12 17 I don't have a clue what you are talking about
Ok, let me ask the question another way. Do both the EV scale and zone system scale use one stop increments? So the difference between an EV of say 8 to 7 is one stop, and the difference between say zone 5 and zone 4 for example is one stop? ie they both use the same currency so to speak or am I missing something?
Correct!
Great video , no one else has explained using zone system so succinctly.
Love hearing that. Thanks so much (and sorry for the lag in response to this comment) - we really appreciate it.
I was looking at fence behind the truck which looked middle gray. But I think the shot could have been done at f-11
Hi, thanks for sharing this - I learnt a number of things especially regarding metering the whole scene. I was surprised you took a 'just in case' image @1/60th at 03:54 given you had just carefully metered the whole scene. Was there a reason for this? Agree with other comments re: converting your EV readings to camera settings given there will be many people who use the camera's meter, or don't understand the EV readings. Thanks again.
👏👏👏👏👏
Hilarious that you moved the sign. Was expecting a pile up in the background haha
To truly do the zone system you must do a film speed test and find the toe of the film with your developer. Here you just use the idea of the zone system. I learned in Lab Practices back in the day where we tested film every week was almost maddening… oh and to find the toe you need a densitometer…
Love it. Moving stuff outta frame. I fux with this guy! 😂
better than doing it later in post.
Newbie here: I get the concept but how can I do this metering on a mirror less?
WOW!!!!! thanks so much for this final piece to the puzzle. I have been practicing BW film photography for around 9 months now, and find myself forever contemplating the purchase of a 1' spot meter, in view of ditching the mirrorless i carry along with me for such purposes. But I ultimately couldnt justify it....haha. but now you deliver the Zone system in leyman's terms! even a fool like me can understand. I actually thought I understood it tbh....I thought it was a task of identifying the 18' grey in a composition and expose for that.....and coupled with the much lauded latitude of film, you can imagine my surprise at my MANY mixed results. Now, and thanks to you, I appreciate the value a spot meter gives in balancing the scene and in achieving this via the Zone system sticker no less!!! Im making the purchase. Thanks again
pentax is set acc to F stop, you measure ev values to use the zone system, that's clear.. now, is it superior to just measuring f stops in dark and light areas, evaluating the range and setting pentax accordingly without translating EV into F stops?
I like that there are people out there trying to tackle this subject, but people seem to be attempting to simplify the zone system without demonstrating a proper understanding of what's necessary to use it effectively. this video went awry the moment you said you were rating Tri-X at 320. There is no way on earth that's an appropriate EI for the zone system and that film, no matter what developer you're using. To be able to use the zone system you need to actually test the true speed of the film you're using, then separately test the right amount of development needed to get the right result for N-2, N-1, N, N+1, N+2. What you'll typically find is that the speed you need to shoot at is WAY less than box speed (think 100-125 ISO for Tri-X) and the development time will be shorter than what's recommended by a chart.
The N-x numbers are dependent on the scene, exposure and development time/formula/temperature to capture the image as you want. Since that varies from shot to shot, it is mostly useful for sheet film. To be effective, when you pull the sheet film from the camera you literally put a tag on it with the N factor that you want to develop to. You may notice that he is using roll film which requires a more "generic" approach. His example images look good to me.
As other comments have pointed out, this video is rather lacking in an explanation of what the Zone System actually is, which is a two part process of choosing both how to meter a scene to capture on the negative all the information you want, but also then, crucially, how to develop the negative to map the information on the negative to the tonal range you want. You are doing a disservice pedagogically, I think, to pretend it's just about the figuring out your exposure settings, although that is of course the important first step. If you've ever heard an experienced photographer say, or read in a photography text something like 'expose for the shadows, develop for the highlights', then that's the zone system that they are implicitly invoking. To emphasise, it is a two part process, the first being the exposure, the second being the development, that let's you, to use Ansel Adam's favourite word, end up with a final print that is what you 'pre-visualised'.
Charitably, you could say that the development half is less important in a world where you scan your negs and then flail the curve tool in Darkroom to your heart's content, so long as there is the information in the negative you can then manipulate it digitally away from the darkroom. And, of course, this is all much easier with sheet film where you develop on a per-sheet basis, and the per-image development is less applicable to a roll film full of a bunch of different photos. So, this video is a useful guide to metering with an understanding of the latitude film, and has value as that on its own, but it is a stretch to claim that it is an explanation of the Zone system - it isn't really.
expose for the shadows, develope for the highlights
Missed badly on the truck, but overall nice info
🤯
Great explanation, some of the criticism here is ridiculous. You have to have a basic understanding of the zone system before watching this. Of course you can go way deeper in the zone system, then this video would be 2 hours.
Hi Braedon, why do you take few measurements ?? I shoot digital now and since digital back are sensitive to shadows, all you have to worry is not burning your highlights, so you spot meter your lightest part and if you know your digital back get see details two stops over exposed then you over expose two stops knowing you can recover details for these two stops and by doing this it brings your shadows two stops then you can do minor adjustments for highlights and shadows in Lightroom or Photoshop…
You would take multiple measurements to determine your dynamic range (DR) . For instance my Canon 5DM3 has 5 stops of range before clipping. This is 2.2 stops between midtone and highlight clipping and 2.3 stops between midtone and shadow clipping. (This 5 stops is the usable DR, not the 11 that Canon advertises) These figures are determined by the camera / light meter calibration between my 5DM3 and my Sekonic L858 using Sekonic's DTS software. In practical use they are "spot" on. (Pun intended)
Why is knowing the DR important? If you have more DR in the scene that your camera can capture, it allows you to make informed decisions. If you have a bright sky you can know exactly which shadows are going to clip. Perhaps you recompose to eliminate some of the shadow area or make multiple exposures for blending while editing. If you need the shadows, maybe you expose for shadow detail and either recompose or sacrifice the sky. I am a 75 year old guy who has been photographing and metering since the mid 60's. Hand metering my shots with my digital camera is as important to me now as when I was shooting film. The only difference is that now I protect highlights (usually) rather than shadows.
@@RickLincoln How do you explain that many camera manufacturers advertise 14-15 stops dynamic range when it seems to be 6-7??? It seems to be a lie and no one is reacting…
@@RickLincoln If your dynamic range is wider than your camera sensor you are out of luck, the only thing you can do is multiple exposures to compensate