Yes indeed! Many of us like to proclaim our right to vote but we also have to realize we have duties that go along with that right. Book 8 will focus on this topic a good bit. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Johnny Harris once did a video on mandatory gun training in Switzerland. I think the same holds true with regards to firearms as well. Bearing arms is a privelage that has to be exercised with dutiful respect.
Thanks so much! I believe the same thing. I know I do not have all the answers but I am enjoying the journey to find the answers. Hopefully we can all gain something along the way. Truly appreciate the kind words and thanks so much for watching. Stay blessed!
Finishing the defense of the Greeks portion and on to the Romans next. Homeschooling our children here. Using a Christian and Classical education mix. It’s going amazingly thank the Lord. Oldest child just went 98th%+ on his state equivalency exams. 4th grader reading at the 75th% high school senior level already… Persevere Rob, you’re on the Path
@@markdevlin3630 GREAT question: started at birth. Read to my son EVERY night that I was home and not deployed. Encourage his Q&A sessions, taught him about world history and American history, read the scripture with him, pray with him, exercise with him, no tablets or cellphones or social media, give him responsibilities and chores and award him accordingly, have tough conversations about responsibilities and repercussions and discipline, love him and tell him I love him, and show him I love him. Etc. And then I replicate this for my two other children as well. It’s not easy. But they’re worth it. Much easier to plop them in front of TVs or tell them “bc I’m your Father and I said so” but in the long run both of those are counter productive and ineffective. So I choose the harder, but more meaningful and productive path. Lead with the “Why” with your kids. Answer their questions. And again, “Lead”. They know when you’re genuine and when you have their best interests in mind. Can’t fool your kids… they see you 7 days a week 😅 Again, GREAT question! Best of luck. You can do it too.
@@markdevlin3630 I wrote a whole reply and it seems to have been filtered out 😔 Basically, love your kids. Lead with the why. Read to them. Do the hard things (no tablets/phones/social media), bc kids know when you’re being genuine and when you’re not. They see us 7 days a week 😅 we can’t fool them. GREAT question!
@@CheapSeats Thanks for the reply. Nothing is more annoying on YT then when your reply doesn't show up. I hear you on the removal of distractions. Worst decision I ever made was allowing YT and roblox. Take care.
I would say that Classical Education is based on Greek, Jewish, and Roman studies. These cultures placed an emphasis on the person exceeding basic, minimal, animalistic traits, for they promoted virtue, physicality, discipline, the arts, debates, and even moral. We are capable of so much more than we are given credit for. Communication is a key principle in the Classical form of education. On your comment on agriculture, there is a similar Classical Education called Thomas Jefferson Education which promotes agriculture in its studies. I hope that our education trains our youth to have "flexibility of mind" and moves away from Progressive Education. Great video - thank you.
I remember Hutchins quoted Livingstone. I find it very provoking that these gentlemen saw the down fall beginning in the 1950s in America and the world. Plato had the Philosopher King, which can be any man if he wishes to be. The mind is the final battlefield.
A great video. Upon discovering your channel a couple of weeks ago I became inspired and invigorated with a desire to learn more and more deeply. Therefore I have set myself the ambition of achieving a Classical Education by learning Latin, Ancient Greek and Biblical Hebrew while reading all the literature, studying all the history and culture which goes along with it. I want to thank you for the inspiration and I am looking forward to your future videos!
That is so cool to hear! I am glad my videos helped lead you down the path. It has been a fun journey for me so far and I am sure you will feel the same. Judging by how well you sound on the Piano practice and dedication should not be a problem. I would love to venture in to Music one day and learn that side of the education as well. Thanks so much for watching my friend and stay blessed!
One of the best started books for learning Latin is "Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata" and the various supplements. And there's a great RUclips series called "Aleph with Beth" for Hebrew. Unfortunately Ancient Greek is a whole nother animal
Thanks so much for tuning in! Paradise Lost video #4 will be next and then, back to this series! If you need a little caffeine to get you through the series then try some of the coffee I roast. www.cedarotacoffee.com Stay blessed my friends!
Thanks for doing these videos. I'm blessed to be able to send my kids to a classical Christian school, and I'm currently working through the Great Books to remediate my government schooling. Glad to see other people pushing themselves.
Thats awesome! I am sure it will pay dividends later in life. The Great Books are such an amazing set. I have not started reading them yet but I flip through them regularly. Work is the key word for the Great Books. Definitely not anything easy or quick about them. haha Thanks for watching and stay blessed!
No problem at all my friend. I am happy to hear that they are helpful. It has been a nice learning process making them. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
great start to the series Rob! This book has been on my TBR for a few weeks now, ever since I heard them mention it on one of the Memoria Press podcasts... Definitely one i want to pick up! and i think the biggest thing most people discount is the fact that even if you didn't have a classical education, you can still choose to SELF-educate and move more towards that kind of understanding and way of viewing the world. So many people discount the fact that you need to be constantly learning and growing and improving yourself or else you'll stagnate and die. The goal is create and consume something true and beautiful every single day - do that and you'll be alright! :D Thanks for another awesome video my man!
Thanks so much brother! I completely agree on self-education. I eventually want to do a dedicated video on that. I think it is more important than ever to build your own university/library to learn and study from. I have been enjoying the journey and it has really allowed me to slow down and think more. I truly appreciate the kind words and thanks so much for watching! Stay blessed my friend!
Great video Rob! I totally agree with you that our children are truly missing out on true education. And we are paying for it in our communities & workplaces. Amazing how my younger teammates can’t seem to say a normal sentence without adding “like” after every other word! So annoying! Looking forward to you next video! God bless!
I notice that as well. As I get older I have been stepping back and thinking to myself. The kids coming out of school are a product of the programs and policies that we (My Generation and Older) have put in place and are teaching them. I think it is more important than ever to revive the classical way of learning and point anyone willing to learn in a direction that I think is the correct path to go down. What we currently have set up is not working that well. Then again, I do not know how much is cultural decay, poor parenting, or the effects of a privileged/affluent/softer society. It is crazy to speak to older men in their 80s and 90s who are still living and remember not having electricity in their house and a time when an ice truck would actually deliver ice. Makes you realize it really wasn't that long ago that things were completely different. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
I came to the same conclusion. This is outstanding. I am reading the ancient Greek and Roman historians. Classic education: Democracy ends in tyranny. Modern education: Democracy is wonderful but yet we see our society degenerating.
Yes indeed. Which books are you currently covering? In Plato's Republic he is against democracy as well. But, he is also against almost every form of government so that is not saying much. Glad to have you here my friend!
@@The_Cause Thucydides Peloponnesian War but I believe Aristotle also criticizes democracy. Cicero in his De republica says that Democracy is the worst of the three pure forms of government.
@@libertycoffeehouse3944 pure democracy isn't really used today. The most famius example of pure democracy would be plebescites. Like the one that made Napoleon emperor. Democracy is dnagerous because it can be used as undisputable confirmation by tyrants.
@@The_Cause I think that you are on to something useful and good with this channel and my hope is that a way can be found to support it. There is nothing wrong with flooding RUclips with channels full of interesting content, especially given the rest of the content and the rest of the media.
Hello Rob! Thanks for a great video and solid overview of Livingstone's work. As a scholar of Latin (but not ancient Greek-at least not yet), I can definitely appreciate the ways in which learning these languages and appreciating the works of Cicero, Vergil, and others in their original form is incredible. I would say, though, the most essential group of works missing from a classical education (assuming the classical education is focused on the humanities) are those of the Enlightenment, without which many of the central ideas of the Western world are left undeveloped, including democracy (Montesquieu's The Spirit of the Laws is a must-read!). An education in the classics, though, should be the cornerstone of a wider education in the great books and ideas of world culture, which in my view should continue on to the works of the modern day--without a sampling of the many eras and viewpoints of human history, it can be difficult to get a full understanding of both human nature and where the world is today. I thank you for your well thought-out take on the importance of the classics!
I most definitely agree. I have listened to many of Adler’s lectures and talks and I think he felt the same. It is nice to hear from those who know Latin. I usually hear the argument against Greek and Latin from people who do not know it. I don’t either but I have read enough of Milton and Bacon to realize that some deep foundational understanding they have allows them to communicate at a deeper level than I can. I understand they are professionals in their field though. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and stay blessed!
Many will treat it as some great mystery beyond solving, but it's actually quite simple to define "classical education." It is an education in the seven _classical_ liberal arts of the Trivium (Grammar, Logic, and Rhetoric), and the Quadrivium (Arithmetic, Geometry, Music, and Astronomy). And they should be learned and taught as the classical arts from the classical sources; modern substitutes will not suffice. That's it, really. But we can expound on and clarify that further, for those interested.
While the Greeks and Romans sometimes played fast and loose with education (the Romans especially gave pride of place to rhetoric above all), classical education and the seven classical liberal arts were formalized in late Antiquity by Martianus Capella in his _On the Marriage of Philology and Mercury._ St. Augustine of Hippo also wrote on it to some degree. It was further treated by Cassiodorus in his _Institutes of Divine and Secular Learning,_ and was helped by St. Boethius, who translated many of the standard works. And much later, classical Christian education was regimented further by the early Jesuits for their schools as part of the Counter-Reformation in response to Protestantism and the scientific revolution birthed out of the occult "Enlightenment" of the Renaissance. The standard works used from the classical liberal arts were and still should be: Logic = Aristotle's _Organon_ Rhetoric = Aristotle's _On Rhetoric,_ supplemented with Cicero Arithmetic = Nicomachus of Gerasa's _Introduction to Arithmetic_ Geometry = Euclid's _Elements_ Music = Nicomachus of Gerasa's _Manual of Harmonics_ Astronomy = Claudius Ptolemy's _Almagest_ Grammar was the teaching of Greek and Latin. Many of the ancient and medieval grammars can still be found and used today, but quality modern grammars also exist. It should be stressed that the logic learned in true classical education is Aristotelian logic, _not_ Baconian inductive reasoning (the scientific method). Bacon titled his work _Novum Organum_ to set it over and against Aristotle's, but it is Aristotle who prevailed throughout the Classical, Antique, and Medieval eras, not Bacon. There are many sources that were used for the teaching of rhetoric. The primary source was Aristotle, but he eventually gave way to others, namely to Cicero and many Ciceronians after him. But one can also make use of Quintilian (who also has insights for the teaching of grammar), and we still have the rhetorical exercises of Libanius, who taught none other than St. John Chrysostom (John the Golden-Mouthed). Also, the classical liberal arts of arithmetic and music were not the training in how to count (add, subtract, multiply, divide-these were called "logistics" in Antiquity) or how to play a musical instrument. They were, instead, the _philosophical_ study of mathematics and music. To be more exact, they were training in Pythagorean mathematical philosophy. Both the _Introduction to Arithmetic_ and _Manual of Harmonics_ were standard texts for these arts from the second century AD onwards. They were authored in Greek by Pythagorean mathematician Nicomachus of Gerasa and translated into Latin (with adaptation and commentary) by St. Boethius. Classical geometry is Euclidian geometry. And classical astronomy is not the modern science of astronomy, but that of the second century AD Alexandrian, Claudius Ptolemy. For classical Christian education, all of these still hold true (many of the greatest saints of the Church received a classical education), but it was rounded out and perfected with training in the Holy Scriptures and theology, called the Queen of the Sciences. For Catholics, this would be achieved through (capital S) Scholasticism and the natural theology of Thomas Aquinas. For the Orthodox, far more through (little s) scholasticism and the mystical theology of the Cappadocian Fathers, John of Damascus, Maximus the Confessor, and Gregory Palamas. (The Byzantine theologians were scholastic in that they were careful scholars, but they were not Scholastics. While Thomas Aquinas was beloved and held in high regard by Byzantine theologians, Scholasticism proper was rejected. This is especially true after the humanist monk Barlaam of Seminara came to metaphorical blows with the hesychast St. Gregory Palamas. Palamas and his defense of hesychasm [holy quietude] prevailed in Orthodoxy.)
Comments like this are the ones I copy and save! I want to dissect and go through this. So much info and knowledge here well beyond anything I am capable of. I hope to be at this level one day of understanding. Thanks so much for taking the time to share. Stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Happy to help! But please never discount yourself. It's not beyond what you're capable of. It just takes gradual exposure to it and, after a little while, you will begin to form a cohesive mental image of it. I highly recommend Cassiodorus' _Institutions of Divine and Secular Learning._ It's a pleasant reading experience overall. (A good version is in the Translated Texts for Historians (TTH) series by Liverpool University Press.) Martianus Capella's _Marriage of Philology and Mercury_ is worth having as an authoritative reference, but it can be a slog to read based on the type of literature it is and how detailed he gets. It's basically an encyclopedia on the seven classical liberal arts (teaching all their basic substance), but in the form of an allegory, where the seven liberal arts are personified and come before the council of the gods to describe their work.
Would recommend the history of western philosophy by Bertrand Russell, it's a really good book, well written and includes all those classical works and authors intertwined. Love that book by Livingstone.
I hear so much about Bertrand Russell. I am looking forward to finally crossing paths with his works. So much to read so little time! Haha Livingstone’s book was great. I am anxious to know what I would think of his arguments if I also knew Greek and Latin. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and stay blessed!
I have them all linked in the description of the video. But this book "Defense of Classical Eduction", Memoria Press puts out and it can be purchased off their website. Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed my friend!
Finishing this book today, and weapons of mass instruction arrives on Tuesday so I can crush through it. The other 6 books are here now too. Stoked! When is the video on Weapons of Mass Instruction slated for release so I can plan out how quickly I needs to read through it before video release Sir?
I don’t know why my reply did not go through. I know I posted it. Anyway, glad you are reading along and looking forward to getting out the next one. I am working on Paradise Lost’s 4th video now and hope to have it out next week. I hope to have weapons of mass instruction out in about 2-3 weeks. If time permits sooner but it never does. Haha As always, stay blessed my friend and thanks for ordering coffee again!
@@The_Cause got it in the mail yesterday, it is a GREAT read thus far. I’ll have it finished within 10 days so that’s plenty of time! Thanks brother, and thank you for the recent delivery of Cedar Ota Coffee last week!
Ya Weapons of Mass Instruction was a book that really changed the way I think. Reading it again has been just as rewarding as the first time. I could do 20 video on all the topics in this book and not even do the subject justice. Anxious to hear what you thought of it after you finished. For you it may just be more confirming what you already realized. Stay blessed brother!
@@The_Cause just finished it. Loved it. You are right, it is an affirming book for the path our family has already begun. But great to have arrows like this in the quiver. On to Plato and The Republic!
I just want to spin green beans in a furnace and turn them brown so as to grind and drink later. Reading a good book in the process always pairs well with the process. Great video dude…
I just finished this book last night. I loved how it changed my views on humanities and the importance of reading the Greeks and Romans. I also saw many parallels between the emphasis on "natural science" in his day and STEM in ours. It seems to me the best benefits of classical education are "soft" benefits, ie better equipped to learn, better morals, more empathy, etc. I would never have considered the humanities as more important than STEM unless I read this book. Also, this dude loves his Greeks. Even the chapter on the Latins was overshadowed by them 😂
There was no doubt about his support of the Greeks! haha I think the expression of thought was my biggest takeaway. I never really ever though about the skill of translating your ideas into another language and the skill that must build in being precise in the words you use. I think this skill would translate over to code and other more tech concepts. There is a need for both but also like I kind of mentioned. There is a need for welders, machinist and mechanics. Which is most important now days is being determined by the market. Thanks for watching my friend and glad to have you along the reading journey!
Rob, great analysis of the topic. It is frightening today to see so many of today’s “students “ lack critical thinking or any real knowledge of history. The future is grim unless things change dramatically. Have you read The Cave and the Light by Arthur Herman? It’s a great read about the influence of Plato and Aristotle on Western thought and how their philosophy influenced important events and Western culture.
I read that book a couple years ago and honestly it kind of was what set me off on this journey. I like how he showed the division between Plato and Aristotle and how that divide has literally shaped our western culture. I would love to revisit it someday. I agree with the state of out society. We definitely have a lot of work to do. haha Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed my friend!
Word of advice: If looking to pull the trigger on the Harvard Classics or GBWW with regard to a liberal education, the GBWW has the texts for 5 of the 7 classical liberal arts, and many of those that students classically moved up to in moral philosophy, natural philosophy, and theology. The Harvard Classics doesn’t really have any that were part of a classical education. It is a good set of classic literature though.
Most definitely. The Harvard Classics are more literature based. The Great Books dives more into the math and sciences as well. I like that the Great Books are compiled in a more chronological order versus the HC that go from Ben Franklin in volume 1 to Plato in volume 2. Great point to bring up. Thanks so much for watching my friend and stay blessed.
In which way learning Latin and Greek changes our brain and helps you thinking more clearly? Imo training public speaking, argumentation and talking to people of all ages and different fields of work, learning different modern languages, helps more than learning dead languages. Can you point me to scientific studies instead of an individual opinion?
He explains it better than I can in the book. He says that by translating into Greek and Latin you build a technique for precisely picking and choosing the correct words. All of modern languages (at least in the west) are rooted in these to languages. The problem is the that people like myself even who have argues against it don it know the languages. I study could be done on all the great writers in history such as Milton, Bacon, Shakespeare and pair them against all the ones who do not know Latin and Greek and see how it affects. What he says in the book makes perfect sense but I understand the push back because of the time commitment and our attachment to modern languages or even computer code over ancient languages. Very good points though. Something I will have to look into further as we learn more about it. Thanks for watching!
"to be deluded by sentiment or passion or rhetoric or humbug, whether it be in politics, education, business, or private life, means failure, as its opposite means success." (p. 23) today more important than ever!
That is definitely a topic I want to cover soon. I think it would pair well after this series. Truly appreciate you watching and stay blessed my friend!
I have an opinion and I don't know how to communicate it to people who haven't thought about it yet. I agree with your statement at 12:18 _"[...] but a long walk with Gibbons through Rome will make you realize, all this material stuff you care about and take for granted is just a few bad decisions away from disappearing."_ I don't think the classical education is the only glue that can hold a country together. China doesn't have it and it had a civilization for thousands of years. Or Switzerland is basically a collection of villages and cities who decide that they want to be together against the rest of the world. In case of modern Switzerland I think the cultural glue are things like public school which connects people across social class or the mandatory military service which connects people across regions. Also the small size of the country and great public transport connects the urban and rural parts of the country in a way which probably no other country does. It's still a problem to some degree, but in Switzerland many companies set their base in some rural village and still export to the whole world. Anyways, we are in agreement with society needing a glue to keep up a high social safety and living standard. Many people I talk to think that it can't be that bad. Another thing that some people also struggle with is the vulnerability of our infrastructure. How much of the milk produced is milked by hand and how much is milked by a machine? How much wheat can still be harvested if there is no oil anymore? How are good distributed if the American military supremacy on the ocean breaks down? Will a less educated populous be able to maintain the electric grid? Will they be able to create and maintain the machines to automate all the manual labor that is required to keep society running? When I talk to non-technical people they all think about the newest smartphone and ask _"What is so bad about it if we take a step back? Even if it is all the way back to the flip phone."_ I agree with them that entertainment electronics is a luxury which is not necessary. But feeding the population and giving energy to the population is. And that is stuff which only very few people have insight into, percentage wise. Or a historian I recently talked to said _"If we look at the entire human history, the desire for a higher comfort rose. So the bigger problem to tackle is how to do technology efficiently, not how to stop a decay."_ I sadly didn't get around to give a response. But in my opinion the society structure provides the upper range of the possible technological level. If you have a tribal society you can't have steel tools, as they require a semi global trade. Same with our current technology. Just because people desire luxury doesn't mean they can build a society that can produce luxury. If we make a few wrong decisions then that means we don't have any companies anymore which produce stuff and which ship stuff just in time so that the people have their luxury. It doesn't matter if there are no people who want to be engineers anymore, if there are politicians who prohibit companies from making stuff or if war prevents trade. If you stop production civilization will break down. And we have too many people and too incompetent people to be able to live in a broken down society. It's quite possible that I view things too dark. But I think it is blissfully ignorant to just assume a solution will pop up when the need arises. Especially if fewer people want to go into the engineering jobs which require logical thinking or the manual labor jobs which require working with the hands. According to the university teachers I know, all technical apprenticeships and all engineering degrees have fewer students applying. But the social jobs and the office jobs which focus on human interactions have more workers than jobs. So far I have not found out how to explain that in an appealing way. If I just say the summary, then people think I'm a pessimistic doom-monger. But I'm an optimistic pessimist. I think the trends and risks are quite large, but it doesn't really affect me emotionally and I have the best education to feed myself through a crisis, as long as it isn't a complete blackout. What do you think about this? Any tips on how to communicate it? Do you have any thoughts on the infrastructure side of civilization?
Every American should have at least some classical education, some knowledge of the Great Works, and history. In our constitutional republic, all citizens shoulder some responsibility in self-governance. In order to best participate, everyone should have some of the knowledge and wisdom our Founders xarried within them. I know several working class individuals who are quite the history buffs and who can wrestle with ideas as well as machinery.
I agree! And after watching it through before posting I wish I would have clarified that more. I know a dump truck driver that reads more than I do and you could never tell looking at the man. Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed!
@@The_Cause You as well! Thank you for putting these videos out! May classical education catch hold, as much as possible, in all our schools. Keep up the good work of lighting the fire of excellent education!
I would add farming. If some big disaster happened. It would be best to know some farming to be able to SURVIVE . Another thing to look at. Books today may be around an 8th grade reading level. Back when I was much younger, books had closer to a 13th grade.
I agree farming should be included as well. I was reading about Cato The Elder, Jefferson and some others who believed farming was just as important as reading and writing when it came to an education. If we think our classical knowledge is bad we haven't even discussed how bad our agricultural knowledge has become. As for books in the day being harder you can see that with some of the older children books we have picked up. Blows my mind how far we have regressed in some areas and improved in others. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and hope all has been well up there!
I have probably benefitted from as close to a classical education as is possible. I have also come to study classics even more as I age though not without balancing it with continuous learning of modern science. I remain wary of pure apologies of the classics. The greek philosophers made some important conceptual errors. The Roman state building was also not without major flaws. To discern these issues, you must accept to explore at the very least the Enlightenment and probably go at the very least to WWII when some key modern ideas were introduced. Conceptual knowledge is a key component of classical training that needs to be highlighted. It contrasts with the dumbed down current education centered on technical skills. It's the key to real understanding ent therefore the ability to correctly think and apply knowledge under changing circumstances.
I most definitely agree. I have always viewed the classics as a foundation. It is a place to build from and add on to. It does not replace the technology and physics texts of our current age. I do wish I would have learned the foundation when I was younger so I could be focused on more modern works as you mentioned. But such is life, and I am having to "repair" my education a tad. We will most definitely touch on some of this in our next book/video "Weapons of Mass Instruction". I really appreciate you watching and stay blessed my friend!
I had some contact with Swiss homeschoolers. The ones I talked to are not in favor of public school. One of the reasons why they dislike it is the following. They think the public school system is a tool of the industrialization. They think the sole purpose of public education is to turn humans into cogs of the machine called the industry. Or in other words we are forced to learn what outside forces want us to learn at the time they want us to learn it. They oppose that extrinsic form of education and favor an intrinsic form of education. They think any child has a built in learning schedule that runs on its own time. Perhaps you don't want to learn to read at the age of 6 but you may want to learn it at the age of 9. So why don't we let the child learn it at 9? After all if you force someone to learn something that he doesn't want to learn then this will just kill all motivation to learn as a whole. I can understand their argument. But I think there are several problems with that. - One of them is that they have no reason to belief that this is true. If they think we are a product of evolution then which selective process gave us the desire to read at age x? After all reading is a very recent phenomena. Sure, if they are Christians then they can say God gave that intrinsic learning plan. But so far nobody gave me a reason why that should be the case. And I won't do the job for them. - They say that each child has its own inner plan of when it wants to learn stuff. I think that is false. I think there is another reason that makes the child want to learn. And that would be the desire to fit in. At some point a child will find out that every other child can read but they can't so this child wants to learn it to have access to what the group is talking about. But what would happen if 20% of society can't read anymore? Will that desire still push a child to read? Or what about more complex stuff like an electrical engineering degree? There will always be a select few humans who have the desire and discipline to learn technical jobs on their own. But will those outliers be enough to maintain all of that infrastructure which grants us the luxury to ask those questions? - I was always an average student. I always did more than the minimum to pass, but I was not pursuing excellence. If my education were driven by intrinsic learning then I'm pretty sure I would be nowhere near where I am now. And when I look at my fellow students then that seems to be the norm. - Some things are better learned when the brain is developing those areas within the brain. If we let the child learn it at some other time then that may come with a lower capacity of learning. - One advantage of extrinsic learning is that you also train delayed gratification. Also I don't think the child is necessarily the best judge of what type of knowledge is best later in it's live. Especially when it comes to basic knowledge and skills. After letting those thoughts run wild for a while in my subconscious, I have come to a temporary conclusion of what education would look like, if I had to design it. I would say half of the day should be dedicated to learning the basics in an extrinsic fashion. With basics I mean math, language, reading & writing and logic. The rest of the day should be focused on intrinsic form of learning and there it is about application. For example if someone loves electronics then they should have plenty of time and support to tinker around with electronics. In that intrinsic part of the education they should also be confronted with various other things that they don't know yet. And when it comes to stuff like health, gardening, sports and so on then it should not be taught but instead it should be lived out by the parents. The children will mimic that automatically. If you have children and you could freely determine their education, how would you go about doing it?
There is 100% value of learning languages if you can get around to it. When you read a translation, you risk interacting with a misrepresented (whether intentionally or unintentionally by the translator) version of the original work. When a translator is grinding a proverbial axe and presents it to the reader as if it were the original, it is a demonstration of their insufficient skill at best and manipulation at worst; when it is done unintentionally, the misunderstanding is still unfortunate and the translation still falls short. Unless you do copious amounts of research before settling on a translation for a book in a language you're not familiar with, the only other real solution is to learn the language itself. Just as not all reading materials are of the same caliber and value (which is probably a hot take and might make this comment an ire-magnet), not all translations are of the same quality either.
Education, Education, Education 👀 I would love to see a video in which you to write out how to implement some of the education related things in our current education system. Would it simply start as a statewide "classics credit"? In which every student in your state would be required to take at least one of the following: Greek, Latin, grammar, rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, geometry, astronomy, music, and maybe agriculture or farming? As part of a high school diploma, an additional graduate requirement, a fully funded summer school/camp/voucher program, shattering the normal high school experience into specific life paths? Btw if you're going to read about modern European education in attempt to work backwards I highly recommend the German Gymnasium wiki article for being filled with hilarious titles like: ""Great equaliser" or "breeding ground of privilege"?". As someone who went to an old school with old values: I think that learning Latin and Ancient Greek brings many benefits such as clarity of mind but also come with many cons. If someone is planning on living life with precision it often requires a certain level of wealth, stability, and/or order. Trying to live life according to some sort of golden path sounds nice but the transition phase can be quite troublesome. If everything is perfectly calibrated it can get knocked out of place when we change our clocks twice a year, or when talking to adults that aren't even at an 8th grade reading level and explaining each individual word used, expressing everything accurately might be quite risky if at the bottom of the totem pole, etc. But it's not just precise and accurate thought not meshing properly. If for example someone with autism is raised with an education of under stimulation, they won't know how to interact with people who communicate through memes and vibes. Hot take: I think level 1 of 5 languages is better for most people than level 5 in 1 for an intro to that society.
With technology taking over so many jobs we have a choice before us. We can just devolve into blubbering couch potatoes drooling over the latest video games from the time we get up to when we go to bed or we can use the classics as what Mortimer Adler called a sharpening stone to improve our minds and give meaning to our lives
Exactly. It’s a tough choice because it so easy now days to scroll and do. Nothing vs actively pursue something of difficultly. And then there is the hoping that this great easy life we all live now days continues and nothing collapses back into chaos. In perspective of history, we live in some pretty dangerous good times.
@@The_Cause Thank you, you too brother! Yusuf seems to echo a lot of the same insights I’ve gleamed from your videos and expounds a bit more on the nature and importance of a liberal arts education, primarily from an Islamic perspective since that’s what he specializes in. Your videos just reminded me of some of his lectures
What’s with the hat 🧢? (Other than to provoke folks to say “What’s with the hat?” ;) -not far enough into the video to ask anything else yet but just had to ask this. Thx
@@The_Cause Thank you for responding. Just wondered if it had a mysterious significance (it reminds me of something tho I can't rem. what.. ;) JFYI- I just found you today & I really like your videos 🙏🙌
No significance really. If the hat is forward it throws off the light and my eyes are blacked out and if I take it off I have to get my hair looking somewhat youtuberpresentable. I am glad you are enjoying the videos and l am glad to have you here. Means a lot!
"If you have the privilege to vote, you have the duty to read."
Yes indeed! Many of us like to proclaim our right to vote but we also have to realize we have duties that go along with that right. Book 8 will focus on this topic a good bit. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Johnny Harris once did a video on mandatory gun training in Switzerland. I think the same holds true with regards to firearms as well. Bearing arms is a privelage that has to be exercised with dutiful respect.
Rob, I just want you to know I really appreciate what you’re doing. This is important. It’s important for today and important for the future.
Thanks so much! I believe the same thing. I know I do not have all the answers but I am enjoying the journey to find the answers. Hopefully we can all gain something along the way. Truly appreciate the kind words and thanks so much for watching. Stay blessed!
Finishing the defense of the Greeks portion and on to the Romans next.
Homeschooling our children here. Using a Christian and Classical education mix. It’s going amazingly thank the Lord. Oldest child just went 98th%+ on his state equivalency exams.
4th grader reading at the 75th% high school senior level already…
Persevere Rob, you’re on the Path
How did you get your children to want to put in the effort? I find the hardest part is the willingness of the child. Just curious.
@@markdevlin3630 GREAT question:
started at birth. Read to my son EVERY night that I was home and not deployed. Encourage his Q&A sessions, taught him about world history and American history, read the scripture with him, pray with him, exercise with him, no tablets or cellphones or social media, give him responsibilities and chores and award him accordingly, have tough conversations about responsibilities and repercussions and discipline, love him and tell him I love him, and show him I love him. Etc.
And then I replicate this for my two other children as well. It’s not easy. But they’re worth it. Much easier to plop them in front of TVs or tell them “bc I’m your Father and I said so” but in the long run both of those are counter productive and ineffective. So I choose the harder, but more meaningful and productive path.
Lead with the “Why” with your kids. Answer their questions. And again, “Lead”. They know when you’re genuine and when you have their best interests in mind. Can’t fool your kids… they see you 7 days a week 😅
Again, GREAT question! Best of luck. You can do it too.
@@markdevlin3630 I wrote a whole reply and it seems to have been filtered out 😔
Basically, love your kids. Lead with the why. Read to them. Do the hard things (no tablets/phones/social media), bc kids know when you’re being genuine and when you’re not. They see us 7 days a week 😅 we can’t fool them.
GREAT question!
@@CheapSeats Thanks for the reply. Nothing is more annoying on YT then when your reply doesn't show up. I hear you on the removal of distractions. Worst decision I ever made was allowing YT and roblox. Take care.
@@markdevlin3630 it can be overcome. You can do it and they (the children) are worth it. Persevere, you are not alone in this Cause. ✊
I would say that Classical Education is based on Greek, Jewish, and Roman studies. These cultures placed an emphasis on the person exceeding basic, minimal, animalistic traits, for they promoted virtue, physicality, discipline, the arts, debates, and even moral. We are capable of so much more than we are given credit for. Communication is a key principle in the Classical form of education. On your comment on agriculture, there is a similar Classical Education called Thomas Jefferson Education which promotes agriculture in its studies. I hope that our education trains our youth to have "flexibility of mind" and moves away from Progressive Education.
Great video - thank you.
Your channel has inspired me to start educating myself and to change the way I homeschool my children. Thank you.
I remember Hutchins quoted Livingstone. I find it very provoking that these gentlemen saw the down fall beginning in the 1950s in America and the world. Plato had the Philosopher King, which can be any man if he wishes to be. The mind is the final battlefield.
The mind is the final battlefield indeed! What a great line!
A great video. Upon discovering your channel a couple of weeks ago I became inspired and invigorated with a desire to learn more and more deeply. Therefore I have set myself the ambition of achieving a Classical Education by learning Latin, Ancient Greek and Biblical Hebrew while reading all the literature, studying all the history and culture which goes along with it. I want to thank you for the inspiration and I am looking forward to your future videos!
That is so cool to hear! I am glad my videos helped lead you down the path. It has been a fun journey for me so far and I am sure you will feel the same. Judging by how well you sound on the Piano practice and dedication should not be a problem. I would love to venture in to Music one day and learn that side of the education as well. Thanks so much for watching my friend and stay blessed!
One of the best started books for learning Latin is "Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata" and the various supplements.
And there's a great RUclips series called "Aleph with Beth" for Hebrew.
Unfortunately Ancient Greek is a whole nother animal
Thanks so much for tuning in! Paradise Lost video #4 will be next and then, back to this series! If you need a little caffeine to get you through the series then try some of the coffee I roast.
www.cedarotacoffee.com
Stay blessed my friends!
Thanks for doing these videos. I'm blessed to be able to send my kids to a classical Christian school, and I'm currently working through the Great Books to remediate my government schooling. Glad to see other people pushing themselves.
Thats awesome! I am sure it will pay dividends later in life. The Great Books are such an amazing set. I have not started reading them yet but I flip through them regularly. Work is the key word for the Great Books. Definitely not anything easy or quick about them. haha Thanks for watching and stay blessed!
Your videos serve as a guide for my intellectual enlistment. Thank you.
No problem at all my friend. I am happy to hear that they are helpful. It has been a nice learning process making them. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
great start to the series Rob! This book has been on my TBR for a few weeks now, ever since I heard them mention it on one of the Memoria Press podcasts... Definitely one i want to pick up! and i think the biggest thing most people discount is the fact that even if you didn't have a classical education, you can still choose to SELF-educate and move more towards that kind of understanding and way of viewing the world. So many people discount the fact that you need to be constantly learning and growing and improving yourself or else you'll stagnate and die. The goal is create and consume something true and beautiful every single day - do that and you'll be alright! :D Thanks for another awesome video my man!
Thanks so much brother! I completely agree on self-education. I eventually want to do a dedicated video on that. I think it is more important than ever to build your own university/library to learn and study from. I have been enjoying the journey and it has really allowed me to slow down and think more. I truly appreciate the kind words and thanks so much for watching! Stay blessed my friend!
Rob…wow! This is my new favorite channel!
I’m glad to hear you are enjoying it. It really means a lot to hear that.
Great video Rob! I totally agree with you that our children are truly missing out on true education. And we are paying for it in our communities & workplaces. Amazing how my younger teammates can’t seem to say a normal sentence without adding “like” after every other word! So annoying! Looking forward to you next video! God bless!
I notice that as well. As I get older I have been stepping back and thinking to myself. The kids coming out of school are a product of the programs and policies that we (My Generation and Older) have put in place and are teaching them. I think it is more important than ever to revive the classical way of learning and point anyone willing to learn in a direction that I think is the correct path to go down. What we currently have set up is not working that well. Then again, I do not know how much is cultural decay, poor parenting, or the effects of a privileged/affluent/softer society. It is crazy to speak to older men in their 80s and 90s who are still living and remember not having electricity in their house and a time when an ice truck would actually deliver ice. Makes you realize it really wasn't that long ago that things were completely different. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
I came to the same conclusion. This is outstanding. I am reading the ancient Greek and Roman historians. Classic education: Democracy ends in tyranny. Modern education: Democracy is wonderful but yet we see our society degenerating.
Yes indeed. Which books are you currently covering? In Plato's Republic he is against democracy as well. But, he is also against almost every form of government so that is not saying much. Glad to have you here my friend!
@@The_Cause Thucydides Peloponnesian War but I believe Aristotle also criticizes democracy. Cicero in his De republica says that Democracy is the worst of the three pure forms of government.
@@libertycoffeehouse3944 pure democracy isn't really used today. The most famius example of pure democracy would be plebescites. Like the one that made Napoleon emperor. Democracy is dnagerous because it can be used as undisputable confirmation by tyrants.
Thanks!
Thank you so much James! I truly appreciate the kindness. Your generosity means a lot! Stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause I think that you are on to something useful and good with this channel and my hope is that a way can be found to support it. There is nothing wrong with flooding RUclips with channels full of interesting content, especially given the rest of the content and the rest of the media.
Great video! A method I use is visiting secondhand bookshops. I should visit my local library and see what they are discarding.
I would check with them. They may give you the dates they do it or the location that the discard sales are held in.
Enjoying this book, too! Finally got it and am reading it.
Awesome! I truly hope you enjoy it. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
Hello Rob! Thanks for a great video and solid overview of Livingstone's work. As a scholar of Latin (but not ancient Greek-at least not yet), I can definitely appreciate the ways in which learning these languages and appreciating the works of Cicero, Vergil, and others in their original form is incredible. I would say, though, the most essential group of works missing from a classical education (assuming the classical education is focused on the humanities) are those of the Enlightenment, without which many of the central ideas of the Western world are left undeveloped, including democracy (Montesquieu's The Spirit of the Laws is a must-read!). An education in the classics, though, should be the cornerstone of a wider education in the great books and ideas of world culture, which in my view should continue on to the works of the modern day--without a sampling of the many eras and viewpoints of human history, it can be difficult to get a full understanding of both human nature and where the world is today. I thank you for your well thought-out take on the importance of the classics!
I most definitely agree. I have listened to many of Adler’s lectures and talks and I think he felt the same. It is nice to hear from those who know Latin. I usually hear the argument against Greek and Latin from people who do not know it. I don’t either but I have read enough of Milton and Bacon to realize that some deep foundational understanding they have allows them to communicate at a deeper level than I can. I understand they are professionals in their field though. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and stay blessed!
Many will treat it as some great mystery beyond solving, but it's actually quite simple to define "classical education." It is an education in the seven _classical_ liberal arts of the Trivium (Grammar, Logic, and Rhetoric), and the Quadrivium (Arithmetic, Geometry, Music, and Astronomy). And they should be learned and taught as the classical arts from the classical sources; modern substitutes will not suffice.
That's it, really. But we can expound on and clarify that further, for those interested.
While the Greeks and Romans sometimes played fast and loose with education (the Romans especially gave pride of place to rhetoric above all), classical education and the seven classical liberal arts were formalized in late Antiquity by Martianus Capella in his _On the Marriage of Philology and Mercury._ St. Augustine of Hippo also wrote on it to some degree. It was further treated by Cassiodorus in his _Institutes of Divine and Secular Learning,_ and was helped by St. Boethius, who translated many of the standard works. And much later, classical Christian education was regimented further by the early Jesuits for their schools as part of the Counter-Reformation in response to Protestantism and the scientific revolution birthed out of the occult "Enlightenment" of the Renaissance.
The standard works used from the classical liberal arts were and still should be:
Logic = Aristotle's _Organon_
Rhetoric = Aristotle's _On Rhetoric,_ supplemented with Cicero
Arithmetic = Nicomachus of Gerasa's _Introduction to Arithmetic_
Geometry = Euclid's _Elements_
Music = Nicomachus of Gerasa's _Manual of Harmonics_
Astronomy = Claudius Ptolemy's _Almagest_
Grammar was the teaching of Greek and Latin. Many of the ancient and medieval grammars can still be found and used today, but quality modern grammars also exist.
It should be stressed that the logic learned in true classical education is Aristotelian logic, _not_ Baconian inductive reasoning (the scientific method). Bacon titled his work _Novum Organum_ to set it over and against Aristotle's, but it is Aristotle who prevailed throughout the Classical, Antique, and Medieval eras, not Bacon.
There are many sources that were used for the teaching of rhetoric. The primary source was Aristotle, but he eventually gave way to others, namely to Cicero and many Ciceronians after him. But one can also make use of Quintilian (who also has insights for the teaching of grammar), and we still have the rhetorical exercises of Libanius, who taught none other than St. John Chrysostom (John the Golden-Mouthed).
Also, the classical liberal arts of arithmetic and music were not the training in how to count (add, subtract, multiply, divide-these were called "logistics" in Antiquity) or how to play a musical instrument. They were, instead, the _philosophical_ study of mathematics and music. To be more exact, they were training in Pythagorean mathematical philosophy. Both the _Introduction to Arithmetic_ and _Manual of Harmonics_ were standard texts for these arts from the second century AD onwards. They were authored in Greek by Pythagorean mathematician Nicomachus of Gerasa and translated into Latin (with adaptation and commentary) by St. Boethius.
Classical geometry is Euclidian geometry. And classical astronomy is not the modern science of astronomy, but that of the second century AD Alexandrian, Claudius Ptolemy.
For classical Christian education, all of these still hold true (many of the greatest saints of the Church received a classical education), but it was rounded out and perfected with training in the Holy Scriptures and theology, called the Queen of the Sciences. For Catholics, this would be achieved through (capital S) Scholasticism and the natural theology of Thomas Aquinas. For the Orthodox, far more through (little s) scholasticism and the mystical theology of the Cappadocian Fathers, John of Damascus, Maximus the Confessor, and Gregory Palamas. (The Byzantine theologians were scholastic in that they were careful scholars, but they were not Scholastics. While Thomas Aquinas was beloved and held in high regard by Byzantine theologians, Scholasticism proper was rejected. This is especially true after the humanist monk Barlaam of Seminara came to metaphorical blows with the hesychast St. Gregory Palamas. Palamas and his defense of hesychasm [holy quietude] prevailed in Orthodoxy.)
Comments like this are the ones I copy and save! I want to dissect and go through this. So much info and knowledge here well beyond anything I am capable of. I hope to be at this level one day of understanding. Thanks so much for taking the time to share. Stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Happy to help! But please never discount yourself. It's not beyond what you're capable of. It just takes gradual exposure to it and, after a little while, you will begin to form a cohesive mental image of it.
I highly recommend Cassiodorus' _Institutions of Divine and Secular Learning._ It's a pleasant reading experience overall. (A good version is in the Translated Texts for Historians (TTH) series by Liverpool University Press.) Martianus Capella's _Marriage of Philology and Mercury_ is worth having as an authoritative reference, but it can be a slog to read based on the type of literature it is and how detailed he gets. It's basically an encyclopedia on the seven classical liberal arts (teaching all their basic substance), but in the form of an allegory, where the seven liberal arts are personified and come before the council of the gods to describe their work.
Would recommend the history of western philosophy by Bertrand Russell, it's a really good book, well written and includes all those classical works and authors intertwined. Love that book by Livingstone.
I hear so much about Bertrand Russell. I am looking forward to finally crossing paths with his works. So much to read so little time! Haha Livingstone’s book was great. I am anxious to know what I would think of his arguments if I also knew Greek and Latin. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and stay blessed!
One of my new favourite youtubers!!!!!
haha thanks so much for the kind words and I truly appreciate you watchings! Stay blessed my friend!
This is the first video of yours I have seen, and I really
enjoyed it. I started following you.
Jeff
Well I am truly happy to have you along my friend! Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed!
Thanks for these very thoughtful presentations.
You are most very welcome! I truly appreciate you watching!
I oughtta read this one. Where do you get these books from?
I have them all linked in the description of the video. But this book "Defense of Classical Eduction", Memoria Press puts out and it can be purchased off their website. Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Ah, good man
Happy reading my friend!
Finishing this book today, and weapons of mass instruction arrives on Tuesday so I can crush through it. The other 6 books are here now too. Stoked!
When is the video on Weapons of Mass Instruction slated for release so I can plan out how quickly I needs to read through it before video release Sir?
I don’t know why my reply did not go through. I know I posted it. Anyway, glad you are reading along and looking forward to getting out the next one. I am working on Paradise Lost’s 4th video now and hope to have it out next week. I hope to have weapons of mass instruction out in about 2-3 weeks. If time permits sooner but it never does. Haha As always, stay blessed my friend and thanks for ordering coffee again!
@@The_Cause got it in the mail yesterday, it is a GREAT read thus far. I’ll have it finished within 10 days so that’s plenty of time!
Thanks brother, and thank you for the recent delivery of Cedar Ota Coffee last week!
Ya Weapons of Mass Instruction was a book that really changed the way I think. Reading it again has been just as rewarding as the first time. I could do 20 video on all the topics in this book and not even do the subject justice. Anxious to hear what you thought of it after you finished. For you it may just be more confirming what you already realized. Stay blessed brother!
@@The_Cause just finished it. Loved it. You are right, it is an affirming book for the path our family has already begun. But great to have arrows like this in the quiver.
On to Plato and The Republic!
I just want to spin green beans in a furnace and turn them brown so as to grind and drink later. Reading a good book in the process always pairs well with the process. Great video dude…
I just want to read books and create RUclips videos but the garden calls!
Great video. Thank you
No problem at all. It was a joy to read. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
I just finished this book last night. I loved how it changed my views on humanities and the importance of reading the Greeks and Romans. I also saw many parallels between the emphasis on "natural science" in his day and STEM in ours. It seems to me the best benefits of classical education are "soft" benefits, ie better equipped to learn, better morals, more empathy, etc. I would never have considered the humanities as more important than STEM unless I read this book.
Also, this dude loves his Greeks. Even the chapter on the Latins was overshadowed by them 😂
There was no doubt about his support of the Greeks! haha I think the expression of thought was my biggest takeaway. I never really ever though about the skill of translating your ideas into another language and the skill that must build in being precise in the words you use. I think this skill would translate over to code and other more tech concepts. There is a need for both but also like I kind of mentioned. There is a need for welders, machinist and mechanics. Which is most important now days is being determined by the market. Thanks for watching my friend and glad to have you along the reading journey!
Rob, great analysis of the topic. It is frightening today to see so many of today’s “students “ lack critical thinking or any real knowledge of history. The future is grim unless things change dramatically. Have you read The Cave and the Light by Arthur Herman? It’s a great read about the influence of Plato and Aristotle on Western thought and how their philosophy influenced important events and Western culture.
I read that book a couple years ago and honestly it kind of was what set me off on this journey. I like how he showed the division between Plato and Aristotle and how that divide has literally shaped our western culture. I would love to revisit it someday. I agree with the state of out society. We definitely have a lot of work to do. haha Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed my friend!
Word of advice: If looking to pull the trigger on the Harvard Classics or GBWW with regard to a liberal education, the GBWW has the texts for 5 of the 7 classical liberal arts, and many of those that students classically moved up to in moral philosophy, natural philosophy, and theology. The Harvard Classics doesn’t really have any that were part of a classical education. It is a good set of classic literature though.
Most definitely. The Harvard Classics are more literature based. The Great Books dives more into the math and sciences as well. I like that the Great Books are compiled in a more chronological order versus the HC that go from Ben Franklin in volume 1 to Plato in volume 2. Great point to bring up. Thanks so much for watching my friend and stay blessed.
In which way learning Latin and Greek changes our brain and helps you thinking more clearly? Imo training public speaking, argumentation and talking to people of all ages and different fields of work, learning different modern languages, helps more than learning dead languages. Can you point me to scientific studies instead of an individual opinion?
He explains it better than I can in the book. He says that by translating into Greek and Latin you build a technique for precisely picking and choosing the correct words. All of modern languages (at least in the west) are rooted in these to languages. The problem is the that people like myself even who have argues against it don it know the languages. I study could be done on all the great writers in history such as Milton, Bacon, Shakespeare and pair them against all the ones who do not know Latin and Greek and see how it affects. What he says in the book makes perfect sense but I understand the push back because of the time commitment and our attachment to modern languages or even computer code over ancient languages. Very good points though. Something I will have to look into further as we learn more about it. Thanks for watching!
"to be deluded by sentiment or passion or rhetoric or humbug, whether it be in politics, education, business, or private life, means failure, as its opposite means success." (p. 23) today more important than ever!
Please do a review on john dewey’s education philosophy
That is definitely a topic I want to cover soon. I think it would pair well after this series. Truly appreciate you watching and stay blessed my friend!
Your hitting it right nose, on our educational system
Thanks so much brother! I agree, we have a lot to fix! haha
I have an opinion and I don't know how to communicate it to people who haven't thought about it yet.
I agree with your statement at 12:18 _"[...] but a long walk with Gibbons through Rome will make you realize, all this material stuff you care about and take for granted is just a few bad decisions away from disappearing."_
I don't think the classical education is the only glue that can hold a country together. China doesn't have it and it had a civilization for thousands of years. Or Switzerland is basically a collection of villages and cities who decide that they want to be together against the rest of the world. In case of modern Switzerland I think the cultural glue are things like public school which connects people across social class or the mandatory military service which connects people across regions. Also the small size of the country and great public transport connects the urban and rural parts of the country in a way which probably no other country does. It's still a problem to some degree, but in Switzerland many companies set their base in some rural village and still export to the whole world.
Anyways, we are in agreement with society needing a glue to keep up a high social safety and living standard. Many people I talk to think that it can't be that bad.
Another thing that some people also struggle with is the vulnerability of our infrastructure. How much of the milk produced is milked by hand and how much is milked by a machine? How much wheat can still be harvested if there is no oil anymore? How are good distributed if the American military supremacy on the ocean breaks down? Will a less educated populous be able to maintain the electric grid? Will they be able to create and maintain the machines to automate all the manual labor that is required to keep society running? When I talk to non-technical people they all think about the newest smartphone and ask _"What is so bad about it if we take a step back? Even if it is all the way back to the flip phone."_ I agree with them that entertainment electronics is a luxury which is not necessary. But feeding the population and giving energy to the population is. And that is stuff which only very few people have insight into, percentage wise.
Or a historian I recently talked to said _"If we look at the entire human history, the desire for a higher comfort rose. So the bigger problem to tackle is how to do technology efficiently, not how to stop a decay."_ I sadly didn't get around to give a response. But in my opinion the society structure provides the upper range of the possible technological level. If you have a tribal society you can't have steel tools, as they require a semi global trade. Same with our current technology. Just because people desire luxury doesn't mean they can build a society that can produce luxury. If we make a few wrong decisions then that means we don't have any companies anymore which produce stuff and which ship stuff just in time so that the people have their luxury. It doesn't matter if there are no people who want to be engineers anymore, if there are politicians who prohibit companies from making stuff or if war prevents trade. If you stop production civilization will break down. And we have too many people and too incompetent people to be able to live in a broken down society.
It's quite possible that I view things too dark. But I think it is blissfully ignorant to just assume a solution will pop up when the need arises. Especially if fewer people want to go into the engineering jobs which require logical thinking or the manual labor jobs which require working with the hands. According to the university teachers I know, all technical apprenticeships and all engineering degrees have fewer students applying. But the social jobs and the office jobs which focus on human interactions have more workers than jobs.
So far I have not found out how to explain that in an appealing way. If I just say the summary, then people think I'm a pessimistic doom-monger. But I'm an optimistic pessimist. I think the trends and risks are quite large, but it doesn't really affect me emotionally and I have the best education to feed myself through a crisis, as long as it isn't a complete blackout.
What do you think about this? Any tips on how to communicate it? Do you have any thoughts on the infrastructure side of civilization?
Good job as always
Thanks so much my friend! I truly appreciate you watching and stay blessed!
Dude, so well done.
Thanks brother! I truly appreciate the feedback!
Every American should have at least some classical education, some knowledge of the Great Works, and history. In our constitutional republic, all citizens shoulder some responsibility in self-governance. In order to best participate, everyone should have some of the knowledge and wisdom our Founders xarried within them. I know several working class individuals who are quite the history buffs and who can wrestle with ideas as well as machinery.
I agree! And after watching it through before posting I wish I would have clarified that more. I know a dump truck driver that reads more than I do and you could never tell looking at the man. Thanks so much for watching and stay blessed!
@@The_Cause
You as well! Thank you for putting these videos out! May classical education catch hold, as much as possible, in all our schools. Keep up the good work of lighting the fire of excellent education!
I would add farming. If some big disaster happened. It would be best to know some farming to be able to SURVIVE . Another thing to look at. Books today may be around an 8th grade reading level. Back when I was much younger, books had closer to a 13th grade.
I agree farming should be included as well. I was reading about Cato The Elder, Jefferson and some others who believed farming was just as important as reading and writing when it came to an education. If we think our classical knowledge is bad we haven't even discussed how bad our agricultural knowledge has become. As for books in the day being harder you can see that with some of the older children books we have picked up. Blows my mind how far we have regressed in some areas and improved in others. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and hope all has been well up there!
I have probably benefitted from as close to a classical education as is possible. I have also come to study classics even more as I age though not without balancing it with continuous learning of modern science. I remain wary of pure apologies of the classics. The greek philosophers made some important conceptual errors. The Roman state building was also not without major flaws. To discern these issues, you must accept to explore at the very least the Enlightenment and probably go at the very least to WWII when some key modern ideas were introduced. Conceptual knowledge is a key component of classical training that needs to be highlighted. It contrasts with the dumbed down current education centered on technical skills. It's the key to real understanding ent therefore the ability to correctly think and apply knowledge under changing circumstances.
I most definitely agree. I have always viewed the classics as a foundation. It is a place to build from and add on to. It does not replace the technology and physics texts of our current age. I do wish I would have learned the foundation when I was younger so I could be focused on more modern works as you mentioned. But such is life, and I am having to "repair" my education a tad. We will most definitely touch on some of this in our next book/video "Weapons of Mass Instruction". I really appreciate you watching and stay blessed my friend!
I had some contact with Swiss homeschoolers. The ones I talked to are not in favor of public school. One of the reasons why they dislike it is the following. They think the public school system is a tool of the industrialization. They think the sole purpose of public education is to turn humans into cogs of the machine called the industry. Or in other words we are forced to learn what outside forces want us to learn at the time they want us to learn it. They oppose that extrinsic form of education and favor an intrinsic form of education. They think any child has a built in learning schedule that runs on its own time. Perhaps you don't want to learn to read at the age of 6 but you may want to learn it at the age of 9. So why don't we let the child learn it at 9? After all if you force someone to learn something that he doesn't want to learn then this will just kill all motivation to learn as a whole.
I can understand their argument. But I think there are several problems with that.
- One of them is that they have no reason to belief that this is true. If they think we are a product of evolution then which selective process gave us the desire to read at age x? After all reading is a very recent phenomena. Sure, if they are Christians then they can say God gave that intrinsic learning plan. But so far nobody gave me a reason why that should be the case. And I won't do the job for them.
- They say that each child has its own inner plan of when it wants to learn stuff. I think that is false. I think there is another reason that makes the child want to learn. And that would be the desire to fit in. At some point a child will find out that every other child can read but they can't so this child wants to learn it to have access to what the group is talking about. But what would happen if 20% of society can't read anymore? Will that desire still push a child to read? Or what about more complex stuff like an electrical engineering degree? There will always be a select few humans who have the desire and discipline to learn technical jobs on their own. But will those outliers be enough to maintain all of that infrastructure which grants us the luxury to ask those questions?
- I was always an average student. I always did more than the minimum to pass, but I was not pursuing excellence. If my education were driven by intrinsic learning then I'm pretty sure I would be nowhere near where I am now. And when I look at my fellow students then that seems to be the norm.
- Some things are better learned when the brain is developing those areas within the brain. If we let the child learn it at some other time then that may come with a lower capacity of learning.
- One advantage of extrinsic learning is that you also train delayed gratification. Also I don't think the child is necessarily the best judge of what type of knowledge is best later in it's live. Especially when it comes to basic knowledge and skills.
After letting those thoughts run wild for a while in my subconscious, I have come to a temporary conclusion of what education would look like, if I had to design it. I would say half of the day should be dedicated to learning the basics in an extrinsic fashion. With basics I mean math, language, reading & writing and logic. The rest of the day should be focused on intrinsic form of learning and there it is about application. For example if someone loves electronics then they should have plenty of time and support to tinker around with electronics. In that intrinsic part of the education they should also be confronted with various other things that they don't know yet.
And when it comes to stuff like health, gardening, sports and so on then it should not be taught but instead it should be lived out by the parents. The children will mimic that automatically.
If you have children and you could freely determine their education, how would you go about doing it?
I would add farming. If some big disaster happened. It would be best to know some farming to be able to SURVIVE
There is 100% value of learning languages if you can get around to it. When you read a translation, you risk interacting with a misrepresented (whether intentionally or unintentionally by the translator) version of the original work. When a translator is grinding a proverbial axe and presents it to the reader as if it were the original, it is a demonstration of their insufficient skill at best and manipulation at worst; when it is done unintentionally, the misunderstanding is still unfortunate and the translation still falls short. Unless you do copious amounts of research before settling on a translation for a book in a language you're not familiar with, the only other real solution is to learn the language itself. Just as not all reading materials are of the same caliber and value (which is probably a hot take and might make this comment an ire-magnet), not all translations are of the same quality either.
Education, Education, Education 👀
I would love to see a video in which you to write out how to implement some of the education related things in our current education system. Would it simply start as a statewide "classics credit"? In which every student in your state would be required to take at least one of the following: Greek, Latin, grammar, rhetoric, logic, arithmetic, geometry, astronomy, music, and maybe agriculture or farming? As part of a high school diploma, an additional graduate requirement, a fully funded summer school/camp/voucher program, shattering the normal high school experience into specific life paths? Btw if you're going to read about modern European education in attempt to work backwards I highly recommend the German Gymnasium wiki article for being filled with hilarious titles like: ""Great equaliser" or "breeding ground of privilege"?".
As someone who went to an old school with old values:
I think that learning Latin and Ancient Greek brings many benefits such as clarity of mind but also come with many cons. If someone is planning on living life with precision it often requires a certain level of wealth, stability, and/or order. Trying to live life according to some sort of golden path sounds nice but the transition phase can be quite troublesome. If everything is perfectly calibrated it can get knocked out of place when we change our clocks twice a year, or when talking to adults that aren't even at an 8th grade reading level and explaining each individual word used, expressing everything accurately might be quite risky if at the bottom of the totem pole, etc. But it's not just precise and accurate thought not meshing properly. If for example someone with autism is raised with an education of under stimulation, they won't know how to interact with people who communicate through memes and vibes.
Hot take: I think level 1 of 5 languages is better for most people than level 5 in 1 for an intro to that society.
With technology taking over so many jobs we have a choice before us. We can just devolve into blubbering couch potatoes drooling over the latest video games from the time we get up to when we go to bed or we can use the classics as what Mortimer Adler called a sharpening stone to improve our minds and give meaning to our lives
Exactly. It’s a tough choice because it so easy now days to scroll and do. Nothing vs actively pursue something of difficultly. And then there is the hoping that this great easy life we all live now days continues and nothing collapses back into chaos. In perspective of history, we live in some pretty dangerous good times.
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Thanks so much for watching my friend and stay blessed!
Thank you. I wish you and your family all the best.
Are you Muslim? I feel like you’d be fan of Hamza Yusuf either way
I am not but I will definitely look up Hamza Yusuf and see what he is about. Truly appreciate you watching my friend and stay blessed!
@@The_Cause Thank you, you too brother! Yusuf seems to echo a lot of the same insights I’ve gleamed from your videos and expounds a bit more on the nature and importance of a liberal arts education, primarily from an Islamic perspective since that’s what he specializes in. Your videos just reminded me of some of his lectures
What’s with the hat 🧢? (Other than to provoke folks to say “What’s with the hat?” ;)
-not far enough into the video to ask anything else yet but just had to ask this. Thx
I just simply like it. It’s only a normal fitted hat. Thanks for watching and stay blessed my friend!
@@The_Cause Thank you for responding. Just wondered if it had a mysterious significance (it reminds me of something tho I can't rem. what.. ;)
JFYI- I just found you today & I really like your videos 🙏🙌
No significance really. If the hat is forward it throws off the light and my eyes are blacked out and if I take it off I have to get my hair looking somewhat youtuberpresentable. I am glad you are enjoying the videos and l am glad to have you here. Means a lot!
Thanks!
Thanks so much again! Your kindness if very appreciated! Hope you enjoy and thanks so much for watching. Stay blessed!