Finally! A low rpm big block video!! Please build and dyno an 8100 vortec! I know the market is limited but the more ppl build em the more parts will come out! Gen 7 BBC is the best one!
Not sure what you guys were thinking here. 234/244 is a poor cam selection for a torque/towing application, as seen on the dyno, low end suffers with this approach. And the EFI is expensive, I don't know which FiTech kit you are using, but the Easy Street 600HP master kit is $1200. With the same or less money, for a towing application I would go with a hydraulic roller upgrade, it will have less duration but higher lift than a flat tappet, something like a 206/212 @0.50. At most 212/218@0.50. The lower duration will keep the torque curve down low. And just use a simple 600cfm carb with vacuum secondaries. Use a knockoff air-gap manifold and phenolic spacer to keep the carb from boiling over after those long uphills towing.
@@stormwolfgames6636 we're talking low end torque here, not 6000 rpms. 600 cfm is more than enough for a heavy towing or motorhome application that only revs to 4500. With peanut port heads and a stock cam you will not get more power with a 750cfm carb.
@@JimBronson I know I have peanut port heads, I have always used and been told to use no lower than 750cfm. I have used both 750 and 800. You will open up your top end a little more at a small sacrifice of bottom end, considering these motors are swapped into half tons all the time it's not such a bad idea. I have seen many forums guys try running under 750 with stock 454 they always run in to problems. My stock qjet that came with the truck is 750 at least and if you do your research all qjets for 454s were 750 or 800cfm. Even 650 is too low for a 454.
@@Wanous-hv7zo anyone who knows about the 8.1 knows the only things that need replaced are the stock Rods and Pistons. Better design over the Gen 6 454 and the only casting better comes from world products. You can't use a Gen 6 454 to get 572 or 632. But you can from an 8.1 496 tall deck.
@@bladenrexroth2555 you would you want to use a gen 6 anyways. the gen 2 is the way to go for pretty much anything. stock rebuilds all the way up to 600 cubic inch 1,800hp turbo builds. they're was more common, way cheaper and have a WAY bigger aftermarket compared to the 8.1. i don't even know if id considered a set heads and a few different cams an aftermarket.
I've always liked this show because it's always a budget build and always around 350-400hp. And even when they do blow the bank it's like 600hp. It makes me feel safe. 😆
my stock 454 has 450 hp and it was free with 6,000 miles on it with a 02xx 400r turbo good to 800 hp so far 4 just this year plus it has the 4 inch stroke instead of the 4 1/4 inch stroke
Y’all need to watch Richard Holdner’s videos. For the price of those roller rockers you could have picked up a set of Gen VI rectangle port heads that would have made 60 more HP and more torque due to higher compression and better flow. The stock rockets would work fine up to around 6500 rpm. Pat should know that.
@@BigUnk85 I didn’t say the ports increase compression. I said the Gen 6 Rec port heads flowed better and would increase compression. Better airflow and more compression equals more power. The best recipe for any motor is the right combination with the best airflow possible. For a street motor the recipe is sufficient cubic inches, good amount of compression, mild cam and the most air flow possible. The mild cam let’s you make power down low and the airflow allows a broad power band and that gives you good driveability.
Great vid but if I did all that in my garage and only found 12-15 ftlbs of torque i would be disappointed, just a camshaft in my 455 Buick brought it up over 500 torque. Glad to see the young men taking up the trade and bringing business and marketing to the table!
I understand what you mean about not gaining a lot of torque being disappointing, but if you look at the torque lines it is a huge improvement. The stock torque line just falls off after hitting peak. The new cam has a torque line that runs evenly across the graph. That is the big gain there. A very long torque range.
That Generation is notoriously low on CR. That's one of the biggest reasons the 454SS was such a dog. Those heads don't help either. Except for the Fitech, this is a really inexpensive build that won't hurt reliability.
I appreciate the episode and sharing the build with the guests. The Total Seal rings are good stuff. I think a pair of used budget friendly L29 Vortec heads, would get the build to one HP per CI and match the intake ports better. I'd add a rear water crossover if there isn't one cast in the manifold, maybe try a small spacer for runner length. The 3M copper based anti seize works great for plugs especially for people who use to much since it insulates them less than the nickel based anti seize. Thanks again.
Was thinking the same thing about the heads. I was always told by an old engine builder, those peanut port heads caused major disruption on the intake side and were only worth running if it's all ya had. A brand new set of boat anchors!
Torque on a budget? What should have happened: Good valve job and a bit of bowl blend porting. Peanut ports are plenty for the job at hand. Simple dual plane manifold with a large vacuum secondary carb. Cam like a Lunati Voodoo 10110701 with 213/219 @ .050". Pistons with enough dome for 9.5 to 1 compression. Then there would be torque.
And they put in a bigger cam, 234/244🤔. A single plane with that cam is odd. A smaller cam below 220/XXX with an after market dual plane intake would be a low end torque monster.
Generally, EFI wants that single plenum, whether wet or dry, but the "signal" is going to be different than a carb, since it's not running off vacuum or atmospheric pressure above the venturis but what the computer determines from the ignition timing. single plane also allows for a more direct path for air to travel. consider GM's TPI system from the 1980's. it was a single plenum intake with long runners, made a lot of low RPM torque from 305 cid. of course, this EFI is hoping to fit every setup while GM designed TPI for a specific requirement.
Should have said screw the budget and went with small chamber afr 265 heads and went with a smaller cam like a summit 228/238 or even a 218/228. Would have made better torque everywhere than stock peanut ports
That is a lot of money for the results. Meaning the EFI system, Distributor kit, and rockers probably didn't add much value (results) compared to the cam and springs alone for a "budget" torque monster.
@@stevenhoitz9260 Low RPM is the bottom third of the throttle. Lots of American V8s redline in the low and mid 6s. A third of let's say 6500 is almost 2200rpm. However, I think lots of people would agree that it's 3000rpm and lower. Anything beyond that is mid or high throttle. Since this was a pickup motor, that's where it's likely to spend 80+% of it's life. Why move the power band out of where it's likely to live?
the easiest way to stab a cam in during a rebuild--before you put the crank and connecting rods in your way, stand your block up on its bellhousing side. Now let gravity help you drop the camshaft in vertically. you can even do this dry, and reach into the empty crankcase to slather on the lube. this way instead of dripping on the floor as you see here, it drips inside the crankcase where you want it. Bonus points, you can install the flat tappet lifters after rocking their base on flat surface to check they have the right taper after all. Now give the camshaft a spin. if the lifters aren't spinning in their lifter bores, you're on your way to wiping out the camshaft (and then complaining about it online). Measure their outside diameter to the ID of the lifter bore--use a brake cylinder hone to get the clearance you need. It's a lot easier to clean up any machine work when you don't have to dissasemble the entire reciprocating assembly.
Can you remove one of the spark plugs and install a Computer Interface Pressure Gauges to see the increase of the pressure at low speeds and high speeds also check the vacuum on various speeds.
Really?? I watched McFarland newest and it had over 5 min just promoting t shirts. These guys gotta pay the bills too. At least they promoted speed parts. Shit dude in blue had a add for male pattern baldness. 😂
They should get a F. The motor was to perform best below 3500 not a average up to 5000! A stroker kit could easily have been done for the cost of that FI and obviously a better cam than the one they chose. But Hey they did say both the kids were going into sales or marketing. So go figure they are not going to listen to the customers goal and will sell you what makes them the best $ and when you call them back its your fault you didn't install the cam correctly or the motor isn't tuned right etc etc with excuses. 🤣😥😭 Oh and nice touch with the SFI balancer on a low rpm motor. Guess that was a hint it wasn't going to be a low rpm motor.
i get the 450 hp 454 4 inch stroke for free so far this year i got 4 of them plus they come with the 02xx 400r turbo good to 800 hp from 6,000 to 58,000 miles on them then all they need is to breath a bigger carb and intake does wonders for them close to 600 hp i priced it at GM at it would cost me close to 15,000 for the set up because they come complete and ready to go the long block is 8,000 for it
Add in they put in an all new ignition system, but didn't do any timing control while going with fuel injection and a terrible fitech as well. Really this was just a long winded ad for people who have no idea what they should be buying.
You can tell from the gaskets that someone has been inside it. It's still typical of what you can still find in the junkyards and still running trucks. It's a leftover from another project. .40 over isn't much more than a typical rebuild.
Not to be a troll, but wasn't the point low end torque? Literally all the power it made on the new set up was about 3500 rpm and up l, which is all the upper part of the power curve. So for a truck motor which this was, ill take the old setup
@@towgod7985 I mean when I heard the only new part was a bigger cam I guessed they were gonna lose the low end grunt, I would of liked to see a stroker kit, I know not as cheap but they already had the motor completely torn down. I think bang for buck your not gonna beat the added torque of a longer piston stroke
Single plane manifold seems like an odd choice when looking for mid-range torque. I"d bet my lunch money a performer manifold with a throttle body EFI would have made noticeably more low to mid range torque............... which is really what they were looking for. I'm sure they knew that, but you gotta pimp the products your given LOL
I have watched since th beginning and even before this was engine power. But nothing on the 335 series ford engines. Would really like to see a 400 ford stroker or even a 351 cleavland stroker.
Can you guys put together a talldeck 454? 4 inch crank in a 427 talldeck block and show us the torque increase with the longer stroke over the standard deck. Having 600tq at 1600-1800 rpms would be nice for towing and efficiency.
@BillieWilliams-l6m use the 4 inch crankshaft out of a standard deck 454. Bore sizes are the same. A set of 6.535 rods and a 1.65 compression height 4.250 bore piston.
i got a 450 hp crate 454 with 4 inch stroke steel crank heavy rods high flow heads stock manifold 10.5 to 1 compression with a 02xx 400 r turbo good to 800 hp with 6,000 miles on it for free but not just one but 4 this years from 6,000 miles to 58.000 miles on them they just need to breath . i got a weidland high rise and a tunnel ram for a 100 bucks for both which are oval port set ups for the high flow heads like to port the valve and set up the heads for a bigger cam i have it in my pu all stock and it runs way better then my 396 from a 68 chevelle the tunnel ram is for my 79 z28 rs t top that i am going to build next after the 68 pu and 70 high boy i am working on now
after gapping the rings for our application.......we wont tell YOU what that is but just trust us. This is just one of the reasons corporate sponsored shows suck compared to independent ones.
Skipped ondy vitals with more in fuel injection, fastener's, and plugs then anything else. Couldn't even do a simple port match. Stock engine with money invested indy wrong thing's. Good job
I’m currently redoing two gen 5/ mark v bbc 454’s and I’m wondering is it better to buy a cam kit(cam lifters and timing set) or buy parts separately? It can be difficult matching parts up because of the number of options.
I'm in a big Ford engine fan. Would like to see them able to take a old school straight 6 300ci. As where bore it out to 302 with signal or Double old school Carbs with 2- 4/ bbl, Carbs or 2 - 2bbl carbs. Or if possible put in 1 cobra Jet set up on it. With 3/4 cams which where your able to use Unlead fuel with out adding lead Addative in the fuel. That would be cool to see something like that as well. I'm old school person from the baby boom era's. During the late 60s and the 70s also that early 80s we didn't have any sort of those types gadget for our engines. As EFI.
Big blocks beg for a supercharger. If you got room for a big block you got room for a centrifugal supercharger. Even just a few pounds is enough to awaken the beast.
I like to see a single turbo, with 8 lbs of boost, for towing 30 foot gooseneck trailer. Replace the peanut heads with oval port 049. Reduce the cam duration. I would only care about Torque 1500 - 4000 rpm, don't care about hp. Why is this NOT making over 500 foot/lbs?????
Going fuel injection because it’s easier than fixing and tuning a quadrajet. Which most 454’s had. I wish they would actually do a real life style build because that budget is not a realistic budget. Using 1.8 rockers on the intake would have made it more realistic too.
Anytime uall want to rebuild another 454 let me know , lol im retired with 2 broken necks so i dont do alot of stressing that neck . Its for my 1984 MH , still runs like a top but at 330hp & 470 ft.lbs. it could stand a bit more of Both. 34ft Holiday Rambler with tag axle , a rare and Still mint , 78k on the motor. Take care injoy watching uall build with all the cool parts !
OK so I understand that the efi company probably sent you a lot of sponsorship money but if you wanted to improve power and torque on a budget, why did you spend thousands on efi when you could have used that money to replace the "peanut port" heads and put a carb on it? Way more performance. Same amount of money.
@@jerrycoon3369 I build custom quad rail carbs for drag bikes, customize holley style 4 barrels for drag cars. And build a lot of 2 strokes for jet skis and restoring all the amazing motocross bikes of my youth. And I think some of us older guys romanticize "back in the day" and we forget how big of a pain in the ass they are. I make a pretty good amount of money because there's not a lot of people today that even know how to tune a carb correctly much mess build one. People forget buying a brand new car in the 70s and early 80s and still having to let it warm up for 15 minutes on a cold day while freezing their azz off before they can go anywhere. Or having to take the carburetor apart to tune it. And most guys forget about that because all the cars in their driveway are fuel injected and have been for over 20 years. As we get older we tend to forget about everything that sucked and we only remember all the good stuff that was fun. We remember what it was like to drive a new L88 corvette. (Just an example) but we forget how much of a pain in the ass it was to adjust the valves every 2-3 weeks. We forget about points ignition getting out of whack and causing the carb to burp fire and blow out the power valve. Or vacuum secondaries sticking and almost killing us despite pulling the gas pedal back. We even forget the little things like being late for work some days because that pos flooded out trying to crank it when the temperature was in the 20s and now you gotta change the oil because there's gas in it. We take for granted now that it can be freezing outside and we can jump in our cars, crank it and throw it into drive and go in less than a minute. And have been able to crank it and drive since 1986. We remember all the fun and none of the inconveniences. And the new technology is the reason that today we have small blocks that make over 1000hp on pump gas and get 20+mpg when back in the day 650hp was the ceiling plus you had to find a gas station that sold Sonoco 110 and get 8mpg. I'd probably forget the same way if I didn't specialize in building them. Today I can tune my cars engine and I don't even have to open the hood. And a lot of the show cars I've built back in the day are paying me today to throw an EFI system on them so they can enjoy them and drive them more.
@@worldssickestmedia2713 I don't disagree with anything you just said. I think you missed the point of my original comment. The point of the video was to make more torque and HP for the least amount of money. The first thing to jump out at anyone should be the "peanut port" heads. Some low end aluminum oval ports and the proper camshaft with a carb would make WAY more power and torque than what they ended up with. For about the same price as the efi setup.
I would never reuse bearings no matter how good of shape they are in! Also jack looks like the cop that drinks piss from a beer bottle in the movie "dumb and dumber". lol!!!
Would love to see a big block head comparison. I'm in the process of choosing heads . Afr , Brodix, trick floe , Flotec, My machinist says there is nothing wrong with floteks if they are set up right. They are a good price. AFR $2300 a piece. Dont want to spend that.
When I saw the cam that you chose, I laughed. It is completely mismatched to those junk peanut port heads. You should have at least pocket ported those heads. A slightly smaller cam would have been better (224/234 duration?). Decking the block and/or heads could have given you another 1/2 pt compression and another 20 ft lbs torque. I figured you left about 40 ft lbs of torque on the table.
210/213 is stock duration. So you're saying rocker arms would of really been the only advisable upgrade? Who swaps a came with less then 10 points of increased duration?? Lets be real. Whats the point? Youre just being knit picky now.
@@nasty3145A 224/234 would be about 14 degrees larger than stock (not 10 degrees) (still quite a bit for a daily driver tow machine.) and I would've done 1.8 rockers instead of the 1.7s. A modern camshaft with 224/234 and perhaps a 110 degree lobe sep angle wouldn've worked much better. I swapped my stock 6.0 LS cam for a stage 2 truck cam. That cam has about 12 degrees more duration than stock, and it will work great in the Blazer I am building. I also cammed my 455 trans am with a 224/224 roller cam, and I can smoke the tires from 50-100mph in 3rd gear (the turbos help). Read a few of David Vizzard's books and get back to me.
Main caps are very strong, especially on a street motor even two bolt mains won’t fatigue, and you have to making serious serious power to fatigue 4 bolt mains.
@@stephenkrambeck6589 Sure, but my thought was if your there wouldn't it be beneficial to change them? Maybe it's not a simple task. Do they have to re-measure or something? I just don't know.
To replace a whole set of main caps, or even just the center three to upgrade a small block to four bolt main, you install the new mains then hone the line bore to roundness and/or a certain size. So it’s usually gonna have to be bigger than stock making proper bearing clearance more difficult. And like I said they’re very strong, unless you’ve drastically upgraded power the main caps aren’t going to fail. I guess I could equate it too wheels? You buy a new car and sure the wheel could be fatigued or cracked but no ones gonna replace wheels or main caps just in case like you would an old seal.
Poor thing is crying for more compression! Could have at least used shim head gaskets. Cam is way too big that's why they advanced the shit out of it. Not a good advertisement for UNOH
What's stronger? 6 bolt main caps? Or the stitches holding Pat's pocket?
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🤘
🤣🤣🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣
Nice 😂😂😂🤣😂🤣🤣🤣🤣
We need answers!!!!!!
😂😂😂😂
Great to see the young ones coming into the trade. They did a good job on the big block.
Finally! A low rpm big block video!! Please build and dyno an 8100 vortec! I know the market is limited but the more ppl build em the more parts will come out! Gen 7 BBC is the best one!
it definitely isnt. weak bottom ends and poor flowing heads coupled with poor parts selection.
@@juliennacer8871 you are rite
Dude that would be a super cool engine to build! I don't see them often so it would be a breath of fresh air for sure.
Pocket porting, valve job, cam, headers, tune adds 100hp and looks almost stock.
@@juliennacer8871 pretty funny they managed to build quite literally the exact opposite of what they intended lol
Man, it's so awesome they used students to help out. Talk about being a great opportunity for them as well as helping them with a career
Not sure what you guys were thinking here. 234/244 is a poor cam selection for a torque/towing application, as seen on the dyno, low end suffers with this approach. And the EFI is expensive, I don't know which FiTech kit you are using, but the Easy Street 600HP master kit is $1200.
With the same or less money, for a towing application I would go with a hydraulic roller upgrade, it will have less duration but higher lift than a flat tappet, something like a 206/212 @0.50. At most 212/218@0.50. The lower duration will keep the torque curve down low. And just use a simple 600cfm carb with vacuum secondaries. Use a knockoff air-gap manifold and phenolic spacer to keep the carb from boiling over after those long uphills towing.
@@bigboreracing356 if you're paying, sure let's swap the truck to a 12 valve and use the 454 for a drag car that we have yet to acquire.
lol 600cfm carb? 454's want at least 750CFM, 600 is for a 350...
Great suggestions! They need to give the cost of the upgrades they did. Why not roll in new bearings since the engine was torn down?
@@stormwolfgames6636 we're talking low end torque here, not 6000 rpms. 600 cfm is more than enough for a heavy towing or motorhome application that only revs to 4500. With peanut port heads and a stock cam you will not get more power with a 750cfm carb.
@@JimBronson I know I have peanut port heads, I have always used and been told to use no lower than 750cfm. I have used both 750 and 800. You will open up your top end a little more at a small sacrifice of bottom end, considering these motors are swapped into half tons all the time it's not such a bad idea. I have seen many forums guys try running under 750 with stock 454 they always run in to problems. My stock qjet that came with the truck is 750 at least and if you do your research all qjets for 454s were 750 or 800cfm. Even 650 is too low for a 454.
I'm not a TV watcher, but when I was, I loved all of these series. I hope that my subscription and watches help you do more of these programs.
Pat is an excellant mechanic.he can teach you a lot.
The 8.1 has over 400 tq from 1400-3400 rpms. The cam they used put too much dip into the torque curve.
8.1 are junk
@@Wanous-hv7zo anyone who knows about the 8.1 knows the only things that need replaced are the stock Rods and Pistons. Better design over the Gen 6 454 and the only casting better comes from world products. You can't use a Gen 6 454 to get 572 or 632. But you can from an 8.1 496 tall deck.
The cam was to big for low end torque.
@@bladenrexroth2555 you would you want to use a gen 6 anyways. the gen 2 is the way to go for pretty much anything. stock rebuilds all the way up to 600 cubic inch 1,800hp turbo builds. they're was more common, way cheaper and have a WAY bigger aftermarket compared to the 8.1. i don't even know if id considered a set heads and a few different cams an aftermarket.
I've always liked this show because it's always a budget build and always around 350-400hp. And even when they do blow the bank it's like 600hp. It makes me feel safe. 😆
my stock 454 has 450 hp and it was free with 6,000 miles on it with a 02xx 400r turbo good to 800 hp so far 4 just this year plus it has the 4 inch stroke instead of the 4 1/4 inch stroke
No $ were given on their "budget" upgrades
Y’all need to watch Richard Holdner’s videos. For the price of those roller rockers you could have picked up a set of Gen VI rectangle port heads that would have made 60 more HP and more torque due to higher compression and better flow. The stock rockets would work fine up to around 6500 rpm. Pat should know that.
Its the chambers that increase compression not the ports. A street motor dont need rec heads ovals will work just fine long as there not peanut ports.
@@BigUnk85 I agree. You can actually lose HP by running too big a head on a motor like this.
@@countryrebel01 exactly
Agreed
@@BigUnk85
I didn’t say the ports increase compression. I said the Gen 6 Rec port heads flowed better and would increase compression. Better airflow and more compression equals more power. The best recipe for any motor is the right combination with the best airflow possible. For a street motor the recipe is sufficient cubic inches, good amount of compression, mild cam and the most air flow possible. The mild cam let’s you make power down low and the airflow allows a broad power band and that gives you good driveability.
I've been running the same distributor in my 396 68 Camaro for 3 years still working great
Tell me I'm wrong but you said camshaft and took out the crank hahaha love the video!
Great vid but if I did all that in my garage and only found 12-15 ftlbs of torque i would be disappointed, just a camshaft in my 455 Buick brought it up over 500 torque. Glad to see the young men taking up the trade and bringing business and marketing to the table!
Love my 1970 Buick 455
Pontiac too.
I understand what you mean about not gaining a lot of torque being disappointing, but if you look at the torque lines it is a huge improvement. The stock torque line just falls off after hitting peak. The new cam has a torque line that runs evenly across the graph. That is the big gain there. A very long torque range.
That Generation is notoriously low on CR. That's one of the biggest reasons the 454SS was such a dog. Those heads don't help either. Except for the Fitech, this is a really inexpensive build that won't hurt reliability.
I appreciate the episode and sharing the build with the guests. The Total Seal rings are good stuff. I think a pair of used budget friendly L29 Vortec heads, would get the build to one HP per CI and match the intake ports better. I'd add a rear water crossover if there isn't one cast in the manifold, maybe try a small spacer for runner length. The 3M copper based anti seize works great for plugs especially for people who use to much since it insulates them less than the nickel based anti seize. Thanks again.
Was thinking the same thing about the heads. I was always told by an old engine builder, those peanut port heads caused major disruption on the intake side and were only worth running if it's all ya had. A brand new set of boat anchors!
Torque on a budget? What should have happened: Good valve job and a bit of bowl blend porting. Peanut ports are plenty for the job at hand. Simple dual plane manifold with a large vacuum secondary carb. Cam like a Lunati Voodoo 10110701 with 213/219 @ .050". Pistons with enough dome for 9.5 to 1 compression. Then there would be torque.
Yessir. Maybe cut the heads down for a smidge more compression and tighter l.s.a
By the time u do all that and buy pistons u could just buy aftermarket aluminum heads and be done more power less weight
I love this show on rebuilding Motors like this and high- performance
They said they were trying to build it for bottom end torque and then put a single plane intake?
And they put in a bigger cam, 234/244🤔. A single plane with that cam is odd. A smaller cam below 220/XXX with an after market dual plane intake would be a low end torque monster.
Yea a proper hash video but at least gives beginners a look inside an engine
Generally, EFI wants that single plenum, whether wet or dry, but the "signal" is going to be different than a carb, since it's not running off vacuum or atmospheric pressure above the venturis but what the computer determines from the ignition timing. single plane also allows for a more direct path for air to travel. consider GM's TPI system from the 1980's. it was a single plenum intake with long runners, made a lot of low RPM torque from 305 cid. of course, this EFI is hoping to fit every setup while GM designed TPI for a specific requirement.
Should have said screw the budget and went with small chamber afr 265 heads and went with a smaller cam like a summit 228/238 or even a 218/228. Would have made better torque everywhere than stock peanut ports
The pens in the pocket almost resemble ranks and experience level. More pens/clipped items=accolades and experience
That is a lot of money for the results. Meaning the EFI system, Distributor kit, and rockers probably didn't add much value (results) compared to the cam and springs alone for a "budget" torque monster.
Right! Then they pushed the torque out another 1500+ RPM. That's not much of a low rpm torquer any more.
@@joetalley192 Below 5000 isn't low RPM?
@@stevenhoitz9260 hahaha not quite
@@joetalley192 That is an interesting theory. What do you consider low RPM?
@@stevenhoitz9260 Low RPM is the bottom third of the throttle. Lots of American V8s redline in the low and mid 6s. A third of let's say 6500 is almost 2200rpm. However, I think lots of people would agree that it's 3000rpm and lower. Anything beyond that is mid or high throttle. Since this was a pickup motor, that's where it's likely to spend 80+% of it's life. Why move the power band out of where it's likely to live?
The ratio of content to ad spots is getting a bit out of whack.
The show has to be paid for.
the easiest way to stab a cam in during a rebuild--before you put the crank and connecting rods in your way, stand your block up on its bellhousing side. Now let gravity help you drop the camshaft in vertically. you can even do this dry, and reach into the empty crankcase to slather on the lube. this way instead of dripping on the floor as you see here, it drips inside the crankcase where you want it. Bonus points, you can install the flat tappet lifters after rocking their base on flat surface to check they have the right taper after all. Now give the camshaft a spin. if the lifters aren't spinning in their lifter bores, you're on your way to wiping out the camshaft (and then complaining about it online). Measure their outside diameter to the ID of the lifter bore--use a brake cylinder hone to get the clearance you need. It's a lot easier to clean up any machine work when you don't have to dissasemble the entire reciprocating assembly.
Unfortunately it lost a ton of power below 3500 rpm, where most trucks run everyday
First thing i thought about when they listed cam specs......they are still in HP mode. They need to knock about 10 degrees out of that cam....
@@robtdougherty more like 20 degrees for a towing application. You need torque off idle.
I searched the specs on summit and the only 2 cams that come up are extreme marine grinds 11-240-4 and 11-240-20
Keep in mind that the big block isn’t running wide open throttle all day every day! The torque curve you base your comment on is at WOT.
Left some power on table with 112 lobe Sep with those peanut port heads
Can you remove one of the spark plugs and install a Computer Interface Pressure Gauges to see the increase of the pressure at low speeds and high speeds also check the vacuum on various speeds.
wow! that new curve!!! bet that motor pulls in every gear!!!!!!! and the reliability
The called Pat sir! Respect!
A little Clay Smith HR cam would put torque well over 500+ lbxft! 221/235@0.050’
If there was anymore advertising there wouldn't be any show.
Really?? I watched McFarland newest and it had over 5 min just promoting t shirts. These guys gotta pay the bills too. At least they promoted speed parts. Shit dude in blue had a add for male pattern baldness. 😂
They should get a F. The motor was to perform best below 3500 not a average up to 5000! A stroker kit could easily have been done for the cost of that FI and obviously a better cam than the one they chose. But Hey they did say both the kids were going into sales or marketing. So go figure they are not going to listen to the customers goal and will sell you what makes them the best $ and when you call them back its your fault you didn't install the cam correctly or the motor isn't tuned right etc etc with excuses. 🤣😥😭 Oh and nice touch with the SFI balancer on a low rpm motor. Guess that was a hint it wasn't going to be a low rpm motor.
I thought the same, FItech too :/
i get the 450 hp 454 4 inch stroke for free so far this year i got 4 of them plus they come with the 02xx 400r turbo good to 800 hp from 6,000 to 58,000 miles on them then all they need is to breath a bigger carb and intake does wonders for them close to 600 hp i priced it at GM at it would cost me close to 15,000 for the set up because they come complete and ready to go the long block is 8,000 for it
Add in they put in an all new ignition system, but didn't do any timing control while going with fuel injection and a terrible fitech as well. Really this was just a long winded ad for people who have no idea what they should be buying.
@@beilno2890 i agree 100%
A cam smaller than a 220/XXX with an aftermarket dual plane intake would have been a better setup for low end torque.
Did you break in that cam? what about zinc for those flat tappets?
Not sure you can call this a "Stock" engine upgrade when you can see it has .040" aftermarket pistons already in it.
i was wondering about those pistons myself lol
You can tell from the gaskets that someone has been inside it. It's still typical of what you can still find in the junkyards and still running trucks. It's a leftover from another project. .40 over isn't much more than a typical rebuild.
I seen that 2 lol
Did you see the power it made? Stock!!! Damned thing can't hardly get out of it's own way!!
If you want low end power, torque, why make it a high reving engine to peak it?
They already blow the tires off just off idle, but falls off in the top end. Soooo
@@brysonshires9742. They said they wanted more low end torque, not mid and top end.
@@bri-manhunter2654 as if they're not already getting both🙄
@@brysonshires9742. I agree, but like I already stated, they said they wanted more low end and not mid range.
@@bri-manhunter2654 nah your argument is pointless. If they're getting a gain across the entire power band its a win win. Period
Wouldn't new rings need the bores get honed, or at least deglazed?
Cheap pistons could have been installed and raised up compression a bit for more power. I mean cheap.
Decking the heads and/or the block would be a fairly cheap way also.
ANOTHER! High Rpm torque motor! !!! What's the point?
Wasn't the objective to raise lower end power and torque????
You are right. If they were trying to what they said then they made it worse than it was before they started.
Not to be a troll, but wasn't the point low end torque? Literally all the power it made on the new set up was about 3500 rpm and up l, which is all the upper part of the power curve. So for a truck motor which this was, ill take the old setup
Thank you, this has been my complaint about these engine builds for a long time, a street torque motor at 5000 rpm is an oxymoron!
@@towgod7985 I mean when I heard the only new part was a bigger cam I guessed they were gonna lose the low end grunt, I would of liked to see a stroker kit, I know not as cheap but they already had the motor completely torn down. I think bang for buck your not gonna beat the added torque of a longer piston stroke
this entire video was a waste of time, mostly just an advertisement
🧌
Single plane manifold seems like an odd choice when looking for mid-range torque. I"d bet my lunch money a performer manifold with a throttle body EFI would have made noticeably more low to mid range torque............... which is really what they were looking for. I'm sure they knew that, but you gotta pimp the products your given LOL
Long live unoh 2007 graduate my hero’s there where Morgan Higgins and McPherson I pray they are still there!!!!
Professor Pat Topolinski .....class is in session
I thought you were doing a low rpm torque build, why did you go with a healthy 234/244 duration🤔, that is more of a mid range cam.
I'm going with the 6bolt main caps!
Anyone else watching Frankie's growing pocket protector collection?
I totally noticed lol. I actually had to pause the video to examine his new shirt pocket collection.
Good show, too bad that new intake manifold did not match the heads better, giving up power there for sure.
I have watched since th beginning and even before this was engine power. But nothing on the 335 series ford engines. Would really like to see a 400 ford stroker or even a 351 cleavland stroker.
They keep talking about budget minded build then put a efi system on the engine . Much much more money .
anyone else wonder what they pulled that motor from? did i miss it? looks like a little manufactured patina to me..
I think they said an 80s Chevy but I though the HD 454s had black valve covers
That's the fakes patina I've ever seen lol
It's got flattops in it deffo not stock motor
@@Harrybowles1969 those are the stock 80's big block pistons
@@WestSandyAutomotive fake as can be man. That was a low run time remanufactured engine all day
Baaamm! Major key! Attitude and effort! Awesome 👏👍👍🙏🏽
Can you guys put together a talldeck 454? 4 inch crank in a 427 talldeck block and show us the torque increase with the longer stroke over the standard deck. Having 600tq at 1600-1800 rpms would be nice for towing and efficiency.
Tell me more.
I have a Tall deck 454 cid.
What is the best crankshaft stroke measurement???
@BillieWilliams-l6m use the 4 inch crankshaft out of a standard deck 454. Bore sizes are the same. A set of 6.535 rods and a 1.65 compression height 4.250 bore piston.
Can you guys rebuild a performance cummins? Or powerstroke? Or duramax? Something diesel related instead of gas?
Nice job lads
i got a 450 hp crate 454 with 4 inch stroke steel crank heavy rods high flow heads stock manifold 10.5 to 1 compression with a 02xx 400 r turbo good to 800 hp with 6,000 miles on it for free but not just one but 4 this years from 6,000 miles to 58.000 miles on them they just need to breath . i got a weidland high rise and a tunnel ram for a 100 bucks for both which are oval port set ups for the high flow heads like to port the valve and set up the heads for a bigger cam i have it in my pu all stock and it runs way better then my 396 from a 68 chevelle the tunnel ram is for my 79 z28 rs t top that i am going to build next after the 68 pu and 70 high boy i am working on now
after gapping the rings for our application.......we wont tell YOU what that is but just trust us. This is just one of the reasons corporate sponsored shows suck compared to independent ones.
Came out good guys 💪🏾💪🏾
The torque two cam with intake gets you 565 ft of torque and 480 hp on 89 octane. With a eldbrock 800 cfm carbonator .
I have a 454 in my 84 k5 i want to build up. Has an 8" lift. I also have an 88 chevy dually i will pull the 454 to put a 6ltr ls in for fuel mileage.
Skipped ondy vitals with more in fuel injection, fastener's, and plugs then anything else. Couldn't even do a simple port match. Stock engine with money invested indy wrong thing's. Good job
My favorite for low end torque is my 1970 Buick 455
500 lbs/ft
I got 1971 Buick centurion 455 👑
I’m currently redoing two gen 5/ mark v bbc 454’s and I’m wondering is it better to buy a cam kit(cam lifters and timing set) or buy parts separately? It can be difficult matching parts up because of the number of options.
Mate, do you have enough pens in that pocket?
I would have ponied up for a hydraulic roller but that's still a good truck motor right thar.
not a good truck motor, lost torque under 3500 compared to where it was before they opened it up.
Don't the E3 plugs need to be indexed?
I'm in a big Ford engine fan. Would like to see them able to take a old school straight 6 300ci. As where bore it out to 302 with signal or Double old school Carbs with 2- 4/ bbl, Carbs or 2 - 2bbl carbs. Or if possible put in 1 cobra Jet set up on it. With 3/4 cams which where your able to use Unlead fuel with out adding lead Addative in the fuel. That would be cool to see something like that as well. I'm old school person from the baby boom era's. During the late 60s and the 70s also that early 80s we didn't have any sort of those types gadget for our engines. As EFI.
Whats a 3/4 cam?
They did a decent job on this one a while back
ruclips.net/video/bSTxCfuhIAk/видео.html
Cheap heads likely would be better than a cam and rockers. It's all about flowing more air.
How much was spent? An ebay turbo kit and a stall converter may have been a good bit cheaper
very nice engine wondering what the compression ratio is
Great job
Great vid!!!!!!!!!!
Should have done a 3 angle grind and flowed the heads. Then you would have made a lot more power.
How will flowing the heads make more power?
@@centraltexasfoxbodies Flowing the heads can make more power by the information it provides. Thanks.
@@grabir01 flowing the heads won't gain any power, it just tells you what the heads will flow.
@@centraltexasfoxbodies it would have informed a more appropriate cam selection at least.
@@JimBronson the bigger the better!!
No you're correct a huge cam would hurt power with low flowing heads, an rv cam would've been a good choice
Pulled my 454 out of my 1 ton installed a small block 396 with more torque and hp than my 454 for pulling my trailer up the hills in my southern state
WHAT WOULD BE THE BEST RV CAM WITH OUT CHANGING VALVE SPRINGS???
Just here for my dose of big block chevy
Big blocks beg for a supercharger. If you got room for a big block you got room for a centrifugal supercharger. Even just a few pounds is enough to awaken the beast.
Can you provide the information on the products that you used such as the sealants and the extreme pressure lubricants part numbers
Not interested. But, definitely check out the gizmo plugs and nicely painted EFI. Bring your primary and backup credit cards.
That 305 hp with headers. Try it with some stock exhaust manifolds, then the headers, then the rest.
neet trick with the rings if it really works
Why was the heads not ported/polished also? Free power. ?????
Looks like you put a marine cam in this engine a 11-240-4 known as a XM278H power 2000-6200.
I like to see a single turbo, with 8 lbs of boost, for towing 30 foot gooseneck trailer. Replace the peanut heads with oval port 049. Reduce the cam duration.
I would only care about Torque 1500 - 4000 rpm, don't care about hp.
Why is this NOT making over 500 foot/lbs?????
Going fuel injection because it’s easier than fixing and tuning a quadrajet. Which most 454’s had. I wish they would actually do a real life style build because that budget is not a realistic budget. Using 1.8 rockers on the intake would have made it more realistic too.
Anytime uall want to rebuild another 454 let me know , lol im retired with 2 broken necks so i dont do alot of stressing that neck . Its for my 1984 MH , still runs like a top but at 330hp & 470 ft.lbs. it could stand a bit more of Both. 34ft Holiday Rambler with tag axle , a rare and Still mint , 78k on the motor. Take care injoy watching uall build with all the cool parts !
Try to look up a video on 454 motorhome. The guys from motor trend did a top end kit on a 454 and did way better than this one
@@bryanhoward226 thanks
ruclips.net/video/JG438976rK8/видео.html
@@bryanhoward226 thanks again 👍
No problem at all
Which is better? Fitech or holley sniper 2? For daily
Nice concept. Not executed well =as in cheap low rpm high tq pieces and tricks. Nice to see some young guns at the shop
OK so I understand that the efi company probably sent you a lot of sponsorship money but if you wanted to improve power and torque on a budget, why did you spend thousands on efi when you could have used that money to replace the "peanut port" heads and put a carb on it? Way more performance. Same amount of money.
Because unless your building a race car carburetors are dumb. And this thing isn't going into any race car. Not with 390hp.
@@worldssickestmedia2713 I disagree. If you know how to tune a carb they are awesome. Most people don't.
@@jerrycoon3369 I build custom quad rail carbs for drag bikes, customize holley style 4 barrels for drag cars. And build a lot of 2 strokes for jet skis and restoring all the amazing motocross bikes of my youth. And I think some of us older guys romanticize "back in the day" and we forget how big of a pain in the ass they are. I make a pretty good amount of money because there's not a lot of people today that even know how to tune a carb correctly much mess build one. People forget buying a brand new car in the 70s and early 80s and still having to let it warm up for 15 minutes on a cold day while freezing their azz off before they can go anywhere. Or having to take the carburetor apart to tune it. And most guys forget about that because all the cars in their driveway are fuel injected and have been for over 20 years. As we get older we tend to forget about everything that sucked and we only remember all the good stuff that was fun. We remember what it was like to drive a new L88 corvette. (Just an example) but we forget how much of a pain in the ass it was to adjust the valves every 2-3 weeks. We forget about points ignition getting out of whack and causing the carb to burp fire and blow out the power valve. Or vacuum secondaries sticking and almost killing us despite pulling the gas pedal back. We even forget the little things like being late for work some days because that pos flooded out trying to crank it when the temperature was in the 20s and now you gotta change the oil because there's gas in it. We take for granted now that it can be freezing outside and we can jump in our cars, crank it and throw it into drive and go in less than a minute. And have been able to crank it and drive since 1986. We remember all the fun and none of the inconveniences. And the new technology is the reason that today we have small blocks that make over 1000hp on pump gas and get 20+mpg when back in the day 650hp was the ceiling plus you had to find a gas station that sold Sonoco 110 and get 8mpg. I'd probably forget the same way if I didn't specialize in building them. Today I can tune my cars engine and I don't even have to open the hood. And a lot of the show cars I've built back in the day are paying me today to throw an EFI system on them so they can enjoy them and drive them more.
@@worldssickestmedia2713 I don't disagree with anything you just said. I think you missed the point of my original comment. The point of the video was to make more torque and HP for the least amount of money. The first thing to jump out at anyone should be the "peanut port" heads. Some low end aluminum oval ports and the proper camshaft with a carb would make WAY more power and torque than what they ended up with. For about the same price as the efi setup.
I’ve never pulled a crank to do a cam before
I would never reuse bearings no matter how good of shape they are in! Also jack looks like the cop that drinks piss from a beer bottle in the movie "dumb and dumber". lol!!!
Would love to see a big block head comparison. I'm in the process of choosing heads . Afr , Brodix, trick floe , Flotec, My machinist says there is nothing wrong with floteks if they are set up right. They are a good price. AFR $2300 a piece. Dont want to spend that.
The best three are: 1.) AFR , 2) AFR, and 3) AFR. Pick one of those, and your golden.
Richard Holdener has many bbc head comparisons...
I noticed you were using FiTech on your big block. How do I get mine to decel as fast as a carburetor. Mine takes too long to idle down between shifts
Would be nice if they had a exact link to the parts used. Not just to the manufactures links....
When I saw the cam that you chose, I laughed. It is completely mismatched to those junk peanut port heads. You should have at least pocket ported those heads. A slightly smaller cam would have been better (224/234 duration?). Decking the block and/or heads could have given you another 1/2 pt compression and another 20 ft lbs torque. I figured you left about 40 ft lbs of torque on the table.
What cam would you recommend for a bare Bones stock oval port 454
210/213 is stock duration. So you're saying rocker arms would of really been the only advisable upgrade? Who swaps a came with less then 10 points of increased duration?? Lets be real. Whats the point? Youre just being knit picky now.
@@nasty3145A 224/234 would be about 14 degrees larger than stock (not 10 degrees) (still quite a bit for a daily driver tow machine.) and I would've done 1.8 rockers instead of the 1.7s. A modern camshaft with 224/234 and perhaps a 110 degree lobe sep angle wouldn've worked much better. I swapped my stock 6.0 LS cam for a stage 2 truck cam. That cam has about 12 degrees more duration than stock, and it will work great in the Blazer I am building. I also cammed my 455 trans am with a 224/224 roller cam, and I can smoke the tires from 50-100mph in 3rd gear (the turbos help). Read a few of David Vizzard's books and get back to me.
@@chrismunson7899 Can you tell me more about the application?
@@CrankAddict is going into a street truck want to make more power and torque won't be towing or anything like that
That’s a lotta money to spend for only 22 foot pounds of torque, and there’s less torque at the bottom which is worst for a street/tow application.
You don't need oil additives if you use the proper oil to begin with, just keep it clean.
Please do a v6
How many cc's is the small dish in the center of the piston?
Great video. Need a engine with lots of power for my c10 😂. 👍 👌
Just doing a 454 for my 69c10 can't wait for spring time
Is crankcase evac so close to the O2 sensor going to potentially mess with sensor accuracy? Not very far downstream...
Not an engine builder but wouldn't it be beneficial to replace mains when apart? Even on a budget?
Main caps are very strong, especially on a street motor even two bolt mains won’t fatigue, and you have to making serious serious power to fatigue 4 bolt mains.
@@stephenkrambeck6589 Sure, but my thought was if your there wouldn't it be beneficial to change them? Maybe it's not a simple task. Do they have to re-measure or something? I just don't know.
To replace a whole set of main caps, or even just the center three to upgrade a small block to four bolt main, you install the new mains then hone the line bore to roundness and/or a certain size. So it’s usually gonna have to be bigger than stock making proper bearing clearance more difficult. And like I said they’re very strong, unless you’ve drastically upgraded power the main caps aren’t going to fail. I guess I could equate it too wheels? You buy a new car and sure the wheel could be fatigued or cracked but no ones gonna replace wheels or main caps just in case like you would an old seal.
@@stephenkrambeck6589 he’s talking about the bearing inserts you dud.
Poor thing is crying for more compression! Could have at least used shim head gaskets. Cam is way too big that's why they advanced the shit out of it. Not a good advertisement for UNOH
You should install the cam first. You can guide both ends instead of one on big blocks that way.