It's also the realization of the greater picture behind who the princess is and why she is important. His desire to slay the princess is a desire to rid the world of death. But what is life without death. The endless pointless feast and games illustrate the dissolutionment that has been manifested for the narrator. He finally gets his wish and realizes it wasn't what he thought it would be. That death is a vital part of the universe. And to put an end to it would not actually be a better world. His purpose is gone, and therefore, so is he.
@@오주환-b1nWell actually.... Some change. We were both one god and the narrator split us in two. While doing so he also made sure each of us had a small part of each other. So since we have a part of her within us, change will still exist. Just enough to allow people to grow and move but at the same time they'll forget everything that happened and keep repeating it. Kind of like a twisted Groundhog Day.
@reubensalter8125 that's probably why he gets so depressed here this is just a step above what he planned for the rest of all life. If it's this bad for him and them, why would he want this on people he actually cares for.
@@EldritchObserver3301so the guy has multiple personalities talking to him while his wife actually changes personalities based on whatever happens, I hope the guy doesn't encounter fury too often
He used to be one of my favorite voices, because I thought he was funny. Now? I *hate* him. So much. I have suffered through toxic relationships in the past. I have been both the Happy Ending Smitten, and I have been his victim. Happy Ending Smitten is the past me that I DESPISE. Happy Ending Smitten is my past partner's abuse that I''ve yet to heal from fully. What I mean to say is, this game is a masterpiece (A game/movie/book doesn't have to be "fun" to be one). Even more so now, after the update.
@@Lady_in_Yearning Wholeheartedly agreed. When I came upon this route, I was thinking it would lead to some middle-ground between TSM and TLQ. The edge of the coin, the secret third option. I appreciated his presence at the Thorn route, with bad blood being water under the bridge and distrust transmuted into a deep connection. But the moment the Smitten spoke about "Showing the contents of our hearts" it was one of the biggest red flags I ever saw. The more his Shadow lingered over the situation, the more I saw of myself from times long past. Yet even with that reflection there was also a sense of happiness that I've grown, that I have become so much more than how I was then. To look upon the scars around my heart and finally realize just how well those wounds have actually healed. The Princess and the Dragon did the exact same thing. To perceive yourself as a hero saving the day, yet from the other's perspective you're the dragon that is the source of your imprisonment and pain. A valuable perspective to explore. If there is one thing the 'Happy Ending' perfectly exemplifies, is that a painful truth is better than honeyed lies.
@@Lady_in_Yearning Hey, I'd like to genuinely ask for some advice, since you said that you were like the smitten from this route in the past and also the victim, I'd like to know, how can I stop being like him? I can't see exactly what is wrong in the things he does, but i know for sure that there is _something_ wrong. I see a lot of myself in him and how I act/treat some people. I genuinely want to change and not be like him, but I don't have any idea how. any advice would help, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you for reading this far.
@@Chynoach The very fact you want to change is already a step in the right direction (arguably the most important one). Giving more concrete advice is more difficult, since I don't really know you or your situation. The best I can do is to give advice based on my personal experience. When a person grows up in a... not-healthy environment (let's put it that way), it can make us desperate to not be alone, to do whatever it takes to please, and to stay together at all times. Problem is, that can suffocate our partner, and turn us into a toxic one. It is important to give your partner/s space and respect their personal boundaries while at the same time establishing and protecting your own. In the end, honest and open communication is key. It's ok to be vulnerable with your partner and admit your fears and flaws (chances are, some of them turn out to not even be flaws at all). It's not a guarantee that that relationship will last, of course. Some people are just incompatible, and that's ok too. I sincerely hope at least some of this will prove useful, and that you get to dance under the stars❤🩹(genuine)
@@Lady_in_YearningThank you so much for the kind words!! I'll definitely try giving them more space. It sucks that trying to communicate about what our boundaries are might also be seen as "lingering" and suffocating, so it's kind of a shot in the dark, but I guess just giving more space and time regardless should be better than keeping things the way they are. Thank you so much for the help!! Really appreciate it. Wish you the best. Just got a message back from her as I was writing this. I hope things go well this time
God, seeing the narrator finally realize the horrors he put you and the princess through now that the shoes on the other foot is actually a little heartbreaking. Just hearing his voice slowly fill with depression as the princess slowly spills out the truth feels way too genuine
(Spoilers) I think It’s more then that,I think he’s really getting a taste of what his “saved” world would look like for the rest of humanity no change no transformation, and no hope of things getting better or stopping just being trapped in a prison of repetition.
@@cristaltophat But the important thing is we'd enjoy it. Well not us but the people of the narrator's world would - they're all on the brink of death. They'd want something to keep them going, even if it is the same thing over and over. It's better than oblivion to them.
20:12 the slow realization of the Narrator as he starts to see the flaws in his worldview, that something eternal and unchanging can't stay good forever
Technically, Princess is a mortal, but countless or infinite versions of Princess are taken away by Shifting Mound who represents concept of change, which has potential to be unchanging and eternal once she and the Player slip into the infinite plane.
And someone in the comment saying they wish Smitten appear in the dancing and finally saying some genuine true smitten beuty, but the reply saying that the Smitten not appear is perfect because he say that the last torch indicate that the smitten accepted and disappear. made me fantasyses/imagining that "Smitten, standing in the cabin, looking at you and the princess dancing in open space, in under the night sea of star." "You two are" "Dancing, Smiling, Laughing." "He is" "Staring, smiling, saying" Voice of the Smitten "I am proud of you"
@navalinomilzamashshidqi5384 Awww, that's adorable 🥹 Also, I think you were talking about my comment! Someone said they wished he had shown up in the dance, and I replied to them saying the last flame going out represents him finally letting go. And that he would be proud of us dancing with her under the stars. I legit cried so much at the end and I still and always will love Smitten, not just as a character, but also as a person. (I've done a big analysis on his personality in my head so I just can't ever hate him lol)
Okay, _holy shit_ . New absolute favorite route alert. GOD the way Narrator just. Give up by the end. But not in a "clearly I can't change your mind ugh" way but in a "I saw a glimpse of what my ideal world would be and it is not what I want" way. How as the same meal becomes repulsive, the same game becomes numbing, the same routine repeating over and over again, the Narrator realized there's a reason why Change exists, and why killing the embodiment of Change itself is just dooming the world in This. An eternity of stagnation and pretending to be okay with that stagnation. Holy shit the writing of this game...
@@cristaltophat yeah, that one considered this Narrator to be delusional. It’s sad how one Narrator managed to see the truth with his own eyes and realize the mistake in his ideal world, yet that realization would fade away while the remaining Narrators remain stuck in their delusions
The thing about Smitten is that he's not just "in love". Love can turn into obsession if left unchecked and uncontrolled, and that's exactly what happens here. Smitten can be quite intimidating and powerful with how he's able to override control of the Hero/Quiet's body. He's overbearing with his love for the Princess. Just look at the shadow of the Smitten looming over her, he towers over her and smothers her by doing so many "nice" things for her. Yes, he made the cabin into a castle, gave the Princess an even more elaborate dress and crown, but she is practically drowning in his presence. When she gets upset despite everything the Smitten does for her, she immediately regrets feeling that way because she probably feels like she isn't allowed to feel that way. How could you be upset when someone does so much for you? Smitten makes the Princess feel pressured to be the perfect lover with everything he does for her, and although they're done with good intentions, it's really not helping anymore. This kind of love results in a lot of pressure that results in the relationship and the people in it falling apart.
@@reicho3034 I agree with everything youve said here but,a small fraction of me was hoping he wouldnt go THAT far,but nonetheless he does,and the way the whole situation plays out as a result is utterly heartbreaking, im really not suprised the narrator just decided to stop fighting after he saw what he was doing to both Quiet/Princess through smittens abuse, that or after just seeing the situation as a whole,no clue what could of been going through his head honestly.
@@laxzazazaza8278 Even the word smitten is almost synonymous to “obsession”. He’s infatuated with her, but he loved her so much that he unintentionally hurt her, hugged and squeezed her so tight until she broke under the pressure of “trying to reciprocate better”.
this new ending made me so sad and yet felt so utterly fulfilled. as someone who refused to kill the princess the first time around, and then still refused to kill her, it makes me so happy that at the very end, despite her forced pandering and despair, that she was finally able to say what *she* wanted. that dance under the stars was indeed beautiful. im glad she found her peace. i love this game.
@@stghost825 I wouldn't call it somber (because I don't think it is personally, it is indeed fulfilling) and it's definitely not a Moment of Clarity. Because here we're not an object, nor a tool, and we are what we always have been - us, formed by clear and not-jaded memories.
It's what I always felt was missing from the damsel root. You can deconstruct her by asking what she wants but this route lets her actually say what she wants.
@@seekingabsolution1907 Damsel does say what she wants from the get go: "I want to leave" and then, indirectly, she wants us. We deconstruct her by dismissing what she wants. Damsel, for all her sugary sweetness, is probably the most insecure of all the princesses. We swooped in like the perfect hero to save her from a prison she didn't even know why she was locked in, and then we died trying to let her escape. She hurt us, killed us, but she wants us to love her. Why else would she be so nonchalant about our disturbing suggestions of ending the world? She loves us, but she's so scared we'll leave her that she tries to play perfect, whatever that might be, to us. Rejecting Damsel earns us either Grey or Ever After. She still loves us. She's still traumatized and afraid we'll leave her. But now she has to pick and choose between what she wants and what she needs, and she thinks she has to deny herself while walking on eggshells this time to keep us. No wonder she breaks. But we get to dance with her by reassuring her that we can love her without her pandering to us and playing perfect after her breakdown. Damsel gets to let go of her facade and insecurity as Ever After and thus, gets to genuinely connect with us if we let her. I believe that is what "sing for herself" means; being honest to herself, not necessarily us.
@@MrSilentProtagonist I mean, even in the original, when she deconstructs trying to make you happy, Smitten doesn't see anything wrong with it. It gave me the feeling he only saw her like that and considered his wants more important.
Because he separated himself from Quiet, Hero and the other Voices. They balance and keep each other stable. Smitten loves the Princess, but be is just THAT: Love and Passion, without the other emotions and thought processes to keep him grounded. Same goes for the Opportunistic in the route where Quiet gets stuck in the Princess's body. He becomes the absolute Littlefinger. This game has so many metaphors and analyses on human behavior, psyche and morality. HOW THE FUCK DID WE GET THIS PIECE OF AMBROSIA WHILE MOST POP CULTURE IS GETTING TURNED INTO ABSOLUTE GARBAGE?! Seriously, the people who conceived this game should be ranked alongside the likes of Soren, Nietzsche and Aristotle.
Worth noting, this is *very different* than what he envisioned. There was supposed to be a process of forgetting that made every meal taste as good as the first.
As a married man this hit different. I find too many people in relationships who do this very thing: constantly trying to never mess up or make a mistake ending up in displeasing or boring their partner. Relationships are fulfilling because of the struggle you overcome together. Struggles to pay bills on time, raising a family, having a job good enough to provide it all. There are good moments like the food and entertainment, but it means nothing when there is no opposition, no struggle. You need to know the hard times in order to better appreciate the good. The most fulfillment I’ve gotten from my marriage isn’t when everything is perfect. It’s when the odds are overcome, the deadline met, the battle won, and the small good things that punctuate those struggles. A delicious meal here, a fun game there. But simply doing happy things all the time leads to boredom. The love dies, and then you’re just two people. The struggles of life keeps the love burning.
@elderliddle2733 this can work even outside of marriage or love in general. Been stagnant and doing the same thing over and over, even if it's something you enjoy doing it can affect you. That's why in our human nature we have the drive to push ourselves to more things. And I want to add that some people don't always have to struggle with physical things only. There are some of us that struggle with our own mind and that struggle can stop us from pushing forward or even stop doing what we used to love. Struggle is a necessary evil, so we can all enjoy the little things that life can give us to enjoy.
@@Upsetkiller456 That's what someone who lacks love would say, we live to love, we live because we love living, we don't murder our parents or friends because we love them, we don't bash a dogs head open because we love animals, if love is a lie, then is there a reason to live? And if you don't love anything, then why do YOU live.
Damn Smitten is tweaking this route.Yet I don’t think he was being actively malicious either. He’s trying to do the right thing but he’s doing it in the completely wrong way.
Extreme acts of love are rarely done with malicious intent, merely infatuation and love taken to the extreme (unless it’s getting someone out of their way)
Yep, definitely. That's why I wasn't hating or angry at Smitten at all when playing through this route. Instead, I was just disappointed. Thank goodness we have the Thorn route where he does it right and shows us the best side of himself :)
I love how the princess changes in this route. She’s her usual self, she kills you after you try to free her, she becomes a simpler version of herself, you try to keep her in the cabin with you, she becomes more complex, somehow both better off and worse off than before. The dance at the end is so heartwarming, waiting for The Pristine Cut was so worth it!
So I know the ending for this can turn out very romantic and fulfilling, but honestly, I felt like a lot of this is just so sad. There was a fire between you two, but you don’t know how to keep it going, and the more desperate you get to keep it lit, the more quickly it goes out, until you wonder if you even loved each other in the first place. And even the Narrator sees your relationship fading and can feel how utterly sad and hopeless it all is.
One nice way to take this is that by letting the fire go out and walking out together you both admit this was a mistake, but it doesn't have to be the end, just the end of that mistake. Even if you don't take her hand down the steps (if you feel that it would be inappropriate) the princess will still invite you for a dance if you asked her what she *really* wanted earlier.
Quick note: you can also access the route by getting up the stairs to the cabin and then at the last moment, picking the “let’s stay here” option. You get the Opportunist that way, instead of the Paranoid
Interestingly enough, if you do, you don't get a conformation that it's Smitten doing this. Instead, you manipulate the game's rules to decimate her in the game, lmao
This is such an interesting path. My interpretation is that even as the initial joy fades from the monotony of routine, that you still really care about each other and you enjoy doing new things together at first. That dance is beautiful and heartfelt, but it’d be less so the 100th time. The Smitten here is the wish that you and your love could be trapped in time together forever as you are, so you’d never grow apart. The reality is that if you had infinite time then the joy would eventually fade, and you’d run out of ways to rekindle it. Change is necessary, things ultimately ending is necessary. The Narrator realises this too from this path, it’s what weakens his resolve that the world would be better off without change.
"Do you...still care about me?" Absolutely destroyed me emotionally. So real and heartbreaking to ask. Yet, this is the turning point where you can find something real. Even rediscover your love for each other, not because you think it would make you both happy to be in love. You're happy just to be as you both are and find love in that. Nothing more real than that.
You know what’s funny, when you reach the mirror scene after the ending, the smitten returns to your head, though no one freaks out and is like “dude what were you doing?!” (Except me)
They were happy together when they could leave the stress and monotony of the cabin and were free to dance under the stars. That’s what I’ll cling on to from this depiction of a failing relationship, it was the strain of their situation that was robbing their happiness, not each other.
The issue was The Princess was sacrificing her happiness for yours, outside of making you happy she just wants to leave the cabin. She tried to make it work in the cabin but it was just too stifling and monotonous for her. Doing the same empty things over and over got boring fast for us too. A relationship needs compromise and real connections.
God, that ending where you take her out of the cabin got me. I don’t cry at a lot of things, but goddamnit, that was powerful. Easily one of the best routes in the game and I’m not afraid to say it.
What he always does when he has a smidgeon of control: Ruin everything. Blind devotion will only ever destroy bridges, it never builds them. Even when it does, they aren't stable for long
@@kokirij0167 Eh, I wouldn't say he always ruins things. Like any other voice he has the chance to do good or bad things just that unlike most voices he has enough willpower to force you to do them. The Cold or the Opportunistic will always try to make you pick shitty options but never force you to take them.
@@kingragnarok7302 Yeah, I know, I was being hyperbolic. Sorry if that didn’t come through. He does kill you in two routes though, iirc the only other voices that do that are Broken and Skeptic, both in only one route each.
@@kokirij0167 Blind, and *excessive* devotion/love will always, albeit, unintentionally bad. As they say, the path to hell is paved with good intentions.
So did anyone else get Voice of the Opportunist instead of Voice of the Paranoid when doing this route? From what I can tell the difference seems to be choosing *when* to suggest staying in the cabin, for Paranoid you do it in the basement and for Opportunist you do it just before leaving the cabin. What I find interesting is how different the roles either voice plays in this chapter while accompanied by the Voice of the Hero and Narrator, Paranoid is obviously suspicious from the start and seems to catch on to what's going on as soon as the player enters the "basement", meanwhile Opportunist is more than happy to indulge in what's going on, almost to an ignorant degree, and you don't even get any dialogue confirming Smitten is the shadow when Opportunist is present. It's honestly rather unsettling but I think that really adds to this new route of being unfulfilled in paradise so to speak, you have one voice who's painfully aware of the cracks in "perfection" and another that holds onto it for as long as it can.
That's not Contrarian, that's Opportunist. He knows how to play the game and helps us win it. If it were Contrarian he'd not want to play the game and he'd try to ruin the dance by playing some more uplifting 80's style music from a boombox that somehow attracts other perspectives and turns into a party. 😂
@@reubensalter8125 OMG I DIDN'T EVEN REALIZE 😭 Thank you for pointing that out but damn-- I'm changing that rn I'm so dumbbbb I genuinely get those two kinda mixed up all the time
I didn't even realise there was a way you could get someone other than the opportunist! Now that I've seen both, the difference in tone is really apparent.
Maybe it's just me, but when you spin around with her I wish Smitten had said something. Not overly dramatic, not hammed up. Something Simple. Subtle. Genuine. One can say the love that was burning out was a symbol of the smitten and unchecked love, but I like to think of it like the honeymoon phase of a relationship. Holding hands when it grows cold, and swaying in the stars, turns it from raw unchecked passion to true smitten beauty.
In a way, same. When we were dancing, I thought to myself, "Smitten would be proud" But I'm glad he didn't actually show up in the end. He's one of my favourites, but I think, at this point, it was best for them to finally have some time apart. For both of their sakes.
@@reubensalter8125 Yeah, and I'm pretty sure Smitten disappearing when the fourth light goes out represents him finally letting her go. He never truly wanted to do this, the princess even says her self that "he's tired" And of course we can't forget about him in the Thorn when we see him at his best. It saddens me to see people taking only the worst part of him and saying that's how he truly is. They only focus on a single side of him, which is a bit ironic since a huge part of this game is finding love in all shapes and sizes.
I just did my first playthrough, this was my first ending, and it was a hundred times more wholesome than I ever expected, seeing her happy and smiling so genuinely just made me smile and sometimes, an old-fashioned fairy-tale ending is exactly what we all need.
I love that in all the entire context of it. This voice really is just how the character processes it outside of your control. So it's like it's not just that she was unhappy about the situation. The moment you ask her what she wants, she becomes so one-dimensional. She starts to physically fall apart and can not maintain a detailed appearance and starts to slowly unravel as a character she had no desire. And then as soon as you mention staying in the cabin she becomes normal again because she's not unraveling because she has an actual thought there and she's not happy with the decision the one time she shows her actual emotion.And it has to do with not staying there with you.And then the smitten responds as such like an obsessed tweaker fricking funny then dark after sitting with the ending.
It should be noted; Damsel *does* mention first she wants to leave the cabin, then after that she says she just wants to make you happy. Pressing her on the matter is what deconstructs her because by doing that you *perceive* her to be a being with zero wants outside of you when she in fact does. You (the main character) just don't find her answer satisfying. If you decide to leave you let go of those thoughts and accept her at her word, if you decide to stay her confliction makes you see her as more three-dimensional. It's why putting her at odds with her two desires by suggesting to stay causes the conflict in Happily Ever After; she is staying to make you happy but she's not fulfilled herself being cooped up in the cabin forever. She panics as the fires go out because it means you're not happy and she can't even have her other desire fulfilled.
@@michaelcoleman2173 but that's why it's so great it's about perspective metaphorically and literally although that is the case, and that's the reason for it your character or rather his voices can't perceive it as such.Since they can't remember that's an actual option only what he sees in this route it leads to the same conclusion you are right that is exactly what happened, but to the character it is as I said she had no desire other than those two things but once put into the confliction of what she wants. She shows actual conclusion and it's nothing that the Smitten expected because although she wants to make you happy. That's only specific to this princess wanting to leave is the constant they all yearn to leave. Also I like your perception of it the character really is as impassive as a player would be it makes her liking your character. All the more fulfilling, since it's not just a monster but a monster that just stares in the silence wanting more perspective just to not become bored.
Didn't expect this type of ending, especially with smitten. Like I knew smitten was a psycho in the other endings but to think he would ended up becoming the one to open the narrator's eyes and make him doubt his ideals. Its honestly unexpected.
Can I mention something? I think during the route, Smitten realizes that what he was doing was wrong after the last torch goes out. I was SO ready to have to fight some sort of monstrous beast version of him but instead the princess and us just... left. It makes me really sad because in all honesty, it's our fault that he ended up going this extreme. Not defending what he does at all, but still.
I admit that this path got better. The damsel was soo cut and dry. Like love is not just make you happy, I am sure if I was like 10 I would loved her, but as you grow up forever happiness in love is not real. But bringing up the "happy ever after" bs it really made this path so much better and I started to enjoy the Damsel for reaching the potential I wished she had. Not to mention the awareness of happyless love life. It felt so right. They did a fantastic job, I felt sooo many emotions and seen the Narator feeling the stagnation as something worst than the end of the world, it gave him a bit more character than I didn't even thought he needed. Ok game good job you made me simp for the damsel, you happy now?
Damn I made like a tier for all the princess and before the pristine cut she was like D (S,A to D, didn't felt like putting E or F, felt too cruel), she really jump to A super fast on this path. I mean the happy ever after did go S and damsel received A thanks to it. Yeah she got better when we got paid out with her having more characteristics than just "she loves us and want to make us happy"
@@FratoiuAlexYeah but you do remember the Burned Grey exists right? And that she always wanted to leave from the beginning? And that she always had that agency in her, she just didn't know it yet?
@@FratoiuAlexAgain, and I keep saying this I know but it's important, she wants to leave. She's always wanted to leave. Even before the Pristine Cut came that's all she ever wanted besides our happiness. She only deconstructed because we ignored it. And in Burned Grey she got that agency back but buffed, to the point where she felt she had to destroy the cabin in order for both of us to be together.
I like that they maintained that the Smitten is *not* like the other voices. He has his own motivations , and the strength to bring his goals to fruition. He’s the only voice that kills us.
Skeptic will also kill you in the Prisoner route if you keep being fine with the Narrator's reward and the other voices can make you do things (such as Contrarian throwing the blade out the window in one version of the Razor route).
@@lucaswilliams2292 Not really: Skeptic does it too: we either let him do it with the blade or he stops our heart. Broken also does it but he was kinda being led by the Tower. Outside of that, Contrarian throws the blade out the window in Razor and now Fury along with Stubborn, Hunted dodges without us telling him to, also in Razor and Cheated takes us straight to the cabin.
Exactly, it’s why the routes where you can’t or don’t use your influence to rein them in almost invariably end in pain and tragedy. Not just this one but also Princess and Dragon for Opportunist, and to an extent Cage for Skeptic. This applies to some of the preexisting routes as well, updated or not; Broken is particularly dangerous in the Tower and the new Den content can result in you losing control over Hunter, for example. And listening to Cold too much in the Spectre can lead to the Wraith and he’s also incredibly unhelpful in both Grey routes as well. And so on.
@@오주환-b1n Actually it's not listening to Cold that gets you to Wraith because he doesn't really care what you do as long as you do it, and he's just being pragmatic and throwing suggestions in the air. It's more about not being able to make an actual decision, and instead either doing the same thing over and over again or not doing anything at all, something he himself is against. It's a complete contrast to Nightmare where your decisiveness is what leads to Wraith instead. Also he's extremely helpful and amazing in the greys - he correctly identifies them as dead and he puts Smitten in his place and he's extremely good as Skeptic's detective partner. And Cage doesn't end in pain or tragedy if you can't reign Skeptic in, because it's still a beautiful ending - it ends in a dance too. Plus the more tragic one is where you do reign him in, or rather convince him to briefly adopt a different worldview. Also slight correction it's Apotheosis, not Tower. And you left out Stubborn who's basically enabling Hunted at that point in Den.
This is honestly id say the "Narrators" best possible ending. I always loved how the reward has been related to the "Happily ever after" of fairytales and taken to a literal sense, eternal blissful happiness, and in turn the horrors that come with it, this route directly making the connection and showing it for what it truly is is honestly id say one of the most impactful parts. (Spoilers for the ending/endings) Quite sadly then that, if this is one of your routes, you get the chance to talk to the Echo about how a version of himself doubted the mission, and though there is a tiny bit of trepidation in his voice, he chalks it up to a mere delusion on part of the version that choose that, that one version among many doesn't mean anything.
Important reminder: if you're in a relationship where your SO behaves in any creepy way similair to The Smitten, RUN! (Don't enter a abusive relationship or atleast leave it as soon as possible when you can)
Hey man, could you give me some help? I'm gonna genuinely ask here, you seem to have experience with the topic, how can I stop being like the smitten? like, I can't exactly see what is wrong with the things that he does, but I can see for sure that there is _something_ wrong. I see a lot of myself in him and how I've been acting with people and genuinely want to change and not be like him, but I really don't have any idea how. I'd really appreciate any advice.
@@ChynoachI saw your comment, and have the advice to you as a married man. Dont strive for perfection, strive to BE perfection. Understand that you, as who you really are, are all you (and she) needs to be. Smitten tries to be everything he can be FOR someone else…everyone except himself, and that is what causes him to remove himself from the equation. He becomes a shadow over the princess because his “sacrifice” becomes a curse, and burden that she can never be free from as long as she believes she must continue to proving herself to everyone but herself. Understand this, life NEEDS you to be different. It needs you to embrace the flaws that you see in yourself so that you can become the real you And not just a voice in your head.
@@kunami13sora well, I don't really know who I am when I'm not being someone else for her/other people. I guess this would be more on the "self-discovery" side of things, wich, ironically enough, I also got zero idea on how to work on either. But, i guess I'm closer to my final goal now than before. Thank you so much for making this more clear to me, even though it's still confusing, this will be the next step on the right direction. Thanks so much for the help!! Really appreciate it.
@@Chynoach there isn't a manual on self discovery, but it is the easiest thing to find once YOU become the priority of your life. Remember, before you put on another's oxygen mask on a plane, you put YOURS on first so that you can be the best version of yourself when you inevitably help others. As long as you continue moving forward, there is no wrong step. Keep moving forward and the world will break itself open to the real you.
I genuinely never grew to like the Narrator in the previous release. I understand his motives and understand that he isn't necessarily evil but it felt out of character to be sad about his death. I didn't hate him and I didn't want him to suffer in his death but he just seems incapable of change or new perspective. Understandably, he always starts fresh but he always felt like a nuisance while acting like the player was one. I never liked games that felt like it hated how it gave players agency. At least, this was done by a character unlike something like Bioshock or Telltale games where player choice felt like it was given out of obligation. The narrator needed to not change his mind for the narrative to work but it is nice to see that there is a glimpse of humanity in one of his iterations. He learn the necessity of change in the hard way.
Its also because the Narrator is but a fragment of what he once was, everytime you reset, a part of him dies along with it, he is already shattered just to get one single shot at his goal, he cant change his world wiew else that means his end, but in a world without change preserving everything means preserving him too, a fragmented shell forced to forever narrate an unchanging tale forever, knowing that without change, his existance never mattered. Every route is basically that way, attempting to end change before realising he cant, and giving up in some way, by convincing itself that you wont listen to him when in truth he stopped believing it ever since the scenario already repeated a few times, or here, by acknowledging that his ideal was flawed at its core
I felt more sympathy for the narrator when I saw the one line the echo can give about how even in his ideal world there could still be some change left Player: “If I destroy her how is that existence any better than death? Or even different from death at all? Honestly it feels worse” Narrator: “When I broke the cycle, I made sure the tear was rough. You carry a part of what should be her, and she carries a part of what should be you. Things won’t be as they are now, but they won’t be nothing, either. Besides… anything is better than oblivion. In the end, nobody wants to leave”
The greatest weakness of the Narrator was playing himself as a narrator, unable to be grounded with the interactions with the Princess or Quiet and being unable to relate to either of them due to hostility or feelings of superiority. Along with this, he can’t adapt to the world resets, meaning he becomes stuck and stale. All of this leads The Long Quiet to become slowly resentful towards the narrator via the various voices opinions.
My favorite route in this game fr, yeah call me corny and romantic dumbass. I don't care. I loved how the protagonist and the princess dance at the end before the world crumbles down, really feeling that one on my heart
This has to be my new favorite route. The Thorn will always be up there for me. but this one hits hard and the fact that even the Narrator finally sees what he's been doing for this one route, is just beautiful. Also wtf Smitten being toxic in this relationship (or maybe just misguided but still), i thought he was just funny/goofy before, This route alone knocked him down a bit on my favorite voices list.
I would certainly classify Smitten's *behavior* as toxic, however I don't feel like Smitten is actively trying to be malicious here. Rather, like all the other voices, there are times where his worldview is useful and times where it's not, and that nearly everything is better in moderation, not extremes.
You.. defeat the narrator. More than just skirting his plans you make him realize that he was wrong from the start when you show him what his happy ending would be. This almost feels like a true ending.
You... don't defeat him; he realises his mistake on his own without your or anyone else's input. Plus he hates the way the princess is being treated, and he accepts that he was wrong and is happy that he was.
@reubensalter8125 I'm not sure what you considered defeated. He acknowledges that he was wrong after being shown the horrifying reality of what he was trying to accomplish. You don't get much more defeated than that in a philosophical disagreement.
@@soujemn5 Again that's not really defeat, that's self reflection. And even if those are two very different things, you can have one without the other.
The smitten truly has a disturbing and, frankly, *startling* amount of influence over not only us, but clearly, the world itself, when his passions run deep enough... We've seen the voices in our head revolt before, they ARE capable of making their own decisions and influencing others (such as the skeptic and the paranoid refusing to let you move on without the blade in the prisoner/the cage), but... This? He created all of this. He has total control over it all, over US (and the princess), so long as the torches stay lit. He escaped being just a voice in our head - he managed to CREATE a physical presence, even if only a shadow... That is INSANE. Just think of what he else he could be capable of, if he wasn't so psychotically in love, if he could redirect that emotional strength...
it's so insane yet telling seeing the narrator experiencing the stagnation he craved and realizing what he's put you and the princess through that even HE didn't want you to do the thing he created you with the sole purpose for
It show also the toxic love of a self obssesed one ... Smitten is such a nice simp , always want to pleased, to be at the service of the princess but he dont really love her , he act like a servant but never like an equal , in the end he is abusive to her and scare her because , he in love with an idea not the real her
Honestly, I'd love for someone in the comments to discuss about the meaning of the "Keep the last torch aflame" ending in the context of each route reflecting a kind of dysfunctional relationship. It's interesting to me.
Is this some allegory for abuse? The princess isn't truly happy but is forced to, Smitten tries everything except give her what she really needs, to able to leave. This is what a loveless relationship is isn't it?
I like to think that aside from the third ending. It's basically an allegory of a couple who used to be infatuated with each other but that fiery spark of love slowly burns out, leaving out a now numbing cold love life that both couples desperately attempt to re-spark but to no avail and all they just need is to let go. It was nice, they still cared for each other. But they need to take a break or go their separate ways
To my mind The Smitten is just the desire to keep you happy together forever, but as the path shows that’s just not possible. I don’t think her wanting to leave is her rejecting you, it’s just accepting that this ‘perfect moment’ can’t last and things need to change, by leaving the moment
For me, I think this route is showing how a love like that of the Smitten can be smothering. He doesn't hurt the Princess, but look at what he becomes once he is with her now. He's an enormous shadow looming over the Princess that does so many "nice" things for her. Damsel is pressured to be the perfect lover to reciprocate and show gratitude to her lover, but when even she grows tired of everything, she immediately feels regret at expressing it because "how can you be tired of someone being so nice to you?" Smitten's love is overbearing and overpowers the princess completely. It isn't until the last of the torches go out that the Smitten's shadow disappears, finally allowing the Damsel to express herself and her own wants.
Either the stuff on the table is changing, or you're changing (though there is some relative change between you and the table-stuffs). Isn't that still an admission that things haven't quite gotten the way you're supposed (by the Narrator) to have them? If things don't have to change, your feelings of happiness and contentment don't have to change. Is it that the Narrator's pursuit is pointless when you can't halt the organic process of reaction and transformation? Did He just not think this through, or...? The games clearly changed, too, by the way. Unless you're going for an infinite set of elements to work with - which you won't get if the universe is finite - there's still a limited number of permutations of games you can play, in terms of both rules and progressions. Yet it seems like we can still be fond of playing games and coming up with new arrangements of old, classic elements until we die. I mean, you're not supposed to die, but, isn't what dying does just reset your memory and shuffle who you are and make you forget every time, distracting you from the limited possibilities of an isolated finite reality, even if that reality repeats itself forever? And that reality doesn't necessarily have to include suffering, unless every possibility necessarily has to be realised, or some other mechanism. Can't you just always reset your hedonic adaptation and desensitisation without dying? Can you transform and be brought to certain states while remaining alive and intact and well? Ah, this is all just the stuff I mentioned at first, isn't it It's the same thing with the food. There are limited possibilities. Sure, the perception of each taste, texture and effect component might seem continuous, but if you keep trying to have different things, they'll just become imperceptible variations of each other. You just forget all the time through imperfect memory and death in order to fight your hedonic adaptation and desensitisation, but, you don't need to have those constraints. Surely
I think we finally have figured out what the narrator truly wanted for a perfect world, It was, infact,a world without death, but.. Instead of death, there was an excuse in it's place,forgetting everything you achieved just so you could repeat it, doesn't sound as bad initially,but, when you start thinking about it,Is It truly better than death? if without it, without forgetting, everything eventually gets dull,as you experience everything you could possible achieve,infact reaching an end,but the end is... Just that an ending, it's a conclusion,but a conclusion to all your limited growing and learning,that leaves you with nothing but well, nothing left. It truly feels like trying to salvage an idea that simply just doesn't work out.. *Isn't that what a desperate person would do?* Sorry for my derailing, just wanted to share my view on what I believe is the narrator's perspective
I watched the first version of this game last year, right before a breakup. Now, seeing this new release with even better writing and storytelling, I get how much this game really is a love story-for better or worse. Sure, the situations are totally over the top, but you can still feel the parallels. It hits differently this time around. I really love this game :)
the echo got a taste of his dream world. and that broke him, for reality was not what he envisioned. Apathy is the fate of his world and he came to the realisation that he would choose death and all the suffering he resisted over it. he saw the end of the fairy tale he was writing, then he tossed away the pen in dispair. it was a truth he could not deny.
It's pretty sure take comment on fairy-tales with there happy ever after. In books is just a nice way to say the end. But realistically how long is that ever after happiness. As much as we all want a happy love life, it's not always this way. We as humans are creatures of chaos, we can't always be happy or be sad, but we need both emotions to happen. A happy relationship, no a Real relationship is not when a couple is constantly happy, is one that keeps life goin, accept change, expirience life and it's trials, and built trust and communication on whatever life delivers to us. Death needs life and Life needs Death. This is why immortality is a wrong wish for us mortals. And I want to ad Mark of Cain. We all know the story of Cain killing his brother Abel, and receiving the punishment of immortality. Some say how is that a punishment? Well at some point you will expirience everything life can give and at some point you get bored of it, in specially been also limited of your power.
@@FratoiuAlex It is exploring the darker side of the Damsel route. The Damsel is the idealized victim. She only wants what the Player wants. When I played this route previously, I thought that it was weird but figuring it out later when we leave sounded like a reasonable thing to do since how is she supposed to know living in a dungeon. However fears about not being compatible creeps in, you aren't going like the same things & being a different being is the point of a relationship.
@MrSilentProtagonist exactly. Like as you said is the ideal victim that can be abused and manipulated. Of course it's not super dark, but it's good enough to give the idea that love is not that simple. To me it rubs me wrong when someone is super obedient to the point that they don't show much of a desire for themselves. It is nice to care for others, but don't forget to care for yourself more. Yes I know she wants to leave and everything, but she was fine with what ever you suggest, which for me lack of agency can affect you (when I refer lack I don't mean completely out of it, it's there, but it's like at the minimum and waiting to be told what to do, I say this because some think I talk about extrem parts and wanted to clear that confusion). Anyway I loved this part it made me feel a lot more out of it.
@@MrSilentProtagonistWell actually she does want to leave, she's always wanted that in addition to us being happy. So when we suggest staying here it sets off an internal conflict. I think you can guess what happens next. Also here she doesn't want what the player wants, she wants what Smitten wants.
This was my first route after I bought this game and honestly it will probably stay as my favorite. I haven't seen every route but I've seen maybe half or so and now am able to acknowledge how special it is that The Narrator changed his mind. In the ending sequence where we talk with him there's an option to talk about when he changed his mind here and since it was my first playthrough I didn't really appreciate just how unique this was. Playthroughs where we go against the rigid narrator and either change or overcome him as seen in The Den ending. All I'm saying is I fuck with this game heavy and will probably 100% it in the coming days cause I sure as hell want to experience everything this has to offer.
We didn't overcome him in Fury? We just told him to dictate what happens because we need him to describe it for it to happen. That's not really overcoming, that using him to our advantage. If you want an example where we do overcome him despite everything he throws at us, I'd say freeing the Den.
@reubensalter8125 I have not seen The Den yet so no idea about that particular one. I'd also say that it is directly overcoming him. As much as he likes to say that he just narrates the truth of the matter it has been shown that he's not doing that at all and can manipulate the world somewhat. An example of that would be closing the door and dropping the sword to us before forcing us to try and slay the princess. He has been shown to have the ability to manipulate the narration to his wants so I'd say that being able to go against him saying that we die and cease existing is overcoming him somewhat.
@@gabrielr1199 Yeah but he's not exactly powerful, especially in Fury - he disappears around the same time. I'd just call that a coincidence. In Den, I won't spoil it but he definitely becomes more antagonistic and worth overcoming.
We only saw him like this in one chapter in the entire game. So don't base your whole opinion on him from that. Try to take into consideration what he's like in all the other chapters. A loving, compassionate guy who holds no standards for his beloved to reach, because he will always love and accept her for who she is :) It's just that in this route, he's in an extremely toxic mindset despite his good intentions. Leading him to making bad decisions and harmful actions. Think about the Thorn route, in this chapter, he was in a much healthier, less desperate and toxic mindset. So he was able to make much better decisions that gave much better results. We see who he truly is in the Thorn, where he's at his best. What we saw in Happily Ever After was truly horrible and will forever stain our opinion on Smitten, and that's ok. As long as we remember that this isn't all there is to him.
@@n4n4sh1_ Exactly! People need to remember that all these voices are extremes of a certain emotion. So of course when giving too much control or listened to too much, it will cause them to go down hill. You, the player and Voice of the Hero are the ones keeping them under control. Keeping them grounded. On their own, every voice can become dangerous. This was just Smitten's moment of having too much control (Worsened by the fact that he was in an unhealthy mindset at the time). The Thorn is a great example of him at his best because he's in a healthy mindset, is very considerate and understanding of how the princess is feeling and helps us get one of the most wholesome and romantic moments in the entire game! Smitten is a loving, compassionate guy who cares deeply for the princess. So we should remember him at his best, while also acknowledging his worst side, and accepting it as a _part_ of who he is without making it his whole thing.
I think in my last relationship I was the princess, sacrificing a good amount of myself to make the other person happy and placated, and when I… became fragile and empty, she left me. She never mistreated me, I just became something that wasn’t truly myself around her because I was so desperate to feed her own insecurities at the cost of myself. The cold “It’s finally over” from the princess is exactly how I felt when I received the breakup text after three and a half years, as heartbroken as it made me.
The narrator is amazing character. He isn't a bad person and never wanted to hurt you but he was misguided. He was a man who feared death to the point of wanting to eliminate it for everyone around him (not himself). That's why he refuses to accept that he is wrong bxz that means he sacrificed his life and all his work was for nothing and he was wrong
You know, looking at it from this perspective, I wonder if something like this was what the other Voices saw in the Princess and The Dragon route? The princess with a looming shadow behind her?
Love and courtship isn't about becoming happy. It's about being together because you want to be with that person, not because you want happiness. I wish the princess had realised that, then maybe she wouldn't have left after realising how cold it is. Being free from the basement wasn't any different from being in it, but at least knowing there's someone who wants to be there with you not for happiness but only for you, then maybe she would have stayed.
this route is really interesting since it basically gives the Narrator a taste of what he wants; a still world that doesn't change. but if you had all the time in the world to do whatever you wanted, eventually; you will run out of things to do. the new is only new and novel for a short period of time and then they become mundane, ordinary, dull. just another nail in the wall like the rest. what's the point of enjoying a life that can never end? immortality can be paramount to torture, an eternity of boredom and stagnation. things need to be finite to have value, there was actually a period in time on our planet where trees _couldn't rot_ since the bacteria and fungi that can decompose wood hadn't evolved yet so you had piles and piles of dead trees just lying on top of each other, its actually where a large chunk of petrified wood and coal comes from. change isn't necessarily bad, while an old dead tree is sad, its food for the rest of the forest like mushrooms or homes for animals that could nest inside of it, or it could be cut down and processed into timber that could be used to build something entirely new.
It really is sad to see the Narrator so destroyed, and yet it's also the thing that I wanted to see the most. To have him finally realize the error of his ways, that the unchanging world he wanted so badly was truly worse than death, and to understand why we need change, why we need endings.
When I played this version I felt wrong because of mine character/experiences. I felt like I once again Im on someone strings, felt like someone is pulling them and I cant do anything about that. This make me anxius because ages ago I said to myself "Never again" and that felling of being once again a puppet and pretending everything is fine was... A nightmare. I wanted to be free, even if that ment misery or darkness around me.
Fun fact: If you ask her what does she really want then she says that she wants to dance under the stars. If you take her outside, then says that she really meant it 😔
That’s interesting….. I just had a very…. Disturbing realization about this game…. The quiet and the shifting mound or the player, and the princess are indeed two Godly entities…. Capable of boundless to even unlimited amounts of power… But they’re trapped in an endless loop of realities that they can’t escape from no matter how hard they try and there are hundreds Thousands to even millions or possibly even infinite versions of them that are all lesser, but are equally needed in order for them to exist….. When one or more of these Versions of the quiet and the princess leave the cabin and actually leave, They return to their original forms which in Other videos of this game, I refer to as the connected Quiet and princess, which are versions of them connected to all of the others, It’s evident through their appearances. I believe that it’s actually not their fault that they’re here… It can’t be their fault. Yes, they created this reality. Sure, but the quiet was influenced in order to shackle the mound and split them both apart so that the reality never ends because something else is here. Something far darker and far far more sinister. I’m talking about the voices…. I think these are malevolent entities that hold these two gods hostage, Seeking for them ascend to actual godhood so that they may escape the reality that was created by these two gods and infect more worlds that they intern either create or escape to. The narrator is a being that seeks to control the quiet and have all the power by not sharing it with the princess, a.k.a. slaying the princess. The paranoid seems to be an entity that eirs on the side of manipulative caution Though I’m not entirely sure what it wants. The smitten Is obsessed with the Shifting mound and wants her for himself. Forgive me if I can’t remember the others, but even still, my point stands. No matter how much these two know or how much these two achieve, These voices will always be there to ensure that certain outcomes happen so that they benefit. I think that’s still why the connected ending where the connected versions of the quiet and the princess escape by leaving the cabin is actually the best ending because there are no voices, The last one stays behind, which is the voice of the hero because he’s the only one that genuinely wants the best for both of them, but specifically for the quiet because this version of the voices from everything I’ve seen is more or less a reflection of the quiet itself.
This ending I feel, truly shows how much they need eachother, and how much existance needs bith of them. chadont see how the world is if you kill the Shifting Mound in the end, but now, right here, we do, and I love that the narrator learns the Long Quietjmay be safer, a world without destruction or death....but its also meaningless. Shallow. Just as painful.
This might be the only route that I was genuinely sad that the grabby hands took her away, the thorn was close for me, but i genuinely wanted to stay with this princess and it broke my heart to have her taken away
But at least we got to dance with her. Right? Plus it would go against the whole theme of the chapter if they just stayed there forever. In the end, everything has to.
Wonder what the Long Quiet Narrator thinks of this one. I wonder if it's possible to make this narrator the one that you confront when the mirror shatters.
You can bring it up during your conversation at the mirror and the Narrator will dismiss it as one version out of trillions that happened to be delusional.
The smittens voice sounds a lot different here to me- it almost sounds like that one lego ad guy lol- “a man has fallen into the river in lego city!!!”
I do intend to compile other routes, I'm just hopping between this and Observation Duty 7. Hopefully both will be finished over the weekend. I also second playing the game as well if you get the chance, it's well worth experiencing on your own the first time around!
![Twenty One Pilots - The Line (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Audio]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/XCz7WUotXs8/mqdefault.jpg)
There’s… something sad about seeing the narrator emotionally giving up near the end… like he finally sees the agony of both characters situation
Empathy is a double-edged sword
It's also the realization of the greater picture behind who the princess is and why she is important. His desire to slay the princess is a desire to rid the world of death. But what is life without death. The endless pointless feast and games illustrate the dissolutionment that has been manifested for the narrator. He finally gets his wish and realizes it wasn't what he thought it would be. That death is a vital part of the universe. And to put an end to it would not actually be a better world.
His purpose is gone, and therefore, so is he.
@@lauralouwhooo Especially since death is only part of what she is, and what she really embodies is change. No change and only stagnancy…
@@오주환-b1nWell actually....
Some change. We were both one god and the narrator split us in two. While doing so he also made sure each of us had a small part of each other. So since we have a part of her within us, change will still exist. Just enough to allow people to grow and move but at the same time they'll forget everything that happened and keep repeating it. Kind of like a twisted Groundhog Day.
@reubensalter8125 that's probably why he gets so depressed here this is just a step above what he planned for the rest of all life. If it's this bad for him and them, why would he want this on people he actually cares for.
“But her skin against yours is the most real thing you’ve ever felt”
Just perfect writing
You know, I feel like the entire story of Slay The Princess is inspired by the devs' romantic life considering they're a couple.
@@EldritchObserver3301so the guy has multiple personalities talking to him while his wife actually changes personalities based on whatever happens, I hope the guy doesn't encounter fury too often
@@MrSasukeSusanoo when menstruation hits, that's when Fury comes out, I guess.
@@EldritchObserver3301😂
@@EldritchObserver3301 ARE YOU STILL THERE? ARE YOU STILL YOU? 🗣️
Seeing smitten go from sort of comic relief to an obsessive psycho is a delightful turn for a new route
He used to be one of my favorite voices, because I thought he was funny. Now? I *hate* him. So much. I have suffered through toxic relationships in the past. I have been both the Happy Ending Smitten, and I have been his victim. Happy Ending Smitten is the past me that I DESPISE. Happy Ending Smitten is my past partner's abuse that I''ve yet to heal from fully.
What I mean to say is, this game is a masterpiece (A game/movie/book doesn't have to be "fun" to be one). Even more so now, after the update.
@@Lady_in_Yearning Wholeheartedly agreed. When I came upon this route, I was thinking it would lead to some middle-ground between TSM and TLQ. The edge of the coin, the secret third option. I appreciated his presence at the Thorn route, with bad blood being water under the bridge and distrust transmuted into a deep connection. But the moment the Smitten spoke about "Showing the contents of our hearts" it was one of the biggest red flags I ever saw. The more his Shadow lingered over the situation, the more I saw of myself from times long past. Yet even with that reflection there was also a sense of happiness that I've grown, that I have become so much more than how I was then. To look upon the scars around my heart and finally realize just how well those wounds have actually healed.
The Princess and the Dragon did the exact same thing. To perceive yourself as a hero saving the day, yet from the other's perspective you're the dragon that is the source of your imprisonment and pain. A valuable perspective to explore. If there is one thing the 'Happy Ending' perfectly exemplifies, is that a painful truth is better than honeyed lies.
@@Lady_in_Yearning Hey, I'd like to genuinely ask for some advice, since you said that you were like the smitten from this route in the past and also the victim, I'd like to know, how can I stop being like him?
I can't see exactly what is wrong in the things he does, but i know for sure that there is _something_ wrong.
I see a lot of myself in him and how I act/treat some people. I genuinely want to change and not be like him, but I don't have any idea how.
any advice would help, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you for reading this far.
@@Chynoach The very fact you want to change is already a step in the right direction (arguably the most important one). Giving more concrete advice is more difficult, since I don't really know you or your situation. The best I can do is to give advice based on my personal experience. When a person grows up in a... not-healthy environment (let's put it that way), it can make us desperate to not be alone, to do whatever it takes to please, and to stay together at all times. Problem is, that can suffocate our partner, and turn us into a toxic one. It is important to give your partner/s space and respect their personal boundaries while at the same time establishing and protecting your own. In the end, honest and open communication is key. It's ok to be vulnerable with your partner and admit your fears and flaws (chances are, some of them turn out to not even be flaws at all). It's not a guarantee that that relationship will last, of course. Some people are just incompatible, and that's ok too. I sincerely hope at least some of this will prove useful, and that you get to dance under the stars❤🩹(genuine)
@@Lady_in_YearningThank you so much for the kind words!! I'll definitely try giving them more space. It sucks that trying to communicate about what our boundaries are might also be seen as "lingering" and suffocating, so it's kind of a shot in the dark, but I guess just giving more space and time regardless should be better than keeping things the way they are. Thank you so much for the help!! Really appreciate it. Wish you the best.
Just got a message back from her as I was writing this. I hope things go well this time
God, seeing the narrator finally realize the horrors he put you and the princess through now that the shoes on the other foot is actually a little heartbreaking. Just hearing his voice slowly fill with depression as the princess slowly spills out the truth feels way too genuine
I wouldn't call that depression. I'd call that regret. And a bit of hope
(Spoilers)
I think It’s more then that,I think he’s really getting a taste of what his “saved” world would look like for the rest of humanity no change no transformation, and no hope of things getting better or stopping just being trapped in a prison of repetition.
@@cristaltophat Actually there would be "some" change. Everyone would still be able to move and do things. And they would all forget then redo them
@@reubensalter8125 sounds like the saddest equivalent of putting a rumba in a box and watch hit the walls over and over
@@cristaltophat But the important thing is we'd enjoy it. Well not us but the people of the narrator's world would - they're all on the brink of death. They'd want something to keep them going, even if it is the same thing over and over. It's better than oblivion to them.
20:12 the slow realization of the Narrator as he starts to see the flaws in his worldview, that something eternal and unchanging can't stay good forever
mhm
Technically, Princess is a mortal, but countless or infinite versions of Princess are taken away by Shifting Mound who represents concept of change, which has potential to be unchanging and eternal once she and the Player slip into the infinite plane.
It could so easily be a real man and wife in the best living circumstances living in his “World without death and change”.
And it was awful.
So this route has 20 different metaphors none of which I’m gonna emotionally recover from
Relatable lmaoo
And someone in the comment saying they wish Smitten appear in the dancing and finally saying some genuine true smitten beuty, but the reply saying that the Smitten not appear is perfect because he say that the last torch indicate that the smitten accepted and disappear.
made me fantasyses/imagining that
"Smitten, standing in the cabin, looking at you and the princess dancing in open space, in under the night sea of star."
"You two are"
"Dancing, Smiling, Laughing."
"He is"
"Staring, smiling, saying"
Voice of the Smitten
"I am proud of you"
@navalinomilzamashshidqi5384 Awww, that's adorable 🥹
Also, I think you were talking about my comment! Someone said they wished he had shown up in the dance, and I replied to them saying the last flame going out represents him finally letting go. And that he would be proud of us dancing with her under the stars. I legit cried so much at the end and I still and always will love Smitten, not just as a character, but also as a person. (I've done a big analysis on his personality in my head so I just can't ever hate him lol)
Okay, _holy shit_ . New absolute favorite route alert. GOD the way Narrator just. Give up by the end. But not in a "clearly I can't change your mind ugh" way but in a "I saw a glimpse of what my ideal world would be and it is not what I want" way. How as the same meal becomes repulsive, the same game becomes numbing, the same routine repeating over and over again, the Narrator realized there's a reason why Change exists, and why killing the embodiment of Change itself is just dooming the world in This. An eternity of stagnation and pretending to be okay with that stagnation. Holy shit the writing of this game...
I actually brought up the Change of heart to the original narrator near the end, and in his own fancy way he kinda told me to go get bent.
@@cristaltophat yeah, that one considered this Narrator to be delusional.
It’s sad how one Narrator managed to see the truth with his own eyes and realize the mistake in his ideal world, yet that realization would fade away while the remaining Narrators remain stuck in their delusions
Gotta admit,i knew smitten had a darker side to him but DAMN.
The thing about Smitten is that he's not just "in love". Love can turn into obsession if left unchecked and uncontrolled, and that's exactly what happens here. Smitten can be quite intimidating and powerful with how he's able to override control of the Hero/Quiet's body. He's overbearing with his love for the Princess. Just look at the shadow of the Smitten looming over her, he towers over her and smothers her by doing so many "nice" things for her. Yes, he made the cabin into a castle, gave the Princess an even more elaborate dress and crown, but she is practically drowning in his presence. When she gets upset despite everything the Smitten does for her, she immediately regrets feeling that way because she probably feels like she isn't allowed to feel that way. How could you be upset when someone does so much for you? Smitten makes the Princess feel pressured to be the perfect lover with everything he does for her, and although they're done with good intentions, it's really not helping anymore. This kind of love results in a lot of pressure that results in the relationship and the people in it falling apart.
@@reicho3034 I agree with everything youve said here but,a small fraction of me was hoping he wouldnt go THAT far,but nonetheless he does,and the way the whole situation plays out as a result is utterly heartbreaking, im really not suprised the narrator just decided to stop fighting after he saw what he was doing to both Quiet/Princess through smittens abuse, that or after just seeing the situation as a whole,no clue what could of been going through his head honestly.
@@laxzazazaza8278 Even the word smitten is almost synonymous to “obsession”. He’s infatuated with her, but he loved her so much that he unintentionally hurt her, hugged and squeezed her so tight until she broke under the pressure of “trying to reciprocate better”.
@@reicho3034 Yep
Agree. I didn't expect THAT
Paranoid is smart. This route, the chain route, Paranoid really understands how the world works, even better then skeptic.
I prefer the Stubborn's interpretation. "and then we get back up" was such an amazing turn in the story.
this new ending made me so sad and yet felt so utterly fulfilled. as someone who refused to kill the princess the first time around, and then still refused to kill her, it makes me so happy that at the very end, despite her forced pandering and despair, that she was finally able to say what *she* wanted. that dance under the stars was indeed beautiful. im glad she found her peace. i love this game.
Somber is the word you’re looking for. A moment of clarity as water stills and you see your reflection.
@@stghost825 I wouldn't call it somber (because I don't think it is personally, it is indeed fulfilling) and it's definitely not a Moment of Clarity. Because here we're not an object, nor a tool, and we are what we always have been - us, formed by clear and not-jaded memories.
It's what I always felt was missing from the damsel root. You can deconstruct her by asking what she wants but this route lets her actually say what she wants.
@@seekingabsolution1907 But she already said what she wanted in chapter 2 - she wanted to leave. She always wanted to leave, even in the base game.
@@seekingabsolution1907 Damsel does say what she wants from the get go: "I want to leave" and then, indirectly, she wants us. We deconstruct her by dismissing what she wants.
Damsel, for all her sugary sweetness, is probably the most insecure of all the princesses. We swooped in like the perfect hero to save her from a prison she didn't even know why she was locked in, and then we died trying to let her escape. She hurt us, killed us, but she wants us to love her. Why else would she be so nonchalant about our disturbing suggestions of ending the world? She loves us, but she's so scared we'll leave her that she tries to play perfect, whatever that might be, to us.
Rejecting Damsel earns us either Grey or Ever After. She still loves us. She's still traumatized and afraid we'll leave her. But now she has to pick and choose between what she wants and what she needs, and she thinks she has to deny herself while walking on eggshells this time to keep us. No wonder she breaks.
But we get to dance with her by reassuring her that we can love her without her pandering to us and playing perfect after her breakdown. Damsel gets to let go of her facade and insecurity as Ever After and thus, gets to genuinely connect with us if we let her. I believe that is what "sing for herself" means; being honest to herself, not necessarily us.
I want to say that Smitten didn't have it in him to end up like this...but he definitely did.
@@kiwikarp9509
Love isn't meant to be perfect. This is what happens when he is left unchecked.
@@MrSilentProtagonistYeah. I think most of these routes show that without us, most of the voices become extremely dangerous.
@@MrSilentProtagonist I mean, even in the original, when she deconstructs trying to make you happy, Smitten doesn't see anything wrong with it. It gave me the feeling he only saw her like that and considered his wants more important.
Because he separated himself from Quiet, Hero and the other Voices. They balance and keep each other stable. Smitten loves the Princess, but be is just THAT: Love and Passion, without the other emotions and thought processes to keep him grounded.
Same goes for the Opportunistic in the route where Quiet gets stuck in the Princess's body. He becomes the absolute Littlefinger.
This game has so many metaphors and analyses on human behavior, psyche and morality. HOW THE FUCK DID WE GET THIS PIECE OF AMBROSIA WHILE MOST POP CULTURE IS GETTING TURNED INTO ABSOLUTE GARBAGE?!
Seriously, the people who conceived this game should be ranked alongside the likes of Soren, Nietzsche and Aristotle.
Its poetic seeing the narrator experience the stagnation he wanted from the beginning.
And then witnessing that his desire was probably the worst thing that could happen
its nice for him to change
Worth noting, this is *very different* than what he envisioned.
There was supposed to be a process of forgetting that made every meal taste as good as the first.
@@zacharybosley1935 And that didn't really work out too well
@@amethyphoenix nop. It definitely didn't. But I can't fault a guy for dreaming big.
As a married man this hit different. I find too many people in relationships who do this very thing: constantly trying to never mess up or make a mistake ending up in displeasing or boring their partner. Relationships are fulfilling because of the struggle you overcome together. Struggles to pay bills on time, raising a family, having a job good enough to provide it all. There are good moments like the food and entertainment, but it means nothing when there is no opposition, no struggle. You need to know the hard times in order to better appreciate the good. The most fulfillment I’ve gotten from my marriage isn’t when everything is perfect. It’s when the odds are overcome, the deadline met, the battle won, and the small good things that punctuate those struggles. A delicious meal here, a fun game there. But simply doing happy things all the time leads to boredom. The love dies, and then you’re just two people. The struggles of life keeps the love burning.
@elderliddle2733 this can work even outside of marriage or love in general. Been stagnant and doing the same thing over and over, even if it's something you enjoy doing it can affect you. That's why in our human nature we have the drive to push ourselves to more things.
And I want to add that some people don't always have to struggle with physical things only. There are some of us that struggle with our own mind and that struggle can stop us from pushing forward or even stop doing what we used to love. Struggle is a necessary evil, so we can all enjoy the little things that life can give us to enjoy.
The idea of love is a lie.
@@Upsetkiller456 womp womp
@@chamomiletea6123m indeed.
@@Upsetkiller456 That's what someone who lacks love would say, we live to love, we live because we love living, we don't murder our parents or friends because we love them, we don't bash a dogs head open because we love animals, if love is a lie, then is there a reason to live? And if you don't love anything, then why do YOU live.
Damn Smitten is tweaking this route.Yet I don’t think he was being actively malicious either. He’s trying to do the right thing but he’s doing it in the completely wrong way.
Extreme acts of love are rarely done with malicious intent, merely infatuation and love taken to the extreme (unless it’s getting someone out of their way)
Yep, definitely. That's why I wasn't hating or angry at Smitten at all when playing through this route. Instead, I was just disappointed. Thank goodness we have the Thorn route where he does it right and shows us the best side of himself :)
@@CowMalicious9479Real🙏
I love how the princess changes in this route. She’s her usual self, she kills you after you try to free her, she becomes a simpler version of herself, you try to keep her in the cabin with you, she becomes more complex, somehow both better off and worse off than before. The dance at the end is so heartwarming, waiting for The Pristine Cut was so worth it!
So I know the ending for this can turn out very romantic and fulfilling, but honestly, I felt like a lot of this is just so sad. There was a fire between you two, but you don’t know how to keep it going, and the more desperate you get to keep it lit, the more quickly it goes out, until you wonder if you even loved each other in the first place. And even the Narrator sees your relationship fading and can feel how utterly sad and hopeless it all is.
One nice way to take this is that by letting the fire go out and walking out together you both admit this was a mistake, but it doesn't have to be the end, just the end of that mistake. Even if you don't take her hand down the steps (if you feel that it would be inappropriate) the princess will still invite you for a dance if you asked her what she *really* wanted earlier.
Quick note: you can also access the route by getting up the stairs to the cabin and then at the last moment, picking the “let’s stay here” option. You get the Opportunist that way, instead of the Paranoid
Good to note! I thought there might be a way to have a different voice show up but I hadn't experimented yet with this route.
Interestingly enough, if you do, you don't get a conformation that it's Smitten doing this. Instead, you manipulate the game's rules to decimate her in the game, lmao
Eyy that’s how I got this route too!
That's exactly how I first got this Route, piecing it together myself and seeing the result was .. a profound experience
@@kokirij0167A true gamer moment achieved! Let us go!!!
This is such an interesting path.
My interpretation is that even as the initial joy fades from the monotony of routine, that you still really care about each other and you enjoy doing new things together at first. That dance is beautiful and heartfelt, but it’d be less so the 100th time.
The Smitten here is the wish that you and your love could be trapped in time together forever as you are, so you’d never grow apart. The reality is that if you had infinite time then the joy would eventually fade, and you’d run out of ways to rekindle it.
Change is necessary, things ultimately ending is necessary. The Narrator realises this too from this path, it’s what weakens his resolve that the world would be better off without change.
"Do you...still care about me?" Absolutely destroyed me emotionally. So real and heartbreaking to ask. Yet, this is the turning point where you can find something real. Even rediscover your love for each other, not because you think it would make you both happy to be in love. You're happy just to be as you both are and find love in that. Nothing more real than that.
You know what’s funny, when you reach the mirror scene after the ending, the smitten returns to your head, though no one freaks out and is like “dude what were you doing?!” (Except me)
I think that's a glitch
They were happy together when they could leave the stress and monotony of the cabin and were free to dance under the stars. That’s what I’ll cling on to from this depiction of a failing relationship, it was the strain of their situation that was robbing their happiness, not each other.
But it wasn't really failing anymore, was it?
The issue was The Princess was sacrificing her happiness for yours, outside of making you happy she just wants to leave the cabin. She tried to make it work in the cabin but it was just too stifling and monotonous for her. Doing the same empty things over and over got boring fast for us too.
A relationship needs compromise and real connections.
@@michaelcoleman2173 Yeah but you're forgetting Smitten. You're also forgetting how similar it was to the narrator's ideal world free from change
@@reubensalter8125 But all can be true interpretation. That's part of what's so good about this game.
God, that ending where you take her out of the cabin got me. I don’t cry at a lot of things, but goddamnit, that was powerful. Easily one of the best routes in the game and I’m not afraid to say it.
22:17 When the Narrator said that, it indicated that he was starting to have doubts about his decision to slay the princess.
SMITTEN WHAT HAVE YOU DONE???
He really bared his heart.
What he always does when he has a smidgeon of control: Ruin everything. Blind devotion will only ever destroy bridges, it never builds them. Even when it does, they aren't stable for long
@@kokirij0167 Eh, I wouldn't say he always ruins things. Like any other voice he has the chance to do good or bad things just that unlike most voices he has enough willpower to force you to do them. The Cold or the Opportunistic will always try to make you pick shitty options but never force you to take them.
@@kingragnarok7302 Yeah, I know, I was being hyperbolic. Sorry if that didn’t come through. He does kill you in two routes though, iirc the only other voices that do that are Broken and Skeptic, both in only one route each.
@@kokirij0167 Blind, and *excessive* devotion/love will always, albeit, unintentionally bad. As they say, the path to hell is paved with good intentions.
So did anyone else get Voice of the Opportunist instead of Voice of the Paranoid when doing this route? From what I can tell the difference seems to be choosing *when* to suggest staying in the cabin, for Paranoid you do it in the basement and for Opportunist you do it just before leaving the cabin.
What I find interesting is how different the roles either voice plays in this chapter while accompanied by the Voice of the Hero and Narrator, Paranoid is obviously suspicious from the start and seems to catch on to what's going on as soon as the player enters the "basement", meanwhile Opportunist is more than happy to indulge in what's going on, almost to an ignorant degree, and you don't even get any dialogue confirming Smitten is the shadow when Opportunist is present.
It's honestly rather unsettling but I think that really adds to this new route of being unfulfilled in paradise so to speak, you have one voice who's painfully aware of the cracks in "perfection" and another that holds onto it for as long as it can.
That's not Contrarian, that's Opportunist. He knows how to play the game and helps us win it.
If it were Contrarian he'd not want to play the game and he'd try to ruin the dance by playing some more uplifting 80's style music from a boombox that somehow attracts other perspectives and turns into a party. 😂
@@reubensalter8125 OMG I DIDN'T EVEN REALIZE 😭
Thank you for pointing that out but damn--
I'm changing that rn I'm so dumbbbb I genuinely get those two kinda mixed up all the time
@@wornoutrei Hey don't worry. It's an easy mistake to make since they sound so similar. They are voiced by the same person after all. 😁
I didn't even realise there was a way you could get someone other than the opportunist! Now that I've seen both, the difference in tone is really apparent.
I got the opportunist, and even him got tired of the whole situation
Maybe it's just me, but when you spin around with her
I wish Smitten had said something. Not overly dramatic, not hammed up. Something Simple. Subtle. Genuine.
One can say the love that was burning out was a symbol of the smitten and unchecked love, but I like to think of it like the honeymoon phase of a relationship. Holding hands when it grows cold, and swaying in the stars, turns it from raw unchecked passion to true smitten beauty.
In a way, same. When we were dancing, I thought to myself, "Smitten would be proud"
But I'm glad he didn't actually show up in the end. He's one of my favourites, but I think, at this point, it was best for them to finally have some time apart. For both of their sakes.
I think the whole point is he disappears after the lights go out.
Plus, he's still genuine in Thorn.
@@reubensalter8125 Yeah, and I'm pretty sure Smitten disappearing when the fourth light goes out represents him finally letting her go. He never truly wanted to do this, the princess even says her self that "he's tired"
And of course we can't forget about him in the Thorn when we see him at his best. It saddens me to see people taking only the worst part of him and saying that's how he truly is. They only focus on a single side of him, which is a bit ironic since a huge part of this game is finding love in all shapes and sizes.
@@CowMalicious9479such is the nature of humanity. Unfortunately it is all too easy to just not seek every aspect of something.
@@fishyfishyfishy500akabs8 True :(
I just did my first playthrough, this was my first ending, and it was a hundred times more wholesome than I ever expected, seeing her happy and smiling so genuinely just made me smile and sometimes, an old-fashioned fairy-tale ending is exactly what we all need.
Getting my wish of a romantic dance fulfilled in the best way possible.
I love that in all the entire context of it. This voice really is just how the character processes it outside of your control. So it's like it's not just that she was unhappy about the situation. The moment you ask her what she wants, she becomes so one-dimensional. She starts to physically fall apart and can not maintain a detailed appearance and starts to slowly unravel as a character she had no desire. And then as soon as you mention staying in the cabin she becomes normal again because she's not unraveling because she has an actual thought there and she's not happy with the decision the one time she shows her actual emotion.And it has to do with not staying there with you.And then the smitten responds as such like an obsessed tweaker fricking funny then dark after sitting with the ending.
It should be noted; Damsel *does* mention first she wants to leave the cabin, then after that she says she just wants to make you happy. Pressing her on the matter is what deconstructs her because by doing that you *perceive* her to be a being with zero wants outside of you when she in fact does. You (the main character) just don't find her answer satisfying. If you decide to leave you let go of those thoughts and accept her at her word, if you decide to stay her confliction makes you see her as more three-dimensional.
It's why putting her at odds with her two desires by suggesting to stay causes the conflict in Happily Ever After; she is staying to make you happy but she's not fulfilled herself being cooped up in the cabin forever. She panics as the fires go out because it means you're not happy and she can't even have her other desire fulfilled.
@@michaelcoleman2173 but that's why it's so great it's about perspective metaphorically and literally although that is the case, and that's the reason for it your character or rather his voices can't perceive it as such.Since they can't remember that's an actual option only what he sees in this route it leads to the same conclusion you are right that is exactly what happened, but to the character it is as I said she had no desire other than those two things but once put into the confliction of what she wants. She shows actual conclusion and it's nothing that the Smitten expected because although she wants to make you happy.
That's only specific to this princess wanting to leave is the constant they all yearn to leave.
Also I like your perception of it the character really is as impassive as a player would be it makes her liking your character. All the more fulfilling, since it's not just a monster but a monster that just stares in the silence wanting more perspective just to not become bored.
Didn't expect this type of ending, especially with smitten.
Like I knew smitten was a psycho in the other endings but to think he would ended up becoming the one to open the narrator's eyes and make him doubt his ideals. Its honestly unexpected.
Can I mention something? I think during the route, Smitten realizes that what he was doing was wrong after the last torch goes out. I was SO ready to have to fight some sort of monstrous beast version of him but instead the princess and us just... left. It makes me really sad because in all honesty, it's our fault that he ended up going this extreme. Not defending what he does at all, but still.
The new routes are so good.
Favourite princess unlocked
I admit that this path got better. The damsel was soo cut and dry. Like love is not just make you happy, I am sure if I was like 10 I would loved her, but as you grow up forever happiness in love is not real. But bringing up the "happy ever after" bs it really made this path so much better and I started to enjoy the Damsel for reaching the potential I wished she had. Not to mention the awareness of happyless love life. It felt so right.
They did a fantastic job, I felt sooo many emotions and seen the Narator feeling the stagnation as something worst than the end of the world, it gave him a bit more character than I didn't even thought he needed.
Ok game good job you made me simp for the damsel, you happy now?
Damn I made like a tier for all the princess and before the pristine cut she was like D (S,A to D, didn't felt like putting E or F, felt too cruel), she really jump to A super fast on this path. I mean the happy ever after did go S and damsel received A thanks to it. Yeah she got better when we got paid out with her having more characteristics than just "she loves us and want to make us happy"
yeah...
@@FratoiuAlexYeah but you do remember the Burned Grey exists right? And that she always wanted to leave from the beginning? And that she always had that agency in her, she just didn't know it yet?
@@FratoiuAlexAgain, and I keep saying this I know but it's important, she wants to leave. She's always wanted to leave. Even before the Pristine Cut came that's all she ever wanted besides our happiness. She only deconstructed because we ignored it. And in Burned Grey she got that agency back but buffed, to the point where she felt she had to destroy the cabin in order for both of us to be together.
"There's always been cold here"
Fuck, that hurt, didn't it?
I like that they maintained that the Smitten is *not* like the other voices. He has his own motivations , and the strength to bring his goals to fruition. He’s the only voice that kills us.
Skeptic will also kill you in the Prisoner route if you keep being fine with the Narrator's reward and the other voices can make you do things (such as Contrarian throwing the blade out the window in one version of the Razor route).
@@lucaswilliams2292 Not really:
Skeptic does it too: we either let him do it with the blade or he stops our heart.
Broken also does it but he was kinda being led by the Tower.
Outside of that, Contrarian throws the blade out the window in Razor and now Fury along with Stubborn, Hunted dodges without us telling him to, also in Razor and Cheated takes us straight to the cabin.
oof! the symbolism goes HARD on this one chat !!
such a beautiful route, seeing the narrator slowly realize where he went wrong was incredibly well done
Wow okay some of the things some of the Voices can potentially get up to in this update are *messed up*
Any singular and uncontested emotion can be VERY dark and messed up.
Exactly, it’s why the routes where you can’t or don’t use your influence to rein them in almost invariably end in pain and tragedy. Not just this one but also Princess and Dragon for Opportunist, and to an extent Cage for Skeptic. This applies to some of the preexisting routes as well, updated or not; Broken is particularly dangerous in the Tower and the new Den content can result in you losing control over Hunter, for example. And listening to Cold too much in the Spectre can lead to the Wraith and he’s also incredibly unhelpful in both Grey routes as well. And so on.
@@오주환-b1n Actually it's not listening to Cold that gets you to Wraith because he doesn't really care what you do as long as you do it, and he's just being pragmatic and throwing suggestions in the air. It's more about not being able to make an actual decision, and instead either doing the same thing over and over again or not doing anything at all, something he himself is against. It's a complete contrast to Nightmare where your decisiveness is what leads to Wraith instead. Also he's extremely helpful and amazing in the greys - he correctly identifies them as dead and he puts Smitten in his place and he's extremely good as Skeptic's detective partner.
And Cage doesn't end in pain or tragedy if you can't reign Skeptic in, because it's still a beautiful ending - it ends in a dance too. Plus the more tragic one is where you do reign him in, or rather convince him to briefly adopt a different worldview.
Also slight correction it's Apotheosis, not Tower.
And you left out Stubborn who's basically enabling Hunted at that point in Den.
Wow, the Pristine Cut really came out swinging with this emotional gut punch
This is Rivalling the Thorn Kiss, DAMN this one hurts.
This is honestly id say the "Narrators" best possible ending. I always loved how the reward has been related to the "Happily ever after" of fairytales and taken to a literal sense, eternal blissful happiness, and in turn the horrors that come with it, this route directly making the connection and showing it for what it truly is is honestly id say one of the most impactful parts.
(Spoilers for the ending/endings)
Quite sadly then that, if this is one of your routes, you get the chance to talk to the Echo about how a version of himself doubted the mission, and though there is a tiny bit of trepidation in his voice, he chalks it up to a mere delusion on part of the version that choose that, that one version among many doesn't mean anything.
I did find it neat they added something new to your final conversation with the Narrator from this route.
this is the most precious one of all these paths
This route and thorns route maaan, they are pure peak
Important reminder: if you're in a relationship where your SO behaves in any creepy way similair to The Smitten, RUN! (Don't enter a abusive relationship or atleast leave it as soon as possible when you can)
Hey man, could you give me some help? I'm gonna genuinely ask here, you seem to have experience with the topic, how can I stop being like the smitten? like, I can't exactly see what is wrong with the things that he does, but I can see for sure that there is _something_ wrong.
I see a lot of myself in him and how I've been acting with people and genuinely want to change and not be like him, but I really don't have any idea how.
I'd really appreciate any advice.
@@ChynoachI saw your comment, and have the advice to you as a married man.
Dont strive for perfection, strive to BE perfection. Understand that you, as who you really are, are all you (and she) needs to be.
Smitten tries to be everything he can be FOR someone else…everyone except himself, and that is what causes him to remove himself from the equation. He becomes a shadow over the princess because his “sacrifice” becomes a curse, and burden that she can never be free from as long as she believes she must continue to proving herself to everyone but herself.
Understand this, life NEEDS you to be different. It needs you to embrace the flaws that you see in yourself so that you can become the real you
And not just a voice in your head.
@@kunami13sora well, I don't really know who I am when I'm not being someone else for her/other people. I guess this would be more on the "self-discovery" side of things, wich, ironically enough, I also got zero idea on how to work on either. But, i guess I'm closer to my final goal now than before. Thank you so much for making this more clear to me, even though it's still confusing, this will be the next step on the right direction.
Thanks so much for the help!! Really appreciate it.
@@Chynoach there isn't a manual on self discovery, but it is the easiest thing to find once YOU become the priority of your life.
Remember, before you put on another's oxygen mask on a plane, you put YOURS on first so that you can be the best version of yourself when you inevitably help others.
As long as you continue moving forward, there is no wrong step. Keep moving forward and the world will break itself open to the real you.
I genuinely never grew to like the Narrator in the previous release. I understand his motives and understand that he isn't necessarily evil but it felt out of character to be sad about his death. I didn't hate him and I didn't want him to suffer in his death but he just seems incapable of change or new perspective. Understandably, he always starts fresh but he always felt like a nuisance while acting like the player was one. I never liked games that felt like it hated how it gave players agency. At least, this was done by a character unlike something like Bioshock or Telltale games where player choice felt like it was given out of obligation. The narrator needed to not change his mind for the narrative to work but it is nice to see that there is a glimpse of humanity in one of his iterations. He learn the necessity of change in the hard way.
Its also because the Narrator is but a fragment of what he once was, everytime you reset, a part of him dies along with it, he is already shattered just to get one single shot at his goal, he cant change his world wiew else that means his end, but in a world without change preserving everything means preserving him too, a fragmented shell forced to forever narrate an unchanging tale forever, knowing that without change, his existance never mattered. Every route is basically that way, attempting to end change before realising he cant, and giving up in some way, by convincing itself that you wont listen to him when in truth he stopped believing it ever since the scenario already repeated a few times, or here, by acknowledging that his ideal was flawed at its core
I felt more sympathy for the narrator when I saw the one line the echo can give about how even in his ideal world there could still be some change left
Player: “If I destroy her how is that existence any better than death? Or even different from death at all? Honestly it feels worse”
Narrator: “When I broke the cycle, I made sure the tear was rough. You carry a part of what should be her, and she carries a part of what should be you. Things won’t be as they are now, but they won’t be nothing, either.
Besides… anything is better than oblivion. In the end, nobody wants to leave”
The greatest weakness of the Narrator was playing himself as a narrator, unable to be grounded with the interactions with the Princess or Quiet and being unable to relate to either of them due to hostility or feelings of superiority.
Along with this, he can’t adapt to the world resets, meaning he becomes stuck and stale. All of this leads The Long Quiet to become slowly resentful towards the narrator via the various voices opinions.
Its nice to see there is more on this pristine cut
i wonder what new things i haven't seen yet
Smitten's shadow getting smaller each time a torch goes out is a cool detail.
My favorite route in this game fr, yeah call me corny and romantic dumbass. I don't care. I loved how the protagonist and the princess dance at the end before the world crumbles down, really feeling that one on my heart
This has to be my new favorite route. The Thorn will always be up there for me. but this one hits hard and the fact that even the Narrator finally sees what he's been doing for this one route, is just beautiful. Also wtf Smitten being toxic in this relationship (or maybe just misguided but still), i thought he was just funny/goofy before, This route alone knocked him down a bit on my favorite voices list.
I would certainly classify Smitten's *behavior* as toxic, however I don't feel like Smitten is actively trying to be malicious here. Rather, like all the other voices, there are times where his worldview is useful and times where it's not, and that nearly everything is better in moderation, not extremes.
You.. defeat the narrator. More than just skirting his plans you make him realize that he was wrong from the start when you show him what his happy ending would be. This almost feels like a true ending.
You... don't defeat him; he realises his mistake on his own without your or anyone else's input. Plus he hates the way the princess is being treated, and he accepts that he was wrong and is happy that he was.
@reubensalter8125 I'm not sure what you considered defeated. He acknowledges that he was wrong after being shown the horrifying reality of what he was trying to accomplish. You don't get much more defeated than that in a philosophical disagreement.
@@soujemn5 Again that's not really defeat, that's self reflection. And even if those are two very different things, you can have one without the other.
@@reubensalter8125 i don't think you understands what defeat means
@@soujemn5 I do. And again we don't do anything to him; if anything, he defeats himself
Didn’t realise that if you bring Her The Damsel then you can’t bring Her The Happy Ending and vice versa.
@@selder_7 Yeah because HE is the extended path of Damsel, much like how Eye of the Needle is an extension to Adversary, or Den is to Beast.
The first time I’ve felt good about the narrator
The smitten truly has a disturbing and, frankly, *startling* amount of influence over not only us, but clearly, the world itself, when his passions run deep enough... We've seen the voices in our head revolt before, they ARE capable of making their own decisions and influencing others (such as the skeptic and the paranoid refusing to let you move on without the blade in the prisoner/the cage), but... This?
He created all of this. He has total control over it all, over US (and the princess), so long as the torches stay lit. He escaped being just a voice in our head - he managed to CREATE a physical presence, even if only a shadow... That is INSANE. Just think of what he else he could be capable of, if he wasn't so psychotically in love, if he could redirect that emotional strength...
it's so insane yet telling seeing the narrator experiencing the stagnation he craved and realizing what he's put you and the princess through that even HE didn't want you to do the thing he created you with the sole purpose for
It show also the toxic love of a self obssesed one ... Smitten is such a nice simp , always want to pleased, to be at the service of the princess but he dont really love her , he act like a servant but never like an equal , in the end he is abusive to her and scare her because , he in love with an idea not the real her
That's why the Adversary has way more healthy relationships with the Princess in his route XD
@@SkarrierYou mean Stubborn right?
@@reubensalter8125 Oh, yeah, the Stubborn voice and Adversary route
@@Skarrieryeah but the point of that is that no conflict has never been resolved tho
Honestly, I'd love for someone in the comments to discuss about the meaning of the "Keep the last torch aflame" ending in the context of each route reflecting a kind of dysfunctional relationship. It's interesting to me.
Is this some allegory for abuse? The princess isn't truly happy but is forced to, Smitten tries everything except give her what she really needs, to able to leave. This is what a loveless relationship is isn't it?
I like to think that aside from the third ending. It's basically an allegory of a couple who used to be infatuated with each other but that fiery spark of love slowly burns out, leaving out a now numbing cold love life that both couples desperately attempt to re-spark but to no avail and all they just need is to let go. It was nice, they still cared for each other. But they need to take a break or go their separate ways
its more like an after getting together in love you always ask what now?
as you both never thought what would happen after this
To my mind The Smitten is just the desire to keep you happy together forever, but as the path shows that’s just not possible.
I don’t think her wanting to leave is her rejecting you, it’s just accepting that this ‘perfect moment’ can’t last and things need to change, by leaving the moment
For me, I think this route is showing how a love like that of the Smitten can be smothering. He doesn't hurt the Princess, but look at what he becomes once he is with her now. He's an enormous shadow looming over the Princess that does so many "nice" things for her. Damsel is pressured to be the perfect lover to reciprocate and show gratitude to her lover, but when even she grows tired of everything, she immediately feels regret at expressing it because "how can you be tired of someone being so nice to you?" Smitten's love is overbearing and overpowers the princess completely. It isn't until the last of the torches go out that the Smitten's shadow disappears, finally allowing the Damsel to express herself and her own wants.
It is smothering.
Either the stuff on the table is changing, or you're changing (though there is some relative change between you and the table-stuffs). Isn't that still an admission that things haven't quite gotten the way you're supposed (by the Narrator) to have them? If things don't have to change, your feelings of happiness and contentment don't have to change.
Is it that the Narrator's pursuit is pointless when you can't halt the organic process of reaction and transformation? Did He just not think this through, or...?
The games clearly changed, too, by the way. Unless you're going for an infinite set of elements to work with - which you won't get if the universe is finite - there's still a limited number of permutations of games you can play, in terms of both rules and progressions. Yet it seems like we can still be fond of playing games and coming up with new arrangements of old, classic elements until we die. I mean, you're not supposed to die, but, isn't what dying does just reset your memory and shuffle who you are and make you forget every time, distracting you from the limited possibilities of an isolated finite reality, even if that reality repeats itself forever? And that reality doesn't necessarily have to include suffering, unless every possibility necessarily has to be realised, or some other mechanism. Can't you just always reset your hedonic adaptation and desensitisation without dying? Can you transform and be brought to certain states while remaining alive and intact and well? Ah, this is all just the stuff I mentioned at first, isn't it
It's the same thing with the food. There are limited possibilities. Sure, the perception of each taste, texture and effect component might seem continuous, but if you keep trying to have different things, they'll just become imperceptible variations of each other. You just forget all the time through imperfect memory and death in order to fight your hedonic adaptation and desensitisation, but, you don't need to have those constraints. Surely
I think we finally have figured out what the narrator truly wanted for a perfect world,
It was, infact,a world without death, but..
Instead of death, there was an excuse in it's place,forgetting everything you achieved just so you could repeat it, doesn't sound as bad initially,but, when you start thinking about it,Is It truly better than death? if without it, without forgetting, everything eventually gets dull,as you experience everything you could possible achieve,infact reaching an end,but the end is... Just that an ending, it's a conclusion,but a conclusion to all your limited growing and learning,that leaves you with nothing but well, nothing left.
It truly feels like trying to salvage an idea that simply just doesn't work out..
*Isn't that what a desperate person would do?*
Sorry for my derailing, just wanted to share my view on what I believe is the narrator's perspective
I watched the first version of this game last year, right before a breakup. Now, seeing this new release with even better writing and storytelling, I get how much this game really is a love story-for better or worse. Sure, the situations are totally over the top, but you can still feel the parallels. It hits differently this time around. I really love this game :)
From the moment you see the clawed shadow, this keeps gets more and more disturbing 😂
“And they lived happily ever after?”
Narrator-“No… I don’t think they did.”
Narrator later-"But they just might after all."
26:52
I got this on my 4th path on my 1st playthrough and it emotionally destroyed me... I wish I could have a happy ending like that...
the echo got a taste of his dream world. and that broke him, for reality was not what he envisioned. Apathy is the fate of his world and he came to the realisation that he would choose death and all the suffering he resisted over it. he saw the end of the fairy tale he was writing, then he tossed away the pen in dispair. it was a truth he could not deny.
Didn't see that happy ever after to me
It's pretty sure take comment on fairy-tales with there happy ever after. In books is just a nice way to say the end. But realistically how long is that ever after happiness. As much as we all want a happy love life, it's not always this way. We as humans are creatures of chaos, we can't always be happy or be sad, but we need both emotions to happen. A happy relationship, no a Real relationship is not when a couple is constantly happy, is one that keeps life goin, accept change, expirience life and it's trials, and built trust and communication on whatever life delivers to us. Death needs life and Life needs Death. This is why immortality is a wrong wish for us mortals.
And I want to ad Mark of Cain. We all know the story of Cain killing his brother Abel, and receiving the punishment of immortality. Some say how is that a punishment? Well at some point you will expirience everything life can give and at some point you get bored of it, in specially been also limited of your power.
@@FratoiuAlex
It is exploring the darker side of the Damsel route. The Damsel is the idealized victim. She only wants what the Player wants. When I played this route previously, I thought that it was weird but figuring it out later when we leave sounded like a reasonable thing to do since how is she supposed to know living in a dungeon. However fears about not being compatible creeps in, you aren't going like the same things & being a different being is the point of a relationship.
@MrSilentProtagonist exactly. Like as you said is the ideal victim that can be abused and manipulated. Of course it's not super dark, but it's good enough to give the idea that love is not that simple. To me it rubs me wrong when someone is super obedient to the point that they don't show much of a desire for themselves. It is nice to care for others, but don't forget to care for yourself more. Yes I know she wants to leave and everything, but she was fine with what ever you suggest, which for me lack of agency can affect you (when I refer lack I don't mean completely out of it, it's there, but it's like at the minimum and waiting to be told what to do, I say this because some think I talk about extrem parts and wanted to clear that confusion). Anyway I loved this part it made me feel a lot more out of it.
@@MrSilentProtagonistWell actually she does want to leave, she's always wanted that in addition to us being happy. So when we suggest staying here it sets off an internal conflict. I think you can guess what happens next.
Also here she doesn't want what the player wants, she wants what Smitten wants.
@@FratoiuAlexBut she did show a desire for herself before. She wanted to leave. It was just hidden.
This was my first route after I bought this game and honestly it will probably stay as my favorite. I haven't seen every route but I've seen maybe half or so and now am able to acknowledge how special it is that The Narrator changed his mind. In the ending sequence where we talk with him there's an option to talk about when he changed his mind here and since it was my first playthrough I didn't really appreciate just how unique this was. Playthroughs where we go against the rigid narrator and either change or overcome him as seen in The Den ending. All I'm saying is I fuck with this game heavy and will probably 100% it in the coming days cause I sure as hell want to experience everything this has to offer.
We didn't overcome him in Fury? We just told him to dictate what happens because we need him to describe it for it to happen. That's not really overcoming, that using him to our advantage.
If you want an example where we do overcome him despite everything he throws at us, I'd say freeing the Den.
@reubensalter8125 I have not seen The Den yet so no idea about that particular one. I'd also say that it is directly overcoming him. As much as he likes to say that he just narrates the truth of the matter it has been shown that he's not doing that at all and can manipulate the world somewhat. An example of that would be closing the door and dropping the sword to us before forcing us to try and slay the princess. He has been shown to have the ability to manipulate the narration to his wants so I'd say that being able to go against him saying that we die and cease existing is overcoming him somewhat.
@@gabrielr1199 Yeah but he's not exactly powerful, especially in Fury - he disappears around the same time. I'd just call that a coincidence. In Den, I won't spoil it but he definitely becomes more antagonistic and worth overcoming.
@@reubensalter8125 I'll try to get The Den later today and I'll get back to you on this, seems like a necessary part of the discussion.
@@reubensalter8125Yeah, fair enough. I assume you mean the whole buried thing? I can see how it's more fitting as an example.
I think i would like to dance under the stars.
But there arent any stars here. Id have to leave.
This is my new favorite route because dancing with the Princess under the stars is too damn sweet for hopeless-romantic heart.
Wow i change my mind about smitten i dont think i can remember him the same anymore
:( I love smitten I need a palate cleanser
We only saw him like this in one chapter in the entire game. So don't base your whole opinion on him from that. Try to take into consideration what he's like in all the other chapters. A loving, compassionate guy who holds no standards for his beloved to reach, because he will always love and accept her for who she is :)
It's just that in this route, he's in an extremely toxic mindset despite his good intentions. Leading him to making bad decisions and harmful actions.
Think about the Thorn route, in this chapter, he was in a much healthier, less desperate and toxic mindset. So he was able to make much better decisions that gave much better results. We see who he truly is in the Thorn, where he's at his best.
What we saw in Happily Ever After was truly horrible and will forever stain our opinion on Smitten, and that's ok. As long as we remember that this isn't all there is to him.
Every emotion can be bad on its own, even love
Dont remember Smitten for this, remember him for his best (thorn)
@@n4n4sh1_ Exactly! People need to remember that all these voices are extremes of a certain emotion. So of course when giving too much control or listened to too much, it will cause them to go down hill. You, the player and Voice of the Hero are the ones keeping them under control. Keeping them grounded. On their own, every voice can become dangerous. This was just Smitten's moment of having too much control (Worsened by the fact that he was in an unhealthy mindset at the time). The Thorn is a great example of him at his best because he's in a healthy mindset, is very considerate and understanding of how the princess is feeling and helps us get one of the most wholesome and romantic moments in the entire game!
Smitten is a loving, compassionate guy who cares deeply for the princess. So we should remember him at his best, while also acknowledging his worst side, and accepting it as a _part_ of who he is without making it his whole thing.
Remember, no matter which or how good the emotions are, if it's too strong, it'll end up in violence.
Smitten is by far the strongest voice
I think in my last relationship I was the princess, sacrificing a good amount of myself to make the other person happy and placated, and when I… became fragile and empty, she left me.
She never mistreated me, I just became something that wasn’t truly myself around her because I was so desperate to feed her own insecurities at the cost of myself.
The cold “It’s finally over” from the princess is exactly how I felt when I received the breakup text after three and a half years, as heartbroken as it made me.
The narrator is amazing character. He isn't a bad person and never wanted to hurt you but he was misguided. He was a man who feared death to the point of wanting to eliminate it for everyone around him (not himself). That's why he refuses to accept that he is wrong bxz that means he sacrificed his life and all his work was for nothing and he was wrong
AMN Even the Narrator Changed
Is this… actually an ending?
28:15 knew it, *CANT HAVE SHIT IN DETROIT*
But hey - at least we got that dance
@@reubensalter8125 at least I guess..
@@reubensalter8125 a sad but beautiful farewell
Can't have shit nowhere it seems
@@EldenLord-wh4ov But we did have it - we got to dance. We didn't get anything with Thorn.
You know, looking at it from this perspective, I wonder if something like this was what the other Voices saw in the Princess and The Dragon route? The princess with a looming shadow behind her?
Probably not. We're not as powerful as we are in the spaces between.
Love and courtship isn't about becoming happy. It's about being together because you want to be with that person, not because you want happiness. I wish the princess had realised that, then maybe she wouldn't have left after realising how cold it is. Being free from the basement wasn't any different from being in it, but at least knowing there's someone who wants to be there with you not for happiness but only for you, then maybe she would have stayed.
this route is really interesting since it basically gives the Narrator a taste of what he wants; a still world that doesn't change.
but if you had all the time in the world to do whatever you wanted, eventually; you will run out of things to do. the new is only new and novel for a short period of time and then they become mundane, ordinary, dull. just another nail in the wall like the rest.
what's the point of enjoying a life that can never end? immortality can be paramount to torture, an eternity of boredom and stagnation.
things need to be finite to have value, there was actually a period in time on our planet where trees _couldn't rot_ since the bacteria and fungi that can decompose wood hadn't evolved yet so you had piles and piles of dead trees just lying on top of each other, its actually where a large chunk of petrified wood and coal comes from.
change isn't necessarily bad, while an old dead tree is sad, its food for the rest of the forest like mushrooms or homes for animals that could nest inside of it, or it could be cut down and processed into timber that could be used to build something entirely new.
It really is sad to see the Narrator so destroyed, and yet it's also the thing that I wanted to see the most. To have him finally realize the error of his ways, that the unchanging world he wanted so badly was truly worse than death, and to understand why we need change, why we need endings.
When I played this version I felt wrong because of mine character/experiences. I felt like I once again Im on someone strings, felt like someone is pulling them and I cant do anything about that. This make me anxius because ages ago I said to myself "Never again" and that felling of being once again a puppet and pretending everything is fine was... A nightmare. I wanted to be free, even if that ment misery or darkness around me.
This was so good. I actually don't want to see the other paths for this route because I'm afraid of what I'll find. 😅
I slayed the Princess when she asked me if I still cared about her because i thought it was a funny option... a part of me will never recover.
I haven't even seen it all yet, holy cow!
i'm literally sobbing rn i did not expect this to be so sad what the flip 😭😭😭
Fun fact: If you ask her what does she really want then she says that she wants to dance under the stars. If you take her outside, then says that she really meant it 😔
@@dark_wolf260But it's not sad, it's happy. Truly happy 😊
That’s interesting….. I just had a very…. Disturbing realization about this game…. The quiet and the shifting mound or the player, and the princess are indeed two Godly entities…. Capable of boundless to even unlimited amounts of power… But they’re trapped in an endless loop of realities that they can’t escape from no matter how hard they try and there are hundreds Thousands to even millions or possibly even infinite versions of them that are all lesser, but are equally needed in order for them to exist….. When one or more of these Versions of the quiet and the princess leave the cabin and actually leave, They return to their original forms which in Other videos of this game, I refer to as the connected Quiet and princess, which are versions of them connected to all of the others, It’s evident through their appearances. I believe that it’s actually not their fault that they’re here… It can’t be their fault. Yes, they created this reality. Sure, but the quiet was influenced in order to shackle the mound and split them both apart so that the reality never ends because something else is here. Something far darker and far far more sinister. I’m talking about the voices…. I think these are malevolent entities that hold these two gods hostage, Seeking for them ascend to actual godhood so that they may escape the reality that was created by these two gods and infect more worlds that they intern either create or escape to. The narrator is a being that seeks to control the quiet and have all the power by not sharing it with the princess, a.k.a. slaying the princess. The paranoid seems to be an entity that eirs on the side of manipulative caution Though I’m not entirely sure what it wants. The smitten Is obsessed with the Shifting mound and wants her for himself. Forgive me if I can’t remember the others, but even still, my point stands. No matter how much these two know or how much these two achieve, These voices will always be there to ensure that certain outcomes happen so that they benefit. I think that’s still why the connected ending where the connected versions of the quiet and the princess escape by leaving the cabin is actually the best ending because there are no voices, The last one stays behind, which is the voice of the hero because he’s the only one that genuinely wants the best for both of them, but specifically for the quiet because this version of the voices from everything I’ve seen is more or less a reflection of the quiet itself.
I'm not in a relationship, but this felt too real.
SMITTEN WHHHHHYYYYYYY YOU WERE MY FAVORITE
He can still be
@n4n4sh1_
Yes he is still my favorite.
I wish the voice of smitten was in the happy ending 😢
Uhhh I guess if he was still in our body
but the shadow honestly no he’s basically fallen to the deep end tho
This ending I feel, truly shows how much they need eachother, and how much existance needs bith of them. chadont see how the world is if you kill the Shifting Mound in the end, but now, right here, we do, and I love that the narrator learns the Long Quietjmay be safer, a world without destruction or death....but its also meaningless. Shallow. Just as painful.
amn should have expected more Emotional Damage
I think the "controlling love" was good enough of Emotional damage.
@@FratoiuAlex more like love expectations after infatuation
This might be the only route that I was genuinely sad that the grabby hands took her away, the thorn was close for me, but i genuinely wanted to stay with this princess and it broke my heart to have her taken away
But at least we got to dance with her. Right?
Plus it would go against the whole theme of the chapter if they just stayed there forever. In the end, everything has to.
Such a lovely ending. Exactly scenes what I want in my life and dream.
My cold heart cracked up a little here.
imagine if they add an ending where you could destroy the solid wall and see what's behind it truly.
You basically do that in the godhood ending and get some glimpses beyond the wall in the Apotheosis route.
@CrankyTemplar good to know
maybe I'll start playing this game , i only avoided it because i was really busy.
smitten be wildin
PRISTINE CUT IS OUT?!?
Wonder what the Long Quiet Narrator thinks of this one. I wonder if it's possible to make this narrator the one that you confront when the mirror shatters.
You can bring it up during your conversation at the mirror and the Narrator will dismiss it as one version out of trillions that happened to be delusional.
@CrankyTemplar ouch
The smittens voice sounds a lot different here to me- it almost sounds like that one lego ad guy lol- “a man has fallen into the river in lego city!!!”
Holy smokes, i haven't played the pristine cut yet but it looks wonderful! Genuinely every criticism i had with the original game was answered.
As someone who broke up because of the same reasons the damsel and the protagonist felt stifled, this hits a little too close to home.
Here we are... RUclips algorithms like: "Hey, you haven't watch the video about this game in a while!"
Now I just need to add something like "Have YOU considered slaying the princess today?"
Question could you do the others like the other endings of the Pristina cont❤❤❤
Please hopefully❤
There are other extras added to other paths, all you have to do is find them yourself
i wonder how many new ones
I do intend to compile other routes, I'm just hopping between this and Observation Duty 7. Hopefully both will be finished over the weekend. I also second playing the game as well if you get the chance, it's well worth experiencing on your own the first time around!
@@CrankyTemplar very true
I’m teary eyed
"Reverse-reverse psychology" is really something a paranoid "entity" would say
Smitten a D1 crashout