Correct sizing of your battery is very important. I added a Powerwall this July to complement my solar array. Effectively go off grid in summer and pay 7.5p per kWh in winter to charge PW and EV. PW has ample capacity to run house each day even in mid December. The fact that it’s thermally managed also means no drop off in charge/discharge rates in depths of winter.
Time for you to add a second battery! I built my own small 1000 watt system here in Jamaica and it supplies about half my power. Definitely worth it. Cheers!
@@Prince-fr2lr No, they are ground mounted on a wooden frame. The property is rented so cant put stuff on the roof. I got another panel so now im up to 1330 watts and a second 100ah LiFePo4 battery is on its way. I'm addicted to solar and its my hobby that saves me money.
These guys installed my panels for me! They couldn’t have been more professional and helpful. Answered every query I had (and I had a lot!). Highly recommended
Had 19 415w panels with optimisers on each panel. 9.5kw givenergy battery gen3 and givenergy gen3 inverter for just under £12k installed. East west facing but generating well from October install
Solar seems so much more complex than standard electricity installation. A fuse box and a metre but from what I see here, so many gadgets for solar. I was wondering about the outside of the house when the panels are added onto to the roof or wherever. What kind of trailing is there? If you have an aerial, for example, there is a cable running along an outside wall. Solar panels that I have seen have only been from a distant and only the roof. I haven't seen any close up of the outside of any home.
That 3rd install with the flat panels, eeek! All the water pooling is going to create moss etc, blocking the sunlight. He should get those panels tilted. Hope you gave him that advice 🤞
I had our system put in in September 2022. It's a west facing, 8 x 395W JA Solar panel array (3.16kWp) coupled with Growatt 3.68 kW inverter & a 3.3 kWh Growatt battery. It cost £8,750. Our annual domestic consumption is 2,050 kWh & the system, in its first year produced 2,500 kWh. We're on the Octopus Flux tariff. If I could go back in time, I would NOT have gone the solar route. It took me a while to realise it, but for low power consumers, solar is hopelessly uneconomic! Think about it. At the Octopus standard tariff of 28.8p/kWh, my 2,050 kWh would (excluding standing charge) cost £590.40/year. So the cost of the system was 14.8x my annual bill, so14.8 years until the thing breaks-even (assuming it doesn't breakdown in that period!). It's not the best investment in the world is it??
sounds similar to what I've arrived at looking at components and trying to run the numbers. What you DO get is a toy powerplant with cool components to play with on your phone. Like the miniatyre train sets retirees played with in the past. If you invest that sum instead you could easily double the money in the time it takes to make a profit with your toy powerplant system.
I'm not in the UK, but it always surprises me how little electricity you guys seem to use, obviously you use gas for a lot of your energy needs. I'm in New Zealand, and electricity is used for just about all heating, with wood burners still being used by some, but most people use heatpumps for both heating and cooling. Hot water systems are just about always electricity, often controlled to off-peak times for a small cost saving. Cooking is usually electricity too. The result is, using 10,000 kWh a year is typical for many households, so solar makes complete sense.
@@Pete856 I'm probably an atypically low user. My annual gas consumption (for heating & hot water) this year will be a mere 3,550 kWh. It's not so much because I'm a committed eco-warrior & more because I'm a lifelong tightwad! However the energy stats suggest I'm not alone. National electricity consumption has dropped from 312 TWh ten years ago to 248 TWh in 2023. Likewise gas consumption, especially since Putin invaded Ukraine, has dropped like a brick. The latest government figures suggest it dropped by 20% in 3Q23 vs 3Q22 to levels we haven't seen since the 1970s! All forms of energy in the UK are eye-wateringly high & this is giving rise to a phenomenon known as fuel poverty. This is what happens when you put a bunch of doctrinaire Right-wing reckless shitheads in charge of the country for 13 years!
If you get an EV, switch to a heatpump or induction stove etc you will benefit more and more. My long term goals is to disconnect the gas. This will take a while as I will do so as things need replacing. But the EV is what started me down this route. (I'm east west facing combo 7 panels on the East and 3 on the WEST (for now).
@@OneLessCar I've looked at it & an EV makes zero sense for me. It's not economical, practical & only marginally better environmentally. My car regularly does 70+ mpg. Last time I filled up, my petrol consumption worked out 72.4 mpg. At £1.39.9 per litre, that works out at 8.75 p/mile. Last year the car did 3,640 miles which means I spent £318 per/year on petrol. If I get an EV, my Octopus Flux cheap overnight rate is 14.79 p/kWh. Typically an EV does 3.5 miles/kWh so I'd be paying 4.22 p/mile, or £153 per year in leccy. So overall, an EV would save me £165 per year or £1,650 PER DECADE but that's before you subtract the £1,000 typical cost of having a charger installed!! In what world is that 'a good investment'??
It depends on what you call small scale for wind, if we are talking even 10kW it's pretty effective at that point if you are in a windy area without a lot of building around.
Looking at it myself at the moment. These costs seem very high compared to the systems I’ve been looking at, which seems to have equivalent functionality. Is that because hardware costs now are significantly (greater than a third less) less than they were when this was produced?
No is the answer , my neighbour has a 8 panel system on a 3 bed house,in the south generates £1 of electricity a day in the summer with the sun fully hitting it, cost 9k to install.
my 7k$usd 13 year old phev saves me $3,300/year. hard to beat the ROI of an older PHEV like a chevy volt. getting 45-50 miles range on the 10.5kwh battery (reserves the extra 6kwh so the battery basically lasts forever). I added 2x 100w solar panels to the roof of the car, just simple wired them into the low voltage system to reduce parasitic 12v load, and they paid for themselves after 3 months because solar is so cheap and gas is so expensive. the car has actually somehow gone up in value since I bought it, and it only has to last about 1 more year to be a free car. cant even make that much money putting it into the stock market unless I averaged 40% for 3 years which has never happened before.
I still think solar companies charge a fortune to install. If I could start over I’d go to companies like its technologies and buy 15-20kwh system with panels and hire an mcs registered installer to install the system. After pricing my 5.8kwh system the actual cost for hardware was just under 3k, I paid under 10k for my system to project solar. Take away scaffolding costs and instal cost, I’m sure they walked away with a healthy margin. I called them recently to add more batteries and they tried to charge me 3.5k to move up an extra 2.88kwh. And 4.5k to go to 5.7kwh. The system I have is a plug and play system. ( Fox ecs 2900 ) so I did it myself. I bought the battery for 930£ and it took me 10 minutes to install.
To add the hardware cost for 22 panels and 15-20kwh system would have cost me about 6k if I’d gone directly to a supplier. My payback would be far faster.
I don’t mind paying a company to do it myself, I’m still seeing around 20% per annum on my system which is much better then what I’m getting with money in the bank.
I don’t have a big house or an attached garage so really not an option for me. Would be interested in the yearly maintenance cost and life expectancy of the systems
Under a scheme, here in Scotland, my old croft is having Solar/Battery/ground source heat pump/Rads/Insulation, all installed for free, hopefully, it will cut my Electric bills!.
Imagine being a retailer and being forced to buy the same product you sell for the same price you charge from anyone who wants to sell it. You have to provide your product on demand as needed by the public but they can wander in at random and demand you buy what they have even if you can't sell it before it expires. Sound like a good business model to you? The poor who can't afford solar are the ones who will pay for your share of maintaining the grid. I think 4 or 5 to one is a fair ratio for using the grid as a battery. Don't like it don't sell them any and buy yourself a bigger battery. If you grew apples how many apples would you want to charge me (when I'm selling them at my convenience) to give me back an apple whenever I want it back?
Yeh for 2 people 5kWh espically with an EV isn't much, for a single person household I would say 5kWh is about enough if you are carful to move loads around to times where you are generating plenty of solar, but for 2 people 10 to 15kWh is really want you want, 5kWh is really lacking if for 2 people if you want a high self consumption. As said person 5kWh is enough to 80 - 90% of the time with some careful power usage shifting is enough to keep you off the grid, but you would probably want 10kWh so you don't have to be so mindful of moving loads to specific times. For a whole family of 4 I would I would say 15 - 25kWh is want you want depending on your usage, really I do think EV manufactorers should start doing bi-driectional AC so you can use your car as a house battery, because even a hybrid with a sensible electric range is going to have 15 - 20kWh of battery capacity and if you can use that for the evening and charge cheaply during the night that would be a pretty nice usage.
I see the government is doing away with VAT on batteries from 1st February. I intend to get 2 more then. But solar, it is the biz in summer, not so much in winter. Indeed, lately I have gone days without producing nigh on any to either export or charge the batteries.
If you’re having a system it’s the inverter and batteries that are a big portion of the cost. I’ve got 20 panels and 12Kwh batteries. I have 3 phase electrics though which is a huge advantage as I can export 8KW in summer. Standard single phase systems will likely clip during the summer. Go big as you can. Panels are the quickest payback item.
@@Lerpzoid there is no environmental benefit. Its a scam. It’s all a lie. You think one house globally makes any difference? It’s like filling up your bath and keeping water in it to stop sea levels rising. It’s a giant grift to make money from the poor. Kim Kardashian’s flies a private jet to get a cake she likes from one hotel. Some people fly to Italy to buy a pizza.
With the green deal, I don’t think you’re paying out of pocket, so you have access to funding that you wouldn’t other have access to to invest elsewhere. So I think it does make sense, but the pay back period is pretty crap.
@@trailblazer7108 what green deal? In the UK you get a heat pump paid for by other tax payers which doesn’t save any energy or money. The rest is chargeable
Except you are still consuming Electricity.... Over the period. You cannot store up your energy bills for 30years to pay out of your long term investment. Is it a good investment in certain circumstances yes - to neuter or offset a ongoing cost. Energy is the base of economy - unless Nuclear Fusion suddenly becomes viable - that will continue to a be a cost, and inflationary as demand for energy never ceases, only increases. A lack of understanding Economics screws everyone, and their decisions. My own 3.2kwh Solar - 14kwh storage system was doing great - 10% return. Then Ukraine kicked off and the cost skyrocketed and my cost of production was the same.... Smart tariff. Made another 100%, so my pay off has been enormous.
Correct sizing of your battery is very important. I added a Powerwall this July to complement my solar array. Effectively go off grid in summer and pay 7.5p per kWh in winter to charge PW and EV. PW has ample capacity to run house each day even in mid December. The fact that it’s thermally managed also means no drop off in charge/discharge rates in depths of winter.
Couldn’t agree more
Time for you to add a second battery!
I built my own small 1000 watt system here in Jamaica and it supplies about half my power. Definitely worth it. Cheers!
were you able to install it on a zinc roof?
@@Prince-fr2lr No, they are ground mounted on a wooden frame. The property is rented so cant put stuff on the roof. I got another panel so now im up to 1330 watts and a second 100ah LiFePo4 battery is on its way. I'm addicted to solar and its my hobby that saves me money.
These guys installed my panels for me! They couldn’t have been more professional and helpful.
Answered every query I had (and I had a lot!).
Highly recommended
Our pleasure!
What You installed and how much it cost😊
Had 19 415w panels with optimisers on each panel. 9.5kw givenergy battery gen3 and givenergy gen3 inverter for just under £12k installed. East west facing but generating well from October install
Who was your supplier?
Same question that price is amazing
Solar seems so much more complex than standard electricity installation. A fuse box and a metre but from what I see here, so many gadgets for solar. I was wondering about the outside of the house when the panels are added onto to the roof or wherever. What kind of trailing is there? If you have an aerial, for example, there is a cable running along an outside wall. Solar panels that I have seen have only been from a distant and only the roof. I haven't seen any close up of the outside of any home.
That 3rd install with the flat panels, eeek! All the water pooling is going to create moss etc, blocking the sunlight. He should get those panels tilted. Hope you gave him that advice 🤞
Sol Fuel did my solar system and i could not be happier in the summer months i run total off solar saves me so much money
Thanks, Stefan! We're delighted with the results!
I had our system put in in September 2022. It's a west facing, 8 x 395W JA Solar panel array (3.16kWp) coupled with Growatt 3.68 kW inverter & a 3.3 kWh Growatt battery. It cost £8,750.
Our annual domestic consumption is 2,050 kWh & the system, in its first year produced 2,500 kWh. We're on the Octopus Flux tariff.
If I could go back in time, I would NOT have gone the solar route. It took me a while to realise it, but for low power consumers, solar is hopelessly uneconomic!
Think about it. At the Octopus standard tariff of 28.8p/kWh, my 2,050 kWh would (excluding standing charge) cost £590.40/year. So the cost of the system was 14.8x my annual bill, so14.8 years until the thing breaks-even (assuming it doesn't breakdown in that period!).
It's not the best investment in the world is it??
sounds similar to what I've arrived at looking at components and trying to run the numbers. What you DO get is a toy powerplant with cool components to play with on your phone. Like the miniatyre train sets retirees played with in the past. If you invest that sum instead you could easily double the money in the time it takes to make a profit with your toy powerplant system.
I'm not in the UK, but it always surprises me how little electricity you guys seem to use, obviously you use gas for a lot of your energy needs. I'm in New Zealand, and electricity is used for just about all heating, with wood burners still being used by some, but most people use heatpumps for both heating and cooling. Hot water systems are just about always electricity, often controlled to off-peak times for a small cost saving. Cooking is usually electricity too. The result is, using 10,000 kWh a year is typical for many households, so solar makes complete sense.
@@Pete856 I'm probably an atypically low user. My annual gas consumption (for heating & hot water) this year will be a mere 3,550 kWh. It's not so much because I'm a committed eco-warrior & more because I'm a lifelong tightwad! However the energy stats suggest I'm not alone. National electricity consumption has dropped from 312 TWh ten years ago to 248 TWh in 2023. Likewise gas consumption, especially since Putin invaded Ukraine, has dropped like a brick. The latest government figures suggest it dropped by 20% in 3Q23 vs 3Q22 to levels we haven't seen since the 1970s! All forms of energy in the UK are eye-wateringly high & this is giving rise to a phenomenon known as fuel poverty. This is what happens when you put a bunch of doctrinaire Right-wing reckless shitheads in charge of the country for 13 years!
If you get an EV, switch to a heatpump or induction stove etc you will benefit more and more. My long term goals is to disconnect the gas. This will take a while as I will do so as things need replacing. But the EV is what started me down this route. (I'm east west facing combo 7 panels on the East and 3 on the WEST (for now).
@@OneLessCar I've looked at it & an EV makes zero sense for me. It's not economical, practical & only marginally better environmentally. My car regularly does 70+ mpg. Last time I filled up, my petrol consumption worked out 72.4 mpg. At £1.39.9 per litre, that works out at 8.75 p/mile. Last year the car did 3,640 miles which means I spent £318 per/year on petrol. If I get an EV, my Octopus Flux cheap overnight rate is 14.79 p/kWh. Typically an EV does 3.5 miles/kWh so I'd be paying 4.22 p/mile, or £153 per year in leccy. So overall, an EV would save me £165 per year or £1,650 PER DECADE but that's before you subtract the £1,000 typical cost of having a charger installed!!
In what world is that 'a good investment'??
Suspect the first customer wish he had got a second battery for that size array. Great setup and video.
It depends on what you call small scale for wind, if we are talking even 10kW it's pretty effective at that point if you are in a windy area without a lot of building around.
Looking at it myself at the moment. These costs seem very high compared to the systems I’ve been looking at, which seems to have equivalent functionality. Is that because hardware costs now are significantly (greater than a third less) less than they were when this was produced?
Great job guys ❤️🙏🏻💪🏻
Brilliant video from a brilliant company dedicated to customer experience and outcomes! Looking forward to the next video 👍
More to come!
No is the answer , my neighbour has a 8 panel system on a 3 bed house,in the south generates £1 of electricity a day in the summer with the sun fully hitting it, cost 9k to install.
Very interesting and informative! Thanks for the info!
Glad it was helpful!
my 7k$usd 13 year old phev saves me $3,300/year. hard to beat the ROI of an older PHEV like a chevy volt. getting 45-50 miles range on the 10.5kwh battery (reserves the extra 6kwh so the battery basically lasts forever). I added 2x 100w solar panels to the roof of the car, just simple wired them into the low voltage system to reduce parasitic 12v load, and they paid for themselves after 3 months because solar is so cheap and gas is so expensive. the car has actually somehow gone up in value since I bought it, and it only has to last about 1 more year to be a free car. cant even make that much money putting it into the stock market unless I averaged 40% for 3 years which has never happened before.
and how much is the batteries going to set you back after 10years? With Li-ion prob not as frequent but more
expensive at the moment.
A rising tide lifts all boats, but it releases yachts first.
I still think solar companies charge a fortune to install. If I could start over I’d go to companies like its technologies and buy 15-20kwh system with panels and hire an mcs registered installer to install the system. After pricing my 5.8kwh system the actual cost for hardware was just under 3k, I paid under 10k for my system to project solar. Take away scaffolding costs and instal cost, I’m sure they walked away with a healthy margin.
I called them recently to add more batteries and they tried to charge me 3.5k to move up an extra 2.88kwh. And 4.5k to go to 5.7kwh. The system I have is a plug and play system. ( Fox ecs 2900 ) so I did it myself. I bought the battery for 930£ and it took me 10 minutes to install.
To add the hardware cost for 22 panels and 15-20kwh system would have cost me about 6k if I’d gone directly to a supplier. My payback would be far faster.
I don’t mind paying a company to do it myself, I’m still seeing around 20% per annum on my system which is much better then what I’m getting with money in the bank.
you need more batteries and not more solar. you could have a heat pump for heating, looks like ground source would be good at your property
Make a video on earthing system please!
I don’t have a big house or an attached garage so really not an option for me.
Would be interested in the yearly maintenance cost and life expectancy of the systems
We'll be filming some more content around previous client soon, so will be sure to add this in.
SOUND IS SO QUIET, I CANT HEAR IT PROPERLY !!!
Under a scheme, here in Scotland, my old croft is having Solar/Battery/ground source heat pump/Rads/Insulation, all installed for free, hopefully, it will cut my Electric bills!.
Interesting.. what's the scheme called?
@@DavidBond668 My scheme, is through Union Technical, BUT, it now seems Labour has put scheme on hold!!.
Yes what’s the scheme we can then look at all this free stuff as well
Eco4 criteria apply, depends on income/health etc., all details on google.
This scary highly cost of battery storage, is published by the electricity supplier, which doesn’t wants you be a self sufficient
Just the kind of video I was after
I wish someone would explain why the feed in tariffs are not a like for like. If grid charge 40p a kilowatt I want 40p a kilowatt back
That’s just business I guess 🤷🏼♂️
Store it, use it yourself
Add batteries
Interesting stuff
Imagine being a retailer and being forced to buy the same product you sell for the same price you charge from anyone who wants to sell it.
You have to provide your product on demand as needed by the public but they can wander in at random and demand you buy what they have even if you can't sell it before it expires.
Sound like a good business model to you?
The poor who can't afford solar are the ones who will pay for your share of maintaining the grid.
I think 4 or 5 to one is a fair ratio for using the grid as a battery. Don't like it don't sell them any and buy yourself a bigger battery.
If you grew apples how many apples would you want to charge me (when I'm selling them at my convenience) to give me back an apple whenever I want it back?
Yeh for 2 people 5kWh espically with an EV isn't much, for a single person household I would say 5kWh is about enough if you are carful to move loads around to times where you are generating plenty of solar, but for 2 people 10 to 15kWh is really want you want, 5kWh is really lacking if for 2 people if you want a high self consumption. As said person 5kWh is enough to 80 - 90% of the time with some careful power usage shifting is enough to keep you off the grid, but you would probably want 10kWh so you don't have to be so mindful of moving loads to specific times.
For a whole family of 4 I would I would say 15 - 25kWh is want you want depending on your usage, really I do think EV manufactorers should start doing bi-driectional AC so you can use your car as a house battery, because even a hybrid with a sensible electric range is going to have 15 - 20kWh of battery capacity and if you can use that for the evening and charge cheaply during the night that would be a pretty nice usage.
15k Seems a high price for the 6kw system? I've just been quoted 9.5k for 6.375kw with 2 2.5kwh batteries
Pay cheap... pay twice as they say
£100 back during the summer
Whole quarter
Is it case for a bigger battery?
6kW solar 3kW inverter?
This works really well in the UK, always over panel, better for the grid, better value for you.
Love the video 🎉
Thanks 😁
Very informative video!
Glad it was helpful!
Batteries need to improve in storage and come down significantly in price for the existing electricity utility monopolies to be really disrupted.
I see the government is doing away with VAT on batteries from 1st February. I intend to get 2 more then. But solar, it is the biz in summer, not so much in winter. Indeed, lately I have gone days without producing nigh on any to either export or charge the batteries.
How about 3kw system with small battery?cost wise and if its worth it?
If you’re having a system it’s the inverter and batteries that are a big portion of the cost.
I’ve got 20 panels and 12Kwh batteries. I have 3 phase electrics though which is a huge advantage as I can export 8KW in summer.
Standard single phase systems will likely clip during the summer.
Go big as you can. Panels are the quickest payback item.
Would be interested 3kw system 6kw and 9kw.
Is that for your own property?
I've got a system I designed and built myself
@@SolFuel mainly for comparison
No it’s a terrible investment. If you invested that in stocks over 25 years you would have 10x the returns of solar
Agree, but Sometimes people think outside of purely monetary value and think environmentally also
@@Lerpzoid there is no environmental benefit. Its a scam. It’s all a lie. You think one house globally makes any difference? It’s like filling up your bath and keeping water in it to stop sea levels rising. It’s a giant grift to make money from the poor. Kim Kardashian’s flies a private jet to get a cake she likes from one hotel. Some people fly to Italy to buy a pizza.
With the green deal, I don’t think you’re paying out of pocket, so you have access to funding that you wouldn’t other have access to to invest elsewhere. So I think it does make sense, but the pay back period is pretty crap.
@@trailblazer7108 what green deal? In the UK you get a heat pump paid for by other tax payers which doesn’t save any energy or money. The rest is chargeable
Except you are still consuming Electricity.... Over the period. You cannot store up your energy bills for 30years to pay out of your long term investment. Is it a good investment in certain circumstances yes - to neuter or offset a ongoing cost. Energy is the base of economy - unless Nuclear Fusion suddenly becomes viable - that will continue to a be a cost, and inflationary as demand for energy never ceases, only increases. A lack of understanding Economics screws everyone, and their decisions. My own 3.2kwh Solar - 14kwh storage system was doing great - 10% return. Then Ukraine kicked off and the cost skyrocketed and my cost of production was the same.... Smart tariff. Made another 100%, so my pay off has been enormous.
Big massive PHONE charger on your roof😆