Still Don't Buy an RV! Ep. 6.002
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- Опубликовано: 4 янв 2025
- Don't Buy an RV! Still. The advice remains the same. The article I reference: www.curbed.com...
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After listening to many problems of purchasing a used RV, decided on converting a enclosed cargo trailer. I purchased a 22-foot cargo trailer; then coverted the cargo trailer to a travel trailer. This lacks much of the luxuary of modern RV's, though it has been thru thunderstorms, snow, cold weather and has an excellent independent wheel torsion suspension. Installed heating, air conditioning, kitchen, storage and bed. This made travel trailer will last longer than any mass produced RV trailer.
Owning an RV is like owning a boat, you are only happy with it twice, the day you buy it and the day you sell it.
Despite having watched BOTH of your 'Don't buy an RV" videos, I am still buying one. A USED one. A PRE-2006 one. And I already anticipate the problems that it will have that are inherent in these things. They aren't built well, but you can minimize the risk with proper research and being handy with the tools. It is what it is. Thanks for the warnings though, they are very true. Buyer beware has never been more important. And into the flames I go. I love your videos by the way, you are very informative and a damn good teacher. Keep it up!
After much research, I decided to buy my Class C made before 2008. Bought a 2005 Fleetwood Tioga. I’ve had for 2 months now and have only found 2 minor problems. All fixable for less than $50! New ones are crap!
Just got a laugh - the ad that played before the video was for an RV manufacturer selling 'freedom' : )
We bought new. I wish more people would take your advice and stay out of RVs. We don't use campgrounds very much but it is annoying when it's hard to get reservations in one. We've put 60K near trouble free miles on our Winnebago Travato Class B campervan in just over 3 years and are having a blast! Crossed this great country twice. Trips are usually 2 to 3 months at a time with some shorter ones thrown in spontaneously. Heading out on a 5 month sojourn from the East Coast to Alaska and the West coast next summer. Absolutely love our little motorhome! And yes, I'm very handy. Don't mind doing what I can to fix things. Always have. Always will. Gives this 66 year old brain a challenge once in a while!
I personally believe some of the issues are by design. The large vehicle industry seems to build vehicles with the intent of them breaking down regularly. I think it's to fleece owners for service fees. I own three semi trucks and a 5th wheel camper. Being a truck driver I have been to the factories that build RVs in Indiana and Oregon. The materials they use are cheap and the labor force is made up of a lot of low skill labor. The Semi truck manufacturers are no different. When I buy a truck and pay 150k for it I expect that I should have everything available in a modern car but we're only getting amenities that are on a 1990s level. Beyond that the quality is trash. People are buying brand new trucks only to be back in the shop within 6 weeks having to have the entire after treatment system replaced costing the owner sometimes weeks of time. In february of this year I had a truck with 180k miles break down leaving me stranded in PA for 3 weeks while Freightliner did warranty work. In The end it cost me $6000 for tow bills and and road service which should have been reimbursed by Freightliner but they refused. Beyond that I lost approximately 15k in revenue to the truck which Freightliner refused to reimburse me for also. I know it might sound weird that I would expect the manufacturer to reimburse me for my paycheck but if the vehicle fails because of the manufacturers defect I don't work. I still owe the truck payment, insurance, taxes etc. but I'm not getting revenue because of their failure.
Buying a new RV is for the birds. My 5th wheel cost me 10k and it's held up wonderfully. The previous owners made a lot of improvements and fixed a lot of the issues that popped up while they were using it. I have only had to replace a few check valves in the water system in 5 years of ownership. In my opinion it's best to let someone else take the hit on depreciation and let them do the shakedown cruise on it.
For anyone who thinks that 180k miles on a truck is a lot it's not. We run on average 10k a month. So a truck with 180k is only 1.5 years old.
I totally agree. Vehicle manufacturers spend a ton of money on testing parts that are scientifically designed to fail at a specific time. If i had no morals, and focused purely on profits (without satisfaction) that is exactly what I'd do.
In college I had a job driving RVs from the factory in Indiana to delivery sites around the country. If you watch how these are made, you will realize you're paying a lot for crap-quality toothpicks, glue, and cheap plastic.
Steve you are absolutely correct. Buying a used motorhome you will get all the equipment that the previous owner paid for to set his motorhome up for use. Plus he will also have gone through all the unfortunate bad building errors that the builder made and had them corrected. I bought a 1993 diesel pusher with only 80,000 miles on it in the thing is fantastic. It came with everything and everything works. That’s the way to buy a motorhome
Wow. In '93 did they still have shag carpeting and avocado-green appliances? You might be able to get "Historic Vehicle" plates on that beauty...
We've owned a 1966 Serro Scotty travel trailer for over 10 years. We did have to fix some of the "fixes" from a previous owner but overall it has been trouble-free. Just keeping it clean and new tires. Besides, the point of going camping is to get away from it all...not to bring it with you!
I bought a brand new Coachman 36 ft double slide in 2004. What a piece of junk.. It spent 6 months of the 1st year of ownership in the shop. I finally unloaded at a great loss 6 months later. After learning my lesson last year I bought a 2000 Ford E 350 7.3 turbo diesel shuttle bus with handicap access. Having taken SHOP class in high school I converted it myself to an RV. I am very happy with it and the bullet proof 7.3 will go for miles. And guess what No water leaks, nothing falling off of it, just enjoyment. DON'T BUY AN RV folks....
Millennials are buying RVs because houses and rent are too expensive. #vanlife
Great advise Steve. Another thing from a victim of bait and switch, myself, a salesman showed me a pull-behind RV that was pristine and had every thing we wanted. Did not leak, looked great. When I picked it up, it did not look quiet right, but same model,same color. Got it home, leaked like a sieve, had manufacturing defects that could not be fixed, and more. How could ours leaked and the one we looked at did not? My advise is if you find one on the dealers lot that you like, write down the "VIN" number and make sure it matches the one on the purchase contract and the unit delivered.
Wow. Yes. Important advise.
Lawyer up on them .
Class B's (cargo vans) are the way to go!
We've had towables, class C's and A's (all problems)! Rubber roofs, sealant issues dah, dah-dee dah! We've experienced it all... 😒 Give me a factory metal shell over sticks and tin any day!
Spot on. Anyone interested in an RV should watch both of your RV videos. As an RV owner I believe your advice is the best.
Yes, and I liked the point about the happiest RV'ers (esp. full-timers) being those who don't mind using their own decent skill set. Very true. My RV's have been such poor quality builds, esp. for the money, and miserable quality to try to work on, that I finally had a small cargo trailer customized by a commercial-trailer builder, with thermally-broken walls and roof system for severe temperatures so I can use it anywhere, anytime. Tiny woodstove, too. Operationally, it's simple, durable, and much easier to keep up with my skill set than the factory systems used by the RV industry. (I had the internal systems like wiring done to marine standards.) Oh, and it weighs just a little over half what my last RV weighed on average.
My Jayco class C had the optional electrified roll out awning. If you touched the awning arms while the RV was plugged in to shore power or running on the generator power you’d get shocked. ⚡️ my guess is that one of the mounting screws went through the 120 volt wiring. It was great entertainment.
Make sure you're handy. I bought a 1990 Winnebago class A 5 years ago. Since then, I've replaced my toilet (medium difficulty), water pump (easy), electric connection (easy), furnace stopped working three times...1st time I paid a guy $340. 2nd time the pilot hole for the gas became clogged, last time a bug died on the pilot hole for the gas. Water heater wouldn't burn correctly. Ended up being a bug over that hole too. Various lights have been replaced, refrigerator has been replaced (only $150 on Facebook). Nothing mechanical has broke down yet as coach only has 63k original miles. I'm handy under a hood so I will also be handling my mechanical issues. Also replaced alternator in twenty minutes from inside the coach. Buy a used one with low miles and a good roof. Keep it under cover if possible. Keep roof swept off.
I'm in the yacht management / charter business. I tell people all the time when they tell me, "I'm thinking about buying a yacht...." I tell them, don't do that to yourself. Unless you plan on living on it, fixing it yourself, and safely operating it yourself, you are much better off chartering a much bigger and better one whenever you have time to use a yacht with a knowledgeable captain and crew.
RVs are in the same boat (pun intended). You're taking a house, driving it down a bumpy road, hitting potholes, curbs and anything else that you didn't see , and every system on board is getting jolted, cracked , and broken without even using it.
Renting is the way to go with RVs, and yachts.
The fact that RVs don't have build standards is pretty scary.
Yachts at least have classed construction standards so you can be assured of construction standards meeting or exceeding safe build standards.
Good video Steve
I bought a good used 5th wheel toy hauler camper. It was 9 years old when I found it.I am the second owner.
The first owners took good care of it.
I bought it knowing that it was going to need some things.
I do not mind fixing my own stuff.
In 5 years I have never taken it to an RV dealer to have anything fixed on it by them. I fix everything on my camper.
I even added the on board generator myself as it did not come that way from the factory.
Also put new tires on it and overhauled and upgraded the suspension myself.
I have been up into Canada a few times and down to the Grand Canyon in Arizona from Mn.
No issues.
I even pull it with a new GM 1/2 ton 4x4 pickup truck. Pulls like a dream.
I would never buy a new one for all the reasons you stated.
As a former full time RVer, great advice. We did 7 years and will probably return to the life after retirement. Absolute truth, Steve.
I have a 2005 honda civic and took out the front passenger seat, laid the rear seats down and built a bed to sleep on. Very comfortable. Pillows everywhere. I also have a tarp with 4 posts that i set up and screen that surrounds the perimeter for cooking out and relaxing keeping sun, bugs and weather off of me. Costs? $87. This is just me. Ur needs may differ 😆
We have had trailers, overhead campers and currently a 5th wheel. We have been shy of buying anything that needed a motor. We love to get out and play. We have had our 5th wheel for over 11 years. We have changed out the truck 3 times. Same trailer. If f I could, I would post a picture. We have a 2000 Nash 24.5 5th wheel. With only minor maintenance once a new roof. Happy! I have pulled this with a 1973 F250, long bed, trailer special, Then a 1994 F250 extended cab, long bed 4x4, We now have a 2007 GMC crew cab, long bed, 4x4, diesel. We spent 2 months driving to Alaska in 2017. I recommend pulling as you can always change the drive train.
No one will listen, only wish they would have taken this excellent advice. I watched one of your previous videos a couple of years ago! You were spot on! The story is the same as almost everyone else! Glad I don’t have an RV
Now just resorting to cruises! No worries, just pure indulgence!
Thanks
Here are the results of the latest Gallup poll:
48% of the people were not home,
32% of the people made believe they weren't home
and 20% of the people have no front door.
Steve, the underlying problem is that the RVIA has NOT published reasonable standards, like using treated wood to stop rot, using utility raceways to be able to easily replace plumbing and wiring, etc. They should either follow the same regulations as new housing, or special RV regulations that are more suitable to RVs, but NOT cheapened out to make the junk that is now on the market.
This way, you could call commercial carpenters, electricians, plumbers, etc., to fix your RV, rather than having to take it to an RV repairman to deal with the crap that is now being manufactured.
Great advice Steve! Buy used but research, research, research: youtube, Internet, other owners (like you said) so you don't end up with somebody else's problem. Campers and RVs are like everything else, older is usually better quality. Some mentioned "get a hotel". Rather sleep in my own bed, shower in my own shower, etc. We love camping, cooking on the fire, running back and forth between each others' campers, etc. on our family camping trips with the kids and grandkids. Nothing better IMO. Sometimes I go out and sit in my camper or a take a nap in there or have my lunch in there right in my back yard because I love it so much. It's a second home! The industry needs regulation. I hate to say that because we have enough regulation but they are getting away with too much.
I think the old adage: don't put all your eggs in one basket, really applies. And you're right, research, test, and have used vehicles checked out by qualified professionals, just like a used car.
Rv's make sense for some people, and situations, but not others. Like anything, go in with your eyes open. The industry does, however need to increase their build quality and service.
Quick thought, wood glue and toothpicks. The RV owners best friend. Cabinet screw comes out, 2 drops of glue, 2 toothpicks in the hole, wait a couple minutes, Razor blade it flat and screw it back in while glue is wet. They use short screws, and soft wood. Keys to the RV repair kingdom folks. As a current full time RV-er, i use this trick often.
Along time ago I watched a Old German welder build his own RV. Tube Aluminum Frame, diesel, unbelievable, interior was set up by his wife. It had doors in the back that folded out into a complete welding shop. When he closed his shop and retired, he traveled to NASCAR Races and did welding for the rest of his life. Last I heard he was 91 and still welding. Almost bet that RV is still out there somewhere, it was that well made.
Wife and I bought a new 21’ travel trailer after we retired, travelled across the USA twice and up and down the east coast for a total of about 4 years. We were shocked at the cost of camping. We did have a good time but sold it this year during the spring buying season, lost 6k, not too bad. Thank God we didn’t buy a big rig! We learned that it would be a lot cheaper and less hassle to rent cabins, Air B&B sites, etc.
By far, our best camping years was with our little Coleman pop up when the kids were growing up, I might try to find another clean used pup down the road?
I bought a good used one that I love an had no problems with. Full time living in it for over a year now.
And as if all that weren't bad enough, and it is, there are so many restrictions on where they can be parked. I live in a van and recently traveled through Grand Teton and Yellowstone national parks. There were so many parking areas at attractions that said "No RV parking." Out on the roads most RV nomads have to use Wal-Mart parking lots to stay overnight at. If Wal-Mart ever decided to ban overnight parking, the entire RV lifestyle and the manufacturers would die. And because of their low road clearance and long wheelbase, they are limited to well maintained roads only. So they have to cram themselves like sardines into overcrowded RV parks and many parks will flatly refuse to take older model RVs because they're afraid they will completely fall apart and be abandoned in their park. Besides, who wants to spend their time in an RV park when the whole idea of mobile living is to escape the crowds? My converted handicap school bus van has high clearance and I've taken it to places you could never take an RV. For those who are handy with tools, buy a high top, extended body van and built it out for a more durable and more easily repairable place to live.
We tow our Jeep or Motorcycle to travel to the parts harder to reach with an RV. You could also invest in a toy hauler if you are not comfortable towing something.
@@Myrune1 Sure but then you have to leave your RV parked somewhere while you head off in your jeep to the places you really want to get to and then what, sleep in a tent on the ground and rough it with cooking and toileting while your home on wheels is left unguarded?
I know a little something about RVs. Typically the engine and suspension are the best part of the vehicle, as they are typically Ford truck engines and chassis. Everything that's built above the chassis is mostly junk, similar to the junk mobile homes are built with. Water intrusion is the RVs Achilles heel- they leak- and rainwater can quickly destroy the building materials, which are mostly made from paper. Then there's mold.
I would never buy an RV. or a large boat for that matter. If I wake up one day and decide I want to take a trip across the US, I would rent an RV for a few months. and hope for the best.
Your comment at 10:35 is absolutely the truth about owning an RV. I have learned a lot of do-it-yourself skills since I bought my bumper-pull trailer in 2014. The other reality that people need to learn about RVs - they need to like sealing and caulking things a lot too and chasing down water leaks.
Way too many people do not do a lengthy and thorough pre delivery inspection. I am talking at least a couple of days opening, closing, checking, using, rechecking absolutely everything. Those that do tend to have far fewer issues.
Even then, you may have a leak
Even if you are a DIY guy or gal, the learning curve on RVs is BRUTAL. There is so much to learn, from plumbing, to electrical systems, suspension, towing, weight capacities, driving conditions, ACs, heaters,, etc.
Also, going RVing? Bring your toolbox. Stuff it with everything you think you'll need. Don't worry, it won't do you any good. Whatever tool you actually end up needing will be back at home in the garage. It's a guy named Murphy's fault.
All that said, get out there and go. It's the most fun you've had since you were a kid. The country is your oyster. Be safe, be prepared, be brave, have fun. Life is not a dress rehearsal.
I drove from Detroit to Midland, MI last night, now I totally understand why Steve talks about RV's so often! They're EVERYWHERE here in Michigan! Wow, never seen that many in my life!
@@chekovcall2286 I try to avoid FL if I can :)
Another great message Steve. Thank you. FWIW The original GM Frigidaire refrigerator compressor in our 1948 Spartan Mansion finally broke last year. Talk about quality control problems! LOL
Buy used rv. I bought 1998 Monaco dynasty diesel pusher 3 years ago. I put more than 10000miles on it. Now living full time in it for 1 year. Very well built unit. Like most people says older RV's specially luxury ones are well built in the past. It is absolutely true. Also older diesel pushers don't have emission crap like DEF and filters. Which has lots of sensors and giving problems. My advise, if you are not somewhat mechanically inclined and can't even change a headlight bulb or windshield wipers.. don't buy an rv.
I know three parties that bought new RVs, a couple of friends and an in law. One was a nice motor home on a bus chassis (diesel), the other a more modest motor home built on a heavy-duty van chassis (also diesel), and the third was a high-end fifth wheel travel trailer. All three had water leaks. All three experienced multiple failures/breakdowns. All three were resold within two years at a significant loss.
Sounds like a very typical experience. A bit surprised that the higher-end bus chassis motorhome had water intrusion problems so quickly [did it have something like dealer-installed solar panels?].
My wife and I lived full time in two motorhomes for 10 years after retirement. It was mostly fun, but not a bed of roses. I always tell people; don't buy an RV if you are not "handy", or in possession of a lot of money to pay someone for fixing all the little bothersome things that come up. I am fairly handy, and found my skills and patience tested a lot. I did pay for a few repairs that I wasn't confident about, but was able to take care of most problems myself. If there was something I didn't want to tackle, I at least knew enough about it so that I could talk to the repair man, and he knew that he couldn't put anything over on me, not that I expected him to. People I dealt with were honest and straight forward with me, without exception. Running through my memories, there were a LOT of problems that we had, many from rookie mistakes that we made, some manufacturing defects, and other just from things breaking or wearing out. But, there are also a lot of good memories, and friends made along the way. On balance, I would like to do it again, but my wife would not.
I love ny RV, however I got a deal on a Used RV. Already knew the suspensions are not designed for the coach and I upgraded the suspension and other upgrades. ButI did not use a dealer for services. Having an RV in the Southwest is nice to have for off-roading trips to BLM lands here.
Steve, this is why I subscribe. No bull, straight talk, honest advice - thanks. As a fellow MI resident about 90 minutes from you, I can attest to all of this. Between in-laws, friends, former classmates, relatives, and friends - - you are spot on. As one friend put it, you wouldn't buy a pair of boots without trying them on, yet people buy $200,000++ RVs off the lot. What the hell? Take Steve's advice.
Amazing vid Steve,one of your very best so far! One of my friends bought a used,6 year old driver with 3 slide outs for 30 cents on the dollar.Definitely the way to go.Congrats on your milestone and looking foward to another great season.👍💯
Yep...that's how I found your channel...through the Curbed article. I'm doing research on RVs and cargo van conversions and Google News suggested the Curbed article in my feed and there you were. I love Google.
If you don't know what to look for don't buy it. Go on a rainy day. Bring some plates 2. Move them around and listen for them to rattle. So if you buy one try it drive it twice. Go look when it's wet and cold test the heating test the cooling. Ask questions. Don't just get a floor plan you like and run with it.
This is great advice that is difficult to find anywhere else in such a succinct package (i.e., it is NOT ubiquitous.) I have friends who just mentioned today that they plan to buy an RV so they can travel and avoid getting a bed bug infestation from a hotel (which has happened to them before). I'm sharing your RV videos with them so they can make an informed decision. Thanks for the great work and advice.
Super video Steve. So true. I was hoping you would produce another R.V video soon. Thank you for such timely wisdom. I owned a Starcraft travel trailer in the early 2000's when Quality was definitely more a priority. No warranty issues. Opening this R.V institute you mentioned is long overdue.. Perhaps there is finally a glimmer of hope the R.V industry will arise from the quality control abyss. Record Sales since the great recession combined with a acute lack of Q.C and skilled factory workers, along with the acute shortage of certified R V service technitions to fix them. This has certainly created a huge crisis in the industry. These problems have been the main contributor to a sea of pissed off R.V customers with little or no recourse. I would just add. If one insist on buying new it's most important and absolutely crucial to find a High rated dealer that has a great reputation for service after the sale that also has good partnerships with the manufacturers. Not always easy to find but they are out there. Research is key. Definatly more dealers with bad reputations then good. Camping World being one of the worst and the biggest.
Which is why I did my own conversion. And, I'm not particularly handy, but I am relatively poor.
Me, and my relatives, are all pretty much poor [unfortunately, none of us are actually "pretty"]
Overall, great advice. I think most people don't understand what they are getting into, when they buy an RV. Watch RUclips, there are tons of videos on walk arounds, RVing advice, explaining how things work, how things are done, and the "lifestyle", and pitfalls to avoid. Don't watch the videos from a dealership without understanding they will only paint one side of the picture. Use that knowledge gained to search for the features and comforts you need, and as you said, find the right used RV. And always have qualified mechanics and professionals look over any purchase. I really like the rental idea, since most folks don't understand what is involved in using an RV, until they actually do it. Nothing like hands on experience!
I had a travel trailer once. I spent the first year and a half fixing every thing that was wrong with it. After that it was great. Just lucky I had the skills to do that.
All the horror stories I’ve heard have persuaded me from ever considering one. I’ve fitted out my Van to travel in, and the cost savings in fuel alone will get me a lot farther down the road.
I have an RV and I love it, it's been nothing but awesome. You should clarify this as don't buy a NEW RV. Let someone else fix all the stuff that came broken from the factory. Also, be handy or don't bother. EDIT: I made this comment before watching to the very end, you are absolutely correct. Buy USED. Lots of the stuff will be fixed by then, and you won't be expecting perfection, also you will save a bundle. Also 10 year old RV's are actually built better if you can find one with 25,000 miles like I did.
I'm looking at a 92 leaker with a Cummins 8.3!
Bought an 18 month old sprinter for half stickerlast year and built my own
Yea we bought a toyhauler sofar I'm on second set of batteries, I found out you can't keep it plugged in. The internal battery charger is poor quality and overcharges, it's 2 yrs old and I have to replace batteries again. So time to rewire spend money and fix it myself
Glad you can. We pull our toy behind our old 5th wheel that keeps giving us the best times ever.
Bought a mid size Hotel Courtesy Bus and put a bedroom, living room, kitchen and shower in it. Blacked out the windows and just parked it at airport staff parking lots for FREE! Free parking at transport truck repair depots, highway service centers, and church parking lots.
We are thinking of going full time RVing, so watching all the videos to learn the good and the bad. Thanks for sharing
People want to be free but are INTENT on having a ridiculous MONSTER BOX (with 5 slide outs), requiring a HUGE TRUCK or worse yet, a diesel pusher costing as much as a house. They spend more time at the service center (spend more $$) when they are not in some ridiculous trailer park where they spend their time parked side/side...ridiculous.
There are some like that, but there are also many that get a used class B van type RV and love it.
My sister and her husband bought one of those big monster rv’s and its been a nightmare every since! Been in the shop more than they have used it! The first trip out it rained and it flooded out inside! They regret it but they’re upside down on what they could sell it for. Used RV’s have no resell value! They feel they are stuck with it unless they are willing to take a huge loss on it though I think they need to make a clean break from this mobile money pit!
The best place to buy a used RV is Arizona (possibly Florida) because all the snow birds from the upper Mid-West scare the crap out of themselves the first time they drive it to Arizona for the winter. A good place to pick up one with only a few miles from someone that says they will never drive one again. The only downside is that you might have to clean the driver's seat. :-)
OMG this is so true. Snowbirds go to Arizona and literally just sell their RV for pennies on the dollar, simply because they don't want to drive it back
In a perfect world, Toyota would make recreational vehicles.
Just so Steve could utter the phrase “heaven forbid ... a Toyota RV” !
Toyota used to make an RV! I have seen them in the wild, they are funky looking.
Just seen a RV burn down on interstate 40 in Tennessee yesterday
The Employees that build these for the most part are on "Piece rate", get it done as fast as possible. If ya can't straighten what the weld shop messed up you get a bigger hammer. Been there done that.
We own a 1994 travel trailer. Bought cash and had a few years now. I read these horror stories of new RVs (I run a camping related FB group).
While ours does not have all of the bells and whistles of newer units, it is solid. I do need to reseal the roof this fall, and have one soft spot to address (my own fault for putting hoses with water still in them on the floor for a couple years straight. Doh!)
My humble opinion is they were built much better in the past. New units delaminste, have things not working or broken on day 1, and generally fall apart right off the lot.
I have a 2016 Coachman Apex. It's a travel trailer and typical for the industry. While it is definatly not high quality it is so damn simple to fix and maintain. I can do all the work myself so it is not an issue. Our family absolutely loves it and we camp as much as we can. My wife never camped when she was young like I did with my parents so she is discovering all the things I saw as a kid. She wants our kids to be campers and not hotelers (not a word, I know) like her family was.
I will admit. My fresh water tank almost fell out of the trailer. But now it gives me an excuse to upgrade. I will be building a new, removable support for it and will also be moving it back in the trailer so it sits just in front of the axles instead of half way between the axles and hitch.
My neighbors rebuilt a 1988 Vixen last Winter and I haven't seen them since. "We'll be right back..."
We just bought our first RV, a used one. I think one of the issues is that people buy one size too big. Oh look at the room of those expansion modules. Oh the one with the dualee is a bit longer. I hope we'll be fine with our Class B Pleasureway. The only RV we tested that didn't rattle at all. Seems to be well-built, good reputation. We'll check in with you in a few months.
I own a 1989 travel trailer, and I love it!! We have owned it for 7ish years. It is not big and fancy, but it works well for us. We are only weekend warriors. I have a friend who wants a brand new class c, and I keep telling her to get one a few years old but she won't listen! She will live in it full time all through the summer. So what will happen when she is away from home and something goes wrong! I can't convince her otherwise!!
Some people have to learn the hard way. Our 5th Wheel was 6 years old when we bought it. It has been a blessing for over 13 years.
I guess we have been lucky. Bought ours new first of this year and no problems. But I am handy and plan to fix whatever needs to be done myself. Construction is rushed on most units I looked at with little clean up. Lots of saw dust and bits of wood. If you take your time and look hard you can find good new models. Watched your videos on RVs and many others before we brought. Became educated buyers. Thanks.
Steve, it would appear that the quality/reliability record is the same for sailboats. Most of the sailing channels on YT are always showing them repairing something. Usually it's a critical system (engine, bilge pump, water maker, etc). I would expect for something costing ~$800K-$1.5Mil everything "would just work". How is it they can get away with it, everyone knows it, and lemon laws aren't used to make them improve reliability or at least deliver a working version of what they advertised?
I spent $5000 for a 1987 22ft Class A about 3 years ago. Why'd I get it? Well, I like to tinker/refurbish things as a hobby. Add on new toys, fix up problems, that sort of thing.
I've used it several times each spring/summer/fall. When I first got it, the thing would backfire going up hills. Replaced the plugs, the wires, the distributor cap (about $100 tops in parts) and it runs like a champ.
Since then, I've added a battery bank and 500 watts of solar, a tracking satellite dish, Roku, power regulator, tankless water heater, diesel heater (now have 5 different sources of heat) and updated the interior. It's comfortable when I use it, and small enough to get most places larger RV's can't get to.
The other reason I got it, and refurbished it is as an "insurance policy". If things get bad...recession, lost job, lose my home, etc. I have a back up plan; I won't be homeless.
The RV is built well. Much better than today's standards.
Interesting way of looking at it: a back up plan. If a recession causes you hardship, you can always liquidate and still have a comfortable place to live, still have a means of long distance travel to relocate for meaningful employment, and have near off grid self sustaining living except for water which can be bought for a penny or two a gallon through a garden hose hookup.
I have seen eco-houses which appear to be not much more than a redesigned camper or self built camper affording these same luxuries for the price of a pre-owned vehicle which are great for career orientated people or childless couples. These can be used with your idea, an emergency plan when finances becomes tight and standard housing becomes a burden.
Brand and model? 🤷♂️
@@cedarbay3994 1987 Itasca Sunflyer 22ft Class A.
I bought a 1987 Winnebago class C ten years ago for $3000. Drove it on a trip the next day! Yeah, it's had a few issues but I've kept it going and we've driven that thing nearly coast to coast. Best advice: do everything you possibly can to store it indoors!
@@Jeff_Pendleton I completely re-did the roof last year, including covering all the seams with Eternabond (that stuff is awesome!) No leaks at all. After the season is over, I have a thick oversized tarp to cover it (16ft x 24ft), so there's no leaks during the winter. Unfortunately, I don't have an indoor space to store it, but I make sure it's out of the elements as it best can be. End and beginning of every season, I check all the seams and make sure there's no cracking or wear. Gotta baby these old timer RV's.
Used to me is saved thousands, everything works, and not concerned of scratches.
Paid in full, not in debt, so able to afford maintenance and preferences.
Rest often, work as often as I like, and have time for family and fun.
If not a loan, then able to save for something else. If not a loan, not pressure to work, and can enjoy life full-time.
Every new thing is used within a year exposed to weather and use. So buying used is a new thing in the list of owning things. Have a happy life.
at 9:08......Heeeeeyyyyy - "My RV's Horrible, My Motorcycles Horrible, My Boat Sank, My Dog Ran Away and Whatever Else." is my favorite Country Western song!!!
Spot on advice! I've been looking at RVs for several years but never pulled the trigger as they're junk. Particle board interiors, extremely poor construction and the hardware is garbage. Not to mention how horrible the build quality is, done far too quickly and half-assed. I started out looking at short class As, then Class Cs and since it's just the wife and I, Class B models but I fail to see what they can do within a day or two that turns a $30k van into a $100k+ "motorhome". The best option from what I can tell for a couple is to build a campervan with a high roof van. You can park this anywhere and don't need to go anywhere near a RV park, boondocking wherever you are. It's the best of all worlds.
Get a rental and try before you buy...Not sure if this is a Upper MIdWest / (Mid-East thing from me). However we don't have those problems here in the Southwest. Unless this a new thing? Michigan issue?
everything is particleboard these days. I wish they'd outlaw that garbage.
@@Maybe-So I've been to a furniture store where everything was made of basically upgraded cardboard...I couldn't believe that anyone would bother manufacturing anything so horrible. I had to leave rather quickly because I had a strong urge to go on a Godzilla type rampage and smash the store's entire showroom. It would have been glorious, but a few head clearing deep breaths outside and it passed...I think it was the cheap glue fumes that did it to me ;)
I was astosnished just today, as I was passed by a horrid, old RV. It gas water leaking, and parts flapping in the wind. How is this road legal? it had antique plates!
So far so good with our 2019 travel trailer, except a gear on one slide out stripped... On back order, but I can still push that side of the slide out manually.... if you buy an RV and don't expect problems you haven't done enough research or watched enough of Steve's videos!
Bought a Toyota (85) back in 97. Drove it for ten years, paid $7500 for it and sold it for $6800. 4 cyl 22r, a bit under powered especially on hills but good mpg and basically no problems. If you are looking buy an older model (make sure basic parts available) and keep trips state to state. Imho you’ll be fine.
They like selling lots of rvs but no one is buliding any new places to use them. Most of the campgrounds I know of were built in the 60s when rvs were smaller now people drive huge 35 foot ones and can't even park them in a space. Many National Parks require 25 feet or less rv.
After discovering your channel, I'll NEVER get an RV! Not that I could afford one anyway lol
Buy used is great advice. "As Is" is expected from a used RV while a new RV has unrealistic expectations of a real warranty, when "as is" is far more likely.
As a longtime RVer and current owner of two RVs, I can say -- RVs are all GARBAGE. They're built as cheaply as possible and once the mfr has your money, the will NO LONGER GIVE YOU THE TIME OF DAY. And if something doesn't work on your new RV, you're out of luck with the exception of dealing with the manufacturer of the specific item (e.g. the refrigerator). The dealer and manufacturer won't give a crap. I know because I'm going through it right now with a brand new Arctic Fox camper and Norcold (refrigerator maker).
My other RV is a 13yo Keystone 5th wheel that I bought new and it's a huge piece of garbage. Not nearly enough space to go into detail here, but over the years I've seen just how poorly designed and built it is. The new camper is vastly better, but the after-sale support has been nil. Keystone is a total crap company.
Maybe companies like Forrest River should focus on quality rather then having close to 50 separate brands with countless different models within each brand. It’s almost an antitrust issue because there’s little to no competition to make things better. Forrest River brands are for the most part only in competition with themselves and as long as this continues, the industry will continue to pump out high priced garbage.
I bought a used RV 4 year old model low miles last year. Best decision I made. Price was right, there were a couple issues I had repaired immediately and we have enjoyed travels that we wouldn’t have been able to do without it. Do your research and if you buy a gas look at cheap handling fix to tighten suspension.
I am very satisfied with my 2019 Forrest River travel trailer. I bought a new over buying a used one that could have some unforeseen expensive leaks. Years ago I bought a used one and couldn't tell it had massive water damage from leaks in the critical corners. It would have cost as much as a new RV to fix the used one. Learning from that lesson I bought a brand new RV and inspected it inch by inch. What little I did find I fixed it myself. I spent 2 months hooked up at a RV park and now boondocking on private land I own for 3 months and going. I couldn't ask for a better rig for myself. It absolutely beats trying to live out of a tent while taming the land into what I want. My advice is buy from a reputable Manufacturer and either inspect it yourself or have a professional RV repair technician inspect your new rig. That way you know your RV is solid with NO LEAKS and everything works as it should.
I've owned RVs all my life. I've always bought used ones and every one required constant repair. Now there is lots of info on RUclips on how to do the repairs but be prepared to do the work yourself or endure a long wait. The warranties are 100% bullshit and it's always "We're very busy and we can't get to you until months later" and they hope you just go away.
@@easyd5564 Good luck with your new Rv. I've had travel trailers and motor homes. I think the travel trailer is the best deal and requires a lot less repair than motor homes. Trailers have cheaper tires also and hold more of their value than motor homes do. Bearing have to be maintained but they are easy to work on and new bearing are a lot cheaper than replacing rear seals on a Motor home.
That training /tech institute in Elkhart should become a testing and quality certification group.
Some of the problems I found in my camper looked like it was built by 12 years olds. Some of the construction was just pitiful. I was able to fix every thing but it was just amazing they would put these on the market. Yeah I had to reseal the top as well to keep it from leaking. My family had a lot of good times after I made every thing right.
Good thing RV manufacturrs dont build airplanes,lol
Four winns/winds broke off.
We purchased a 2008 Tiffin Open Road TSA 35 (36f) new in 2007 and still have it and travel 3 months each year;what was nice we had the luxury (retired) of stopping in Red Bay AL where they build Tiffin Motorhome on our first trip North and had every single items corrected of which we had about 20 most cosmetic;they have 45 or more service bays with full hook up while working on motorhomes;Bot Tiffin owner even called me and said we will make sure everything is to your satisfaction before you leave;we stop their every year on our way back home each summer and guess what they still give me free touch up paint and have checked my slideouts to make sure they are ok (some had a problem) ours doesn't;this is after 8 to 11 yrs;if prob they would fix free;again it's family owned; I do a lot of my own minor maintenance also never had to deal with a dealer;they are the problem;we always went right to Tiffin to have problems fixed;we maintain our motorhome and even after 12 yrs (we purchased the 2008 in July 2007). Also we keep all our vehicles for years so we a better off buying a new one;again new is not for everyone but we have had 3 new and never had the issues many have because I take charge and raise hell if things are done right the first time;good luck to all;we will keep roughy it smoothly in our current Tiffin until we feel we are done traveling every summer.
i would take the $140,000 and use it as my holiday fund. no problematic RV involved....just traveling to the destinations of my choice without the hassle driving an RV.
Nice way to look at it!
And this is why I'm building a "Skoolie". Way better than a store-bought RV. Freightliner chassis, air brakes, rear air suspension, Cummins 5.9, Allison MD3060, all steel, and no rust. Ohh, did I mention al real stuff, not RV junk.
My grandpa brought a new Holiday Rambler in 1992 and He never had a problem with it and it was very reliable. I thank they were built better back in 1992 His was 55,000 back then. This thing was built like a tank.
Good morning everyone. My wife and I just bought a 1985 RV for $1000 dollars yes it need work but the engine,trans is working great it drives pretty good. I like driving the 28 ft we bought. We have to work on the body and some of the interior needs fixing but for a 1000 dollars gives me plenty of money to fix it up for what is wrong with it and to what I see it is going to cost us to fix it back up but worth the money I say about 10 to 15 thousand dollars to fix what is wrong with it but again it is worth it. Why do I think this way well it's bought and paid for so we are not trying to make payments plus trying to fix the RV. So now if we spend the money to fix it we are really not out of the money cause even if we fix the RV we are still coming out cheaper then going and buy one and making payments plus trying to fix it. We live in our RV full time and it's still cheaper then renting an apartment or a house. Plus a lot of times we get parts for the RV cheaper then what other people pay for fixing a house or an apartment. Well peace out everyone and be safe in your travels.
What most people don't know is that like Boats, RV Dealerships need to contact the manufacture of each and every part be for any warranty work can be done! What I find unbelievable is that consumers have been taught that RV's are built like crap and that's just the way it is! We've owned 6 different types of RV's and currently have a Motorhome. Only one of those was purchased new and while that rig was a decent one, I'll never buy new and would rather buy a lightly used one and hope that most of the problems have been worked out. Right now we have a 2004 Motorhome that when new was over $140,000 (the original paperwork was still inside of it as the original owners traded it in), we bought it 3 years ago for $25,000 out the door with 30,000 miles on it!
@@JF-fx2qv, usually it takes owning several RV's to get to know what you like and don't like. Most RV's have usually owned sevreal different "campers" in the first 5-10 years of RV'ing. Also, most people start small and then move up. We started with a small popup then 20 foot camper then to a van camper to a 27 foot camper (purchased new) then to a 37 foot fifth wheel toy hauler (totaled in a Hurricane) and finally the 34 foot motorhome we now have.
I am a RV owner. It is not just about the low quality of work when they build the RV it is also how the dealer treats people. The dealer sells a RV on a 15 year note and if it hold up for 10 years you are doing good, the service department are horrible they treat the customer bad.
Right. Which is a huuuugeee reason i dont buy RVs or cars new
My motorhome took three years to get to run correctly and was over its rear axle weight rating out of the factory. The manufacturer's support was... uninspiring. And yes it is still overweight. 100% on target Steve.
To use a phrase from Scotty Kilmer "endless money pits"
Rev up your engines!
I solved RV problem by building my own. Bought a semi. Stretched the frame to 42 feet. No problems in 14 years of use. We travel about four months a year.
DIY is the way to go!
Always thought the older semi truck conversions to RVs was the way to go!
Not exactly a workable solution for most people
I bought an RV in 2017. It’s a class C, 27 ft. (2018). It has worked fine. However, my wife is now really sick and I had back surgery and now can hardly walk. We can’t use it. I’m paying over $800 a month and can’t even sell it. The bank which has the title and who I am paying says they can’t do anything and said if we missed a payment they would sue us for the full amount. I did ask them can I give it back to them and they said no, and that won’t happen. So we are stuck with paying for something that is sitting. I don’t know what to do. We are both over 70 years old.
Lightning48 sorry you and your wife are having such a rough time. I hope things improve for you.
Is it possible to see an attorney? Maybe there is something- a loop hole or something you can do legally. Even if it’s arranging a lower payment? Some other thoughts-
What about renting it out? Maybe there’s someone out there who would like to try it or someone who’d live in it for a while? I realize there’s risks involved. But $800/month is pretty high to let it sit. Best of luck to you.
SummerLove217 - Thanks for your response. Yes, that is an option. In addition, I pay $100 a month to store my RV. I do go once a week and run the engine, generator and A/C. It’s been sitting for 9 months.
Lower your selling price, it will sell.
Sell it for whatever you can. Next time don't buy anything you can't pay cash for.
Lightning48 hang in there buddy! I know it’s not easy when an unexpected curve in the road changes everything.
Very good video.... I agree 100%...
Your point about the "do I like this lifestyle" is VERY well taken, hopefully your viewers listened up on that.... But the other thing I see all the time is, the salesman sells you a certain package of features... and, some you need, and some you don't, and some that are not there, would be really useful... and that varies person to person, and depends on your RVing experience, expectations, how you use it, how far you drive it, a whole plethora of factors....
So yes, RENT... and then when you go to shop, you can say "Okay, I NEED to have these features, I do NOT need these other features..." Tremendously helpful, to make a good decision and buy the RV that fits your lifestyle, and gives you the experience you are looking for, when you are out using it....
And of course, used is the only way.... In this area, now, I mean, down the street from me, someone has their RV on marketplace... Very nice unit. Probably 350-400 new. He's got it listed for 75. Let's not kid ourselves, he'd probably take 50. Has no hours on it. Just me, but, if I bought it for 50, I don't mind doing a few repairs, fixing a few things, whatever.... If I pay 350, I expect perfection, and that is not going to happen, and there's a lot of reasons for that...
But yeah, your advice... Hopefully people will listen...
Many campgrounds don't allow RVs that are older than 5 or 10 years. Its and effort to keep out the riff raff (aka Me). So when buying a used RV your trading away a few years of its very short usable lifespan.
You might be able to fool them with an Airstream, unless they check your registration. Guess those older fellows mostly stick to state or national parks, or boondock.