@@simpleplan100687if youre inside the smoke - enemies lose their bright outline and invis lights stay invisible. If youre looking through the smoke - you still see everyone
@@simpleplan100687 I think that's on purpose, depending on how the light hits them. They definitely don't always show though, or sometimes you will see only parts of them.
Something these tier lists always lack is how the contextual ranking of every gadget changes depending on game mode. For instance, the Data Re-shaper goes from niche to nearly over-tuned specifically if you have it in Power shift. People often forget that the DR instantly wipes EVERY kind of defense a team could hope to have outside of detonated goo. Dome shields, Barricades, C4, Jump-pads, Ziplines, all grenades, all mines, all buildings, and any arena carriable goes away instantaneously at a range of 30 feet (which is longer than the lengths of most buildings). Assuming you know how to avoid dying while playing around the platform, the enemy has no way of setting up defenses, ever, period. Wish I saw a list-style video discussing these distinctions.
100 agree, had a power shift match with full medium turret, aps team. They were definitely winning at first but once I switch to shield turret, flash, data reshape I basically solo whipped out the platform of all turrets and meleed the aps and enemies couldn't die 😂. Won that matc, got highest combat and objective score.
Honestly I have a hard time calling it niche in cashout anyway. I don’t think it’s map-dependant at all. If you come across a team spamming mines, turrets (admittedly rare in higher elo games) or any heavy defences, you just hard counter it now. I personally always have it it my reserves at least.
The changes to reshaper is downright nutty. It honestly made the item OP and I hope no one notices. Us mediums need to ban together an create a psyop force to hide it's power through disinformation imo
I see your point on aps but there ARE tons of creative solutions that get rid of it. Reshaper for me is my personal one but my other favorite is gateway. These when thrown will trigger the uses on APS without eating it. I guess aps is all up to perspective tho, I don't really run projectile loadouts so I've never had an issue. EDIT: Also, THANK YOU for the defib comment. I'm in an argument on another thread where I made the same point an said that Defib at low ranks is actually detrimental and all you are doing until you learn to get better at the game is giving the opponent more killing blow cash. Until you get to mid ranks an in solo queue, reshaper is way better because it insta gibs turrets an mines without triggering them
Only thing that really belongs in overturned is the defibrillator, that’s why triple M is the meta comp. It has high value n every single game and allows for risky plays. I would put gateway into competitive, it’s absolute game changer, not many players know how to use it to the full potential, but just to steal the vault and protect the cash out is alot of value and it can even bait enemies into traps to get them killed. smoke grenade have a slow rise in popularity right now, players see more and more the value, they allow the light to get much much more value to defend and steal the cash out, aswell as reviving teammates. It’s also really strong with the sword, because the sword hits in crazy AOE and makes you evasive+ smoke the enemy have a super hard time hitting you in fights
I would prefer pyro mines over amy other ones, since they deal a total of ~100 damage with burning+ instant 80 (can be double stacked to kill a light) and have some area denial. Also, is APS broken? I never see it in games. Defib which has almost a 100% pick rate is only in competitive
Great vid! Have to kinda say though, I kinda wanna make a case for smoke nades as niche at least for Power Shift (fully understand why it's placed as avoid tho -- for Cashout modes it is not practical; I'm just mentioning ideas, bear with me). Smoke nade renders pyro/Flamethrower useless; placing gas inside smoke guarantees its effect the whole time, which can serve as area of denial but crucially force enemies out of the platform early to mid game. It also temporarily obscures turret vision tho for some reason you can still get detected through it if you shoot the turret. There's a different kind of fun and rewarding feeling to pull off SH1900 + Grapple + Smoke + Thermal Vision in particular, zip through the smoke and if my aim doesn't miss (which I miss a lot lol) they don't see it coming.
Dang didn't even think about power shift and the turret cancel. I can def see the argument for that. Generally I stick to cashout but I'll have to give that a try!
Pyro mines are a great thing to put on revive statues, if they pop you can't even grab the statue anymore and sometimes kills the person going for a revive
Sorry for the second comment buut I have to say as well, love the recognition of the Anti-Grav cube having strong capabilities. We need a video for it fr (maybe you already do, have to recheck, but more tips will always be nice)
Dude, I can not even count how many powershift games I've won thanks to the cube. However I also can't count how many games I've LOST to someone simply jumping while in overtime thanks to the same mechanics that makes cube great there.
I have two ideas for the glitch mines as a nerf. One is to limit it so only one player can be affected by it at a time. The other is to introduce a burnout similar to the healing beam, i think that would be the way id go with it
Not sure man, I just don't think Finals is a game where smokes can get a lot of value if the opponents know what they're doing. What makes it worse is that enemies can see your HP bar if they hit you once through a smoke
Smoke Grenade actually great if only CD is not long But i kinda understand why Embark doesn't do that, its frustrating against Smoke covering battlefield
pyro mines are better than gas mines. They act like mini explosive mines, pyro mines blow up and deal 85-90 damage and burns whoever triggered it. Even if you smoke the mine, it'll still do the initial explosive damage.
Couple ideas I’ve had for new gadgets are a healing bomb for medium that works like a vanishing bomb but gives 50 hp to self and teammates, so maybe medium doesn’t have to always run healing beam and can finally heal themselves a little. And then some kind of a direct impact grenade that does damage when you hit a player directly; maybe a Semtex type nade that does 120 when you land it on someone, otherwise it breaks a wall. Thoughts?
@@samuelajakaye nah Light already no needed that due to Health regen change where Heavy getting longer than Light Even heavy now need that due to that change lol
hell yeah fuck the aps turret, it used to totally ruin power shift far beyond snipers, one of those turds on the platform and every item you tried throwing in there was just gone - no fun allowed garbage. even more so if you played cl-40, your weapon was rendered inoperable.
you can see invisible players with thermal vision
ya wtf thats the whole point of it
It's bugged, sometimes you see them sometimes you don't
@@simpleplan100687if youre inside the smoke - enemies lose their bright outline and invis lights stay invisible. If youre looking through the smoke - you still see everyone
@@simpleplan100687 I think that's on purpose, depending on how the light hits them. They definitely don't always show though, or sometimes you will see only parts of them.
You can see invisible players if you turn on rt anyway.
Something these tier lists always lack is how the contextual ranking of every gadget changes depending on game mode. For instance, the Data Re-shaper goes from niche to nearly over-tuned specifically if you have it in Power shift.
People often forget that the DR instantly wipes EVERY kind of defense a team could hope to have outside of detonated goo. Dome shields, Barricades, C4, Jump-pads, Ziplines, all grenades, all mines, all buildings, and any arena carriable goes away instantaneously at a range of 30 feet (which is longer than the lengths of most buildings). Assuming you know how to avoid dying while playing around the platform, the enemy has no way of setting up defenses, ever, period.
Wish I saw a list-style video discussing these distinctions.
100 agree, had a power shift match with full medium turret, aps team. They were definitely winning at first but once I switch to shield turret, flash, data reshape I basically solo whipped out the platform of all turrets and meleed the aps and enemies couldn't die 😂. Won that matc, got highest combat and objective score.
Honestly I have a hard time calling it niche in cashout anyway. I don’t think it’s map-dependant at all. If you come across a team spamming mines, turrets (admittedly rare in higher elo games) or any heavy defences, you just hard counter it now. I personally always have it it my reserves at least.
Can’t do dome shields as the shield blocks the reshaper unless you’re in the dome
Aps turret in overtuned is crazy, especially after the nerf, and the buff of cl40
APS turret was way overtuned before when it could block projectiles infinitely.
Data reshaper my beloved get your turrets outta here
The changes to reshaper is downright nutty. It honestly made the item OP and I hope no one notices. Us mediums need to ban together an create a psyop force to hide it's power through disinformation imo
@@sparquisdesademaybe it belongs in a different class because only mediums counter mediums.
I see your point on aps but there ARE tons of creative solutions that get rid of it. Reshaper for me is my personal one but my other favorite is gateway. These when thrown will trigger the uses on APS without eating it. I guess aps is all up to perspective tho, I don't really run projectile loadouts so I've never had an issue.
EDIT: Also, THANK YOU for the defib comment. I'm in an argument on another thread where I made the same point an said that Defib at low ranks is actually detrimental and all you are doing until you learn to get better at the game is giving the opponent more killing blow cash. Until you get to mid ranks an in solo queue, reshaper is way better because it insta gibs turrets an mines without triggering them
Only thing that really belongs in overturned is the defibrillator, that’s why triple M is the meta comp. It has high value n every single game and allows for risky plays. I would put gateway into competitive, it’s absolute game changer, not many players know how to use it to the full potential, but just to steal the vault and protect the cash out is alot of value and it can even bait enemies into traps to get them killed.
smoke grenade have a slow rise in popularity right now, players see more and more the value, they allow the light to get much much more value to defend and steal the cash out, aswell as reviving teammates. It’s also really strong with the sword, because the sword hits in crazy AOE and makes you evasive+ smoke the enemy have a super hard time hitting you in fights
The s need to go lol. Should be absolutely punished for using the defib out of position.
I would prefer pyro mines over amy other ones, since they deal a total of ~100 damage with burning+ instant 80 (can be double stacked to kill a light) and have some area denial.
Also, is APS broken? I never see it in games. Defib which has almost a 100% pick rate is only in competitive
I wuold say that dome is very powerful for heavy 1v1's. I drop it down to get distance and free shots. Usually its a deciding factor in a fight.
second this
Great vid! Have to kinda say though, I kinda wanna make a case for smoke nades as niche at least for Power Shift (fully understand why it's placed as avoid tho -- for Cashout modes it is not practical; I'm just mentioning ideas, bear with me).
Smoke nade renders pyro/Flamethrower useless; placing gas inside smoke guarantees its effect the whole time, which can serve as area of denial but crucially force enemies out of the platform early to mid game. It also temporarily obscures turret vision tho for some reason you can still get detected through it if you shoot the turret.
There's a different kind of fun and rewarding feeling to pull off SH1900 + Grapple + Smoke + Thermal Vision in particular, zip through the smoke and if my aim doesn't miss (which I miss a lot lol) they don't see it coming.
Dang didn't even think about power shift and the turret cancel. I can def see the argument for that. Generally I stick to cashout but I'll have to give that a try!
@@CalmZinCombo Hell, I got hundreds of hours in game an didn't even know it did that.
Pyro mines are a great thing to put on revive statues, if they pop you can't even grab the statue anymore and sometimes kills the person going for a revive
Sorry for the second comment buut I have to say as well, love the recognition of the Anti-Grav cube having strong capabilities. We need a video for it fr (maybe you already do, have to recheck, but more tips will always be nice)
Lol all g, and bet ;)
Dude, I can not even count how many powershift games I've won thanks to the cube. However I also can't count how many games I've LOST to someone simply jumping while in overtime thanks to the same mechanics that makes cube great there.
make your intro skeleton thumbs up point higher or im going to defibrillate you in The Finals!!
Oh jeez 😳
calm zin combo does not negotiate with terrorists
I have two ideas for the glitch mines as a nerf. One is to limit it so only one player can be affected by it at a time. The other is to introduce a burnout similar to the healing beam, i think that would be the way id go with it
I really enjoy your content keep it up
Data reshaper is very strong. You can switch turrets, APS, any mine, grenades and rockets, barricades IN A SINGLE CLICK.
Smoke grenades in avoid! In my opinion they are SEVERLY underated as i have many clips of steals, revives, ect because of smokes.
let me guess, all quick cash clips?
Not sure man, I just don't think Finals is a game where smokes can get a lot of value if the opponents know what they're doing. What makes it worse is that enemies can see your HP bar if they hit you once through a smoke
Smoke Grenade actually great if only CD is not long
But i kinda understand why Embark doesn't do that, its frustrating against Smoke covering battlefield
I would like to see a Secondary pistol as a gadget, would that be op? For clutch moments you need those extra couple bullets to finish someone off
pyro mines are better than gas mines. They act like mini explosive mines, pyro mines blow up and deal 85-90 damage and burns whoever triggered it. Even if you smoke the mine, it'll still do the initial explosive damage.
do you have the link for this tierlist? i kinda want to do it as well :).
Great vid and helpful as always. 🤙🏻
Couple ideas I’ve had for new gadgets are a healing bomb for medium that works like a vanishing bomb but gives 50 hp to self and teammates, so maybe medium doesn’t have to always run healing beam and can finally heal themselves a little.
And then some kind of a direct impact grenade that does damage when you hit a player directly; maybe a Semtex type nade that does 120 when you land it on someone, otherwise it breaks a wall.
Thoughts?
what if you gave the heal bomb to light so people wouldn't complain when they got a light on their team
Lowk a healing stim for light would be even better lowk
@@samuelajakaye nah Light already no needed that due to Health regen change where Heavy getting longer than Light
Even heavy now need that due to that change lol
@@manyblock4192 Ahhh you right, I actually forgot about that change ngl
I would argue that gateways r better than sonar grenades....atleast for a solo player
Gas mine plus turret is nice combo. Gas mines deny good angles to destroy your turret.
29:55 u can easily steal cuz no one can kill u while u stealing, cuz they simply cannot see u
32:49 i am sword main, one stun - i am dead
Another great video
How can you kill people with the defib bro?
If you walk up and zap an enemy they take damage lol
@@CalmZinCombohuh lmao that makes sense who knew
forget to say clear
gateway in niche is criminal.
Nice new pfp
Thanks, right back at ya!
video starts at 2:00
Hello friend, o think i should put some vids of examples of wath u r sayng just to be more intuitive and more fun to Watch (sorry for bad english)
Oho new pic
Yup 🎉
Hi
Hello :D
hell yeah fuck the aps turret, it used to totally ruin power shift far beyond snipers, one of those turds on the platform and every item you tried throwing in there was just gone - no fun allowed garbage. even more so if you played cl-40, your weapon was rendered inoperable.