I think a good thing to take away is, you can totally get started racing with your freestyle bike. Take off the pegs (if you have them), and start practicing and get a feel for riding the track.
These racing videos have been fun to watch, I didn’t think I’d like them as much as I do. Great to see that track providing some awesome opportunities for people to learn without having to invest a ton of money, that’s a great service they provide.
Awesome episode as always. In the 80's I had very little money so my freestyle bike was my race bike, my jumper, my ride to school, my transport to my girlfriend's house, and my beach cruiser (I grew up in Torrance CA). Oh, I also used it for my delivery job. I was best at freestyle and jumping, but I also was able to scratch out a few race wins on my tuff-wheel, coaster brake laden tank. :)
I don't want to be nit picky ... but for those who don't know, this is an important bit of information. Clipless pedals allow you to "turn circles" If you are pushing and pulling, you are wasting a lot of potential and power. Even at a lower level of cycling (MTB) I learned to "turn circles" and focus / train for constant power input. It was explained to me that as your foot comes to the bottom of the stroke you should concentrate on a motion like you're trying to scrub dog poop off your shoe 🤣 Riding a road bike clipped in or riding on a bike stand is a good way to focus on getting the technique down, so that you can then apply it to other riding disciplines.
I raced for 17 years, no the clips are not more efficient giving you pulling pressure on the backstroke, testing has proved that this upsets your pedal stroke and from a power standpoint is negligible. The advantage of clips is being able keep your feet in place while you smash on the pedals and pedalling over stuff without having to keep your feet from blowing off. With proper pedalling technique on flat pedals in a standing sprint position generates pretty much the same amount of power. So while they are definitely an advantage in racing it’s one of those crutches to make a person more competitive without extensive practice and training. I did a lot of testing of flats vs clips and am def more consistent on the clips overall but had some of my fastest times on flats and have a much better start and first couple pedals being smoother and maximizing the downward pedal stroke with a mid foot pedal position than with lifting with the Blackfoot on clips which usually spins the wheel of upsets your gate start.
Hey guys, If you want to compare Freestyle vs the race, you need clip ons, Tire that can take same pressure in the tires and for the gearing look at the sprockey chart ratio calculator. What equal 16/44 with your rear pignon tooth on the freestyle is 9/25.
So you gotta do more tests now, onyx hubs vs profile hub, and different bottom brackets , put sinz wheelsets to the test, are blades spokes faster? Can it out run the po po?
Love the sound effects talking about the head tube angle! It’s more errr that way! Perfect said! Lol the same way I describe stuff all the time actually so I comprehended that perfectly! Awesome video tho! I used to take my Candy Apple Red Mirra Pro and later my Raw Mirra S351 Pro to Tom Brown Parks NBL track in Tallahassee Fl Always wanted to try a race bike but always spent my money on bike parts or more lumber to build more ramps. I went to Tom Brown Park two weeks ago and now it’s a pump track. I took my midschool machine that’s 39.8 lbs……my Schwinn Hydramatic Comp
If we could finally have BMX race tracks that were downhill, then that timeless ratio would change. Until then, the near-boredom and the ratio will continue on....and on.
Amazing video! I love the new race bike. It looks sick! For people who live near tracks that are closed access outside of race meets, look for your local pump track or dirt jump trails. It's all the same motions, and means you can keep practicing outside of race meets!
i have never rode clipped in, but i do have a technique, im sure others do as well, where you are of course , pushing down, but i let my shoe grip the pedals so i also do pull back and forward push as te pedals are at the angle coming around, you do get more efficient pedal strokes doing that, its more efficient and you get some more speed as well.
One thing people got to learn on the gate... You do not put pressure against the pedal against the wheel against your forks against the.... The way to teach people how to balance on the gate is to make them sit on their seat with their feet kind of out to the side.... With just the pressure and the weight of their body sitting against the tire pressure of the gate use the handlebars to move the bikes left and right.... When you're putting pressure on the front pedal you are basically causing your bike to want to rotate one way or the other and caused you to fall..... You want to have your feet ready but you want to have a neutral... As soon as the gate sounds you want to pull yourself as hard as you can towards the handlebar pushing down on the pedal at the same time... It should look like as if you're trying to thrust against the handlebars make sure you're pulling your rear leg back to the and push that other pedal through the floor..... Also Park bikes versus race bikes you have to know the gear roll out another words the teeth on the front chainring versus the cog in the rear on both bikes come up to a mathematical thing called a gear ratio then the tire size and the type of tire determines the rollout if the rollout is the same on both bikes then it would be an even comparison based on weight only...
My first bmx when I started racing was a freestyle. I knew no different. But I learnt everything on that bike and when I upgraded to a race bike I shot up the rankings. As a full time bmx coach when kids want to get their first bike there budget needs to be second hand and under £150. There’s a kid at my local pump track who rides what looks like a toysrus bike. But he sends jumps and has the most ratings. The day he gets an actual real bike 💥
If Matty is going to Woodward for the USABMX Freestyle contest in May, There is also a PA state qualifier race on Saturday and Gold cup qualifier race on Sunday.
I miss bmx race tracks I had the freestyle bike but I got to try the other racers racing bikes it's a big difference on the track for sure I was more of the dirt bike jumper and some parks back when I was 16 I'm 39 now but I'd love to try the track race scene again
One trick I found to help balance on the gate is to keep your palms open on the bar until you get to the "riders ready" bit, then grip and go, works pretty good.
About clips - the “advantage” of applying power on the pull stroke is negligible. If you get a set of good mtb flats like some RaceFace Chesters you’ll get more than enough grip and more than enough downstroke power. What would really get you moving is what I used to do when I raced - run 45/16 or 56/16 gearing. Your gate start will be slightly slower but you end up with the power of a drag racer. Try it. Good flats and 46/16.
Dead on regarding clips and gear ratios. Mutch knowledge Jon. Just look for vids about pro mtb on flats times always faster. Only on a flat road would you really need clips.
Yea! When you’re clipped in it allows you to use your hamstrings more! The push down is all quads and the pull is your hammies. If you start training your hamstrings you’ll get even faster 💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽
Lame, mountain bikes belong in the mountains, makes me wanna puke when I see them on the streets or at a skatepark, bmx is sacred, mtb is for goons and kooks. Sorry, not sorry, bmx only for life.
The reduced turning agility he felt on the freestyle bike was likely due to having heavier wheels. The heavier the wheel, the more angular momentum the wheel has, and the more it will resist being turned/leaned. It also has a big effect on acceleration out of the gate.
Matty when your against the gate, you have to rotate your wrist forewards. So when you pull your bars back and trow your waist forewards at the start, your hands are correct. Advice from old school bmx-er
I'd be curious to see how a race bike compares to freestyle bike like mine is set up. It's basically a trail bike, no pegs, straight cable, and pretty traditional geometry as I'm a mid school rider. but all of the parts are pretty lightweight and I have a bunch of ti stuff as well. I also run 28/9 gearing but in theory should be faster than 44/16. I dont see any reason why someone wouldn't be able to condition themselves to be quick out the gate on the 28/9 or i guess maybe 45/16 to avoid chain breakage
I’m 40 and will start racing in 2025. I’m looking at the Haro race lite pro 24 bmx race bike. But I’m wondering if 24” wheels or try to find. 20.5” wheel bike? I use a link whip xl for street and park. I could race with it tho…
Tbh it would be fair to say if mattys freestyle bmx had a cassette on it, it would be way more fair and equal to the race hub on that race bmx. Idk i could be wrong. Just a thought. Cause freecoaster slack could be a small reason why. Great video tho!!❤
Man, I remember when my all steel/chrome GT was 'the bike' to have for racing, back in early 90's. And was probably built to more of the freestyle dimensions lol.
Here I am just distance riding an old Walmart style Mongoose from the 90s for fun. It's geared decent enough so it can creep up hills all right and it kind of hauls ass on the straightaways and the downhills.
Now imagine if you had Profile racing Elite hubset with ceramic bearings and fully titanium freestyle frame, forks ,handlebars and spokes, cranks and Alienation acme ud carbon rims and time Xpro 15 carbon titanium clip pedals that freestyle bike with all those mods would most likely match the time of that race bike if not beat it
My rl540 is full cro-moly it weighs about 16 lbs! I know a GT performer was about 25 lbs, not to sure but I know my friends performer was a whole lot heavier. Never even heard of anyone using clip-ons lol, those are for ten speed race bikes.
I looked at geometry between freestyle and BMX. They were almost identical. Unless you plan on only racing, I would get the freestyle bike. The BMX is purpose built.
Time is a trip. The pro guy started the year I quit racing. Feel old now lol. Got kids now that want to ride so dad is gonna get back into the “old dudes wanna race again” club lol.
Matty you want to start with your front pedal one or two clicks lower. That will help you get out of the gate faster. The higher your front pedal is the longer it will take you to get going.
Try the race bike without clips and a sub 21inch frame the front end won't dive on you. I'm guessing your 5'9 155lbs? Never had clips we had Hutch bear traps ya get the same upstroke cause they're literally knives embedded into the Vans.
I mean... His freestyle bike is damn near an 80s flatland bike. Would be dope to see how a more trail oriented bike does with his beast butt pedaling it
It's because there was no number plate on the freestyle one. That's why
Don't forget flame stickers make your bike faster too.
@@neonnerd1364 decals give you an extra 10 horse power
@@ryannull4567 exactly. It also doesn't help to include a nos sticker.
@@neonnerd1364 more decals more speed
I remember when freestylers put number plates on their bikes, just for extra space for stickers.
You guys are brilliant. Entertaining and fun combined with a stack of great information for riders out there. Highly appreciate your videos!
I used to race BMX bikes and I have actually been to that Naples BMX track for the BMX state championships.
I think a good thing to take away is, you can totally get started racing with your freestyle bike. Take off the pegs (if you have them), and start practicing and get a feel for riding the track.
And get racing tires, I did it as a kid with a diamondback 😂 only kid on the track w a gyro
Love love these type of vids Scotty. Big respect from the UK!
These racing videos have been fun to watch, I didn’t think I’d like them as much as I do. Great to see that track providing some awesome opportunities for people to learn without having to invest a ton of money, that’s a great service they provide.
Awesome episode as always. In the 80's I had very little money so my freestyle bike was my race bike, my jumper, my ride to school, my transport to my girlfriend's house, and my beach cruiser (I grew up in Torrance CA). Oh, I also used it for my delivery job. I was best at freestyle and jumping, but I also was able to scratch out a few race wins on my tuff-wheel, coaster brake laden tank. :)
That was me too I ended up getting a shadow chain for my freestyle bike so it had less play
where in Torrance did you live - i was at Torrance and Anza
@@adZHARRISON I lived on Emerald St. west of Torrance Blvd.
This is making me miss racing. The feeling of being on the gate in the main is pretty special.
44/16... same gearing a lot of us were running in the early/mid '80s on our race bikes.
I don't want to be nit picky ... but for those who don't know, this is an important bit of information. Clipless pedals allow you to "turn circles" If you are pushing and pulling, you are wasting a lot of potential and power. Even at a lower level of cycling (MTB) I learned to "turn circles" and focus / train for constant power input. It was explained to me that as your foot comes to the bottom of the stroke you should concentrate on a motion like you're trying to scrub dog poop off your shoe 🤣
Riding a road bike clipped in or riding on a bike stand is a good way to focus on getting the technique down, so that you can then apply it to other riding disciplines.
matty's guesses were crazy close
Yes! Love seeing more kinds of cycling on the channel
I raced for 17 years, no the clips are not more efficient giving you pulling pressure on the backstroke, testing has proved that this upsets your pedal stroke and from a power standpoint is negligible. The advantage of clips is being able keep your feet in place while you smash on the pedals and pedalling over stuff without having to keep your feet from blowing off. With proper pedalling technique on flat pedals in a standing sprint position generates pretty much the same amount of power. So while they are definitely an advantage in racing it’s one of those crutches to make a person more competitive without extensive practice and training. I did a lot of testing of flats vs clips and am def more consistent on the clips overall but had some of my fastest times on flats and have a much better start and first couple pedals being smoother and maximizing the downward pedal stroke with a mid foot pedal position than with lifting with the Blackfoot on clips which usually spins the wheel of upsets your gate start.
Great video! The similarities/differences between BMX disciplines are so interesting.
Hey guys, If you want to compare Freestyle vs the race, you need clip ons, Tire that can take same pressure in the tires and for the gearing look at the sprockey chart ratio calculator. What equal 16/44 with your rear pignon tooth on the freestyle is 9/25.
Absolutely fantastic that they offer completely free to try events.
So you gotta do more tests now, onyx hubs vs profile hub, and different bottom brackets , put sinz wheelsets to the test, are blades spokes faster? Can it out run the po po?
Love the sound effects talking about the head tube angle! It’s more errr that way! Perfect said! Lol the same way I describe stuff all the time actually so I comprehended that perfectly! Awesome video tho! I used to take my Candy Apple Red Mirra Pro and later my Raw Mirra S351 Pro to Tom Brown Parks NBL track in Tallahassee Fl Always wanted to try a race bike but always spent my money on bike parts or more lumber to build more ramps. I went to Tom Brown Park two weeks ago and now it’s a pump track. I took my midschool machine that’s 39.8 lbs……my Schwinn Hydramatic Comp
Some things never change, i used to race BMX back in the 80's and we used 44 16 gear ratio then as well.
If we could finally have BMX race tracks that were downhill, then that timeless ratio would change. Until then, the near-boredom and the ratio will continue on....and on.
Nah we ran 44-17 to get a faster jump out the gate. If you pedal clipped in and use your pump you dont really lose any top end
good job guys..good to have fun especially on some bikes..
Amazing video! I love the new race bike. It looks sick! For people who live near tracks that are closed access outside of race meets, look for your local pump track or dirt jump trails. It's all the same motions, and means you can keep practicing outside of race meets!
Where else can a BMX track get 50 to 100 thousand views worth of advertising? This was a great video, guys!
i have never rode clipped in, but i do have a technique, im sure others do as well, where you are of course , pushing down, but i let my shoe grip the pedals so i also do pull back and forward push as te pedals are at the angle coming around, you do get more efficient pedal strokes doing that, its more efficient and you get some more speed as well.
One thing people got to learn on the gate... You do not put pressure against the pedal against the wheel against your forks against the.... The way to teach people how to balance on the gate is to make them sit on their seat with their feet kind of out to the side.... With just the pressure and the weight of their body sitting against the tire pressure of the gate use the handlebars to move the bikes left and right.... When you're putting pressure on the front pedal you are basically causing your bike to want to rotate one way or the other and caused you to fall..... You want to have your feet ready but you want to have a neutral... As soon as the gate sounds you want to pull yourself as hard as you can towards the handlebar pushing down on the pedal at the same time... It should look like as if you're trying to thrust against the handlebars make sure you're pulling your rear leg back to the and push that other pedal through the floor.....
Also Park bikes versus race bikes you have to know the gear roll out another words the teeth on the front chainring versus the cog in the rear on both bikes come up to a mathematical thing called a gear ratio then the tire size and the type of tire determines the rollout if the rollout is the same on both bikes then it would be an even comparison based on weight only...
Nah
My first bmx when I started racing was a freestyle. I knew no different. But I learnt everything on that bike and when I upgraded to a race bike I shot up the rankings.
As a full time bmx coach when kids want to get their first bike there budget needs to be second hand and under £150. There’s a kid at my local pump track who rides what looks like a toysrus bike. But he sends jumps and has the most ratings. The day he gets an actual real bike 💥
If Matty is going to Woodward for the USABMX Freestyle contest in May, There is also a PA state qualifier race on Saturday and Gold cup qualifier race on Sunday.
I miss bmx race tracks I had the freestyle bike but I got to try the other racers racing bikes it's a big difference on the track for sure I was more of the dirt bike jumper and some parks back when I was 16 I'm 39 now but I'd love to try the track race scene again
One trick I found to help balance on the gate is to keep your palms open on the bar until you get to the "riders ready" bit, then grip and go, works pretty good.
Ill try that today. Could do it easy as a kid. Just started back up at 48. My balance is horrible. My second race is today
Wouldn't you want it to be heavier to conserve momentum better?
No
They stop talking at 3:16
About clips - the “advantage” of applying power on the pull stroke is negligible. If you get a set of good mtb flats like some RaceFace Chesters you’ll get more than enough grip and more than enough downstroke power. What would really get you moving is what I used to do when I raced - run 45/16 or 56/16 gearing. Your gate start will be slightly slower but you end up with the power of a drag racer. Try it. Good flats and 46/16.
Dead on regarding clips and gear ratios. Mutch knowledge Jon. Just look for vids about pro mtb on flats times always faster. Only on a flat road would you really need clips.
Also would love to see matty take a 22” down the track just for comparison……in fact a whole 22” review
Yea! When you’re clipped in it allows you to use your hamstrings more! The push down is all quads and the pull is your hammies. If you start training your hamstrings you’ll get even faster 💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽
6:19 nose heavy with front brakes, gyro, chromo forks vs carbon fiber and probably heavier tires or rim set
I’ve actually always wondered this… thanks for the video!
Now take the dirt jumper on the track 😅 would be pretty interesting
Lame, mountain bikes belong in the mountains, makes me wanna puke when I see them on the streets or at a skatepark, bmx is sacred, mtb is for goons and kooks. Sorry, not sorry, bmx only for life.
The reduced turning agility he felt on the freestyle bike was likely due to having heavier wheels. The heavier the wheel, the more angular momentum the wheel has, and the more it will resist being turned/leaned. It also has a big effect on acceleration out of the gate.
Having run mags and lightweight aluminum spoke wheels, I agree with your deduction.
I have learned counterstere harder to to counter that
I think it's a skill thing
Would love to see Matty race the pro running the gate at full effort
he gets smoked. I could smoke him and I havent raced in 5 years
Thumbs up if you want to see "21 Levels of BMX" with Scotty and friends!
For a freestyle bike that was some good times!
He could run even smaller tires too
Good ol Barry nobles shreds on his race bike at a park
I'm curious to know that if you geared the freestyle bike the same as the gearing for your race bike how would those compare
I'm actually really surprised the times were as close as they were.
Matty when your against the gate, you have to rotate your wrist forewards. So when you pull your bars back and trow your waist forewards at the start, your hands are correct. Advice from old school bmx-er
I'd be curious to see how a race bike compares to freestyle bike like mine is set up. It's basically a trail bike, no pegs, straight cable, and pretty traditional geometry as I'm a mid school rider. but all of the parts are pretty lightweight and I have a bunch of ti stuff as well. I also run 28/9 gearing but in theory should be faster than 44/16.
I dont see any reason why someone wouldn't be able to condition themselves to be quick out the gate on the 28/9 or i guess maybe 45/16 to avoid chain breakage
rollout is against you compared to a race bike
I’m 40 and will start racing in 2025. I’m looking at the Haro race lite pro 24 bmx race bike. But I’m wondering if 24” wheels or try to find. 20.5” wheel bike?
I use a link whip xl for street and park. I could race with it tho…
@Scotty Cranmer whats the model of that Mongoose Race Bike?
speed depends on gear ratio not on style of BMX.
Do the supergoose repop versus the race bike next. I'm thinking the times would be closer.
nice vid i do both one thing not evry race bike should have click peddels or should have this or that
Put skinny tires on the freestyle bike and clip pedals
What track is that ?
Tbh it would be fair to say if mattys freestyle bmx had a cassette on it, it would be way more fair and equal to the race hub on that race bmx. Idk i could be wrong. Just a thought. Cause freecoaster slack could be a small reason why. Great video tho!!❤
I would love to see how it would be with a oldschool mongooese bike - i think the gear ratio is better for racing
You guys should try the park gear on the race bike to match.
What is the model of the mongoose racer please?
Man, I remember when my all steel/chrome GT was 'the bike' to have for racing, back in early 90's. And was probably built to more of the freestyle dimensions lol.
try scottys TI bike clipped in
My bike is designed to handle very little abuse and it would not be safe for Matty to ride it.
Great comparison!
Here I am just distance riding an old Walmart style Mongoose from the 90s for fun. It's geared decent enough so it can creep up hills all right and it kind of hauls ass on the straightaways and the downhills.
Is this Wylde bike park?
Now imagine if you had Profile racing Elite hubset with ceramic bearings and fully titanium freestyle frame, forks ,handlebars and spokes, cranks and Alienation acme ud carbon rims and time Xpro 15 carbon titanium clip pedals that freestyle bike with all those mods would most likely match the time of that race bike if not beat it
you got will the thrill, now we need brandon leave em standin'
7:33 DO YOUR HELMET UP PROPERLY.
YES BOSS!
Try hydro brake from formula.
World of difference vs your mechanical disk brake
"F-150 will take the abuse" F-150 drives by in the background.
Are race bikes decent for dirt jumps?
My rl540 is full cro-moly it weighs about 16 lbs! I know a GT performer was about 25 lbs, not to sure but I know my friends performer was a whole lot heavier. Never even heard of anyone using clip-ons lol, those are for ten speed race bikes.
His estimation skills are on point lol
i love how the race bike is being stopped a bit by the air pressure on the plate with number lol
I have a 24 tooth sprocket in the front and a eight tooth sprocket in the back on my BMX and it is one easy bike to wheelie
Good info needed this
Where can I order one?
drivetrain on the left side?
I looked at geometry between freestyle and BMX. They were almost identical. Unless you plan on only racing, I would get the freestyle bike. The BMX is purpose built.
Love this. Thank you!
Time is a trip. The pro guy started the year I quit racing. Feel old now lol. Got kids now that want to ride so dad is gonna get back into the “old dudes wanna race again” club lol.
I need to come to america to ride a track and I hope to ride u guys I’ve been racing since I was 10 and I’m go to the world this year
Real BMXers don’t clip in.
You should try this test on a bmx track instead of a sidewalk
17:20 sounds like fighting words lol
Matty you want to start with your front pedal one or two clicks lower. That will help you get out of the gate faster. The higher your front pedal is the longer it will take you to get going.
DAMN noice I love going to a pump track
The turning thing had to be the wider tires with less pressure
Race BMX VS dirtjumper?
Mario's not a plumber no more 😂
Very cool
Thank you for explaining
Try the race bike without clips and a sub 21inch frame the front end won't dive on you. I'm guessing your 5'9 155lbs? Never had clips we had Hutch bear traps ya get the same upstroke cause they're literally knives embedded into the Vans.
The difference on the back ends are drastic.
In 1998 I would take my GT Speed series race bike to sheep hills in SoCal all the time 😂
You guys need to customize that title
there’s a reason why sport bikes are a hell of a lot faster than harley’s and cruisers even tho they have smaller engines ergonomics is everything
I mean... His freestyle bike is damn near an 80s flatland bike. Would be dope to see how a more trail oriented bike does with his beast butt pedaling it
i go race these days can't afford to break anything on my body.
Can we see a quick race Mario vs Matty??
You guys should upgrade the race bike and see what upgrades make the biggest difference
Rad bro🎉
you should do a mtb enduro vs your race bike
I ride a Standard 125r, race trails n park.
i lover the coaster czu u jus hear tires rollin rohnd track
Where is the track