How to Kill a King
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- For as much bitching as I do in this video, I really wanna remind everyone that I love, and have loved, all of the music in Warcraft so far.
And this expansion is no exception, I think they did a superb job with Anduin's theme.
Twitter: / sideways440
Twitch: / sideways440
"Or if you play Horde, it's a Tuesday."
Ouch. #darkspearnevahdie
Horde is just Red Alliance
Vengeance for Zul'jin!
We all felt that
Yep... we seem to get new leaders like ever other expansion.
Hold up.
Was that a Street Fighter Movie reference?
I'm not even horde and I was pissed when Vol'jin died
Yay you made a new video! You're my favorite RUclipsr :D
You're getting geekier and geekier
so glad you posted. so sad I have no idea what you're talking about.
spoilers man flagged your vid. I'M a RUclips HERO scrub.
YOU UPLOADED!!!! I THOUGHT YOU DIED!!!! Are you going to be back to posting more often now?
I don't know anything about this franchise but this was truly interesting, thanks for the video!
this video is not very accurate
I'm not gonna pretend that I know anything about music. or that I'm an expert in WoW, but the correlation I see with this cinematic's theme and with Anduin's theme is a father who, at the end, has learned his son's vision of the world and finally understood and accepted what his child was constantly trying to prove. I think the themes represents a new mentality for the Alliance, Anduin's vision, that at the end, was Varian's as well (Although Varian's has a more "Warrior" feeling to it). That would mean that this expansion is mainly for the Alliance, but it will eventually mean a lot for Azeroth.
But hey what do I know.
Right, I thought it was supposed to suggest that Varian's last thoughts were of his son.
7:30 Turn auto-generated captions on.
"[Applause]"
Gosh. No remorse.
1:55 That's the most accurate Alliance shade I've ever heard. I'm a blue bitch and I'm not even mad, shit was hilarious.
Gotta say I go with Blizzard on that one. O Thanagor, while thematically being a good fit,
might have been too confusing for people who don't read the books. The way it is now also
plays into Anduin growing into the role of a king and his relationship with his father.
The death of Varian doesn't feel like it is about Varian because it's not about Varian. Varian's story has reached it's climax and was already done. With him trusting the Horde so much as to let him life depend on their support he has reached the end of his character development. His part to play in the story is now not as himself but as Anduin's father in what will come to be the archetypical "Rescuing the father from the belly of the beast" story for Anduin.
As well, his death was for his people. His act wasn’t about him, so centering the theme around him could be confusing as well.
Like a soldier giving his life for his country to the national anthem, his music both references his son the new king, and the musical themes of the alliance. Literally the last thing to come out of varians mouth before he is murdered
I've really grown to like your videos, but I just think you're not as on point with regards to stuff here. "O Thanagor" is pretty consistently Arthas' theme. It's had various permutations, and they all revolve around him. While, if you dig deep enough into lore, you'll find that Varian and Arthas used to be friends as kids, it just does not get anywhere near the level of narrative emphasis to place Arthas' theme right there.
And I'm sure the guys at Blizz, if they felt it would work, they would. I mean Legion reprised a single David Arkenstone pub melody from 10 years ago into a full orchestral motif. "Temple of the Moon," to the new "Moon Rising." The expansion is full of references to old thematic material.
Neal Acree wrote Anduin's theme though, and if you look at his work, he's done the same thing here as he did in Warlords of Draenor, where he establishes an idea for a character, but then utilized it in a more general melody for cinematics. Khadgar's theme from WoD, which I believe had a ton of grandiose statements from as far back as the announcement trailer to the expanion, is something to look into.
I do think it's better connected here, though. You can clearly get the idea of the father-son relationship between Anduin and Varian, and it's not really used in any super out of context manner. The same cinematic where Varian died, also featured a nice rendition of the Stormwind theme, so I'm not seeing any bases that were particularly left uncovered.
Still, keep it up! Your videos are always interesting.
3:15 I think the 'king of castamere' theme was very intentional in GoT. The audience is meant to notice the 'spoiler'. It signifies the transition from suspiciously happy wedding to horrible massacer. It might even have been the signal for the hosts that the murder is about to begin. As the theme plays the wolfs notice their mistake, and moments later the killing begins.
Would upvote twice. That was the moment of realization. and it was even played explicitly for that purpose
The *reins* of castamere was played in the book at that point. Very intentional.
The band playing the song was the actual signal in the book for the massacre to start. As in, when the band plays that song, all of the plotters knew that it was time to start cutting.
funstuff81girl The *_Rains_* of Castamere lol
It's also the point at which Catelyn realises that something's up so the choice to place the band in her point of view with such an emphasis is a very intentional and appropriate one.
To understand what's happening from the music alone is pretty sick though
you should do a video about Prince zukos fight against his sister in the last episode of avatar The last Airbender, I think that the way they address the conflict is excellent and I'm curious what your thoughts are
I think that the inclusion of O Thanagor in that scene would perhaps lead to assumption that not only does Varian die, but he returns as a corrupted form of himself, or that he may have even been corrupted by Arthas himself. Many people hold that song to symbolize the downfall of Arthas, and for such a song to play would indicate that Varian would come back, corrupted by the forces that took him. If it did happen, that would be a music spoiler. If it didn't, it might leave people confused, and even annoyed that they were "misled".
Edit: Part of the majesty of the song seems to lie in the innocence of its sound, and the rather dark connotations that follow. It symbolizes an embrace of a dark entity, which Varian outright denies, in the form of him not dropping to his knees and pleading for mercy.
Hey yo, I'd totally be up for a corrupted King Chin to come back as part of the last legs of Legion, just sayin'.
yeses I've been waiting
me too !
i still need more, more!!!!
Anduins theme could also represent his ideals about peace, and Varians quote about "to preserve peace you must be willing to fight" extends the theme and makes it more bombastic in the cinematic (compared to Anduins flute and soft violins), ya know, that 'being willing to fight' and sacrificing is making Anduins ideals obtainable.
I don't even know about WoW yet I still enjoy the video. Nice work!
I see O Thanagor and Anduin's theme more representative of their respective families, rather than O Thanagor being for a king, or Anduin's theme being a representative of Legion as a whole. O Thanagor is an almost ironic song inherently connected to the Menethil family, while Anduin's theme is applied to the Wrynns family. Thus it plays in the cinematic where he is fighting the demons and during Varian's sacrifice as they are moments of a member of the Wrynn family epitomising their legacy as kings, and the theme is in turn, like his title, passed down to Anduin through succession.
Here's my very late take on this. An Karanir Thanagor (or Invincible) is Arthas's theme and has always been that. It has never been associated with the Kingdom of Stormwind, so I don't think it makes sense to use it for Varian's sacrifice. (Notwithstanding how cool it sounded in your edit.)
On the other hand, Anduin's Theme makes sense from a lore perspective. Everything Anduin has done in his life so far has been to bring peace to Azeroth, to end warcraft. When this theme is first introduced, what was Varian doing? Thinking about his son. Then when Sylvanas comes in, the theme plays again, because it symbolizes the unity between the factions. (Again, very Anduin). It then plays when Varian screams "For Azeroth." I guess you get what I mean.
And as you yourself kinda imply in your latest video about Battle for Azeroth, Anduin's Theme is about unity and peace. It belongs to his family, in that regard.
So yeah that's my counterpoint to yours.
That's not invincible. The song is called "Arthas, My Son." However the real invincible does have that lyric in it
Honestly, I think a really simple thing has been overlooked here. Legion is an expansion made for a lot of different types of players, from once returning after Warlords of Draenor spurned them, player returning from longer times away than that, as well as attracting new players (especially from the promotion with the movie).
And a sad reality is that a lot of players will only see the beginning of this expansion. For ones who are just getting into the story as well as ones who may not see the whole expansion, this moment is made to be as dramatic and engaging and satisfying as possible even if you don't know all of what lead up to it or where it ends up going. This is why both factions still see Varian's death: It ties back to the cinematic and creates a complete story arc for the opening alone, able to stand on its own regardless of WoW's expansive lore.
But on top of that, it's not really a spoiler. It's supposed to point forward to Anduin. It doesn't tell you any spoilers about what will happen as it is Anduin's theme, not Varian's. That's why it is new music. The first bit of it we hear is seeing Anduin's face in the compass (signifying his place as what gives Varian direction), and the next time we hear it is seeing Sylvanas (signifying how he has helped Varian work with the Horde, which the narration also echoes). Hearing this music when Varian lets go is entirely deliberate. It's not a spoiler of the story, it's the entire point of it.
Even if he's not there on the Shore, this music is about Anduin. This theme and this moment is about the passing of the torch from father to son, and the lessons learned between them both. Whether you're new to WoW, a diehard, or just trying the expansion out, this one moment is something meant to stick to you and say something very specific and clear.
I think he also pointed out the connection to Anduin in the video, which I agree with very much. Given this, why is there a necessity to find a way to musically kill a king?
Me (who's never played WoW before): nice
As much as I like that piece, I can't ever in good conscience view that as anything but belonging to Arthas. Using it for Varian would change the meaning of the theme.
"I play horde. I know what the sun looks like, have a girlfriend and am amazing at PVP."
So true
"have a girlfriend" (image not found) LOL
YAY! You're back! I found your channel recently and I love you! It's a blend of my two passions, video games and music.
Mainly music though :)
Liam O'grady make sure to watch 8-Bit Music Theory too! 👍
I always love your music replacements
Wait people still play this game
Oh god. Coming back to the video now that Shadowlands is out-
THERE ARE PARTS OF THE LICH KING'S THEME IN ANDUIN'S THEME.
SPOILERS. MUSICAL SPOILERS EVERYWHERE.
SIDEWAYS BIG BRAIN 5HEAD.
You managed to point out the musical spoilers for Shadowlands during a discussion about the musical spoilers of Legion.
AGDGSTAFAFADFSHDHAGAFSFAFAF
Wine. This video aged like fine wine. Omg.
This video deserves more views. This channel deserves more subscribers.
The leitmotif, quite obviously, represents 'fighting for the greater good of everyone', that being Azeroth in the case of the opening cinematic, and peace in the case of Anduin's theme.
Representing Varian himself is not exactly possible, because he does not really have an identity. Most of the time he was either a symbol of the whole Alliance, or a supporting actor in the character development of his son. Personally, I think something like the Stormwind theme would be most fitting. Certainly not Arthas' thing - it does not fit by any measure.
Regardless, Horde is trash.
I clicked on this video because I thought Varian in the thumbnail was Quinlan Vos from the Clone Wars
Me: I have no interest in World of Warcraft and don't know any of these names or characters
Also me: ooh, a Sideways video I haven't seen!
(Sorry for commenting on such an old video)
I think the problem here is that the theme is really the Scourge's Theme, Arthas's Theme. I think if they had a theme they wanted to use, the Stormwind theme but in adagio or in a darker key.
This analysis took the topic further, and I don't think it got enough attention:
www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/6eldm7/musical_analysis_whats_the_deal_with_anduins/
I'm like 2 years late, but why do you see the leitmotif as a theme for Legion as a whole, and not just the theme for the Wrynn family?
Yes, the leitmotif is used in the Legion cinematic, but only in moments where Varian is being badass. The theme is never used for any other characters but the Wrynns.
I dont think the reins of castamere was a spoiler in game of thrones. it was very soon before the event and made my heart start beating cause i knew shit was about to go down. plus, if you read the books, that was the signal used by the freys so that everyone knew to start the red wedding
A new version of "O Thanagor" that would fit the scene and show contrast from the more mournful version for The Lich King would be amazing! Also when we throw Sylvanas Windrunner off of the position of Warchief for being a sneaky and traitorous and stuff, when she goes evil and stuff we should have a mix of The Lich Kings "O Thanagor" and "The Lament of The Highborn" would be pretty sweet, also that would be very Ironic and symbolic.
Oh shit, you're alive!
Not into Warcraft universe, but I really liked the video, or mainly the idea behind it
YOURE ALIVE
The playing of the Rains of Castamere in Game of Thrones happened in the books, it was the chosen signal for the massacre to start
Yes! I've been waiting for a new video from you! This has become one of my new favourite channels. Great work!
Great video , Ethen. You should check out Bo Burnham as I think he would make an interesting subject for a video
#NotMyWarchief?
I hear it's another Tuesday...
So by having the Arthis’s music be in Anduin’s theme do you think they were hinting to what would happen to him in Shadowlands?
A musical spoiler :O
First video of you to pop up in my feed since a subbed a while back. Love it. My dad is a director and has directed world class orchestras like the Dutch KCO. So it's indicative that I pretty much grew up in music. But I gotta bow down to your musical skill and analysis. Got yourself another fan, keep it up bro.
(Might have used indicative wrong, wanted to use it really badly)
Isn't a "musical spoiler" just foreshadowing?
7:07 this gave me goosebumps... and I don't even care about the world of warcraft.
ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh O Thanagor is pretty synonymous with Arthas becoming the Lich King, it doesn't really work here at all.
This is absolutely gold, thank you! Would it be possible to do an essay on Quentin Tarantino' sound track and how he use it?
Have a gf: image not found
Have you?
Man...watching this with the 7.3 spoilers datamined feels weird. We know Anduin is going to be VERY important in the future, considering the Son of the Wolf (title unsure) comic, but Legion has mostly been Illidan's story. The story of how Illidan is going to try and end the Burning Legion once and for all.
You're back!!! I missed you!
6/10, Siegfried died a bit better...
God damn chills going down my spine at 7:12. You know what you're talking about. Good informative channel. Go big mate.
I think they meant it to just be a "Wrynn Theme", we get fragments of it while Varian is in his cabin. To me that makes the most sense as to why it is played in the cinematic/when Varian sacrifices himself, and then becomes Anduin's Theme. But they did a mistake in playing it while Sylvanas and Varian give their "sup" to each other, so I get why it gives the impression of it being a leitmotif for the Legion expansion
Watched all your videos. Don't regret subscribing. Joining notification squad.
forgot how much i love this game, the music never fails to impress me
TAKE ME BACK TO THEN. please... please, ill be in tyria till i can go back.
Spent 14 years of my life growing up with wow and wc3, nothing hurt more than BFA. though ive found new prospects and even better music,characters and world (so far) in the guild wars series. HOPEFULLY shadowlands can convince me to comeback.
I was hoping you could do an episode on the sound track of Coraline. There is a lot of cool stuff in there that you should definitely check out
LONG LIVE THE HORDE!!!
Interestingly, they seemed to have used the "O, Thanagor" music in the Knights of the Frozen Throne expansion for Hearthstone, of all things. This means the piece represents the Frozen Throne specifically? Undead in Warcraft? Or just general "Fall/corruption"?
I know this video is almost 4 years old now but, Varian dieing with that theme and Anduin having a very similar one makes sense, not just are they father and son, but they learned from and shaped each other, so they are tied together musically and emotionally, so it would also make sense if Anduin, not just being Varians Son but also now being High King of the Alliance(the actual good Guys), now also has a close emotional bond to the broken shore.
And with BfA Anduins theme has become very synonimous with the Alliance itself, more so than just the older theme of Stormwind. The Horde being given similar treatment with, what I shall call, Saurfangs Honor theme, both themes are very much about Heroism, though in different ways, Anduins theme, feeling more about doing the right thing because it is right and Saurfangs feeling more like a call to action to defend the honour of your people, your family and such.
Also the Song which you proposed for Varians death, "Arthas - My Son"/"Oh King", is basically synonimous with the Lich King, probably the remains of his humanity and in the end his death, and in a wider sense, corruption and mislead hunger for power, as Arthas didn't become the Lich King for wanting to but by accident in pursuit to gain power to save Lordearon, which makes its usage in the Wrath cinematic doubly important, because Terenas was right, Arthas would have become a great and wise King for he cared for his people and his country so much that he literally went to the ends of the earth in pursuit of Mal'Ganis to destroy the Scourge, which...well we know how that ended.
Also more and more character/concepts are receiving similar treatment with the Emerald Dream and Ysera having basically the same theme, the titans and their structures having a theme that can be at least related to Wraths Ulduar Raid(My Second Favourite ever after ICC) and more such relationships that I currently probably just can't think of.
Also Boralus Habour has better music than Stormwind.
tell me that i'm not dreaming , a new fkin video
While I absolutely LOVE "O Thanagor," if they had played that piece during Wrynn's last fight, I would have just WTF'd the scene because I would have immediately thought about The Lich King, or at the very least Arthas, or at the very, very least the Menethil Family. I would have thought the piece to be very out of place and it would have taken me right out of that pivotal and emotional moment. I think the connection between Varian and how his death now passes all that loss and responsibility onto Anduin is very fitting in how they used "Anduin's Theme" there.
So late to this video, but this reminds me of when I was watching my bf play Breath of Fire 4, and the developers chose to use a piece of classical music that I already knew. It was Pavanne for a Dead Princess. I just looked at him and said, "You know you have to kill her, don't you?" He was a tad surprised when I was proved right.
The crazy thing about the Rains of Castamere is that it’s a theme in canon. It was written about Tywin’s complete destruction of the Reynes (pronounced rains). It’s now played as a threat. So in the books, there were two different orchestras, one in each tower, playing different songs throughout the night and creating a horrific cacophony. That’s why Catelyn immediately realizes that they’ve been betrayed when both bands strike up Rains of Castamere. It’s a deliberate Lannister threat, specifically that they’re about to destroy someone’s house. Can’t remember how the show played it, but there’s no way they could have conveyed all of that nuance to an audience that didn’t know the books
I play alliance and horde. I love the Warcraft soundtracks. The song that they play when Varian jumps off the ship is called "What a King must do". I guess the writers wanted to make Varian more heroic because he is sacrificing his life to protect his people(giving them a chance to escape). The song "Anduin's theme", is played when Anduin goes to the Broken Shore where Varian died after the battle to collect Shallamayn(the sword). To me, "Anduin's Theme" displays Anduin's grief that his father is gone, but then there is also hope that Anduin can carry on Varian's legacy and that his father's spirit will always be with him.
So one big thing to keep in mind here, and this is an issue of how they cut the song to fit the cut scene and trailer, is that the piece of music being used is a song called "Alliance Hero Theme". It a legion specific piece of music that is meant to to scream FOR THE ALLIANCE. (Which is why its in the cinematic, because its from Varian's POV. Sorry Hordies.)
What's interesting to the discussion here, is two fold: 1.They cut off the beginning of the song for the trailer and cut scene. The full piece of music is about double the length and actually transitions out of a big build up of the Stormwind theme. The song in its whole is supposed to stand for Varian's sacrifice and dying defiance. 2. You were right about Anduin's theme tying him to the Broken Shore through his father's death, that is literally his story arc this expansion. His father dies a hero and leaves him unprepared to take up the mantle of that hero, thus why his version of the hero theme is so somber. He's grieving.
Great video as always, just thought I'd contribute, even if I'm about a year late.
I did really like your use of "O Thanagor" and I agree that it would of worked wonderfully there. I think calling the music they used "Anduin's Theme" betrays why they used it. All the voice over is about Anduin and was obviously on his mind. I Think the music tells us just how much his Son means to him linking into the Dialog.
However It can be read both ways; that this is Auduin's Theme because it was Varians Legacy of Valor and Last Act that Anduin now has to follow, or That Varian was doing this for his son, invoking his Motif?
So I’m not a musical expert or anything but if you listen to the stormwind music after the initial AH AH AH part there’s a softer part that sounds like a parallel to the theme that plays when Varian drops from the air ship. This theme also plays in MOP when you sit in the log in screen for too long and in MOP there’s an entire quest line where Anduin runs away from Varian and learns about the panderan and how they live peacefully and he starts advocating this peaceful outlook to Varian who isn’t having it. And then it plays when Varian falls from the airship; knowing that he’s going to die and his son is going to become the new king and he finally understands what Anduin meant and accepts his peaceful outlook and so the song was put there because it reminds you of stormwind, the alliance, and Azeroth and SETS THE SCENE for battle for Azeroth which we thought was going to be Horde v Alliance but really turned into a fight for peace and a fight for Azeroth as A WHOLE instead of single factions and idk man but I think that’s really fuckin beautiful. Thanks for my coming to my ted talk.
Hey sideways, do you read comments? If so, I just wanted to say how much I enjoy your videos. I'm a 13 year old that LOVES piano and video game OST's, so I really appreciate these videos
I know literally nothing about WoW, video games in general, or just /music/, and you just gave me chills dude, powerful stuff
Fellow Orc player and new viewer here - I've really enjoyed your stuff so far, and this one was particularly great for me as I'm already good and familiar with the music. I love your idea of reusing the Lich King music - it *was* a great scene as is, but I think your idea would have taken it up several notches. Also yeah, completely agree with your very last point. Why do the good Warchiefs keep picking the worst possible successors?
I think Blizzard didn't use a "heroic sacrifice" music, because the scene isn't about sacrifice but "resolve to resist the legion on even to the bitter end", Varian didn't just bow down and accept the killing blow, but instead pretty much said "go f*ck yourself" to Gul'dan without using those exact word. That's why it's used in the opening as it shows Alliance and Horde side by side fighting the legion and also why it's used in Anduin's theme as Anduin Wrynn was seen as weakling compared to his father so the theme shows he's willing to end what his father started.
As to why it's not used in the Horde, well the Horde's willingness to fight was never in question.
You can actually hear some leitmotifs of the Stormwind theme after Varian says "For the Alliance!" and as he is getting disenchanted by Gul'dan. I don't know if the "Anduin" theme was used when he made the decision to sacrifice himself because in a way he did it to save Anduin (and also the Alliance) or if it was just because it sounded cool. Either way, I think the unaltered "Arthas My Son." Kind of takes some energy away from the scene and that if they did use O'Thanagor they would have to alter it in a way to be more high energy and major key.
Great video as usual, very interesting analysis, but I have to disagree with your assessment that this and the other examples you provided count as "musical spoilers".
Using themes and leitmotifs in this manner is fairly common as a form of subliminal foreshadowing, as you yourself talked about at lenght in past videos (even if mixing them together like in the case of KH or reverse them like in LoZ:SS is fairly unusual), but the key word here is "subliminal", for 99% of people won't ever conciously notice such a thing while immersed in the experience. They'd too focused on what's going on with the characters, story, and gameplay (when it's not a cutscene of course), to question such obscure details of the audio-visual presentation. And they are most certainly obscure, because few have the musical training and recognize what's going on on a subtextual musical level, not to mention have the rediness to catch on the fly such a thing.
This leads to the other problem with your argument: You yourself mentioned that it took you many viewing to take notice of this extra layer to the opening of the game. This isn't an attempt to diminish your accomplishment in finding out this very interesting detail and its possible future implications, but unfortunately it doesn't automatically mean that's a form of spoiler. Because in storytelling the first time you experience the story is the one that counts.
Any piece of good traditional storytelling, no matter what, upon further analysis will eventually reveal loads of details uncovering the events about to unfold early on, because that's just how stories work, and as long as these details aren't obvious enough for most people to recognize them right away, calling them a spoiler would be a mistake. It's nothing more than another form of narrative foreshadowing. One that is much less often talked about, but foreshadowing nonetheless.
For it to be a spoiler, aka an overly obvious piece of foreshadowing, like, say, a character who is supposed to surpise the audience by actually being a villain all along, it would require the story to suggests it fair and square for anyone to see, with no possibility for the majority of the audience/players/readers to miss or misinterpret, often because of past experiences with similar pieces of media. In the example I just provided that would be the villain giving the back to the camera, while looking back and smiling evilly after a conversation where they promised their complete loyalty (maybe accompanied by a menacing musical cue to bring this back to the main topic). THAT would count as a spoiler/extremely poor foreshadowing if the reveal is supposed to be a surprise.
The subject of your video doesn't really fit these pre-requisites, for I am certain 100% that next to no one would have ever noticed that this is something that was going on.
Even if one were to pay extreme attention to the music from the start for some strange reason, they wouldn't exactly fit into the kind of audience any storyteller could ever hope to surprise or even immerse in any sort of narrative, no matter how well constructed, subtle and layered. Good storytelling is like the a magician's trick. You let the magician direct you where to look and let yourself forget it's all a trick while they work their magic so that you may experience wonder by the end of it, and that can't happen if one keeps actively focusing on what the magician is doing all the way trough.
So here is something interesting. I was listening to a Hans Zimmer playlist (Cause thats how we roll) and the track from King Arthur titled "Budget Meeting (Score)" (in google play music) shares an identical tune to O'Thanagor at around the 7 minute mark Link:(ruclips.net/video/nrJf_UA6oNw/видео.htmlm10s)
Keen to hear your thoughts - I am not sure what context it is played in the movie, but I get the feeling that this enforces the regal connection of the tune by connecting it to a historical/legendary figure
Sideways, what do you think of Progressive Metal? Stuff like Sithu Aye, CHON, Sea in The Sky, etc.
Sorry, but this is one where I have to hard disagree. The mistake is the conflation with the musical theme as being 'the Legion' theme when it doesn't really play anywhere else in Legion, whereas it's more realistically the Anduin and Varian relationship theme. It's the relation between Varian accepting Anduin's ideals for peace and making the decision that he's willing to sacrifice his life to make sure that those ideals can come to fruition.
Personally, I think seeing the theme in that light makes it MUCH more appropriate in the situation, and for me, the very heroic and bombastic rendition makes Varian's death feel truly epic, as he's heroically going out. O Thanagor has always been much more about Arthas, and I don't personally think it would fit Varian's death in the slightest, since it's much more mournful and regretful in feeling.
I can agree with your idea but in context I don't think it would stick well with the Warcraft fans as these are two very different stories and everyone would ragequit over the fact that you used the song Invincible, Arthas' theme song to the death of Varian. What they should rather have done was to create the Anduin's Theme much sooner. It's a fantastic, recognisable piece of music. Alternatively they could have used Legends of Azeroth or Call to Arms instead, two old recognizable pieces.
Well to answer the title, what you need is a Truthless from Shinovar wearing white, wielding an Honorblade. You will only understand if you've read the Stormlight Archive
I wish I had watched this sooner, I love this video. This may be counterintuitive because we now have the Anduin cinematic from the Broken Shore, but having Anduin's theme there was very intentional. Anduin's theme plays in the same physical locations as it does during Varian's death. The reason it plays as he lets go of the letter is likely because despite it being his death, it really doesn't end up being about Varian. It's about his impact, and the person it will have the most impact on is Anduin. Anduin's theme plays right as Varian lets go of his last words to his son.
Not sure if you watched it, but there's a Madefire version of Anduin's Son of the Wolf comic, and his theme is playing constantly through it, especially in parts where the narrative is showing Varian's letter. The reason it played in the opening cinematic is because of this. The narrator of both the comic and the cinematic is Varian's letter to Anduin, his theme plays over the letter. The opening cinematic is basically just a visual telling of his letter, and I love how Terran Gregory, Russel Brower, and the lore team at Blizzard pieced it all together.
Coming back to this a while later, and I figured that if they were planning Sylvanas' arc back in Legion then Anduin's Theme could represent peace which would tie in with the dialogue in the Legion cinematic, and then Varian dying sort of for the cause of peace in the broken shore cinematic. Sylvanas wouldn't have been able to use the peace motif because of her basically wanting to wage war on life itself.
If you want to talk about music signifying someone's death look no further than the music that plays when Optimus Prime dies in Transformers: The Movie. Just thinking about it tears me up. The whole musical score was awesome.
"I play horde. I know what the sun looks like, have a girlfriend and am amazing at PVP."
Excellent way to isolate your viewers.
I think they didn't use the older song because they wanted to make something new specifically for Varian. As you said, he didn't really have something that was super specific to him, so they made it, and then tied it in with his son (which has parts that sound very Stormwind-y). On a side note, Legion has be ROUGH! So much death, especially on the Druid side, ugh, I haven't been this depressed about fictional characters in years.
Maybe it's a song of sacrifice- Varian literally gives everything to show Anduin how to rule as a king. In the first use of the theme it's letting go of past hostility for the greater good; in the second scene it's letting go of personal goals in trade of setting an example to the troops (The underwater sequence was quite literally Varian looking at Anduin as his innocent defenceless son, and a parallel is drawn between Varian choosing to be a King to many and being a Father to one, ultimately showing Anduin that it was a sacrifice that was made on Varian's part, not negligence) and finally the most literal metaphor: Letting go of your life for the greater good of the kingdom, as to allow others to thrive.
That's just how I see it though, as a letter to Anduin on how to rule both in the literal and metaphorical sense. And as the theme has been used within the context of Arthas, I'd bet Blizzard sees it as the King's Mantle, the song of a soon-to-be-leader.
But can we talk about the real loss today? Vol'jin :( the horde misses u
They have used Anduin's theme elsewhere - the cinematic with him and Greymane comes to mind.
The Rains of Castermere isn't a spoiler. It's literally what you described. It was written in-universe as a musical monument to the Lanister's dominance, and the ease with which all opposition will be crushed. When a man sings this song in the wrong place, he's likely to be killed for the very simple reason that "Listen, we're team lion. You guys are fucked." is the entire point of the song, to the point where having one of the bandmembers outright saying that wouldn't be on the nose, it would be redundant.
While this is a good video, I think you're misunderstanding the theme going on. What's going on is a leitmotif and I'm sure you know what a leitmotif is. If the music was changed for the event of his big sacrifice then what the hell kind of relationship would the music have going back to Anduin? Intro: writing the letter for his son. Sacrifice:"Take this to my son" following into that music which is used in his son's music which is a lot more depressing and has considerably more sorrow? C'mon man.
Silly Sideways, thought it was about killing Varian but hindsight shows it was about making the Alliance the pro-Azeroth faction.
I have a question. I like your videos, mostly because of the analysis of how different media use music. BUT why don't you use music when you talk? Is that an intentional choice?
2:34 I would really disagree with that definition, and my best example of why is the use of My Beloved Monster by Eels in Shrek. If you listen to the song as a whole or were familiar with the song before seeing Shrek, then you might well have worked out that Fiona wasn't simply a princess.
They should do this with the Black Panther/Wakanda theme should theycever kill him off, when Chadwick Boseman has enough
I'm unfortunate to be born at a time and a country where by the time i got into gaming WoW wasn't so hot, but it's still a really cool video! Keep making videos, i've been here since your Pixar video, you're building a great channel :D
I disagree.
First off, "O Thanagor" is not only considered as "Arthas' theme" in the eyes of most people familiar Warcraft, but also a theme representing the lifeless cold of Icecrown and the tragedy that was the former hero's fall, as this also plays during his final moments at the end of Wrath of the Lich King. The theme would have been out of place and misleading expectations on what woudl happen next.
The reason this leitmotif fits is because Anduin was a *huge* part of Varian's character development up until this point. It's the only family he has left after his wife was stoned to death and the only one who tempered his warrior heart. He used to be VERY anti-horde and extremley gung-ho about it, but as expansions went on, his wrath cooled down. He still distrusted The Horde, but seeing wisdom and certain truth in his son's beliefs, he puts it aside to face The Legion alongside his enemies. Anduin is one of the reasons Varian fought for and were it not for him, he wouldnt have considered teaming up with The Horde at all.
You should talk about the theme of the Bunker (Fortress of Lies) from Nier:Automata. Pretty much a spoiler within the title of the song :D
idikmanFirst off I just want to say how much I love your channel! I'm always super excited when you post something new. I don't mean to come off as being incolent or to pry, but I do feel like if your titles had more to do with the content of your videos or if they were more direct more people would probably watch them