Starr DA & SA Revolvers
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- Опубликовано: 3 фев 2015
- Starr revolvers are one of the less recognized designs used in the US Civil War, although tens of thousands of them were made and issued. Indeed, in many ways they were superior to the much more common Colt and Remington revolvers of the period. One of the interesting facts about the Starr is that the double action design came first, and was only replaced with the more typical single action design several years into the war (due to problems with price and complexity). Today we're taking a look at a pair of Starrs, one single action and one double action. Ultimately the company shut down after the end of the war, and Colt would go on to dominate the revolver market in the United States.
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I have the SA model with the original leather flap holster for a Cavalry Officer. Handed down through my family. I've had it close to 50 years now.
my great great great grandpa used these during the civil war for the union, I found a picture of him with one
Mine was in the Union Cavalry and carried a pair of Colt Navy's. He died in 1862
You should post the picture up ! I’d like to see it
@@Tyronious870 Navy, like I said, 1851. 1860 would be the Army model. Which tbh look cooler and pack a bit of a heavier punch. He probably had them from before the war, but I will never know. Do wish I know what happened to them.
@@erichzahn3926 here's the pic
media.discordapp.net/attachments/929098677627285525/978459739040124948/image000000.jpg
I usually prefer single action revolvers but that double there has probably the coolest mechanism i've seen on a revolver.
Da/sa is best. Model 29s with the dirty harry cylinder are the best revolvers out there in my mind
@@codyjackalope8464 *Laugh in Manurhin MR73*
I was luck enough to be able to purchase an original Starr Model 1858 DA percussion revolver today at an auction. It's complete (just not currently functioning) and I got it for only $140!!! I plan to have it restored to working order by a professional gun smith that deals in antique firearms.
Have you fired it yet? How do you like it? Easier to clean than a Colt I'm guessing.
Please update us.
I'm feelin' you, bro. 140 is insane!
Just stumbled a Pietta 1863 Starr at a local shop this week. I had no idea what it was but it was beautiful and I had to have it. Thanks for the history lesson.
The single action is super light at 12 oz. It was only 6 oz till I stoned all the burrs off the trigger and hammer.
I've fired Italian repros of Starr, Remington and Colt .44. The Starr has a different feel and balance and this may partially have been factor in its demise since users accustomed to the feel of the others. Also at a gun show there was an original Starr single action some long forgotten gunsmith had intricately converted to cartridge.
As always, great video.
You did not inmediately buy it ? .
A set trigger revolver! So cool. I remember seeing these at the Smithsonian and wondering what that little lever at the back of the trigger guard was for. I assumed it was some sort of trigger safety mechanism.
Those are actually some sharp looking revolvers. I dig them
I have heard all my life how old gunmen used to carry loaded cylinders and switch them out for a quick re-load ...
After I got old enough to shoot cap-n-ball revolvers , I decided this was an urban legend .
No way was that happening .
But with this design , it's entirely doable .
Could this be the source of an old legend ?
Not necessarily. For example the Remington model 1858 had a cylinder that could be interchanged in just a few seconds.
@@captainnemo4770 In theory, but again most guns back then were hand fitted as a unit. Taking a cylinder and just trying to plug it in likely wouldn't work.
Today with machine replication, sure. You could have a half dozen cylinders made and fitted to the gun that would work just like swapping magazines on a auto-loader.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine it is "fiddly" and slow to reload any black powder weapon. It is a lot less "fiddly" to swap cylinders.
@@0neDoomedSpaceMarine Hollywood actors never run out of bullets unless they're trying to make a certain part of the show scary. I didn't live back then and I don't know anybody who did so I don't know If They Carried spare cylinders or complete second guns. I know it's possible to fit a second cylinder to work in a revolver even if it's hand fit. And it would be handy to be able to reload a cylinder rather than trying to reload the whole gun. I don't know why you are so bent on thinking that having a spare cylinder was impossible. It is today and was 150 years ago entirely possible
All on thread: It's likely a lot of different people did a lot of different things back then, kinda like nowadays. Gunfights were actually very rare. Very rare.
Military action was seldom done with sidearms and it's unlikely an officer would ever have time to reload a revolver in battle in any way if he were in any range that would make a sidearm of those times effective.
Great presentation of a seldom seen Civil War era firearm! I'd love to have those!!!
Hey Ian, thanks for all these videos you put out. They're very well done, and informative. Whatever they're paying you for em, get it doubled!
At last, a revolver with a trigger pull that makes a Nagant seem petite!
Very interesting guns.
Very interesting revolvers thanks so much for the upload
That thing is beautiful! !!!!
I like the brass front sight on the SA version. Looks like it would be fairly easy to get a sight picture. Rear sight looked to be the hammer so. . . ick. Interesting, easy to clean and service. I'd be proud to own one.
I love the solid handsome looks of this gun
I have some older cartage revolvers that have the same trigger system. I was wondering who came up with it first.
That revolver design is great. The machining looks great too. I would had been very happy if I was issued one of these during that time. I wish there were more replicas made of this design. It would be great to have another fun shooter in the collection.
fun to look at with a original double action in my hand,nice vid
What a wonderful revolver.. this is one I must have in my collection..
One of the government's big beefs with the Starr double action pistol was the price, being 25.00 apiece. The price came down to 12.00 with the newer single action. Another demand of the government was a screwdriver set be issued with each revolver, which Starr agreed to. In my opinion, this is a very well-designed gun, especially the fix for caps fouling the mechanism, like they often did in colts. The hinged design is very robust and brilliant in its simple, perfect function. I have a double action with serial number 9887 that I just love. This show is great. Excellent close up views of every gun they show.
thanks cool to see these guns
Very good video.
I love the 19th century revolvers you show.
Sorry by sliding down that part of the cocking trigger you actually do the opposite and fire/ easier quicker. The reason you found it hard to fire was that the slider was uppermost!
Not on my navy, sliding down makes it a single action and up double action.
What a great job you have, its my dream job.
Very cool. I'd never heard of this before, which is a shame. I think if I were shopping for a handgun back then, I might have picked this over the Colts and Remingtons.
The cylinder wants to be free!
Yeah, that was cute the way it kept trying to escape.
OMG. I am a current subscriber/Patreon and love FW in 2021.
These old vids are pure, 'Gun Jesus'.
It almost appears as if he is arranging his hair to look more like The Son of God.
Thanks for the vid sir.
Very cool revolvers.
My understanding is that the DA trigger pull was unpopular with soldiers. I used to have a replica DA Starr in which I broke the mainspring by cocking the hammer with my thumb; apparently it isn't supposed to be cocked that way. I also had an antique Starr SA that I greatly preferred. BTW, the DA Starr is what Clint Eastwood carries in his film, "Unforgiven".
I'm lovin' that front sight on the SA
Beautiful gun..even if my 2 favourite are Old Army and Roger & spencer... (i wait a Pietta Starr DA for good price in used Market)
They are cool. Have a repro that I like. A friend has the double action. Its nice but keeps breaking main springs.
Really wish Pietta hadn't stopped making reproductions of these.
Very cool.
Late to the party but don't care. My dad has a SA starr that his great grand uncle, I think, picked up off a battlefield. The bottom of the handle has a C.S. on it. Either the officer who carried it or meaning Confederate States. All the parts still work, only had to replace the original leather holster. Thing weighs a good bit but that weight helps arm the hammer.
Also where can I find a working repro?
I’m late too. I just found my single action Starr that my uncle gave to me. His aunt gave it to him after a trip to Gettysburg in the early 60’s. Mine is not in working order though. It is missing a trigger, has some unoriginal screws and some pitting. Still very cool though. I’d like to talk to an expert to see if it’s a good idea to buy reproduction parts for it or leave it alone. I can read the number on it too. I wonder if you can tell who owned it by the number. Probably a long shot though. It’s cool to think that my gun was from the battle of Gettysburg though. But creepy to think that the guy who carried it probably didn’t make it through the battle. I wonder how much my gun is worth in its less than operable condition.
I recently inherited the single action Starr arms revolver and with some research found that the serial number being in the 23000 range it would have been in the first delivery of 1000 made to the government. Where I'm running into a roadblock is finding out what cavalry was issued the first order. It has initials carved into it and thought that maybe with long odds I could match it up with a soldier from a regiment roster list. Any help would be appreciated.
Interestingly enough, I've got an old Crosman Co2 pellet revolver, which uses the same "Trigger as a cocking lever" design, with the real trigger being behind the cocking lever. However, the fake trigger does behave exactly like a normal double/single design like we would see today. Did any other firearms use this faux trigger design? Its quite...interesting. At the very least, it's nostalgic for me.
Wish you could have a look at lot#1459. The Winchester 99 thumb trigger. Looks interesting
Sorry, but I didn't have a chance to take a look at that one.
Just bought a Starr navy da that has had a rough life, serial no 269 so very early in the production, lots of pitting but the bore is decent, the hand is rusted and someone has replaced the original hand spring in a not so good way. Love the odd mechanism and are looking forward to shooting it.
i think that unscrewed part of trigger in double action one works exactly opposite to what you said - it looks like protruding part of the front trigger would get rid of stiff pull on the actual trigger - but it's just an observation so correct me if i'm wrong
If I were an officer preparing for battle with one of these I'd drop the cylinder out of the frame and load it out the gun. It's so easy to do that for the busy officer in 1863, such as myself, I'd even consider getting a private to load my cylinders. Of course, I'm a swanky officer, I'll carry 2 of these beautiful pieces.
What a cool Revolver.
Ebenezer Townsend Starr is my ancestor. I am very proud of his contribution to the Union Army effort.
ive heard that the double action mechanism commonly broke on DA stars revolvers.
I watch all your videos as the are some of the best on the net but you need to improve your audio on many of them. I can barely hear half of them with the volume turned all the way up. It gets a little better when you have the camera closer to yourself but still isn't great. Other than that keep up the good work.
Disassembly would be popular wih me back then, for easy cleaning and maintenance
Hey brother might want ta level you’re table Thanks for the video 👍🏻👍🏻
Awesome and expensive revolvers.
30k units is no joke.
I love this gun.
A question to everyone familiar with these:
Which one would you rather go into battle with? The Starr or the Colt SA?
I`m quite curious to knoe that.
1860 Colt Army or Dragoon. The Star had an issue with the hand spring, if it was out of adjustment by a very small about it would tie the gun up, take it apart and put it back together and it works till the next time it jams you up. Not to mention the horrendous double action trigger pull.
Man , the Starr is so good looking .Wish they made them in cartridges .
i have one my grandfather found in a old ghost town under a loose floor board in a saloon its number is 30158 its the single action
It really does appear to be a better revolver than Colt made, and still quite handsome.
Didn't the webley ric have a simiral trigger mechanism?
man
can I say?
I freaking love your channel
IIRC Cmint Eastwood carried one in The Unforgiven..a single action...
Ian letting his hair down.
Wait aren't these the revolvers used by Anthony mackie's character in Abe lincoln the vampire hunter?
I know Im 8 years late on this video but i still wanted to ask this. I held one today. It was rusty didnt work and was missing the loader handle. I found it in a box at a yard sale here in finland. I asked what it costs and the seller said 600€, is that a good price?
These are fascinating. Any repros sub $1000 to be had?
Yes, Pietta makes repros of both the SA and DA version. Retail price is about $550 for either one.
thanks for the info
6:14
-Freeeedoooom!!
Ian: Nope.
Wow, those are such handsome revolvers. Particularly the DA. Any idea if anyone is doing modern replicas to fire cartridges?
Not cartridge guns, but there are Italian muzzleloading copies made.
Ah, of course, leave it to the Italians...
There's some that have been converted to fire cartridges by gunsmiths.
Looks like they increased the gun barrel length on the SA version from the DA version too, unless it's a different variant or an optical illusion?
You can see on the auction page that the SA has an 8 inch barrel and the DA has a 6 inch, I imagine that both the DA and SA were made to different barrel lengths.
graidstinHitlerRants from what i can find, they don't say much about different barrel lengths, just that there were 3 types produced (DA in .36cal, DA in .44cal, and SA in .44cal) and all the pictures seem to show the SA pistol with what look like 8in barrels and both the DAs with only 6in ones
I am sure you have had many a d@head comment with negativity. I love everything about your videos and what you share with the public. Please consider That the word "February" has, and is pronounced with two of the letter "R". Much respect to all the hard work that you put in, and all the knowledge that you share 😊
Made in my home town.
Imagine paying 25$ for that wonderful SA beauty, now it's just a dream :(
If the cylinders are interchangeable, that could make for a very fast reload, without the weight of a second whole pistol.
Does anyone know what the last rifle in the into is? I really want to watch that video but haven't been able to find it.
Ross Mk.II, about 1915 or 16. Canadian,303 calibre.
Love that SA, the DA looks like it has a nasty trigger
is it use ‘UNFORGIVEN′ revolver? that is great movie...
Yes Clint Eastwood uses a double action starr in the film
I wonder how many hammers spurs got cut off on the double action
So there are no cartridge Starrs?
BWT, I prefer you with a ponytail.
I am 66 and conservative in many things, though I do agree with many of the 1960s tenets of sex(not enough), drugs(not saying, but not much), and rock and roll (not enough).
I really enjoy your channel and your take on the world of firearms.
Correct, no cartridge Starrs.
Hair down vs hair back is just a daily whim. :)
I'm afraid you made mistake. If at the contrary of the Colt, a cap could not fall into the Starr action, a cap could get caught between the cylinder and the recoil shield. This is what happened to Peter Schiffers, author of "Civil War revolvers, myth vs. reality" when he test fired an original Starr Model 1858. Schiffers explains that both arms, M.1858 and M.1863, were unpopular because their actions jammed very often. He discovered why.
It’s crazy.. I’ve often wondered if there ever were double action pistols back in the day and here they are.
Ian what's your favorite band? Your hair would suggest \m/
I love this, cause I'm looking for revolvers that can do it better then Colt revolvers. Remington now this revolvers.
How does the feature that lets you carry in between chambers work?
It simply holds the cylinder in place positioned so the hammer isn't over a chamber. That way if the half-cock notch fails, the hammer won't hit a cap when it falls.
Forgotten Weapons Sorry, I was unintentionally vague. I was curious as to how much fiddling was required to get the hammer onto a camber.
I'm a Starr !I'm a Starr !I'm a Starr!!!
Adjusted for inflation, the price of the DA is equivalent to around $660 today. The SA would've been about $320.
Gold was about $20 an ounce in 1860, and almost $1300 today, so I think your conversion is off a bit.
John Burnett The price of gold fluctuates independently from the buying power of the dollar, and thus is not an effective reference point for calculating and adjusting for inflation.
***** You must be a banker. The buying power of the dollar has remained quite constant, while the Dollar has lost buying power rapidly for the past 100 years. Before 1932 gold was consistently about $20 an ounce and is still the best reference for inflation. I realize there are other ways to figure inflation, but the price of gold is one way as well.
John Burnett Buying power != Value. Check any inflation calculator and my numbers are pretty close. Civil war era gold was a bit sporadic too, the U.S. supply changed rapidly.
Clint Eastwood in Unforgiven (1992)... All I have to say.
must been easy back then to just build something new. Look at the others and come up with a better and more badass design.
No axis for the cylinder to foul on and get jammed and stops between the cylinders for the hammer to rest, cracking it open it stays in one piece not 2 making changing of loaded cylinders fast
Why did colt even win the contract
I'd say I would buy a replica of that but I'd be lying. I just think it's cool.
Is there a repro of this offered by anyone?
+Throw Away There were repros made yes
Pietta makes them.
February has 2 Rs
Sometimes I wonder what kind of rich weirdos end up with these forgotten weapons and we'll never see them again
I'm one of those "rich weidos"!
They're not all that expensive in the grand scheme of things. I'd rather own a piece of history than drink Starbucks every day and I drive a rust bucket rather than a Ferrari.
I'm in the UK and mine (single action) cost about £1200 (1500ish bucks?) and from the serial number it was around the 600th single action made by Starr.
I shoot it fairly regularly.
Everyone gangsta till jesus start preaching guns
Hippie Gun Jesus
Hold on. How do you patent a DA? Aren't there like 50 designs out there? All the same idea, and all equally as good? All manufactured and in use? Some guy? Thinks he 'invented it' ????
the finger is cut ! hope not to hurt
Who else is here because of Unforgiven?
That's why I came back
Munny didn't really fight with his though, he used his coach gun, Ned's Spencer and the kid's Schofield
All praise gun jesus