@@JimmySilverFoothe will not respond my jarhead brother and I are having a disagreement about the tools you equip yourself with and how those tools can and will be deployed in combat. Terrain dictates weapon selection, I don't understand why this is a hard concept, if I'm running through Chicago ghettos, I most definitely DO NOT want my 338 or my bolt 22lr precision rifle. I want a 9mm sub gun or a short barreled rifle. If I'm out here in Wyoming I want my 338 and bolt precision rifles. Do I have an AR-15 on stand by yes absolutely. And I also see stokers point as well, my 338 isn't my main battle rifle even out here, and I can see where the synthesis of his point and mine do cross over into an AR-10 308 to stretch the legs at distance and semiautomatic for the suppression capability.
@@SwoleApp Did he not cover the open West landscape in the video. It was about identification, movement chances, giving your position away for a low chance shot, and morality.
@@jayjason423 "giving your position away" have you heard of a suppressor? I assure you, will neither be able to pin point my location nor see a flash, and like I said previously if I'm running a precision 22lr bolt you will absolutely hear or see nothing and I can send a 40gr 610yds with absolute accuracy
In my mind anything past about 300m can be avoided in most situations. I still remember what a 400m target looked like and I think I’d rather avoid than engage. I’m thinking VERY defensively. If SHTF… lasting the first 4-6 weeks is going to weed out a lot of people. So to me hiding and avoiding might just save your life.
I would add, another good reason not to stick around, trying to figure out where you're getting shot from and then working out the distance and a way to engage the attacker, is that while you're doing all this, while you're firing at them and they're firing at you at 700-800 yard distance, their buddy or buddies could be moving just on the other side of a ridge to hit you from a flank when they're 100 yards away or less. Always assume there's one more.
Oh yeah. From that distance, that's likely either an established military, a local militia on some Negan sh*t, or a militarized group like the cartel or something. Definitely a flank coming. At that distance they're fixing you. At any distance they could be doing that. But definitely at that distance.
@@jimmydigriz362 and that is precisely how we train out here in Wyoming, there is a group of us, who takes these bolt 22lrs with sub sonic rds out to almost 700 yds, our mission is to identify and isolate and radio to our push teams to flank in, zooming out and taking a step back, my group trains in a 700 yd box, our goal is to set up a base of fire, while our suppressed bolt 22s like arrows, are being dropped into the enemies location, just like indirect fire, so now any opposition has to deal with 2 angles of fire, we set full size mannequins in the prone from 300 to 655 yds and we are dropping into prone laiden bodies at ultra long distance, we will reverse the drill, sometimes using the push team to be a blocking force while we drop in the rds and eliminate the Targets.
Right, it's best to disengage and put distance between you and them. If you can find a good defensive position from which you can see all approaches and prevent yourself from being flanked and boxed in, that's great, but in reality, it's best to keep moving away from the threat if you can.
Truth of the matter is to have what ever weapon you are comfortable with. I spent 11yrs in the Armed Forces of this Country and have seen the Poverty and Despair of people throughout the world. This Country is Blessed with our freedom. Understand You would NOT have the freedom of your opinions anywhere else. Thank GOD you live here. However Always be Prepared. It happened here in 1776.😮
Thanks for your service. I too am well traveled. I have also seen the happiest folks in the world in far off places that have close to nothing. No alcohol (dry Muslim island off Sumatra) and folks are always smiling and laughing with family, even late at night. No homeless, no addiction, no suicide. Something important is missing in America. My belief is its a sense of belonging. Take care!
Without proper context, my answer is that I run away as fast as I can. My job is to survive, not get into a firefight. I have no idea who, why, how many or how well equipped. Are we talking Chinese soldiers? Drug cartel remnants? Fellow Americans mistaking me for an enemy?
Excellent game plan run if at all possible if running isn't an option fight smart and fast.....im up he sees me im down no nore than 3 seconds of movement at a time. Take care bro stay safe
@@STOKERMATIC No, they needed 7.62 to even hit people. That is why the Army is going to a bigger round closer in size to the 7.62. The 5.56 is only a useful round if you have great logistics backing you up. Otherwise you are better off with a bigger longer shooting round to one shot, one kill at 400+ yards.
What's interesting, Vietnam and the Rhodesian bush war was fought roughly at the same time/era... 556 in asian 308 in Africa. Seems the 308 was far more successful, open expanse , deep bush, heavy vegetation, varying elevation. In Africa it's been studied between the two and most if there was no NATO influences... 7.62 x 39 or 51 is the choice, just a thought where a country that has non stop conflict
If it's a situation, shtf , you don't go looking for engagements , you protect what you have , your resources and property. Our small community of like minded people we planned out in 1994 . I worked for the Intel community for 35yrs mostly all overseas. We knew back then the direction the ppl who really control our country and their plans which would come to a head about 2020 . We found investors and ex Intel , spec. ops , veterans, doctor's and like minded folks who understood the future . We built a 500 acre community with 70 Homes, built 2 large ponds that are spring fed . They are for raising fish . We found farmers who brought their cattle to raise , pigs , chickens. We have a large deer population here in the Appalachian mountains so food resources was the first to be established . Now our community is up and running pretty much on its own . We have ppl here who are in charge of security, the property is gated and fenced in . Everyone in the community trains up for defending our land . Everyone has a job to do in a crisis situation. Everyone in their home has their own AR and sidearms and at least 2500 rounds of ammo for every firearm they have , plus there's a stock in our armory. Obviously this was a 25yr project and if you are not prepared by now it might be to late.
The one constant in life is there is always people. And with people comes problems, even in family's. When it goes down, I only want my family around me. Friends come and go. Strangers will come. Nothing on earth is scarier than a father or mother who is watching their children starve to death. In the good old days the old were the guards from 11-7am. In a dog-eat-dog world. The less contact, the better. A little black shoe polish under the eyes helps hide the fact you aren't starving. Advertising will get you killed. My weapon of choice will always be a 22 l.r. Rifle. Most are deadly accurate to 100 yards. Cheap to shoot too. The biggest mistake people make is clothing. And sleeping needs. More than likely no electricity will be the norm. So what you sleep under now will not do at all. Wool blankets will be life or death, wool clothing will be life or death. Wool stays warm even if wet. It can't catch fire either. No one I've ever met has these items already. wool hats gloves coats and clothes. Learning how to make water filtering is also vital. It'll get ugly, and if you don't have solar panels and batteries put up, or kerosene for lanterns and extra wicks etc. Leather gloves etc. Fishing equipment, traps, etc. Every single day the world gets crazier. We are ready as much as we can be. We live out in the country. We have #2 springs on our land. And lots of wild game. I see it coming. Do you? Peace.
You are wrong, you might be forced to go on the offensive, whether you want to or not. The worse thing you can do in these supposed doomsday scenarios, is limit yourself to some specific "only do" "never do" mentalities. Its going to be to random from day to day to know what you might HAVE to do to survive. Ya'll got a compound, many will. Many will rise up, that were not there, and many will fall from others coming to take, regardless of size or security or resources. THAT is just the plain facts of the matter.
I hear some many people claim they will go into the woods and hunt animals for food, when in fact, they never spent a day in the woods, forest or wilderness area. I know a guy that missed a deer 🦌 at 75 yards with a scoped rifle, so thinking you are going out and get some food is a joke for 99.9% of the people. Never mind going after an enemy force !!!
I live in Northeast Tennessee and I hear the same from people all the time. I think to myself, you have no wilderness knowledge, survival skills, or hunting and tracking abilities, BUT just going walk out into the forest and hunt. Good luck with that.
No, they won't be hunting. They will go to farms and shoot the farmers cows and goats!! We had it here in the 70s. People would kill a cow and cut off a leg and leave it to rot in the field! This time they will be rotting in the field!!!
In Top’s scenario, I’m finding cover and not engaging. Break any contact and use terrain to cover my withdrawal and as possible, back on my original heading.
Yes, 'red forces' may be in the area, but most likely not for long, restraint is key. The first shot obliterates 'Plan A ' ,now things get really 'dynamic' ,so to speak....
Alot of good talking points here. Another reason I love my SAM7SF. I have no business shooting out to 500 yards. If the enemy is that far away, id rather be quiet and not shoot at all.
I would rather drop them from safety. The vid is wrong about location id from one round. Sure you have given up your stealth, but NOT location, you disengage, and leave, but with a success, and little risk. The high risk, is engaging at assault weapon ranges, with others, usually many others, all with the same, and now them circling you from all them rounds spewing forth giving solid location id. When I fire, once, everyone is running for cover and hiding, temporarily, but at range, that's the safe zone for extract. Absolutely requires skill and training tho.
@@andyhwell8419 A shootout is all you get with an AK. Nobody has to play sniper, and sometimes you don't get to avoid something. So its about how you plan on implementing an offense, and surviving. Mine will be from range, by choice, and certainly not AR close.
@@sword-and-shield People naturally gravitate towards close points of interests and that's where the gunfights will be. Meaning there's way higher chances you have to shoot someone within 50 yards than 500+ due to the nature of rivers, buildings, campsites, etc. You'd have to purposely look for people to kill at a long distance in order to enact your "pick them away from a safe distance" fantasy. Matter of fact, you might get one or two guys, but if the people you're shooting at know what they're doing, the rest will hunt you down. You have to eat, you have to sleep, and you have to rest, and that's when they'll strike. Even if they have to disengage that particular day, they will come back for you and hunt you down at some later point in time.
@@UrbanDefenseSystems No its no fantasy, but a choice of engagement. You not knowing the difference, proves you out tho. I can rest eat and sleep in a hole, covered, and have done it, many times. You got nothing for me kid, the only thing you got right is there will be hunting, and the best will always get their tag.
In Minnesota the cold will take you out faster than a speeding bullet people won’t last long if the power goes off all new home construction doesn’t have any backup wood stoves in the basement they are relying on something they don’t have control of up here it’s electricity that will cause the first crisis it won’t take long if it’s in the winter
I was taught that the best DEFENSIVE is a Good OFFENSE. Stories from my PIONEER FAMILY, "LONG BECOMES SHORT IN A HURRY". My drill sergeants said the same thing 🗽🦅🇺🇸🙏
Good thought exercise. Food for thought, there is a real possibility that the opposition may have drones to deploy ,if they haven’t already. Stay small, be vigilante, and stay quiet until forced to do otherwise.
Yes I've heard about that their called Mauraders not to be confused with Survivalist or preppers. They train to take what you have and a lot of them have prior military experience
The SHTF weapon for me is very different based on either a bug-in or bug-out scenario. I agree with an AR platform as primary for bug-in or bug-out with a vehicle, but for bug-out on foot with a pack, I'll stick with my Henry Survival Rifle and a sidearm. I can easily carry 1000+ rnds of .22lr. In a long-term scenario, I can feed myself with it, and for defense, non-lethal shots take more hostiles out of the game than lethal ones.
@@kevinobrien3888 You could feasibly carry that much, but my pack is already about 40lbs and I’m not the Marine I was when I got out in ‘87. Pack has tent, jungle bag with liner, water purifier, rocket stove, fire starter, quick clot, suture kit, socks, compass and map, survival food, etc. For me, 1000 .22lr and 100 .40 is good enough (along with the Kabar and a combat tomahawk). If I need more, I’ll barter for it of have to full on Patriot like Mel Gibson…
In my honest humble opinion, the best shtf rifle is the one you train with the most. If you have a preferred rifle then train with it until you can use it without having to think about it. No matter what it is. All that being said I’d still stick with the AR platform because I’ve been training with it for over twenty years.
Eugene Stoner was a damn genius. The AR15/M16 is truly a work of art and you realize it even more when you put one together from a kit when you see how all the pins and everything else go together in the weapon.
My ar is 7.5 lbs with sights and loaded mag. Everything else(bren, fal..etc) is like 12-13lbs+. And pistol carbines that are AR weight.. are no good at distance. To use anything other than than an AR is bizarre.
Most people can not hit past 200 (most).... most people never practice (most) .... for most 200 yard rifle is fine (most)...anything longer for most would be your bolt deer gun (For most)
Not true. I've been surprised to see how many of the noobies I take shooting easily hit man sized steel targets at 300 yards. Most of them without excessive instruction. Dangerous enough that anyone with a rifle within a 500 yard radius is a deadly threat to you. Regardless of training. Ask yourself how many men out there with hunting rifles and AR15s.
@@Rubeless No, not BS lol. I've done it several times. Shooting a rifle is extremely easy. We take 18-year-old recruits in the military and give them similar tests with minimal training. However, it's true what you're saying about how it's on a bench and with zero thought of being killed. However, the latter is dependent on the individual. No amount of training gives you nerves of steel. As per Marcus Luttrell abandoning his fellow Navy Seals despite all the advanced training.
Hi Top, your weapon of choice should be the one that has become part of your body & mind. One that you train and practice with weekly. Semi, 5.56, 20”/16” bbl, with optic. Become proficient & stay “Stoked”! 🇺🇸
@@k9six185 Clearly, but they are child's play to those mastering and proficient with many. Maybe you have never heard of diminishing returns? but weapons have them, and when they are reached its only expedient to expand your tool skill set. The "master of one gun" saying is viable, when you have not mastered any.
Why isn't anyone expanding on attaching lightweight shotguns to rifles? The Russians were putting modified grenade launcher triggers w/12GA barrels on for one shot. What about using a bullpup style rifle to make room for more shotty underneath ?
Terrain and availability of resources is what determines which weapon is best. I am originally from Louisiana. A shotgun is probably the best weapon. I now live in the desert of west Texas. An AR is best here. Many factors to consider.
@@stevenrush9862 but what can a 12 gauge do that a 5.56 or 308 can't do? Especially if we assume that most of the targets are going to be two legged animals, the shotgun is just an inferior choice.
I have guns ranging from M96 Swedish Mausers to Savage heavy barreled 22-250 to Garands, 1903’s, M1A’s, riot guns, etc.. At my age, if I had to pick a defend the homestead rifle, it would be the Savage 22-250 with Nightforce 5-20 power scope. For hitting the trail, I’d choose the Mini14 tactical with 4-12 scope.
The thing I see, often when people speak on this issue is they tend to talk like they’ll be a nomad. If you are living in an area after SHTF you can’t always just decide to duck for cover, then run and never come back. Having a long range rifle for home, camp, or in transport is a good idea. There will be times you need to leave your home, if for nothing else than to see who has moved in to your area. Information is more important that almost anything in a hostile situation. Also, You may be out with family or friends, you don’t want to run and hope they are able to do the same. Say you’re split up foraging for game or new water source or, whatever, you hear a shot pop off. Does he have your friend, son, wife pinned down? I can tell you I couldn’t leave the area until I know either bad guy is dead or friends are safe. If you practice ranging with your reticle and practice long range shooting. Hitting a target past 1,000 yards is fairly easy with the correct set up. They can even be pretty lightweight too. I agree tho, this should be secondary to a good 0-500 yard semi auto rifle regardless of your likely AO.
One solution for being on the offensive in long range engagements in that terrain could be thermal optics, using a bush for concealment or going prone doesn't work when the person shooting has thermal. So in that specific use case thermal with a SPR/DMR/Battle Rifle set up might be tangible. That goes both ways, defeating thermal on the defensive will be useful.
@darlsbarkley3493 For general passive use analog NV is preferred, but if you're hunting in a known location day or night, having a clip on can be very useful for things that like to hide.
@@ry3713 battery life, frame rate, weight, etc are all issues with thermals. You're watching everything on a tiny screen, not actually viewing through a series of lenses like a scope or red dot. Modern red dots don't have an issue with battery life and a magnified optic still works without batteries. A clip on thermal or a handheld thermal is probably a good thing to have in these scenarios but if you try to rely on a thermal scope without any other option, you're going to die.
I personally do not want a weapon I can't reproduce parts for. FN FAL has a tilt bolt and the SKS Junkwagon uses a tilt lock bolt. Those can be made with files and drills. Barrels are essentially small car axles, same grade of steel. We need to have our own fail proof home made ammunition casings and be able to turn our own copper and zinc projectiles or cast lead. We will not be getting factory ammo by the time things get bad.
@knifelover73 presently, yes. Future no. Try to think like a grand strategist. People who hate us want us to be first without any new ammunition. Second, these people want us without firearms. The South ran out of ammunition on many occasions. They had rifles. It's worth it to think and prepare for the next 30 to 50 years by taking action now to be ready for a group of people here and elsewhere who have no problem being slaughtered like sheep.
Different tools for different jobs. A silenced SBR 556 is for shorter engagements. A SPR 6.5 Grendel is for hunting and midrange offense/Defense. A range finding scope is useless in heavily wooded terrain.
Backdrop looks familiar. Thanks for giving your thoughts. Hopefully in those SHTF nightmares we find ourselves held to a higher law. "Circumstances don't make the man, they only reveal him to himself." Epictetus
Number one rule in SHTF scenario, avoid guns fights. I see so many people stocking up on ammo and planning on being in who knows how many gun fights. I promise you, you will be very lucky to make it out of a gun fight without being shot yourself. More than one gun fight will most certainly be your death. No hospital or ER available. People watch too much TV. You don’t need thousands of rounds of ammo.
Until I find better I’m running a IWI X95 Tavor 5.56 with a Vortex AMG UH1 gen 2 “Huey” as my main , with a Glock 19 Gen 5. In the piney woods of SouthEast TX. But as a collector have plenty of options. Digging your content lately!
In my area Vegetation dictates the preferred tool. Certainly an accurate, telescopic sighted tool would advantageous in some scenarios, but not most… in my neck of the woods.
Thanks! How is the puppy doing? My choices of guns for homestead recce in shtf would be: 1. My AR-15 build chambered in 5.56 with 1-8 sig tango lpvo with piggyback red dot, 16in. Barrel, and other stuff and carrying 8, 30rnd mags. Ranges 2-500yds 2. Sig cross bolt action chambered in 308 with 6-24 vortex crossfire ii scope with piggyback red dot and other stuff with 4, 20rnd mags. Ranges 100-1,000 (I’m a skilled marksman) 3. Sig p226 xfive legion with red dot, light and rear sight. Ranges 0-50yds Thanks for reading y’all and you to stoker. Stay stoked and stay safe see y’all!
Good thing about that area is not many people are going to be there to do dirty work. It's going to be in the cities, then the suburbs, then the rural areas, I don't think it will get out that far. Same with the desert areas. My furthest shot here is about 100 yards before we get into heavily wooded areas with lots of underbrush.
Where he's at isn't too distant from Sacramento and San Francisco. There are alot more people out there than you might imagine, and there'd be a lot more in a SHTF! Listen to the background. Hear the semis. There's a major roadway very nearby.
I just moved from Southern AZ (Cochise County) to NE Georgia and nothing has changed with my rifle set up; AR15 with EOTech and 3x magnifier. My tactics haven't changed either, I am still not going to slug it out with anyone but will break contact and get to a better defensive position. Engaging anyone at distance is just drawing attention to yourself. There is always someone bigger and badder out there, plan on it and live to fight another day.
I have been seeing lots selling out in Cochise county for very inexpensive prices. Would you recommend building a cabin or small home out there? Thanks
Decent thermal optics are becoming affordable for many. Something to consider if you're thinking you're gonna just sneak up on anyone trying to take their stuff in a shtf situation. Those that prep are more likely to own such thermal scopes.
I believe attempting to go around stealing from others is a fool errand, they won't last long, even spec ops don't want to cqb in the unknown over and over
We have to watch out for poisonous snakes around here. We do not wear sandals or shorts at night or when walking out past the fences where I haven't cut the grass. I bush hog three times a year so everything out past 10 feet on the other side of my fences potentially has a copperhead, rattlesnake or a cottonmouth.
A 16" 5.56 AR with a 1-6x LPVO or 3x or 4x fixed power scope. The magnification is for target recognition so a person can use it for hunting. Recommend M193 for the majority of applications. For southern Whitetail hunting out to 100 yards I've had success with Barnes 70gr TSX loaded to 5.56 pressures. For close in/homestead ranges, an SP5K is adequate.
I'm a brand new subscriber. I'm a disabled grandpa. The plan my family has is that I will keep the children and other non-combatants hidden and as safe as I can while the others in our group do any roving fighting that needs to be done. We will never be the raiders of others. In fact, we are more likely to share with those that have nothing than to take from others. That is just who we are. That being said, I have an sks for close in defensive work and a multiple bolt guns capable of very accurate fire out to 1,500 and I have been practicing for such engagements. I don't have an AR because I live in a communist state in the PNW that banned their sale before I could afford one. My hope is to never be forced into that situation to start with, but I am mentally ready and practiced physically to fulfill my role in our plan. Ultimately, I want to take my family as far from the conflict as I can into remote country and just do what we can to survive. But should conflict come to us, we will defend our own.
Distance is one thing, terrain is a thing, but cover is another. In CONUS there are MILLIONS of light skinned automobiles that 5.56mm M855 and M193 are not very good at penetrating. Lot of stories from Iraq of M855 skipping off automobile windshields. The only thing on a light skinned automobile that will stop a .30 caliber rifle round is the engine block. Battle rifles will be advantageous when 99% of everybody running around in TEOTWAWKI have .22 caliber AR-15’s.
I agree with you except for the hunting part. I’ve taken those 500-800 yard shots with great success while hunting in the mountain west. While using a bolt gun. But hunting is not the same as if you would be going against a two legged threat. Cause animals don’t shoot back.
@@danielrumble11 so if someone is going around killing people and is perhaps even closing in on you or fired upon, you don't have to? Do you wait until they've shot you to shoot back?
@@danielrumble11so if people are going around harming others and are perhaps even closing in on you, you'll just wait until they're on top of you before you respond?
After finally getting to shoot out to some distance. 500yds and in is a good metric. Able to identify out to 500 is about all you need in an optic. So an acog with rds, 3x or 5x with rds, a 1-6x, 1-8x, 2-10x, rds with a 3x-5x magnifier would be sufficient for most.
@@RodolfoMartinez-px6cj Its complicated. Once evil holds power and its position is so strong that it controls the political apparatus, the "education" system, the mass and social media, law enforcement, and the legal system, no group unwilling to use violence to protect mankind from its evil has any chance of succeeding. Its weakness and passivity will be obvious to the parasite, and the parasite will naturally destroy it. God Speed.
I like the way you contemplate a variety of situations and scenarios and step through each one logically ... cause and effect ... this is valuable in formulating actions you may have to take at a later time ... in a way pre-training in your mind and mulling over consequences of actions taken ... it's a good mental exercise ...
Hey Top. We’ve been bombarded with so much MEDIA… television-movies-video games-now content creators; hero type stuff, that REALITY is almost gone these days. Everyone thinks they’re going to actually engage…with the adversary. I appreciate your videos and perspective.
17:28 I know a former Marine that has that plan. He worries me. If I'm defending my property, my .270 Win is what I'd pick, there's a reason our military is looking at switching to .277 Fury. In my house? It's hard to beat .300blk Close to mid range but not inside probably my Mk12, for all the reasons you gave.
Most city contacts will be under 100 yards, and in the woods, depending on how thick it is, it could be much less, but out in the plains or in open areas, it could easily be 500 yards, and from what I see most will only be somewhat accurate in the 100 yards range, and that's on a stationary target, if they know they are being shot at and moving fast, good luck hitting them!
Wow!! Brother, very different from western Washington state, looking like Yakima Washington. If you don’t mind, can you give your boy Hondo a big hug for me? I was hoping to see him in your video!! Loving your videos!! Brother!! I’m staying STOKED about mastering my craft!!👍🏿💯🇺🇸🪖
I get what you are saying. I have a couple choices. One of my hunting rifles started out taking care of two legged critters. It stays where I started though . It is to heavy to move with . You can but there is better choices.
If things got bad. I would try to equip and organize my neighbors. Strength in numbers. I would try to rise to the occasion. I'm thinking I'd be a threat to Raiders. I'm American and will conduct myself as such...
Here where I live in South Louisiana with our heavily wooded areas 556 is good to go... Out West with it's wide open spaces it would be Bolt Action 308 with a good scope, and a good AR in 556.
I believe that the best SHTF rife is the one you can control and know very well and hit your target at the range required to make the kill shot ' a long range to engage ? I think not . I live in Wyoming very hard to judge distance without a good rangefinder ' also wind is a big factor. You better know your platform ballistics very well and then the wind can change it very fast . I agree with Stokermatic 100 percent.
Doesn't matter too much. Small arms don't really change anything. An AK or AR is more than capable of being a danger to others at 500 yards and more. What will matter are things outside of your control. Like getting ambushed, and unlucky bullet, etc. A 16 inch barreled AR15 with an ACOG can do anything a rifle is realistically required to do. And quite frankly, I think most engagements will be at fairly close distances. Almost 90% of all Americans live in big city, the rest of them in suburban and urban environments.
I'm a veteran, I have no plans on shooting anything 300+ yards away, I use iron sights, LVPO, magnifier and red dot. The calibers I use 5.56, 223, .300, .308 .7.62 x 39, .50 Beowulf and .22. Just depends on the situation. I do practice but shooting crazy distance is a waste of ammo, if you don't hit the target with a few rounds. When people talk about SHTF, you have to ask what their idea of SHTF is, people watch WAY too many Hollywood movies thinking within a snap all chaos break out. Usually, SHTF is a few days build up, meaning the government starts off by lying to you about what's going on or what's about to happen. (That's when you implement SHTF drill, locking down home and getting family together). The government then change to condition Orange by this time you're going over your checklist to make sure home and family are ready (finishing touch). The scenario I just gave you was for SHTF in case of ECONOMY disaster, the crash of the dollar which is right around the corner. Try and remember the president first televised discussion of COVID to how many days or weeks it took for people to make a run on stores for face mask, Clorox and toilet tissue. To this day, experts have no clue why toilet tissue became gold, but now that you know, be prepared. SHTF scenario will require difference responses Has anyone watched "Civil War 2024?". The most realistic movie I've seen without Hollywood special effect and unrealistic situations.
even if you DO hit one guy at say, 400m, you wont hit the others, cause they'll drop prone, roll, run/dive and you can't hit such targets. So now, you've told them of your (hostile, armed) presence, and t hey hate you for shooting their buddies. What have you gained, hmm? If you had your stuff underground, all you need to do is stay underground and let them walk on by! Why would you even be out in daylight in the first place? Once shtf, 99% of the population will be dead in a year, 90% in 6 months, probably 50% in 90 days. So all you really HAVE to do is have a year's supply of food scatter-buried at your BOL, bring some spices, seeds, fats when you bug out, dig a tunnel and stay in it except for one hour at night. Scan 360 with thermal imaging, repeat every 5 minutes, as you access a food-bucket and cook a meal. Once a year has passed, you can much more safely have hidden plots of root veggies, peanuts, sprouts. You dont want any part of this scouting, patrolling, etc, folks. It makes no sense. It's a stupid risk to be taking, for no reason at all
@@Dread_Pirate_Homesteader No, but its cheaper, no flying brass, and just as quick far away since you have to get back on target anyway. And getting .5 MOA with a cheap factory gun is just...well fun.
@jardo531 try to use context next time. This situation is some end of the world murder people/get ambushed at long distances. I use a 22 all summer for grouse, but that's not what's being discussed
So im the one with the other acct that hes responding to, i said " terrain dictates weapon selection, we are out in Wyoming, i literally came off the long range we ran A suppressed Riger precision 22lr with 30moa base with a venom vortex 16x and i repeatedly hit a 32x32 steel plate at 610yds with 4moa overhold and 4,moa Right windage, my friend with his Bergara 22lr with his combined 50moa of railmand mount using a 90moa night force scope touched 655.8yds repeatedly. Everyone is missing tje concept that 22lrs can be used for supprrsssed ultra long range and can have repeatability. It's something to be said to have a friend in an elevated position like 3 degrees on a hill in some scrub brush and quietly Arching the 22lr into your Prone backside. Get two of us spoting and hunting and its over. I stand by what I said bring your semiautomatic AR 5.56 whatever, and we with a bolt 22 or 6.5 or 300winmag will touch you long before your AR ever does.
proven correct, there is some drunken additions to the ar platform, but me I don't have any gunz so no dog in this fight, that's my story and i'm stuck 2it
I just realized I need a SHTF pack mule. You won't hear a shot if they are within 1000 yards. If they can't make that shot, they will let you walk on by.
In shtf you probably have what you have. Me an ought6 is fairly likely. To me components and flexibility are probably most important. Something that can use multiple powders, blackpowder, and use cast projectiles. So if i had a choice 45-70 in a rolling block might fit the bill.
I've found this to be helpful. For most people the SHTF situation will be temporary and as a fact - law and order - if absent will be restored rather quickly. Taking a 'defensive' mindset to protect you and yours is best and likely legal. In the extreme condition of a complete breakdown of society and civility the 'rules' no longer apply. It's hard survival and only your own morality will exist. I plan and practice around temporary but maintain capability for worse.
I’ve been thinking the same for a long time for similar reasons. 1. If they are at a distance greater than the range of my ar15, are they really a threat to me? 2. Can I even identify if they are a threat? 3. Even if I can identify that they are a known threat or something, is it really morally justifiable to just murder them out right? 4. What if they are actively shooting at me? Wouldn’t I be better off just getting the hell out of there? This is why for my personal rifle I chose an AR15, set up with a focus on maximum performance at 0-200(can be pushed further if necessary but not set up for that) along with keeping the weight and size to a minimum.
As a moral, prudent person in this scenario you’re most likely to avoid a firefight. If you have to return fire you better know distance, have ample DOPE to confidently take shots. There are exceptions to avoiding a firefight, however in general I’d prefer not to get into a gun fight across a ridge at 700m. Also, this shows a good use case for a suppressor. It’s very very difficult at long distances to determine where shots come from when the shooter has a decent can
The issue I always have with people talking about a TEOTWAWKI arsenal is that the most basic weapons will serve the best. My apocalypse arsenal will supply me with food if needed, and, if I need a better weapon, I can take one off of a potential threat from 500M . The best advice I ever heard, was a flintlock musket or fusil because: 1. Easy to fix. 2. Versitility 3. Lead ball and shot can be recovered. 4. Black powder can be made from readily available materials. A good bow can be priceless. 1. Arrowheads can be made from stone or glass. 2. Bows can be made from scavenged fibreglass marker rods and pvc tubing. 3. Arrowshafts and fletching can be made of natural materials or dowles and duct tape.
It's more complicated than that... You have to assume he is talking shtf without rule of law, in that case how close is to close, assuming you see few armed individuals traveling in the direction of your house or camp, you have your wife and kids there, what do you do? You let them get 20 yards away to ask them who you are? Or What do you want? If they are bad guys you are dead... What you choose to do in that situation is your business, I pray to the Lord it never comes to that point... In that type of terrain you are, AR10 308 caliber all day long, m&p 10 is about 7lb accurate 4 to 18 x scope and good luck inside 800 yards if you shoot and miss your shot.
If you're alone, it's best to try to avoid a confrontation. Likely you might not be worth anyone of them getting shot. If you're in a big group, you can risk a gunfight and eliminate the potential threat. Scary stuff for sure.
If we had any sense, we would have our own ammunition production. Like using common steel cylinders we would make and use the powders we harvest off of factory ammo, and make our own projectiles. We would fire them with a copper wire charged by a little battery and a capacitor.
Reliability ,availability of ammunition, spare parts, accuracy, and what the other members of my group or team is going to determine what weapon I carry. Now the AR-15 even though it uses a varmint round has came a long way since it was considered to only have a effective range of 360 meters. Its easy to carry a extra upper receiver and ammunition dedicated for making shots at longer distances.
As im in Texas and have a mix of in the brush and in the city depending on how far i go in and out, my plan is in the brush i have a good 45 LC lever action, as it has good range over all and as my native American ancestors proved, quite effective at hit and run if needed as long as you're a decent distance away. Along with this, because its a lever action, i can reload ammo with black powder if needed But ill have a 9mm pistol with a conversion kit for in the city this way i do have a cqb back up arm when in the brush and a primary arm that is quite effective at close ro medium range in the city, and as its 9 mm i can pretty easily get more ammo. I do eventually plan on getting an AR15 but im wanting to get a relatively high quality one and dont have that kind of money yet. But i have training with them so if i ever needed to (hope not) i can get it off the dude that tries to hurt me and my family. But right now, im trying to get my family armed and read to go.
I laugh a bit when I hear guys say "Don't get an unreliable AR style rifle with all those moving parts, get a nice reliable, simple lever action." AR's have way fewer moving parts than a lever action. Lever guns are incredibly complex, which is probably a good reason why they're so bloody expensive, and they almost never have detachable mags, harder to mount optics etc. Not to bash lever rifles, indeed any gun is better than no gun, so if a lever rifle is all you have then that's better than nothing, but modern semi autos are clearly and vastly superior for what we're talking about.
Of course terrain will dictate choice of weapon and accouterments. That said, I expect my choices will stay they same irrespective. While I have a 300blk AR for the homestead, that’s not my choice for when I leave. In my case, it’s a highly accurized (sub MOA) stainless mini-14 on a Hogue sunthetic stock with a 3x14 shorty scope and a 1K lumen light/laser combo 10 30 round magazines, 55/62 grain 5.56, 4 42 round magpulls in the patrol pack, and 20 rounds of match grade 70+ grain rounds in a magazine on the butt stock. Backed up by an HK USP .45 and several blades. As to the scenario, I would very much go to ground and use the failing light to mask my movements once I’m sure of what’s going on. The incoming may be designed to force my movements towards and ambush of some sort. I’d also have to consider my current loadout, as any kind of dynamic movement will be curtailed by the weight of my gear. In this situation I’m more than likely carrying a full backpack along with my fighting load so unless it’s indirect fire, I’m digging in with an improvised fighting position until I know I can egress safely.
Stoker, and many others, will be offended by my stance. The best battle rifle is the one you actually train with. If you don't train, there is no "good" battle rifle. My grandfather started teaching me marksmanship at 8 years old. I'm now solidly in my mid-50s. I EDC a .357 with a 4" barrel. I train multiple times per week with my Henry .357 lever action. So, with nearly 50 years of training with revolvers and levers, what do you think is my "best battle rifle"?
@@STOKERMATIC Pacific Theatre veteran. He was a tough, old rusty nail, but he loved his grandchildren. I miss that mean ass bastard even all these years later. He passed when I had just turned 13.
well there is training then there is training soldiers. Carbine course training does not equal training to be a soldier. As a infantry veteran I would much rather go up against civilians who took carbine courses than trained soldiers.
@@theintrovertedcalifornian5047you seen what happened overseas fighting in their own home. Imagine what’s going to happen here. Hunters, competition shooters, well trained vets, law enforcement such as swat teams ect ect. This ain’t just guys with flip flops running around with an AK.
@@losoway4505 This is why communication and leadership skills are essential. you want these people on your side. Give me just a squad size element of well trained 11 Bravos and my neighborhood turn into a no go zone real quick
lies? all these jootoob chans are lies BS and clickbait
Can you elaborate, please?
@@JimmySilverFoothe will not respond my jarhead brother and I are having a disagreement about the tools you equip yourself with and how those tools can and will be deployed in combat. Terrain dictates weapon selection, I don't understand why this is a hard concept, if I'm running through Chicago ghettos, I most definitely DO NOT want my 338 or my bolt 22lr precision rifle. I want a 9mm sub gun or a short barreled rifle. If I'm out here in Wyoming I want my 338 and bolt precision rifles. Do I have an AR-15 on stand by yes absolutely. And I also see stokers point as well, my 338 isn't my main battle rifle even out here, and I can see where the synthesis of his point and mine do cross over into an AR-10 308 to stretch the legs at distance and semiautomatic for the suppression capability.
@@SwoleApp Did he not cover the open West landscape in the video. It was about identification, movement chances, giving your position away for a low chance shot, and morality.
@@jayjason423 "giving your position away" have you heard of a suppressor? I assure you, will neither be able to pin point my location nor see a flash, and like I said previously if I'm running a precision 22lr bolt you will absolutely hear or see nothing and I can send a 40gr 610yds with absolute accuracy
@@SwoleApp😂 I will watch that video.
A guy in prison didn't wear glasses, "if it was more than 6' away it wasn't my business"
Good advice!
Well said sir.
In my mind anything past about 300m can be avoided in most situations. I still remember what a 400m target looked like and I think I’d rather avoid than engage.
I’m thinking VERY defensively. If SHTF… lasting the first 4-6 weeks is going to weed out a lot of people. So to me hiding and avoiding might just save your life.
I would add, another good reason not to stick around, trying to figure out where you're getting shot from and then working out the distance and a way to engage the attacker, is that while you're doing all this, while you're firing at them and they're firing at you at 700-800 yard distance, their buddy or buddies could be moving just on the other side of a ridge to hit you from a flank when they're 100 yards away or less. Always assume there's one more.
Oh yeah. From that distance, that's likely either an established military, a local militia on some Negan sh*t, or a militarized group like the cartel or something. Definitely a flank coming. At that distance they're fixing you. At any distance they could be doing that. But definitely at that distance.
@@jimmydigriz362 and that is precisely how we train out here in Wyoming, there is a group of us, who takes these bolt 22lrs with sub sonic rds out to almost 700 yds, our mission is to identify and isolate and radio to our push teams to flank in, zooming out and taking a step back, my group trains in a 700 yd box, our goal is to set up a base of fire, while our suppressed bolt 22s like arrows, are being dropped into the enemies location, just like indirect fire, so now any opposition has to deal with 2 angles of fire, we set full size mannequins in the prone from 300 to 655 yds and we are dropping into prone laiden bodies at ultra long distance, we will reverse the drill, sometimes using the push team to be a blocking force while we drop in the rds and eliminate the Targets.
@@jimmydigriz362 lol first comment on this toob acct and already censored....hahahah you gotta love these tough guys
Right, it's best to disengage and put distance between you and them. If you can find a good defensive position from which you can see all approaches and prevent yourself from being flanked and boxed in, that's great, but in reality, it's best to keep moving away from the threat if you can.
Everyone wants to train for engagement but you never hear anything about evasion.
Truth of the matter is to have what ever weapon you are comfortable with. I spent 11yrs in the Armed Forces of this Country and have seen the Poverty and Despair of people throughout the world. This Country is Blessed with our freedom. Understand You would NOT have the freedom of your opinions anywhere else. Thank GOD you live here. However Always be Prepared. It happened here in 1776.😮
Thanks for your service. I too am well traveled. I have also seen the happiest folks in the world in far off places that have close to nothing. No alcohol (dry Muslim island off Sumatra) and folks are always smiling and laughing with family, even late at night. No homeless, no addiction, no suicide. Something important is missing in America. My belief is its a sense of belonging. Take care!
The armed forces of this country? Here we go
Without proper context, my answer is that I run away as fast as I can. My job is to survive, not get into a firefight. I have no idea who, why, how many or how well equipped. Are we talking Chinese soldiers? Drug cartel remnants? Fellow Americans mistaking me for an enemy?
Agreed
Excellent game plan run if at all possible if running isn't an option fight smart and fast.....im up he sees me im down no nore than 3 seconds of movement at a time. Take care bro stay safe
Why would someone be shooting at me from such long distance?(>1000m)
If you don't fight you won't survive. In a WORL world the only one that will get you out of the hole is you
@@thatsthewayitgoes9 Who could know, but it's not likely an AR rifle.
.308 semi or bolt, good glass, is the tool. The real weapon is between your ears.
The Army found out that in Afghanistan, terrain dictated what type of battle rifle was effective.
And interestingly - it’s the same one that was effective in the jungles, desert, islands, and urban AOs.
@@STOKERMATIC No, they needed 7.62 to even hit people. That is why the Army is going to a bigger round closer in size to the 7.62. The 5.56 is only a useful round if you have great logistics backing you up. Otherwise you are better off with a bigger longer shooting round to one shot, one kill at 400+ yards.
What's interesting, Vietnam and the Rhodesian bush war was fought roughly at the same time/era... 556 in asian 308 in Africa. Seems the 308 was far more successful, open expanse , deep bush, heavy vegetation, varying elevation.
In Africa it's been studied between the two and most if there was no NATO influences... 7.62 x 39 or 51 is the choice, just a thought where a country that has non stop conflict
@@behanner they're going to a larger round because of body armor, not to be able to "hit" people.
I heard a Seal operator say he wish he had 7.62 cause 556 just wouldn’t put enemies down fast enough
It sucks to know some Americans are willing to hurt rather than help other Americans in time of “crisis.” Thank you for your knowledge
Its not that "most" dont want to help, it just comes down to not been able to trust people that are in survival mode.
If it's a situation, shtf , you don't go looking for engagements , you protect what you have , your resources and property. Our small community of like minded people we planned out in 1994 . I worked for the Intel community for 35yrs mostly all overseas. We knew back then the direction the ppl who really control our country and their plans which would come to a head about 2020 . We found investors and ex Intel , spec. ops , veterans, doctor's and like minded folks who understood the future . We built a 500 acre community with 70 Homes, built 2 large ponds that are spring fed . They are for raising fish . We found farmers who brought their cattle to raise , pigs , chickens. We have a large deer population here in the Appalachian mountains so food resources was the first to be established . Now our community is up and running pretty much on its own . We have ppl here who are in charge of security, the property is gated and fenced in . Everyone in the community trains up for defending our land . Everyone has a job to do in a crisis situation. Everyone in their home has their own AR and sidearms and at least 2500 rounds of ammo for every firearm they have , plus there's a stock in our armory. Obviously this was a 25yr project and if you are not prepared by now it might be to late.
Good to hear that's awesome!
I worked for the Intel community for 35yrs... Really?
And they never mentioned the word "OpSec" to you?
The one constant in life is there is always people. And with people comes problems, even in family's. When it goes down, I only want my family around me. Friends come and go. Strangers will come. Nothing on earth is scarier than a father or mother who is watching their children starve to death. In the good old days the old were the guards from 11-7am. In a dog-eat-dog world. The less contact, the better. A little black shoe polish under the eyes helps hide the fact you aren't starving. Advertising will get you killed. My weapon of choice will always be a 22 l.r. Rifle. Most are deadly accurate to 100 yards. Cheap to shoot too. The biggest mistake people make is clothing. And sleeping needs. More than likely no electricity will be the norm. So what you sleep under now will not do at all. Wool blankets will be life or death, wool clothing will be life or death. Wool stays warm even if wet. It can't catch fire either. No one I've ever met has these items already. wool hats gloves coats and clothes. Learning how to make water filtering is also vital. It'll get ugly, and if you don't have solar panels and batteries put up, or kerosene for lanterns and extra wicks etc. Leather gloves etc. Fishing equipment, traps, etc. Every single day the world gets crazier. We are ready as much as we can be. We live out in the country. We have #2 springs on our land. And lots of wild game. I see it coming. Do you? Peace.
@@jrjerles9761 thank you for posting this, I saw it too, but everybody told me just to watch the game and relax. Here we are.
You are wrong, you might be forced to go on the offensive, whether you want to or not. The worse thing you can do in these supposed doomsday scenarios, is limit yourself to some specific "only do" "never do" mentalities. Its going to be to random from day to day to know what you might HAVE to do to survive. Ya'll got a compound, many will. Many will rise up, that were not there, and many will fall from others coming to take, regardless of size or security or resources. THAT is just the plain facts of the matter.
I hear some many people claim they will go into the woods and hunt animals for food, when in fact, they never spent a day in the woods, forest or wilderness area. I know a guy that missed a deer 🦌 at 75 yards with a scoped rifle, so thinking you are going out and get some food is a joke for 99.9% of the people. Never mind going after an enemy force !!!
Can you imagine how protective land owners would be over there property and game.
I live in Northeast Tennessee and I hear the same from people all the time. I think to myself, you have no wilderness knowledge, survival skills, or hunting and tracking abilities, BUT just going walk out into the forest and hunt. Good luck with that.
In about a month there will be no animals to huntm. During the SHTF situation.
Sir, I've killed two possums in urban situations. Please stop underestimating me. It hurts my feelings.
No, they won't be hunting. They will go to farms and shoot the farmers cows and goats!! We had it here in the 70s. People would kill a cow and cut off a leg and leave it to rot in the field! This time they will be rotting in the field!!!
In Top’s scenario, I’m finding cover and not engaging. Break any contact and use terrain to cover my withdrawal and as possible, back on my original heading.
The best way to survive a gun fight is to not get into one. I don't know who said it but it's the truth.
@@Brett235 the media will try to 🤣attribute it to Tyson or MLK or Claudine Gay
Yes, 'red forces' may be in the area, but most likely not for long, restraint is key. The first shot obliterates 'Plan A ' ,now things get really 'dynamic' ,so to speak....
Yup, always assume they have all the advantages on you.
I always carry a phase plasma rifle in 40 gigawatt range. Works all the time everytime.
No 45 long slide with laser sighting?
@@Ash_95 UZI 9mm, 12 Gauge autoloader.... which will it be? All.................
You should get the sustainable version charged with solar panels.
for close range go with the 12ga autooooloddder.
Why is there always some asshole that makes this comment on every gun-related video? It’s not witty or funny, it’s tired and old.
Alot of good talking points here. Another reason I love my SAM7SF. I have no business shooting out to 500 yards. If the enemy is that far away, id rather be quiet and not shoot at all.
I would rather drop them from safety. The vid is wrong about location id from one round. Sure you have given up your stealth, but NOT location, you disengage, and leave, but with a success, and little risk. The high risk, is engaging at assault weapon ranges, with others, usually many others, all with the same, and now them circling you from all them rounds spewing forth giving solid location id. When I fire, once, everyone is running for cover and hiding, temporarily, but at range, that's the safe zone for extract. Absolutely requires skill and training tho.
@@sword-and-shield I have my AK for self defense. Not to play sniper. I’d rather avoid a shootout than try to start one
@@andyhwell8419 A shootout is all you get with an AK. Nobody has to play sniper, and sometimes you don't get to avoid something. So its about how you plan on implementing an offense, and surviving. Mine will be from range, by choice, and certainly not AR close.
@@sword-and-shield People naturally gravitate towards close points of interests and that's where the gunfights will be. Meaning there's way higher chances you have to shoot someone within 50 yards than 500+ due to the nature of rivers, buildings, campsites, etc. You'd have to purposely look for people to kill at a long distance in order to enact your "pick them away from a safe distance" fantasy. Matter of fact, you might get one or two guys, but if the people you're shooting at know what they're doing, the rest will hunt you down. You have to eat, you have to sleep, and you have to rest, and that's when they'll strike. Even if they have to disengage that particular day, they will come back for you and hunt you down at some later point in time.
@@UrbanDefenseSystems No its no fantasy, but a choice of engagement. You not knowing the difference, proves you out tho. I can rest eat and sleep in a hole, covered, and have done it, many times. You got nothing for me kid, the only thing you got right is there will be hunting, and the best will always get their tag.
In Minnesota the cold will take you out faster than a speeding bullet people won’t last long if the power goes off all new home construction doesn’t have any backup wood stoves in the basement they are relying on something they don’t have control of up here it’s electricity that will cause the first crisis it won’t take long if it’s in the winter
They will use a bullet to take your house I camped outside in the middle of winter in Minnesota as a kid don't underestimate people
I was taught that the best DEFENSIVE is a Good OFFENSE. Stories from my PIONEER FAMILY, "LONG BECOMES SHORT IN A HURRY". My drill sergeants said the same thing 🗽🦅🇺🇸🙏
And what do cops say? Cops are the reason our border is a free for all. Ironic, no?
Good thought exercise. Food for thought, there is a real possibility that the opposition may have drones to deploy ,if they haven’t already. Stay small, be vigilante, and stay quiet until forced to do otherwise.
I lost my friend Brody a while back about the same time as Riggs. Peace be with you, I know you're still missing him.
Riggs from lethal weapon?
@@RubelessMartin! 😮
A combination AK57 Uzi radar laser triple barrel double scoped heat seeking shotgun is all you'll ever need.
Yes I've heard about that their called Mauraders not to be confused with Survivalist or preppers. They train to take what you have and a lot of them have prior military experience
Excellent video and thanks for striking up the debate. Grunt Proof posted your video which is how I found myself here
The SHTF weapon for me is very different based on either a bug-in or bug-out scenario. I agree with an AR platform as primary for bug-in or bug-out with a vehicle, but for bug-out on foot with a pack, I'll stick with my Henry Survival Rifle and a sidearm. I can easily carry 1000+ rnds of .22lr. In a long-term scenario, I can feed myself with it, and for defense, non-lethal shots take more hostiles out of the game than lethal ones.
1000 rounds will cost you $50 and fit in your front pocket. You could easily afford and carry 10,000. If you add a suppressor you’re good then.
@@kevinobrien3888 You could feasibly carry that much, but my pack is already about 40lbs and I’m not the Marine I was when I got out in ‘87. Pack has tent, jungle bag with liner, water purifier, rocket stove, fire starter, quick clot, suture kit, socks, compass and map, survival food, etc. For me, 1000 .22lr and 100 .40 is good enough (along with the Kabar and a combat tomahawk). If I need more, I’ll barter for it of have to full on Patriot like Mel Gibson…
In my honest humble opinion, the best shtf rifle is the one you train with the most. If you have a preferred rifle then train with it until you can use it without having to think about it. No matter what it is. All that being said I’d still stick with the AR platform because I’ve been training with it for over twenty years.
Eugene Stoner was a damn genius. The AR15/M16 is truly a work of art and you realize it even more when you put one together from a kit when you see how all the pins and everything else go together in the weapon.
My ar is 7.5 lbs with sights and loaded mag. Everything else(bren, fal..etc) is like 12-13lbs+. And pistol carbines that are AR weight.. are no good at distance. To use anything other than than an AR is bizarre.
Where I am, in the winter months you can see for miles. But the same exact fields in the summer are mostly corn fields and you cannot even see 50 ft.
Corncob camo FTW
@@RonLumbar 😂
Most people can not hit past 200 (most).... most people never practice (most) .... for most 200 yard rifle is fine (most)...anything longer for most would be your bolt deer gun (For most)
Easy. 200 yards put on belt buckle. 300 yards is point of aim
I don't limit myself by or care what other people do
Not true. I've been surprised to see how many of the noobies I take shooting easily hit man sized steel targets at 300 yards. Most of them without excessive instruction. Dangerous enough that anyone with a rifle within a 500 yard radius is a deadly threat to you. Regardless of training. Ask yourself how many men out there with hunting rifles and AR15s.
Man size steel targets? That’s BS
You are also talking about sitting on a bench, rifle supported and zero thought of being killed yourself.
@@Rubeless No, not BS lol. I've done it several times. Shooting a rifle is extremely easy. We take 18-year-old recruits in the military and give them similar tests with minimal training.
However, it's true what you're saying about how it's on a bench and with zero thought of being killed. However, the latter is dependent on the individual. No amount of training gives you nerves of steel. As per Marcus Luttrell abandoning his fellow Navy Seals despite all the advanced training.
Hi Top, your weapon of choice should be the one that has become part of your body & mind. One that you train and practice with weekly. Semi, 5.56, 20”/16” bbl, with optic. Become proficient & stay “Stoked”! 🇺🇸
Like any craftsman tho, mastering more than one tool gives you far more options.
@@sword-and-shieldbut beware of the man with only one weapon…..cuz he is probably very proficient with it
@@k9six185 Clearly, but they are child's play to those mastering and proficient with many. Maybe you have never heard of diminishing returns? but weapons have them, and when they are reached its only expedient to expand your tool skill set. The "master of one gun" saying is viable, when you have not mastered any.
Why isn't anyone expanding on attaching lightweight shotguns to rifles? The Russians were putting modified grenade launcher triggers w/12GA barrels on for one shot. What about using a bullpup style rifle to make room for more shotty underneath ?
I really like the notion of even acknowledging something as a threat before considering to engage.
Terrain and availability of resources is what determines which weapon is best. I am originally from Louisiana. A shotgun is probably the best weapon. I now live in the desert of west Texas. An AR is best here. Many factors to consider.
No shotgun outperforms a rifle in any scenario.
Being from LA, I guess you are use to being hunted down by other 2 legged creatures. Especially in the public schools, or when a storm hits. 😉
Capacity and the time it takes to reload that limited capacity are huge weak points for shotguns.
@@darlsbarkley3493 yes but, there’s not much a 12 gauge can’t do in a Louisiana swamp.
@@stevenrush9862 but what can a 12 gauge do that a 5.56 or 308 can't do? Especially if we assume that most of the targets are going to be two legged animals, the shotgun is just an inferior choice.
308 battle rifle pick your flavor i prefer an AR10. A good variable optic. Fight only if you have to avoid contact and flee if you can
FAL is my choice.
I have guns ranging from M96 Swedish Mausers to Savage heavy barreled 22-250 to Garands, 1903’s, M1A’s, riot guns, etc.. At my age, if I had to pick a defend the homestead rifle, it would be the Savage 22-250 with Nightforce 5-20 power scope. For hitting the trail, I’d choose the Mini14 tactical with 4-12 scope.
The thing I see, often when people speak on this issue is they tend to talk like they’ll be a nomad. If you are living in an area after SHTF you can’t always just decide to duck for cover, then run and never come back.
Having a long range rifle for home, camp, or in transport is a good idea. There will be times you need to leave your home, if for nothing else than to see who has moved in to your area. Information is more important that almost anything in a hostile situation. Also, You may be out with family or friends, you don’t want to run and hope they are able to do the same. Say you’re split up foraging for game or new water source or, whatever, you hear a shot pop off. Does he have your friend, son, wife pinned down? I can tell you I couldn’t leave the area until I know either bad guy is dead or friends are safe.
If you practice ranging with your reticle and practice long range shooting. Hitting a target past 1,000 yards is fairly easy with the correct set up. They can even be pretty lightweight too. I agree tho, this should be secondary to a good 0-500 yard semi auto rifle regardless of your likely AO.
One solution for being on the offensive in long range engagements in that terrain could be thermal optics, using a bush for concealment or going prone doesn't work when the person shooting has thermal. So in that specific use case thermal with a SPR/DMR/Battle Rifle set up might be tangible.
That goes both ways, defeating thermal on the defensive will be useful.
Thermals come with a ton of disadvantages in a SHTF situation.
@darlsbarkley3493 still a great thing to have. Or at least know how to reduce your own signature.
@darlsbarkley3493 For general passive use analog NV is preferred, but if you're hunting in a known location day or night, having a clip on can be very useful for things that like to hide.
@@darlsbarkley3493 can you elaborate?
@@ry3713 battery life, frame rate, weight, etc are all issues with thermals. You're watching everything on a tiny screen, not actually viewing through a series of lenses like a scope or red dot. Modern red dots don't have an issue with battery life and a magnified optic still works without batteries. A clip on thermal or a handheld thermal is probably a good thing to have in these scenarios but if you try to rely on a thermal scope without any other option, you're going to die.
I agree, caliber fits need-rounds down range will be a deterrent, but not everyone walks,something a little bigger is always a plus.
I personally do not want a weapon I can't reproduce parts for. FN FAL has a tilt bolt and the SKS Junkwagon uses a tilt lock bolt. Those can be made with files and drills. Barrels are essentially small car axles, same grade of steel. We need to have our own fail proof home made ammunition casings and be able to turn our own copper and zinc projectiles or cast lead. We will not be getting factory ammo by the time things get bad.
Love the sks
@@noahsaville it's fun
I always keep at least two rifles of the same model and caliber, 3 if I can locate another at a reasonable price.
Alternatively. AR parts are plentiful. They’re common to find. And cheap to stock
@knifelover73 presently, yes. Future no. Try to think like a grand strategist. People who hate us want us to be first without any new ammunition. Second, these people want us without firearms. The South ran out of ammunition on many occasions. They had rifles. It's worth it to think and prepare for the next 30 to 50 years by taking action now to be ready for a group of people here and elsewhere who have no problem being slaughtered like sheep.
Different tools for different jobs. A silenced SBR 556 is for shorter engagements. A SPR 6.5 Grendel is for hunting and midrange offense/Defense. A range finding scope is useless in heavily wooded terrain.
Backdrop looks familiar. Thanks for giving your thoughts. Hopefully in those SHTF nightmares we find ourselves held to a higher law.
"Circumstances don't make the man, they only reveal him to himself."
Epictetus
NorCal... Sierra Nevada foothills. I suspect Stokers out visiting Grunt Proof. 🤔
@@realpropertymangement7640
P
Number one rule in SHTF scenario, avoid guns fights. I see so many people stocking up on ammo and planning on being in who knows how many gun fights. I promise you, you will be very lucky to make it out of a gun fight without being shot yourself. More than one gun fight will most certainly be your death. No hospital or ER available. People watch too much TV. You don’t need thousands of rounds of ammo.
you mean to tell me not everyone is gonna become john wick after shtf?
Until I find better I’m running a IWI X95 Tavor 5.56 with a Vortex AMG UH1 gen 2 “Huey” as my main , with a Glock 19 Gen 5. In the piney woods of SouthEast TX.
But as a collector have plenty of options.
Digging your content lately!
In my area Vegetation dictates the preferred tool. Certainly an accurate, telescopic sighted tool would advantageous in some scenarios, but not most… in my neck of the woods.
Thanks! How is the puppy doing?
My choices of guns for homestead recce in shtf
would be:
1. My AR-15 build chambered in 5.56 with 1-8 sig tango lpvo with piggyback red dot, 16in. Barrel, and other stuff and carrying 8, 30rnd mags. Ranges 2-500yds
2. Sig cross bolt action chambered in 308 with 6-24 vortex crossfire ii scope with piggyback red dot and other stuff with 4, 20rnd mags. Ranges 100-1,000
(I’m a skilled marksman)
3. Sig p226 xfive legion with red dot, light and rear sight. Ranges
0-50yds
Thanks for reading y’all and you to stoker. Stay stoked and stay safe see y’all!
Hondo’s doing great!
if one has a group theres more than likely going to be a mixed bag of calibers and action type , SA , PA , LA , BA plus shotguns etc.
Here in the TN mountains the combat shotgun is my choice 😊
Good thing about that area is not many people are going to be there to do dirty work. It's going to be in the cities, then the suburbs, then the rural areas, I don't think it will get out that far. Same with the desert areas. My furthest shot here is about 100 yards before we get into heavily wooded areas with lots of underbrush.
Where he's at isn't too distant from Sacramento and San Francisco. There are alot more people out there than you might imagine, and there'd be a lot more in a SHTF! Listen to the background. Hear the semis. There's a major roadway very nearby.
I just moved from Southern AZ (Cochise County) to NE Georgia and nothing has changed with my rifle set up; AR15 with EOTech and 3x magnifier. My tactics haven't changed either, I am still not going to slug it out with anyone but will break contact and get to a better defensive position. Engaging anyone at distance is just drawing attention to yourself. There is always someone bigger and badder out there, plan on it and live to fight another day.
I have been seeing lots selling out in Cochise county for very inexpensive prices. Would you recommend building a cabin or small home out there? Thanks
You raised good valid issues. This is something that goes far beyond equipment and skills. Something that too many give no real thought to.
Decent thermal optics are becoming affordable for many. Something to consider if you're thinking you're gonna just sneak up on anyone trying to take their stuff in a shtf situation. Those that prep are more likely to own such thermal scopes.
I believe attempting to go around stealing from others is a fool errand, they won't last long, even spec ops don't want to cqb in the unknown over and over
@@Thekulprit92 better to form alliances or circumvent the situation entirely
Yeah until like a week later and you can't find batteries. Night sights irons is a better long term solution and so much lighter.
@@someguy5444 I have rechargeable batteries and a solar powered battery bank. I also have night irons.
Have to watch out for catcus here when going prone
We have to watch out for poisonous snakes around here. We do not wear sandals or shorts at night or when walking out past the fences where I haven't cut the grass. I bush hog three times a year so everything out past 10 feet on the other side of my fences potentially has a copperhead, rattlesnake or a cottonmouth.
A 16" 5.56 AR with a 1-6x LPVO or 3x or 4x fixed power scope. The magnification is for target recognition so a person can use it for hunting. Recommend M193 for the majority of applications. For southern Whitetail hunting out to 100 yards I've had success with Barnes 70gr TSX loaded to 5.56 pressures. For close in/homestead ranges, an SP5K is adequate.
He said “2 legged creatures” so are we fighting velociraptors again? Cause I’m out then.
That was my first thoughts as well. Those suckers work in packs too….
Get some!
Lol... good one
It could also be Australia’s gripping cassowaries birds.
@@David-O970"Clever girl..." screams..knarly raptor noises....
Always more than one.
I'm a brand new subscriber. I'm a disabled grandpa. The plan my family has is that I will keep the children and other non-combatants hidden and as safe as I can while the others in our group do any roving fighting that needs to be done. We will never be the raiders of others. In fact, we are more likely to share with those that have nothing than to take from others. That is just who we are. That being said, I have an sks for close in defensive work and a multiple bolt guns capable of very accurate fire out to 1,500 and I have been practicing for such engagements. I don't have an AR because I live in a communist state in the PNW that banned their sale before I could afford one. My hope is to never be forced into that situation to start with, but I am mentally ready and practiced physically to fulfill my role in our plan. Ultimately, I want to take my family as far from the conflict as I can into remote country and just do what we can to survive. But should conflict come to us, we will defend our own.
You could just drive to a free state and buy one
@southernpartisan1772 if I can ever save enough to buy one I'll do just that.
308 is more powerful than 5.56 in 100 yards 200 yards 650 yards...
but yes I agree with your points , great video
Distance is one thing, terrain is a thing, but cover is another. In CONUS there are MILLIONS of light skinned automobiles that 5.56mm M855 and M193 are not very good at penetrating. Lot of stories from Iraq of M855 skipping off automobile windshields. The only thing on a light skinned automobile that will stop a .30 caliber rifle round is the engine block. Battle rifles will be advantageous when 99% of everybody running around in TEOTWAWKI have .22 caliber AR-15’s.
💪
I agree with you except for the hunting part. I’ve taken those 500-800 yard shots with great success while hunting in the mountain west. While using a bolt gun. But hunting is not the same as if you would be going against a two legged threat. Cause animals don’t shoot back.
@@danielrumble11 how are they going to shoot back after you shot them?
You don’t engage unless you have to
@@danielrumble11 so if someone is going around killing people and is perhaps even closing in on you or fired upon, you don't have to? Do you wait until they've shot you to shoot back?
@@danielrumble11so if people are going around harming others and are perhaps even closing in on you, you'll just wait until they're on top of you before you respond?
That’s not what I’m saying at all.
After finally getting to shoot out to some distance. 500yds and in is a good metric. Able to identify out to 500 is about all you need in an optic. So an acog with rds, 3x or 5x with rds, a 1-6x, 1-8x, 2-10x, rds with a 3x-5x magnifier would be sufficient for most.
I hear you, but nothing about the ‘Ukraine War Leaks’ I’ve seen says ‘they’re a loving family man, won’t steal from you, and are virtuous.’
What’s your point? That it’s okay to be immoral because others are immoral?
@@RodolfoMartinez-px6cj Its complicated. Once evil holds power and its position is so strong that it controls the political apparatus, the "education" system, the mass and social media, law enforcement, and the legal system, no group unwilling to use violence to protect mankind from its evil has any chance of succeeding. Its weakness and passivity will be obvious to the parasite, and the parasite will naturally destroy it. God Speed.
@@RodolfoMartinez-px6cjSometimes morality is an unaffordable luxury.
@@slappy8941 only for those who don’t mind going to hell.
Your comment is completely irrelevant. Bot ? Just a incoherent human ? 🤔
I like the way you contemplate a variety of situations and scenarios and step through each one logically ... cause and effect ... this is valuable in formulating actions you may have to take at a later time ... in a way pre-training in your mind and mulling over consequences of actions taken ... it's a good mental exercise ...
Great video. Think light, capable, and common. Ammo is cheap, parts are available.
As prior military, this guy is wise….and that’s an understatement.
Man, I really enjoy your vids. Definitely words of wisdom! Thank you for the insightful views/ commentary.
The plan is to live to be an old man. Taking what dont belong to you doesnt seem like a good way to reach that goal. Haha
Until you are forced. In these "Scenarios" sooner or later everyone will be taking just to live.
That is your plan my plan is to take two with me on the way out, Keep your powder dry and the barrel pointed in the right direction.
@@vFANGv Yeah, most spew it, but in these doomsday scenarios, yeah, its bs. Your 2 mo no eating means squat when there IS food still available huh
@@vFANGv in 2 months, you could've planted an egg and grown yourself a whole chicken
Thanks for sharing good info
Hey Top. We’ve been bombarded with so much MEDIA… television-movies-video games-now content creators; hero type stuff, that REALITY is almost gone these days. Everyone thinks they’re going to actually engage…with the adversary. I appreciate your videos and perspective.
17:28 I know a former Marine that has that plan. He worries me.
If I'm defending my property, my .270 Win is what I'd pick, there's a reason our military is looking at switching to .277 Fury.
In my house? It's hard to beat .300blk
Close to mid range but not inside probably my Mk12, for all the reasons you gave.
Most city contacts will be under 100 yards, and in the woods, depending on how thick it is, it could be much less, but out in the plains or in open areas, it could easily be 500 yards, and from what I see most will only be somewhat accurate in the 100 yards range, and that's on a stationary target, if they know they are being shot at and moving fast, good luck hitting them!
Wow!! Brother, very different from western Washington state, looking like Yakima Washington. If you don’t mind, can you give your boy Hondo a big hug for me? I was hoping to see him in your video!! Loving your videos!! Brother!! I’m staying STOKED about mastering my craft!!👍🏿💯🇺🇸🪖
I get what you are saying. I have a couple choices. One of my hunting rifles started out taking care of two legged critters. It stays where I started though . It is to heavy to move with . You can but there is better choices.
If your plan is to take everyone else’s stuff as a means to survive then guess what, YOU are the bad guy. Even if you have kids to feed.
Jocko said he was gonna full warlord makes you think what he really means by that.
Jacko is an idiot. Stop being a simp to these attention seeking clowns
Get a deer cart and use it to carry a long range rifle with a built in shooting rest
I’m in S Florida. I’ve collected AR’s in 10”. We will never shoot over 150 meters and weight counts in 110deg
You will never shoot at all. Our kind is being replaced. The gov tells you to stand down and accept it, and you will. End of story...or is it
Thank you for a take on the hills. Thank you for calling out the Creepers.
If things got bad. I would try to equip and organize my neighbors. Strength in numbers. I would try to rise to the occasion. I'm thinking I'd be a threat to Raiders. I'm American and will conduct myself as such...
Here where I live in South Louisiana with our heavily wooded areas 556 is good to go...
Out West with it's wide open spaces it would be Bolt Action 308 with a good scope, and a good AR in 556.
I believe that the best SHTF rife is the one you can control and know very well and hit your target at the range required to make the kill shot ' a long range to engage ? I think not . I live in Wyoming very hard to judge distance without a good rangefinder ' also wind is a big factor. You better know your platform ballistics very well and then the wind can change it very fast . I agree with Stokermatic 100 percent.
Il stick with my AK, it might not be the best at long range but its damn effective at close with outstanding barrier penetration.
16 to 18" barrel reliable semi auto 308 with an optic/backup irons. Magazine fed.
ive always said if a threat is more than a few hundred yards away, its probably best to evade rather than engage.
Realistic , Pragmatic , StokerMatic ! ! !
Doesn't matter too much. Small arms don't really change anything. An AK or AR is more than capable of being a danger to others at 500 yards and more. What will matter are things outside of your control. Like getting ambushed, and unlucky bullet, etc. A 16 inch barreled AR15 with an ACOG can do anything a rifle is realistically required to do. And quite frankly, I think most engagements will be at fairly close distances. Almost 90% of all Americans live in big city, the rest of them in suburban and urban environments.
I'm a veteran, I have no plans on shooting anything 300+ yards away, I use iron sights, LVPO, magnifier and red dot. The calibers I use 5.56, 223, .300, .308 .7.62 x 39, .50 Beowulf and .22. Just depends on the situation. I do practice but shooting crazy distance is a waste of ammo, if you don't hit the target with a few rounds. When people talk about SHTF, you have to ask what their idea of SHTF is, people watch WAY too many Hollywood movies thinking within a snap all chaos break out. Usually, SHTF is a few days build up, meaning the government starts off by lying to you about what's going on or what's about to happen. (That's when you implement SHTF drill, locking down home and getting family together). The government then change to condition Orange by this time you're going over your checklist to make sure home and family are ready (finishing touch). The scenario I just gave you was for SHTF in case of ECONOMY disaster, the crash of the dollar which is right around the corner. Try and remember the president first televised discussion of COVID to how many days or weeks it took for people to make a run on stores for face mask, Clorox and toilet tissue. To this day, experts have no clue why toilet tissue became gold, but now that you know, be prepared.
SHTF scenario will require difference responses
Has anyone watched "Civil War 2024?". The most realistic movie I've seen without Hollywood special effect and unrealistic situations.
Haven't seen it but on this platform it can be rented for 5 bucks in standard def. I might watch it on a weekend. The trailer looks pretty good!
@@je862 After watching the movie, let me know what you think
@@musclebymike1382 For sure!
even if you DO hit one guy at say, 400m, you wont hit the others, cause they'll drop prone, roll, run/dive and you can't hit such targets. So now, you've told them of your (hostile, armed) presence, and t hey hate you for shooting their buddies. What have you gained, hmm? If you had your stuff underground, all you need to do is stay underground and let them walk on by! Why would you even be out in daylight in the first place? Once shtf, 99% of the population will be dead in a year, 90% in 6 months, probably 50% in 90 days. So all you really HAVE to do is have a year's supply of food scatter-buried at your BOL, bring some spices, seeds, fats when you bug out, dig a tunnel and stay in it except for one hour at night. Scan 360 with thermal imaging, repeat every 5 minutes, as you access a food-bucket and cook a meal. Once a year has passed, you can much more safely have hidden plots of root veggies, peanuts, sprouts. You dont want any part of this scouting, patrolling, etc, folks. It makes no sense. It's a stupid risk to be taking, for no reason at all
Lol prepper porn
high value targets is what a bolt gun is for
@@jayjason423 you don't really need a bolt gun for that
@@Dread_Pirate_Homesteader No, but its cheaper, no flying brass, and just as quick far away since you have to get back on target anyway. And getting .5 MOA with a cheap factory gun is just...well fun.
@@jayjason423 unlikely you're getting half moa with cheap cheap ammo and cheap optic..
I'd seen a few of those videos from the war in Ukraine, and a lot of terrain they were in looked very much like the rural midwest.
If you are in the mountains without a range finder and only 556, I don't know if you should be there
I go to the mountains with only a 9mm sometimes.
@jardo531 try to use context next time. This situation is some end of the world murder people/get ambushed at long distances. I use a 22 all summer for grouse, but that's not what's being discussed
So im the one with the other acct that hes responding to, i said " terrain dictates weapon selection, we are out in Wyoming, i literally came off the long range we ran A suppressed Riger precision 22lr with 30moa base with a venom vortex 16x and i repeatedly hit a 32x32 steel plate at 610yds with 4moa overhold and 4,moa Right windage, my friend with his Bergara 22lr with his combined 50moa of railmand mount using a 90moa night force scope touched 655.8yds repeatedly. Everyone is missing tje concept that 22lrs can be used for supprrsssed ultra long range and can have repeatability. It's something to be said to have a friend in an elevated position like 3 degrees on a hill in some scrub brush and quietly Arching the 22lr into your Prone backside. Get two of us spoting and hunting and its over. I stand by what I said bring your semiautomatic AR 5.56 whatever, and we with a bolt 22 or 6.5 or 300winmag will touch you long before your AR ever does.
proven correct, there is some drunken additions to the ar platform, but me I don't have any gunz so no dog in this fight, that's my story and i'm stuck 2it
That’s good stuff amigo. Just don’t miss the point.
I just realized I need a SHTF pack mule.
You won't hear a shot if they are within 1000 yards. If they can't make that shot, they will let you walk on by.
In shtf you probably have what you have. Me an ought6 is fairly likely. To me components and flexibility are probably most important. Something that can use multiple powders, blackpowder, and use cast projectiles. So if i had a choice 45-70 in a rolling block might fit the bill.
I've found this to be helpful. For most people the SHTF situation will be temporary and as a fact - law and order - if absent will be restored rather quickly. Taking a 'defensive' mindset to protect you and yours is best and likely legal. In the extreme condition of a complete breakdown of society and civility the 'rules' no longer apply. It's hard survival and only your own morality will exist. I plan and practice around temporary but maintain capability for worse.
I can see maybe 300 yards in Michigan...i have a MK18 with a 3-15x for oversight
Good word, preacher! Who do we wanna be?👍👍👍
I’ve been thinking the same for a long time for similar reasons.
1. If they are at a distance greater than the range of my ar15, are they really a threat to me?
2. Can I even identify if they are a threat?
3. Even if I can identify that they are a known threat or something, is it really morally justifiable to just murder them out right?
4. What if they are actively shooting at me? Wouldn’t I be better off just getting the hell out of there?
This is why for my personal rifle I chose an AR15, set up with a focus on maximum performance at 0-200(can be pushed further if necessary but not set up for that) along with keeping the weight and size to a minimum.
As a moral, prudent person in this scenario you’re most likely to avoid a firefight. If you have to return fire you better know distance, have ample DOPE to confidently take shots. There are exceptions to avoiding a firefight, however in general I’d prefer not to get into a gun fight across a ridge at 700m. Also, this shows a good use case for a suppressor. It’s very very difficult at long distances to determine where shots come from when the shooter has a decent can
Not gonna lie, I would really like to see Stoker on the Shawn Ryan Show
🥃
Sooner or later, everyone of value will be on Shawn's show.
Shawn Ryan is Lex Fraudman for tactifools
The issue I always have with people talking about a TEOTWAWKI arsenal is that the most basic weapons will serve the best. My apocalypse arsenal will supply me with food if needed, and, if I need a better weapon, I can take one off of a potential threat from 500M .
The best advice I ever heard, was a flintlock musket or fusil because:
1. Easy to fix.
2. Versitility
3. Lead ball and shot can be recovered.
4. Black powder can be made from readily available materials.
A good bow can be priceless.
1. Arrowheads can be made from stone or glass.
2. Bows can be made from scavenged fibreglass marker rods and pvc tubing.
3. Arrowshafts and fletching can be made of natural materials or dowles and duct tape.
* dowels
It's more complicated than that... You have to assume he is talking shtf without rule of law, in that case how close is to close, assuming you see few armed individuals traveling in the direction of your house or camp, you have your wife and kids there, what do you do? You let them get 20 yards away to ask them who you are? Or What do you want? If they are bad guys you are dead... What you choose to do in that situation is your business, I pray to the Lord it never comes to that point... In that type of terrain you are, AR10 308 caliber all day long, m&p 10 is about 7lb accurate 4 to 18 x scope and good luck inside 800 yards if you shoot and miss your shot.
If you're alone, it's best to try to avoid a confrontation. Likely you might not be worth anyone of them getting shot. If you're in a big group, you can risk a gunfight and eliminate the potential threat. Scary stuff for sure.
And those guns I mentioned all have suppressors except for the handgun.
I have a diamondback. 556 AR sighted in at 300 yds. Hope it works
If we had any sense, we would have our own ammunition production. Like using common steel cylinders we would make and use the powders we harvest off of factory ammo, and make our own projectiles. We would fire them with a copper wire charged by a little battery and a capacitor.
Reliability ,availability of ammunition, spare parts, accuracy, and what the other members of my group or team is going to determine what weapon I carry. Now the AR-15 even though it uses a varmint round has came a long way since it was considered to only have a effective range of 360 meters. Its easy to carry a extra upper receiver and ammunition dedicated for making shots at longer distances.
As im in Texas and have a mix of in the brush and in the city depending on how far i go in and out, my plan is in the brush i have a good 45 LC lever action, as it has good range over all and as my native American ancestors proved, quite effective at hit and run if needed as long as you're a decent distance away. Along with this, because its a lever action, i can reload ammo with black powder if needed
But ill have a 9mm pistol with a conversion kit for in the city this way i do have a cqb back up arm when in the brush and a primary arm that is quite effective at close ro medium range in the city, and as its 9 mm i can pretty easily get more ammo. I do eventually plan on getting an AR15 but im wanting to get a relatively high quality one and dont have that kind of money yet. But i have training with them so if i ever needed to (hope not) i can get it off the dude that tries to hurt me and my family. But right now, im trying to get my family armed and read to go.
I laugh a bit when I hear guys say "Don't get an unreliable AR style rifle with all those moving parts, get a nice reliable, simple lever action." AR's have way fewer moving parts than a lever action. Lever guns are incredibly complex, which is probably a good reason why they're so bloody expensive, and they almost never have detachable mags, harder to mount optics etc. Not to bash lever rifles, indeed any gun is better than no gun, so if a lever rifle is all you have then that's better than nothing, but modern semi autos are clearly and vastly superior for what we're talking about.
Of course terrain will dictate choice of weapon and accouterments. That said, I expect my choices will stay they same irrespective.
While I have a 300blk AR for the homestead, that’s not my choice for when I leave.
In my case, it’s a highly accurized (sub MOA) stainless mini-14 on a Hogue sunthetic stock with a 3x14 shorty scope and a 1K lumen light/laser combo
10 30 round magazines, 55/62 grain 5.56, 4 42 round magpulls in the patrol pack, and 20 rounds of match grade 70+ grain rounds in a magazine on the butt stock.
Backed up by an HK USP .45 and several blades.
As to the scenario, I would very much go to ground and use the failing light to mask my movements once I’m sure of what’s going on. The incoming may be designed to force my movements towards and ambush of some sort.
I’d also have to consider my current loadout, as any kind of dynamic movement will be curtailed by the weight of my gear. In this situation I’m more than likely carrying a full backpack along with my fighting load so unless it’s indirect fire, I’m digging in with an improvised fighting position until I know I can egress safely.
Stoker, and many others, will be offended by my stance. The best battle rifle is the one you actually train with. If you don't train, there is no "good" battle rifle. My grandfather started teaching me marksmanship at 8 years old. I'm now solidly in my mid-50s. I EDC a .357 with a 4" barrel. I train multiple times per week with my Henry .357 lever action. So, with nearly 50 years of training with revolvers and levers, what do you think is my "best battle rifle"?
Why would I be offended?
Appreciate you sharing amigos and I bet your grandfather was a helluva man.
@@STOKERMATIC Pacific Theatre veteran. He was a tough, old rusty nail, but he loved his grandchildren. I miss that mean ass bastard even all these years later. He passed when I had just turned 13.
Lots of folks have gear and quite a few train. This is going to get very messy, very quickly
well there is training then there is training soldiers. Carbine course training does not equal training to be a soldier. As a infantry veteran I would much rather go up against civilians who took carbine courses than trained soldiers.
I’ve watched all the John Wick movies several times. Pretty sure I’m ready.
@@theintrovertedcalifornian5047you seen what happened overseas fighting in their own home. Imagine what’s going to happen here. Hunters, competition shooters, well trained vets, law enforcement such as swat teams ect ect. This ain’t just guys with flip flops running around with an AK.
@@losoway4505 This is why communication and leadership skills are essential. you want these people on your side. Give me just a squad size element of well trained 11 Bravos and my neighborhood turn into a no go zone real quick
@@theintrovertedcalifornian5047 better hope you get some good shit added to your roster before SHTF 😂😂😂