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Thanks for the heads up, Sam, but I think you should explain C ratings better. Some people still don't understand that charging power needs to be seen in relation to battery size. Saying that a certain chemistry can take 600 kW makes no sense unless you specify battery size. Applying 150 kW to a 15 kWh PHEV battery is just as brutal as charging a 100 kWh EV at one megawatt; both will be 10 C.
In Brazil, going fully electric is challenging due to the lack of fast chargers. The best option for now is hybrid vehicles, especially flex hybrids that run on ethanol or gasoline in any proportion. Personally, I only use ethanol because it’s better for the environment and cheaper.
Brazil gets 60% of their electricity from hydro and 20% from wind and solar. Hopefully BYD will set up a factory in Brazil and build affordable EV's. Electric cars are better than ethanol made from sugar cane. Brazil needs to adopt electric cars and have a mass build out of EV charging stations as soon as possible.
Unless you are compulsive road trippers, fast chargers are not really a solution - it is an aid tool, a temporary patch for people not used to EV usage pattern. Over 4 months of owning EV, I only use them 3 times, and all of that time is because I still haven't got chargers at home. My daily commute is 13-16 km back and forth (an average total of 30 km per day). Fast chargers ruins your battery for not so much gain or time savings. Not to mention that they impose premium 50-100% more expensive rate per kW than home electricity usage. You better off plugging into slow 7 kW chargers at work (if they have any), start from 8 AM, plug it in while your battery is at 25% and return home at 5 PM with full 100% 60 kW battery that should give you 320 km range at worst, 360 km on average, and 510 km on constant coasting / cruising traffic. The best way to own EV is to install your own home chargers and totally enjoy that off-peak electricity discount, where in Indonesia you can enjoy up 30% more savings on top of 400% typical savings you already get with EV. Bombastic savings number, I know, but the expensive EV price will take up all those savings in addition to the less maintenance cost and tax bonus - you ended up with the same number as you did if you buy normal gasoline car. You just waste less time taking a detour and queue at gas stations. Going hybrid in 2020 is like 15-20 years too late isn't it? Not good enough being ICE car, not good enough for EV. Unless you live really far (like 40-50 km away from work), it doesn't make any sense to force that overburdened gasoline engine to carry along heavy batteries. The hybrid compromise would cost you 40% more than a pure EV setup (in case of BYD Qin Plus PHEV vs BYD Atto 3 BEV).
Except ethanol is made with corn, which if you recall when the US first did that created an extreme shortage in the Mexico and Central America maybe not in Brazil, but Mexico literally had some food right at the time. Anytime you come early human food to non-edible uses, you need to replace the food in the food chain but I’m more farmland or whatever.
@@yohannessulistyo4025 I agree with a lot of your post, but why being so negative on fast chargers? I've got an eight year warranty on my battery, much longer than I will keep the car, and it has no restriction on DC charging. I live in an appartment and normally charge twice a week on a MER DC charger near where I live. It's not superfast, 80 kW, but I only charge between 35 and 65 kWh (of course it's not the case when on travel) following an advice from a battery developer on RUclips. He also downplayed the need to avoid DC charging. The real killer for the battery is charging it to 100%, or drawing it down to zero, and keeping it in that state for a long time. I have two subscriptions, one for the MER network because I have one station nearby, and one Ionity Passport for longer trips, making fast charging really cheap for me as a frequent user. On Ionity I pay 3.50 SEK/kWh ($0.33) plus 136 SEK/month for the subscription. Without subscription it cost 8.70 SEK/kWh. On MER it's time dependent. On midday or after 8 PM (off peak hours) the price is 3.05 SEK/kWh with subscription, and on high consumption hours it's 3.60 SEK/kWh. For me as a high milage traveller it's a lot cheaper than a petrol or diesel car as the fuel taxes are so high in Europe.
@@gregkelmis2435Brazil’s ethanol is made primarily from sugar cane. It’s much more efficient than corn and is over abundant there. It makes way more sense to use as a fuel source in their economy. With US corn, the food versus fuel argument is overblown. While I’m sure that there are complications from the land displaced to grow the corn rather than better food sources, the corn used for ethanol is a non-human food source. It’s used as a cheap feed for livestock, reducing the price of our meat, and the feed (distiller’s grain) is a byproduct of making ethanol. You get the fuel and the feed without wasting one or the other. Mass corn growing in the US isn’t good for the environment by any means. It’s got environmental pros and cons even comparing it to oil and gasoline, but it does serve multiple purposes in our economy. For starters, if it went away we would have to replace it with another livestock food source on the mass scale that our current agricultural system requires.
If you can charge a 30kWh PHEV battery as you get in the Shark 6 at 150kW, then you could recharge in about 12 minutes. That's not much longer than filling up with fuel. Which means you could fill up your charge on the road.
It still doesn't make much sense. 30kWh battery in a truck will probably only go 100km, and you can still only charge to 80% quickly. Meaning you are sitting around for 15 minutes for 80km. You may as well just had and go unless you are stopping somewhere for lunch anyway. It's similar with my Outlander PHEV. It has a fast charge port but charging it on public chargers is only slightly less expensive than petrol so it almost never makes sense to do unless you are stopping for something else anyway.
I love your channel Sam. All the best to you and your family. Quick fact check on this video. The 2024 plug-in hybrids from Toyota no longer use nickel metal hydride batteries. Although I don’t have the exact chemistry, they use some form of lithium ion. Adding that to this video would make it a bit more credible. Keep up the good work!
You get to drag around a petrol motor and fuel with a tiny slow charging EV battery and then bonus, carry that wee battery and electric motors with the petrol engine. Sounds great. You also get to maintain the petrol engine AND replace the sub par small battery. Where do I sign?
A good, efficient PHEV with an empty battery can still be an excellent hybrid and can, in the mountains for instance, still benefit from the bigger buffer AND the greater regen power compared to a normal hybrid. Toyota RAV4 and Ford Escape are very good at this sort of thing. Thing is, this works until a certain battery size...like say 15-20KWh....bigger than that gives you faster charging but also the weight penalty with an empty battery really starts to take its toll. If you want facts, look up the ecodriver youtube channel, he has done quite a bit of testing with these kind of scenario's.
@Viking, very insightful and informative presentation explaining the new hybrid tech and what it is all about and how it fits in. Keep up your great work, that's why I follow you everyday.
Hybrid batteries like this is the way to go. One for short term frequent use and direct delivery, the other for longer storage. The battery then shuffles charge between the two systems.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
@@protagonist9716 range is not the only issue the pure EV solve: cost of ownership for hybrid is similar if not higher than combustion engines. Hybrid adds to the complexity of combustion engines the complexity of electric systems.
In effect the sodium are the primary battery for charge/discharge and the LFPs act as the long term store but the packs in the battery are mixed AB cell arrangements - the battery management system manages the balancing between the cells. From the car's motor/charger perspective the whole battery is seen as a unit, one type of battery isn't used for one particular purpose over the other type (it's up to the BMS to determine how the electrons flow into and out of the battery packs).
nah they never make it to market because a new battery gets invented, then that one never makes it to market because a newer battery was invented, and we end up with lots of youtube content but no batteries? Thats not whats going to happen...
A Chinese carmaker takes 18 months to bring a new car into production. Legacy carmakers take 40 months. So the time it takes between a battery being ready for sale and it being incorporated into EV designs is roughly that much. This, BTW, is part of the reason the EVs from legacy carmakers are usually worse than the ones from good Chinese brands; since legacy carmakers take almost two years more to design and release a new model, this means that the tech in a brand new model from a legacy carmaker is almost two years older than the tech in a brand new Chinese model.
@@mikejones-vd3fg CATL is not joking. They don't boast about solid batteries like Toyota that they can never mass-produce. At the beginning of last year, they launched Shenxing batteries, and the 2024 Zeekr 001 was equipped with them. Since then, many auto influencers have tested their charging speed, which is really impressive.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
China, India, Middle East , ASEAN large markets are all going by hybrids. If you buy a hybrid with excellent electric range along with a gas tank then it's much more appealing in these regions to have dual systems for propulsion. This is what people demand in Asia where EV infrastructure is taking time to develop. It will make the electrification transition quicker
That statement only plays true if BEV batteries were standing still, which they are definitely not. So if comparing a new PHEV targetted battery it's more valid to compare with a new BEV targetted battery, such as those mentioned by Sam in the video.
@@GruffSillyGoat Your statement would hold true only if engine efficiency wasn't increasing but that fact that it is with both Geely and BYD tooting most efficient engines. Therefore an increase in efficiency both forms propulsion integrated into a hybrid makes it most versatile and is reflected even in China where plug in hybrids sales growth is 70% YoY Vs ~25% for Pures.
The fact they pollute the air Is the problem so I think you are a bit lost having a lump of aluminium alters the balance and weight and will always reduce efficiency 😂 you are being silly
If I get that right, it means you use your PHEV like a EV for daily commute. You can fast charge it for ten minutes and have 40 miles or so?. Then, on long trips, you stop to fast charge your battery and to fill your gas tank as well? I think maybe the advantage would come if it is cheaper than existing ones. Not at the same price. Cheers!
400 km range says CATL. That's better than a lot of pure BEVs. The petrol engine costs money, its weight lowers battery range, and for many customers is unnecessary. The use case is a few customers who make very long trips in areas where there are no charging stations? Surely most customers will prefer BEVs? Cheaper and better.
The 400 km range depends on the size of the battery used in the comparison by CATL, although given the announcement also states the new battery provides a 10% increased range indicating it was being compared to a base 360 km range battery, which today would equate to a 64kWh standard LFP battery today. A 360 km range vechicle today would most likely be a BEV rather than a PHEV, which tend to have a max range currently of around 140 km with a 20kWh battery; or even an EREV, such as those from Li Auto, with a range of 212 km from a 37kWh battery. However, the Freevoy battery isn't targetting BEVs as there are already better options available for this use that outperform in both range and charging ability, both as LFP and high-nickel ternary chemistries, with higher energy densities and faster charge rates; from many battery makers such as CATL, BYD, Tesla, Panasonic, LG Chem etc. This will become more apparent as BEVs swap from gen1 to gen2 cells (and in some cases gen 2 to 3 cells). Although, ICE price-parity BEVs using smaller batteries with later gen cells are also appearing on the market. The aim of the Freevoy battery is to reduce to cost of PHEV and EREV hybrids to a level comparable or cheaper to pure ICE and HEVs, so they don't get squeezed out by the lowering BEV prices, offering a cheaper battery option that supports a wider range of markets via a wider temperature range. The LFPs in the battery are probably being used to optimise weight as Sodium is heavier than LFP (and many high nickle chemistry configurations), so as to reduce weight impact on overall efficiency. The actual size of pack used in PHEV/EREV may well be smaller than the 400 km example in the announcement, to reduce cost and vehicle weight further. The Sodium is doing the heavy lifting here in extending the usable temperature range, and likely used to drive pre-conditioning to warm up the LFP cells before they kick in to take load or charge. The sodium batteries are likely also used as high rate charging buffers to speed up charging, due to their higher power C rates, for a section of the crange curve before the LFPs charging degrades in at a slower rate (or shuffle charged from the sodium cells). The 10 minute / 280 km faster charging indicates that faster charging occurs for 70% of the battery pack range, indicating that the final 30% is slower with the LFPs are driving the remaining charge pace.
I'll welcome anything using Sodium ion as that's the technology that will inevitably dominate grid storage and shut up the FUD about not enough Lithium. It just needs the economy of scale from cars to get going.
I just retired in Thailand where BYD have just opened a new factory. I took a look at the Sealion hybrid which looks like anyother SUV and it feels good to drive but I guess I should do a little more research on battery types and their pros and cons. The thing is, i'm a carpenter not an electronics engineer. 🤫😂
Just think of the benefits... You still have to put gas in it... and it probably still catches fire if it gets in a crash... We're right on it here at industrial revolution Central.
Toyota buying CATL's batteries and BYD's PHEV assemblies seems like a positive step for the company; they're admitting that someone else makes better, cheaper technology. A Toyota Rav4 Prime that goes 50 or more miles in EV mode, and another 400 miles in ICE mode, seems like a very appealing vehicle for the near future at least.
Hybrid vehicles are looking better and better as a way to bridge the gap between full electrification and ice. These new batteries also sound great for terrestrial storage as well!
@@RyanWilmot Possibly for towing. But how many people frequently tow large loads long distance? Most towing, my guess, is to the closest place to launch your boat. Or the camping spot close to home so you don't waste a lot of your weekend time on the road. Not likely for cold weather. The Tesla Y loses about the same amount of range as an ICEV in cold weather. On a long trip in sub-freezing weather you might have to stop one extra time for charging. People should keep records of the actual lost time spent charging vs. money saved. For most people, you're paying yourself well over $100 per hour. Remote areas will get rapid chargers. I don't know if one can conveniently drive the AlCan highway in an EV, but it will become possible. And I suspect few people realize how short, in miles, most remote driving is. There were some people who continued to use horses well after cars and tractors were a better option. I used to help my grandfather harness his team and I drove the hay wagon and rock sledge as a young boy. My grandfather was a laggard because he couldn't stand the idea of his beloved horses going to the dog food factory. People sometimes have reasonable reasons for lagging, some are just cantankerous.
@@bobwallace9753 there’s not enough manufacturing capacity in the world to provide EV’s for everyone right now, so the adoption curve is a really good thing. it gives companies like Tesla the time they need to ramp up and to create new supply chains . Also, currently many people who live in apartments have a hard time with charging, which needs more time to be solved as well. That will happen slowly as EV’s become more common. But for now, plug-in hybrids are a great option for people who don’t see an EV as a good fit for their specific situation, which right now is the vast majority of people in the United States.
Metal-Air batteries will likely be the future for mobility as these address more types of vehicles and offer the higher specific energy density. Both Zinc-Air and Lithium-Air are getting serious attention due to this very high energy density (currently 1700 Wh/kg achieved with Lithium and 800 Wh/kg for Zinc ) with 4,000 to 6,000 Wh/kg expected to be available for Lithium soon. They're not in general use today due to their current lower life cycle (< 1,000 cycles) but processes and techniques learned from other chemistries are being applied to Metal-Air with good results, accelerating their innovation rate. Unfortuantely, Aluminium-Air batteries are primary cells so not rechargable; although, the same was thought true of Zinc-Air till relatively recently. Iron-Air will also be used in grid storage in addition to Sodium as it provides longer duration storage.
Sodium Ion(SIB/NTM) battery has a thermal runaway of 511C vs 180C for LFP vs 140C for NCM. Higher the temperature(degree C) lower the chances of thermal runaway.🤔
12:30 yeah dragging the massively heavy battery around 😄 Yes and you are dragging the Inverter the electric motor as well 100-200Kg. And while using the battery you are dragging the Engine, Radiator, starting motor, exhaust pipes, the gear shift, tank + fuel, etc.. get it... 400-500 kg This why I said million times Plug in hybrids DO NOT MAKE SENSE at all... They are crazy concepts. Especially nowadays with current battery tech.
@@ohger1 yes I say this from the beginning. Toyota Prius was a big hit 10+ years ago. Back then sort of made sense. Until I saw the weight data.... Yes double maintenance, yearly oil changes... And basically in electric or petrol mode you carry dead weight.. I think popularity is based on human psychology we tend to choose the known thing. Most of us can make only baby steps forward, full electric is too drastic change for many people...
@@ohger1 --Hybrids can overcome the disadvantages of full BEVs and ICEVs. Lower prices and no range anxiety. Can go anywhere even if there aren't any fast charging stations in remote areas. The engine is rarely used and therefore needing almost no maintenance. Rarely needing oil changes and never need spark plug change. No brakes maintenance, ever.
It would be better if we had a division between city and country cars. A city car can have a small battery and so be very light and cheap. Rent a long range country car when you need it.
In china the charging infrastructure is still lacking in wide areas. With the available PHEV and 25 or 40kwh battery packs, you can fully electric in the city for +100km and still do motorway trips, without the fear to be stranded, because the chargers don’t work again or are too slow . 30kw/h chargers are still too many there.
Whatever pushes production of battery cells forward. I don't think hybrids is a great idea, but it seems like an ok entry point for those who scared of EVs.
Hybrids have generally been wrongly engineered from the git go. For the masses, the engine should run a generator powering electric wheel motors and have batteries for 50 miles range. The other use of hybrids would be have electric motors powering the A/C and/ or a super/ turbo charger providing a brief boost in power. Edison motors has the right idea.
I would love to be able to take my 2012 Prius and change out the battery for something much longer lasting. I end up driving a lot in the city at slow driving speeds because of traffic and if I could use the battery for the majority that I'd hardly use any gas. I'm not sure how easy that is to do though
the new ecoflow alternator battery system will help you? you can put a cooler size ecoflow battery on wheels into trunk and charge it for 7 days of fridge power in 2 hours of driving a normal vehicle with an alternator
The issue with sodium Ion batteries is the voltage range during the discharge cycle. It's a wide range...very wide, whereas Lifepo4 chemistries are dead on 3 volts for 80% of the cycle.
Must admit, I never charge my PHEV other than at home or friends/family if we go away and stay over. The newer PHEVs with 20kw batteries, yes, but these are only just coming out. Unless that's the intended market? But bear in mind charging needs to be cheap otherwise it''s better to just use petrol.
Yep, the only case for a PHEV is if you can fast charge the battery on the road. Otherwise lugging around a battery you can't recharge is fairly pointless.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
It's not pointless at all. Take for example BYD sealion 6. It has an electric only range of 80 km. If someone wants take a road trip once a month they can easily go upto 1000 km without any charger anxiety. And do daily driving with cheap and electricity.
It remains to be seen whether the 400km battery pack will be used in PHEV/EREV at it's full 400km capacity - other commercial factors may come into play for the automakers. Using the figures in the announcement this seems ot equate to a 64kWh AB battery being used (achieving 400km rather than 360km). The BMS design from the announcement seems to optimise the benefits of the high power rate of sodium with the lower weight of the LFP, to give an AB cell design battery pack that has fast initial charge rates (280km stated would be 0 to 70%) before the LFPs throttle the remaining 30% rate. Given the details stated is seems CATL may be using their gen 1 sodium cells (160 Wh/kg) along side their similar rated gen 1.5/2 LFPs (which would make AB cell balancing easier to perform). The gen 2 sodium and gen 2/3 LFPs (at 200 Wh/kg) announced earlier this year will probably be an increment in the next itteration. The extended temperature range description hints that the sodium cells are being used to pre-condition (heating and state of charge) the LFPs to perform better at load/charge handling, although at some energy/range cost. The pack cell designed stated suggests the the bms performs charge shuttling from the Sodium cells into the LFP, acting as charge/load buffers. The weight of the pack isn't mentioned, which would impact BEV usage, but the LFP appears to be being used to optimise the higher weight of the Sodum cells. The configuration also appears optimised for PHEV/EREV as the cars are already heavy and the mixed Sodium/LFP would add additional weight that could be addressed else where (particularly for Series PHEV or EREV, using a small ICE generator and removing ICE traction parts). BEVs, based on CATL's other battery offerings, it seems CATL are segmenting the market and will likely offer gen2/3 cells (either LFP or ternary dependign upon a cars power requirements) to enable higher pure EV range advantage using higher density cells (260+ Wh/kg). This allows automakers a choice of high capacity premium/long-range BEV models with significantly more range (600km+) or reducing battery size/weight to increase efficiency with more affordable BEV models (400km+). The Freevoy batteries likely will sit just below these ranges for their electrified propulsion.
Great content, as always! I need some advice: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). What's the best way to send them to Binance?
We have had a Toyota Rav 4 Prime 2023 model for 1.5 years, getting 50 miles if Im really easy on it of just electric range (18KW and avg is 3.1 miles per... It has a LiOn battery and takes longer than advertised to charge but has been a good car. I gotta say I would love in a few years to be able to swap out the batt and charging HW for a 3x or 5x of range version (once energy density is high enough to allow it to fix in the same space etc.) that can charge on DC (Rav4 can't) and much faster charge speeds. DO you think this would ever be possible inexpensively?!
Oct 21: "Amid a challenging economic environment and declining market demand in China, the lithium battery industry is facing significant struggles, including overcapacity, low utilization rates, excess inventory, and continuous declines in product prices. These issues have forced many companies, including industry leaders, to halt production. Industry analysts suggest that the sector has entered a period of consolidation, with expectations of large-scale production cuts and many companies exiting the market in the near future." CATL halts a part of manufacturing despite Sept 29, according DongChang FD, factory fire destroys manufacturing site about 32 acres in common.
That, frankly, is bullocks. The demand for batteries in China, both for EVs and for other uses, is growing at double digits YoY. And while the overall car market is slightly down, that is due to ICE and regular hybrids; the electric part of the car market is also growing at double digits YoY. China is on track to surpass 10 million NEVs sold locally this year (some 99.9% of which are either BEVs or large battery PHEVs, with a few hydrogen cars there just to be the butt of jokes about stupidity). Well, apart from declining product prices. The Chinese, including CATL, are very aggressively pursuing production improvements that can reduce their costs - and passing those cost reductions to their customers. That is not much of a problem when the market is growing much faster than prices are falling, though (unless you are a non-Chinese company trying to enter the market, as every time prices fall it makes it even harder for new entrants, like Northvolt, to reach profitability).
So why don't EV companies compartmentalise their batteries so they are smaller, easier to charge but your car has 2 or 3 separate ones. And you can switch between?
In 20 years we will have data of durability and reliability of these things. For now it's just words and I learned a long time ago to not trust in words. Oh and if an EV can't last at least 15 years then it's not for me.
Agree, and really, you don't need to own and keep a car for 15 years to be affected by life. If you keep a car, say, 12 years and it has a calendar age lifespan of 15, the value of the car really drops. I drive a 14 year old Ford Escape as our second car (we have one fairly new and one cheap car) and it's in no danger of becoming inert simply by virtue of age regardless of the mileage.
It doesn’t take 15 years to drive an electric car. Taxis can run tens of thousands of kilometers in a year, and hundreds of thousands of kilometers in a few years.
@@疯狂宇宙-y6x Yes usage is an important factor, but time is also a factor in determining the car and specially the battery lifespan. Also I'm not a taxi driver. So I really want to know the feedback from 15 year EV users. So I will not jump on this EV bandwagon for at the very least 10-15 years as words alone won't convince me.
The marketing of that is meant for carmakers, not customers; you would expect whoever a carmaker designates to deal with suppliers of the single most important component in an EV, including PHEVs with large batteries, to fully understand what they are buying.
PHEV’s are really designed best to work plugged in overnight where you can get a full charge for max ev range. Fast charging a PHEV for 60 to 80kms range is a waste of your time. Charging my Outlander on a DC fast charger takes 38min for 80% and 70min for 98%. 70min for 60 to 80 kms is ridiculous and when you take into account the higher price of using fast chargers there is no financial benefit. Use PHEV’s what they were designed for, charge overnight every night.
fast charging damages PHEV batteries and shortens their lifespan, PHEVs are meant to slow-charge at home for short trips and use petrol for long trips. as for "why people buy them" its really a vote of no-confidence in the government's ability to keep power prices low, and a vote of no-confidence in the international oil market. sales of the outlander PHEV "ES" model are very low compared to all other outlander PHEV models, largely because people really really want the V2L capability that the more expensive models provide, its a guarantee that you've got 1.5kw of 240v AC power everywhere you go, whether you're camping in the middle of nowhere or on a road trip, or at home during a blackout. many campsites have banned petrol generators too, so having 240v outlets in your car is a great way to get around that restriction. and unfortunately mitsubishi still haven't caught on, which is why they're still not offering a larger inverter as standard on all outlander PHEVs, and still haven't produced a portable V2L system that can pull 5-10kw from an outlander and turn it into 240V-AC, even though everyone who chose an "ASPIRE" over an "ES" has literally paid over $6000 extra just to have those power outlets. i get that mitsubishi is a car company not a power company, but its almost like a burger joint that doesn't sell chips, BYD sells very cheap V2L adapters and from what i can tell it is a deciding factor in some purchases, mitsubishi need catch up, by rushing their V2G/V2H/V2L program and releasing a portable V2L adapter ASAP.
@@asleytamkei7507 PHEVs are more expensive to buy because the engineering required for a PHEV powertrain is more complex than most people realise, their engines need to be able to withstand more frequent cold starts. to be more specific, more components need to run on electricity (oil pumps, water pumps, etc) because those components need to be able to operate while the petrol engine isn't running, to minimise damage during cold starts. pure EVs are cheaper to buy, and cheaper to run if you're set up for them, I.E. you can charge at home every time, have solar and batteries so your cost per kwh is below 10c/kwh. charging them at 30c/kwh has a per km cost half that of petrol, whereas at 60c/kwh you're paying more per km than if you used petrol. buying a PHEV isn't about cost savings, ordinary hybrids are the cheapest vehicles to run (by a wide margin), specifically the new swift hybrid and camry hybrid get 3.5L/100km which is on par with home charging an EV at 30c/kwh, an EV is superior to them only if you've got solar panels and a home battery system, and they're already paid for. if you're buying a solar/battery setup just to charge an EV, you're adding $15k to the cost on top of the purchase price of the EV, which will already be more expensive than the camry/swift hybrid. i'd only recommend buying a PHEV to people who live in warm climates and go camping frequently, or live in areas where grid power is unreliable. if you live in a warm climate and have a solar/battery setup, buy an EV. they're great IF you can mitigate the downsides, which basically requires you to already own your own home. if you're not "upper middle class" and want the best cheap option, buy a prius/camry/swift hybrid. traditional cheap hybrid cars blow everything else out of the water. the only downside to them is you can't run on pure electric when "global supply chain disruption" causes the fuel price to triple, which could very easily happen if iran gets involved in a war and decides to blockade the persian gulf.
I drove a friend's Toyota RAV 4 hybrid 2022 for a month (back in 2022). They were in short supply and highly sort after (to the degree where after 12 months on the road it was sold for the same price it was bought for new... by a car auction company!) My experience? Did not like it at all, had and caused a lot of problems, and definitely not economical. Not even close to being worth the money.
I highly doubt they have a fully working sodium battery. it is really hard to make it work. even if they have one, it won't last long, due to it's inherent issues.
Hybrids are an unfortunate half-way house originally (I believe) intended to be viable until battery tech could deliver 300+miles of range. But guess what? they do right now. Unless you live somewhere where the charging infrastrucure is not good, then Hybrids are redundant.
1C minds literally "to charge or discharge the whole capacity per 1 hour" . So 4C it is a quarter of a hour i.e. 15 minutes. It is irrelevant to the "kWt".
That would be peak charge/discharge rate, mind. A 4C battery can typically reach that kind of speed for the fast charge range (often between 20% and 80% charge), but has to slow down when too close to empty or full, so fully charging a 4C battery takes more than a quarter of an hour.
You know that CATL has far more than one plant, right? Even if that one was a total loss (it was not) it wouldn't reduce CATL's production capacity by much, the same way that a single McDonald's restaurant burning down wouldn't be much of an issue for the McDonald's company. Heck, more than one in every 3 EV batteries in the world are from CATL. That is how big they are.
@@FabioCapela i saw the videos, it was a total loss. I understand they have many production facilities. With what happened in Korea, this technology is potentially quite dangerous. I certainly don't want one in my garage.
@@chris-t-4569 First, the fire affected a single building at a large manufacturing base that has dozens of buildings. Even if it was a total loss of that one building (which the company says wasn't the case) it would have little impact on the production of even that single site, which is just only one of the more than a dozen that CATL operates. Second, the fires in Korea involved a Mercedes and a Kia EVs, both of which use less safe NMC batteries. Both LFP and Sodium batteries, including those this video is about, are much safer; it's almost impossible to make them catch fire, and even if they do catch fire they are likely to quickly extinguish themselves before you even have a chance to call the firefighters. Frankly, I would rather have an EV with a modern LFP (or Sodium) battery than an ICE car in my garage. The EV is much safer (assuming it's a BEV; if it's a PHEV, well, PHEVs are as dangerous as ICE cars).
Most likely it is related to very cheap PHEV prices in China. It usually cost less than BEV but still has quite substantial battery capacity. Another issue with the PHEV is that because the battery typically 3-4 times smaller than in BEV for the same performance during the acceleration and regenerative braking needs a battery that is more capable for high current. Simple speaking if the PHEV battery is 20kWh and the BEV version is 80kWh for the same performance the PHEV battery shall be designed for 4 times higher currents...
G'Day Sam. You should stop laughing at other web sites when you are making a HUGE error yourself. CATL batteries are highly unlikely to use SODIUM, which is a METAL that is highly explosive when it comes into contact with water. CATL probably mean SODIUM CHLORIDE (table salt) instead. A subtle difference in wording, but a HUGE difference in chemistry.
No point in getting excited about this battery. Within a month, the Electric Viking will announce a better one. Seriously, how about reviewing all the “breakthroughs” you’ve covered, and projecting which one will make a market impact.
@Viking Not sure if I'm the only one but I keep on hearing you banging on your desk - I hear many strong "THUMP!" sounds as you bring down your hands. Do you think you could filter it out? It's annoying AF ... I'm using Sennheiser HD 4.40BTs and they are "calling it the way it is". Perhaps attach your mic to something else?
PHEV Fast charging is mostly nonsense. The range is just not enough to justify charging in the middle of a long distance trip. You recharge your PHEV slowly at home and drive your average daily distance on electricity.
@@xlaylaylayx We have both of those but I still am not willing to stop every 50-100 km to charge my car. That short distance just doesn’t justify to time it takes to stop and charge.
You would use petrol on highway and electric when driving through urban and suburban areas (Low speed lots of breaking). This reduces petrol and electric usage significantly and with a 20 kwh plus battery would only need to be done after quite alot of driving. This is the difference between 30-40 mpg and 50 to 60 on a long trip.
150Kw? My electric unicycle charges at 700W. I cannot get the charging station guys interested in providing a GPO for us. What is the electrical environment like in an EV? Clif High says it is as savage as the inside of a micro-wave oven. What are the health consequences? Has anyone taken a frequency meter into the cab of their EV? Perhaps even a full spectrum analysis? There is no point asking technicians about the health effect of EMF on the biological cell, they wouldn't have a clue. I'll ask Claude to peruse the internet for me.
The need for sodium is quickly depleting as MASSIVE reserves of lithium are being found, almost every day, which will drastically reduce costs of lithium, which is superior to sodium, in every way. CATL should be focusing ALL efforts of making batteries solid state and highest capacity.
I have to disagree with you. Sodium is superior for grid energy storage in every possible way. It can with an 80% efficiency even in -40C. Sodium batteries are much more safer. Has a fast charge and discharge rate. Also sodium doesn't need that much refining that lithium needs to go through.
Thanks Electric ⚡️ Viking I agree nickel, metal, hydride, batteries, or at least twice the weight of lithium ion batteries. I still use them in my devices and they are over 23 years old. Rayovac iC3 AAs. My lithium AAs are only about 7 years old. Toyota probably brags about having BYD batteries and they’re plug-in hybrid to lower Chinese consumers into purchasing Toyotas but I do agree that BYD batteries are probably much better than the lithium ion batteries inside current Toyota plug-in hybrids. what has killed my lithium batteries is when they accidentally get drained to zero and this is why I predicted 12 years ago that there would be hybrid batteries that would be lithium ion and nickel metal hydride the nickel metal dried batteries would give up charge to prevent the lithium ion from going to zero. Obviously I was wrong. The media has a goal and being fair and honest and accurate are not part of the goal unless it supports the agenda of the people who pay them. Thanks Electric ⚡️ Viking
No one talks how our wonderful EV are getting this electricity from. When we had energy crisis in the Europe, Switzerland limited drastically charging EVs... Why? Because it is not so "energy efficient as advertised. Power houses have to generate electricity, but most of the countries don't want to have nuclear power. Since China don't care about the nature, and pollution, but profits, under umbrella of clean EVs.they generate profit from sales. Also, recycling of batteries is a huger technological problem. Issue no 3 value of usesd, second hand modern EV are less than 50% in 2-3 years! Who wants it?
While your commentary is generally insightful, your criticisms of Toyota’s continued (limited) use of NiMH batteries comes from a narrow perspective. Toyota is in a unique position for two reasons. First, it introduced the first ICE-electric hybrid car in 1997, and continues to make the most efficient hybrid drivetrain, with a planetary gear system. A hybrid car uses its battery to capture a limited amount of energy from regenerative braking. So, it doesn’t need a large capacity. The Gen 4 Prius hybrid has a 1.3 kWH NiMH battery weighing 85 lbs. In a 3,500 lb vehicle, reducing the battery weight by 50 lbs going to a Lithium battery is not economically compelling. Toyota has a very cleverly nuanced battery strategy. Its Gen 4 Plugin-Prius is essentially the same as the Gen 4 Hybrid Prius. The key difference is the 85 lb m, 1.3 kWH NiMH battery is replaced by a 4.4 kWH Lithium battery weighing 180 lbs. Toyota decided that the Lithium battery made more sense at the 4.4 kWH plugin hybrid requirement, while the NiMH made more sense at the smaller 1.3 kWH non-plugin hybrid requirement. Any other car manufacturer might have chosen Lithium for both hybrid and plugin hybrid, but that leads us to Toyota’s second uniqueness. Toyota continued to invest in NiMH battery technology long after GM stopped its investment in the late 1990s. Thus, Toyota squeezed out a lot more performance (and cost reductions) from NiMH batteries than any other car manufacturer. While early Lithium batteries were going through growing pains, Toyota’s NiMH batteries were humming along, going unnoticed because of their low cost and high reliability. Another benefit of the maturity of NiMH batteries is they are 100% recyclable, unlike Lithium batteries. Last, but not least, Toyota has uniquely diversified its battery supply chain. If there’s a prolonged disruption in Lithium battery supply, Toyota’s NiMH hybrids are not directly affected, and they have options that other’s don’t. In summary, Toyota made a substantial investment in NiMH early on, and continues to benefit from it, economically, today. Even as their higher battery capacity cars have transitioned to Lithium, Toyota, unlike any other car manufacturer, is well positioned to benefit from a mix of NiMH and Lithium battery chemistries.
I have a 2024 rav4 prime we get up early in the morning 5 am that’s when we charge it up. Full charge take 2 and a half hours it’s done at 7 30 am. We live in a small town in mn. Only 2 miles from town we go in a couple of times a day so we only have to charge up every 3 or 4 days. We always switch over to gas when we get on the hyway over 30 mpg at 70 mph. Why would we want to use electric on the highway. We will wait until 2026 when Toyota puts an lfp battery in the rav4 electric before we use electric on the highway. Convenience we only waist time at the gas station never charging the rav4.
Yet another break through game changing battery, that never becomes reality, because it doesn't exist. If I received 1 dollar for every time I hear about these so called improved batteries I would have become a millionaire by now, lol. Batteries have platued in both power output and range. You can not beat physics!!! There is only so much density and power that a battery can store for any given cell size. You can't squeeze more out of a cell then the physical properties of the materials used allow. The only way to improve this anymore is by either inventing or the discovery of a totally new material. After 20 plus years battery tech has not improved hardly at all. Batteries have become bigger to handle the bigger useage required. With current tech unless you make the batteries even bigger you will not be able to get more power or range. 20 plus years and no one has made a break through battery, no one. It is just a fantasy and pipedream. Better to stick to making better and cleaner fuels for ice cars. The tech is already well developed and engines can be converted easily to run on a variety of fuels.
Thank you, a factual statement. The EV fanboys live in fantasy world. Remember though, the eviking needs content so these videos will never end. If any of these so-called breakthroughs ever materialize, they're like 20 years down the road.
This was one of the worst comments I have read for a long time. When ICE development has almost stopped and billions are invested in battery technology. The batteries have evolved enormously the last 20 years. Todays batteries cost a fraction of what they did then, can charge at much higher power, and last much longer. Due to this improvements batteries has entered the exponential phase, also reinforced by the exponential growth of PV solar panels. More production => lower prices => improved demand => even more production and so on.
@@perperers2502 Yep. And by "cost a fraction of what they did then", think around 95% cheaper, and getting cheaper by the day; by 2030, with the price drops expected of batteries until then, EVs are likely to be significantly cheaper than ICE cars even without any kind of subsidy or incentive.
@@perperers2502Hmm battery technology enormously evolving I don't agree yes energy density to weight ratio has greatly increased with different chemistries but they still have limitations on charge and discharge speed . High speed charging is limited to the available charge current and the higher the current the more heat produced and heat is wasted energy. Longevity issues also arise when batteries are cycled hard which ultimately leads to cell failure and it only takes one cell failure in a series string to cripple that string and the cost to repair is prohibitive so become waste and only a percentage is recyclable at quite a high cost . Take the humble 12 volt automotive car battery back in about 1960 these batteries were mostly what they referred to as tar tops and lasted at least 10-15 years and even after they failed they were easily refurbished at a fraction of the cost of a replacement . The tar that sealed the top of the battery was sliced out and the cells were lifted out and replaced , nothing was wasted as the cell plates were melted down on-site and new plates cast,acid was collected filtered and reused and even the tar was melted down and reused to reseal the battery no expensive electronics or gadgets required.
A question: the magnetic field in EV automobiles bad on human tissue, great for plants. Very bad on living tissue. The EV produces a magnetic field in compartment carrier. The gas automobile only produces the Magnetic field in engine compartment. A way from people. When you drive a EV for several hours, same as living under power lines. They do not build homes near power lines. Only Parks, plant nurseries, and equipment storage.
What is pointless is worrying about charging rates on a Phev! The whole Phev concept is based on taking it on a trip and not worry about the chargers while taking advantage of EV drive and savings around town. You certainly won’t save money charging on the road. A “pointless” video.
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Thanks for the heads up, Sam, but I think you should explain C ratings better. Some people still don't understand that charging power needs to be seen in relation to battery size. Saying that a certain chemistry can take 600 kW makes no sense unless you specify battery size. Applying 150 kW to a 15 kWh PHEV battery is just as brutal as charging a 100 kWh EV at one megawatt; both will be 10 C.
Volts too
In Brazil, going fully electric is challenging due to the lack of fast chargers. The best option for now is hybrid vehicles, especially flex hybrids that run on ethanol or gasoline in any proportion. Personally, I only use ethanol because it’s better for the environment and cheaper.
Brazil gets 60% of their electricity from hydro and 20% from wind and solar. Hopefully BYD will set up a factory in Brazil and build affordable EV's. Electric cars are better than ethanol made from sugar cane. Brazil needs to adopt electric cars and have a mass build out of EV charging stations as soon as possible.
Unless you are compulsive road trippers, fast chargers are not really a solution - it is an aid tool, a temporary patch for people not used to EV usage pattern. Over 4 months of owning EV, I only use them 3 times, and all of that time is because I still haven't got chargers at home. My daily commute is 13-16 km back and forth (an average total of 30 km per day). Fast chargers ruins your battery for not so much gain or time savings. Not to mention that they impose premium 50-100% more expensive rate per kW than home electricity usage.
You better off plugging into slow 7 kW chargers at work (if they have any), start from 8 AM, plug it in while your battery is at 25% and return home at 5 PM with full 100% 60 kW battery that should give you 320 km range at worst, 360 km on average, and 510 km on constant coasting / cruising traffic.
The best way to own EV is to install your own home chargers and totally enjoy that off-peak electricity discount, where in Indonesia you can enjoy up 30% more savings on top of 400% typical savings you already get with EV.
Bombastic savings number, I know, but the expensive EV price will take up all those savings in addition to the less maintenance cost and tax bonus - you ended up with the same number as you did if you buy normal gasoline car. You just waste less time taking a detour and queue at gas stations.
Going hybrid in 2020 is like 15-20 years too late isn't it? Not good enough being ICE car, not good enough for EV. Unless you live really far (like 40-50 km away from work), it doesn't make any sense to force that overburdened gasoline engine to carry along heavy batteries. The hybrid compromise would cost you 40% more than a pure EV setup (in case of BYD Qin Plus PHEV vs BYD Atto 3 BEV).
Except ethanol is made with corn, which if you recall when the US first did that created an extreme shortage in the Mexico and Central America maybe not in Brazil, but Mexico literally had some food right at the time. Anytime you come early human food to non-edible uses, you need to replace the food in the food chain but I’m more farmland or whatever.
@@yohannessulistyo4025 I agree with a lot of your post, but why being so negative on fast chargers? I've got an eight year warranty on my battery, much longer than I will keep the car, and it has no restriction on DC charging. I live in an appartment and normally charge twice a week on a MER DC charger near where I live. It's not superfast, 80 kW, but I only charge between 35 and 65 kWh (of course it's not the case when on travel) following an advice from a battery developer on RUclips. He also downplayed the need to avoid DC charging. The real killer for the battery is charging it to 100%, or drawing it down to zero, and keeping it in that state for a long time.
I have two subscriptions, one for the MER network because I have one station nearby, and one Ionity Passport for longer trips, making fast charging really cheap for me as a frequent user. On Ionity I pay 3.50 SEK/kWh ($0.33) plus 136 SEK/month for the subscription. Without subscription it cost 8.70 SEK/kWh. On MER it's time dependent. On midday or after 8 PM (off peak hours) the price is 3.05 SEK/kWh with subscription, and on high consumption hours it's 3.60 SEK/kWh. For me as a high milage traveller it's a lot cheaper than a petrol or diesel car as the fuel taxes are so high in Europe.
@@gregkelmis2435Brazil’s ethanol is made primarily from sugar cane. It’s much more efficient than corn and is over abundant there. It makes way more sense to use as a fuel source in their economy.
With US corn, the food versus fuel argument is overblown. While I’m sure that there are complications from the land displaced to grow the corn rather than better food sources, the corn used for ethanol is a non-human food source. It’s used as a cheap feed for livestock, reducing the price of our meat, and the feed (distiller’s grain) is a byproduct of making ethanol. You get the fuel and the feed without wasting one or the other.
Mass corn growing in the US isn’t good for the environment by any means. It’s got environmental pros and cons even comparing it to oil and gasoline, but it does serve multiple purposes in our economy. For starters, if it went away we would have to replace it with another livestock food source on the mass scale that our current agricultural system requires.
If you can charge a 30kWh PHEV battery as you get in the Shark 6 at 150kW, then you could recharge in about 12 minutes. That's not much longer than filling up with fuel. Which means you could fill up your charge on the road.
Correct
It still doesn't make much sense. 30kWh battery in a truck will probably only go 100km, and you can still only charge to 80% quickly. Meaning you are sitting around for 15 minutes for 80km. You may as well just had and go unless you are stopping somewhere for lunch anyway.
It's similar with my Outlander PHEV. It has a fast charge port but charging it on public chargers is only slightly less expensive than petrol so it almost never makes sense to do unless you are stopping for something else anyway.
You're buying an phev, use gas for longer trip! That's why EV owner in China hates about these phev with slow charging speed
Hmmmm now I have an image of pulling up, inserting a fuel pump and an electrical cable at the same time when I visit the servo. Bit risky...
I love your channel Sam. All the best to you and your family. Quick fact check on this video. The 2024 plug-in hybrids from Toyota no longer use nickel metal hydride batteries. Although I don’t have the exact chemistry, they use some form of lithium ion. Adding that to this video would make it a bit more credible. Keep up the good work!
Informative and entertaining.
Thanks Mate!
You get to drag around a petrol motor and fuel with a tiny slow charging EV battery and then bonus, carry that wee battery and electric motors with the petrol engine. Sounds great. You also get to maintain the petrol engine AND replace the sub par small battery. Where do I sign?
A good, efficient PHEV with an empty battery can still be an excellent hybrid and can, in the mountains for instance, still benefit from the bigger buffer AND the greater regen power compared to a normal hybrid. Toyota RAV4 and Ford Escape are very good at this sort of thing. Thing is, this works until a certain battery size...like say 15-20KWh....bigger than that gives you faster charging but also the weight penalty with an empty battery really starts to take its toll. If you want facts, look up the ecodriver youtube channel, he has done quite a bit of testing with these kind of scenario's.
@Viking, very insightful and informative presentation explaining the new hybrid tech and what it is all about and how it fits in. Keep up your great work, that's why I follow you everyday.
Thanks Mate! Glad you're enjoying the content.
Hybrid batteries like this is the way to go. One for short term frequent use and direct delivery, the other for longer storage.
The battery then shuffles charge between the two systems.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
@@protagonist9716 range is not the only issue the pure EV solve: cost of ownership for hybrid is similar if not higher than combustion engines. Hybrid adds to the complexity of combustion engines the complexity of electric systems.
In effect the sodium are the primary battery for charge/discharge and the LFPs act as the long term store but the packs in the battery are mixed AB cell arrangements - the battery management system manages the balancing between the cells. From the car's motor/charger perspective the whole battery is seen as a unit, one type of battery isn't used for one particular purpose over the other type (it's up to the BMS to determine how the electrons flow into and out of the battery packs).
With so many breakthroughs on an almost weekly basis, we're going to see these new batteries in EVs in a couple of months, right?
nah they never make it to market because a new battery gets invented, then that one never makes it to market because a newer battery was invented, and we end up with lots of youtube content but no batteries? Thats not whats going to happen...
A Chinese carmaker takes 18 months to bring a new car into production. Legacy carmakers take 40 months. So the time it takes between a battery being ready for sale and it being incorporated into EV designs is roughly that much.
This, BTW, is part of the reason the EVs from legacy carmakers are usually worse than the ones from good Chinese brands; since legacy carmakers take almost two years more to design and release a new model, this means that the tech in a brand new model from a legacy carmaker is almost two years older than the tech in a brand new Chinese model.
@@mikejones-vd3fg CATL is not joking. They don't boast about solid batteries like Toyota that they can never mass-produce. At the beginning of last year, they launched Shenxing batteries, and the 2024 Zeekr 001 was equipped with them. Since then, many auto influencers have tested their charging speed, which is really impressive.
@@CatsMeowPaw Degradation testing for a 10 year battery takes at least a couple of years.
it is getting like graphics cards... top end and in 6 months its outdated and 2nd best 😅
However in very cold climates it might actually offer better range.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
China, India, Middle East , ASEAN large markets are all going by hybrids. If you buy a hybrid with excellent electric range along with a gas tank then it's much more appealing in these regions to have dual systems for propulsion. This is what people demand in Asia where EV infrastructure is taking time to develop. It will make the electrification transition quicker
That statement only plays true if BEV batteries were standing still, which they are definitely not. So if comparing a new PHEV targetted battery it's more valid to compare with a new BEV targetted battery, such as those mentioned by Sam in the video.
You sound like someone who likes giving his money to oil companies
@@GruffSillyGoat
Your statement would hold true only if engine efficiency wasn't increasing but that fact that it is with both Geely and BYD tooting most efficient engines. Therefore an increase in efficiency both forms propulsion integrated into a hybrid makes it most versatile and is reflected even in China where plug in hybrids sales growth is 70% YoY Vs ~25% for Pures.
The fact they pollute the air Is the problem so I think you are a bit lost having a lump of aluminium alters the balance and weight and will always reduce efficiency 😂 you are being silly
I'll replace my Vegemite with those sodium batteries. YUMMY!
Thanks for setting the record straight, Sam. And I'll never buy a Toyota.
If I get that right, it means you use your PHEV like a EV for daily commute. You can fast charge it for ten minutes and have 40 miles or so?. Then, on long trips, you stop to fast charge your battery and to fill your gas tank as well? I think maybe the advantage would come if it is cheaper than existing ones. Not at the same price. Cheers!
400 km range says CATL. That's better than a lot of pure BEVs. The petrol engine costs money, its weight lowers battery range, and for many customers is unnecessary. The use case is a few customers who make very long trips in areas where there are no charging stations?
Surely most customers will prefer BEVs? Cheaper and better.
The 400 km range depends on the size of the battery used in the comparison by CATL, although given the announcement also states the new battery provides a 10% increased range indicating it was being compared to a base 360 km range battery, which today would equate to a 64kWh standard LFP battery today. A 360 km range vechicle today would most likely be a BEV rather than a PHEV, which tend to have a max range currently of around 140 km with a 20kWh battery; or even an EREV, such as those from Li Auto, with a range of 212 km from a 37kWh battery.
However, the Freevoy battery isn't targetting BEVs as there are already better options available for this use that outperform in both range and charging ability, both as LFP and high-nickel ternary chemistries, with higher energy densities and faster charge rates; from many battery makers such as CATL, BYD, Tesla, Panasonic, LG Chem etc. This will become more apparent as BEVs swap from gen1 to gen2 cells (and in some cases gen 2 to 3 cells). Although, ICE price-parity BEVs using smaller batteries with later gen cells are also appearing on the market.
The aim of the Freevoy battery is to reduce to cost of PHEV and EREV hybrids to a level comparable or cheaper to pure ICE and HEVs, so they don't get squeezed out by the lowering BEV prices, offering a cheaper battery option that supports a wider range of markets via a wider temperature range. The LFPs in the battery are probably being used to optimise weight as Sodium is heavier than LFP (and many high nickle chemistry configurations), so as to reduce weight impact on overall efficiency. The actual size of pack used in PHEV/EREV may well be smaller than the 400 km example in the announcement, to reduce cost and vehicle weight further.
The Sodium is doing the heavy lifting here in extending the usable temperature range, and likely used to drive pre-conditioning to warm up the LFP cells before they kick in to take load or charge. The sodium batteries are likely also used as high rate charging buffers to speed up charging, due to their higher power C rates, for a section of the crange curve before the LFPs charging degrades in at a slower rate (or shuffle charged from the sodium cells). The 10 minute / 280 km faster charging indicates that faster charging occurs for 70% of the battery pack range, indicating that the final 30% is slower with the LFPs are driving the remaining charge pace.
Great content
Here in Thailand it gets HOT 40c at times , ALL batteries have hot temp probs .
Phev main disadvantages are low EV range (smaller benefits in charging) and a good home charger cost a lot compared to the benefit
I'll welcome anything using Sodium ion as that's the technology that will inevitably dominate grid storage and shut up the FUD about not enough Lithium. It just needs the economy of scale from cars to get going.
I just retired in Thailand where BYD have just opened a new factory. I took a look at the Sealion hybrid which looks like anyother SUV and it feels good to drive but I guess I should do a little more research on battery types and their pros and cons. The thing is, i'm a carpenter not an electronics engineer. 🤫😂
Just think of the benefits... You still have to put gas in it... and it probably still catches fire if it gets in a crash... We're right on it here at industrial revolution Central.
Toyota buying CATL's batteries and BYD's PHEV assemblies seems like a positive step for the company; they're admitting that someone else makes better, cheaper technology. A Toyota Rav4 Prime that goes 50 or more miles in EV mode, and another 400 miles in ICE mode, seems like a very appealing vehicle for the near future at least.
I bet it charges really slow
Phev ,down side is partially ICE and EV s .ICE Cost factors difficult to "reduce" to be profitable eventually for manufacturers.? Yes or no?
It only has to charge overnight.
@@asleytamkei7507 It’s a matter of scale. Toyota seems to have cracked the code on both cost and reliability but they are the only ones.
Hybrid vehicles are looking better and better as a way to bridge the gap between full electrification and ice. These new batteries also sound great for terrestrial storage as well!
Is there a gap that needs to be filled?
@@bobwallace9753 Yes for towing, cold climates, long drives in remote areas such as Alaska, and laggards that irrationally hate EVs
@@RyanWilmot
Possibly for towing. But how many people frequently tow large loads long distance? Most towing, my guess, is to the closest place to launch your boat. Or the camping spot close to home so you don't waste a lot of your weekend time on the road.
Not likely for cold weather. The Tesla Y loses about the same amount of range as an ICEV in cold weather. On a long trip in sub-freezing weather you might have to stop one extra time for charging. People should keep records of the actual lost time spent charging vs. money saved. For most people, you're paying yourself well over $100 per hour.
Remote areas will get rapid chargers. I don't know if one can conveniently drive the AlCan highway in an EV, but it will become possible. And I suspect few people realize how short, in miles, most remote driving is.
There were some people who continued to use horses well after cars and tractors were a better option. I used to help my grandfather harness his team and I drove the hay wagon and rock sledge as a young boy. My grandfather was a laggard because he couldn't stand the idea of his beloved horses going to the dog food factory. People sometimes have reasonable reasons for lagging, some are just cantankerous.
@@bobwallace9753 there’s not enough manufacturing capacity in the world to provide EV’s for everyone right now, so the adoption curve is a really good thing. it gives companies like Tesla the time they need to ramp up and to create new supply chains . Also, currently many people who live in apartments have a hard time with charging, which needs more time to be solved as well. That will happen slowly as EV’s become more common. But for now, plug-in hybrids are a great option for people who don’t see an EV as a good fit for their specific situation, which right now is the vast majority of people in the United States.
Sodium is the future of EV and power grid batteries. Ubiquty of super charging networks will ensure that EV takeup is massive.
Sodium is the future of grid storage.
And Aluminum will be the future of EVs.
Stationary storage not transport …too heavy
Metal-Air batteries will likely be the future for mobility as these address more types of vehicles and offer the higher specific energy density.
Both Zinc-Air and Lithium-Air are getting serious attention due to this very high energy density (currently 1700 Wh/kg achieved with Lithium and 800 Wh/kg for Zinc ) with 4,000 to 6,000 Wh/kg expected to be available for Lithium soon. They're not in general use today due to their current lower life cycle (< 1,000 cycles) but processes and techniques learned from other chemistries are being applied to Metal-Air with good results, accelerating their innovation rate.
Unfortuantely, Aluminium-Air batteries are primary cells so not rechargable; although, the same was thought true of Zinc-Air till relatively recently.
Iron-Air will also be used in grid storage in addition to Sodium as it provides longer duration storage.
Sodium Ion(SIB/NTM) battery has a thermal runaway of 511C vs 180C for LFP vs 140C for NCM. Higher the temperature(degree C) lower the chances of thermal runaway.🤔
does it mean its more likely to catch fire? due to high C, assuming all else being equal?
12:30 yeah dragging the massively heavy battery around 😄 Yes and you are dragging the Inverter the electric motor as well 100-200Kg. And while using the battery you are dragging the Engine, Radiator, starting motor, exhaust pipes, the gear shift, tank + fuel, etc.. get it... 400-500 kg This why I said million times Plug in hybrids DO NOT MAKE SENSE at all... They are crazy concepts. Especially nowadays with current battery tech.
Thank you. Hybrids have all the problems of EVs and ICE cars combined.
@@ohger1 yes I say this from the beginning. Toyota Prius was a big hit 10+ years ago. Back then sort of made sense. Until I saw the weight data.... Yes double maintenance, yearly oil changes... And basically in electric or petrol mode you carry dead weight..
I think popularity is based on human psychology we tend to choose the known thing. Most of us can make only baby steps forward, full electric is too drastic change for many people...
@@ohger1 --Hybrids can overcome the disadvantages of full BEVs and ICEVs. Lower prices and no range anxiety. Can go anywhere even if there aren't any fast charging stations in remote areas. The engine is rarely used and therefore needing almost no maintenance. Rarely needing oil changes and never need spark plug change. No brakes maintenance, ever.
It would be better if we had a division between city and country cars. A city car can have a small battery and so be very light and cheap. Rent a long range country car when you need it.
In china the charging infrastructure is still lacking in wide areas. With the available PHEV and 25 or 40kwh battery packs, you can fully electric in the city for +100km and still do motorway trips, without the fear to be stranded, because the chargers don’t work again or are too slow . 30kw/h chargers are still too many there.
Would be great to hear your latest thoughts on Quantumscape news yesterday of progress with shipping B samples.
4C means the battery can be charged in 15 minutes, theoretically if the onboard charger and fast charger support it
Whatever pushes production of battery cells forward.
I don't think hybrids is a great idea, but it seems like an ok entry point for those who scared of EVs.
Hybrids have generally been wrongly engineered from the git go.
For the masses, the engine should run a generator powering electric wheel motors and have batteries for 50 miles range.
The other use of hybrids would be have electric motors powering the A/C and/ or a super/ turbo charger providing a brief boost in power.
Edison motors has the right idea.
Really interesting re Toyota, but what is your thoughts on non plug in Toyota hybrids?
I would love to be able to take my 2012 Prius and change out the battery for something much longer lasting. I end up driving a lot in the city at slow driving speeds because of traffic and if I could use the battery for the majority that I'd hardly use any gas. I'm not sure how easy that is to do though
the new ecoflow alternator battery system will help you? you can put a cooler size ecoflow battery on wheels into trunk and charge it for 7 days of fridge power in 2 hours of driving a normal vehicle with an alternator
The issue with sodium Ion batteries is the voltage range during the discharge cycle. It's a wide range...very wide, whereas Lifepo4 chemistries are dead on 3 volts for 80% of the cycle.
This has already been solved with semi conductor devices. This isn't a problem at all.
Toyota and Subaru, get these into your cars asap. 😅
4C is more accurate than xxx km/h
4C at 80kwh means 320kw
Must admit, I never charge my PHEV other than at home or friends/family if we go away and stay over.
The newer PHEVs with 20kw batteries, yes, but these are only just coming out.
Unless that's the intended market? But bear in mind charging needs to be cheap otherwise it''s better to just use petrol.
Yep, the only case for a PHEV is if you can fast charge the battery on the road. Otherwise lugging around a battery you can't recharge is fairly pointless.
Viking is actually downplaying this battery range because if hybrid batteries achieve a RANGE close to Pures then his mantra of Pures are better will take a hit. On CATL website it clearly states this is the world's first hybrid battery to achieve over 400km of CLTC range and this is due to improvement in algorithms, System on Chip (Soc) control accuracy and improvement in pure electric utilisation rate. It therefore means density is not the only paremeter which increases range and thus websites reporting on this news with more RANGE are correct.
It's not pointless at all. Take for example BYD sealion 6. It has an electric only range of 80 km. If someone wants take a road trip once a month they can easily go upto 1000 km without any charger anxiety. And do daily driving with cheap and electricity.
If you need to routinely charge on the road, you don’t buy a PHEV to begin with.
It remains to be seen whether the 400km battery pack will be used in PHEV/EREV at it's full 400km capacity - other commercial factors may come into play for the automakers. Using the figures in the announcement this seems ot equate to a 64kWh AB battery being used (achieving 400km rather than 360km).
The BMS design from the announcement seems to optimise the benefits of the high power rate of sodium with the lower weight of the LFP, to give an AB cell design battery pack that has fast initial charge rates (280km stated would be 0 to 70%) before the LFPs throttle the remaining 30% rate. Given the details stated is seems CATL may be using their gen 1 sodium cells (160 Wh/kg) along side their similar rated gen 1.5/2 LFPs (which would make AB cell balancing easier to perform). The gen 2 sodium and gen 2/3 LFPs (at 200 Wh/kg) announced earlier this year will probably be an increment in the next itteration.
The extended temperature range description hints that the sodium cells are being used to pre-condition (heating and state of charge) the LFPs to perform better at load/charge handling, although at some energy/range cost. The pack cell designed stated suggests the the bms performs charge shuttling from the Sodium cells into the LFP, acting as charge/load buffers.
The weight of the pack isn't mentioned, which would impact BEV usage, but the LFP appears to be being used to optimise the higher weight of the Sodum cells. The configuration also appears optimised for PHEV/EREV as the cars are already heavy and the mixed Sodium/LFP would add additional weight that could be addressed else where (particularly for Series PHEV or EREV, using a small ICE generator and removing ICE traction parts).
BEVs, based on CATL's other battery offerings, it seems CATL are segmenting the market and will likely offer gen2/3 cells (either LFP or ternary dependign upon a cars power requirements) to enable higher pure EV range advantage using higher density cells (260+ Wh/kg). This allows automakers a choice of high capacity premium/long-range BEV models with significantly more range (600km+) or reducing battery size/weight to increase efficiency with more affordable BEV models (400km+). The Freevoy batteries likely will sit just below these ranges for their electrified propulsion.
I don't know every model, but the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV and the Toyota RAV4 PHEV have Li-Ion batteries, not NiMH.
The faster the charge the higher the current from the grid x by the number of charges in use. The grid cannot provide it
1st (after the bots!)
I’ve heard that catl have been closing factories
They could be. They have also been opening new factories.
Old ones replaced by bigger faster better ones would make sense right?
Great content, as always! I need some advice: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (alarm fetch churn bridge exercise tape speak race clerk couch crater letter). What's the best way to send them to Binance?
We have had a Toyota Rav 4 Prime 2023 model for 1.5 years, getting 50 miles if Im really easy on it of just electric range (18KW and avg is 3.1 miles per... It has a LiOn battery and takes longer than advertised to charge but has been a good car. I gotta say I would love in a few years to be able to swap out the batt and charging HW for a 3x or 5x of range version (once energy density is high enough to allow it to fix in the same space etc.) that can charge on DC (Rav4 can't) and much faster charge speeds. DO you think this would ever be possible inexpensively?!
So the bottom line is you can go further in less time when it’s cold.
150 kW charging will result in a wild C-factor? What will that do to lifespan?
What do you guys think will be the role of Lithium based batteries in 15-30 years. You think it will completely be replaced? Or just complimented?
Oct 21: "Amid a challenging economic environment and declining market demand in China, the lithium battery industry is facing significant struggles, including overcapacity, low utilization rates, excess inventory, and continuous declines in product prices. These issues have forced many companies, including industry leaders, to halt production.
Industry analysts suggest that the sector has entered a period of consolidation, with expectations of large-scale production cuts and many companies exiting the market in the near future."
CATL halts a part of manufacturing despite Sept 29, according DongChang FD, factory fire destroys manufacturing site about 32 acres in common.
That, frankly, is bullocks. The demand for batteries in China, both for EVs and for other uses, is growing at double digits YoY. And while the overall car market is slightly down, that is due to ICE and regular hybrids; the electric part of the car market is also growing at double digits YoY. China is on track to surpass 10 million NEVs sold locally this year (some 99.9% of which are either BEVs or large battery PHEVs, with a few hydrogen cars there just to be the butt of jokes about stupidity).
Well, apart from declining product prices. The Chinese, including CATL, are very aggressively pursuing production improvements that can reduce their costs - and passing those cost reductions to their customers. That is not much of a problem when the market is growing much faster than prices are falling, though (unless you are a non-Chinese company trying to enter the market, as every time prices fall it makes it even harder for new entrants, like Northvolt, to reach profitability).
So why don't EV companies compartmentalise their batteries so they are smaller, easier to charge but your car has 2 or 3 separate ones. And you can switch between?
In 20 years we will have data of durability and reliability of these things. For now it's just words and I learned a long time ago to not trust in words. Oh and if an EV can't last at least 15 years then it's not for me.
Agree, and really, you don't need to own and keep a car for 15 years to be affected by life. If you keep a car, say, 12 years and it has a calendar age lifespan of 15, the value of the car really drops. I drive a 14 year old Ford Escape as our second car (we have one fairly new and one cheap car) and it's in no danger of becoming inert simply by virtue of age regardless of the mileage.
It doesn’t take 15 years to drive an electric car. Taxis can run tens of thousands of kilometers in a year, and hundreds of thousands of kilometers in a few years.
@@疯狂宇宙-y6x Yes usage is an important factor, but time is also a factor in determining the car and specially the battery lifespan. Also I'm not a taxi driver. So I really want to know the feedback from 15 year EV users. So I will not jump on this EV bandwagon for at the very least 10-15 years as words alone won't convince me.
"Hybrid" battery
Yes that wont totally cause consumer confusion.
The marketing of that is meant for carmakers, not customers; you would expect whoever a carmaker designates to deal with suppliers of the single most important component in an EV, including PHEVs with large batteries, to fully understand what they are buying.
They're also know as AB Batteries (due to have two types of cells mixed in the packs), this will probably be the term adopted to reduce confusion.
Love the content. 100% but please not Jeely. It's a G Geely.
Please discuss ecatthenewfire
Toyota PHEV’s don’t use NiMH. Only the regular hybrids.
PHEV’s are really designed best to work plugged in overnight where you can get a full charge for max ev range. Fast charging a PHEV for 60 to 80kms range is a waste of your time. Charging my Outlander on a DC fast charger takes 38min for 80% and 70min for 98%. 70min for 60 to 80 kms is ridiculous and when you take into account the higher price of using fast chargers there is no financial benefit. Use PHEV’s what they were designed for, charge overnight every night.
fast charging damages PHEV batteries and shortens their lifespan, PHEVs are meant to slow-charge at home for short trips and use petrol for long trips.
as for "why people buy them" its really a vote of no-confidence in the government's ability to keep power prices low, and a vote of no-confidence in the international oil market. sales of the outlander PHEV "ES" model are very low compared to all other outlander PHEV models, largely because people really really want the V2L capability that the more expensive models provide, its a guarantee that you've got 1.5kw of 240v AC power everywhere you go, whether you're camping in the middle of nowhere or on a road trip, or at home during a blackout. many campsites have banned petrol generators too, so having 240v outlets in your car is a great way to get around that restriction.
and unfortunately mitsubishi still haven't caught on, which is why they're still not offering a larger inverter as standard on all outlander PHEVs, and still haven't produced a portable V2L system that can pull 5-10kw from an outlander and turn it into 240V-AC, even though everyone who chose an "ASPIRE" over an "ES" has literally paid over $6000 extra just to have those power outlets.
i get that mitsubishi is a car company not a power company, but its almost like a burger joint that doesn't sell chips, BYD sells very cheap V2L adapters and from what i can tell it is a deciding factor in some purchases, mitsubishi need catch up, by rushing their V2G/V2H/V2L program and releasing a portable V2L adapter ASAP.
Difficult to reduce phev costs ? Major c9st advantage of pure EV period? Wanna disagree? Economics reasoning behind?
@@asleytamkei7507 PHEVs are more expensive to buy because the engineering required for a PHEV powertrain is more complex than most people realise, their engines need to be able to withstand more frequent cold starts. to be more specific, more components need to run on electricity (oil pumps, water pumps, etc) because those components need to be able to operate while the petrol engine isn't running, to minimise damage during cold starts.
pure EVs are cheaper to buy, and cheaper to run if you're set up for them, I.E. you can charge at home every time, have solar and batteries so your cost per kwh is below 10c/kwh. charging them at 30c/kwh has a per km cost half that of petrol, whereas at 60c/kwh you're paying more per km than if you used petrol.
buying a PHEV isn't about cost savings, ordinary hybrids are the cheapest vehicles to run (by a wide margin), specifically the new swift hybrid and camry hybrid get 3.5L/100km which is on par with home charging an EV at 30c/kwh, an EV is superior to them only if you've got solar panels and a home battery system, and they're already paid for.
if you're buying a solar/battery setup just to charge an EV, you're adding $15k to the cost on top of the purchase price of the EV, which will already be more expensive than the camry/swift hybrid.
i'd only recommend buying a PHEV to people who live in warm climates and go camping frequently, or live in areas where grid power is unreliable.
if you live in a warm climate and have a solar/battery setup, buy an EV. they're great IF you can mitigate the downsides, which basically requires you to already own your own home.
if you're not "upper middle class" and want the best cheap option, buy a prius/camry/swift hybrid. traditional cheap hybrid cars blow everything else out of the water. the only downside to them is you can't run on pure electric when "global supply chain disruption" causes the fuel price to triple, which could very easily happen if iran gets involved in a war and decides to blockade the persian gulf.
I drove a friend's Toyota RAV 4 hybrid 2022 for a month (back in 2022). They were in short supply and highly sort after (to the degree where after 12 months on the road it was sold for the same price it was bought for new... by a car auction company!)
My experience? Did not like it at all, had and caused a lot of problems, and definitely not economical. Not even close to being worth the money.
I highly doubt they have a fully working sodium battery. it is really hard to make it work. even if they have one, it won't last long, due to it's inherent issues.
Hybrids are an unfortunate half-way house originally (I believe) intended to be viable until battery tech could deliver 300+miles of range. But guess what? they do right now. Unless you live somewhere where the charging infrastrucure is not good, then Hybrids are redundant.
1C minds literally "to charge or discharge the whole capacity per 1 hour" . So 4C it is a quarter of a hour i.e. 15 minutes. It is irrelevant to the "kWt".
That would be peak charge/discharge rate, mind. A 4C battery can typically reach that kind of speed for the fast charge range (often between 20% and 80% charge), but has to slow down when too close to empty or full, so fully charging a 4C battery takes more than a quarter of an hour.
Didn't CATL's battery plant just burn down?
I give this comment about 30 seconds before it gets pulled. Lmao
You've managed 16 minutes and counting !
You know that CATL has far more than one plant, right? Even if that one was a total loss (it was not) it wouldn't reduce CATL's production capacity by much, the same way that a single McDonald's restaurant burning down wouldn't be much of an issue for the McDonald's company.
Heck, more than one in every 3 EV batteries in the world are from CATL. That is how big they are.
@@FabioCapela i saw the videos, it was a total loss. I understand they have many production facilities. With what happened in Korea, this technology is potentially quite dangerous. I certainly don't want one in my garage.
@@chris-t-4569 First, the fire affected a single building at a large manufacturing base that has dozens of buildings. Even if it was a total loss of that one building (which the company says wasn't the case) it would have little impact on the production of even that single site, which is just only one of the more than a dozen that CATL operates.
Second, the fires in Korea involved a Mercedes and a Kia EVs, both of which use less safe NMC batteries. Both LFP and Sodium batteries, including those this video is about, are much safer; it's almost impossible to make them catch fire, and even if they do catch fire they are likely to quickly extinguish themselves before you even have a chance to call the firefighters.
Frankly, I would rather have an EV with a modern LFP (or Sodium) battery than an ICE car in my garage. The EV is much safer (assuming it's a BEV; if it's a PHEV, well, PHEVs are as dangerous as ICE cars).
How is this battery different for PHEV vs regular EV? EXplain. I don't get it.
Most likely it is related to very cheap PHEV prices in China. It usually cost less than BEV but still has quite substantial battery capacity.
Another issue with the PHEV is that because the battery typically 3-4 times smaller than in BEV for the same performance during the acceleration and regenerative braking needs a battery that is more capable for high current. Simple speaking if the PHEV battery is 20kWh and the BEV version is 80kWh for the same performance the PHEV battery shall be designed for 4 times higher currents...
@@shafir2info Good explanation
👍👍
G'Day Sam. You should stop laughing at other web sites when you are making a HUGE error yourself. CATL batteries are highly unlikely to use SODIUM, which is a METAL that is highly explosive when it comes into contact with water. CATL probably mean SODIUM CHLORIDE (table salt) instead. A subtle difference in wording, but a HUGE difference in chemistry.
my brother in chemistry, do you have any idea what lithium is?
@@JedPotts-jv2ux Yes, Li is #3 on the periodic table. It is the lightest metal. However, I was talking about Sodium Chloride...
No point in getting excited about this battery. Within a month, the Electric Viking will announce a better one.
Seriously, how about reviewing all the “breakthroughs” you’ve covered, and projecting which one will make a market impact.
@Viking Not sure if I'm the only one but I keep on hearing you banging on your desk - I hear many strong "THUMP!" sounds as you bring down your hands. Do you think you could filter it out? It's annoying AF ... I'm using Sennheiser HD 4.40BTs and they are "calling it the way it is". Perhaps attach your mic to something else?
BTW I really enjoy your coverage and your research. Your commitment is awesome!
PHEV Fast charging is mostly nonsense. The range is just not enough to justify charging in the middle of a long distance trip. You recharge your PHEV slowly at home and drive your average daily distance on electricity.
It does make sense for countries with expensive petrol and cheap electricity
@@xlaylaylayx We have both of those but I still am not willing to stop every 50-100 km to charge my car. That short distance just doesn’t justify to time it takes to stop and charge.
You would use petrol on highway and electric when driving through urban and suburban areas (Low speed lots of breaking). This reduces petrol and electric usage significantly and with a 20 kwh plus battery would only need to be done after quite alot of driving. This is the difference between 30-40 mpg and 50 to 60 on a long trip.
Yetv another GAME CHANGER ?????
What about fire?
LFP, no fire. Add salt, no fire
why PHEV?
Holly hell???
150Kw?
My electric unicycle charges at 700W. I cannot get the charging station guys interested in providing a GPO for us.
What is the electrical environment like in an EV? Clif High says it is as savage as the inside of a micro-wave oven. What are the health consequences? Has anyone taken a frequency meter into the cab of their EV? Perhaps even a full spectrum analysis?
There is no point asking technicians about the health effect of EMF on the biological cell, they wouldn't have a clue.
I'll ask Claude to peruse the internet for me.
The need for sodium is quickly depleting as MASSIVE reserves of lithium are being found, almost every day, which will drastically reduce costs of lithium, which is superior to sodium, in every way. CATL should be focusing ALL efforts of making batteries solid state and highest capacity.
I have to disagree with you.
Sodium is superior for grid energy storage in every possible way. It can with an 80% efficiency even in -40C. Sodium batteries are much more safer. Has a fast charge and discharge rate. Also sodium doesn't need that much refining that lithium needs to go through.
Lithium batteries are mire suitable for EVs than sodium.
Not to mention some can store 1000 degrees f
PHEVs are just a car with an ICE engine and complications.
Thanks Electric ⚡️ Viking
I agree nickel, metal, hydride, batteries, or at least twice the weight of lithium ion batteries. I still use them in my devices and they are over 23 years old. Rayovac iC3 AAs. My lithium AAs are only about 7 years old.
Toyota probably brags about having BYD batteries and they’re plug-in hybrid to lower Chinese consumers into purchasing Toyotas but I do agree that BYD batteries are probably much better than the lithium ion batteries inside current Toyota plug-in hybrids. what has killed my lithium batteries is when they accidentally get drained to zero and this is why I predicted 12 years ago that there would be hybrid batteries that would be lithium ion and nickel metal hydride the nickel metal dried batteries would give up charge to prevent the lithium ion from going to zero. Obviously I was wrong.
The media has a goal and being fair and honest and accurate are not part of the goal unless it supports the agenda of the people who pay them.
Thanks Electric ⚡️ Viking
No one talks how our wonderful EV are getting this electricity from. When we had energy crisis in the Europe, Switzerland limited drastically charging EVs... Why? Because it is not so "energy efficient as advertised. Power houses have to generate electricity, but most of the countries don't want to have nuclear power. Since China don't care about the nature, and pollution, but profits, under umbrella of clean EVs.they generate profit from sales. Also, recycling of batteries is a huger technological problem. Issue no 3 value of usesd, second hand modern EV are less than 50% in 2-3 years! Who wants it?
Media fabricating things ? Says the one reporting on 5 game changing batteries each day? this bloke cannot be serious
… low on technical details :-(
While your commentary is generally insightful, your criticisms of Toyota’s continued (limited) use of NiMH batteries comes from a narrow perspective.
Toyota is in a unique position for two reasons. First, it introduced the first ICE-electric hybrid car in 1997, and continues to make the most efficient hybrid drivetrain, with a planetary gear system.
A hybrid car uses its battery to capture a limited amount of energy from regenerative braking. So, it doesn’t need a large capacity. The Gen 4 Prius hybrid has a 1.3 kWH NiMH battery weighing 85 lbs. In a 3,500 lb vehicle, reducing the battery weight by 50 lbs going to a Lithium battery is not economically compelling.
Toyota has a very cleverly nuanced battery strategy. Its Gen 4 Plugin-Prius is essentially the same as the Gen 4 Hybrid Prius. The key difference is the 85 lb m, 1.3 kWH NiMH battery is replaced by a 4.4 kWH Lithium battery weighing 180 lbs. Toyota decided that the Lithium battery made more sense at the 4.4 kWH plugin hybrid requirement, while the NiMH made more sense at the smaller 1.3 kWH non-plugin hybrid requirement.
Any other car manufacturer might have chosen Lithium for both hybrid and plugin hybrid, but that leads us to Toyota’s second uniqueness.
Toyota continued to invest in NiMH battery technology long after GM stopped its investment in the late 1990s. Thus, Toyota squeezed out a lot more performance (and cost reductions) from NiMH batteries than any other car manufacturer. While early Lithium batteries were going through growing pains, Toyota’s NiMH batteries were humming along, going unnoticed because of their low cost and high reliability.
Another benefit of the maturity of NiMH batteries is they are 100% recyclable, unlike Lithium batteries.
Last, but not least, Toyota has uniquely diversified its battery supply chain. If there’s a prolonged disruption in Lithium battery supply, Toyota’s NiMH hybrids are not directly affected, and they have options that other’s don’t.
In summary, Toyota made a substantial investment in NiMH early on, and continues to benefit from it, economically, today. Even as their higher battery capacity cars have transitioned to Lithium, Toyota, unlike any other car manufacturer, is well positioned to benefit from a mix of NiMH and Lithium battery chemistries.
Maybe the articles were AI generated.
I have a 2024 rav4 prime we get up early in the morning 5 am that’s when we charge it up. Full charge take 2 and a half hours it’s done at 7 30 am. We live in a small town in mn. Only 2 miles from town we go in a couple of times a day so we only have to charge up every 3 or 4 days. We always switch over to gas when we get on the hyway over 30 mpg at 70 mph. Why would we want to use electric on the highway. We will wait until 2026 when Toyota puts an lfp battery in the rav4 electric before we use electric on the highway. Convenience we only waist time at the gas station never charging the rav4.
Car Expert are not Battery smart are anti EV.
Why do you look like your stoned all the time
Yet another break through game changing battery, that never becomes reality, because it doesn't exist. If I received 1 dollar for every time I hear about these so called improved batteries I would have become a millionaire by now, lol. Batteries have platued in both power output and range.
You can not beat physics!!! There is only so much density and power that a battery can store for any given cell size. You can't squeeze more out of a cell then the physical properties of the materials used allow.
The only way to improve this anymore is by either inventing or the discovery of a totally new material.
After 20 plus years battery tech has not improved hardly at all. Batteries have become bigger to handle the bigger useage required. With current tech unless you make the batteries even bigger you will not be able to get more power or range. 20 plus years and no one has made a break through battery, no one. It is just a fantasy and pipedream. Better to stick to making better and cleaner fuels for ice cars. The tech is already well developed and engines can be converted easily to run on a variety of fuels.
Thank you, a factual statement. The EV fanboys live in fantasy world. Remember though, the eviking needs content so these videos will never end. If any of these so-called breakthroughs ever materialize, they're like 20 years down the road.
This was one of the worst comments I have read for a long time. When ICE development has almost stopped and billions are invested in battery technology. The batteries have evolved enormously the last 20 years. Todays batteries cost a fraction of what they did then, can charge at much higher power, and last much longer.
Due to this improvements batteries has entered the exponential phase, also reinforced by the exponential growth of PV solar panels. More production => lower prices => improved demand => even more production and so on.
@@perperers2502 Yep. And by "cost a fraction of what they did then", think around 95% cheaper, and getting cheaper by the day; by 2030, with the price drops expected of batteries until then, EVs are likely to be significantly cheaper than ICE cars even without any kind of subsidy or incentive.
@@perperers2502Hmm battery technology enormously evolving I don't agree yes energy density to weight ratio has greatly increased with different chemistries but they still have limitations on charge and discharge speed . High speed charging is limited to the available charge current and the higher the current the more heat produced and heat is wasted energy. Longevity issues also arise when batteries are cycled hard which ultimately leads to cell failure and it only takes one cell failure in a series string to cripple that string and the cost to repair is prohibitive so become waste and only a percentage is recyclable at quite a high cost . Take the humble 12 volt automotive car battery back in about 1960 these batteries were mostly what they referred to as tar tops and lasted at least 10-15 years and even after they failed they were easily refurbished at a fraction of the cost of a replacement . The tar that sealed the top of the battery was sliced out and the cells were lifted out and replaced , nothing was wasted as the cell plates were melted down on-site and new plates cast,acid was collected filtered and reused and even the tar was melted down and reused to reseal the battery no expensive electronics or gadgets required.
A question: the magnetic field in EV automobiles bad on human tissue, great for plants. Very bad on living tissue. The EV produces a magnetic field in compartment carrier. The gas automobile only produces the Magnetic field in engine compartment. A way from people. When you drive a EV for several hours, same as living under power lines. They do not build homes near power lines. Only Parks, plant nurseries, and equipment storage.
What is pointless is worrying about charging rates on a Phev! The whole Phev concept is based on taking it on a trip and not worry about the chargers while taking advantage of EV drive and savings around town. You certainly won’t save money charging on the road. A “pointless” video.