Now that solo modes have become de rigeur for many new board games, with Viticulture being a huge influence, it'd be interesting to see a 3 minute survey of various solo modes in games (comparing Viticulture/Scythe/Anachrony bot based modes to mission-based modes to cooperative-solos like Pandemic and Spirit Island).
Heh. That gag at the end - One of the modules from the original Tuscany expansion that I think was cut for both Viticulture Essential and Tuscany Essential expansions was about cheese making, so you were making both wine and cheese.
If i have a personal negative about this game, it is that it is quite safe. I can see how that makes it hugely appealing and very marketable and popular. But I found myself wishing it was a little more cut-throat or challenging at times. Weirdly, the first 3 or 4 turns i thought you had to get the wine orders exact. So was really digging the timing challenges. when I found out that wasn't the case. The game got way less intense :) This is definitely a game i recommend, and will play again. But it's not one I personally will seek to own. One of my best friends, who's copy this is, owns it, and thats fine.
Some of that was done on purpose. As pointed out here: cardboardedison.com/podcast/2019/1/6/place-of-miracles-viticulture-s1e1 he wanted to create a pleasant, romanticized version of winemaking. It also was one of his earliest game designs. I think that combination had a lot to do with how it turned out. I still see it come out at game nights out here because the theme resonates so strongly. It could be because we live so close to the Napa Valley and so many people drink wine in Northern California. If I owned the game myself, I'd definitely be opening a bottle of wine and getting out a cheese plate for everyone before we started. Jamey: "I wanted to pick a theme that was pleasant. Pleasant and universal… I wish I could say it was some very professional part of the research process, but more it was about me being in my early 20s and wanting to hang out with my friends and just have a good time at a vineyard. So it was drawing on some experiences a few years, I think I designed Viticulture when I was around 30,…(Early in the design process, the game had elements where players had to worry about things like the weather and soil quality. But he worked on the game, and he trimmed it down. He focused only on the elements that created a certain kind of experience, one that was more like the romanticized version of winemaking that he saw when he was a visitor.) I want people to have a pleasant experience when they’re playing the game. It’s also a game that’s all about progression…The experience that I was aiming for is that players always feel good when they’re doing things in Viticulture."
Noel Villarin - Ha, in many ways yes. I respect Rahdo a lot, but we have almost inverse opinions of games. I love take that, tension, and in your face play :)
Play with the Tuscany board! It adds so much more depth and planning and is just simply better (once you know the basic mechanics, the base game board is better for learning imo).
I should buy this for my cousin. He sold his winery in Hawkes Bay recently and ended up a multi-millionaire. On second thoughts he can buy it for me :-p
Sounds like you'd like the expansion which swaps the visitor decks to ones that don't grant straight victory points but instead boost your wine production.
Been a long time since I played original viticulture (without Tuscany), but I think, like Tuscany, it was very much a game whose length was dictated by the number of players, say 20-30 minutes a player. Also, the original Tuscany has a cheese expansion! It did not make Tuscany Essential Edition, apparently for good reason :-)
Weirdly, with this, welcome to dinoworld and wingpan as the next planned recaps. That's 3 games by the same artist back to back. Totally unplanned. (beth sobel)
@@3MBG Mean as, can't wait to see more, and also, what's your favorite war board game (when each player controls a faction and trays to best each other) ?
Paths of Glory. But that's a pretty high end complexity war game. It's world war I, and playing it is rough as you have to attack. But attacking sucks. It's also really interesting because you end up fighting on nearly a dozen fronts. For low complexity, probably Spheres of influence, which is hard to get but its basically "risk, but better in every way".
@@TheJimmy000 - I’m about to buy this game because we love wines. Is the theme felt throughout the game? Do you really feel like you are running a winery?
Perfect timing! i have this and only played it once. Gunna head to my cuz house this afternoon and give it a go. Appreciate the te reo used too brother. Nga mihi
I've only played brew crafters twice i think, seemed like a pretty solid game. I love its look especially with all the different brands. I think I made lots of chocolate stouts last time i played.
Ah, they migrated their music to another site recently, the licence is still fine but the links not. Here it is, i get all my music from here incompetech.filmmusic.io/song/3495-cheery-monday
It's a possible. The same friend of mine who's copy of Viticulture this is also owns brew crafters. I was considering putting it up on a poll on patreon in the future.
30 second typed review. brew crafters is a reasonably heavy euro style game with some worker placement and set collection stuff fin it. In terms of complexity its a step up from Viticulture, and a significant step at that. From my plays I was thinking there was some potentially dominant strategies when it came to selecting certain upgrades and cards, but I haven't dug in enough to confirm. I'd consider it a solid, themeatic, but not spectacular medium to heavy Euro, that leans on its theme way more than most.
Thanks. It does look good. I own viticulture, and my other favourites seem to be worker placement games, such as village and agricola. Agricola is by far my favourite game and I much prefer it over caverna for its tightness and unforgiving nature (I know saying you prefer agricola over caverna tends to be considered blasphemy in gaming circles). I like my games complex, and I hear this one is verging toward that complexity I like. Would love to playtest It, but don't know anyone who owns It!
From the description, it sounds like essential is not actually that different from regular. I've only played regular, and was curious what could be so different to make essential so much better. I still don't know haha
@@3MBG IIRC the grande worker wasn't in the original base game. It was moved over to the Essential Edition from Tuscany. Lots of ideas in Tuscany. You could also win the original edition without actually growing wine (just having wine tastings and such).
I was skeptical about the value it would add to the base game, but it makes it so much better and widens the decision space so vastly, that it's hard to go back. I have encountered few expansions that are essential, Tuscany is truly one of them.
To buy this game go here www.boardgameprices.com/prices/viticultureessential/?
Now that solo modes have become de rigeur for many new board games, with Viticulture being a huge influence, it'd be interesting to see a 3 minute survey of various solo modes in games (comparing Viticulture/Scythe/Anachrony bot based modes to mission-based modes to cooperative-solos like Pandemic and Spirit Island).
Heh. That gag at the end - One of the modules from the original Tuscany expansion that I think was cut for both Viticulture Essential and Tuscany Essential expansions was about cheese making, so you were making both wine and cheese.
If i have a personal negative about this game, it is that it is quite safe. I can see how that makes it hugely appealing and very marketable and popular. But I found myself wishing it was a little more cut-throat or challenging at times. Weirdly, the first 3 or 4 turns i thought you had to get the wine orders exact. So was really digging the timing challenges. when I found out that wasn't the case. The game got way less intense :)
This is definitely a game i recommend, and will play again. But it's not one I personally will seek to own. One of my best friends, who's copy this is, owns it, and thats fine.
Some of that was done on purpose. As pointed out here: cardboardedison.com/podcast/2019/1/6/place-of-miracles-viticulture-s1e1 he wanted to create a pleasant, romanticized version of winemaking. It also was one of his earliest game designs. I think that combination had a lot to do with how it turned out.
I still see it come out at game nights out here because the theme resonates so strongly. It could be because we live so close to the Napa Valley and so many people drink wine in Northern California. If I owned the game myself, I'd definitely be opening a bottle of wine and getting out a cheese plate for everyone before we started.
Jamey: "I wanted to pick a theme that was pleasant. Pleasant and universal… I wish I could say it was some very professional part of the research process, but more it was about me being in my early 20s and wanting to hang out with my friends and just have a good time at a vineyard. So it was drawing on some experiences a few years, I think I designed Viticulture when I was around 30,…(Early in the design process, the game had elements where players had to worry about things like the weather and soil quality. But he worked on the game, and he trimmed it down. He focused only on the elements that created a certain kind of experience, one that was more like the romanticized version of winemaking that he saw when he was a visitor.) I want people to have a pleasant experience when they’re playing the game. It’s also a game that’s all about progression…The experience that I was aiming for is that players always feel good when they’re doing things in Viticulture."
Anti-Rahdo
Noel Villarin - Ha, in many ways yes. I respect Rahdo a lot, but we have almost inverse opinions of games. I love take that, tension, and in your face play :)
Play with the Tuscany board! It adds so much more depth and planning and is just simply better (once you know the basic mechanics, the base game board is better for learning imo).
Haha I prefer games that are more cutthroat too 😂
I should buy this for my cousin. He sold his winery in Hawkes Bay recently and ended up a multi-millionaire. On second thoughts he can buy it for me :-p
"Now all we need is a good game about cheese." Looking forward to the Fromage KS!
Definitely one of the top 3 favorite games of all time for my wife and I. :)
nice one
What are the others?
Sounds like you'd like the expansion which swaps the visitor decks to ones that don't grant straight victory points but instead boost your wine production.
Been a long time since I played original viticulture (without Tuscany), but I think, like Tuscany, it was very much a game whose length was dictated by the number of players, say 20-30 minutes a player.
Also, the original Tuscany has a cheese expansion! It did not make Tuscany Essential Edition, apparently for good reason :-)
Love the art work in this game
You beat me to a thumbs up! *shakes fist*!
Weirdly, with this, welcome to dinoworld and wingpan as the next planned recaps. That's 3 games by the same artist back to back. Totally unplanned. (beth sobel)
Top game and the Tuscany expansion is great too. Haven't tried Moors visitors yet though
"Now all we need is a good game about cheese" Anddd Fromage is coming soon!
Big fan of your work, I've watched a lot of board game reviewers and you are by far the best reviewer, Kia ora and keep up the good mahi
Kia ora Te Awa. As long as the mahi is fun, i'll keep doing it. :)
@@3MBG Mean as, can't wait to see more, and also, what's your favorite war board game (when each player controls a faction and trays to best each other) ?
Paths of Glory. But that's a pretty high end complexity war game. It's world war I, and playing it is rough as you have to attack. But attacking sucks. It's also really interesting because you end up fighting on nearly a dozen fronts.
For low complexity, probably Spheres of influence, which is hard to get but its basically "risk, but better in every way".
@@3MBG Thank you, I really appropriate you help, will go check out those games, you should do a review on paths to glory. Kia ora
I plan to. I did a review of Twilight struggle, which shares a lot in common with paths of glory. Paths is a step up from that in terms of complexity.
Wow, wine and board game, now I will have a reason to drink
I just bought the essential edition. Can’t wait!
What's your opinion of the game today?
@@EfrainRiveraJunior its really good, highly recommend
@@TheJimmy000 - I’m about to buy this game because we love wines. Is the theme felt throughout the game? Do you really feel like you are running a winery?
@@EfrainRiveraJunior yeah the theme is well represented
Perfect timing! i have this and only played it once. Gunna head to my cuz house this afternoon and give it a go. Appreciate the te reo used too brother. Nga mihi
Kia ora Adam. Hope the game works out for you and the cuz :)
I like the art.
Have you played the Tuscany expansion?
Honestly can't recall, I don't think so
@@3MBG Ok, I have not played the game itself but a lot of people say it makes the game better.
So when are you coming out with "Fromagaculture?"
Brew Crafters is more complex and much tighter. I view it as the next step after viticulture, but I do like it more.
I've only played brew crafters twice i think, seemed like a pretty solid game. I love its look especially with all the different brands. I think I made lots of chocolate stouts last time i played.
You as the player are not a couple. Mamas and papas are your parents, from which you inherited the vineyard.
cheery Monday link isn't working
Ah, they migrated their music to another site recently, the licence is still fine but the links not. Here it is, i get all my music from here
incompetech.filmmusic.io/song/3495-cheery-monday
Thank you !
Any chance of covering brew crafters?
It's a possible. The same friend of mine who's copy of Viticulture this is also owns brew crafters. I was considering putting it up on a poll on patreon in the future.
Thanks! I'm just considering it as my next purchase
30 second typed review. brew crafters is a reasonably heavy euro style game with some worker placement and set collection stuff fin it. In terms of complexity its a step up from Viticulture, and a significant step at that. From my plays I was thinking there was some potentially dominant strategies when it came to selecting certain upgrades and cards, but I haven't dug in enough to confirm. I'd consider it a solid, themeatic, but not spectacular medium to heavy Euro, that leans on its theme way more than most.
Thanks. It does look good. I own viticulture, and my other favourites seem to be worker placement games, such as village and agricola. Agricola is by far my favourite game and I much prefer it over caverna for its tightness and unforgiving nature (I know saying you prefer agricola over caverna tends to be considered blasphemy in gaming circles). I like my games complex, and I hear this one is verging toward that complexity I like. Would love to playtest It, but don't know anyone who owns It!
From the description, it sounds like essential is not actually that different from regular. I've only played regular, and was curious what could be so different to make essential so much better. I still don't know haha
I think, but im not 100% sure. the mama and papa cards, a remix of the visitor cards, the field cards and the solo rules. Might be some more.
Love it bought it :-)
I like my games heavy, so for me Vinhos easily tops Viticulture.
did you try it with tuscany?
T U S C A N Y
makes the base game just flat for me.
I've been hearing this a fair bit. Might have to hassle Andy into buying it (this is a borrowed copy from a friend, not a review copy)
@@3MBG IIRC the grande worker wasn't in the original base game. It was moved over to the Essential Edition from Tuscany. Lots of ideas in Tuscany. You could also win the original edition without actually growing wine (just having wine tastings and such).
I was skeptical about the value it would add to the base game, but it makes it so much better and widens the decision space so vastly, that it's hard to go back. I have encountered few expansions that are essential, Tuscany is truly one of them.