@@SerpentHashiraObanaiIguro In my case I sat in back rows so I can keep answering even if the time is up, the teacher has some time before he can get to my position lol
It is a very simple problem, for those in confusion go through this : Look, there are 8 vertices for a cube. He was asked to find a domain of area. He says that there is a world outside of the cube. From this, he meant to visualize each dot to have its own sphere. Each spheres 1/8th portion was inside the cube. There are 8 such dots. If u simply multiply 8 × 1/8, u get 1. So, the ratio of the domain around the dot and to that of those 8 vertices is 1:1. The required area is half the total volume of sphere.
You're right, and wrong at the same time. The domain of the atoms are not spherical, but in fact, a complex polyhedron. Karma's sphere visualization confused you. Spheres inside a cube would either overlap or leave out a certain area. The domains can only be a regularly shaped complex polyhedron. Gakushuu had the right idea, but not the correct understanding. Gakushuu wasted his time trying to identify the dimensions of the polyhedrons, when in fact it is not necessary. All you need to know is that the cube is filled with 8 eighth parts of an identical polyhedron and one whole polyhedron. Hence why the volume of each polyhedron can only be half of the cube.
You don’t actually need to worry about the domain as such. Since the relative sizes of the atoms are not in question, you can break down each bcc lattice into 4 smaller cubes with 2 atoms on opposing ends. Since roughly half the volume of each of these smaller cubes is going to be for the central atom, you can extrapolate that half of the total volume of the 4 small cubes together will also be the domain of the central atom, giving you your answer of a^3/2. While the polyhedron approach is correct, the question doesn’t require that approach
@@Imrandomasheck Given a body-centered cubic lattice (a repeating cubic-like pattern with an addition atom in the center of each cube) with a side length of 'a', find the volume of the space that is closest to just one of these atoms. Full question was at 0:39. Easiest way to go about it is to note that the problem hasn't specified which atom in the structure you need to find the volume for, because it doesn't actually matter. The points in the center of each cube are a distance 'a' away from the center of the next cube over, and the distance to any edge is the same as any edge to the center, meaning what we are calling an edge or center are in fact the same thing but in different perspectives. In the edge perspective, any volume (call it 'v') around it will be split between 8 different cubes, and since the cube itself will have 8 edges, each cube will contain the full volume equivalent for one edge inside of any cube. And since the center is already fully contained in a cube, it will also have this full volume equivalence, 'v'. Now we haven't actually said what this volume looks like, just that an edge and the center are the same. Since there are no other atoms to consider, the volume inside the cube will be 2'v'. We know this cube had an edge length of 'a' so the volume of it must also be 'a'^3. That giving us the relation that 2'v' = 'a'^3. Thus our volume is 'v' = 'a'^3 /2
It’s actually amazing that the show included a problem that is pretty challenging to solve when you try to solve it directly but is pretty easy once you know the “trick.” What’s even more amazing is how the insight needed to find the easy solution ties in so well with the themes of the show, and the difference between the two methods of solving the problem fit in so well with the characters and their respective arcs. It must’ve taken a lot of thought to come up with a problem that fills this role in the story while still being able to be solved by middle schoolers, even if it is still challenging. And the show does all this and providing a succinct explanation for how to solve it, and giving the viewer all the info they need to try to solve it themselves. It would’ve been so easy to just say how they each tried the math problem without taking the time to actually create one, but they really went the extra mile here
Fun fact. The author himself said it took him 3 days to give a proper answer to the question, that he asked a teacher friend to make. Actually anyway, even if not the same way karma did, it was still very simple(even it takes your good 5 minutes to understand it, while most ot the problems could be solved in auto mode).
Crystaline structures: They are conformed by the same "piece", those pieces share the same shape and size, hence the volume. Knowing that, you can reach the answer easily. My head canon is that Karma knew that thanks to Okuda www
@@ICantThinkOfANameBwell, they got the math correctly in both instances. Basically the brute force vs knowing the trick to get the answer. Most math tests have them
Dont beat yourself up. alot of things taught in school are building skills meaning you learn layer by layer. When you miss or are never taught a layer the whole thing falls apart. Also those in Class E basically have the most advanced IEP which helped them ace tests designed for one of the most advanced schools ever. . . that is ironicly only a middle school but its anime whatcha expect
Gosh I love this moment so much. It really did show Karma's evolution throught the show. Like, he was so overconfident in S1, but this little sentence at 0:30, you can really see he's taking things more seriously. Like, he would NEVER said that in season 1 but because he failed at the exam of the first semester, he's less arrogant and more cautious. I love little moments like that :)
Este detalle que algunas veces los problemas más "dificiles" simplemente les ponen muchos distractores es muy real , por eso es importante tener conocimiento flexible y variado, para llegar a soluciones mas cortas y sencillas.
They both works smart but asano used to see everyone as his enemy, rival, or step to the top and making everything alone, karma have proper connections to people and he understand what he is not center of the universe
I straight up do not remember this scene from assasination classroom, but it's good to see math any time (basically the difference here is brute force vs symmetry abuse)
I had the same thought as Karma about extending the grid out infinitely, but I thought of it more as a density argument. If you extend the grid out to infinity, then every point (a, b, c) can be mapped to the point (a+1/2, b+1/2, c+1/2) next to it. This means that there's a one-to-one correspondence between the number of points, and since they're symmetrically spaced, that must mean their volumes are the same too.
Es una red bcc una red cubica de cuerpo centrado se estudia mas a fondo en el curso se materiales de metales, en dicha red existe 2 atomos y asumiendo que en el problema no se considera los espacios intersticiales se podria decir que el volumen de la esfera es la mitad del cubo ya que el volumen de dos esferas es igual a un cubo de arista A, otra forma de hacerlo es usando de radio a/2 y bueno saldria el volumen de una esfera (3.1416 /3) ×a^3/2 ybueno esto sale 1.046 aprox 1 saldria lo mismo a^3/2 este problema , si lo leen tiene mas distractores :v karma lo deducio de la forma mas sencilla en cambio asano busco la forma supuestamente mas segura y larga
Karma's anwser simplified for people like me(dumb): The cube can contain eight 1/8ths of a sphere And the cube can also contain the sphere itself alongside the eight 1/8ths The sphere must be the largest it can be without colliding with the eight 1/8ths Eight 1/8ths = a sphere Meaning: the cube can contain 2 spheres at max Conclusion: 1 sphere = half a cube = a³/2
Well it's not a sphere but yeah Thé domain around each point is identical By symettry we know that 1/8 of the domain of a point at the corner is insane the cube And the domain of the center point is entirely inside the cube, which is trivial to show So the cube is composed of 8 1/8s of a domain + 1 domain So the domain is 1/2 of the cube
I think remember when i read the manga, there's a note saying that the author ask someone who are expert in maths to make an college level question with a solution of a middle school level
I've studied a bit of chemistry, physics and maths but this question seems incredibly odd to me and I'm blown away by the fact that Middle Schoolers were suppose to solve something like this. The question seems to imply having some sort of knowledge within chemistry given the fact that they out right give you the elements they're using, but they're talking about their atoms specifically which would then require physics when dealing with atoms, it almost makes me wonder if they're talking about electric fields of some sort because it almost seems like its trying to describe its relationship to the other atoms nearby. The math portion I'm beyond confused because some of it looks like its using a branch of mathematics that realistically should have nothing to do when it comes to chemistry and physics. The use of set theory here, which describes a collection of objects, unless I'm simply reading too much into this and that's just suppose to be fluff for the students to just ignore, but the question literally says the set of all points, I'm going to assume that its only talking about the points shown in the problem because if its talking about every point in the universe it'd just be an infinite set. Since Karma and Asano were heavily focused on the geometry of this problem I'm going to have to assume that perhaps this question is just purely a geometry question as suppose to a question involving high level mathematics, as well as knowledge of chemistry and physics.
This is a standard introductory level competition math problem albeit formatted with far more sophisticated wording. The sentences about paragraph structure is just problem "lore" as it is called in olympiad math communities, and doesn't impact the problem.
It’s simply asking to calculate a volume, so it’s just geometry. The extra info isn’t there to throw you off, it’s to give a hint about how to approach the problem. It could’ve been phrased as “find the volume of the region inside a cube that’s closer to the center than the corners” and it would be asking the exact same thing. The reason it included information about atoms and crystal structures is to give a hint towards thinking about multiple cubes each with their own domain, which is the insight Karma uses to solve the problem easily. Without that extra info, you’d be much less likely to make that insight, which would likely lead to just trying to find an exact formula for the volumes like Asano did, which ends up being much more difficult
this...this an x-ray crystallography problem. I challenge any highschool student anywhere in the world to show me a question like this on a test. Also there is not enough information in the wording to solve this problem. you need to know the braggs distance and 2(theta) angle, also a calculated reference pattern to even begin to answer this question
the comment section makes me realize i need to restudy physics chemistry and maths I'm a medical student and barely even understand their efforts in simplifying this problem I'm thankful though
So, BCC lattice, has Radius of an atom equals √3a/4. then Volume of any atom would be basically 4/3πr³ right? Why does it differ in this case? and on top of that, the Body-centered Atom contibutes a whole, ie, it has a whole 1 contribution to the Volume if lattice right? the corners have 1/8 and edge centers have 1/4, face centers have 1/2. So the atom at body center should be taken a whole, and its volume is my answer, right?. It is NOT a³/2 by this method
This is very late but Karma's visualization using spheres is wrong. I did this problem on my rewatch of the anime without knowing the answer and I found a much simpler method. I realized that, since the cubes extend out infinitely, each atom has the same volume. This means that the atoms on the corners of the cubes have 1/8th of their total volume inside one cube, while the atom in the middle has its entire volume in one cube. If the volume of an atom is x, that means that the total volume of the cube is x (center atom) + x/8 * 8 (corner atom, multiply them by 8 since there are 8 corner atoms). This just simplifies to 2x = a^3 (a^3 is the volume of the cube since a is the side length) and x = a^3/2
@@tbicedshot2819 well, if you take 'atoms' which are spheres again, then you are left with something called as voids. There are 2 types of voids, namely: 1. Tetrahedral void, (T.V) 2. Octahedral void. (O.V) The number of these depend on the effective number of atoms in a lattice. For eg, in a 'simple cubic' arrangement, when we all 8 corners containing 1 atom each, what you said is correct, the effective number of atom inside is "1" But here, the Number of T.V is 2 times effective atoms, thus we have "2" of these tetrahedral voids. Similarly, Number of O.V is 1 times the effective number of atoms, which is "1" of this void. My point is, the total volume of the cube will be more than just adding total atoms at corners
@@virajmhetar7456 I can see what you are saying but I think you misunderstood me. I was saying that using spheres to visualize the volume of the atoms doesn't work, then provided a way that does work. The way I did it was making the volume of the atom equal x. Then, since 1/8th of the corner atoms volume is in the cube, and there are 8 corner atoms, they make up 1x of the volume. The center atom has all of its volume inside the cube, so it also accounts for 1x. So the volume of the cube is 2x, and the equation 2x = a^3 leads to x, or the volume of an atom, being equal to a^3/2
![Summer Walker - Heart Of A Woman [Official Lyric Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/SFddctbZzw8/mqdefault.jpg)
That feeling when you only need one more line is such a horrible feeling.
And this is why I always had extended testing time accommodations in school.
Well... As youve already watched, usually if you write so much, your understanding is probably correct but your missing at an simple answer
When you got the perfect solution and answer but you don't have enough time is truly the worst in all tests.
@@SerpentHashiraObanaiIguro In my case I sat in back rows so I can keep answering even if the time is up, the teacher has some time before he can get to my position lol
It is a very simple problem, for those in confusion go through this :
Look, there are 8 vertices for a cube. He was asked to find a domain of area. He says that there is a world outside of the cube. From this, he meant to visualize each dot to have its own sphere. Each spheres 1/8th portion was inside the cube. There are 8 such dots. If u simply multiply 8 × 1/8, u get 1. So, the ratio of the domain around the dot and to that of those 8 vertices is 1:1. The required area is half the total volume of sphere.
You're right, and wrong at the same time. The domain of the atoms are not spherical, but in fact, a complex polyhedron. Karma's sphere visualization confused you. Spheres inside a cube would either overlap or leave out a certain area. The domains can only be a regularly shaped complex polyhedron. Gakushuu had the right idea, but not the correct understanding.
Gakushuu wasted his time trying to identify the dimensions of the polyhedrons, when in fact it is not necessary. All you need to know is that the cube is filled with 8 eighth parts of an identical polyhedron and one whole polyhedron. Hence why the volume of each polyhedron can only be half of the cube.
You don’t actually need to worry about the domain as such. Since the relative sizes of the atoms are not in question, you can break down each bcc lattice into 4 smaller cubes with 2 atoms on opposing ends.
Since roughly half the volume of each of these smaller cubes is going to be for the central atom, you can extrapolate that half of the total volume of the 4 small cubes together will also be the domain of the central atom, giving you your answer of a^3/2.
While the polyhedron approach is correct, the question doesn’t require that approach
What’s the question 😢?
@@Imrandomasheck Given a body-centered cubic lattice (a repeating cubic-like pattern with an addition atom in the center of each cube) with a side length of 'a', find the volume of the space that is closest to just one of these atoms. Full question was at 0:39.
Easiest way to go about it is to note that the problem hasn't specified which atom in the structure you need to find the volume for, because it doesn't actually matter. The points in the center of each cube are a distance 'a' away from the center of the next cube over, and the distance to any edge is the same as any edge to the center, meaning what we are calling an edge or center are in fact the same thing but in different perspectives.
In the edge perspective, any volume (call it 'v') around it will be split between 8 different cubes, and since the cube itself will have 8 edges, each cube will contain the full volume equivalent for one edge inside of any cube. And since the center is already fully contained in a cube, it will also have this full volume equivalence, 'v'. Now we haven't actually said what this volume looks like, just that an edge and the center are the same. Since there are no other atoms to consider, the volume inside the cube will be 2'v'. We know this cube had an edge length of 'a' so the volume of it must also be 'a'^3. That giving us the relation that 2'v' = 'a'^3. Thus our volume is 'v' = 'a'^3 /2
@@ImrandomasheckOpen your eyes and watch the fucking video?
まんがのどこかに筆者のコメントみたいなやつで、「大学入試レベルの問題で、たくさん計算すれば解ける。けど別解で気づいたらものすごく簡単な式と答えになるような問題を教えてください」って依頼かけて考えてもらった問題がこれらしい。うろ覚えだけど。
大学入試レベルだが、中学範囲で解ける問題
みたいな指定もしてたね
Z会だっけ
It’s actually amazing that the show included a problem that is pretty challenging to solve when you try to solve it directly but is pretty easy once you know the “trick.” What’s even more amazing is how the insight needed to find the easy solution ties in so well with the themes of the show, and the difference between the two methods of solving the problem fit in so well with the characters and their respective arcs. It must’ve taken a lot of thought to come up with a problem that fills this role in the story while still being able to be solved by middle schoolers, even if it is still challenging. And the show does all this and providing a succinct explanation for how to solve it, and giving the viewer all the info they need to try to solve it themselves. It would’ve been so easy to just say how they each tried the math problem without taking the time to actually create one, but they really went the extra mile here
Now this is how the power of friendship solves a math problem.
立方体の中の世界を見続けた浅野君と、
その領域の他にも続いてることを考え、他の領域をみんなの領域と考えられる業、
やっぱこの2人得点は近くても考えは対照的
業の思考をちゃんと途中経過として文章化するのって意外と難しそうだけど、理解すると超単純な解答なの面白い
Fun fact.
The author himself said it took him 3 days to give a proper answer to the question, that he asked a teacher friend to make. Actually anyway, even if not the same way karma did, it was still very simple(even it takes your good 5 minutes to understand it, while most ot the problems could be solved in auto mode).
だなだな笑笑
暗殺教室みたあとにテストうけるとこんな感じに妄想してテストという敵と銃持って戦ってたら、いつの間にか寝てて気づいたらテスト終わってたわ
俺もセンター試験で鉛筆転がしの理論を考えながら鉛筆を転がしてたらいつの間にか試験終わってたわ。良い睡眠がとれた。
Crystaline structures: They are conformed by the same "piece", those pieces share the same shape and size, hence the volume. Knowing that, you can reach the answer easily. My head canon is that Karma knew that thanks to Okuda www
one piece??
漫画でこの問題のイメージに出てくる顔がカルマが解いた時笑みを浮かべる描写が好きだった
業「なーんだ、小学生でも解けるじゃん⤴︎ 」
高校生わい「は」
大学生文系俺「？？？」
25歳サラリーマンの僕「🤪」
専門学生自分「🤮」
同い年我「⁇」
俺(現在工学部)うん…発想力次第では小学生でも解けないことはないかな
ただ中学の問題で出るような内容ではない気がする
I had a question like this on college a few months ago, instantly I remembered this scene.
Lol, did it help?
@@ICantThinkOfANameBwell, they got the math correctly in both instances. Basically the brute force vs knowing the trick to get the answer. Most math tests have them
周期性から考えて、他のどの原子よりも近い点の集合の領域は、全ての原子についてD0の体積と等しい。(D0の体積をV0とする)
1つの立方体に注目して、頂点にある1つの原子についてD0のうちその立方体に含まれるのは(V0)/8、中心部の原子で立方体に含まれるのはV0。
よって、(V0)/8が8個とV0が一個で1つの立方体になるから、(V0)/8×8+V0×1=a^3. したがって、V0=a^3/2。
確かに(めちゃめちゃ賢い)小学生でも解ける問題ではある。
教師「途中式がないから減点な」
浅野くんとカルマくん同点！ｗ
ツイーゴ…懐かしいな…
ツイーゴ笑笑
I realised that for a student studying in kota Allen,this question is actually a child,s play
yep , direct formula based question from solid state lmao
@@ponnamadithyasai6645 you are right,but then I realized that they are junior high students whereas it is actually a high school question😅😅
This question is for 15 year olds.
Nah 16 or 17 @@badribishaldas9627
@rakwalking7no its seneior 243
小学生の時この回見て中学生になったらこんな難しい問題解けるようになるのか〜って思ってたけど今見ても全く分からん(高校生)
この問題、姉と昔からずっと考えてこの歳になってやっと説明出来るようになったの嬉しすぎる。
They deadass included materials science in this lmao
I'm confident I'll get a 0 in that exam lol~
Dont beat yourself up. alot of things taught in school are building skills meaning you learn layer by layer. When you miss or are never taught a layer the whole thing falls apart. Also those in Class E basically have the most advanced IEP which helped them ace tests designed for one of the most advanced schools ever. . . that is ironicly only a middle school but its anime whatcha expect
Gosh I love this moment so much. It really did show Karma's evolution throught the show. Like, he was so overconfident in S1, but this little sentence at 0:30, you can really see he's taking things more seriously. Like, he would NEVER said that in season 1 but because he failed at the exam of the first semester, he's less arrogant and more cautious. I love little moments like that :)
...the fact I can understand Karma's explaination...
この問題高校数学教師の親父に解いてもらおうとしたら浅野スタイル(計算で解こうとしてた)だったわ
最も直接的なアプローチはそのようなものであり、計算は批判的に考えるよりも簡単です
Este detalle que algunas veces los problemas más "dificiles" simplemente les ponen muchos distractores es muy real , por eso es importante tener conocimiento flexible y variado, para llegar a soluciones mas cortas y sencillas.
作者も相当頭いいよな、笑
マジレスすると専門家に聞いてそう
単行本に、Z会の方に中学で習うことで解けるが大学生でも解けない程難しい問題を作っていただいたと書いてありましたよ
体心立方格子とか中学で習ったっけ？
@@口内-l2o 超進学校っていう設定なので高１位までの範囲で考えるのかなと思いますね
@@口内-l2o
3つの立体格子は単語だけなら出てくるんやないかな？
体積とかは高校理科だけど
共通テストの悪問の最終形態っぽい
逆に浅野くんのやり方で解けるやついない説
He really solved the Math problem with the power of friendship. How can I learn this power?
Work smart (karma) VS Work hard (Asano)
They both works smart but asano used to see everyone as his enemy, rival, or step to the top and making everything alone, karma have proper connections to people and he understand what he is not center of the universe
目閉じて聞いてると左手でポテチ取るフリして犯罪者の名前書き始めそう
ポテチを取り…食べる( ˘ᵕ˘ )
コメ欄で自称進学校のマウント大会が始まっているのでお気をつけて
I straight up do not remember this scene from assasination classroom, but
it's good to see math any time
(basically the difference here is brute force vs symmetry abuse)
浅野くんの考え方でも内側の図と外側の図の合計の比が1:1になりそうだから本当に解けてたのでは？
解法は1つとは限らないから浅野くんも時間あれば解けてたとおもう。
まぁご本人も分かっていたのにって言ってたし単純に時間がなかっただけじゃね
あと1行だぞ
浅野のやり方でも解けてたよ
そもそも試験終了間近でここに辿り着いたのが二人だけだから勝負の鍵は解くことより簡略化することなんやろ、この二人の対照的な考え（親に固執する浅野と仲間を信じる業）を表したかったんやろ
数学っていうか化学やん、それも浅野レベルなら高校の範囲までやってるだろ
浅野君のやり方で解いたけど中々にエグかった…
特に図形の分割を一発で書いた彼はバケモン
問題の難しさに注目されがちだけど
これって制限時間以内に解けますか？っていう趣旨なのではないだろうかと思った。
要するに1つの問題を解く数多の方法からより短く簡単に解ける方法を見つけられるかどうか。私は解けないからそもそも無理だけどね！
そもそもこれ最後まで辿り着いてるのこの二人だけなんだよな
カルマ「なーんだ小学生でも分かるじゃん」
大学生わい「……(´；д；`)」
カルマ「泣いちゃった〜」
テストの問題はZ会が監修してるから、しっかりと中学範囲の知識でも解ける（一応）という神問題。
別コメで見たけど立体格子図？
って言われてもよくわからんけど
一辺aの立体の半分やから
a×a×aの半分でa3条/2ね
めっちゃ分かりやすく教えたら
中学生でもできそうり
必要な計算は小学生で習うから発想が柔軟な子なら本当に小学生で解ける問題
半分になる理由を言わないと減点確定ではあるけど
I had the same thought as Karma about extending the grid out infinitely, but I thought of it more as a density argument. If you extend the grid out to infinity, then every point (a, b, c) can be mapped to the point (a+1/2, b+1/2, c+1/2) next to it. This means that there's a one-to-one correspondence between the number of points, and since they're symmetrically spaced, that must mean their volumes are the same too.
Es una red bcc una red cubica de cuerpo centrado se estudia mas a fondo en el curso se materiales de metales, en dicha red existe 2 atomos y asumiendo que en el problema no se considera los espacios intersticiales se podria decir que el volumen de la esfera es la mitad del cubo ya que el volumen de dos esferas es igual a un cubo de arista A, otra forma de hacerlo es usando de radio a/2 y bueno saldria el volumen de una esfera (3.1416 /3) ×a^3/2 ybueno esto sale 1.046 aprox 1 saldria lo mismo a^3/2 este problema , si lo leen tiene mas distractores :v karma lo deducio de la forma mas sencilla en cambio asano busco la forma supuestamente mas segura y larga
Karma's anwser simplified for people like me(dumb):
The cube can contain eight 1/8ths of a sphere
And the cube can also contain the sphere itself alongside the eight 1/8ths
The sphere must be the largest it can be without colliding with the eight 1/8ths
Eight 1/8ths = a sphere
Meaning: the cube can contain 2 spheres at max
Conclusion: 1 sphere = half a cube = a³/2
Well it's not a sphere but yeah
Thé domain around each point is identical
By symettry we know that 1/8 of the domain of a point at the corner is insane the cube
And the domain of the center point is entirely inside the cube, which is trivial to show
So the cube is composed of 8 1/8s of a domain + 1 domain
So the domain is 1/2 of the cube
I think remember when i read the manga, there's a note saying that the author ask someone who are expert in maths to make an college level question with a solution of a middle school level
この最後の問題のお互いの解答方法感動したな
I've studied a bit of chemistry, physics and maths but this question seems incredibly odd to me and I'm blown away by the fact that Middle Schoolers were suppose to solve something like this.
The question seems to imply having some sort of knowledge within chemistry given the fact that they out right give you the elements they're using, but they're talking about their atoms specifically which would then require physics when dealing with atoms, it almost makes me wonder if they're talking about electric fields of some sort because it almost seems like its trying to describe its relationship to the other atoms nearby. The math portion I'm beyond confused because some of it looks like its using a branch of mathematics that realistically should have nothing to do when it comes to chemistry and physics. The use of set theory here, which describes a collection of objects, unless I'm simply reading too much into this and that's just suppose to be fluff for the students to just ignore, but the question literally says the set of all points, I'm going to assume that its only talking about the points shown in the problem because if its talking about every point in the universe it'd just be an infinite set.
Since Karma and Asano were heavily focused on the geometry of this problem I'm going to have to assume that perhaps this question is just purely a geometry question as suppose to a question involving high level mathematics, as well as knowledge of chemistry and physics.
This is a standard introductory level competition math problem albeit formatted with far more sophisticated wording. The sentences about paragraph structure is just problem "lore" as it is called in olympiad math communities, and doesn't impact the problem.
It’s a maths exam. Challenging questions will give you unnecessary details to throw you off and test your ability to sift through information.
It’s simply asking to calculate a volume, so it’s just geometry. The extra info isn’t there to throw you off, it’s to give a hint about how to approach the problem. It could’ve been phrased as “find the volume of the region inside a cube that’s closer to the center than the corners” and it would be asking the exact same thing. The reason it included information about atoms and crystal structures is to give a hint towards thinking about multiple cubes each with their own domain, which is the insight Karma uses to solve the problem easily. Without that extra info, you’d be much less likely to make that insight, which would likely lead to just trying to find an exact formula for the volumes like Asano did, which ends up being much more difficult
2:32 あれ？高校生なのにわかんないじゃん
1学期期末で他人を認める、油断しない事ができるようになったから見いだせた解法かもね
1:55 マイクラやってる時の俺
化学の教科書に似てるの乗っててあーってなった
yeah no I'm too dumb to understand this
勘違いしてる人多いけど体心立方格子の原子の体積を求める問題ではなくない？問題文しっかり読んだら、体積ではなく、領域やから、高校化学の典型問題とは少し違う気がする。
このシーン個人カルマと浅野テスト二人実力大好き❤
in the manga it says that the author yusei matsui needed help to solve this question.
このシーン一番カルマと浅野一番頑張たかっこいい❤
無理矢理感は否めないけど、考え方は面白い！笑笑
I just realized this a material science question lol
In iit there was a question like this and it's similar to questions of packing fraction from solid states...
小学生じゃ無理
大人でも無理
this...this an x-ray crystallography problem. I challenge any highschool student anywhere in the world to show me a question like this on a test. Also there is not enough information in the wording to solve this problem. you need to know the braggs distance and 2(theta) angle, also a calculated reference pattern to even begin to answer this question
It’s not that deep bro. The question can be solved using fairly simply (and elegantly) once you realise that it’s actually just a geometry problem.
数学じゃなく化学に出せばいいのでは？そもそも文章を書いて答えを出せれば大丈夫だと思うが。
問題文はややこしくするためのフェイクやで。
the comment section makes me realize i need to restudy physics chemistry and maths I'm a medical student and barely even understand their efforts in simplifying this problem
I'm thankful though
昔、東大生の友達に聞いたら「カルマの解き方が普通だよ。」って言ってた
ここ色々矛盾してるんよな。
基礎化学終わらせてるはずなのにな
調べたら結晶構造は化学基礎じゃなくて化学だからまだやってない説。中学生だから文理にも別れてないし
@@やんやん-b4r 基礎でやったぞ
小学生「え、ちょっと何言ってるか分からない」
小学校の時カルマくんのやり方で点数取れたことあったw😂立方体のやつ形が一緒やったから覚えてたなー
【彼らは定期試験を行っています】
So, BCC lattice, has Radius of an atom equals √3a/4. then Volume of any atom would be basically 4/3πr³ right? Why does it differ in this case? and on top of that, the Body-centered Atom contibutes a whole, ie, it has a whole 1 contribution to the Volume if lattice right? the corners have 1/8 and edge centers have 1/4, face centers have 1/2. So the atom at body center should be taken a whole, and its volume is my answer, right?. It is NOT a³/2 by this method
They aren't asking volume of atom
@@vratha9740 without calculating volume of the atom, how can we substract it from volume of inside of cube..
This is very late but Karma's visualization using spheres is wrong. I did this problem on my rewatch of the anime without knowing the answer and I found a much simpler method. I realized that, since the cubes extend out infinitely, each atom has the same volume. This means that the atoms on the corners of the cubes have 1/8th of their total volume inside one cube, while the atom in the middle has its entire volume in one cube. If the volume of an atom is x, that means that the total volume of the cube is x (center atom) + x/8 * 8 (corner atom, multiply them by 8 since there are 8 corner atoms). This just simplifies to 2x = a^3 (a^3 is the volume of the cube since a is the side length) and x = a^3/2
@@tbicedshot2819 well, if you take 'atoms' which are spheres again, then you are left with something called as voids. There are 2 types of voids, namely:
1. Tetrahedral void, (T.V)
2. Octahedral void. (O.V)
The number of these depend on the effective number of atoms in a lattice.
For eg, in a 'simple cubic' arrangement, when we all 8 corners containing 1 atom each, what you said is correct, the effective number of atom inside is "1"
But here, the Number of T.V is 2 times effective atoms, thus we have "2" of these tetrahedral voids.
Similarly, Number of O.V is 1 times the effective number of atoms, which is "1" of this void.
My point is, the total volume of the cube will be more than just adding total atoms at corners
@@virajmhetar7456 I can see what you are saying but I think you misunderstood me. I was saying that using spheres to visualize the volume of the atoms doesn't work, then provided a way that does work.
The way I did it was making the volume of the atom equal x. Then, since 1/8th of the corner atoms volume is in the cube, and there are 8 corner atoms, they make up 1x of the volume. The center atom has all of its volume inside the cube, so it also accounts for 1x. So the volume of the cube is 2x, and the equation 2x = a^3 leads to x, or the volume of an atom, being equal to a^3/2
English comment.
化学の問題じゃんっていう人多いけど、導入が化学なだけで数学の要素がほとんどだと思う
このレベルの数学（算数）の要素が多いのも含めてこれは化学の問題
@@マルマルモリモリ-b8n 簡単とか、このレベルっていう人多いけど、自分的にはかなり難しいレベルだと思う。カルマの方法はかなりの発想力必要でコメント欄でも勘違いしてる人多いし、浅野のやつは求める立体考えるのがかなり難しく、そこからどんな立体の和になっているか分解がむずいと思う
@@マルマルモリモリ-b8n 体心立方格子って言い換えたら立方体の中に点あるだけだし、数学要素強いかな〜まあ化学っちゃ化学だけど
ですね
中心に近い点の集合の体積を求める問題なので、紛れもなく数学です
@@guraion_NO.1 このレベルというのは問題のことではなく問題でさせられる計算内容のことを指してます。問題自体は中学生であることを考えれば難しいと思います。
ですが前問で漸化式とか一般に高校でやるような数学をやったかと思いきや、この問題で求められるのは発想があればただの四則演算です。
そしてこのような計算問題は高校の化学基礎、化学の問題集を見れば似たようなものはあります。
数学のテストで求める数学的発想が少ないところも、化学の問題とは言わずとも数学の問題としてはナンセンスと思いました。
なんか大学生が意気揚々と大人気ないのすみません、、
真守大好き王子様殺せんせー面白い。
当時は忘れてたし、今も忘れるけど、こいつら高校生じゃなくて中学生なんだよな
体心立方格子の中心の球の体積？普通に浅野くらいだったらできるでしょ
そのほかの問題で時間取られたのでは？
分かってたって言ってるし。
確か『8つのどの頂点よりも中心に近い点の集合の体積』だったと思います
球で分けると立方体の中で隙間が生まれる
この問題では立方体の中身全てを頂点と中心で分割するから体積が綺麗に元の立方体の半分になる
俺気づいちゃったんだけど殺せんせーって高3の基礎まで教えたって言ってたから流石に化学基礎やってるよね？だったらこの問題全員できなきゃおかしくないか
それな笑
気づくな
期末の後に教えたんじゃね？
教えられたからと言って必ずしもできる訳じゃないし、ほとんどの生徒は最終問題まで間に合わなかった的なこと言ってた気がする
カルマだけ学習能力が高いから殺せんせーが高校までの基礎知識を教え過ぎたとかテスト返却の時言ってたような言ってなかったような…。(あれ…これ中間だったかな…)
カルマくんとか解説？みたいなのしてるけどﾁｮｯﾄｺﾉﾓﾝﾀﾞｲﾅﾆｲｯﾃﾙｶﾜｶﾗﾅｲ←
カルマ君の解き方は解説してくれてるし、5回位聞けば理解できたけど
浅野君、君の計算だけは全然分からんw
でもカルマの理論だと真ん中が球体になるなら空間の隙間はどう考えてるんだろ
それめっちゃ思った
半径a/2の球体だけじゃカバーできてない空間があるもんね
解説してるサイトあったはず
だから周期的にってヒントがある。立方体の中に2つの球体があるから、立方体を1:1に分けれる。他の比率になったら、周期的じゃなくなるからね。
理系大学の受験勉強し始めて1か月くらいで解けるくらいの難易度やな
中学３でも解ける人結構いそう
まあ高一の授業範囲だからね
なんかイキってて草
@@IlyaPetrov11 絶対文系か厨房で草
@@monakapengin アイコンと相まって陰、
いやでも実際そのレベルよ。この問題解けないと東海レベルですら受からんぞ
けど中学校の定期テストで出るような問題では無いな
途中式無いので減点！にならなくてよかった
I remember now
It's the one question that stumped me on the SAT
Only after walking out did I realized it's just a sphere in a cube
The shape isn't a sphere
よく分からんけど、要するに立方体の体積の半分が答えってことね。
is it just me or does that question seem too easy??
浅野君のこえ デスノートの主人公に似てる
中学生僕にはまず求めるものがわかりません
今聞いてもわかんねえ爆笑爆笑
すいません、分からないから俺は小学生以下です
1:36 why’d he lose a chromosome on this frame
ほぉー。つまりどういうことですか？
Karma
（立方体の体積）- 8 × (3 × (三角錐の体積) + (六角錐の体積))
これまじで計算量多すぎでしょ。六角錐は面倒くさ過ぎる。
あと一行だったのに
ウィグナーザイツ胞
アメリカ語にすれば理解出来るものを日本のアニメだから本場の声優で聞いてんの？
1:34
how is this middle school math bro
小学生｢ムリっすよ笑｣
浅野くんの力が互角だから中間で攻めぎ合うって発言で
俺、答え分かったんだけどもしかして浅野くん頭固い？
2:10
gg
このコメ欄痛いなぁ.....
中学生でも解けるとか高一には出来ないとやばいとか
なんか勘違いしてる馬鹿ばっかだから言わせてもらうけど、制限時間内に解けるかって話なんだわ
まぁ、youtubeのコメ欄でセコセコマウント取ってる奴らには到底無理だろけどなww
それね
問題文が英語なのをわすれてはいけない
@@user-hi6kr1il2k 海外向けに翻訳されてるだけで元は日本語だよ。
何言ってんかわかんね
ん？中学生ってま？
小学生でも分かるそです
どゆことかわからんww
Why tf are bro tweaking over math?