How teleportation could work: Star Trek transporter - how to make one!
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- Опубликовано: 16 окт 2024
- Is teleportation possible? In the Star Trek transporter, the atoms in your body get converted to their subatomic particles - protons, neutrons, and electrons, and are transmitted as a stream of particles to the surface of a planet or wherever the transporter sends it, and are somehow reconstituted.
To get the subatomic particles into a matter stream, first we have to take molecules apart into atoms. Then we have to take the atoms apart into their constituent neutrons, protons and electrons. Taking molecules apart requires a lot less energy than taking the nuclei of atoms apart. Molecules can come together and apart in normal chemical reactions, for example when you mix baking soda and vinegar, you are taking apart atoms from molecules and putting them together to make new molecules.
But taking nuclei apart is whole other ball game. The forces holding neutrons and protons together in the nucleus, called the strong nuclear force, is millions of times more powerful than the electrical forces holding atoms together in a molecule.
The body consists of about 1x10^28 atoms. If you want to turn all these atoms into neutrons and protons, all the nuclear binding energy of the strong nuclear force will need to be overcome. This turns out to be the energy equivalent of about a 20 megatons of TNT, or a very large hydrogen bomb
Why not just take the atoms of the body and beam them? This would take a lot less energy, and would be less complicated to reconstitute back into a human. So this would probably be a better way to go. But we are going strictly by the Star Trek technical manual.
But debonding would not be the end of the story because now that you have all these subatomic particles, you have to transport them at very high speed to the surface of a planet. the energy required to move these subatomic particles is about equivalent to about their rest mass, or about 100kg. This is a lot of energy, equal to about 2000 megatons of tnt.
But if you just capture the particles and transport them to the surface, you would be transporting a blob of particles. You also need to transport the information contained in that human body so that those subatomic particles can be rematerialized in exactly the same way that they were dematerialized.
How much information would this require? - about 1X10^31 bytes of data. It’s a large number. It is a trillion times more than all the data on the internet today.
Another technical challenge is to rematerialize a person on the surface of a planet. In order to do this, a mechanism has to exist that is able to resolve the human body on subatomic scales. This kind of subatomic resolution from 40,000 kilometers away would require a resolution power 100 trillion times that of the Hubble telescope, requiring a mirror that 50,000 kilometers in diameter.
So the challenges are immense - we have to dematerialize 1x10^28 atoms, and stream it at nearly the speed of light from one location to another. We have to have second stream of information accompanying the particle stream. And we have to be able to rematerialize with a subatomic resolution from 40,000 kilometers away.
Quantum mechanics or quantum teleportation is also a problem. The laws of QM are such that the process of making a measurement alters the system. Obtaining the precise quantum state of particles will alter it such that we will not be able to rematerialize them exactly the same as before measuring them. Could changing the quantum state by measurement result in a completely different human being?
The transporter surprisingly opens up a Pandora’s box of some profound existential questions. Where is this human being during the transfer process? He would be nothing more than a stream of particles and a stream of information.
Second, if we transported all the atoms in exactly the right configuration without the information, wouldn’t we have transported merely a dead body. Is the only difference between a living human being and a dead human being the information contained in the information stream?
Third, how do we know that the reconstituted human being is the exact same individual? What if we made a copy of his information stream, and used another set of identical subatomic particles to create a duplicate human being. Would they be two different individuals with the same consciousness and awareness, or two completely different individuals?
#teleportation #arvinash #startrek
“Beam me up, Scotty.
Oh, I’m dead.
But I’m alive again.
Or am I?”
Another Mandela Effect lol
That phrase was never spoken in the show.
Don’t let the cat out of the box.
Cant believe that the Chinese guy from the original series turned out to be a sausage jockey.
You will be in a state of suspended animation, not dead, when it is done properly. I am sure there would be strict procedures, technology and regulations to prevent deaths. :)
Remember Bones had the very same dilemma about using the transporter.
‘Never bet against human ingenuity.’ Love it. Thanks for another great video.
@John Thijm Thijm I agree but things like flying are totally physical and based on exploiting elements such as air pressure, all we really needed to do to fly was attach an engine to a light as possible aircraft in the right shape. I'm not saying this will never be done but it's really a totally different thing, were not even 1% into understanding how to do this so it's hundreds of years away if ever.
@John Thijm Thijm I agree and it's a great point but you have to remember that flying is inherently part of nature (birds as you said) so it's naturally known to be possible, and so we strive towards achieving it. There is no example of "teleportation" in nature for us to even observe to try and understand, why? Because teleportation is naturally impossible and probably always will be in terms of teleporting physical stuff.
@John Thijm Thijm The dream of flying was stimulated by the flight of birds and the birds actually flew, so the principle of flying existed in the eyes. Man's inability to fly is still true. The laymen misinterpreted the statement of the French Academy on the inability to fly with humans related to the way of flying Daidalos and Ikar. This means that it is still not possible to deploy wings with a total area of 1 square meters and force your own arms to fly to the supermarket. At the time of this glorious statement, aviation and gliders existed, ie, a body heavier than air flight, which was made possible by technical solutions using the existing principle. The invention is therefore limited to existing principles. Therefore, you cannot sit at the table and say that tomorrow I will invent antigravity or human teleport - there is no principle on which it could be built historically, and if something is to be applied in 1000 years, there must be theoretical assumptions of existing principles! But it is not. Of course today, a quantum property can be converted into a distant existing prefabricated superposition with a high degree of probability. The same quantum state can be triggered by Einstein-Bosen condensate ... but it does not circumvent the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, which is precisely why it is not possible to assemble an identical human copy at a remote location - it is directly below the measurement. Video colleague is really a lot, but very optimistic. It is not necessary to incorporate a harmful religious element into the soul. Possible reconstruction, of course, concerns the whole electrochemistry of the brain and its stored associations from the past, so what we call the soul is exactly duplicated. Therefore, the original is killed and the copy does not believe it was killed. This raises an ethical problem, not a religious one. All those Star Trek teleports and Star Gates are killing men. The properties of the elements are transferred to a remote location where they are reconstructed by means of energy (based on the mass-energy equivalent). The copy has exactly the same soul of the original, but the original will be dead, just like his soul, but the copy can be considered a completely identical person who duplicated all the joys and worries, knowledge, ego, nature ... This is the secret of the teleport. Indeed, our brain is constantly reconstructed throughout our lives and none of us accept that our ego has been constantly killed - we do not believe that we are a biological copy of ourselves in time. Simply inventions are in accordance with existing principles. Nothing beyond the existing principle can therefore be devised. There is a limit. edit: Sorry, the second part of the post is up to the author of the video.
@Chosen One A great disaster when scientific terms become an occultist tool.
@Chosen One By then, young children would have to receive a "signal". However, they must first gain experience, which is stored in association and can then interact.
I think we'd first invent the Altered Carbon version of "teleportation", where a digital mind map is sent to a robotic or clone avatar. Great vid!
I was thinking of that, too. Using that technology for both teleportation and continuous life independent of the human body.
Teleporting every atom in your body in the same order across the universe
Did you guys seen game Soma? 😅
Fascinating, Arvin! As a retired programmer, I know about streaming data, parsing bytes and the like, and the process that you describe is very much like those actions -- except on a massively larger scale (obviously). We will be able to do this when we can figure out how to generate that much energy (or how to do it with much less energy.) Great video sir!
Well it's not just about parsing and transmission of data. There's quantum effects at play. The Heisenberg uncertainty principle has huge implications on this type of technology.
@@JJs_playground
Which Star Trek techno-babbled their way out of by the use of a mysterious device known as the Heisenberg Compensator.
Of course we have no such device, nor do we even have a clue what this device does (apart from compensating for the Heisenbwrg uncertainty principle). Which from what I know is not something that is feasible.
The notion of a device that can somehow compensate for such a thing. I wouldn't even know where to beging with that.
That is of course if the Copenhagen Interpretation is the correct understanding of quantum physics. The Pilot Wave hypothesis is gaining a lot of support & doesn't have god playing dice (to paraphrase Einstein).
@@biggsydaboss3410 +1 Regardless of interpretation, the subsequent act of measurement (compensation for interacting devices that does not exist) causes us to receive a probability measure. Thinking about Startrek's "technology", something we can really approach, for example, on-board simulators that everyone would welcome. :) Today it is possible to experience something with the help of VR in the living room, ie both teleport and overlight speed ... just bring the environment to the safety of your home. All we have to do is figure out how to make such a transferred environment realistic without personal aids. Let robots fly and scan for us. What will never work (it is not possible to accept every stupid of sci-fi), there are other possibilities that will provide exactly the same, albeit otherwise done.
Even today in an analog to digital conversion of data, a 100% conversion is impossible no matter how large the data is. Now any fraction of error or loss in the encoding and decoding of your blood and guts will be fatal. Teleportation is impossible for any live organicism. - Now lets be grounded in reality.
Anything is possible with 0s and 1s
Once the particles arrive, you also have to stop them, which takesa a s much energy as orignally zaccelerating them, so another 20,000 megatonnes
This is where I was waiting to hear what he was going to say actually, which bring me to a conclusion that this may be impossible to achieve, at least the Star Trek way. But it could be done the Stargate way. In this case what they did with the transport rings was somewhat similar to Star Trek but much well thought through. The rings would stack from above or below to transport anything that goes between them. Then they'd decode and do what he was explaining. They then beam the info to another set of rings somewhere else (the destination) that do the reverse of what happened initially. So this has a receiver and transmitter setup. The rings will have to be at the destination or they travel with the matter info and build it at the destination if there was no receiver setup at the destination solving the energy barrier and other issues.
@@emmanuelmahuni8163 I also think that its more plausible to get teleportation when you have the same device in both locations than if you just beam it up. I would even say that we could be able to teleport simple objects or substances in the next few hundred years like this. I dont think its possile to just beam someone like in Star Trek, unless you also beam some kind of engineered particles or nanbo-robots to rebuild it on the target location.
@@Constantinesis exactly my point. Maybe that's why they put those swirling effects in recent Star Trek movies to show that there is something that's rebuilding the matter stream
Nop, you're all missing the point, it doesn't need to beam all of the energy, i'm supposing that the debonding process removes the mass of the atoms before beaming, the streamer laser will teleport only one particle with mass to the destination after that a chain of quantum tunneling will pull the massless particles into the first particle in a cascade reaction, this results in a massless body that acts as a bose-einstein condensate that is ready to absorp hadrons from the space around it, materializing and letting the body move when this happens.
@@fss1704 I have no idea if what you said is science or not but sounds exactly how it should be 😂
So, a transporter could be an immortality machine. All you have to do is backup the information, gather a bunch of subatomic particles(you could even "recycle" a dead body for that), mix them together then voilá: a living person.
not so fast, you wont be able to remember your experiences past the backup. In other words your life will be meaningless, just something that you are going to live and never remember. To top that up, if you scan just before you die then whatever killed you might just kill you if it was a disease. If not then quandary 1 takes precedence.
However, judging by the difficulty in achieving this over memory backups I'd say you backup your memories separately from the transporter matter stream backup then reinsert them at the convenient age you want to be at a later age.
eg: backup your matter stream at 20 then live your life with memory backups along the way. After you kick the bucket at whatever age say 70, then they use your matter stream to reconstitute you and 20yearOldBodyBrain = merge(20yearMemoriesOfMatterStream, 70yearOldMemoryBackup); the now 20 year old body with your 70 year old memories... eeeeek
Scotty went through that, stayed in the buffers for decades.
@Dowhat Iwant That's what life is all about experience and memories. You actually get smarter and more wise with more of that by the way. Annnnd, honestly I was barely thinking when I wrote that. Just a tinnie tiny bit of my mind was in use 😂, sorry if it sounded like I had a huge cranking in my brain to say that.
@@emmanuelmahuni8163 I can't believe some dummy is arguing the pros/cons of something that will never exist
FUD Hater why not?
Your channel deserve 10 million subscribers the way you explain things just blows my mind.
No One has ever touched this topic.
Thank you Arvin Ash for your explanation
Love from India🇮🇳.
Thanks my friend. These are difficult and sometimes controversial topics that require a lot of research and presentation planning. It is not surprising that most channels wouldn't want to tackle that.
Very True.
@@ArvinAsh Honestly, I'd rather use a shuttle. It provides shelter, a fun ride, and a secondary means of getting back to the ship... the number of times Scotty couldn't get the transporter to work, or he'd have to lower the shields... etc. Plus have you ever seen those transporter pods spark and emit smoke? That'll mess up your kidneys for sure.
@@chiodotube Ya well science can't really explain consciousness either. Does that mean it doesn't exist - or that we shouldn't talk about it?
Harsh Bhardwaj I don’t think the soul is anything to worry about because if it’s real it’s supernatural and if it’s not real its nothing to start with.
I love the variety of topics you are able to make videos on. Your videos are always consistently well researched and written. Hope youtube finds your gem of a channel and gives it the attention it deserves!
Excellent video once again Arvin. The narration is perfect.
You are the first person who is able to yeach and make me clear about so complicated topics in all of your videos. Even my teacher is not able to teach me and me clear in such a way.
man, your channel and the kurgzegratz channel are the two-channel on you youtube that i can really trust for it's authenticity and quality of the information. You being my no. one. Hope you hit one million subs soon!
Kurzgesagt is a son of a bitch. He runs a propaganda. He accidentally showed his true face when he pushed his 'refugee crisis' and 'ISIS' video on a fucking science channel. Bastard! He can stuff his nutshell in his butthole. P. S get the name right. What the flying fuck is Kurgzegratz?
found your cannel few days ago and you are *blowing up my mind* already... your essence of explaining is 1×10^35 rare on YT 🤩
The transporter is not really a transportation machine. It is a "copy and paste at a distance and delete the original" machine.
"cut and paste"
The ethics part of this chat is the important part of this video. It was explored in an ethics class I did 20 years ago (in the context of mind uploads, brain transplants and teleportation too!). Great to have it presented in a digestible form! It’s a great topic, and leads everywhere. (It is my view we will first experience this problem in a scenario more like the Black Mirror episode San Junipero).
"I've heard they might not be safe..."
Lt. Reed: "I've heard the same stories. Now get up here on the pad."
reminds me of Monty Python and the Holy Grail. I don't want to go on the cart! Oh, don't be such a baby.
Just ask Bones McCoy....
One of the best channels on RUclips! Keep up the great work!
Good video arvansh comprehensive one time will only tell the answer to these questions
Sounds extremely complicated yet fascinating
Great video. Thank you. Beam me to Las Vegas. I feel lucky.
I simply love your videos! The topics chosen are simply awesome.
Good points...if you had the information of a person, and could reconstitute it...that could be a way to immortality. In fact, there were a few Star Trek transporter accidents that involved the characters becoming children again and so on. There's also been a few incidents in Star Trek of the situation of transporter duplicates, particular with Riker. Who is to tell which was actually the 'real' one?
Yes, I remember the Riker episode. I think the writers missed the boat on that one. The way the STNG transporter works, making a duplicate is impossible because the person's original molecules are transported. So there is no duplicate.
I really enjoyed the profound human questions which were raised during the video that such technology would posed. Thank you for a great video.
Also check out a TV show called The Expanse
There isn't teleportation but it is very realistic
Haven't seen it. Will check it out. Also, check out "Dark" on Netflix - it is very fascinating sci-fi on time travel.
Show is Evil like all Netflix shows
This will never be possible but I do like it as a sci fi idea. Great video.
"Sometimes ignorance is the only way to remain optimistic in life."
Why is that so horrifying lol?
A very practical viewpoint, don't worry be happy.
@@stevenmonson5149 don't worry be communist, right?
A microcosm of this would be to avoid news for a week and see how you mood lightens up vs a week of constant emulsion.
Explanations go well beyond the scientific Community you respect the soul and that is amazing thank you
I am using "soul" and "consciousness" interchangeably. I don't think any scientist would disagree that consciousness exists.
Arvin, great vid, my thoughts exactly.
Just the fact that this guy could take such a complex concept and science and explain so anyone can understand it is nothing short of incredible. My thoughts immediately went to transporting a thing instead of a person or living organism. All the requirements would be so much less for something that is not living and so complex. If we could transport stuff to the ISS, imagine the savings in cost and trouble.
Please dont stop making more videos! I feel like you can read my mind. One day I'll have a question and next week you perfectly explain the topic better than anybody else.
You don't have to break any particles apart, you just have to stretch the bonds to the point that even light could pass through. The hard part is the isolation field between your particles and the space around you. Then where you are sent to would have to stop your particles from stretching and you would be back to normal.
That's an interesting idea!
@@ArvinAsh thank you!
This is where philosophy inevitably meets science. Technically what's happening is an identical copy of you is being formed elsewhere while you are being permanentaly destroyed. It's "you", but the "you" of now will never experience anything beyond the point where your brain is disassembled, even though it won't make any difference to the people who meet the copied "you" in at the destination. Which particals are used is not important (they are continuously being replaced anyway). The current interlinked configuration is what makes the "you" that you know, so disassembly will end that as you know it---essentially, it's death but with a copy made from the same material. You could do the same thing using new materials so that you could keep the current "you"... and both would technically be "you" in every possible way, because each type of fundamental partical is identical in composition and function (so far as we know) and thus would serve all the same purposes if configured the same way in the new "you".
First video I've seen on this channel. Subscribed. Nuff said.
Btw didn't notice you're close to 100k in no time, remember us from like 1k..
Thanks my friend.
Big fan, Mr. Ash - Keep up the good work, as I see you with some of those fancy RUclips subscriber boxes soon enough!
Since sub-atomic particles like electrons have so called "wave properties" that doesnt really have fixed position, etc then this would be hard to build?
Absolutely. At this moment in time, this technology is purely speculative. I am only suggesting that in principle, it may be possible.
If the properties can be predicted by advanced AI, it might solve the problem. I mean look at the AI Up-scaling tech that's being shown off now, with enhanced video quality.
I must agree that ur videos are really information rich...Thnx for providing us these great videos
What about entropy? Statistically an ordered state such as a human materializing has a lower chance of occurring than something less complex.
That's the function of the information beam. The information stream that is beamed along with the matter would be needed to materialize the human in the same way that it was dematerialized.
The entropy of the initial and final humans would be the same, but in the process of using the vast amount of energy necessary for this, total entropy would increase via energy released by some mechanism, or so I think.
Thank you very much Arvin. As always, this is another great video! I'm impressed by your ability to communicate difficult concepts in simple language, i had never thought of the spiritual aspect of teleportation, and all its philosophical implications and an answer to the question ''is the essence of consciousness, or the soul quantum information?'' would change humanity forever. I also consider myself an ignorant optimist, and i believe we will eventually find all the answers, because as you said yourself, never bet against the ingenuity of the human race, it is boundless. :-)
"Sometimes, ignorance is the only way to remain optimistic in life." Translation: "We're all screwed."
Well no, not really. I like the statement and it does hold some water in a way, but in less cases than you can imagine. If you try your best to be objective and then think about your issues or situation without any biases and such suddenly you'll realize that yeah you're not truly objectively screwed. Now in order to do this yeah easier said than done, but it does help and it's more plausible than teleporting a human being.
@@loganwolv3393 Yep, I'm sure that's what the Bolsheviks said in 1918.
@@reason2463 Intresting.
I love that you take the proposition of teleportation seriously, and go through the numbers to reveal the hurdles that would need to be overcome. Kudos - That is the true objective approach of a Scientist.
Regarding the nature of soul, individuality, consciousness, etc., we already have some interesting data that we can all agree upon. For instance, we all physically started out as the combination of two reproductive cells. The average human body has approximately 30 Trillion cells. And even though our personalities change, and the physical material of our bodies change in an ongoing process, at are core we remain the same person. In normal transportation, when we move an object from one location to another, we do not need to move the Space that it occupies. If it is that Consciousness is one, undivided, and all-pervasive, as some ancient religious texts and teachers say, then relocating a body may not be an obstacle to teleportation, as long as it is done accurately enough, and metabolism remains functional..
I was in 7th grade when me and my friend concluded everything is just information, but we couldnt understand the relationship between information and mass and energy. Or for that matter what does a unit of information simplify down to?
Fascinating video! We could take this transporting a step further. Imagine you have a disease like cancer; after breaking down the body into protons, neutrons and electrons, delete the cells and their associated particles. Then, when reassembling the body, no more cancer. Hopefully. No cancer, no chemotherapy, no radiation.
Hmm...I hadn't thought of that! Very interesting idea.
7:38 Heisenberg Compensators (which presumably solve the issues with quantum mechanics and the uncertainty principle) are literally mentioned in a number of Star Trek episodes like
TNG: "Realm of Fear"
TNG: "Ship in a Bottle"
DS9: "Past Tense, Part I"
Just saying. 😉
Yep, this is in the official technical manual as well. It doesn't mean anything. The term is used by the writers to give themselves creative freedom to write all kinds of impossible non-science-backed stories in the episodes.
@@ArvinAsh Yes. But it also means the writers were aware that a heisenberg compensator would be required for a transporter to work. That kind of attention to detail is why I love Star Trek.
There was a time Gene Roddenberry was asked how heisenberg compensators worked.
His response: "They work really well. Thanks" 😊
@@ArvinAsh the term heisenberg compensatior means a lot, it shows that the creators have been in touch with scientists and worked with them on loopholes on how to make things "work". for a transporter of this kind heisenberg is the biggest problem before everthing else so they built a compensator, i think you can see this also a little bit as a science joke.
I like it that your open minded to everything
I think that a better solution would be to actually create a temporary wormhole to move the person or item being transported.
This is, in fact, how I always thought the transporters worked: create a temporary connection between 'origin' and 'destination'. It's just geometry.
I like how you break up all data from all angles great video
Glad you liked it!
Never clicked on a video quicker.
I have this book! It was for sell in a book store in Barcelona and I felt in love with it. I bought it 20 years after from the same store. I bet nobody bought it until I did!
When I was about 10 i actually saw something that didn't make sense till years later. I actually saw a beam of light flash down to the ground about a few feet away from me. It was yellowish and kind of blue. Once the brightness dimmed a little I actually saw something like a human silhouette that only came into focus for about less than a second. It was like seeing a flash of light in a dark room and catching a glimpse of someone in the Same room. But it was enough that I saw the dark skinned being dressed in some kind of uniform and looked like it was wearing eye protection and some kind of facial respirator than just as quick as it appeared just like that it disappeared as it looked like the same light that brought him down pulled him back up. I never told anyone because I knew no one would believe me. Maybe time traveler or dimension traveler or just maybe from the same time as me but from where or when it came from one thing is for sure in my head that transportation like this does exist.
Cool story. Thanks for sharing it.
One of the best channels, live from 🇱🇰
Wasn't these problems covered by the Heisenberg compensator?
Only when they're working😆
No. That's just word salad referencing a known name/word to "hang a lantern" on the massive plot hole.
It is to make the audience accept it and move on. Like hanging a lantern on a road danger. Keeps traffic moving.
One of the things I love about Star Trek is that is DOES tackle these, and similar, spiritual and esoteric questions.
brilliant explanations about such complicated subjects....thanks from iraq
I thoroughly enjoy your videos and thank you for working so hard to keep them comprehensible!
I appreciate your remark about following to the letter the 'Star Trek Description' but, how much more attainable would the process be if it were 'simply'the atoms that were relocated?
I wish you every success for the future.
Cheers, John Robert's.
Star Trek really doesn't avoid the questions. Remember Thomas Riker.
Good call.
And dr. McCoy and his reticence and continual complaints against transporters.
The transporter in this case failed to kill the original.
if the matter stream was intentionally delayed for say 100 years it would be a time machine
But first remember Evil Kirk vs Good Kirk, "Enemy Within". Of course this was a common script trope in 60s TV to have the doppleganger double, cousin or sister. Daniel Boone, My Three Sons, Bewitched, I Dream of Jeannie.... They even had an evil Hoss and Little Joe.
So good! You are the man Arvish!! Thanks!!!
I'm with McCoy on this one.
I Love your Videos ,Thank you for posting
There is an episode where Captain Kirk gets doubled into a good side and evil side.
before I even watch this you're intro has addressed material I have written about!
I wouldn't use a teleporter because I'd be too afraid that on the other side the me that is reformed is a new me with the same memory, but essentially a copied version, and the original me was gone.
Basically that is what happens.
Great video Arvin, Thank you!
There are many problems with this. Remember ' The Fly'?
Yeah, I was going to bring up "The Fly" as well after the first few into the video but towards the end saw that this was more a thought experiment video and little details like who first but teleportation out there became irrelevant. I don't know where it originated and that was never the point since Arvin states clearly that he's focusing on just the Star Trek version of teleportation
Excellent video
When I get transported can I get my full head of hair that I had 20 years ago?
If that's possible, I would be the first volunteer...lol.
Lol if we can do teleportation them I'm pretty sure they can also get your hair back
I think so. Something similar was done to Dr. Palaski in season 2 of TNG.
Great show. How about a video on the holodeck?
Actually you wouldn't need the particle's beam, just the information beam. Considering you have the technology and knowledge of how to copy all this information precisely, you can send this information through any means and then rearrange everything using the local resources. But I personally do not believe such a thing could be even feasible. Data is no more than ones and zeros, yes or no... and people are far from being "yes or no" beings. I'm a musician, and I know a little about audio engineering. When you record an audio to a computer, be a voice or a guitar, it is converted from an analog signal (an electric current) from your source (microphone ou guitar pickup), to a bunch of ones and zeros. Depending on the resolution (sometimes as far as 192kHz) you can really "trick" your ears to make them "think" that the sound remains the same. In fact, I think almost no one in the whole world could make a diference between a hi-quality digital audio from the analog audio source. But the fact is, this audio is no more... it's not the same anymore. The information, no matter the resolution, is not the same audio. In fact you couldn't even call it a digital copy, the correct name should be a "digital reproduction". So, I think if we ever manage to reach such a tech, the result on the other side of the beam would not be the same person, nor a copy, but a reproduction. Cheers from Brazil!
"Faxing" or duplicating a facsimile from a scanned pattern and telephonic or parallel data stream creates the obvious problem that GR didn't want to deal with.
You either have two Spocks or you have to kill the first Spock when the copy reports, arrived OK. Then you have to kill Away Mission Spock to create a new Spock on the ship. This was dramatized in a fantastic short story decades ago. It has also been done on The Outer Limits. Best experienced in one off stories, not a weekly series.
Add to that each duplication involves data compression and truncation errors in float point math inherent to all computers, the copies will all contain flaws and interpolations of each new original. So does 100th copy Spock have round ears and a devilish sense of humor...or would that just be Leonard.
An interesting idea, Ensign Williams. But do you not see that by utilizing the materials at hand in the landing zone, you would effectively be BURYING your construct? The matter you move is displaced from somewhere. A universe filled with de facto Federation graves is not my idea of a Science Fiction adventure!
As far as using local resources, Star Trek is way ahead with the food replicators, if they can make the complexe molecules that are food stuff why not people too?
Joao Baptista but again the question.
What do you do with the extra bodies? Not so much an ethical dilemma for a cuppa Earl Grey hot or a cob salad. A bit more of a problem with two identical crewmen.
However, why bother fretting over going down to the dangerous planet just to die to dramatic music, if it is just your copy. Screw em.
Then again why should starfleet bother carrying entire crews of ground mission specialists and security teams to distant stars. Why not just keep a pattern record and create them at will as needed with the trans/replicator. JIT red shirts.
Picard is your best captain in the 24th Cen, why not replicate him and his favorite bridge crew for every ship? Think of all the useless hotmess Trois.
Then there is the Lintilla syndrome from Hitchhiker's. That was fun.
@@STho205 Yep... Never thought of that, still in the TNG series they do just that when that doctor lady gets the get old fast sickness, they recover her dna from a hair follicle and put her back together the right way... I guess we are the ones thinking ahead. lololol...
Don't forget transporting a static object onto a rotating one would cause a huge collision. How does the Star Trek manual address this? Great video.
It doesn't get into that. Interesting thought though. Presumably, the beam would rotate with the planet?
A lot of this would also apply to resurrecting the dead.
That's a very interesting thought! If you could save the person's "information beam" from a time they were alive, you could theoretically use it to rebuild them from a prior state. This is kind of like rebooting your computer after a failure, by using a saved copy of the hard drive!
Oh my, “Danger Will Robinson!”
@@ArvinAsh I've thought about this a lot. If we had invented such technology much sooner, we could retain access to the last-known state of the great people of human history. We could ask the first scientists about their thought processes or life backgrounds that led them to form their conclusions, we could enjoy performances by the original composers of our favorite music, and we could compare the human development processes of philosophers and other people in times past in order to better understand our species and develop a better future for ourselves. Even if we started preserving people's minds today, it would be pretty awesome.
As part of the cutting edge of research of superconductivity and quark physics, the production of gravity drives and levity drives, you have every technology of Star Trek. A gravity-levity propulsor drive gives you impulse, sub-light, and light speed. With a levity drive you manifest defensive shields around the Enterprise. Both gravity drives and levity drives have weapons that shoot (phasers, photon bombs) that either disrupt (gravity well) or disintegrate (levity hill) other's ships. The same phasers are mini-levity drives that shock, stun, or disintegrate an object. A tractor beam is a focussed beam of the gravity drive. A teleportation pad (with holographics) is able to modularly disintegrate the body (or object) back into quarks, shoot them down on a focussed beam of the levity drive - and reassemble them at a distance or on the teleportation pad. The food replicator is the same 3D printing out of dark matter for already quantified hologram of objects, "Earl Grey tea - hot", and then putting the used dinnerware back into the replicator and purely disintegrated back into dark matter (quarks). No garbage. With the same replicator drive - you can manufacture all fresh air, clean water, food out of nothing (miracle !), inorganic chemicals and pre-designed metal parts, organic objects, ... And with proper manufacturing and design you can make superconductive materials (the di-lithium crystals) for power sources and stargates. With a complete expansion of the levity drive shields, you create a worm "bubble" and can then slip into warp speed between the actual space-time fabric ... making to the outside observer what looks like a worm hole. A true wormhole can only be created via 2 stargates making the actual wormhole between the 2 portals. The actual process is not at the molecular level, the atomic level, not even the statement of nuclear level - but the true "ancients" knowledge of "atoms" that are the very quarks in dark matter of energies and forces. All of this provides unlimited energy, no more scarce and tactical resources, and a liberation of humanity en toto.
Using larger levity drives on other planets can create the defensive "shell" shields (instead of building actual domes. Using gravity drives on other plants (moon, mars) one can recreate a higher magnetic potential (gauss) that then pulls down the solar wind of air, humidity, heat, and atmosphere into terraforming an atmosphere on these minimal gravity plants and moons. As such, one can then truly make gray moon, green moon, blue moon, or red mars, green mars, blue mars (Kim Stanley Robinson sci-fi series). One can then do this anywhere ... and produce all the needed planetary volume of fresh air and fresh water produced from the replicators for a planetary formation - all from dark matter. And if you were able to transport (and hover) in the Venus atmosphere (and disintegrate all the sulfur and atompsheric global warming heat particulates ... and later landed on the surface, and clearly create a sterile and fresh air atmosphere - then flood the planet with rich carbon, oxygen, nitrogen, and noble gasses ... and fresh water, one could transform Venus from a hell-planet into a big blue marble sister-planet of Earth.
Beam me up Scotty!
Funny thing is that line was never said. But I hear it in my head anytime I watch Star Trek.
@@ArvinAsh
I think that all trekkies do.
Mind Blowing as always 👏🏻Thank you
So you're telling me there's a chance
haha...yes.
Yes a chance, but none of us will be alive to see it. I'd guesstimate we might have it in 300 to 500 years.
@@JJs_playground no! 150 years at max
We will invent ASI in this century so...
@@DrAdityaReddy I don't know. Do you realize the amount of quantum information is required to store for an object.
@@JJs_playground do you know about Artificial super intelligence?
Your explanation help us to view this problem logically in different aspects. One point is if this technology is ready, and if there is a doom day, who has the luxury to use this
That Is time travel.
Think about it! there's no difference, I've been saying! two kinds of Time travel.Time is it's own Dimension. That's Good or Get your Atoms scattered .
Time travel.... you didn't understand what time is in the first place to define travelling in time.
Back when TOS was originally aired, some of us Star Trek nerds asked many of the same questions raised here. Our understanding of the transporter, based on the books available at the time, was that a person was converted to energy, transmitted, then turned back to matter. This led to "since your body ceases to exist during transport, do you still have a soul at the end?"
This same thought process led us to foreshadow the replicator. If you save the molecular structure of something you've transported, why couldn't you take some energy from the warp engines, convert it to matter using the saved structure, and viola, you have another of that "something".
We also wondered about that point with people. In fact, there was a novel called Spock Must Die, in which a second, mirror image Spock got created during transport.
Brings back memories....
I wanna teleport and materialize inside a big bank's vault.
haha...Well, you'd be locked inside with all that money! Sounds like a great Twilight Zone episode.
Beware the Philadelphia Experiment and Montauk - where the crew, upon re-manifestation were embedded in the ship's bulk sides !!! You might manifest inside a coin pile, or the vault wall, or the bank lock door !!!
Excellent video. I believe a worm hole is a better option, but like Kip Thorne says the problem is to open the worm hole and to maintain open it enough time to make a travel, and what happened to human body when interacts with worm hole matter . But the analysis of Arvin Ash about the subatomic consequences to dematerialized is very scientific and precise
There is absolutely zero evidence of a soul.
Thank you! You are 100% correct!
@@GriuGriu64 You are the one making the positive claim here malaka...so offer the proof or shut up.
@@GriuGriu64 Read up and learn a bit: www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/222/Shifting-of-the-Burden-of-Proof
@@GriuGriu64 Your positive claim is that a soul exists malaka.
@@GriuGriu64 Your first post here malaka. Are you drunk or just stupid?
It's fun to speculate on these potential future technologies. My take as a "lay-physicist" is that it isn't possible to beam an object from a pad to a place. I think a more possible scenario would be sending objects from one pad to another. Even then you have the massive problem of energy and data load requirements. There are other sci-fy technologies that I'm much more confident humanity could achieve over the next few hundred years, like "warp drive" for example. Great video - thanks!
Why is this guy talking about a soul? Are you a scientist or not?
I am using "soul" and "consciousness" interchangeably. I don't think any scientist would disagree that consciousness exists. I was simply using language that a lot of people can relate to...which I see may have been a mistake.
@@ArvinAsh Thank you for your response. I recently came upon your channel and have been hooked ever since. I've learned quite a bit from you and look forward to learning more. I was taken aback by the mentioning of a "soul", but it seems I may have judge too quickly. I apologize. Please continue to do the things you do. I appreciate you.
@@ArvinAsh These things aren't interchangeable in any respect. I don't deny that consciousness exists, but there is no evidence of a "soul". The word "soul" has a lot of religious baggage around it and if we are to move forward we really need to stop implying things like a "soul" to exists in any respect. Yes it was a mistake to use that word or give it any validity at all.
@@leslypierre9574 Thanks for watching my friend! And thanks for your support.
You are a soul.
I do, in fact, agree with your optimism. However, a couple of conundrums arise for me. First, subatomic particles exist in superposition... but this formula suggests that we can represent a series of subatomic items that exist in superposition (that's how they exist as we - living humans - move through our lives) with 1k of data. I'm very dubious of that number, I think it's way too low. The second issue that peaks my eyebrow is that consciousness, as we appear to be learning, is based on quantum superposition. In fact consciousness appears to lapse, if I understand Stuart Hameroff's assertions, when we have wave form collapse at subatomic levels in the brain. So the question for me is, how do we capture and store the state of things that are inherently stateless? It seems that if we force wave collapse via measurement for storage and transmission, we will end up killing the patient in so much as we won't be reassembling the collection of subatomics into their living presentation of superposition, whether in the brain or the rest of the anatomy... very cool stuff to think about, though.
Excellent video. Would like to bring up a couple of points. 1. the information stream would not only have to carry the information of the mass, but would also have to carry all the data stored in the brain itself(this idea was broached by VSauce a long while ago) "Most computational neuroscientists tend to estimate human storage capacity somewhere between 10 terabytes and 100 terabytes, though the full spectrum of guesses ranges from 1 terabyte to 2.5 petabytes. (One terabyte is equal to about 1,000 gigabytes or about 1 million megabytes; a petabyte is about 1,000 terabytes.)" So add that on top of the massive amount of information in the information stream. 2. The Heisenburg Compensator, a nifty little device that helped work out the whole quantum level issue. "The compensator worked around the problems caused by the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, allowing the transporter sensors to compensate for their inability to determine both the position and momentum of the target particles to the same degree of accuracy." This is also how they don't actually send two beams...no information stream needed with this handy device.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transporter_(Star_Trek)
I like this concept dude. I am also fascinated with time travel and we all know that traveling to the future is possible. Traveling backwards in time is an interesting subject to talk about. I want to travel in the past and see what's in there before I was born. I too am ignorantly optimistic, I believe nothing is impossible
Now that you explained it, I'm thinking that it might be cheaper (energy-wise) to just fold space in such a way that the person would be transported from point A to point B. No more ethical problems too.
That's a good thought as others have pointed out. There are two main hurdles, some form of negative matter is needed. This has not been confirmed to exist. The other issue is that the "wormhole" created could not be used to transport anyone to a planet, as any matter near the exit of the wormhole would be gravitationally affected.
Hi Arvin I've just started watching your amazingly put together videos.These are topics that have always fascinated me since childhood as a sci-fi fan and it's been an enjoyable learning experience so far. Thank you and please keep the videos coming!
On the issue of teleportation I'm wondering whether another way to make it happen might be to transport a block of space in which a person was located to given coordinates rather than dematerializing the person? I was reading some of the comments below and the same point is raised by Constantine as well.
This would be somewhat similar to transporting a star-ship with the help of the Alcubierre drive where space-time containing the ship is shifted rather than the ship itself moving.In such a case we wouldn't have to worry about possible loss of life as well during a teleportation attempt.
Would the laws of physics exclude such a possibility?
It is not impossible, but you need negative mass or energy to do it. Negative mass has never been observed.
Wow , I have been avoiding this vid due to the nature of it . Now I ask myself ‘WHY’ , I should have known Arvin Ash would have approached the vid as he did . Kudos to you sir a Brilliant vid as usual , I’m sorry for doubting you , This will never happen again . As a note I have myself always thought that Teleportation would take so much energy that it wouldn’t be feasible . I now agree sir that one day this mode of transport (or something like it) will be a reality .
Also I’m not a believer in a ‘Soul’ and believe our consciousness is merely a sum of our experiences .
Really enjoy your vids...this one especially...I'm a bit of a treky !!!!
You and me both!
Excellent in all aspects.... thanks
One part of the calculation you aren’t considering is in Star Trek universe, there is a SUBSPACE layer to allow faster than light communication... so less energy and time would be needed to transmit the information.
And the Heisenberg compensators allow measurements and location state info... easy.
True. But I am presuming STNG takes place in our universe, and is subject to the physics we know about.
I wonder if there's a need to kill off the original for the transportation to occur. What natural laws prevent you from just making copies? Awesome video. Thank you.
If you want the matter that you are actually made of to be transported, then I don't see a way to avoid it. But even if you used quantum teleportation such that your matter could be duplicated using quantum entanglement, the quantum mechanics laws would require that you destroy the original copy.
@@ArvinAsh Makes sense if you're thinking of transporting matter. I was thinking of either an "avatar" solution where you transport only the information to a readily available body, or even reconstitute the body from local matter; which at the quantum level should be the same. Talk about rising from the "ashes" :)
Interesting. This has been a great thought experiment for philosophers as the Transporter in Star Trek creates a very interesting problem with relation to the concept of the self. An added dimension to what you discuss is the issue of memory. Memory in the human brain is not stored in the wrinkles or folds in the brain tissue. It is also not the arrangement of neurons or the specific chemicals located at a given point. And it is not the electrical impulses in the brain. Memory is the pathway that neuro-electic pulses take along a sequence of neurons. We remember something when we fire our neurons in a known and well-practiced pattern. That seems fine enough alone, but we can't copy those impulse paths. Once they are gone, they are gone. So when you transport someone, do you copy exactly the fundamental path that the pulses were travelling as well as the paths themselves? If not, the "person" doesn't go as you are the pulses and pathways in your meat. Change or remove them and 'you' are gone.
Why do you need to transport particles? You can use those that are available on spot - this would be reason use subatomic ones - you can create whatever atoms from it.
So you need to move only information, and some kind of order for particles to bind into an order regarding data that is sent.
"Sometimes ignorance is the only way to remain optimistic in life." I suddenly feel like Truman (Jim Carry).
Great movie! Are we not all Truman at least to some degree?
Great video and good explanation tx
I think changing the frequency of a subject and transmit them like a radio wave is a better option. Then you can watch your favorite sport while you travel.
In whatever form you may believe it to take, then if the soul is a part of the human body, would it not also be transported along with the rest of the body in the particle stream?
Yes I think so. No reason it would not.
Very well presented. Logical. Fascinating.
As to the particle stream transmitted at nearly light speed, would not Special Relativity come into play. As light photons will travel 10000 light years, but experience no time and no distance (space) themselves. Thus the light we see from distant stellar objects each clear night has not internally degraded through entropy.
Love this video. I hope we do invent teleportation sometime in the distant future.
On the issue of information, consciousness and the soul...
1) the information component is critical but by itself is useless. There must be the physical component to interact with the world in any normal sense.
2) the transporter would be making a perfect copy(disregarding the destruction of the original). The original and the copy would both be conscious and their consciousness would be individual to them. They would initially feel and act a like and share the same past memories. However after transport, their experiences will diverge.
3) On the soul, to me the soul is nothing but an accurate and complete description of something including all of its behaviors. To me, everything tangible and intangible has a soul. The soul for living creatures is just more complex and larger than something simple like 1 particular hydrogen atom. The interesting thing about souls(plural), is that when you overlay souls of many similar living creatures some patterns emerge. You will see grouping in some areas and an absence of groupings in other areas. To me, this would explain a few things like when 2 people meet for the first time and they are instantly attracted or repulsed by each other. These souls(or descriptions) are not bound to anything physical. It's sort of like a numeric average. If we use a program like Excel and enter a number into 5 cells and in the 6th cell we use an average formula, we will get an average value no matter what values are used or change inside the 5 cells. This average is based on 5 values but it lives independent of those values. So does a soul. It lives independent of what it represents.
I think I recall Gene Roddenberry saying that the main reason he “invented” the transporter was simply to speed up the progress of the narrative within a TV show’s inherently-tight timeline. Another “device” - a narrative device - for that purpose was the “Captain’s Log” quotations.
Yes. The shows producers were also trying to save money on special effects - they didn't want to have to film the spaceship landing on new planets all the time.
Arvin Ash, plus of course it’s cool and futuristic!
Thanks for all the great videos, especially the ones on Quantum Mechanics.