Signal Tracing Tube Radios: Basics Video 1
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- Опубликовано: 2 фев 2013
- This video contains some basic information about tracing the frequency signal through an antique radio. Video 2 will contain footage of an actual radio being traced.
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Many Video's show how things work in many different ways, but your signal flow is very conclusive and enlightening as you have explained it so ONE can understand the basic flow but also understand why there's all these other parts under the hood of this radio and how it all functions........
I wish I could have started radio repair with this video...........
I like you are getting my head around electronics. Your video has really helped to explain things in a way other videos haven't managed for me. Thanks for doing the video. Keep them coming.
Hello John, this is by far the best explanation on how tube radios work that I have seen so far. All other videos suggest you know a little more and therfore leave some question as to what is going on inside the set. Thank you for producing this video!
So well done, sir! Many thanks. I'd be most grateful if you could make #2! (and more!).
Very good job explaining how the circuit works, please continue making videos.
John: I am getting ready to retire and wanted a hobby to keep busy so I decided on tube radios because they always fascinated me. I recently purchased a Eico Signal tester, Heathkit Signal Generator, NRI tube tester and an ESR Capacitor meter. I had no idea what I was getting into because even though I have these testers, I had no idea how to read tube radio schematics or how to use this equipment but after watching this video I think I now stand a chance. You did a wonderful job explaining this to myself as a beginner and am going to now watch part 2 and all other video's of yours. Thank You!
I'm glad I was able to help in some way. It is a very enjoyable hobby. You've purchased some great tools to work on radios with. But they are vintage also and most likely in need of repair themselves. My suggestion is to purchase a good 120v isolation transformer. Any item you work on should be plugged into you isolation transformer for safety My fondest tutor on RUclips is AllAmericanFiveRadoo. He has a RUclips video titled "AA5 Radio Signal Flow" that will acquaint you with AA5 radios. These were the most common technology for tube radios from the 50s to about 1970 when transistors took over. I would suggest starting with these AA5 radios in your hobby until you get familiar with all the things that are happening in the radio. I like working on AA5s but also early 1920s radios too. Also remember this website: nostalgiaair.org. They have free schematics for just about any old radio you can find. Rick McCwhorter, (AllAmericanFiveRadio) also wrote a book called "All American Five Radios" that was my own first reading material in the hobby. I call it essential.
@@johnallenrichterJohn, I can’t seem to find your second video on signal tracing. Much enjoyed the first one and would really like to see the second! Thanks
Was a video 2 ever produced. It didn’t come up in a search. This vid 1 was excellent. I’ve been having the tracing issue on a Philco 40-88 that I’m working on.
Anyone ever see video #2? I can't find it and this was a perfect vid for signal tracing
This video is awsome!!!! I just picked up my first tube reciever, NC-183D and looking forward to restoring it
Thanks John, It was clear and really well presented !
Very nice and methodical way of looking for a failure in an old tube receiver. Thanks very much
thank you John
My first video on tube radios, you explained clearly and I learned about frequency and how to determine the tube pin identification. Thank you sir!
I'm a new-ish radio hobbyist, and this video was super helpful. Your explanation helped me figure out what was wrong with my late 30's era Atwater Kent
HOO-RAY!
I have been wanting a video like this. Thank you for producing it. I look forward to your next one.
BRAVO! You should teach a radio course. This is the first time I understood signal tracing.
Very good video, thanks for sharing. I'll watch #2 now.
Nice Job John! I like the arrows... they really help!!
Terrific job of thoroughly explaining.
Hi John,
Solid job on explaining all this with the novice in mind. I learned a lot. Sure wish there was a #2 though. Was very excited to see the lesson applied in real life. Hope you get around to it one day.
Yes you certainly helped me. That was a great video aimed at my level of competence. Thanks a bunch.
Hey man I am trying to get into this hobby and your video helps so much I was wondering if your were ever thinking about returning to the videos and making more. It would be really great to see you make videos going into the fundamentals of oscillation and other related topics. Anyway, I just wanted to say thank you for creating such a easy to digest video about a topic where there is a need for explaination. 😁👍
One minor point - the first number of the tube number does not indicate the voltage of the tube, it indicates the voltage that the tube's heater filament runs on, although there are some early tubes that it's just a number.
Thanks John like you still learning big help good job .
Excellent professional tutorial.
God bless you! Thanks for making this video!
Loved it! new sub indeed! TY for sharing!
Hi John,
This is a really good basic radio video. I've got a Heathkit Signal tracer but had no idea on how to use it. Your video showed me just what I needed to know. I don't know if there's a part 2, but if there isn't, I wish you'd do one with an actual radio, to put theory into practice.
Best regards, Tom
Great video sir! It does help the brain indded ☺👍
I love this, Thank you
very smooth explanation thanks
Excellent video. I'm about to start down the same path :).
Hello John, I very much like your video 1 (signal Tracing Tube Radios). I'm afraid I cannot find video 2. Could you let me know where I can find video 2? Thanks in advance.
Regards,
Jan
The 12BE6 is known as a "pentagrid converter" type vacuum tube.
8:07...unless the local oscillator is working AND on frequency, there will be no IF signal input to the second vacuum tube!
If the receiver is tuned to a signal, the 12BE6 will amplify the signal- but that particular signal information will NOT make it to the input of the second vacuum tube UNLESS the oscillator is RUNNING and ON FREQUENCY!!!
Good explanation.
Thanks John,
I am new to the hobby and found you video very helpful!!
I look forward to your next video as you go through the chassis with the Signal Tracer.
Any idea of when it may be out??
Matt
That "Zenith" model 519 schematic is the most Simplest Zenith radio design I've ever seen !! .....Most Zenith tube radios are significantly more elaborate & complex circuit designed..l..
HiTom. When creating the video I was specifically looking for the simplest schematic I could find because detailed schematics can be off-putting to new hobbyists. This all American 5 tube schematic seeemed to be the best choice. Also, while this is based on the radio's schematic it is actually a simplified copy that I created in my imaging software. (I use PaintShopPro) I traced every dash, dot, line and text on this scematic from the original. I left out a lot of information like notes and part numbers to keep the focus on the signal path, It was a tremendous amount of work to create this video. Most people don't recognize the effort put into making videos, but you did. Thanks for that.
Good video. Excellent. Where is video #2? Post a link please!
Looking forward to Video 2. Is it on your playlist?
John, hello from Kings Mills Ohio
very enlightening! Thanks so much! Trying not to confuse myself though. AT 8:59
you show in red the possible problem areas IF there was a problem between TUNE
2 and 3. I believe that the red "tank" circuits (I think) are "feedback" to help stabilize
the gain under normal situation. Question, even though it's technically a feedback
circuit, CAN the "signal" early on (when working properly) be BOTH output and input?
That is, Which "dominates"...the "signal" DIRECTION in a feed back...since the signal
can go either direction. Or if the signal doesn't go in both direction, why not since
it's only a wire connecting the tank circuits between tubes 1 and 2 yet it's wired to
the "grid" of tube 2. If that make any since! What makes a feedback circuit operators
only in one direction I guess simple stated! Thanks! Can anyone clue me in!!!
Great video. Where is video 2?
Hello and greetings from Saudi Arabia.
I would thank you for the great videos and the illustration you make it available for your followers.
I have Presto K7 Record Cutter Lathe which I couldn’t find any schematic for. I have started the restoration including replacing the tubes and all other components and would ask you to kindly making a video about how to draw a schematic digram correctly for any vintage vacuum tube machine without a schematic available for download and which software you would recommending to use in drawing the schematic to make it available for anyone needs to service or restore the same machine.
Thanks.
I apologize for taking so long. I can tell you that tubes are generally just amplifiers. Except for AC to DC rectifiers. Most of them have an input, like from an antenna or from a previous tube in the series. And they will have an output. Over the years from the early teens to the late 1960s there were tremendous advancements in tubes. The number of screens in the tube improved clarity tremendously. I would suggest studying tubes from single screen to triple screens and then also study the systems that drive the screens. I know it can seem like a forest of things to remember but really with study it will bring it down to clumps of trees instead of an overwhelming forest. And then you'll be able to draw any schematic for whatever machine you have.
cool ~ thanx
Old tube radios are rare nowadays..my oldest radio has a digital readout
Good video explaining the basics of tube radio signal tracing. Did you ever get around to uploading part 2? I just obtained an Eico 147A Signal Tracer and would like to see an expert actually use a signal tracer to repair an AA5 radio. Thanks.
Sorry but no I did not make the second video on tracing problems in the A.M. 5 tube radio. I changed direction and am now grossly involved in study of something else and just don't have time. I suggest finding AllAmericanfiveradio for his great video on tracing. He even has a video that will help you make your own tracer from another A.M. radio.
Human hearing range is 20 to 20,000 cycles per second. And it deminshes with ages
Huh? :) Don't I know it! I've had a high end pitch tinnitus for several years. It drowns out other extraneous frequencies so i end up saying "huh?" A lot. Kids in High School use a certain frequency on the cell- phone ring tone because their teachers ( if over 30 years of age) generally can not hear that frequency. But the kids can hear it.
Thanks for the video and explaining why I can't hear my signal generator. I need an RF and AF generator. What did you use as your signal?
You can use a signal generator. Sometimes I use an antique tube signal generator. Especially if the transformers need to be adjusted. But you dont need a signal generator to diagnose problems. You can just dial in to a strong am station and check the inputs and outputs of each tube for signal strength.
@@johnallenrichter checking the inputs and outputs with what some kind of audio probe?
@@diydan6045 You can check it with a multimeter.
Can't find the "Signal Tracing" #2 video....Easy performed Effective signal tracing Tube radios & Amps don't Necessarily require special costly test equipment more than a typical, low cost digital > 1meg ohm Vom & a narrow shank Screwdriver performing the "Disturbance" test !!....Assuming typical dead no Sound (But all Working filament heaters) tube set, max volume pot & briefly Short audio output tube Grid to ground Listening for definite Speaker "Pop" static sound....If good pop volume sound, repeat again to Previous stage "Plate" then it's Grid working Towards antenna & Speaker "Pop" getting progressively Louder (Ignore any Plate to ground Sparks) stage by stage...Dead or weak stage(s) quickly identified & appropriate tube Replacement & tube socket pin voltage checks made to correct stage gain issue....If Dead at audio output Tube socket pin "Plate" to grd shorted "Disturbance" test, check tube Voltages & suspect defective Open audio output Transformer or speaker VC winding continuity.....
I am doing the same as you I been collecting tube radios for about two years ,trying to learn everything I can find on my hobby ,I been looking for used or kit form signal tracers,I no very little about them ,most I have seen in kit form ,I have no idea if they are any good a lot of them you need a scope to work with them ,I just want a cheap one that can make a tone to let me no if the signal or current is going through ,I any one can suggest something that would be cool.There is so much to learn .
I purchased a healthkit signal tracer on ebay several years ago from ebay for about $40. It has the ability to detect bot radio frequency and audio frequency. When the switch is turned to detect radio frequency, it simply connects to a detector tube to change it to audio frequency before sending it to the built-in AF output speaker circuit. When switched to detect AF in your radio it simply sends the detected signal directly to the built-in AF speaker circuit. Once you understand this difference between AF and RF signal you can build your own signal tracer from an old cheap radio. In fact, my first signal tracer was home built with the help of AllAmericanFiveRadio, who is my go to guy for understanding old radios. He has a book explaining the radios from the 50s and 60s which I highly recommend. And on his RUclips channel he has a video explaining very easily to build your own tracer from an old radio. He is an absolute blessing for our hobby and a wealth of knowledge. I suggest subscribing to his channel if you want to learn as much as you can about all American five radios.
@@johnallenrichter thank for your info ,I like all amarican five too
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 !!!
Can't find video 2 ?,please don't say you never made it after saying you were going too
Great video, however, when you talk about the upper limits of audio frequency range you Say 20,000 Kilohertz (at time 1:01) which should be 20, 000 hertz or 20 Kilohertz as shown in the diagram. You may want to correct the audio of the video so people are not confused. Thanks
Thanks for the update! Frequency rate is important when figuring out which audio transformers to choose when replacing so that's critical.
What you didn't mention is that the 12BE6 actually has TWO functions: the 12BE6 acts as a MIXER and it acts as an OSCILLATOR- all in a single vacuum tube.
hey Mr. John, i want to send you Tube Radio schematic for checking and corrections. please check it and guide me. i have started to make this radio.
Hi Fawad. I am a novice on antique radios. I suggest that you travel to antique radios.com and ask some of the more experienced techs there about your radio.
Not everybody has that radio.
How about using terms plate, grid, screen instead of pin numbers?
I'll keep that in mind for any future radio vids.
Why can I not find part two?
Sorry. Downsized and lost most of my equipment. I recommend allamericanfiveradio for signal tracing problems. He has several great videos on it.
All you really need is a VOM if you know what you are doing.
john part 2?
Hi Earl. Sorry but I'm a huge procrastinator. My intention was to add a second video actually diagnosing a radio with a signal tracer but I got caught in a move and a lot of my things went into storage. Let me suggest a tuber Rich McWhorter, "AllAmericanFiveRadio" who has a couple of really good videos using a signal generator. About everything I know came from Richard. He's a really great guy and excellent teacher.
I drew pictures just like yours..but when i connected the paper to electricty i got nuthin. No blue arrows and no music. It's possible i drew the last tube a lower voltage but i doubt it. Great video though. I guess i lack the artist's eye you seem to have.im gonna go paint my dinner, have a good one
Ok.
Just a little gripe: Radio waves are not audible because they are not sound waves but electromagnetic waves. A radio wave whose frequency falls within our hearing range would still not sound like anything. And that's a good thing because otherwise we'd hear constant buzzing coming off all of our electrical wiring!
Rua Whitepaw Hi Rua. Just for clarification, I can't hear radio waves either. Did I mention in the video that I can hear radio waves?
In your explanation at the start, you describe radio waves as "Un-Audible Sound Waves" and give the impression that radio waves would be audible if only their frequency were lower. While I'm pretty confident that you know the real difference, not all viewers might.
I don't understand what you are asking. It looks to me like you probably will need to make your own video.
But what a letdown not to find video 2!
20,000 Khz is actually 20,000,000 Hz, or 20 Mhz, way beyond hearing range. Nitpicking, sorry.
You're absolutely right.
We hear up to about 20,000 Hertz, or 20 kHz, as you wish, but NOT 20,000 kHz! Edit your videos better!
Ok
I just noticed you don't have any videos on your channel. Would you like a content creator? I'm for hire.